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Thursday, December 06, 2012

Expect more Californication

I have no problem with California and New York City jacking up their tax rates to the Moon... so long as they keep their residents there:
Gerald Prante, an economics professor at Lynchburg College in Virginia, and Austin John, a Lynchburg economics student, calculated marginal tax rates — the highest rates on the highest levels of income — for all 50 states. They combined state, federal and, where applicable, local income taxes, plus payroll taxes for Social Security and Medicare and included the deductibility of some taxes.

Proposition 30 added three percentage points to the marginal state income tax rate for California’s highest-income taxpayers, bringing it to 13.3 percent. That action raised California over other high-tax jurisdictions to a marginal rate of 51.9 percent, slightly higher than New York City’s level. Hawaii was the only other place with a calculated rate above 50 percent.
The problem, of course, is that higher taxes cause left-leaning voters who support them to flee those high-tax jurisdictions, who then Californicate their new places of residence.  And so the disease spreads.  Given that border walls present their own evils and are not presently possible without secession, I think the problem is best resolved by not permitting anyone with less than 18 years residence to vote on state and local affairs.  The mechanism is already there in the age-related voting laws, just make them dependent upon 18 years of residence rather than age.

One would hope that after 18 years, either some sense would have been inculcated into them, or more likely, they would have moved on again.

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46 Comments:

Anonymous Rex Little December 06, 2012 4:01 AM  

36 years ago, I moved to California to get away from the taxes and politicians in Massachusetts. Out of the frying pan. . .

Anonymous Difster December 06, 2012 4:13 AM  

I'm out of California and living in Austin, Texas now. No state income tax, good business environment and solid growth. Unfortunately in Austin (downtown anyway) there are a lot of hipsters. Target practice I guess.

But Austin is growing fast and it's a good place to own an IT shop right now.

I'd willingly tolerate not being able to vote for a long time on local issues if it kept liberals from invading the state and voting to be like the places they left.

Anonymous OCS December 06, 2012 4:23 AM  

Word to the mid-wits that are pontificating on moving to Hawaii in order to live in a "bastion of paradise": housing prices.

Even apartment rent over here costs as much as a mortgage. It's nuts...of the kukui variety.

Anonymous Anonymous December 06, 2012 5:54 AM  

The whole "tax on the rich!" thing is a way for upper class liberals to practice class warfare on the upper-middle class liberals (e.g. hipsters, professionals), by taking away their money and lavishing on the poor and the underclass. It's their form of "charity!". It's disgusting and super rich liberals should be shot.

But hey why should I care? Ins't this intra family warfare? Left-Liberal on Right-liberal?

Anonymous DrTorch December 06, 2012 6:50 AM  

"The problem, of course, is that higher taxes cause left-leaning voters who support them to flee those high-tax jurisdictions, who then Californicate their new places of residence. "

Yeah, I'm wondering if that's part of the plan.

Anonymous TheExpat December 06, 2012 7:00 AM  

"The problem, of course, is that higher taxes cause left-leaning voters who support them to flee those high-tax jurisdictions, who then Californicate their new places of residence. "

Yeah, I'm wondering if that's part of the plan.


Works for the Han Chinese.

Blogger tz December 06, 2012 7:38 AM  

Perhaps zero-tax should be writtrn intona place safe from mob injustice. Quick, pass (state) constitutional amendments.

Perhaps some form of the old southern tradition of the literacy test, but asking about hunting and such instead might help.

If we could buy alaska and the states in the lousiana purchase, maybe we can swap CA for Aztlan oil and return manhattan to the native americans, or maybe the original dutch owners.

Blogger LP 999/Eliza December 06, 2012 7:53 AM  

"Taxation is theft."

Blogger ProNorden December 06, 2012 8:01 AM  

Would you please install a Twitter connection button ?

Anonymous Rally December 06, 2012 8:06 AM  

I don't think that would work. The more educated and productive a person is the more likely they move around a lot. That leaves the voting to the free shit army.

