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Saturday, November 17, 2012

Mandatory guinea pigs

The AMA contemplates "compulsory involvement in vaccine studies".  From a paper entitled "Should Participation in Vaccine Clinical Trials be Mandated?"
“If progression of promising vaccines from the lab to the clinic is to remain unaffected and financial inducement is an ethically unacceptable solution to the recruitment shortage, other strategies need to be considered. Compulsory involvement in vaccine studies is one alternative solution that is not as outlandish as it might seem on first consideration. Many societies already mandate that citizens undertake activities for the good of society; in several European countries registration for organ-donation has switched from “opt-in” (the current U.S. system) to “opt out” systems (in which those who do not specifically register as non-donors are presumed to consent to donation, and most societies expect citizens to undertake jury service when called upon.”
It goes without saying that this is monstrous.  But the fascinating thing here should be the response of those vaccine advocates who have repeatedly argued that the only reason there are no serious double-blind studies of any approved vaccine series is that it would be unethical to use people in such scientific experiments because they would not know if they had received placebos or the actual vaccines.  I'm curious to see if they will suddenly pivot and start arguing that while giving placebos - which are by definition harmless in themselves - is unethical, forcibly giving test vaccines to unwitting human lab rats is perfectly acceptable.

We already know they're morally and logically bankrupt, I'm mostly interested in learning how far down into the abyss they are willing to plunge.

Labels: ,

69 Comments:

Anonymous Jemison Thorsby November 17, 2012 7:23 PM  

It's a short walk from foisting constant social and economic experiments on an unwilling society, to mandating medical experiments on individuals. It's all about the worldview.

Anonymous duckman November 17, 2012 7:23 PM  

Haven't heard a splash yet.

Anonymous Mr Green Man November 17, 2012 7:31 PM  

This is one more step in the giant psychological experiment being run by the US government on the American people to determine the limits. Having proven that genital groping of children and the elderly while crowds watch on isn't a red line, they are going to eventually discover that there is no limit to what a broken and defeated dependent people will accept...just encourage the sexual libertines, that will pacify better than potato mash in vending machines.

Anonymous Jeigh Di November 17, 2012 7:32 PM  

Perhaps if the subjects are all pharmaceutical executives, doctors, and their families...

Anonymous Stilicho November 17, 2012 7:52 PM  

They do not see it as an abyss. They see it as a wormhole, with a brave new world on the other side. In the meantime, this will just pinch a bit...

Anonymous Chelm Wiseman November 17, 2012 8:21 PM  

Does AMA stand for the American Mengele Association?

Anonymous kh123 November 17, 2012 8:27 PM  

I'm surprised they didn't bring up income tax as a forced good.

Anonymous OCS November 17, 2012 8:30 PM  

What actually tipped me off was when those AMA people showed up in black coats chanting "Bonum commune communitatis" repeatedly while holding syringes.

Anonymous kh123 November 17, 2012 8:36 PM  

You know, rocketry and jet flight wouldn't be where it is today without the contributions of unwilling participants in both V2 range tests and high-altitude pressure chamber experiments. The AMA just may be onto something here...

Anonymous castricv November 17, 2012 8:49 PM  

Not to beat a dead horse, but might this astonishing trend toward "compulsory", compassionate medicine coincide with the ever increasing number of women in the field?? I dated a girl who was in med school that was very inclined toward both a big ego and "helping others" through science. While there is nothing wrong with this in theory, knowing her other womanly characteristics coupled with this new development is horrifying, but not surprising.

A woman who thinks she is right AND entitled to not be questioned because of her title or status is capable of making others do anything regardless of morality or principle.

As always I could be wrong.

Anonymous Anonymous November 17, 2012 8:56 PM  

The solution is simple: Test vaccines on members of the AMA.

Anonymous castricv November 17, 2012 8:57 PM  

I guess the reason this idea of women's involvement in this issue came up is because I cannot imagine any scenario where a group of male doctors pre-saturation of women would ever come up with this idea and then announce it publicly. It would have struck even the most arrogant of male doctors as obtrusive and ridiculous outside of some alien-invasion virus event.

