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Thursday, January 31, 2013

Vaccine "safety" and the swine flu vaccine

I find it tragically unsurprising how even with more than 800 confirmed cases of something as rare as teenage narcolepsy staring them in the face, the vaccine providers are still staunchly holding to their usual position of "no causal link":
Emelie is one of around 800 children in Sweden and elsewhere in Europe who developed narcolepsy, an incurable sleep disorder, after being immunised with the Pandemrix H1N1 swine flu vaccine made by British drug maker GlaxoSmithKline in 2009.

Finland, Norway, Ireland and France have seen spikes in narcolepsy cases, too, and people familiar with the results of a soon-to-be-published study in Britain have told Reuters it will show a similar pattern in children there.

Their fate, coping with an illness that all but destroys normal life, is developing into what the health official who coordinated Sweden's vaccination campaign calls a "medical tragedy" that will demand rising scientific and medical attention.

Europe's drugs regulator has ruled Pandemrix should no longer be used in people aged under 20. The chief medical officer at GSK's vaccines division, Norman Begg, says his firm views the issue extremely seriously and is "absolutely committed to getting to the bottom of this", but adds there is not yet enough data or evidence to suggest a causal link.
Perhaps, as supposed to be the case with the increase in autism, what we're seeing here is nothing more than a sudden increase in the parental awareness of narcolepsy.... What one always has to keep in mind when hearing the pro-vaccine parrots squawking "no causal link, no causal link" is that the standard they use for a causal link would eliminate the link between "being shot in the head" and "death" in the vast majority of lethal shootings.

In most cases, unless someone keels over dead after receiving a vaccination while still in the doctor's office, the vaccine propagandists will claim that there is no link between the administration of the vaccine and the resultant harm that has been suffered by the individual receiving it.  Of course, having personally witnessed an individual collapse unconsciousness within two seconds of receiving a vaccine and hearing the doctor exclaim "oh, no", I tend to have a considerably more skeptical outlook concerning the purported safety of vaccines and the vaccine schedule than the average individual.

The undeniable fact of the matter is that vaccines are not entirely safe, nor as they as safe as the vaccine advocates claim they are.  The precise degree to which they are unsafe is completely unknown, by either side, because no real and replicable scientific experiments have been performed concerning the current U.S. vaccine schedule.

Furthermore, we also know for an absolute fact that the vaccine manufacturers cherry-pick their statistical studies purporting to demonstrate the safety of the products they are selling.  The only rational position one can take concerning the safety of vaccines is a cautiously skeptical one, particularly in light of the legal immunity granted to those who manufacture, sell, and administer them.

To be clear, I am not against all vaccines.  I even received a tetanus shot when my kneecap was torn open on the soccer field a few years ago.  But it is also perfectly clear to me that not all vaccines are equally safe, or equally necessary.

Labels:

80 Comments:

Anonymous Beth January 31, 2013 6:52 AM  

Well said. Have you seen the reports of a new hangover vaccine in-the-works? It's designed for anyone who consumes alcohol as a way to "discourage" alcohol use. If you get the vaccine and then have a drink, you'll become violently ill. Alcoholism no more!

Anonymous The Great Martini January 31, 2013 7:23 AM  

I have a feeling what you witnessed was a severe form of needle phobia. From the Wikipedia page:

People who suffer from vasovagal needle phobia fear the sight, thought, or feeling of needles or needle-like objects. The primary symptom of vasovagal fear is vasovagal syncope, or fainting due to a decrease of blood pressure.

Anonymous VD January 31, 2013 7:26 AM  

I have a feeling what you witnessed was a severe form of needle phobia.

It's a reasonable theory but not possible in this case.

Anonymous Beth January 31, 2013 7:31 AM  

The problem with vaccine reactions is that it's nearly impossible to get doctors to admit that a side effect could have been caused by a vaccine even when it's obvious. Doctors are taught that vaccines are safe and that's all there is to it. Any "side effect" must surely be in the patient's head! My neighbor's son developed hives and breathing problems within minutes of receiving his MMR, was administered epinephrine, and the doctor still said, "it's not a reaction. He can definitely continue the series."