Out of curiosity, how many readers here would qualify to vote?

I would not.

Anonymous Anonymous December 06, 2012 8:07 AM  

"Californication" will only make the (tragically) coming upheavals bloodier affairs. As Vox pointed out in another post, there's nowhere else to go, and Rednecks like me will only take so much when our homes of longstanding are being overrun by the invader, whether he's from Chihuahua, Baghdad, or Los Angeles!

Regards,
David Smith

Anonymous Bones December 06, 2012 8:13 AM  

"I think the problem is best resolved by not permitting anyone with less than 18 years residence to vote on state and local affairs. The mechanism is already there in the age-related voting laws, just make them dependent upon 18 years of residence rather than age."

This idea isn't constitutional. It would essentially be taxation without representation and violates the equal protection clause of the US Constitution. The chance it would stand Supreme Court scrutiny, especially considering that Obama will be packing the court with more liberal judges, is zero.

Secession really is the only viable option, but it would have to happen relatively soon since there are a lot of Red States that will turn blue in the next decade due to demographics.

Anonymous Bones December 06, 2012 8:33 AM  

Regarding a secession movement, it would have to be a peaceful one. Basically, you would have to win the in the arena of public opinion and have a region-wide vote (ala Quebec in Canada) with a clear majority.

Otherwise, a secessionist movement would be branded a terrorist group by the President, and the CIA along with the Special Forces would make the leaders of the secessionist groups "disappear" much like they currently make the leaders of al-Qaeda "disappear."

Blogger Joshua_D December 06, 2012 8:35 AM  

Bones December 06, 2012 8:13 AM

This idea isn't constitutional. It would essentially be taxation without representation and violates the equal protection clause of the US Constitution.


I don't remember, but it seems that I paid taxes when I worked part-time as a 16-year-old who couldn't vote. Isn't that taxation without representation? (But maybe I got all those taxes back in my return.)

Anonymous Bones December 06, 2012 8:46 AM  

"I don't remember, but it seems that I paid taxes when I worked part-time as a 16-year-old who couldn't vote. Isn't that taxation without representation?"

No, the reason you can't vote until you are 18 is because of the Twenty-Sixth Ammendment to the constitution:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-sixth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

In fact, 18 is the highest voting age any state or the federal government can set. Under the age of 18, you are a minor, and your interests are better served by your parent's voting ability.

Blogger LP 999/Eliza December 06, 2012 8:55 AM  

Poor Cali but they chose this path.

Anonymous MDH December 06, 2012 9:06 AM  

If the leftist high-tax supporters end up leaving the state, why does the state remain liberal?

Anonymous Oppa December 06, 2012 9:11 AM  

"If the leftist high-tax supporters end up leaving the state, why does the state remain liberal?"

Because the people that leave are generally not the most left-leaning. In fact, as they leave, they make the state they leave even more left-leaning since all that is left behind are the hardcore lefties.

Anonymous JI December 06, 2012 9:48 AM  

I am with you 100%, Vox! As soon as I saw a headline about the high tax rate in California, my first thought was, "Oh no, they're going to leave at any even faster rate, infecting the rest of us that much quicker." And how much you want to bet they vote for high taxes here, too.

Anonymous p-dawg December 06, 2012 9:58 AM  

@Difster

Welcome to Austin! We should grab a beer sometime. :)

Anonymous Mr. Nightstick December 06, 2012 10:44 AM  

How does Californication affect succession? Won't it work to prevent it?

Anonymous The other skeptic December 06, 2012 10:51 AM  

As more white men, usually homeless or alcoholic drifters, started showing up dead and mutilated on Miami's streets, the police thought the killer was a deranged Californian refugee. They never suspected the killings had been ordered by one of the city's revered black leaders.

Now, where have I heard that sort of thing before? LE proclaiming that a killer is white or some such.

(Apologies to Vietnam Vets for rubbing them out of the story.)