Not only that, but men are acutely aware that when you force people to do something that is potentially dangerous to themselves or their children without any moral rationale, you don't just risk the patient's life, but your own. Woman have a built in shield in men themselves that protects their egos from this calculation. This, in a nutshell, has been the ongoing problem for 50 years or so now. Not only in this medical issue but Western civ as well. It got almost too good for women so they have forgotten themselves.....I digress.

Blogger LP 999/Eliza November 17, 2012 9:08 PM  

Such a horror show in the name of science and medicine.

Anonymous Noah B. November 17, 2012 9:12 PM  

If we're talking about what's for the good of society, and individual rights mean nothing, shouldn't Christina England be stood up against a wall and shot? That would certainly have a chilling effect on those who would propose horrendous violations of other individuals' rights, possibly saving countless lives and thereby contributing to a better society.

Anonymous Clay November 17, 2012 9:15 PM  

My daughter is smart. Very smart.

She had the massive innoculation shots of which we always speak of.

I always wonder, if she would would have been "smarter", wihtout them.

Anonymous FUBAR Nation (Ben) November 17, 2012 9:15 PM  

The AMA is the same organization that pushes the BS lipid hypothesis of heart disease, villainizing saturated fat and cholesterol which have nothing to do with heart disease.

You can than the idiot AMA for the obesity epidemic with the low fat hysteria.

Anonymous HardReturn November 17, 2012 9:23 PM  

Would Curie-Hultgreen syndrome also extend to AMA?

Anonymous Outlaw X November 17, 2012 9:29 PM  

"I always wonder, if she would would have been "smarter", wihtout them"

Girls,seem to be less affected by the vaccines than the boys.

Anonymous Outlaw X November 17, 2012 9:33 PM  

I went into convulsions in the 1960's after a vaccine 10 minutes later. Before we left the doctor office. We were checking out.

Anonymous Noah B. November 17, 2012 9:37 PM  

Correction: Susanne Sheehy and Joel Meyer

Anonymous Tom O. November 17, 2012 9:46 PM  

You can than the idiot AMA for the obesity epidemic with the low fat hysteria.

The only "cause" for the obesity epidemic is that people sit on their ass too much and eat too much.

Did you know that Adolf Hitler did a controlled medical study on 6 million Jews, and /not one/ of them got fat?

Anonymous rycamor November 17, 2012 10:12 PM  

Tom O. November 17, 2012 9:46 PM

You can than the idiot AMA for the obesity epidemic with the low fat hysteria.

The only "cause" for the obesity epidemic is that people sit on their ass too much and eat too much.


There's more to it than that. You can eat "too much" fresh vegetables and grass-fed beef, fish, eggs, and even cheese and heavy cream, and you won't turn into a shambling behemoth the way half our population is. The type of food, the types of drugs people are on, and even the emotional state of the individual have a lot to do with it. On the food side, it generally comes down to processed grain-based food, sugars, and corn syrup. Also, I suspect lack of adequate nutrition makes the body go into a starvation state which causes it to hoard fat.

Anonymous FUBAR Nation (Ben) November 17, 2012 10:19 PM  

Tom O. you are right about eating more and moving less. The problem is that low fat diets result in ravenous hunger and overeating.

If you are eating the garbage that is pushed by the government (whole grains) instead of eating nutrient dense foods that people have been eating forever, then you're going to have a problem.

Anonymous horsewithnonick November 17, 2012 10:43 PM  

“If [...] financial inducement is an ethically unacceptable solution to the recruitment shortage..."

"Compulsory involvement in vaccine studies is one alternative solution that is not as outlandish as it might seem on first consideration."

I can't imagine the abyss even going that deep - what festering, maggot-ridden minds these people must possess.

Anonymous karen November 17, 2012 10:47 PM  

It's long past time to stop these human predators.

Anonymous kh123 November 17, 2012 10:48 PM  

"Did you know that Adolf Hitler did a controlled medical study on 6 million Jews, and /not one/ of them got fat?"

Russia had several as well, applied on an even wider scale, and for much longer - The Butyrki Health Resort; as well as the Belomarathon, the Kolyma Low-Carb Gold Plan, Kulak Walkathons.

