So much for "Alpha Mitt"
I told you that Mitt Romney, for all his height, financial success, and executive hair, was a Beta. One display of dominance in the first debate, the first in what is now six years of running for president, does not an Alpha make. Recall that before the debate, Scoobious Doobius noted this:
"In terms of "game" theory (as opposed to "game theory"), it'll be interesting to see tonight if things turn into the classic "real alpha versus beta huffing and puffing and trying to look like an alpha" sort of thing. If Obama takes that bait, then I'll be a little more open-eared towards the predictive power of game."
The case, she is closed. Obama not only came out huffing and puffing, but he even managed to prevent Romney from dominating him the way Romney had in the first debate. The real indicator of Romney's Betatude was not that he failed to AMOG Obama a second time, but rather the way in which he permitted a woman to not only overrule him, but the rules set out for the moderator prior to the debate as well.
There is no excuse for this failure. A true alpha would have shut her up and forced her to submit to him without even requiring an appeal to the rules. But, given how the rules were not only clear, but Candy Crowley openly declared her intent to flout them before the debate, Romney's failure to shut her up and force her to stick to her appointed role is conclusive proof that he is not, and has never been, an alpha male.
All he had to do, the first time she opened her mouth in violation of the rules, was read them to her and ask her what part of them she did not understand. Later, when she attempted to play fact-checker, he should have immediately asked her what the score was, then informed her that if she isn't keeping score, she isn't the judge of the debate and she should stick to her moderator duties as she agreed prior to the debate. The fact that Romney's failure to deal with the woman led directly to him fumbling his best opportunity to publicly drive home Obama's responsibility for the Libyan debacle is merely rubbing salt in the wound.
"In terms of "game" theory (as opposed to "game theory"), it'll be interesting to see tonight if things turn into the classic "real alpha versus beta huffing and puffing and trying to look like an alpha" sort of thing. If Obama takes that bait, then I'll be a little more open-eared towards the predictive power of game."
The case, she is closed. Obama not only came out huffing and puffing, but he even managed to prevent Romney from dominating him the way Romney had in the first debate. The real indicator of Romney's Betatude was not that he failed to AMOG Obama a second time, but rather the way in which he permitted a woman to not only overrule him, but the rules set out for the moderator prior to the debate as well.
There is no excuse for this failure. A true alpha would have shut her up and forced her to submit to him without even requiring an appeal to the rules. But, given how the rules were not only clear, but Candy Crowley openly declared her intent to flout them before the debate, Romney's failure to shut her up and force her to stick to her appointed role is conclusive proof that he is not, and has never been, an alpha male.
All he had to do, the first time she opened her mouth in violation of the rules, was read them to her and ask her what part of them she did not understand. Later, when she attempted to play fact-checker, he should have immediately asked her what the score was, then informed her that if she isn't keeping score, she isn't the judge of the debate and she should stick to her moderator duties as she agreed prior to the debate. The fact that Romney's failure to deal with the woman led directly to him fumbling his best opportunity to publicly drive home Obama's responsibility for the Libyan debacle is merely rubbing salt in the wound.
Labels: game theory, politics
120 Comments:
Why did he not just distract her with a cheeseburger?
http://specials.msn.com/msnvideo/video?videoid=1b6570a6-c5a2-4c7c-8b93-3cddaa258ae0&from=en-us_msnhpvidmod
"...who was it that denied enhanced security [in Libya] and why?"
I guess I'm just a confused Canadian because I don't see how Obama came close to answering those 2 questions. Yes, he said that he gave the national security team 3 orders, the first of which was to beef up security in every consulate in the region, but wouldn't that mean that the questioner was lying when he said that he heard that the state department refused extra security, or that he at least was misinformed; or was Obama simply skirting the issue like a good politician and trying to deflect the blame to Romney when he said:
"You don't turn national security into a political issue."
I almost fell off my chair when I heard that one. There are a lot of people here who are smarter than I am, so maybe one of them can answer my question: how is national security NOT a political issue??? Isn't that kind of like saying, "you don't turn the debt ceiling into an economics issue."
I think the Libya issue showed that neither candidates are Alphas; Romney for not going in for the kill when Obama was lying on his back with his throat bared, and Obama for running away from the question like a poodle from a pit bull. I hope I'm not the only one who noticed this.
I agree that several opportunities to forcefully, but tactfully, dominate the scene blew right past Romney. Still, it's looking like my earlier predictions of an Obama re-election didn't get too much help either. It's kinda funny when guys like that get all puffed up. It reminded me of those kids on the playground who would get nose to nose and say things like: "No. You hit me first!", until they would finally get tired and walk away from each other.
It's not like the behavior of debate moderators is a surprise or unpredictable. They've been acting like liberal tools since... well, always. There is no excuse for any GOP candidate not to know how to deal with it. At the very least, challenge the liberal premises of their questions, and tell them to shut up and moderate.
This was not a debate. It was a question and answer session. Were the candidate used their candid political talking points to answer them.
