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Monday, June 24, 2013

A novel excuse

The SFWA's Damien Walter has produced a novel excuse for not being able to defend his beliefs in public:
You're only as intelligent as the cretin you're arguing with on the internet. Remember that the next time you're tempted to debate Vox Day.
His excuse makes no sense at all. If one is arguing with a cretin, it is very, very easy to demonstrate that he is a cretin and to point out the flaws in his arguments.  And it is even easier for unbiased third parties to not only observe whose arguments are better, but which of the two interlocutors is more intelligent.

This ease of observation, in fact, is why most people, including more than a few who are not terribly well-disposed towards me, readily acknowledge that I am extremely intelligent.  Not so much because I can successfully defend my own positions, but because I am usually able to demonstrate that I understand my opponent's position much better than he does himself.  That's one of the things that has rendered the inflation/deflation debate so interesting in comparison with past debates; both my opponent and I are reasonably well-versed in most of the arguments on both sides.

People like John Scalzi and PZ Myers don't run away from public debates with me because I am insufficiently intelligent, but because they know, on the basis of their past encounters with me, that I can easily shoot down their arguments while they cannot even scratch mine.  Such individuals are intellectually careless and their positions are largely emotion-based, which makes it very easy for any logically-minded individual to detect the flaws in their argument and exploit them.

Remember, it was only last week that I publicly humiliated PZ in his very own field of biology, and moreover, did it in passing.  Although I have to admit, that was a surprise to me.  As as low as my opinion is of the man, it never occurred to me that anyone with a PhD in biology could possibly fail to recognize that "human" and "homo sapiens sapiens" are not perfect synonyms.

The "crackpot" excuse doesn't hold up well in the eyes of anyone who has read my blog for more than a week. And, of course, the "platform" excuse rings increasingly hollow because my own platform is already considerably larger than most of my critics. So it's interesting to see this has resulted in new and increasingly nonsensical excuses being produced by the likes of Walter.

Notice that for all the posturing and shrieking of the crowd that Mike Resnick described as "screamers", not a single individual, not a single white knight, has dare to even attempt to defend their equalitarian position or substantively address my inequalitarian one.  They have a growing panoply of absurd excuses, but the real reason is they don't because they know they can't do it successfully.

UPDATE: It's amusing how the Left is so convinced that their views must be the popular perspective that they retreat to delusional positions rather than admit the obvious:  "I think a half decent data analyst could also prove that most of VDs followers are sock-puppets as well."

He most certainly could not.  First, I have no followers, I have readers.  Second, none of them are sock-puppets.  Unlike numerous lefties, I have no need to sock-puppet because a fair number of people enjoy reading my opinions, and some of them, over time, come to agree with a few of them. But neither my readership nor my wife are fictitious. Just deal with it. Denial only makes one look insane.

Labels: ,

217 Comments:

1 – 200 of 217 Newer› Newest»
Anonymous Salt June 24, 2013 4:40 PM  

If one is arguing with a cretin, it is very, very easy to demonstrate that he is a cretin and to point out the flaws in his arguments.

Not to the cretin or those whom support it, otherwise MPAI would not exist.

Anonymous Daniel June 24, 2013 4:43 PM  

You're only as intelligent as the cretin you're arguing with on the internet.

...tweets a chap who went after Requires Hate for being a "trust fund kid."

Anonymous Josh June 24, 2013 4:46 PM  

The "crackpot" excuse doesn't hold up well in the eyes of anyone who has read my blog for more than a week.

Well, you could always start posting on some of your more heterodox views....

Anonymous Emperor of Icecream June 24, 2013 4:47 PM  

"You're only as intelligent as the cretin you're arguing with on the internet. Remember that the next time you're tempted to debate Vox Day.
"

Kind of him not to cretinize you. Usually retards aren't that charitable.

Anonymous Scintan June 24, 2013 4:53 PM  

including more than a few who are terribly well-disposed towards me

I may be misreading this, but it seems to me that you must have meant "aren't" terribly well-disposed towards you.

Blogger TontoBubbaGoldstein June 24, 2013 4:53 PM  

I'm from South Carolina.


Used to be called "The Iodine State".


Just sayin'........

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 4:54 PM  

"That's one of the things that has rendered the inflation/deflation debate so interesting in comparison with past debates; both my opponent and I are reasonably well-versed in most of the arguments on both sides."

The fact is either of us could make either case effectively. So what you have is a real substantive debate instead of rhetoric thrown back and forth. We're explaining things and exposing the logic and reasoning as we go. People can decide for themselves based on the reasoning and logic.... not the fireworks.

Sad though... lots of folks really wanted fireworks.

Anonymous Daniel June 24, 2013 5:00 PM  

Of course, he goes after the Ilk, too. That makes damien a complete retard, I guess, accounting for Tad.

I think a half decent data analyst could also prove that most of VDs followers are sock-puppets as well.

How does Walter's magical debate mirror work when he takes on a mob of sockpuppets? Is he as smart as the smartest one, or dumb as the dumbest one? Or is he a sock?

Anonymous Mike M. June 24, 2013 5:06 PM  

Having a batle of wits with an unarmed opponent may be annoying, but not impossible.

Anonymous Josh June 24, 2013 5:06 PM  

When will the debate restart?

Anonymous Daniel June 24, 2013 5:12 PM  

I wonder if Damien Walter doesn't dispute his parking tickets because people will confuse him for a meter maid.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 5:20 PM  

"When will the debate restart?"

I should just go ahead and Post Hangman's Body Count...

Blogger IM2L844 June 24, 2013 5:21 PM  

How does Walter's magical debate mirror work when he takes on a mob of sockpuppets? Is he as smart as the smartest one, or dumb as the dumbest one? Or is he a sock?

NOT-RABBIT! NOT-RABBIT!

Not-rabbits are always trying to work those pesky facts and whatnot into the debate. It's not fair!

Anonymous Giraffe June 24, 2013 5:28 PM  

He simply forgot a comma. His tweet was addressing you, not about you.

Anonymous Mr. Rational June 24, 2013 5:30 PM  

it was only last week that I publicly humiliated PZ in his very own field of biology, and moreover, did it in passing.

While your statement was true, you were shooting fish in a barrel.  Myers, though he obviously understands evolution and just how rapidly it works (his lecture on selection for coloration in caterpillars is a great intro to the subject), CANNOT admit that it applies to humans without winding up like Rushton, Richwine or Watson.

Myers' public position is hog-tied by his employment and social sphere... but so are most of his opponents on that very issue.

Blogger MattW June 24, 2013 5:31 PM  

Regarding who's smarter in a debate (not exactly on topic, but related):

I don't think the person that wins the argument is always right. It just means they're better at arguing/debate. One of my brothers in law is very progressive, very smart, and exceptional at debating. He knows when to push, when to pull back, when to use humor or righteous (self-righteous?) anger, and I often concede to him because I'm simply not as good as he is at that type of debating and it does no good to continue when he has clearly beat me. However I almost never agree with him when it's done.

Anyway, just thought I'd share.

Anonymous K. Tempest Blimpette and a Stack of Pancakes 'n' Shit June 24, 2013 5:32 PM  

One thing that's amusing about the SF of KKK is that they know people opposed to them don't comment on their blogs because they'll be deleted. Why even bother? Scalzi runs his blog like an OCD nun with the ruler ready to smack the naughty fingers.

They equally know comments here won't be deleted. They choose not to argue out because the truth is their egos far surpass their accomplishments and experience in life and they must then fall back on it's all too obvious to argue and if you don't "get it" about "intersectionality" and "privilege" you just never will.

Anonymous jack June 24, 2013 5:32 PM  

Well spoken by Vox. I'm looking forward to the inflation debate starting up again.
These screamers at SFWA and other places are getting too predictable and boring. Besides my ears need the rest.

Anonymous jack June 24, 2013 5:36 PM  

I kike K. Tempest's second paragraph above and agree with it. Good observation.
It would be interesting to do a Bell curve on the amount of money made by the entirety of the SFWA membership, if you could find the figures, then correlate it to name. THAT would be interesting indeed to consider.

Anonymous jack June 24, 2013 5:37 PM  

That was 'like' above. I would like for no crap thrown upon me for that typing error, though it is funny.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 5:44 PM  

"They choose not to argue out because the truth is their egos far surpass their accomplishments and experience in life and they must then fall back on it's all too obvious to argue and if you don't "get it" about "intersectionality" and "privilege" you just never will."