Anonymous kh123 November 17, 2012 11:01 PM  

...Speaking of which, I'd probably mentioned a few years ago stories of an abandoned work camp where skulls of prisoners were found around the medical station en-masse, sawn in half for whatever reason. Turns out it was Magadan, just inside the Arctic Circle. Recently saw a documentary where they confirmed its existence, and that photos taken of the procedure hinted that these were medical experiments, done for whatever lofty scientific reason, and apparently in some cases were performed while the patient was still alive. The cold seems to have preserved some of the bodies left on medical tables or in holding cells. I'm not sure if anyone knows why the experiments were performed; but this from the land where they seriously experimented on dogs to see if consciousness can be maintained when a head is completely detached from a body. Like Mengele, all done in the name of medicine.

AMA, take note: Progress demands sacrifice.

Blogger IM2L844 November 17, 2012 11:07 PM  

By doing absolutely nothing other than quitting using sugar in my coffee in the mornings, I lost 40 pounds in just under a year and then my weight stabilized and has stayed the same for nearly two years now.

Hey, I have a question one of you guys might be able to answer. I heard or read somewhere that, if you are going to eat fried foods and I am, it's actually better for you to use pure lard than vegetable oil and also that real butter is better for you than margarine and, over all, that whole milk is actually better for you than skim milk. True? Big Brother says no!

Anonymous FUBAR Nation (Ben) November 17, 2012 11:13 PM  

Of course it's true. Saturated fat is good for you. That being said, you will gain weight if you take in more calories than you burn so you shouldn't gorge yourself on these foods.

Lard is healthy while vegetable oil is absolutely terrible for you. The problem is that crap is in almost everything in the supermarket.

Never trust Big Brother.

Anonymous Idle Spectator November 17, 2012 11:50 PM  

See Vox, this is all part of world society entering the "crazy phase" again.

Much like the years leading up to World War II, with Dr. Josef Mengele or the Japanese Army with their secret Unit 731. Aside: Is that were they got the idea for Resident Evil? I wonder.

Then after it is all over and every calms down again, most of the experiments will be uncovered. Then a vow will be taken of "never again."


Until the cycle repeats itself.

Anonymous realmatt November 18, 2012 12:02 AM  

Did you know that Adolf Hitler did a controlled medical study on 6 million Jews, and /not one/ of them got fat?

He said glass of juice not gas the Jews!

Blogger mmaier2112 November 18, 2012 12:06 AM  

I've not have any vaccines in the last 20 years other than tetanus. Funny that my doctor said my last tetanus booster - which I got because I repeatedly punctured myself on old nails while working on my house - was good for 7 years (IIRC) but wanted me to do a booster for it before the time was up.

And that tetanus booster was "bundled" with something like whooping cough or some such.

I hadn't punctured myself so I declined. I think I might just be done with all vaccinations for the rest of my life.

Anonymous Idle Spectator November 18, 2012 12:07 AM  

Josef Mengele was an amateur compared to the Japanese.

THe Horror of Unit 731

While angry Jews were busy hunting down Nazis in Latin America using Star of Davids as ninja stars, like some kind of demented MacGyver, people like lieutenant colonel Ryoichi Naito from Unit 731 were busy in Tokyo founding Green Cross (Kabushiki Gaisha Midori Juji), one Japan's greatest pharmaceutical companies.

That's why I always laugh when people say the Japanese have been pacified. You round-eye fool!


But don't worry, nothing like that could ever happen in the US or Europe. We're safe.

Anonymous rycamor November 18, 2012 12:08 AM  

IM2L844, that's not the whole story with milk. Yes, whole milk (with the fat) will make you gain less weight than skim milk, ironically, BUT... watch this first.

After seeing, that, plus all the other things I've been reading about standard cow-factory milk, I stopped buying the stuff in plastic jugs completely. Even though it costs more, I buy organic milk from grass-fed cows. In fact, even that is not optimal, because it is pasteurized, which is yet again another part of the story of how milk has been ruined. Pasteurization only came about a century or so ago because so many farms switched from cows in an open pastured setting to cows kept in unsanitary feedlots and raised on nothing but grain, which is not the cow's natural diet. Pasteurization removes nutrients, changes the properties of the milk so it is less digestible, and makes it more likely to cause allergies.

Obviously, if you want to buy fresh unpasteurized milk, you do not want it coming from some nameless, faceless corporation. You want it from a local farmer who you trust to maintain sanitary conditions and good animal-raising practices, but our world has pushed us away from such relationships.