The only person that won was Candy
Karl Denninger is right on this:
The back-and-forth was mostly a good excuse to get drunk -- right up until near the end. But then Romney did himself some serious damage, and it was self-inflicted. The issue turned to guns and Obama, as a Democrat, actually came off as more-moderate than Romney did on the 2nd Amendment!
Mitt got hit square in the face with his Massachusetts record as governor; he was reminded that as Governor he said:
"Deadly assault weapons have no place in Massachusetts", Romney said, at a bill signing ceremony on July 1 with legislators, sportsmen's groups and gun safety advocates. "These guns are not made for recreation or self-defense. They are instruments of destruction with the sole purpose of hunting down and killing people." - July 1st, 2004 -- Mitt Romney
He had every opportunity to repudiate that position and take a strong position of defense of the 2nd Amendment and instead he not only confirmed his previous statement he doubled down and used it as a good example of working across the aisle to find consensus!
In doing so he disqualified himself for the office of President of the United States as he said, in plain language, that he would if elected ignore the Constitution in favor of "consensus."
The Constitution is not about consensus; it is about unalienable rights. Consensus is about two wolves and a sheep holding vote on what's for dinner; unalienable rights are about demanding that the wolves not eat the sheep.
What Mitt Romney said tonight is that if he can find consensus on any issue The Constitution is damned to Hell.
Down this road you are left with a demand to turn over your guns to the government and your only option is whether you are going to do so with them nicely cool at room temperature or smoking hot (and empty.)
Neither man defended unalienable rights this evening. But those who believe that Mittens will somehow effort to defend the 2nd Amendment got a rude awakening this evening, and under a Romney administration you'll have a President seeking consensus on how to take your guns away.
Romney's Betatude was evident when they announced friends of the family and liberals as all the debate moderators. In the early "answer the town hall question" part Romney came off as more personable (and some of the forward leaning poses by the president are vulture like) while Obama looked like an impatient adjunct professor in an undergrad class who would rather be at home watching the game.
By the end of the first hour, they were getting repetitive. During the second hour it sounds like Obama succeeded in getting agressive without being threatening, which is what the base wanted. I think he mostly looks like a jerk, but that is typical Alpha behavior. We went to bed, from reading about the debate this morning, it sounds like things transitioned to a more combative effort in the second hour, with Obama dominating.
Romney is going to have to do better in the next debate, as this is still to close to call, although Romney was pulling ahead. This could give Obama a couple points, and at both Gallup and Rasmussen a couple of points is all that seperates them. Since Rasmussen does a three day average on his presidential poll, it'll probably be Saturday before we see his post debate numbers clearly.
@Stilicho,
Sorry I missed that at the end, sounds like the NRA should rethink their endorsement.
All these debates are all about the media. They make these talking-heads feel important.
Totally agree. Woulda, coulda, shoulda....
Sorry I missed that at the end, sounds like the NRA should rethink their endorsement.
Should, won't. They are stuck in the lesser-of-two-evils mode even though, on this issue, you cannot legitimately claim that Romney is the lesser evil.
A fat feminist couldn't keep her mouth shut and this morning we have a mess.
When talking about energy and the promises Obama didn't keep, I waited for Romney to say something to the effect of, "But here's a promise Obama DID keep... he said that under his administration energy prices would necessarily skyrocket. He's kept that promise in spades."
Or when Obama played the liberal favorite "I'm offended" card over the Libya debacle I was hoping Romney would say "What's offensive, Mr. President, is an American being dragged out of him home in the middle of the night to be questioned by state authorities about a harmless video he posted on Youtube in an effort to distract citizens from your screwup."
I really hate that Romney won't go for the jugular on these issues. It shows me that Romney won't fight for my liberty because he doesn't want to be mean.
I did find the body language interesting. The first part of the debate Obama kept literelaly ducking, dodging and wouldn't look at Romney. Then he got "offended" and that fired him up a bit.
She might have bitten off his arm trying to get it from him.
I didn't learn anything new about the two candidates. They stayed on their talking points. So this was all about their presentation and style. Obama looked like a stupid pussy cat sitting on a chair waiting to pounce on a phony. Then when he jumped off he had trouble dealing with it. He was so eager to get back on that empty chair
What Obama was saying about Libya
I'll take full responsibility providing you don't ask me any question that will politically hurt me.
Damage control, That side that has to the most to repairs from a conflict and is put in defense mode will most likely loose.
Obama made a lot of noise but did no damage to his opponent. Libya is a powder-keg of his own doing. This self inflicted wound is his downfall
The problem with chicks is when they grow up they tend to hen-peck.
As I listening to absurd half truths, lies, distortions and other nonsense. I changed the channel to FX's Sons of Anarchy. My general reaction to how the moderation went down was something that I was 'feeling' all week. It could be more of life's circumstances than the actual debate last night, I don't know, it doesn't really matter. "don't let any female rule you, mind the henhouse with authority."
Forbes ran with a headline of how sickening the debate was and both deserve to lose. Meanwhile AP said that 2 alphas battled it out. I didn't see any alphas last night, did anyone else? Both men were looked very unconformable to me, as if the next day they were going out to breakfast together laughing about the whole scene.