Blogger TontoBubbaGoldstein January 31, 2013 7:32 AM  

Oh pu-lease, I had that shot and suffered no ill eff...... zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzs

Anonymous Rosalys January 31, 2013 7:38 AM  

I started receiving flu shots 5 years ago at the insistence of my husband and I have not gotten the flu since. For a number of years I would catch the flu every other year and then about 15 years ago I noticed I was catching it every third year. I had a bad reaction to my first shot, feeling as though I had a mild flu for about 2 days. Haven't had a reaction since. I know someone who died from the swine flu vaccine several decades ago. I wouldn't go anywhere near the swine flu vaccine of 3 years ago just because it was being pushed so hard by people I instinctively distrust (and because of the death of Mr. Stewart.)

Everyone is different and no medication works for everyone or the same way for everybody. They used to say that flu vaccine was beneficial for those with poor immune systems and older folks. Now they are pushing it for EVERYONE! That seems imprudent. We get daily updates on the news about how this year's flu is becoming an epidemic and PEOPLE ARE DYING!!!! Yet when one looks up past statistics one discovers that this season is pretty much on par with past flu season averages. Can no one tell the truth about anything anymore? Just give us the facts and let us make up our own minds, please!

Anonymous trk January 31, 2013 7:42 AM  

'Pandemics or WORST FLU EVER' helps to sell ad time, which is all that media companies care about. I wonder if evolutionist are pro/con vaccines...since getting a vaccine would interfere with natural selection...

Anonymous dh January 31, 2013 7:48 AM  

It it is also perfectly clear to me that not all vaccines are equally safe, or equally necessary.

It is abundantly clear that most people cannot gauge risk with anything close to reasonable levels. It is somewhat problematic to fix this, given most people are idiots.

Anonymous Disposable Guitar Hero January 31, 2013 7:48 AM  

Rabbit People/ vaccine link:

Every fall, it's the same old thing at my work. Get your flu vaccinations on such and such a date. Administrative assistants ask me, "when would you like me to schedule your flu shot?" My response: (same response given for last twenty-three years) "You know I don't put vaccines in my body".
Her response: "I just think its so crazy that you don't get a flu shot, what if you get the flu?"
My answer: "then I will more than likely get sick and take some time off to recover."
Her next question: "Well, well, well, what if you die?"
My answer: "my wife will score half a mill in life insurance and I'll no longer have to ANSWER YOUR STUPID QUESTIONS!!!!"
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

I think my daughter got Gastroparesis from the Gaurdisil vaccine. Although, I don't know if I can prove it. All I know, I almost got divorced over the whole vaccination issue.

Sigh.

Blogger Nate January 31, 2013 7:50 AM  

"Doctors are taught that vaccines are safe and that's all there is to it. "

This is a gross understatement. Its not just "taught". Its beaten into their heads. Remember our education system deliberately selects people who trust systems and work well in them. And people that make it all the way to med school and finish... are people who trust systems better and work in systems better than just about anyone else.

And yes... at the same time they learn about how drugs work and "there is no free lunch"... they are also taught that vaccines are that free lunch. And... just like the proverbial "Crust is the healthiest part of the bread"... they simply accept it.

Anonymous Splash Daddy January 31, 2013 7:56 AM  

Pediatricians tend to be rabbit people. Their primary skill is making moms feel comfortable. They can write perscriptions, refer you to a specialist, read growth charts, and based on a schedule tell their nurse to give you a shot. They no longer set broken bones or stitch up severe cuts. In an emergency you are better off finding a Boy Scout.

Anonymous Disposable Guitar Hero January 31, 2013 7:58 AM  

Strangely similar, I have been conditioned to avoid having copper clad lead projectiles penetrate my bodily sphere with great velocity. I avoid such by an aggressive tactical awareness of my surroundings, and the ability inflict the same conditions upon the administrator.
This has worked for me up to this point, just like avoidance of vaccination has worked for me up to this point.

ok, why did I say that? I think its time for me to go to work.
Have a great day folks.

Anonymous Outlaw X January 31, 2013 8:14 AM  

"Perhaps, as supposed to be the case with the increase in autism, what we're seeing here is nothing more than a sudden increase in the parental awareness of narcolepsy.... What one always has to keep in mind when hearing the pro-vaccine parrots squawking "no causal link, no causal link" is that the standard they use for a causal link would eliminate the link between "being shot in the head" and "death" in the vast majority of lethal shootings."

BS, they give you coupons down at the Walgreen's in FT Worth to get one. Not only are they free but you get paid to have a flu shot. Bring the kido's as well.