I call this the Harley Davidson debate technique. Harley owners have said for decades... "If I have to explain it to you... you'll never understand."

Its pure bullshit rhetoric.

Anonymous K. Tempest Deep Fried Segregationist Racist Macy's Day Balloon With Titanium Moorings June 24, 2013 5:51 PM  

"K Tempest Bradford ‏@tinytempest 7h

"Went for a 30 minute walk, Yay! Now tired and don't want to do laundry. Boo."

https://twitter.com/tinytempest/status/349171045074358272

Hahahahahaha. A feminist's version of the Inca Trail.

And now for a 30 min. meal.

Tiny Teeny Tempest, the anti-racist, Moby anti-Dick. Later, 30 yards of Ace bandages and a long nap and then a vat of Jello with Cheese Balls inside followed by half a hog and 35 tons of fish sticks with steak tartar eaten with a snow shovel.

Blogger TontoBubbaGoldstein June 24, 2013 5:53 PM  

That was 'like' above. I would like for no crap thrown upon me for that typing error, though it is funny.


Don't joo worry. The Dread Ilk would NEVER make fun of a typo....

Anonymous Huckleberry - est. 1977 June 24, 2013 5:54 PM  

Sad though... lots of folks really wanted fireworks

As I said at the time, we were expecting the debate equivalent of Ali/Frazier, fearful of getting Tyson/Holyfield.
Looking back, it's really more like Holyfield/Bowe, where Fan Man descended into the ring, delaying the fight until the spectators were finished beating Fan Man to a pulp.

Anonymous Noah B. June 24, 2013 5:57 PM  

So Nate, what's your preferred bike, with reasonable budget constraints kept in mind?

Anonymous Huckleberry - est. 1977 June 24, 2013 6:04 PM  

what's your preferred bike

What type of riding do you want to do?

Anonymous Noah B. June 24, 2013 6:14 PM  

Is there anything that works fairly well both on-road and off-road?

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 6:15 PM  

Doesn't matter Huck. BMW GS (800/1100/1150/1200/1200WC) does it all (except for singletrack woods riding) and does it all well.

Anonymous Noah B. June 24, 2013 6:16 PM  

I've only ever ridden a Goldwing... nice bike as long as you keep moving, but very heavy and totally unsuitable for off-road.

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 6:16 PM  

Don't overlook the Tenere and Vstrom for budget choices. But mostly the tenere.

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 6:20 PM  

Noah, We are probably gonna get hit with the OT stick. My email is displayed when you click my moniker. feel free to correspond. Nate will chime in probably, too.

Anonymous Aliette de Racists Know Oriental Bikes June 24, 2013 6:25 PM  

Get one of those 4 stroke 100 cc they only sell in Asia. They take entire families, ride through rice paddies, in the rain, up the side of volcanoes, on the highway fast enough to kill you several times over, along paths, onto sidewalks, across unfinished bridges on a piece of cement only a yard wide, on dirt roads, and they're generally little beasts of fun.

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 6:25 PM  

A Rukus!

Blogger Aviator4 June 24, 2013 6:27 PM  

I thought you guys were talking about actual road/MTB bikes instead of motorcycles. I was about to get into the discussion by bragging about my Niner Air 9 Carbon.

Anonymous N.K. Lickspittle Racist June 24, 2013 6:37 PM  

Read this racist circular logic that pretty much sums up the SFWA's happy version of the KKK. Whites and men are never right and women and non-whites never wrong. Elegant. AND they're anti-racists. hahahah.

http://www.strangehorizons.com/2013/20130624/loenenruiz-c.shtml

I love reading this stuff; I really do. These people are absolute morons.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 6:39 PM  

Noah

You should get any bike you choose... so long as you choose a BMW.

If you're commuting I would look at the Fs.... or an R1150r or an R1200r. Those r1XXXr's are do it all bikes. You can make them into tourers, or commuters, or adventure bikes with accessories. If you're into real road riding... the answer is an RT.

JAC talks the talk about his GS... but never the less he is continually mucking about with his windscreen and such... and more than once I have caught him ogling my fairing with lust filled eyes.

I am full devotee in the cult of BMW. I make no apologies.

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 6:40 PM  

One thing that's amusing about the SF of KKK is that they know people opposed to them don't comment on their blogs because they'll be deleted.

And they wonder why no one reads their blogs. They don't understand that monologues are less interesting than dialogues, or that being challenged regularly is the best way to refine one's thinking.

Anonymous Huckleberry - est. 1977 June 24, 2013 6:45 PM  

Dollar for dollar the BMW is the best bike for your money, but if you're looking for something under 8K, I really like Kawasaki's KLX. You could probably get a lightly used one for under 5K.
Be warned, though, its more dirt than street.
If you don't mind old bikes and if you can find one, any Bultaco from the late 60s or early 70s with a rebuilt engine and a straight frame will give a great off-road bike that really likes the highway also. Sherpa or Matador.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 6:47 PM  

I would avoid the KLX. JAC had two... and it didn't work out well. if under 5k is a priority... then I would consider a honda something or other... or a v-strom.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 6:48 PM  

"I thought you guys were talking about actual road/MTB bikes instead of motorcycles. I was about to get into the discussion by bragging about my Niner Air 9 Carbon."

Fag.

Anonymous Randy M June 24, 2013 6:50 PM  

Admit it, you have a little bobble bird hitting F5 all day to inflate your pageviews.

Any halfway decent data analyst could prove that.

Anonymous Damo June 24, 2013 6:57 PM  

Vox dear, you do realise that "Daniel" is quite obviously you, obsessively commenting on your own blog post? How. Very. Amusing.

Anonymous Salt June 24, 2013 6:59 PM  

BMW is a great bike, but I really would like to check out one of these

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 7:13 PM  

And who could blame you Salt?

Take a look at Royal Enfield too if you're into that sort of thing. The quality control was suspect in the early 2000s but since 2010 has gotten not just better... but very good.

Anonymous zen0 June 24, 2013 7:14 PM  

Ok, I admit it. Damo is my sock puppet.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 24, 2013 7:15 PM  

"People like John Scalzi and PZ Myers don't run away from public debates with me because I am insufficiently intelligent, but because they know, on the basis of their past encounters with me, that I can easily shoot down their arguments while they cannot even scratch mine."

No. People choose not to debate you for the same reason they choose not to roll around in piles of Sh*t in order to demonstrate that Sh*t smells bad.

Anonymous jaciii June 24, 2013 7:15 PM  

Klx is great. As is the klr. My brother is confused. but the klr is a poor man's bike if he can only have one.

Anonymous Salt June 24, 2013 7:16 PM  

I looked at an Enfield. I'll stick with my '75 850 Commando for now.

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 7:21 PM  

That bike is too cool for you, Salt.

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 7:25 PM  

@ Writers gawking at VD -

but Writers Gawking at VD did not miss an opportunity to demonstrate the aroma of pure chickenshit.

Blogger The Great and Powerful Oz June 24, 2013 7:29 PM  

I think it would be a lot of fun to argue with Vox Day, I just want to make sure I pick a field I am quite competent in.

Maybe the C programming language and how horribly it has stunted processor design....

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 7:30 PM  

No. People choose not to debate you for the same reason they choose not to roll around in piles of Sh*t in order to demonstrate that Sh*t smells bad.

No, because if that were true, they wouldn't have volunteered as critics in the first place. The obvious fact is that while they are quite willing to, as you say, roll around in it, they aren't willing to risk the public unmasking that could result from doing more than sniping at a distance.

Smarter individuals than Scalzi and Myers are quite willing to debate me, and some have in fact done so. Some have fared reasonably well, others considerably less so. And the running away from debate has caused them a lot more reputational damage than beating me in a debate possibly could. Which, of course, is why I continue to rub their noses in the cowardice... and will continue to do so until they finally find some balls and dare to show up.

PZ actually might one day if his audience continues to dwindle and mine continues to grow. He's arrogant enough to think he might be able to win if the subject was sufficiently favorable to him and he's not necessarily wrong. I'd be very surprised if Scalzi ever did; he is far too insecure and invested in his identity as the scholarship boy to ever take the risk of being publicly humiliated after all of his posturing.

Anonymous FP June 24, 2013 7:31 PM  

Speaking of motorcycles, do the new Triumphs have a good rep? They look good but that is the extent of my knowledge on bikes.