Romney's gun stance played in Mass (state issue), but it won't play in the south.
Off topic- Homeschooling gets some positive press: https://www.nationalreview.com/nrd/articles/328699/last-radicals
you cannot legitimately claim that Romney is the lesser evil.
Bullshit. You might not agree with it, but the claim is legitimate and defensible.
Actually I am going to point out one moment that I believe was quite effective at showing who exactly was who's bitch.
After the first little dust up... Romney was speaking... and Obama started to stand up and interupt him. Romney turns and takes 2 steps towards obama and holds his hand out at the president and says, "Excuse me no. That was a statement. Not a question." Obama tucked his tail and sat down.
The translation for this is simple. "Sit down boy... the grown ups aren't done talking yet."
And Obama obeyed.
Now... no... Romney is no alpha. But as always... these things are relative. Romney is a classic voxian beta. And Voxian beta's are not likely to consistently take shit from some pissy gamma.
This line of attack wouldn't have helped Romney in the least. His bigger mistake was allowing a fat, leftist, femc**** "moderate" the debate in the first place.
Republicans repeatedly make this mistake and give their opponents the edge every time with these puerile debates that the public hate. They should insist on having true debate moderators (they do exist!) and only take questions from real voters, not leftist swine reporters.
Or don't debate at all. Romney gains nothing from debating Obama a 2nd or 3rd time.
It's all a farce. Two actors putting on a show so that the audience can keep pulling for their perspective here's has to swing back and forth. Applying "game" to this can only highlight the part that was played, not the nature of the actor.
What neither of them have figured out is that there is nothing so hot to women as a man putting ANOTHER women in her place.
What a missed opportunity.
I actually watched extreme cheapskates (horrifying) to learn how to handle to coming crash.
COL. KURTZ: And what about you, Captain? Do you find my methods "unsound"?
CAPT. WILLARD: I... don't see... _any_ method, sir.
"Sit down boy... the grown ups aren't done talking yet."
With respect, but echoing Capt. Willard, on that debate stage:
I... didn't see... _any_ grown-ups, Nate.
After the first little dust up... Romney was speaking... and Obama started >>to stand up and interupt him. Romney turns and takes 2 steps towards obama and holds his hand out at the president and says, "Excuse me no. That was a statement. Not a question." Obama tucked his tail and sat down.
The translation for this is simple. "Sit down boy... the grown ups aren't done talking yet."
That is the exact same thing I thought.
Now... no... Romney is no alpha. But as always... these things are relative. Romney is a classic voxian beta. And Voxian beta's are not likely to consistently take shit from some pissy gamma.
Precisely. Obama butched up in preparation and faked it well, but he couldn't maintain it when actually called to the carpet by a higher-ranking man. But Romney really missed an opportunity by not dealing with the moderator.
A man taking s@it from a fat man is indicative of being a wuss. A man taking it from an obese fat chick is nothing but a total pussy.
The best analysis of the debate (for those who want the gist) is this article, from Forbes, summarized below:
"Second Presidential Debate Proves Both Deserve To Lose
In a nauseating display of pandering and economic ignorance, Obama and Romney fought to one-up each other over who would start the bigger trade war with China, who would drive education costs higher through more federal subsidies, and who would make the top 1% pay higher taxes."
Bring your barf bag.
you cannot legitimately claim that Romney is the lesser evil.
"Bullshit. You might not agree with it, but the claim is legitimate and defensible."
How so?
Does "AMOGing" someone necessarily mean disrespecting them?
"A man taking it from an obese fat chick is nothing but a total pussy."
In Romney's defense, his goal is not to get laid, his goal is to win an election; and unfortunately we have such a debased and diseased public political culture, there are all sorts of counter-intuitive factors which a serious candidate has to consider. For a Republican (even a fake one like Mittens) to debate under these ridiculous conditions is to be playing kick-ball in a mine field.
Now granted, it could have been done, and he could have found a way to bitch-slap Crowley, _had it been executed perfectly_; but one slight off-note, and he's created a sound bite that would haunt him up to election day. That is not a negligible concern to keep in mind, among the many things a man who is running for president on TV against the MSM's Holy Magic Negro must keep in mind if he intends to win. The amount of triangulation involved is off the charts. Unlike McCain, who pretty much gave up and conceded in advance, Romney deserves credit for fighting this far, and for being shrewd about it.
Now it may well be that he's shown himself as VD claims to be a beta or whatever; frankly I don't accept the taxonomy as valid in the simplistic terms by which it's generally used. But beta or no beta, a sober analysis of the landscape of the battle should be kept in mind. What's that old saying about generals? Amateurs talk about tactics; professionals talk about terrain.
> "Bullshit. You might not agree with it, but the claim is legitimate and defensible."
What part of "on this issue" did you not understand?
> ...Romney is a classic voxian beta. And Voxian beta's are not likely to consistently take shit from some pissy gamma.
Bingo.