Anonymous Cryan Ryan January 31, 2013 8:29 AM  

Nate says..."Remember our education system deliberately selects people who trust systems and work well in them. And people that make it all the way to med school and finish... are people who trust systems better and work in systems better than just about anyone else."

This is true. My Sis has been a nurse for about 35 years.

I can assure you that if she were giving flu vaccinations to a group of kids, and each kid who got one immediately started flopping around on the floor, she would continue doing her job as long as there was a doctor there who told her not to stop.

Even if her own grandkids were in the group. You think I'm kidding?

Anonymous ODG January 31, 2013 8:37 AM  

So, it's just a matter of time before the Wil Smith "I Am Legend" becomes reality?

Anonymous Hayden January 31, 2013 9:00 AM  

Can anyone recommend any books on vaccines? Which are considered safe?

Anonymous Starbuck January 31, 2013 9:11 AM  

Last fall they offered flu vaccines here where I work. I turned down the offers to be vaccinated. People laughed and asked me if I like having the flu?! I told them no. They then said "Get the flu shot then!" I still didn't. Then around thanksgiving people who got the shots and had kids got hit with 3 different viruses. The first one was a headcold and very miserable. The second one was throwing up and the runs. The thrid one was in the chest and very miserable. The people that didn't have kids wether they got the flu shot or not didn't get sick. The people that had kids and didn't get the flu shot caught a cold like around Christmas but that was about it. So I then again asked these people who insisted I get the flu shot how they liked getting the flu. My boss said he wouldn't be getting one next year. He noticed the samething I did. People with kids who get the flu shot caught everything that was going around.

Anonymous JCB January 31, 2013 9:11 AM  

Hayden,

I don't think there are any that could be considered 100% "safe." Rather, there are some that may be worth the risk. I'll have to let others elaborate on that, but I suspect it will include vaccines for very serious conditions like polio and skip the ones for more minor ailments.

Anonymous Merrin January 31, 2013 9:11 AM  

Does anyone here know of any link between immunodeficiency and vaccinations? Or even any research into the area?

Not talking about AIDS either.

Blogger Joshua_D January 31, 2013 9:12 AM  

Outlaw X January 31, 2013 8:14 AM

"Perhaps, as supposed to be the case with the increase in autism, what we're seeing here is nothing more than a sudden increase in the parental awareness of narcolepsy.... What one always has to keep in mind when hearing the pro-vaccine parrots squawking "no causal link, no causal link" is that the standard they use for a causal link would eliminate the link between "being shot in the head" and "death" in the vast majority of lethal shootings."

BS, they give you coupons down at the Walgreen's in FT Worth to get one. Not only are they free but you get paid to have a flu shot. Bring the kido's as well.


"OK. You want a Big Mac and a large Coke. Do you want a flu shot with that?"

Anonymous Beth January 31, 2013 9:20 AM  

Can anyone recommend any books on vaccines? Which are considered safe?

Hayden, "What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Children's Vaccinations" is a fantastic starting point. While the doctor who wrote it still advocates for vaccines, she gives a lot of information like ingredients, side effects, and history of each shot. If you're looking for something a bit heavier, "Germs, Biological Warfare, Vaccinations: What You Need to Know" has a lot of information. While you'd be ill-pressed to find a physician who will admit that ALL vaccines have side effects, the truth is that there is no such thing as a "safe" vaccine. Anyone can have a reaction to any shot, although for kids, the combined ones are generally the worst since it's impossible to tell what portion of the vaccine a child had a reaction to if he does develop some symptoms.

Anonymous Outlaw X January 31, 2013 9:21 AM  

"OK. You want a Big Mac and a large Coke. Do you want a flu shot with that?"

Hey look buddy *** get a free Big Mac an a large Coke if I take the flu shot. You just don't know how loving they are? People like you need to be watched.

Anonymous stg58/Animal Mother January 31, 2013 9:23 AM  

"How to raise a vaccine free child" is a good one. My wife read that before she had oldest son. I think the author is a Kiwi, so you will get a different perspective than the American.

Blogger Doom January 31, 2013 9:25 AM  

Your such a girl! Take it and die like the rest. Bleh...

Yeah, no. I'm just as unsure as you, honestly. Hmm, why don't you pivot some stoog... uhrm... scienti... doctor... to do a real study. I'm almost sure the dread ilk could do all the work. As a leader, all you have to do is... lead, honestly. I do believe you know God's will enough to not allow the ilk to... stray... *cough* be bought *cough*

Anonymous zen0 January 31, 2013 9:27 AM  

Recent headlines


Nov. 15 2012 BC Nurses' Union continues fight over mandatory flu shots - CTV News

Nov 30 2012 B.C. backs off on flu-shot policy for nurses - British Columbia - CBC .