Anonymous K. Tempest Racist and a Lard Sandwich June 24, 2013 7:33 PM  

Hi Gawk. Here's a simple thought used before here you morons can't wrap your heads around, as if it's a 9nth dimensional puzzle inside folded geometry.

What is a heterosexual who writes obsessively (daily to weekly) about gays and what they write is negative 100% of the time?

What is a black person who writes obsessively about whites and what they write is negative 100% of the time?

The fact you people consider that some riddle of the ages tells me that you in fact can do almost nothing in life, other than go through unoriginal conformist motions. You can drive a car, you can Tweet, you can dress yourself. But in real terms, how can you actually be considered a thinker when you can't and won't address something obvious to a 6 yr. old?

To you, those questions are some great gulf you simply cannot pass. You're getting almost into cat-brain territory.

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 7:34 PM  

No. People choose not to debate you for the same reason they choose not to roll around in piles of Sh*t in order to demonstrate that Sh*t smells bad.

And yet here you are, disputing my contentions in precisely the manner they fear. Are you the sort of beast who enjoys rolling around in Sh*t? Or are you simply full of it?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 7:38 PM  

'Speaking of motorcycles, do the new Triumphs have a good rep? They look good but that is the extent of my knowledge on bikes."

They are amazing. Almost all of them.

Anonymous Stickwick June 24, 2013 7:43 PM  

"I think a half decent data analyst could also prove that most of VDs followers are sock-puppets as well."

Ye gods, that's lame. How many readers who are generally favorable to VD actually comment here on a regular basis? Twenty? Fifty? It's not in the realm of possibility that out of the roughly 2.5 billion Internet-connected people on this planet, there might actually be of the order 10-100 quasi-like-minded people who, over the years, managed to find this blog by way of VD's columns and books and would voice favorable opinions? Every time I think these losers can't get any dumber, they go out of their way to prove me wrong.

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 7:48 PM  

Stickwick, if they knew who and what you are, it would probably make them cry. It violates their most basic perceptions of the universe.

Anonymous Damo June 24, 2013 7:49 PM  

Stickwick is you as well Vox.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:10 PM  

I can't believe I confused the KLX and the KLR.

The KLX is amazing. Plenty of posts on my blog about mine... and the adventures we had.

Anonymous Saladin Ahmed, Anti-White Muslim Racist and Pay Pal Begger June 24, 2013 8:11 PM  

Obvious, why did you even write that? You guys are just saying the same thing using different words. Do you have any idea how demented your insular culture is for even thinking it's anti-racist, or anti-sexist?

If one cannot make simple comparisons, which is the essence of debate, then you have nothing but these stupid circular analogies that mean something to you but look like your backside running away to me.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:12 PM  

"Maybe they won't participate in a public debate with you for the same reason that the Crimson Tide football team doesn't face off against Tuscaloosa High."

The trouble with this assertion...is the fact that PZ Meyers always refuses to debate... everyone.

Its rather like Sister Mary's School for the Blind asserting that they are undefeated national champions without ever bothering to field a team.

Anonymous Godfrey June 24, 2013 8:13 PM  

The "Progressives" insult. The Liberals just exhibit a blank stare.

Anonymous Laz June 24, 2013 8:17 PM  

"Not so much because I can successfully defend my own positions,..."

Case in point: Vox has still not given a link to this supposed organization with the word "dyke" in the title that Christine Quinn belongs to.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 8:18 PM  

Maybe they won't participate in a public debate with you for the same reason that the Crimson Tide football team doesn't face off against Tuscaloosa High.

Well, if we are to speculate...

Maybe they avoid debate because they are actually twelve-year-old girls, only pretending to be those they claim to be.

Indeed, maybe they are actually cats who can haz cheezburgr.

Maybe Chuck Norris (by the bye, who in the cosmos is this Chuck Norris?) threatened to divide by zero should they respond.

Maybe it's you, maybe it's me, maybe it's just the constant rhythm of the sea.

Maybe they could tell us why not, but then they would have to kill us.

Quizas, quizas, quizas...

Anonymous Jim Hines, always up for a good talk about rape and links to anti-white racist web sites June 24, 2013 8:18 PM  

I agree with the Muslim Racist except there should've been some analogy about rape. Like, "I don't rape cuz no woman is good enough for me."

Moral points for that.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 24, 2013 8:21 PM  

"No, because if that were true, they wouldn't have volunteered as critics in the first place."

Pointing to the Sh*t and warning of its smell isn't the same as being afraid of the sh*t.

For example, one need not take up in debate with someone who can't tell the difference between a savage and a well-schooled, well-read, intelligent cosmopolitan in order to point out that one's observation skills are highly deteriorated.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:22 PM  

"Case in point: Vox has still not given a link to this supposed organization with the word "dyke" in the title that Christine Quinn belongs to."

Couldn't possibly be Dykes on Bikes could it?

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 24, 2013 8:22 PM  

"And yet here you are, disputing my contentions in precisely the manner they fear. Are you the sort of beast who enjoys rolling around in Sh*t? Or are you simply full of it?"

One can make an observation about smelly sh*t without engaging with the smelly Sh*t.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:24 PM  

"One can make an observation about smelly sh*t without engaging with the smelly Sh*t."

and yet now you can be labelled as a Vox Popoli reader... or worse... a Vox Popoli commenter.

OH NOES!!!!

Anonymous K. Tempest What's Brown and Sounds Like a Bell? Dung. June 24, 2013 8:24 PM  

Obvious, the culture you forgot you were defending due to confusing asbestos insulation with cotton candy.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:26 PM  

The trouble with these idiot SFWA types is they are part of a tiny insular sub-culture that's so insulated and isolated that they almost never have to face the reality that their views are bizarre to the majority of the world.

Thus when someone comes along and disturbs their little illusion... they recoil in horror.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:28 PM  

"For example, one need not take up in debate with someone who can't tell the difference between a savage and a well-schooled, well-read, intelligent cosmopolitan in order to point out that one's observation skills are highly deteriorated."

I CAN TYPING!!!

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 24, 2013 8:30 PM  

"and yet now you can be labelled as a Vox Popoli reader... or worse... a Vox Popoli commenter."

It's either this or Pee Wee Herman reruns. Gots to be entertained somehow.Six of one, half dozen of the other.

Anonymous N.K. Fellahin-Brained Racist and All-Around Chump June 24, 2013 8:35 PM  

Gawk thinks N.K. Jemisin is an intelligent cosmopolitan.

I'm guessing she's a bitter hag living in a tiny apt. with a job she hates, and has visited a few countries for SF conventions.

By that standard, I exceeded her worldly experience in one week walking 100 miles from Carmelita to El Tintal to Nakbe, down a sacbe to El Mirador and back again while chatting with my faithful companion in Spanish and robbing graves.

By the way, would you like to buy a pre-classic Chicanel-style bowl? Nice red color, no cracks or chips. Very nice, very nice. No drawings on it but pre-Cosmopolitan grave robbers can't be choosers. It's cursed though... so there's that.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 8:35 PM  

"For example, one need not take up in debate with someone who can't tell the difference between a savage and a well-schooled, well-read, intelligent cosmopolitan in order to point out that one's observation skills are highly deteriorated."

Pardon me, but did you just call N.K. Jemisin a tall drink?

You, sir, are a damned sexist pig.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 8:40 PM  

It's either this or Pee Wee Herman reruns. Gots to be entertained somehow.Six of one, half dozen of the other.

Is that still in syndication? Perhaps your species is doing worse than I had thought.

Anonymous N.K. Best Years Are Behind Me Lonely Alcoholic Racist June 24, 2013 8:41 PM  

I think he called her a women's magazine.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 24, 2013 8:43 PM  

"I'm guessing...."

Don't do that. Next thing you know you'll believe you think straight. And I've seen your comments. That "thinking" thing just doesn't suit you!

Come on everyone, let's face it, Vox Day was called out for a pretty ignorant set of comments. "Savage". Come on. That's one of two things: Proof he's an ignorant racist or proof that he's just plain dumb. And he got called on it. A principled human would apologize and re-state. Not VD. He just doubles down on the stupid. And NOW....he whines, bitches and moans that folks don't want to "engage" him or "debate" him. Talk about a girly girl.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:43 PM  

'It's either this or Pee Wee Herman reruns. Gots to be entertained somehow.Six of one, half dozen of the other.'

Look mate... you don't even have to skip the insults. Just take the time to actually make a case. For example...