Romney is actually trying to "out-Democrat" the Democrat! If he has a shred of "conservativism" in him, he is concealing it to win the general election (because he knows that Americans -- at least 47% of them! -- are soft, addled socialists who can't survive without government assistance).
So he's pandering to them -- and trying to split the difference.
The Democrats get all worked up, calling Romney a "liar!" not because he's a flip-flopper. (The Democrats originated the whole "I-was-for-it-before-I-was-against-it" mantra, after all.) They're upset because Romney is telling THEIR lie! That boosting spending on all these government programs is a GOOD thing! The Democrats KNOW that all they do is create more government dependency as their government subsidies simply drive prices higher.
They can't STAND that Romney is a more palatable, more moderate-looking "Democrat" than Obama! And he's squeaky clean! It makes them sick!
What Republicans can't stand -- and I don't consider myself a Republican, but I can feel their pain -- is that Romney won't be a conservative! Flip-flopping I can live with. But that damned Romney won't flip! He rests on his liberal laurels like he's doing us a favor! WTH?!
Any true conservative would have MOPPED THE FLOOR with that douche bag of a POTUS -- because his words would have the ring of TRUTH! -- and America (the part I care about) would have cheered his effort.
But, instead, he has us all gagging, holding our noses, and wanting to puke as we pull the lever at the ballot box.
By God! Romney makes voting for Putin seem like an honest (and certainly more manly) exercise of civic duty.
Bleaaak!
As a kind of defense of my point...
http://xkcd.com/1112/
"In Romney's defense, his goal is not to get laid, his goal is to win an election; and unfortunately we have such a debased and diseased public political culture, there are all sorts of counter-intuitive factors which a serious candidate has to consider. For a Republican (even a fake one like Mittens) to debate under these ridiculous conditions is to be playing kick-ball in a mine field."
You're absolutely right about that. It's the only shred of logic I cling to to maintain my sanity.
"Bullshit. You might not agree with it, but the claim is legitimate and defensible."
Time to change your pad Mr Period. You're all soaked.
Romney spent the whole debate arguing that he was the one that was the one that would actually do all the things Obama only promised to do. Thus... it indicates Romney was arguing that he is actually the Greater Evil.
The basis for the lesser of two evil arguments has been examined and found wanting.
--------------------
Actually I am going to point out one moment that I believe was quite effective at showing who exactly was who's bitch.
After the first little dust up... Romney was speaking... and Obama started to stand up and interupt him. Romney turns and takes 2 steps towards obama and holds his hand out at the president and says, "Excuse me no. That was a statement. Not a question." Obama tucked his tail and sat down.
The translation for this is simple. "Sit down boy... the grown ups aren't done talking yet."
And Obama obeyed.
--------------------
That's one of the few parts that I watched. Unfortunately, Romney was more subdued after that. Obama, OTOH, "manned up" afterwards according to the MSM. In reality, it was probably more of a "you go, girl, don't take that from a white man...what will Michelle say?!" moment. But it was a turning point and it turned the wrong way for Romney.
How did we end up with no Alpha's running for President?
How did we end up with no Alpha's running for President?
Eh...that's not necessarily a bad thing...being men of action, alphas trend to get shit done...with our out of control government...the last thing we need...is some guy who's going to use all that power to do things...better to have lazy men in charge...
Perhaps this explains why the choice this year has been so difficult.
"better to have lazy men in charge..."
It's like Napoleon is rumored to have said (probably apocryphal) about an army:
STUPID AND LAZY: There's your infantry.
SMART AND ENERGETIC: There's your officer corps.
SMART AND LAZY: There's your high command.
STUPID AND ENERGETIC: These men must be stopped at any cost.
Scoobius, you're assuming that the smart are the morally good.
Nobody has yet mentioned where the "moderator" asked Romney a hypothetical "but what would you do if the numbers don't work out" (trap) and he stopped her right there, and replied forcefully that he knows his numbers work out because he can do the math....
I wish Romney would let us see that math...
Actually... the moderator was the most distracting thing about the debate... as I have never seen a more grotesque creature on television... and once watched Rosanne's show.
One of the more subtle, yet embarrassing descrepancies, imo, about popular mormonism today is that there are a disproportionate amount of betas in the church. You look at the lives of the first three prophets, who were unapologetic polygynists, they were most definitely alphas. Even Wilfred Woodruff was probably an alpha, despite his denunciation of polygyny in 1892. But after that, beta-tude becomes a bit more prevalent.
I had secretly hoped that Mitt would blindside Obama by confronting him about Obama's support of the United Nations Agenda 21 (do a search if you are not familiar) that is being quietly implemented in your own back yard right now! What if Romney had repudiated Agenda 21 and promised to fight against its implementation? Obama certainly would not.
I also hoped he might surprise Obama again by having an open discussion in a very public forum of the proposed new taxes to be collected by the United Nations. (Yes, the UN wants to be a taxing jurisdiction that includes the WORLD, but the taxes happen to target those rich Americans.) These taxes include a tax on email and internet use, an aviation fuel tax, air transportation tax, a currency transactions tax, and a tax on all fossil fuels, including motor fuel, coal, oil, and natural gas. (All of the forms of energy the Americans have in abundance or consume mainly.) Go ahead. Do a search. What if Romney has repudiated any plan for the United Nations to tax this country? Obama certainly would not.