Anonymous The other skeptic January 31, 2013 9:30 AM  

Claims that the flu vaccine is only about 1.5% effective although I cannot find the paper that supports that.

Anonymous RedJack January 31, 2013 9:30 AM  

It is abundantly clear that most people cannot gauge risk with anything close to reasonable levels. It is somewhat problematic to fix this, given most people are idiots.


That is correct. The real trick is stop and think, what is the other guy getting out of this? In the case of vaccines, the pharma company gets greater sales of a product that may or may not work. The flu this year is actually mild compared to many of the "normal" strains that didn't make the news.
I get the shot every few years, but the only time that I got the flu was the year I also got vaccinated. It was the H1N1 strain, and knocked me on my but for two weeks. Flu vaccines are a best guess of what is the strain of the year.

Anonymous Outlaw X January 31, 2013 9:39 AM  

"That is correct. The real trick is stop and think, what is the other guy getting out of this? In the case of vaccines, the pharma company gets greater sales of a product that may or may not work. "

Vox may delete me for this, but the whole purpose fore the vaccines are to cause a pandemic panic in which people will role up their sleeves for anything. Someone tell me why They pay you to take them now?

I forgot the government cares about you.

I am a conspiracy theorist, don't you know?

Anonymous The other skeptic January 31, 2013 9:47 AM  

Vox may delete me for this, but the whole purpose fore the vaccines are to cause a pandemic panic in which people will role up their sleeves for anything. Someone tell me why They pay you to take them now?

This seems unlikely, as they do not have complete vaccine coverage, the number of cases of adverse reactions are not that high (like 5-10%) and even lower to the more severe adverse reactions, and they were mainly trying to force higher vaccination rates to keep pouring money into Big Pharma.

However, deaths among Social Security recipients would help the political classes.

Anonymous Curlytop January 31, 2013 9:56 AM  

@ The other skeptic


You need to go to Lancet's site www.thelancet.com to get the original study that most articles cite.

Under the search engine regarding infectious diseases, type "meta analysis influenza."

Anonymous Outlaw X January 31, 2013 9:58 AM  

"This seems unlikely, as they do not have complete vaccine coverage, the number of cases of adverse reactions are not that high (like 5-10%) and even lower to the more severe adverse reactions, and they were mainly trying to force higher vaccination rates to keep pouring money into Big Pharma."

Whatever? Never had the flu shot and haven't had the flu since 1985. (Patriots Bears). I don't think you are understanding what I am saying.

Blogger Survival Gardener, AKA David the Good January 31, 2013 10:02 AM  

I once got a shot from the docs
Which they said would keep me from pox
The dose was a doozy
I got weak and woozy
And had to ride home in a box

-Vidad

Anonymous harry12 January 31, 2013 10:08 AM  

Many, many, many years ago I was working for Motorola in Franklin Park, Illinois. We were assembling the BIG tv sets (they had nineteen inch CRTs). The company offered free influenza shots to the workers so my herd brain thought: OK, why not!

The after 'flu-shot-cold' had me in bed for a week. Worst cold I could remember having! It was the first year of my marrage and being an hourly worker then, my losing five days of wages was tough.

Many now consider my family 'anti-flu-vaccine' (and I'm sure a few other things that aren't directly mentioned).

Anonymous dh January 31, 2013 10:08 AM  


Whatever? Never had the flu shot and haven't had the flu since 1985. (Patriots Bears). I don't think you are understanding what I am saying.


There is some really interesting research ongoing about people with near complete immunity against all forms of very specific viruses. We already know that there is a tiny sliver of the population that is completely immune to HIV. Same for certain forms of cancer causing viruses, and for norovirus.

That's where the future is.

Anonymous Cary January 31, 2013 10:10 AM  

I found Robert Sears' The Vaccine Book a very helpful review when I examined this after my daughter was born 4 years ago. We ended up putting her on a delayed schedule for some vaccines and totally rejected others.

It is clear that the recommended schedule is way too many vaccines too quickly for young infants, and that the "science" is non-existent regarding the safety of a lot of the vaccines.