If you want something even better for you than natural, unpasteurized cow's milk, try unpasteurized goat's milk. Even better, get your own goats and milk them, so you are sure of the sanitary conditions. I'm hoping to get my goats milking again soon, so I can stop buying any milk.

Anonymous Dr. Idle Spectator November 18, 2012 12:20 AM  

Turns out it was Magadan, just inside the Arctic Circle. Recently saw a documentary where they confirmed its existence, and that photos taken of the procedure hinted that these were medical experiments, done for whatever lofty scientific reason

That was the Butugichag Corrective Labour Camp in Magadan Oblast; part of the gulag system. They had Uranium mines there too. There were rumors they were trying to cross-bred men with apes or something. Or comparing brainsssszz.

I wonder how they got people to volunteer. "You too can have a larger penis! Just sign on the dotted line. And I will not promise you will not not be loving the results in no time."

Anonymous Dr. Idle Spectator November 18, 2012 12:29 AM  

Ugly past of U.S. human experiments uncovered

Oh shit I was lied to! Don't worry though, I've received emphatic assurances that it'll never happen again.

My favorite quote: "As the supply of prisoners and mental patients dried up, researchers looked to other countries." Good thinkin'.

Anonymous jack November 18, 2012 12:40 AM  

Tom O. you are right about eating more and moving less. The problem is that low fat diets result in ravenous hunger and overeating.

I recco the zone system. Goggle it up. Have used it since about 1995 and swear by it. Following the zone, if you do it even half right, your weight stabilizes near where it should. It comes down if you are overweight and goes up if you are under.
On the zone if you ever get hungry you are doing something wrong. Only problem is the first few weeks where you can go into near withdrawal getting off the sugars and heavy carbs. All your carbs, and you need some, should be low glycemic.

Blogger Spacebunny November 18, 2012 2:12 AM  

I cannot imagine any scenario where a group of male doctors pre-saturation of women would ever come up with this idea and then announce it publicly. It would have struck even the most arrogant of male doctors as obtrusive and ridiculous outside of some alien-invasion virus event.

While you might possibly be correct about the announcing publicly aspect, you are dead wrong about the rest. You don't think so? The men in Tuskegee would like a word with you.

Anonymous Bobo November 18, 2012 3:52 AM  

IM2L844: "I heard or read somewhere that, if you are going to eat fried foods and I am, it's actually better for you to use pure lard than vegetable oil and also that real butter is better for you than margarine and, over all, that whole milk is actually better for you than skim milk. True? Big Brother says no!"

The longer vegetable oil is exposed to high temperatures the more saturated and toxic it becomes. If you must eat fries, make sure you eat them just after they replaced their oil. It may be that lard would be safer in that regard, if one compares it to average duration heat exposed oil. Anyway fresh oil is definitely better and raw peanuts/almonds and other nuts do wonders for cholesterol.

Anonymous VryeDenker November 18, 2012 4:10 AM  

bake your fries in the oven like God intended. Also sweet potatoes make better tasting fries than Vodka fruit.

Eat what (and as much as) your grandparents ate.

Anonymous Mudz November 18, 2012 5:26 AM  

OP:

I'm actually confused. Isn't double-blind studies what they do in hospitals anyway? Or are vaccines exempt from this?

I really hope this vaccine business isn't going the way you seem to be intimating, Vox. I'm a fan of the classic sci-fis as much as anyone, but I don't want to see a real life version. I would like paranoia to stay paranoia.

I've never paid much attention to this vaccine stuff in the past, but the more I read about it, the more it seems to be a bad joke. I actually find the hypocrisy, as you've detailed, more offensive than fascinating. I hope I'm just lacking some sort of context here, because if I'm not, it strains the imagination to think how they could not hear the neurons misfiring in their brains to make their logic work. It's kind of giving me one of those I-feel-sick headaches to read it. Wow, how about that, it's literally sickening.

You gotta think that either they're tremendous liars, or genuinely self-deluded with some sort of auto-bullshit mechanism built-in.

But if they do go the full monty, and announce a program of forcibly injecting citizens with diseases, then shouldn't we be able to instantly push them into doing a proper study at the same time? (Preferably, before. But you know, minimising damage in worst-case scenario).