The basis for the lesser of two evil arguments has been examined and found wanting.
Dummies start with false premise and reach false conclusion. Film at 11.
Since you're still here ".", how about answering my question?
More United Nations taxation? How about a quote?
"Those are the most frequently discussed of a bevy of global tax proposals that have been put before the international community. Others include a tax on the international conventional arms trade, fines for ocean dumping, a tax on commercial fishing, a tax on Earth-orbiting satellites, a tax on the use of the electronic spectrum (for television, radio, cell phones, etc.), a tax on the profits of international businesses and even a tax on international advertising.
While the names and proposals are different, the vital undercurrent remains the same. The drive toward world taxation focuses on three key purposes, all of them objectionable: (1) making policy through taxation (for example, levying high taxes on gasoline in order to reduce use of fossil fuels); (2) generating revenue for the United Nations; and (3) redistributing income from richer nations like the United States to the poorer ones in the third world."
Center for Individual Freedom (CFIF)
"you're assuming that the smart are the morally good."
Oh, I rather doubt there were very many of the "morally good" in Napoleon's army. ;)
Candidates are told a million times before debates to avoid arguing with moderators. For one, it makes them look either weak and petty or like a bully, neither of which polls well. Secondly, every moment you spend arguing against the moderator is a moment you're not spending arguing against your actual opponent. So while slapping Crowley down would have upped Romney's alphaness, it very likely could have lost him the election.
And even though I'm not a Romney fan, I do want him to win just so we can all watch Andrew Sullivan live-blog his own suicide.
And even though I'm not a Romney fan, I do want him to win just so we can all watch Andrew Sullivan live-blog his own suicide.
See, I was hoping an Obama win would resultIin the nro staff doing the same thing...
All of the debates so far have been poorly moderated and this is guaranteed by the format.
Both debaters had their own microphone. (Very bad idea.) There should be ONE microphone that both debaters share when it is their turn to speak.
Time is a precious thing in a debate. The speakers are well-aware of when they go over their alloted time. The time clock should shut off the microphone at the end of the time. If the speaker does not want to be cut off mid-sentence, then he should wrap up and end his reply by the end of the time allowed.
This is not difficult to achieve. The technology is nothing short of primative....and totally effective.
(Like the first debate, Obama spoke for more minutes last night and both interrupted each other. Lousy debate setup. The moderator is supposed to moderate, not join the debate and not quize the speaker or do voice-over or redirect. The moderator's microphone should be shut off when either one is speaking. Has anyone heard of Robert's Rules of Order?)
Andrew Sullivan probably jerked off to Obama last night, just like the guy on NRO (forgot his name) jerked off to Palin.
Nate October 17, 2012 10:00 AM Actually... the moderator was the most distracting thing about the debate... as I have never seen a more grotesque creature on television... and once watched Rosanne's show.
Thanks a lot for that imagery! I had completely forgotten that Roseanne even existed! The horror!
Alphamitt Soup.
Vox, I am in total agreement in principle, but I can't help but wonder if Romney knows that berating the fat female moderator would only hurt his position. He has a fragile lead and any stand for principle, however honorable, could screw the pooch with this silly electorate. Remember, right now he is riding a wave of, "Hey Obama isn't awesome and you are the presentable viable alternative". Women have been his biggest boost. If all of a sudden he looks domineering to a woman, that will erode away. Hence, these debates are self-fulfilling which is why I don't watch them and cannot understand why any Republican would agree to participate in them without strict controls. Cliches and pandering overwhelm everything.
The only reason the bozos thought Rommney won last time was because he pulled the same crap liberals always use to win cool points and got away with it from a lazy Obama. Knowing that Obama would come out trained in only one method (angry and aggressive) for this debate, Romney's team should have had him set up as the wise and reserved one, parrying all of Obama's desperate hysterics. This is what I had hoped for. Instead I see that it was a crazy slugfest where nothing was decided. Clearly a blown opportunity for Romney to almost put this away.
All in all, Romney seems to be sitting all in at a poker table with 10s and hoping they will hold up. Or perhaps more aptly at this juncture, Romney is up by 1 and simply running up the middle from his own 10 with 3 minutes to go, hoping the other team won't win with a small late push and a chip shot field goal. We know how this usually turns out.
Say what you will, but I would have enjoyed watching Newt's fat ass in these debates. He would lose the election, but man would Obama and co. be made to look like the vapid, ninnies they are.
Your novella is coming along and I am enjoying it. Might need to look into the others when I'm done.
It will always be a dilemma for a white Republican in that spot. Go all alpha and assertive and you'll secretly impress a lot of people. At the same time, the MSM will have a fit, as white males are supposed to hang their heads down and apologize for every wrong for the last 2,000 years. How dare he talk to a (half) black man and womyn like that? What does he think this is...1830 or something?