Blogger Survival Gardener, AKA David the Good January 31, 2013 10:11 AM  

There was a young man from the sticks
Who was immunized with three pricks
One or two in the vein
And a third in his brain
Till he yelled "get off me you hicks!"

-Vidad

Anonymous JartStar January 31, 2013 10:12 AM  

However, deaths among Social Security recipients would help the political classes.

I believe that a recent study recommended that people over the age of 60 stop getting the flu vaccine as they already have the immunity because the bugs aren't new but rather variants.

Probably the strongest case for the flu vaccine is to use the thimerosal free shots in kids. Healthy adults have a low health risk from the flu and the elderly don't benefit from the vaccination.

Blogger Survival Gardener, AKA David the Good January 31, 2013 10:15 AM  

Sorry. The limericks in the previous thread set me off.

Blame it on the vaccinations I got as a kid.

"After being treated with the DPT, the MMR, the WTF and the OMG, some children are more likely to get obsessed with patterns, particularly of a verbal nature. Thus far, the condition appears to be incurable and uninsurable and drives them to rhymes so turrable..."

-Vidad

Anonymous Outlaw X January 31, 2013 10:19 AM  

"Sorry. The limericks in the previous thread set me off."

I still liked them.

Blogger Survival Gardener, AKA David the Good January 31, 2013 10:24 AM  

There once was a shot for the flu
Which helped no one it is true
But the nice CDC
Gave a free one to me
And the mercury turned me all blue

-Vidad

Blogger Survival Gardener, AKA David the Good January 31, 2013 10:30 AM  

Roxy used to be sexy and zesty
But then caught some bad narcolepsy
Just one shot in the butt
And that poor little slut
Dozed off and drowned in her Pepsi

-Vidad

Blogger Survival Gardener, AKA David the Good January 31, 2013 10:32 AM  

I repent. I'm done. Dust and ashes, no rose colored glasses, I promise I'm done with my fun.

-Vidad

Blogger James Dixon January 31, 2013 10:34 AM  

> The flu this year is actually mild compared to many of the "normal" strains that didn't make the news.

Symptom wise, yes. It seems to be much better at spreading, however.

Anonymous Vidad January 31, 2013 10:36 AM  

On a serious note, I'm getting pretty tired of folks condemning us for not vaccinating. I have no idea where they're getting their blind trust in the system, but I don't want any part of it. I wonder what my IQ would be if I didn't grow up on the vaccine schedule, never fell on my head, and never sucked on the lead weights at the bottom of the curtain pulls as a child.

Anonymous RedJack January 31, 2013 10:37 AM  

Dixon.

Thay may be an effect of the vaccinations (the spreading part).

However, I don't trust the data. We have much better reporting of flu cases now than even 10 years ago.

Blogger Giraffe January 31, 2013 10:48 AM  

Vidad was spending his time
composing bad medicine rhymes
spouting vaccine fears
he drew blood from out ears
thank God he gave up his crime

Anonymous Josh January 31, 2013 10:54 AM  

Roses are red
Bacon is also red
Poems are hard
Bacon

Anonymous Curlytop January 31, 2013 11:02 AM  

Regarding this year's flu, when the "outbreak" began at the end of Dec, early Jan, did you notice all the harping that the infected were "unvaccinated." It was hammered to death for about a week until it became very apparent that this wasn't the case.

Just from my personal circles, I was hearing from friends working in the field in Cinci, Tampa, to SC that "it didn't matter whether you received the flu shot" this year.

So then they 86'd that plot point and went on to "any and all symptoms" could be the flu. The local shortbus news station trotted out to Atlanta and had the same buffoon from the CDC stating that flu doesn't have to include fever, doesn't have congestion, or it does, or...or...or....but get your flu shot! IT's really been quite comical to listen to the talking points.

Anonymous Cryan Ryan January 31, 2013 11:04 AM  

The only thing I have to say,
Is - this will be my last limerick today,
You can all rest assured,
That this last poetic turd,
Will prove that crime doesn't pay.