Moron: 2+2=5!

Not Moron: Not it doesn't you blithering idiot. Look at your fingers. Count them.

See? You can insult and still make a case. So if you're going to hang around to hurl insults... at least point out the refutation. Otherwise you're just here crying like a bitch.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 24, 2013 8:44 PM  

"Is that still in syndication? Perhaps your species is doing worse than I had thought."

Netflix or Hulu.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 8:44 PM  

By the way, would you like to buy a pre-classic Chicanel-style bowl? Nice red color, no cracks or chips. Very nice, very nice. No drawings on it but pre-Cosmopolitan grave robbers can't be choosers. It's cursed though... so there's that.

Hmm, interesting; it sounds like the perfect gift for the genius billionaire playboy philanthropist who has everything. Do you gift-wrap, perchance?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:45 PM  

Wait... is crying like a bitch hetro normative and degrading and sexist?

WHAT KIND OF SCUM WOULD EVER SAY THAT!?

WHAT KIND OF SCUM WOULD EVER SUPPORT ANYONE WHO WOULD SAY THAT!!!???

oh wait... that's right... Godsmack actually has a song with that title... and no one has ever really complained about it.

Because you're idiotic views are those of a tiny insulated minority that no one gives a shit about.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 8:49 PM  

Netflix or Hulu.

I suspect it would be more your sort of thing than to linger here. Go you, and seek your own level.

For your own safety, of course.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD and laughing June 24, 2013 8:49 PM  

"See? You can insult and still make a case."

What are you talking about. There's no "case" to be made. Sh*t is Sh*t. People are generally repulsed by "sh*t". Not attracted to it.

Anonymous TWS June 24, 2013 8:50 PM  

I missed the answer, is Obvious a sfwa author or not?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 8:50 PM  

"Come on everyone, let's face it, Vox Day was called out for a pretty ignorant set of comments. "Savage"."

Yes... yes... because stabbing a boy... and liking it... are totally the behaviors of civilized people.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 8:50 PM  

And NOW....he whines, bitches and moans that folks don't want to "engage" him or "debate" him. Talk about a girly girl.

Ah, so you think such behaviours are feminine.

Splendid. Tell us more about how women behave.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 8:54 PM  

People are generally repulsed by "sh*t". Not attracted to it.

You do realise that you have just insulted coprophiliacs?

Sirrah, has your bigotry no limits?

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD and Loki June 24, 2013 8:54 PM  

"For your own safety, of course."

I appreciate that you are able to offer concern, especially in your diminished condition. Let me guess, you've been wallowing in the Sh*t for quite some time....Am I right?

Still don't be concerned. I've bot my Sh*t boots on. I can just water it off the bottom of my boots when Im done laughing and slumming.

Anonymous N.K. Racist and Pangolin Breeder June 24, 2013 8:56 PM  

Gawk, N.K. Jemisin did everything but call white Australians actual savages. So she didn't use that word; that confuses you?

She straight up lied about Australia being unsafe for her while ignoring actual savage locations in her beloved Africa, which she wouldn't visit for love or money. That's a pretty giant gulf to place on skin alone and call it logic.

Jemisin whines about segregation yet will be Guest of Honor at next year's WisCon, which has racially segregated spaces and events.

She wants to see more people like her in SF novels yet supports racially segregated fiction and recommends fiction herself based on skin and gender alone.

Plying you people with the word "stupid" is setting that word a task it cannot finish.

Anonymous EGA June 24, 2013 8:57 PM  

Count me among the people who have been convinced of Vox's positions by his own observations, some of them personal.

When I tried to converse with Scalzi on his blog towards the beginning of the "McRapey" dust-up, he repeatedly avoided most of what I was saying (much of it trying to help him, no less).

Blogger Scott June 24, 2013 8:59 PM  

Dear "Writers", might you have a dictionary on hand? I know, I know, your kind tend to reinvent words at will, but I don't think you've redefined the word, savage, just yet.

sav·age (svj)
n.
1. A person regarded as primitive or uncivilized.

Africans on the whole are comparatively uncivilized. The masses of non-white Africans use crude tools, don't have plumbing, don't have access to modern utilities, can't read/write in their native language, believe in witchcraft as a means of medical treatment etc.

If these are not traits of an uncivilized race, please enlighten us.

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 9:02 PM  

Case in point: Vox has still not given a link to this supposed organization with the word "dyke" in the title that Christine Quinn belongs to.

It's not a case in point because asking someone to Google something for you is not making an argument. Among various other things, Quinn sponsored and marched in the Dyke March. Now, I suppose you could claim that Dyke March is not an organization if you want to get pedantic, or that marching in it and sponsoring it is not tantamount to "belonging" to it, but regardless, the pretense that Quinn is offended by the term won't hold up.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:02 PM  

I can just water it off the bottom of my boots when Im done laughing and slumming.

That is not mud. That is the neural matter of the last fellow who attempted to poach in my trolling reserve. I can see how you might be confused.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:04 PM  

"What are you talking about. There's no "case" to be made. Sh*t is Sh*t. People are generally repulsed by "sh*t". Not attracted to it."

Wrong.

That's just a naked assertion. Vox has made a claim... and sited evidence to support it. That evidence being lies, and of course then there is the whole "I stabbed a boy and I liked it... and still do." thing which really sort of sounds like a savage.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:07 PM  

"Talk about a girly girl. "

You realize how many of the women in the Bulletin Dust Up would have your head for typing that?

You realize that to them what you just wrote is far worse than ANYTHING the authors published in either edition of The Bulletin?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:09 PM  

Also... do you realize that if you took issue with Scalzi like this on his blog he would simply delete your comments and ban you?

Do you honestly not see a difference in one that tolerates decent and even welcomes it... vs one that silences it?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:10 PM  

" Now, I suppose you could claim that Dyke March is not an organization if you want to get pedantic, or that marching in it and sponsoring it is not tantamount to "belonging" to it, but regardless, the pretense that Quinn is offended by the term won't hold up."

Vox come one.. its like nigger. Its not offensive when they use it.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:12 PM  

Let's face it, the boy is gawk-worthy.

So, now we see why "Writers" is excused from all of his very sexist comments.

Or perhaps he is Tad, come to play again until he is shown the door. He simply cannot get enough of Vox.

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 9:13 PM  

I missed the answer, is Obvious a sfwa author or not?

He's repeatedly refused to answer the question, so he's spam until he answers it.

Come on everyone, let's face it, Vox Day was called out for a pretty ignorant set of comments. "Savage". Come on. That's one of two things: Proof he's an ignorant racist or proof that he's just plain dumb. And he got called on it. A principled human would apologize and re-state. Not VD. He just doubles down on the stupid.

There was nothing ignorant about it. It was, and is, an informed opinion. Jemisin is an educated, ignorant, half-savage. I can make an excellent case for it using her own words.

And NOW....he whines, bitches and moans that folks don't want to "engage" him or "debate" him. Talk about a girly girl.

I find it very amusing that you are under the impression that I am whining, bitching, and moaning that certain folks don't wish to engage or debate me. Do you truly not understand that I am laughing at them? Do you not grasp that this is exactly what I expect from them? The more they try to snipe and then run away, the more cowardly and inept they show themselves to be.

If they didn't care, if I was as irrelevant as you idiots keep trying to pretend, no one would give a damn. No one would make a peep about me. And yet, it's snipe, snipe, snipe, OH SHIT RUN AWAY HE'S POINTING THE BIG GUN AT ME over and over and over again. That sort of thing has been going on for more than eight years now, so who do you think you are going to fool with your nonsense?

Anonymous Stickwick June 24, 2013 9:15 PM  

Stickwick, if they knew who and what you are, it would probably make them cry. It violates their most basic perceptions of the universe.

That's what makes it so much fun.

Stickwick is you as well Vox.

Heh. Yeah, I'm one of Vox's more creative sock puppets. Just to round out the rainbow of diversity here, he invented a pregnant female Christian libertarian scientist.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:15 PM  

"Or perhaps he is Tad, come to play again until he is shown the door. He simply cannot get enough of Vox."

Not Tad... more likely... The Greatest Swordsman in Catalonia!

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:15 PM  

OH SHIT RUN AWAY HE'S POINTING THE BIG GUN AT ME

Now now, you'll only get "Writers" excited with talk like that.