Being a rich Mormon makes it even worse. He has the baggage of his church on race/polygamy as well. About the only thing worse would be a gun-totin' Southern Christian white male with an heavy accent.
Alpha, smalpha, regardless, "We The People" get a murderous, thieving, lying POS, either way.
Obummer's "Pink" campaign for the ladies, and Romulan's "I hire Goils too" position, are pretty much the same as a man entering a Churchian denomination, the boys will be taking it up the A** for the wimmins, and celebrating their position as the 'pool boy'.
Luckily, none of this horse hockey is sustainable over time, but witnessing the flailing awkwardness of these two flaming tards is too much for a thinking being to stomach, I tried to watch but all I could hear was Charlie Brown's teacher, over and over, waaaa, waaa, waaa, waaa, waaa, waaa..........
About the only thing worse would be a gun-totin' Southern Christian white male with an heavy accent.
If only Rick Perry hadn't been a corrupt idiot...he would be up by fifteen points...
No worries, the rand 2016 bandwagon is forming up, assuming there will be an election in 2016...
"Obummer's 'Pink, campaign for the ladies, and Romulan's "I hire Goils too" position"
Can you imagine if a candidate answered that feminazi's question by saying "I reject all that nonsense about women being underpaid" and went on to cogently explain his position? He'd be figuratively (if not literally) crucified.
The funny thing is debate and political discussions do not have to be so strained and awkward. Even just ten years ago watching the PM square off with Parliament all the time was not only informative, but entertaining. We literally are the dumbest 1st world country on Earth and we know it so we just say what the hell and don't expect any type of intelligence or actual logic/debating skill from our leaders.
It strikes me that if these two "candidates" existed 40 years ago or earlier, their respective parties would never be able to put them up for anything as it's frankly embarrassing. Debates should flow from existing knowledge of the facts and experience as that is what leaders will rely on in office, but now it has become memorizing sound bites and what to say that offends the least amount of people. This is why debates have been so awkward for so long. The candidates are reciting from crammed memory, always remebering what to do to maximize style points, instead of tackling issues naturally without regard to how obese black women in Toledo will perceive how I comb my hair.
It's nauseating and quite frankly I hate what this country has become.
Yeah, that was Andrew Sullivan's hope and change Obama spoke of last election.
You look at the lives of the first three prophets, who were unapologetic polygynists
They were Liars, first and foremost.
And the hierarchical, secret structure of the masonic institution itself produces subservient, obedient gamma males by design.
What if Romney had repudiated Agenda 21....
Impossible. He is a globalist himself.
Simple question: did he repudiate it in the state of Mass? Was/Is Mass a haven against the taxes you question, at GovRomney's bidding?
He had the power, authority, and platform to do so.
He certainly used his Governorship to promote gun-grabbing, Bankstas, a Marxist medical system, killing babies, etal. Such a good little obedient gamma mormon.
As VD hints, he is likely more evil than his (supposed) dialectical oppossite.
Hilariously, he IS the very things that the people who are going to vote for him claim to be against.
Ignorant, Pavlovian dogs, every one.
Can you imagine if a candidate answered that feminazi's question by saying "I reject all that nonsense about women being underpaid" and went on to cogently explain his position? He'd be figuratively (if not literally) crucified.
It would be even better if he went a step further and said that women should stay home and become housewives and raise children.
The problem, beyond any analysis of alpha and beta (as valid that is on this kabuki theathre) is that, simply put, the Republican campaign has done all that they can to capture the white female vote.
Which is very, very hard to do against the Magic Negro and his army of media lapdogs.
What I find funny is that nobody talks too much of the VP debate. Everybody lost on that one. Specially the people watching it.
Re Denninger and mittens on guns
Most in the gun rights groups already don't trust mittens, both showed they know little about guns. Anyone who pays attention to this stuff knows we have to be always on watch no matter who is in office. Worrying about underoos selling out on compromise applies to any issue, it applies to just about any GOP moron in office.
I had secretly hoped that Mitt would blindside Obama by confronting him about Obama's support of the United Nations Agenda 21 (do a search if you are not familiar) that is being quietly implemented in your own back yard right now! What if Romney had repudiated Agenda 21 and promised to fight against its implementation? Obama certainly would not.
I also hoped he might surprise Obama again by having an open discussion in a very public forum of the proposed new taxes to be collected by the United Nations. (Yes, the UN wants to be a taxing jurisdiction that includes the WORLD, but the taxes happen to target those rich Americans.) These taxes include a tax on email and internet use, an aviation fuel tax, air transportation tax, a currency transactions tax, and a tax on all fossil fuels, including motor fuel, coal, oil, and natural gas. (All of the forms of energy the Americans have in abundance or consume mainly.) Go ahead. Do a search. What if Romney has repudiated any plan for the United Nations to tax this country? Obama certainly would not.
DonReynolds, have you learned nothing in your time here? Romney, also a Progressive in the bi-factional ruling class, is just as onboard and ready to implement Agenda 21 and every other Globalist scheme they have.
All of that is coming ... unabated. The two-party system is essentially guaranteeing it.