Anonymous DonReynolds January 31, 2013 11:04 AM  

I took my oldest to the pediatrician a few weeks after she was born, signed all of the forms absolving everyone of any adverse effect from her first immunization, and she got her first shot. AFTER the immunization, the physician calmly explained that sometimes this causes "brain damage", but if that happens, we can discuss it when she is brought back. He then produced a small brown bottle and said that this shot often causes fever, some swelling, and pain for a few days. He said to give her this med to relieve those symptoms. After a couple of doses, we noticed that she seemed to be more bothered by the medicine than anything else. So I dipped my finger in the bottle to get a taste, maybe it just tastes bad. It set my mouth on fire! It was so heavy with alcohol, I could not imagine anyone putting a full dose in their mouth. It would be like liquid fire. No wonder my newborn daughter screamed bloody murder when she got her medication. But why would a freakin pediatrician prescribe a med that he knew would be a burning torture to a newborn? Yes, the same thing was commonly available in alcohol-free form. (I had been regular with gin and a pipe smoker for decades. No wonder what effect it would have on an infant.) I decided the physician was at least incompetent and maybe a sadistical bastard. Either way, my daughter would not have any more immunizations until they were required for school. By the time she started school, very few were actually required. The other kids did not have the same initial experience. We waited until they were 6 years old, which had no adverse effects.

Working in a medical environment, the nurses tried to pressure me to into getting with the immunization program. But I always shut them up pretty fast when I said, "fine....I will not be signing any of the forms and I will hold you personally responsible if there are any adverse outcomes." Suddenly, it was no longer important to the nurses.

Anonymous bw January 31, 2013 11:08 AM  

particularly in light of the legal immunity granted VD
Tells one all they need to know, unless they're a TBeliever.
Why should the vaccinated care about those that do not.
They actually work....right? They should just point and laugh.

Blogger ashepherd January 31, 2013 11:13 AM  

"My neighbor's son developed hives and breathing problems within minutes of receiving his MMR, was administered epinephrine, and the doctor still said, "it's not a reaction. He can definitely continue the series."

Medicine is a business. Doctors are so regulated by insurance companies and regulatory bodies (like the CDC) and constrained by concern for "reputation" that they have to toe the line. In the past few years I've heard of more and more life threatening misdiagnosis.

I recently experience high blood pressure after stopping all my natural supplements and was told in no uncertain terms by a doctor and a nurse that NO supplement can reduce blood pressure especially if all they do is thin the blood. Two days after I resumed my supplements which are known to thin the blood, my blood pressure dropped 20%. I recommend they put 100 weight oil in their car and see if the oil pressure stays the same.

Anonymous dr alton oschner January 31, 2013 11:29 AM  

Those Amish are dropping like flies. Always have. Always will.

And taxpayers have been funding Pharma/Walgreens flu shots for years with Gubmint buying the supplies and Walgreeens doling out very cheap or free.
And the laws in place from children to adults in the workplace?
Just more Benevolence. Keep telling yourself it's just about the money.
And as for Polio, I'm sure they have removed the cancer/monkey virus' by this point, surely.

Anonymous Testing123 January 31, 2013 11:33 AM  

Totally Off Topic: Just finished reading, A Throne of Bones. It was excellent book, and was a whole lot of fun to read. I am looking forward to the next book in the series.
AVE!!

Anonymous Anonymous January 31, 2013 11:38 AM  

I suggest to all readers to learn about all the possible side-effects of vaccines, flu shots, etc., before letting your doctor give you the shot. Lots of information online now about what vaccines contain, and the possible side-effects.
I got a flu shot 3 years ago, 3 or 4 days later I came down with Bell's Palsy ; One possible side effect of the flu shot: I found out the hard way.
I'm in my late 50's. Never had any health problems until I got that damn flu shot. I now feel and look alot older than my age. Before the shot, I felt and looked alot younger than my age.
Learn as much as you can about the possible side effects, then decide if you want to take the chance.
It's a gamble. Know that you're gambling before you get the shot : The vaccines/flu shots contain alot of insidious ingredients. Joe

Anonymous JohnS January 31, 2013 11:43 AM  

Anyone know the pluses (if any) for the shingles vaccination they've been running nonstop adds for on simplevision? My mom (retired nurse, of course) seems to have her mind set on getting it. My skeptical response isn't having much effect...

Anonymous NewAnubis January 31, 2013 11:47 AM  

I have sidestepped the flu for nearly a decade now utilizing the same procedure: Reishi Mushroom. It's a God given natural immuno-boost that has helped mitigate and prevent maladies for literally thousands of years long before big-pharma inculcated the collective.

Anonymous Jack Amok January 31, 2013 12:34 PM  

It is abundantly clear that most people cannot gauge risk with anything close to reasonable levels. It is somewhat problematic to fix this, given most people are idiots.