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 9:16 PM  

Read the rules, Gawkie. You'll address me as Vox here.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:16 PM  

" He calls someone a savage? Tell me that's not worth gawking at him the way one gawks at little chimps playing with themselves and throwing their own sh*t at each other."

And yet you have not addressed the stabbing and the fact that she admitted to "liking" it... and claims to still "like" it.

Tell me do you find stabbing someone to be an act of savagery?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:17 PM  

The fact is, as one of greek decent I consider you all half - savages. After all.. as I love pointing out... if it weren't for us you'd still be eating each other and painting your bottoms blue.

I don't see what the big deal is.

Anonymous VD June 24, 2013 9:18 PM  

And yet you have not addressed the stabbing and the fact that she admitted to "liking" it... and claims to still "like" it.

Nate, that was de Bordard who did the stabbing, not Jemisin. Jemisin is a half-savage for her inability to grasp how science fiction was created and who created it.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:19 PM  

I'm just here to point out how gawk-worthy Little Bealie (I like that one!) is.

Come now, control yourself.

I mean come on.

No.

Tell me that's not worth gawking at him the way one gawks at little chimps playing with themselves and throwing their own sh*t at each other.

Now he adds bestiality to his list of paraphiliae. Is there no end to the depravity?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 9:21 PM  

"Nate, that was de Bordard who did the stabbing, not Jemisin. Jemisin is a half-savage for her inability to grasp how science fiction was created and who created it."

Well damn...

I will redact.. and apologize to savages... half and otherwise.. for my mistake.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:21 PM  

The fact is, as one of greek decent I consider you all half - savages. After all.. as I love pointing out... if it weren't for us you'd still be eating each other and painting your bottoms blue.

And what, pray, is wrong with a blue arse?

Anonymous Writers Gawking At Vox June 24, 2013 9:25 PM  

"Tell me do you find stabbing someone to be an act of savagery?"

If someone comes at me with malice, and I stab them, I'm a savage now?

Hmmmmmm...... Are you really SMAART like Vox too?

Blogger Giraffe June 24, 2013 9:26 PM  

Why don't you say something substantive, Writers? Are you capable? Flinging poo trying to get banned so you can claim what a meanie Vox is is cliche.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:27 PM  

What a splendid evening this is shaping up to be. A fresh pan of brownies at my side, some Schubert on the stereo, and a coprophiliac sexist with a puppy crush on Vox attempting to have himself banned.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:28 PM  

I will redact.. and apologize to savages... half and otherwise.. for my mistake.

Forgiven.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At Vox June 24, 2013 9:29 PM  

"Jemisin is a half-savage for her inability to grasp how science fiction was created and who created it."

A novel definition of savagery. Tell us Vox, how was literary criticism invented and who invented it? Careful, get it right lest you be labeled a half savage. (Oh, if you get only one part of the question correct, you become a three-quarter savage.)

Anonymous Stickwick June 24, 2013 9:36 PM  

A fresh pan of brownies at my side, some Schubert on the stereo ...

Oooh, yeah, brownies. But who's this Sherbert guy and why didn't he ever finish that symphony?

Blogger Giraffe June 24, 2013 9:40 PM  

I have some brownie cookies. Which are awesome. And my three young daughters are screaming like savages.

Anonymous zen0 June 24, 2013 9:41 PM  

@ Stickwick :
Stickwick is you as well Vox. (Demo)

Heh. Yeah, I'm one of Vox's more creative sock puppets. Just to round out the rainbow of diversity here, he invented a pregnant female Christian libertarian scientist.


Sorry Stickwick, you must have missed my confession. Demo is MY sockpuppet, demonstrating how ridiculous allegations of sockpuppetry are. That is why I use Demo.
Sorry, I can't help myslf.

(see? I saved an "e" there!)

Anonymous Ikol of Dragsa June 24, 2013 9:44 PM  

I, however, am not a sock puppet. Clearly.

The smell of feet is your imagination at work.

Anonymous Daniel June 24, 2013 9:45 PM  

Oh, sweet! I just noticed that I'm me! Pre-dawn in Italy is so gorgeous. It is as if the sun hasn't even set! I can see Tunisia from my house! For those of you who haven't traveled much, Tunisia looks like soybeans.

Anonymous TheVillageIdiotRet June 24, 2013 9:48 PM  

and I am not a VD sock puppet.
I am real damn it!
All the doctors keep saying so.

of course to me,
it always felt more like a,
My Milli to VDs' Vanilli type of thing goin' on

DannyR

Anonymous zen0 June 24, 2013 9:49 PM  

@ Loki muses:

A fresh pan of brownies at my side,...

A whole pan? Either you have built up an immunity or your connection is ripping you off.

Or, slim chance, maybe you ARE worthy to take over.

Oh, well, at least its not meatloaf.

Blogger Phoenician June 24, 2013 9:49 PM  

Remember, it was only last week that I publicly humiliated PZ in his very own field of biology, and moreover, did it in passing.

Nope. You didn't.

What you did was demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect - you were too ignorant and enamoured with your own supposed brilliance to even know how badly you'd stuffed up.

You dipshit.

Anonymous log June 24, 2013 9:50 PM  

They equally know comments here won't be deleted.

Comments most certainly are deleted here.

Anonymous Stickwick June 24, 2013 9:51 PM  

@ zen0: For realz? I thought you were mocking this Damo person. Well, in any case, it looks like you inadvertently outed "Daniel." Nice going!

Anonymous Nalo Hopped Up On Race or Something June 24, 2013 9:57 PM  

Good point about Jemisin trying to shoe-horn in black folks in the creation of genre SF.

In her Australia speech, Jemisin states: "And people of color have been in SFF from the very beginning, hiding behind the racial anonymity of names and pseudonyms." Well, that's simply false.

The Happy Stabbing racist SFF writer Aliette de Bodard is just as clueless. She writes: "I know aliens in SFF started out as the equivalent of POC natives in a colonial narrative frame." Wrong! Try actually reading the old stuff. Not even close.

Yet another black gay racist woman SFF writer, Nalo Hopkinson, in an article suprisingly titled, "When Will White People Stop Making Movies Like Avatar?", asserts that the main theme of SF by white writers "is going to a foreign culture and colonizing it." That's not even close to being true.

These are idiots who just assume if a white person is doing it, it's always oppressing someone and being racist and so they say insane things about the genre that are simply false.

In not one of the three instances is a single shred of scholarship presented to back up these claims. One simple reason is they can't show such a trend.

Hard genre pop culture SF got started around 1910 in the Munsey Magazines. What are the chances these "scholars" have read Giesy, Stilson, England, Merritt, Cummings, Leinster, Hall and Flint? When Jack Vance died at the end of May, de Bodard admitted she'd never even read him.

The only scholarship these three morons provide is the bitter resentments and racial hatreds in their hearts and that's what they consult. Essentially, the SFWA has taken on David Duke as heroes.

Anonymous Loki of Asgard June 24, 2013 9:58 PM  

A whole pan? Either you have built up an immunity or your connection is ripping you off.

I think I know to what you refer, and no, it would have no effect on me, did she add it.

...One of the peculiar things about my consort is that she has no qualms about aiding in my glorious conquest, and I have got her quite drunk from time to time, but she will not purchase drugs. Odd woman.

Or, slim chance, maybe you ARE worthy to take over.

This is in doubt?

Blogger Giraffe June 24, 2013 9:58 PM  

Comments most certainly are deleted here.

Comments that are on topic by those who have not violated the rules are not deleted.

Blogger Shibes Meadow June 24, 2013 9:59 PM  

Writers Gawking At Vox wrote: oooh look at me arent i clever yes sir i am belling the cat in his lair oh hoo hoo hoo how daring of me how dashing oh wait being daring and dashing are misogynistic power moves used by white male oppressors to objectify nonwhites nonmales no must rethink ah yes i am fearlessly charging my enemies like la pucelle no wait she was a christian cant be like her all enslaved by some great sky daddy i wish my daddy had cared about me plus she fought for a king for god's sake a noshit medieval monarch can you believe it nope not me plus they burnt her i hope it hurt i wish i could burn all the christians it wot they deserve fucking smug selfrighteous bastards always judging people telling them whats right and wrong not like us no sir the sfwa would never judge anybody nor assert a single immutable moral standard something might be wrong for you but not wrong for me like hating niggers oh wait thats always wrong and not being for gay marriage wait thats always wrong too and people who dont agree are evil and no tolerance for evil burn them all i say round them up in caps and gas them filthy homophobic racists every one turn them into soap and lampashades and when all the whitemen and christians are dead then then then my friend we will truly live in a free world a world where peace love and justice exst for all eternity so fuck voxday and his jesusworshiping klan trying to impose their ideas on the world well see about that my friend well see whose ideas get imposed because we are AT WAR with anybody who disagrees with sex in any form with feminism transgender rights people of color supremacy peace and freedom daddy where are you why did you leave me why dont boys like me please daddy im scared kill kill kill kill kill kill kill kill kill kill

tl;dr

Anonymous Nick June 24, 2013 10:00 PM  

VD, are you ever going to finish your debate with Dominic S?