Unbelievable! You Paulbots will say nothing good about Romney will you?
Obama an Alpha? You must be retarded! First he hides behind Hillary's skirt as she takes the Fall for Libya, and last night he hid firmly behind the Fat Ass of a Commie Lesbo as she did all the fighting for him!
Alpha? Hah! He's not enough of a man to be a Beta! He's an Omega!
Unbelievable! You Paulbots will say nothing good about Romney will you?
By all means, please tell us the good about Mitt.
"By all means, please tell us the good about Mitt."
Mitt has good hair.
By all means, please tell us the good about Mitt.
He'll be good at implementing all of the policies that Obama only talks about?
You Paulbots will say nothing good about Romney will you?
He is rich and handsome. He has a nice family and good executive hair.
Obama an Alpha? You must be retarded!
Who said Obama was an alpha? He's not, he is a gamma, assuming he isn't actually lambda.
Who said Obama was an alpha? He's not, he is a gamma, assuming he isn't actually lambda.
I've always thought of him as lambda.
More precisely, Lambda Lambda Lambda.
Unbelievable! You Paulbots will say nothing good about Romney will you?
He's very adept at financial rape.
Your turn, please enlighten us with tales of the splendid awesomeness of mittens.
See, I was hoping an Obama win would resultIin the nro staff doing the same thing...
Nah, Lowry will be fine as long as he and NR get to hang on to the "respectable, sophisticated conservative" label, which of course is granted by the MSM.
just like the guy on NRO (forgot his name) jerked off to Palin.
Better that then McCain, I suppose. YMMV
Unbelievable! You Paulbots will say nothing good about Romney will you?
11:50AM EDT October 16. 2012 - Former president George W. Bush reaffirmed his support of Mitt Romney on Tuesday, saying he would be a "great president" if elected.
Lincoln would probably vote for Mitt too.
Lincoln would probably vote for Mitt
Romney has always been a friend of the gays...
Lincoln would vote for whoever accomplished his vision. Lincoln would vote for the devil himself if it woul "save the Union."
The biggest applause line of the night was in favor of Barack Obama on the subject of LIBYA, for crying out loud.
QED. Mitt is done.
"Can you imagine if a candidate answered that feminazi's question by saying "I reject all that nonsense about women being underpaid" and went on to cogently explain his position? He'd be figuratively (if not literally) crucified."
Au contraire, if one relates the whole exchange to 'Game Theory', it was nothing but a 'sh*t test'.
He should have responded by saying:
1. Yes, teh wimminz r underpaid, and there is are effn good reason for it.
2. Teh wimminz, want all the cushy jobs, for real how many beotches are moaning like it's their first orgasm over getting a coal mining job or welding skyscrapers?
3. Wimminz, get pregnant. They take off time, they get sick more than men, they just don't put in the work hours that men do. Look at wimmin Doctors for example. We spend all this money educating them, then a few years down the road, they pop out a couple of brats, and work 2 days a week the rest of their lives. The value is just not there.
4. And finally, sit down, shad up, and make me some chocolate chip cookies.
If Mittins had said that to Candy, she would have left a stain on her chair begging for more.
Bullshit. You might not agree with it, but the claim is legitimate and defensible.
By all means, please legitimize and defend the claim that Romney is the lesser of two evils on gun control.
> Lincoln would probably vote for Mitt too.
I expect FDR would too. He knew it takes competent leadership to run the country into the ground and pave the way for the one world government to follow.
It would appear the Mitt defenders like to bitch about Mitt-bashing, but aren't really able back up their claims of his conservative small government ass kicking superiority.
Hmmm...
The biggest applause line of the night was in favor of Barack Obama on the subject of LIBYA, for crying out loud.QED. Mitt is done.
You're using qed wrong.
Very interesting psychological evaluation. I suppose the real alphas are the vampire squids who've been calling the shots for decades now as opposed to the well paid mountebank step-n-fetchits who read teleprompter announcements to entertain the idiocracy.
Anonymous raises an interesting point:
Republicans repeatedly make this mistake and give their opponents the edge every time with these puerile debates that the public hate. They should insist on having true debate moderators (they do exist!) and only take questions from real voters, not leftist swine reporters.
Yes they do - and have done so for decades running now. Are they really that hopelessly stupid and inept, or is this yet more proof (as if any were really required) that both nominal political parties are merely a single party which serves the ruling oligarchs while participating in scripted "contests" and "debate"?
Eye of Horus:
Alpha? Hah! He's not enough of a man to be a Beta! He's an Omega!
I expect the Mocha Messiah is really more of a Lambda, or at least a log-cabin Republican.
Scooby & some others.
If winning means taking s@it from fat slobs,especially female ones, regardless of what others may think about it, you ain't no winner and never will be. Who cares what a bunch of life's losers think about you.
"The time clock should shut off the microphone at the end of the time."
I don't know why the Republicans haven't demanded this. It removes the possibility of the moderator yielding more time to one candidate or the other.
Yahoo has been running one headline after another about the MSM Messiah. The latest is "Obama takes charge and wins debate."