Women Doctors:

It's easy to think of women that fit that self-centred self-entitlement sort of profile, but there are dudes that are pretty much the same. Women are just more memorable that way, to us. Maybe because those dudes either sullenly keep to themselves and think resentful thought while women seem to require their obnoxiousness to be acknowledged; or we just think of them as No True Men, while women are bound by the conduct of every single female we meet (or notice). It's hard to say.

Health:

If they're telling you they can design a healthier product by taking a natural one that animals use to nurse their young, and put it through a factory to slap a higher price on it, it should go without saying you should take it about as seriously as your President talking about God in his election campaign.

I'm pretty sure that cows possess the best processing equipment available. In fact, isn't that how scientists actually got a vaccine that didn't retard you? Anti-bodies from surviving cows?

Whenever TV told me I should eat less salt, or this and that, I just assumed that my best course of action was to recommend it to eat shit. I doubt I'm the only one.

Being healthy shouldn't take so much effort. Isn't that just how our bodies are supposed to be normally? Guess it's not as much of a problem here in NZ, though. Dairy farm country.

Blogger HerewardMW November 18, 2012 5:28 AM  

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that they find "financial inducement is ethically unacceptable" but compulsory involvement (i.e. using the power of the state which ultimately comes out of the barrel of a gun) is A OK.

Even for ivory tower lunatics this is strange. Not just disturbing and authoritarian, but downright odd. Paying people to take risks is immoral - forcing them to is fine. Don't they have anyone who point this stuff out to them and ask: is that really what you wanted to say?

Anonymous Dr. Idle Spectator, Yale Historian November 18, 2012 5:43 AM  

Josef Mengele in Brazil, from Spiegel Magazine

From page 1:
Mengele, terrified of being discovered, began chewing off the tips of his moustache hairs and swallowing them. After a few months, the hairs collected in his intestines into balls, blocking his digestive tract. It was a life-threatening condition.

From page 2:
"Even today, Josef Mengele wouldn't feel completely alone in Brazil. Children in Sao Paulo are still given the name Hitler -- as a first name. Even socialist Brazilian President Lula da Silva recently said in an interview that although he believes that Adolf Hitler was wrong, "he had something that I admire in a man: this fire, this passion to get involved in order to achieve something."

An intestinal hairball called a trichobezoar nearly killed Mengele? Groups of children in Brazil still named Hitler? My mind has been raped again from Deutschland über alles, tropical style.

Anonymous L.W. Dickel November 18, 2012 5:59 AM  

"My erection for Mitt Romney remains steadfast. I fear that my balls my actually explode.

If my followers think that they are waiting on my second "coming" they are sadly mistaken. They should be praying for my 50th coming!!!!(At least!!")--Jesus Christ, in Kirk Cameron's anus.

Anonymous Eduardo November 18, 2012 7:49 AM  

??? having an increase of blood flow in someone's penises could lead someone's balls to explode ???

Something tells me this person may never have had a erection... so maybe it is a SHE!

Anonymous Salt November 18, 2012 7:53 AM  

how far down into the abyss they are willing to plunge.

They're inquisitive. The bottom has to be down there, somewhere.

Anonymous Paradisum November 18, 2012 8:17 AM  

"Compulsory involvement in vaccine studies . . ."

I'm amused that some here are surprised. It's not as if there isn't already both a precedent and protocol for this situation. It's simple, in order of application:

1) Prisoners
2) Military
3) Public health workers
4) Public school children
5) Everyone

This will take far less effort on the part of the medical bureaucrats than you may believe. And you can blame lawyers yet again for aiding and abetting. I believe it was Ben Franklin who argued for the inclusion of a freedom of medical practitioners and health care in the Bill of Rights for the very reasons we're discussing here.

Anonymous DrTorch November 18, 2012 9:37 AM  

Paying people to take risks is immoral - forcing them to is fine. Don't they have anyone who point this stuff out to them and ask: is that really what you wanted to say?

Yeah, that stunned me too. But, since MPAI, that may be exactly what they're pushing.

Anonymous aero November 18, 2012 9:51 AM  

Pro choice
When we all belong to the government. The government does have the right to to choose.