Anonymous Mudz June 24, 2013 10:12 PM  

Avatar was supposed to show how Colonial Man was a giant douchebag blowing up sacred and beautiful things in their lust for magic space gold. I'm sure James Cameron will be pleased that chick was so incensed by the Big Bad Manperialists.

I'm still convinced the movie was ripped off Alan Dean Foster's Midworld, though.

-

Dunning-Kruger Effect. A way for dumb people to feel smart by telling smart people they're dumb. It has all the elegance of mathematics.

It's conveniently overlooked that any six-year old, is capable of saying 'you ain't so smart as you think you are, Mr. Smarty Pants!' It's one of the most brilliant arguments ever devised. But I know the secretly even better one.

'Nuh-uh, Phoenician, you're dumb!'

That's right. Feel the burn. That deep, shameful burn.

Anonymous Mudz June 24, 2013 10:15 PM  

(Okay, so an unsually articulate six-year old.)

Anonymous Saladin's Real name was "Joe" and he wasn't a racist hack begging for Pay Pal donations June 24, 2013 10:16 PM  

Gawk, literary criticism has nothing to do with understanding the history of SF. It is not a critique to note who did what when.

And Log, Scalzi's deletions are as delicate as defusing a bomb. Even his regulars don't know how to stay on the safe side without constant warnings.

Not only do Scalzi's deletions outnumber here by about 50 to 1, that's not even accounting for the fact that no one goes there to debate, in which case it would be far worse.

The capper is that Scazi deletes comments for the exact opposite reason as VD, for debating him. VD deletes or bans for refusing to debate.

Honestly, this whole thing has been such an eye-opening experience, because never in my life have I ever seen people so dumb. Who in 20 blue hells are you people? Your hypocrisy is stunning, outnumbered only by breaths you take.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:22 PM  

"VD, are you ever going to finish your debate with Dominic S?"

...

***grumble***

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:24 PM  

"If someone comes at me with malice, and I stab them, I'm a savage now?"

What an interesting description. I note no where does the savage in question (not the noble half savage) claim the matter was self-defense.

No one came at anyone with malice. Judging by her tweets the boy probably called her "girl" or "Lady".

Anonymous Anonymous June 24, 2013 10:24 PM  

Thanks for that Nate, insightful. Now, go drink terrible bourbon.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:26 PM  

The most entertaining thing here... is that while defending these savages... Gawker has said things that would incite those same savages to boil him in oil.

How girly is that?

Anonymous K. Tempest What's Brown and Looks Like a Bell and Eats Like An Elephant? June 24, 2013 10:26 PM  

Go out and colonize the universe Manperialist writers. Show your disdain for non-whites. Retell the sack of Tenochtitlan 1,000 times. Have aliens be nothing more than thinly disguised Sitting Bulls. Have no wimmens on your mighty ships other than to lament and rescue from Apache analogue aliens and carry over your shoulder in skin tight costumes. Conquer the million worlds of the Rajacronky Empire of Hindoost aliens with one broken down spaceship and let your white teeth gleam in the sunlight and the blond aryan hair too.

This is the essential plot of the Foundation series, which I've never read. But c'mon... they're whites [1.]. That is my footnotes.

[1.] They're whites.
[2.] Ibid

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:28 PM  

"Thanks for that Nate, insightful. Now, go drink terrible bourbon."

Hey now!

You can say a lot of things about me... but I don't drink terrible bourbon. Bookers... Makers 46 and Kentucky Spirit are a long damned way from Terrible Bourbon.

Take it up with my co-host... who drinks white label Jim Beam ***shudder***

Anonymous Aliette de Orientalist Racist Jack the Ripper Never Caught June 24, 2013 10:31 PM  

Bodard's exact quote is:

"When I was 13 or so, I stabbed boy who was bothering me with pointy end of a pair of compasses (planted it in his hand when he reached out) "yup. Felt quite happy (still do)."

Anonymous Stickwick June 24, 2013 10:31 PM  

The capper is that Scazi deletes comments for the exact opposite reason as VD, for debating him.

I not only got deleted at Whatever, but managed to get banned after just three comments.

Fact is, Vox is unusually tolerant with the comments here.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 24, 2013 10:32 PM  

"Gawk, literary criticism has nothing to do with understanding the history of SF. It is not a critique to note who did what when."

Maybe. Maybe not. Like Vox, I'm creating an arbitrary definition of what amounts to savagery.

"Honestly, this whole thing has been such an eye-opening experience, because never in my life have I ever seen people so dumb"

I thought it was eye opening because it illustrated the terribly racist heart that vox possesses. Now I realize it only illustrates that he's capable of making up definitions of well defined words. +1 for Vox.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:35 PM  

"I thought it was eye opening because it illustrated the terribly racist heart that vox possesses."

I am casting... FEELBAD!!!

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD and Nate June 24, 2013 10:35 PM  

"The most entertaining thing here... is that while defending these savages... Gawker has said things that would incite those same savages to boil him in oil."

Come'on little Natey. Even you can see how humiliated and set aside Vox was as a result of his racist inspired comments that he can't defend any longer other than to change definitions of words. The author he defamed clearly is civilized. Anyone with half a brain can see that.

We come to gawk. We come to tell tales of witlessness. Join us. It's good for civilization.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD and Nate June 24, 2013 10:36 PM  

"I am casting... FEELBAD!!! "

I know. Take a pill and some tea.

Anonymous zen0 June 24, 2013 10:37 PM  

"VD, are you ever going to finish your debate with Dominic S?"

This debate exists in abeyance, like the unbaptized and virtuous pagans in the first circle of Dante's Inferno.

Yours too, Nate. Sorry.

They exist in the grey smoke of limbo, awaiting a harrowing.

Anonymous Mudz June 24, 2013 10:40 PM  

Maybe. Maybe not. Like Vox, I'm creating an arbitrary definition of what amounts to savagery.

I can go with that. It was pretty arbitrary. People tend to amuse themselves with all sorts of whimsies.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:43 PM  

'Come'on little Natey. Even you can see how humiliated and set aside Vox was as a result of his racist inspired comments that he can't defend any longer other than to change definitions of words. '

Mate you really should look around the blog some. See... I've actually debated Vox... on his best subject. So I have some experience in these matters.

What you'll find is Vox has a habit of making inflammatory statements that appear to be entirely indefensible because binary thinkers assume he is saying something he isn't saying.

To illustrate I will point out the way that republicans assume that anyone who critisizes a republican must be a liberal. Vox therefore makes an inflamatory statement about a supposed conservative... the binary thinking republican tards jump to the conclusion that Vox is a liberal... and in doing so provide a means for him to make them look stupid by pointing out that the republican they are defending is actually a liberal and he is in fact far more right wing than his attackers.

A version of this same trap is being played here.

It hinges on the process of civilization and the fact that it took literally a millennium for Vox's own people to become fully civilized.

Compared to say, me for example, Vox himself isn't much more than a half savage.

But you see the word savage and jump to all kinds of conclusions because you're largely historically ignorant of civilizational history and how it actually works.

That's not actually an insult by the way... almost everyone else. Hell most people think Aristotle wrote De Re Publica.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:48 PM  

"That's not actually an insult by the way... almost everyone else."

...

***sigh***

everyone else is too.

dammit.

Anonymous zen0 June 24, 2013 10:49 PM  

We come to gawk. We come to tell tales of witlessness. Join us. It's good for civilization.

"My name is Legion, for we are many."

Sorry, old line, discredited thousands of years ago. Not interested.

A new schtick would help, maybe.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 10:49 PM  

'Yours too, Nate. Sorry.

They exist in the grey smoke of limbo, awaiting a harrowing."

I should just post the rest of my debate posts. People have questions that I really want to answer but the format isn't allowing for it.