While I'm not voting for Romney (the slightly lesser of two evils), the leftward bias is so clear. Imagine how bad it would be if Obama debated a conservative/libertarian with at least half a backbone.
Lincoln would vote for the devil himself if it woul "save the Union."
Or make the trains run on time. Therein lies the rub, what are you willing to trade for being plunged into evil?
Or make the trains run on time. Therein lies the rub, what are you willing to trade for being plunged into evil?
An iPhone in every home and fountains of the liquid gold of velveeta in every kitchen.
You're using qed wrong.
No, you're using your brain wrong.
"Actually... the moderator was the most distracting thing about the debate... as I have never seen a more grotesque creature on television... and once watched Rosanne's show." - Nate
Then don't Google the mom from "Here Comes Honey Boo Boo."
Then don't Google the mom from "Here Comes Honey Boo Boo."
OH DEAR GOD WHY DID I DO THAT?!?
I'm so sorry...it cannot be unseen! :-(
He is rich and handsome. He has a nice family and good executive hair.
So do I vote for the executive hair? Or stay home and drink?
Stay home and drink, right?
ZT: "It's all a farce. Two actors putting on a show..."
Agreed. The fact that no other presidential candidates from other parties had been invited to this dog and pony show demonstrates everything you need to know about how TPTB wish the public to choose.
"Applying "game" to this can only highlight the part that was played, not the nature of the actor."
Again, agreed.
As scoobius also pointed out, the main goal was to win over whatever undecided voters still remain, not to win chicks. Any attempt to put the female moderator in her place by an Alpha -- whether actual or feigned -- would have backfired and resulted in a loss of many of those voters.
Surely there must be Alpha-Politician hybrids who know this stuff, whether or not Romney is one of them.
Stay home and drink, right?
Given that you just saw what should be unseen, this is the correct course of action.
"Any attempt to put the female moderator in her place by an Alpha -- whether actual or feigned -- would have backfired and resulted in a loss of many of those voters."
A real Alpha could have told Candy off in such a way as to make her thank him for doing it. An angry, unattractive feminist like her, if she's not a lesbian, is desperately longing for even the slightest bit of male attention.
Noah B.: "A real Alpha could have told Candy off in such a way as to make her thank him for doing it."
Perhaps. Again, though, it wasn't Candy he was working on.
An angry, unattractive feminist like her, if she's not a lesbian, is desperately longing for even the slightest bit of male attention.
I think by "male attention" you mean "pizza".
A lot of contributors are right. If Romney indulged himself fighting against the house, he would have blown his chances at winning the election.
Since he's worked so hard to get where he is (where even a supporter is a moody monkey brain) his coolness under fire is a plus.
Have you noticed, his antidote contains specifics, such as releasing practical sources of energy, while Obama's antidote is the cluttered landscape of a socialist dream?
"I think by "male attention" you mean 'pizza'."
Possibly.
Jesus wasn't an alpha.
> Jesus wasn't an alpha.
Tell that to the money changers in the Temple.
I think by "male attention" you mean "pizza".
I think by "pizza" you mean "Party size pizza with double cheese, sausage, and bacon, and a 48 ounce chocolate milkshake to wash it down."
I think by "pizza" you mean "Party size pizza with double cheese, sausage, and bacon, and a 48 ounce chocolate milkshake to wash it down."
And by "Party size pizza with double cheese, sausage, and bacon, and a 48 ounce chocolate milkshake to wash it down" you mean "Rosie O'Donnell in a leather bustier".
Candy is 63, practices TM and is a vegetarian.... On that last point, she must eat by the bushel. She is divorced, had two kids and two step kids.
Think we could get her and Rosie O'Donnel to go into pro wrestling?
Clearly, her attackers must have thought she was a Romney supporter
"Think we could get her and Rosie O'Donnel to go into pro wrestling?"
Make it mud wrestling and you've got something. It's just too bad John Candy isn't still around to wrestle them both.
John October 17, 2012 1:16 PM
Lincoln would vote for whoever accomplished his vision. Lincoln would vote for the devil himself if it woul "save the Union."
Its worse than that:
A Man Possessed
"Jesus wasn't an alpha."
True.
Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega.
Rather trumps being a mere alpha, that.
"Candy is 63, practices TM and is a vegetarian...."
Her wiki page identifies her as 'Candy Alt Crowley'.
Do I smell the ever-present sulphurous fumes of the Chhhhhosen?
It'd be perfectly consistent behavior for a Cylon. If not, she's one of their mind-zombies, at the very least.
I believe I read somewhere, that the Framers were thinking about George Washington when defining the office of the President in the Constitution. I mean, he was sitting in the same room with them!
George was your basic Natural Alpha; tall, courageous (he did right well on Braddock's failed expedition), a Virginia aristocrat, good at cussin and swearin, etc. usw., and so forth.
When considering candidates for the Presidency, I think one should consider how they rate, next to G. Washington.
These latest two ain't anywhere within IRBM shot of him, morally, personally, ethically, or religiously.
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