Anonymous Anonymous December 06, 2012 10:59 AM  

"If the leftist high-tax supporters end up leaving the state, why does the state remain liberal?"

The lefties leaving are the liberal tax paying variety - they want all the 'free' services....but don't like high taxes.

The ones that remain are part of the 47%, on welfare (1/3 of the U.S. welfare recipients live in California - which has 12% of the population), illegal aliens - millions and they use all the available resources including schools, medical, infrastructure, etc; high crime - which is a massive cost; etc.

All of these people (with the exception of the illegals) will vote for massive, bloated gov't - and why not? Free stuff.

So, the liberal taxpayers leave but hypocritically vote for the same services in their new lower tax state. I'm guessing cognitive dissonance or just plain dumb.

- Apollyon

Anonymous A Visitor December 06, 2012 11:02 AM  

I'd qualify to vote in my home state and that's it.

Austin, I've only been there once. I always got a kick outta "Keep Austin Weird" whereas in CS we always had "Keep College Station Normal". I do regret not going to South by Southwest or 6th Street at least once.

Anonymous Grendelizer December 06, 2012 11:23 AM  

Nothing is more frustrating than liberals and illegals screwing their new locales.

Anonymous Stilicho December 06, 2012 11:23 AM  

So, the liberal taxpayers leave but hypocritically vote for the same services in their new lower tax state. I'm guessing cognitive dissonance or just plain dumb.

MPAI and all that, but do not discount the short time preferences and locust-like behavior of the rabbit people (r-selected liberals). They literally cannot help themselves.

Anonymous Crispy December 06, 2012 12:38 PM  

Just need to convince the unwashed masses in California or New York to stop the exodus of "the bacon" by making emigrants liable for CA / NY taxes for several years after they leave the state.

Anonymous Sandra Cheeks December 06, 2012 12:39 PM  

"I'm out of California and living in Austin, Texas now. No state income tax, good business environment and solid growth."

Wish I was back in Texas,
The Californium is no place for a girl.
Wish I was in Texas,
Prettiest place in the world.
I guess deep in my heart
I'll always be a Texas girl

I wanna wake up in Texas
I miss those wide open skies.
I miss my 20 acres,
bar-b-ques and peacan pies?

When I'm so far from you, Texas,
all I can do-o is cry.


Anonymous Boris December 06, 2012 12:47 PM  

"The problem, of course, is that higher taxes cause left-leaning voters who support them to flee those high-tax jurisdictions, who then Californicate their new places of residence. And so the disease spreads."

So these people vote for tax increases then get their bill and say "Whoa, I'm leaving," leave, and then vote for tax increases in their new locale? That doesn't really make sense.

Even if these hypothetical liberals were this irrational, there is little reason to believe that they leave in such large numbers as to shift the voting patterns of their new jurisdictions.

Anonymous Tallen December 06, 2012 1:00 PM  

there is little reason to believe that they leave in such large numbers as to shift the voting patterns of their new jurisdictions

An intriguing claim. Care to explain why so many Mexicans came to the USA and are now voting to make it like Mexico?

Anonymous CLK December 06, 2012 1:03 PM  

"Secession really is the only viable option.... "

Look at all the sports teams that would have to move out of Texas .. the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL (you guys even play hockey down there in Texas ?) -- after all we can't grant expansion franchise to ever tom, dick and harry third world banana republic in central american. You guys would have to join Mexico and the other central american leagues,,, you would have to give up football and take up soccer -- but they will call it football anyway so maybe nobody will notice to begin with -- "Hey you all -- whats that, some new type formation. Too many kickers on the field"

Anonymous Elmer Fudge (friend of Sexual Chocolate) December 06, 2012 1:52 PM  

@Difster December 06, 2012 4:13 AM
@p-dawg December 06, 2012 9:58 AM

That does it! Both of you need to call me. p-dawg, we lost touch. Last time, we shared Shiners at Dry Creek. Time for us to go to the Flying Saucer, or Draught House, or Doc's on S. Congress, down from the Continental Club. (p-dawg, last I remember, they have Shiner Black on tap). Anyone else in Austin, let's all get together, and start a Vox Club. Contact me at dhh451@gmail.com 512-851-3361

Anonymous Ain December 06, 2012 2:47 PM  

The people that ruined the state aren't going to be the first to move out because they didn't vote in higher taxes for *themselves*. Of course they didn't.