Anonymous TD June 24, 2013 10:58 PM  

This threw me (and if it's been addressed in the above 154 comments, my apologies; I want to savor the comments section, and so need to resolve this before I dive in):

"I think a half decent data analyst could also prove that most of VDs followers are sock-puppets as well."

Where is this quote from?

Anonymous Porky June 24, 2013 10:58 PM  

Compared to say, me for example, Vox himself isn't much more than a half savage.

Fat, drunk, and voyeur of Brazilian fartporn. The pinnacle of civilization.

God help us.

Anonymous N.K. Racist Puts the Jazz In Writing She-bop-bee-doo by DNA June 24, 2013 11:06 PM  

Well, the bottom line is that Jemisin's going after us, and we're going after her. The dealbreaker is that she's going after 100 million, not including Europe and Australia. We're going after a single woman with a name.

And since Jemisin likes to separate out people by race, we're just parroting her own language back at her. We're "whites?" Fine. Well, put like that, we "whites" built every frickin' thing that woman uses every single moment of her life. And that rankles. That's why she has to make up fantasies about black SFF authors who never existed.

So, in that sense, VD, and ironically, Jemisin herself, are correct. There is no sign a million Jemisin's have ever built a modern civilization nor that they are capable of maintaining one. What exceptionalism does Jemisin bring to the table? Destroying? Whining? These are not talents. Can she even build a fire in a forest? How is she maintaining the legacy of SFF by tearing it down based on the idea it is endemically racist?

She has a job any moron could do, writes below average SFF no one would ever have heard of if she weren't black and cries.

So, be careful about splitting people up by races rather than humans. Cuz then, each has a history. And I don't have to make the Moon up. In Jemisin's view, I conquered that bad boy. That's her world view, not mine. But I have no problem adopting it just to stick it back in her craw.

My default world view is that, when I see a Mayan pyramid, I marvel and what humans are capable of, not brown-skinned people. Jemisin is a vicious racist who is severely addicted to racialism. In my opinion, she needs help. But with the enablers of the SFWA, they'll give her enough heroin to destroy herself in plain anger, rather than intervene, which, again, ironically, is what were doing by employing plain language instead of feel-good political correctness.

Anonymous TD June 24, 2013 11:07 PM  

Replying to myself, a few inches above:

Found the reference in question. (It had not turned up in a Google search, but searching Twitter revealed it. I'd earlier scrolled through Damien Walter's Twitter feed, but had not thought to look as far back as June 19, as I figured all this stuff was from the past day or two.)

https://twitter.com/damiengwalter/status/347388520379326465

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 11:07 PM  

Nate, is Porky related to us?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 11:09 PM  


"Fat, drunk, and voyeur of Brazilian fartporn. The pinnacle of civilization.

God help us."

No goat rape? For fucks sake if you're going to cast aspersions at least be comprehensive about it.

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 11:09 PM  

"Nate, is Porky related to us?"

No. JAC. He's just one of the three of four dumbest commenters on this blog.

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 11:12 PM  

So how's he know about the fartporn?

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 11:13 PM  

I mentioned it in a comment a couple months ago. Porn was a topic of discussion and I pointed out that porn could in fact be hilarious... and sited a rather... flatulent south american example.

it obviously left an impression.

Anonymous Hyperphrenius June 24, 2013 11:17 PM  

zen0 June 24, 2013 10:37 PM

This debate exists in abeyance, like the unbaptized and virtuous pagans in the first circle of Dante's Inferno.

Yours too, Nate. Sorry.

They exist in the grey smoke of limbo, awaiting a harrowing.


Like Vox's announced posts on Libertarian Nationalism, and his advice on writing SFF, they have vanished, into the same waters where the forgotten promises of future Voxiversities and Voxic Shocks now sleep, sunken at the bottom of the Seas of Time, where swim the lost Haloscan comments.

I fear there's not much chance of gaining any of that back. But perhaps it is not vain to hope. "With Day all things are possible." At least I think that's how it goes.

Blogger JACIII June 24, 2013 11:17 PM  

Oh, I thought maybe he was hiding at Thanksgiving dinner somewhere.

Anonymous Porky June 24, 2013 11:20 PM  

Nate, is Porky related to us?

Actually we're both gingers so... maybe.

He's just one of the three of four dumbest commenters on this blog.

From the guy who believes Stanley Kubrick faked the moon landings.

Anonymous Alex, McFart Lane, 666 Hobb's End, London June 24, 2013 11:31 PM  

Here is what SFWA member Rose Lemberg says about their forums:

"The forums... are triggery, upsetting, and generally unsafe for me."

http://www.alexdallymacfarlane.com/2013/06/on-sfwa-making-bigots-unwelcome/#comment-4482

What are these people, nuts? They're words on a screen. Why do writers act like the bad guys in "1984" by abusing language like that?

Is it like an acid flashback? Do the hounds of Tindalos streak out of the dimensional intersection of a wall? I wonder if Rose has rats she can hear in the walls. Maybe Rose should lay off the SFF for awhile and maybe adjust the ol' medication.

Anonymous Porky June 24, 2013 11:33 PM  

No goat rape?

Another admission? You do shoot from the hip don't you, Drunky McFatterson.


Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 11:33 PM  

"From the guy who believes Stanley Kubrick faked the moon landings."

Me... Vox... a pair of total morons I tell ya...

Blogger Nate June 24, 2013 11:35 PM  

"Oh, I thought maybe he was hiding at Thanksgiving dinner somewhere."

Nah... typical cyber stalker... Vox had Tad... I have Porky. What can I say?

Anonymous jaciii June 24, 2013 11:39 PM  

You sure porky isn't the kid auntie beaula brings that drools a lot and plays with itself?

Anonymous Porky June 24, 2013 11:47 PM  

typical cyber stalker
Says the guy who follows me around this blog in his White Knight outfit.

Anonymous Porky June 24, 2013 11:50 PM  

Me... Vox... a pair of total morons I tell ya...

Vox is a supergenius. You are a fat drunk.

Blogger SDH June 25, 2013 12:04 AM  

Take it up with my co-host... who drinks white label Jim Beam ***shudder***

Your co-host drinks gin and eats stinkbugs. Bad whiskey is the least of his problems.

Anonymous Scintan June 25, 2013 12:12 AM  

Says the guy who follows me around this blog in his White Knight outfit.

There are many aspersions that can be cast in Nate's direction (the same is certainly true of myself, as well). A stalking white knight on this blog he is not, however.

Blogger Nate June 25, 2013 12:14 AM  

"Vox is a supergenius. You are a fat drunk."

And yet again... without even realizing it... you proclaim your own stupidity as loudly as possible.

Blogger Nate June 25, 2013 12:15 AM  

"There are many aspersions that can be cast in Nate's direction (the same is certainly true of myself, as well). "

goat rapist... creative grammar... more creative spelling... occasionally calling aristole an idiot for something plato said...

Anonymous Josh June 25, 2013 12:18 AM  

Hey porky, why don't you debate Vox? Or anyone, really.

Why so bitter and angry?

Anonymous Anonymous June 25, 2013 12:22 AM  

I suspect the reason Vox has postponed his debate with Nate, is that he's waiting for the markets to finish his debate for him.

Sorry Nate, it looks like deflation and it looks bad.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-23/neil-howe-fourth-turning-has-arrived

Anonymous Noah B. June 25, 2013 12:47 AM  

"Vox had Tad"

Well Vox, I hope you didn't think you were the only one.

Blogger Crude June 25, 2013 12:58 AM  

"The forums... are triggery, upsetting, and generally unsafe for me."

My experience lately is that if a woman pipes up and says that a given forum 'is making her feel uncomfortable', what she really means is, 'stop whatever I don't like you doing, NOW, or you are a misogynist and a rape-enabler'. The very idea that their feeling uncomfortable need not provoke any action whatsoever is alien to them. And the idea of making anyone ELSE feel uncomfortable - other than those of the Approved Liberal Groups - is literally unthinkable.

Blogger cmate June 25, 2013 1:13 AM  

"The forums... are triggery, upsetting, and generally unsafe for me."

Hey, I've been in a coma for 50 years, when did being afraid of your own shadow become a virtue?

Blogger Brad Andrews June 25, 2013 1:33 AM  

I still want it explained what the outcome of Nate's inflation or Vox's deflation would be in the real world.

I just can't see them stuffing all those dollars back in the box, even if they are bits. I need to slog through the debate, but it is far too academic and disconnected from reality for me.