Whom will the government choose?
The 47% that pay nothing.
The high school dropout.
The nonproductive.
Some of the criminals.

The elite already say there are too many people. It time to put those that are useless to some good.
All you have to do is tell them its free and the Idiots will come.

Anonymous rycamor November 18, 2012 10:03 AM  

The medical system wants to own you the same way the IRS and the Federal Reserve want to own you. We can say this is just about lust for power, but I think there is more to it.

A couple years ago someone here linked to an excellent lecture on modern language by Australian scholar Don Watson (a liberal, but at least he's the old-fashioned kind of up-front honest liberal I could have a conversation with). That led me to click through a few of his lectures until I found one on his visit to the USA. It's interesting to get a thoughtful outsider's perspective. One thing he said (speaking to a non-American audience) was "America is a society driven by ideas in a way that you will not find in any other society on Earth."

True, and this was our strength as a young nation, but it has been our undoing as a society, because we have been far too credulous, too quick to latch onto any idea that offers some sort of promise without considering the (intended and unintended) consequences.

Every institution in the USA wants to own you in some way or another, and this is not just because its leaders want power. It is because its leaders and its workers truly believe--with humorless devotion--in the driving ideal behind that institution, that they are in the right, that their work matters, that the ideas they serve are necessary for our country. Just talk to any public schoolteacher or IRS employee and you will see what I'm talking about.

Anonymous Bobo November 18, 2012 10:45 AM  

My dear Vrye, potato vodka is the worst type of vodka there is. Best vodka is made from grain. Although self distilled potato vodka in two pots is the way some us did things under the Iron Curtain. It stank the place up and the neighbours would call the militia and you'd be bust.

Anonymous Bobo November 18, 2012 10:48 AM  

Eduardo, it's a bodybuilding vegan atheist troll. He regularly posts here, Ed Feser's blog and on Crude Ideas.

Anonymous clk November 18, 2012 12:12 PM  

Its a single paper paraphrased on an anti-vaccine website .. hardly represents the official position of the AMA...

Anonymous Noah B. November 18, 2012 12:40 PM  

"Its a single paper paraphrased on an anti-vaccine website .. hardly represents the official position of the AMA.."

Then read the original paper on the Virtual Mentor site, which Vactruth has linked to in the article's footnotes.

Anonymous oregon mouse November 18, 2012 12:40 PM  

Medical corruption is particularly insidious because unlike the corrupt cop who liberally hands out beatings, the victim may never catch on that the procedure is not for their own good. The public wants to believe in the compassion of doctors and because illness involves pain and treatment involves pain (sometimes)they are eager to accept any rational given to them for why they must persevere in spite of the extreme discomfort. Just look at any cancer patient. Just ask Dr. Harold Shipman. Medicine attracts soziopaths and occasionally makes soziopaths out of otherwise normal people. I worked at a medical college hospital and had a fair amount of interaction with the various students and doctors. Many med students regard themselves as some sort of super special elect. They made the cut. They are ascending to the top of the hierarchy in their chosen field. Their occult knowledge gives them the right to wield power over others. Who is a patient to question their expertise?
All of the examples other posters have brought up involve times and cultures where women are unlikely to have played a major role in the atrocities, so medical sadism is most certainly not just a female issue. Women have their own brand of power hungry sadism. Combining the maternal instinct ("I know what's best for you!") with innate sadism and power is a terrible thing but the most devastating medical abuses are clearly the result of medical/government collusion.

Anonymous Noah B. November 18, 2012 12:41 PM  

Just to save you the suspense -- Vactruth didn't omit any key details from the original article. It was a serious proposal without the slightest hint of sarcasm.

Anonymous Godfrey November 18, 2012 12:55 PM  

Let’s face reality, the Russian Bolsheviks and German National Socialists were ahead of their time. I think the 20th century merely a prelude to the 21st.

Anonymous Godfrey November 18, 2012 12:58 PM  

Jeigh Di November 17, 2012 7:32 PM Perhaps if the subjects are all pharmaceutical executives, doctors, and their families...


You obviously don't know how it works in Amerika, more likely they'll start with blacks and poor whites... then the rest of us.