Anonymous Ain December 06, 2012 2:48 PM  

"An intriguing claim. Care to explain why so many Mexicans came to the USA and are now voting to make it like Mexico?"

They're voting for free stuff. Poor people shouldn't be allowed to vote.

Anonymous zapbrannigan1 December 06, 2012 3:29 PM  

I'm an Austinite myself, though I'm from Houston originally. I wasn't aware there were so many of us at Vox Popoli.

I agree that Texas is a good place to live if you like a relatively non-intrusive government and low taxes. I went to school up in Indiana (the reddest of the reds in the Midwest, despite going for Obama in '08) and lived for a few years after graduation in Indianapolis. Great people up there. I also lived out in North Carolina for a few years and enjoyed it. But I always longed to return home to Texas. The strong independent streak running through the culture here and the open, welcoming nature of its citizens is very appealing to me.

I've been a lurker here for over a year now; the comments section is usually too rough-and-tumble for me. But, I do enjoy the give and take and usually come away more informed about the issue being debated.

Anonymous Daniel December 06, 2012 3:44 PM  

You've got that upside down CLK. The NFL had hoped to expand into Mexico before it sent its best and brightest en masse to clean our toilets. Secession simply allows the league to finally become truly international.

Then they can finally abandon the stupid dream of starting a team in London.

Please, Texas! Secede! We'll have an international Super Bowl and maybe a "World" Series that involves teams from more than one country!

Anonymous Pissed off in CA December 06, 2012 4:09 PM  

Please note that we who have jobs and are believers in freedom and want freedom for ourselves and our children DID NOT VOTE TO RAISE THE TAX ON OURSELVES FOR GOD'S SAKE. We will want to MOVE to get away from all the stupid illegals and sponges and South Central LA types for many reasons. Stop lumping us into the batch with the idiots.

Anonymous JCclimber December 06, 2012 4:09 PM  

Yes, always been a joy explaining "World Series" to friends from Japan.

By the way, not all Kalifornians are high tax supporters. There were a significant number of people who voted against Prop 30 and other tax hikes, it only won by a few %. And look at the Ron Paul support.

One interesting thing is taking a libertarian stance at ANY kind of social gathering in the San Francisco Bay Area. If I weren't married.....women's eyes absolutely LIGHT UP like a Christmas tree when you intelligently express a view that is contrary to herd think. They are so completely unused to anyone challenging them that they can't help themselves. It especially helps if you make the man they are with look like a pussified liberal...

Thanks for your help Vox in remembering that rhetoric is much more effective with liberals and women than using plain ol' logic. It's so much fun that it borders on being illegal in this state.

Anonymous JCclimber December 06, 2012 4:18 PM  

Another logical disconnect in Kali was the vote to abolish our (rarely used) death penalty and commute the sentences of the death row inmates to life with no parole. If liberals are so opposed to the death penalty as they claim to be, it should have passed like prunes through a dysentery patient.

Excerpt from a Kali article: "Many death row inmates oppose bid to halt executions
If Proposition 34 passed, such prisoners would be given less legal assistance than they have now. Many would rather gamble on being executed."

Since '78, we have executed 13 people. We have 724 inmates sitting on death row, sucking up massive legal resources and prison guard salaries.

Blogger JohnG December 06, 2012 4:44 PM  

Ugh. Kali. I'm going to end up having to move my mum and brother out of there.

Anonymous realmatt December 06, 2012 6:30 PM  

I just wanna live in the desert with a generator and a man made pond with some hot babes that stay 19.

is that so crazy?