I've mentioned Hypomania before, and I do think it is the thing that allows people to make reasonable judgements about risk. People without that gene have a tough time remaining rational when considering risk, and tend to latch onto claims of zero-risk, and become good at just not seeing risk once they've bought into something.

Vaccines are one of the ultimate rabbit endeavors. They get pissed at you for not getting one because they think your failure to vaccinate puts them at risk. Stupid rabbits, how can they possibly be at risk if they've already been vaccinated?

Doh!


"Crust is the healthiest part of the bread"...

The more I learn about carbs and wheat, the more I think the holes left in the bread by yeast bubbles are the healthiest part.

Alcohol should probably be 50% of your average daily carb intake.


Does anyone here know of any link between immunodeficiency and vaccinations?

Don't know of one with vaccinations. I think the biggest immunodeficiency links are with Vitamin D deficiency. We've scared everyone so badly about skin cancer, people don't get enough sun.

Blogger tz January 31, 2013 12:34 PM  

The vaccinators just want the big bucks so there can be no talk of risk-reward, e.g. If this teenager gets the flu, he might have a few unpleasant days, but is unlikely to have any lasting harm v.s. a health care worker who if they get the flu will spread it to many immune-compromised patients and kill them, or someone with a compromised respiratory system that the flu would be a serious threat.

I would apply it to any medicine. Unless you have a serious chronic condition, you shouldn't be on any medication. If you get ill, you might need something for a time. But the world seems to be in bed with big-pharma

Anonymous Susan January 31, 2013 1:27 PM  

I love how the feds admitted one year that the flu that was going around that year was not the same one which the shot was supposed to help. Morons.

My first and only flu shot was back in the mid 80's. It worked. I had a low grade flu problem for several months. Will never get a shot ever again.

Since my kids have been out of school and on their own since the 90's hubby and I have avoided just about every flu and cold bug that comes around every year. Not having anything to do with the germ culture factories called schools really helps.

Anonymous HH January 31, 2013 1:28 PM  

100% is not possible when dealing with real systems. There certainly are vaccines that have proven to be great benefit to mankind: polio, small pox .. and there are certainly more that exist or will exist in the future that will be in the similar category of benefits far outweigh the risks... but the flu vaccine always seemed to be a low benefit vs risk .. at least for normal healthy people. I haven't have a flu shot in my entire life.. I have gotten the flu maybe 5 times that I can remember in my entire adult life. But there are simple public health and personal choice solutions to many diseases and these should be exhausted before resorting to a vaccine...IMHO...

Anonymous Loki of Asgard January 31, 2013 1:32 PM  

You must give your daughters Gardasil
Lest with HPV they become ill
Abstinence is a jape
And besides, what of rape?
And for side effects, Merck has a pill

Anonymous HH January 31, 2013 1:41 PM  

"Since my kids have been out of school and on their own since the 90's hubby and I have avoided just about every flu and cold bug that comes around every year. Not having anything to do with the germ culture factories called schools really helps."

Vaccines are easy ... now kids shouldn't got to school when they are sick but many times there's no choice ... no sick time for Mom or dad, no grandparents ... so the kids go off to school. So to the rescue comes the promise of an easy fix... but the reality is the problem is deeper and the solution needs to be more comprehensive.. but its not cheap...

Its like mandating sick time for food service employees ... how the business community has argued against that because it costs money .. but who wants sick people handling food .. whats the true cost to society just so some business men can make more short term profit.

Or it like demanding smaller government, lower taxes ... who pays for the sewers, or the USDA inspectors .... no problem .. lets irradiate food so we can get rid of inspectors and these mega food farms can still drag your steak through a pile of cow poop. Under fund or outsource sewage treatment so that ever time it rains we have to close the beaches just so that politicians can say no new taxes, smaller government.

I know that the PS students don't read the Jungle anymore but maybe the HS student do ... free enterprise, smaller government, less regulation .. we have seen the effects of unfettered capitalism...

Anonymous Vidad January 31, 2013 1:47 PM  

@ Loki

Nice.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard January 31, 2013 1:47 PM  

Or it like demanding smaller government, lower taxes ... who pays for the sewers, or the USDA inspectors .... no problem .. lets irradiate food so we can get rid of inspectors and these mega food farms can still drag your steak through a pile of cow poop. Under fund or outsource sewage treatment so that ever time it rains we have to close the beaches just so that politicians can say no new taxes, smaller government.