I would rather debate the value of anti-virus or DLP....

Anonymous Steve June 25, 2013 1:44 AM  

@Writers Gawking "You mistake "snipe" for what it really is: Gawking and pointing to the troll. Have you not learned anything by your super SMAART observations of society Mr. Bealie? Shaming and drawing attention to the lesser ones like you is how you deter other lesser ones from also choosing to fling their Sh*t while outside their cage."


Isn't that cute? You think you're in charge.

What kind of guns do you got,Writers? Cause if you don't have any, I suggest you shut the fuck up,before you meet someone who does.

We're lesser than you? That's impossible! You're a fucking limpwristed worm. You'd never even dream of pulling this shit face to face with another grown ass man. You'd get all your teeth knocked out and be keeping somebody's dick warm in your little penis cosy instead of barking orders out of it (That you laughanbly expect others to follow based on childish name-calling and exclusion from your retarded censorious fascist groups!How precious!) like mini-Hitler.

Ok,here's when you can make me follow your totalitarian whims, when you eat the worms out of my dead asshole,you fucking cunt. And that'll be a mighty fucking feat,because if all I've got is a ball point pen I'm going to put your fucking punk eyes out with it. If I've got a strip of cloth I'll strangle your ass with it.

Got it? You can tell me what to do when you demonstrate you're willing to use deadly force to compel that from me, and when you try to use deadly force on me, I'm going to take your ass down so quick your head will spin and I will be perfectly within my rights to do so. And I will relish every second of it because you're a fascist,moronic, totalitarian fuck that is breathing my air and that pisses me off and then you have the stupidity to try to order us around like anyone gives a fuck about what Borg no. 4326 thinks about any-fucking-thing.

Go back to community college and take another course in transgendered fat black queer studies you brain-damaged,mediocre,duckspeaking,evolutionary dead end.




Blogger redlegben June 25, 2013 2:16 AM  

I think we need a discussion of typical views by different levels of civilization. For example, the difference between Greek/Roman and Viking breeds views on life today. How different are the Greco civilizationists versus the Northern European in societal outlooks? Why is current Greek society so ugly vs. Icelandic? The differences between a few generations of civilizational progress is quite an interesting field. Enough of this comparison between obviously barbaric cultures and much more advanced ones. If we fixate on the smaller differences, we can ignore and completely insubstantiate the morons. Let's play chess while they play where's your nose.

Blogger Jack Hanson June 25, 2013 3:47 AM  

Writers Gawking is another faggot hiding behind the internet thinking that he's playing 'dance puppets dance' by posting inane comments.

Meanwhile his side is the one insisting that sexual preference is genetic, gender is fluid, and blank slate is a real thing, among other fallacies that are so damaging that to bring them up on other blogs is an instant ban followed by the activation of the cultural marxist's BURN THE WITCH impulse.
No discussion, just pure feminine hysteria and vapors over something that threatens your delicate as spun sugar world view that's always one hatefact away from collapsing around your ears.

More of what Steve said though. This is the kind of faggot who mumbles into his shoulder throughout life and confrontation causes a total m-m-m-m-meltdown. Only a simpering cocksucker would write in that twee 'I'm SO SMART' smug style that's the trademark of a leftist who's never been in a confrontation.

Anonymous VD June 25, 2013 3:51 AM  

Comments most certainly are deleted here.

Yes, but very, very few in comparison with most blogs. That should be clear from this thread alone. Only four comments have been deleted, three by a commenter who has willfully ignored the clearly posted rules despite being warned and a fourth from a banned commenter who refuses to answer a direct question.

The rest of them, regardless of how rude or offensive they are intended to be, remain.

Nope. You didn't.

Nice attempt at damage control, Phony. Unfortunately, everyone read what PZ wrote. So your attempt won't work any better than his at the same. He completely blew it and you know it.

Anonymous N.K. Brillo Pad June 25, 2013 4:08 AM  

And Gawk refused to answer a simple question put to him earlier in this thread. In fact it is so explosively simple they dare not answer it. To do so reveals either a racial/gender double standard weighted against whites and men or that the SFWA are racists; identity bigotry either way. It is the complete closing of a perceptual trap.

Anonymous zen0 June 25, 2013 5:28 AM  

Hyperphrenius despairs:
I fear there's not much chance of gaining any of that back. But perhaps it is not vain to hope. "With Day all things are possible." At least I think that's how it goes.

Well, its not like we have to pay a subscription fee or anything.

Anonymous VryeDenker June 25, 2013 6:41 AM  

I, for one, am not scared to admit that I am a sock puppet. I hope Vox doesn't punish me for speaking out.

Anonymous Porky June 25, 2013 8:21 AM  

Josh: Hey porky, why don't you debate Vox? Or anyone, really.

Huh? About what?

Why so bitter and angry?

Oh, go cry in your Fresca you woman.

Responding in kind to an insult does not mean one is "bitter and angry". It means I like Nate enough to acknowledge his dig with a better dig right back at him. Otherwise I'd ignore him.

Now, admittedly, this thread was pure anklebitery on my part - I simply can't resist chewing on the ankles of a fat drunk crossdressing redneck connoisseur of fartporn who claims to be the vanguard of Western Civilization.

...Tasted like bourbon and bacon, with notes of baby wipes and gunpowder.

Lighten up Josh. Life is too short to take this shit seriously.

Blogger Nate June 25, 2013 9:09 AM  

"I suspect the reason Vox has postponed his debate with Nate, is that he's waiting for the markets to finish his debate for him.

Sorry Nate, it looks like deflation and it looks bad."

so ya didn't read the last debate or you just forgot?

Anonymous Writers Gawking At Vox and Steve June 25, 2013 9:27 AM  

"We're lesser than you? That's impossible! You're a fucking limpwristed worm. You'd never even dream of pulling this shit face to face with another grown ass man. You'd get all your teeth knocked out and be keeping somebody's dick warm in your little penis cosy instead of barking orders out of it "

Steve,
Just a heads up. I'm going to TM "Penis Cosy". Never heard it before and it's a really funny phrase. And the fact that it was discovered in the middle of a tantrum by a middle aged white guy commenting on the blog of another middle aged white guy during a discussion of how SMAAART the second white guy is makes it all pretty precious.

Thanks for your input and the phrase. I'll find a way to use it. Maybe in a SP or treatment tentatively entitled: "A Pet Named Steve"

Anonymous Writers Gawking at Hate Speech Charges in Canada June 25, 2013 9:38 AM  

Yeah, white, that's enormously stupid to be, Gawk.

Anonymous VD June 25, 2013 10:09 AM  

And the fact that it was discovered in the middle of a tantrum by a middle aged white guy commenting on the blog of another middle aged white guy during a discussion of how SMAAART the second white guy is makes it all pretty precious.

Why do you think I'm white? That's extremely racist and privileged of you. I am both agog and aghast.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 25, 2013 10:33 AM  

"Why do you think I'm white?"

Unless our eyes betray us....

Anonymous Josh June 25, 2013 10:46 AM  

Dats racis! If race is just a societal construct, why would you assume that Vox is the type of cis-race person who chooses to identify with the race it happens to look like he was born with?

Anonymous The other skeptic June 25, 2013 11:16 AM  

"Why do you think I'm white?"

Unless our eyes betray us....


I know of several verified mixed race individuals who look white and yet are fully half-breeds.

Would you deny them the right to identify as non-White.

It seems that non-Whites can only identify as non-White if certain people allow it, but then, the reaction to certain blacks (eg, the one on the Supreme Court) suggests that identity politics are only a game.

Anonymous Writers Gawking at Segregated One-Drop SF Anthologies June 25, 2013 11:25 AM  

Your mind betrays you. What the hell use are eyes?

Anonymous VD June 25, 2013 11:44 AM  

Unless our eyes betray us....

I suspect a picture of me next to my brothers would probably shock you to your core.

Anonymous Harsh June 25, 2013 12:07 PM  

One can make an observation about smelly sh*t without engaging with the smelly Sh*t.

Which seems to contradict your original assertion as to why no one comes here to debate VD.

Anonymous Harsh June 25, 2013 12:09 PM  

OK, I admit it, I am the sock puppet of Robert Heinlein speaking from beyond the grave. I'd also like to promote my newest book from a long forgotten manuscript entitled Angry White Moon. And if that hack Scalzi rips me off again, I'm going to kick him in the pussy.

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