Anonymous oregon mouse November 18, 2012 1:09 PM  

"You obviously don't know how it works in Amerika, more likely they'll start with blacks and poor whites... then the rest of us"
they already do this sort of testing in thrid world
shit holes where informed consent is non-existent.

Anonymous Anonymous November 18, 2012 1:17 PM  

Godfrey,
Testing on negroes and their chillen is unwise, as they have a high probability of dying from a variety of "illnesses" other than actual diseases. Also, if these vaccines actually work, why would we want to preserve negroes? They are a disease in and of themselves.

- Detroit

Anonymous JI November 18, 2012 2:04 PM  

Let's also keep in mind that the AMA is a UNION. This would be like the UAW being able to force people to buy certain cars, or, more aptly, force them to be crash test dummies.

Anonymous Papapete November 18, 2012 3:11 PM  

There is a reason that the AMA is hemorrhaging members and losing influence. It has become a left-wing political organization only peripherally concerned with medicine. Over 3/4 of america's doctors say that the AMA doesn't represent their views. The AMA has become entirely irrelevant and no longer speaks for a majority of the nation's doctors.

As to the idea that women are somehow responsible for this, the loss of membership and influence of the AMA occurred at the same time as the growth of the number of female doctors and is ongoing.

Anonymous The Operative November 18, 2012 3:50 PM  

We're making a better world...all of them.

Anonymous Enoch Powell November 18, 2012 3:52 PM  

This is the sort of thinking that characterizes a left-wing mindset. The Leftist Elite fires God and appoints themselves to take His place. Then they feel justified in using "the Peepul" as guinea pigs and lab rats for every kind of insane social engineering. I have read a LOT about Vladimir Ulyanov and he is the prototype of every single "smart" hipster tyrant who hates and despises normal people. The AMA has simply taken the "Scientist as Promethean Genius" myth and it now permeates everything they think and do. My own doctor has utter contempt for me because I won't get the annual flu shot they so aggressively flog. He thinks it's evidence that I think I am a "tough guy" of some sort – that being a synonym for a right-wing extremist as viewed through their distorted, leftist filter.

Anonymous Tom B November 18, 2012 5:22 PM  

This is what they have already been doing with the vaccine regiment. My son went apeshit after taking his MMR, to the point my wife and I had to call the cops twice when he got violent. We began our own 10 week chelation therapy when the Dr. refused to do so, recommending that my son be given Thorazine! Now my son is no longer violent, but some of his mental sharpness is gone. He also has epilepsy (related to his Asperger's), which the seisure meds may be responsible for the loss of sharpness.

The medical establishment has been experimenting on us for years, helped along by Progressive politicians in both parties. What was the Tuskegee Experiment? Or the forced sterilizations of Blacks and Poor Whites in the South?

Anonymous kh123 November 18, 2012 6:27 PM  

"I have read a LOT about Vladimir Ulyanov and he is the prototype of every single "smart" hipster tyrant who hates and despises normal people."

Although you have to admit, it's a blessing in disguise that any potential hipster tyrant that can actually wield a true revolutionary's power is fewer and further between than in Lenin's time, given that they've forgone the 3-piece suits, reasonable facial hair, and ability to coherently orate, in exchange for elf uniforms and using "like" or "f*ck" every other third word.

Anonymous A Visitor November 18, 2012 8:26 PM  

I would like to point out that having several relatives in the medical field (as doctors) the following: only a quarter of medical professionals belong to the AMA. The three quarters that do not only read JAMA because, for better or for worse, it has a lot of pull. Finally, the three quarters that do not belong to the AMA believe the the 1/4 that does to be Communists.

Anonymous Susan November 19, 2012 8:45 AM  

As long as researchers/doctors continue to use the excuses of 'exploring the various avenues' or 'looking for a cure' or 'for the public interest', there is no bottom of your abyss VD. Classic ends justify the means kind of thinking.

Anonymous Anonymous November 22, 2012 2:01 AM  

I'm sure Rick Perry is willing to offer his daughter for any new Gardasil trials. With all the pharmaceutical moguls pushing the message of how safe their products are there should be a huge pool of human guinea pigs available from their staff. Between pro vaccine school board members, Doctors, Nurses, Scientist, etc. i bet we can get them plenty of fresh meat.

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