If Farmer Jones were not here to feed us, we should starve.

Anonymous Porky January 31, 2013 1:57 PM  


Doctor gives a shot
Says it will prevent the flu
Just a little prick

Anonymous catahoula January 31, 2013 1:59 PM  

After the husband had Guillain-Barre, (during which every single doctor asked if he'd had the flu shot-he had not) his rheumatologist and gp very daintily advised that it would not be recommended for him to ever get one.

Blogger Amy Haines January 31, 2013 2:44 PM  

@Merrin,

Emily Deans ponders the connection between the immune system and mental disorders, specifically schizophrenia, in this post: http://evolutionarypsychiatry.blogspot.com/2013/01/is-schizophrenia-autoimmune-disease.html

Wooo wonders about the connection between over-activating/over-stimulating the immune system (either via vaccination or chronic illness) and the possibilities for mental illness, autism, and I would add my own category of learning disabilities.

The immune system is complex and starts mostly with our gut and its biota; leukocytes are the footsoldiers of Generalissimo Colon and his well-orchestrated army.

Blogger Amy Haines January 31, 2013 2:44 PM  

ooops, linkie for Wooo's post: http://itsthewooo.blogspot.com/2013/01/immune-system-activation-and-chronic.html

Blogger The Aardvark January 31, 2013 5:34 PM  

The side effects list for one flu vaccine does not warn of "seizures". "Seizure-like movements" is the best they can admit to.

Anonymous The Refusers January 31, 2013 5:44 PM  

Do You Want a Flu Shot?

Our Seattle band the Refusers has an indie hit song on this subject with that very title.

The Refusers are currently ranked #2 out of 1900 indie rock bands in Seattle on Reverbnation.

The Refusers stand for Vaccine Freedom - the right to refuse the medical industrial complex's poisons.

Listen to Do You Want a Flu Shot for free at the link below to get a musical perspective on the flu shot.

http://www.reverbnation.com/therefusers/song/15464450-do-you-want-a-flu-shot

Anonymous Outlaw X January 31, 2013 5:56 PM  

Refusers, good music, can play a guitar. Good job.

Anonymous Outlaw X January 31, 2013 6:23 PM  

"First do no Harm." You boys related to JJ Cale? Ya'll got some great music. I'll just leave it there. You guys are talented, going to share this with my buddies.

Blogger Rantor January 31, 2013 7:07 PM  

Getting ready to goto Africa, four shots last week, feel like crap this week. Two more shots next week. If the trip gets cancelled, I'll be pissed.

22 years in the Air Force means lots of shots, but I've noticed no problems. I've noticed no problems. I've noticed... What was that?

I had a bud get sudden onset rheumatoid arthritis as an outcome of the gulf war. He had a lot of shots all at once. Typical gulf war syndrome. With several years of diet and treatment, he's mostly better. Able to work and live a normal life. Of course the government doesn't want to admit the accents were an issue.

Blogger Rantor January 31, 2013 7:08 PM  

Curse spell check. Accents should be vaccines.

Blogger The Aardvark January 31, 2013 7:29 PM  

Vidad, non-vaccinating is the new homeschooling.

Anonymous Wendy January 31, 2013 8:59 PM  

I had a bud get sudden onset rheumatoid arthritis as an outcome of the gulf war. He had a lot of shots all at once. Typical gulf war syndrome.

A woman my husband works with who was in one of the gulf wars has Crohn's and Lupus. Apparently the US admits some responsibility since VA is covering her treatments now, or perhaps they're just being nice?

Blogger Rantor January 31, 2013 9:37 PM  

@Wendy, they won't admit the vaccines are the cause, but about any ailment that you get while on active duty is covered by VA when you separate or retire from service. If you do all the right paperwork, they are actually pretty good about taking care of you. If you fill it out wrong, late, or can't convince them of the problem, you'll probably be screwed.

Anonymous Merrin February 01, 2013 7:24 AM  

@ Jack Amok and Amy Haines:

Thanks. I should have been more clear. When I said immunodeficiency I meant primary immunodeficiency such as CVID (hypogammaglobulinemia), SCID (bubble boy syndrome) etc. I will check out the Woo's blog.

I have CVID and in ~ 50% of cases doctors have no idea where it comes from. I wonder whether exposure to to many vaccines at too young an age overwhelms the immune system and weakens it permanently.

Anonymous Anonymous April 08, 2013 12:44 AM  

thanks for sharing...

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