Anonymous DonReynolds December 06, 2012 6:32 PM  

Vox...."I think the problem is best resolved by not permitting anyone with less than 18 years residence to vote on state and local affairs. The mechanism is already there in the age-related voting laws, just make them dependent upon 18 years of residence rather than age."

Not a bad idea, Vox. (I appreciate the way you think.) My own rule is you can vote if BOTH of your parents were citizens. This means that first generation immigrants (no matter how many there are) will not vote in any election during their own lifetime....but if both the first generation immigrants become naturalized, then their children will have the right to vote when they reach legal age.

There is no reason I am aware of why foreign citizens should be able to vote in our elections simply because they have been allowed permanent residency and naturalization. To quote George Bush, out of context, their natuaralization papers are just a goddam piece of paper and does not entitle them to participate in the voting process. Perhaps their children can learn what it means to be an American, learn to speak the language well enough to understand the culture and appreciate the values that we have here. But the idea of having recent immigrants from foreign cultures fully participate in our elections after only five years in the country is worse than treason. Only a Quisling would be in favor of surrendering the country to foreigners.


Anonymous DonReynolds December 06, 2012 6:44 PM  

zapbrannigan1..."I'm an Austinite myself, though I'm from Houston originally. I wasn't aware there were so many of us at Vox Popoli."

No comparison between Austin and Houston, as you know. I lived in Austin for a decade. My Dad is from Texas. And now I am proud to be an Austin refugee. The only thing I miss about Texas is the weather. I can remember sitting at a sidwalk cafe in 90 degree weather on New Year's Day. My wife at the time, used to get a big kick out of calling her Michigan relatives to ask them about the weather....then tell them how bad we have it in Austin. Yes, the weather is nice and the voters are entirely stupid.

Austin is a deep blue island in the middle of a red sea that is Texas. The only other people who vote blue in Texas are the mex down in the rio grande valley. I do not miss going to the grocery store and no one (at HEB) can speak enough English to tell me where I can find something in the store. Good luck to you in Austin, I truely wish you well...but sometimes you need to drive out into the real Texas and meet some of the real Texans....at least 50 miles from Austin....in any direction.


Anonymous Jack Amok December 06, 2012 10:13 PM  

36 years ago, I moved to California to get away from the taxes and politicians in Massachusetts. Out of the frying pan. . .

Like I've said, maybe us Californians should've just passed the Massaholes, Joiseyite and New Yawkers directly on to other states instead of letting them roost long enough to ruin our state.

Sorry Rex, don't take it personally, you probably weren't part of the problem. But everybody talks about Californication and never seems to realize California didn't hatch these people sui generis, they invaded from the rest of the US and colonized the place. 40 years ago, California was odd, but not insane. But the liberal in-migration continued, and by the early 90's, the state was lost. Really, as recently as 1992, California was a functional state, but then the Dems finally got hold of all the levers and started pulling them hard and fast. Within a generation the place is a complete disaster.

Anonymous zapbrannigan1 December 06, 2012 11:10 PM  

Hey Don,

Tried to respond earlier but my comment got eaten. Basically, I agree with your assessment. I'm a conservative guy and the Keep Austin Weird culture can get a little grating at times but it's mostly harmless. What I've noticed, however, is a general tendency among people who move to Austin from other parts of Texas to place it on a pedestal, and downgrade everywhere else. It's amazing how quickly this mindset can get to folks. I have two close friends from back home in Houston that live here as well and, while their political views have remained unchanged, neither has much of anything good to say about their hometown. They've been here for 5 - 6 years. I don't understand it. Still, Austin is a great city in which to raise a family.

It's funny: with his strong libertarian views and love of the wishbone offense (and the Texas Longhorns apparently), I kind of figured Vox for a Texan. I did not see Minnesota.

Anonymous Anonymous December 23, 2012 1:53 AM  

thanks for sharing.

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