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Wednesday, November 13, 2013

Wine and arrogance stop ADHD

It would appear that my descendants will never suffer from ADHD:
In the United States, at least 9% of school-aged children have been diagnosed with ADHD, and are taking pharmaceutical medications. In France, the percentage of kids diagnosed and medicated for ADHD is less than .5%. How come the epidemic of ADHD—which has become firmly established in the United States—has almost completely passed over children in France?

Is ADHD a biological-neurological disorder? Surprisingly, the answer to this question depends on whether you live in France or in the United States. In the United States, child psychiatrists consider ADHD to be a biological disorder with biological causes. The preferred treatment is also biological--psycho stimulant medications such as Ritalin and Adderall.

French child psychiatrists, on the other hand, view ADHD as a medical condition that has psycho-social and situational causes. Instead of treating children's focusing and behavioral problems with drugs, French doctors prefer to look for the underlying issue that is causing the child distress—not in the child's brain but in the child's social context. They then choose to treat the underlying social context problem with psychotherapy or family counseling. This is a very different way of seeing things from the American tendency to attribute all symptoms to a biological dysfunction such as a chemical imbalance in the child's brain.
I suspect that another major difference is that the European schools are far less feminized than the American schools.  Most "ADHD" is little more than mothers and female teachers drugging little boys due to their inability to behave like little girls.

It's not so much that the French schools are doing it right as the American schools are at war with human nature and the male sex. The lesson, as always, is this: sending children to a public school in America is child abuse.

Karl Denninger notes that all this drugging of young boys comes at a very real price to society as well: "The problem with our approach is that it not only doesn't work it creates monsters.  Yes, statistically, it doesn't create very many monsters.  But it does create some of them and in fact the clinical trial data discloses quite-clearly that these risks and their percentage of outcome numbers are known."

Of course, from the perspective of society's would-be masters, this is a bonus. Not only are the troublemakers turned into zombies, but the occasional pharma-psychological mishap creates political pressure for gun control. If they're willing to see more than 9 percent of the school population chemically lobotomized, they're obviously not going to lose any sleep over a much smaller number of cherubic kindergarteners or cheerleaders being gunned down.

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83 Comments:

Anonymous Josh November 13, 2013 9:06 AM  

Obviously a little boy has ADHD if he can't sit still for 30 min in class while everyone is doing busy work (which girls seem to really love). Let's just ignore his ability to sit still for 5 hrs playing COD or Skyrim...

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 9:11 AM  

It might be helpful to look at family stats in France vs. America. If the French are right and it is social and situational circumstances causing distress and having the kid act out, it would be interesting to see if the French family is significantly more intact than the American.

I personally have always viewed this as a behavioural problem rather then some sort of biological or chemical problem. back in the day you didn't have this diagnosed because clear boundaries were established for children and discipline was swiftly utilized.

-AmicusC

Anonymous Josh November 13, 2013 9:13 AM  

I personally have always viewed this as a behavioural problem rather then some sort of biological or chemical problem

"being a boy" is not a behavioral problem. It's not a problem at all.

Anonymous Stg58/Animal Mother November 13, 2013 9:14 AM  

My two little tornados would definitely be pegged with ADHD. Guess what? THEY ARE BOYS. And I love to see them running, laughing and playing. And they say their prayers every night too.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 9:21 AM  

yes "being a boy" is not a behavioural problem.

But some boys do have behavioural problems. some of them do act out and are disruptive. some of them could use an education in how to properly behave.

there is a significant difference between requiring boys to act like little girls and requiring a modicum of decent behavior by a kid.

I am not sure how you arrive at assuming my comments are directed at all boys, rather than realizing the comment is saying that some children, boys and girls, have behavior problems that need to be addressed.

-AmicusC

Anonymous Josh November 13, 2013 9:24 AM  

I'm not sure I've ever seen any boys exhibit symptoms of ADHD in male environment with male teachers/leaders like Boy Scouts or sports teams.

Blogger IM2L844 November 13, 2013 9:25 AM  

Hasn't it been shown, statistically, that a large percentage of sociopathic criminals were under the influence of ADHD medication when they committed their crimes? I'm sure I read this somewhere (maybe from a commenter's link around here). I can't remember.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 9:31 AM  

"I'm not sure I've ever seen any boys exhibit symptoms of ADHD in male environment with male teachers/leaders like Boy Scouts or sports teams"

symptoms of "ADHD" frequently exist in those environments. but they are flashes in a pan as the male teachers/leaders quickly put the boy in his place and let him know that S*** ain't going to fly.

look at a male environment where the male teacher/ leader isn't comfortable with his authority or is a pansy and you will see more of that behaviour.

if you have honestly never seen a boy acting out and being extremely disruptive in a male environment I tip my hat. I can honestly say that if I was a kid now even in a male environment I'd be pumped full of adhd pills.

-AmicusC

Anonymous Catan November 13, 2013 9:31 AM  

Yeah, you just sit a young boy in a chair for eight straight hours, day after day and you just call it "expecting a modicum of decent behavior" as if that's that.

All the while, schools are eliminating everything that a boy might be able to let steam off with, recess, physical education, competition…

They tried to diagnose me with ADD because I insisted on reading my own books in class instead of listening to the same repetitive dredge over and over and over again that I already knew. Hell, they banned me from the school library. They couldn't stand that I wanted to learn and read about new things instead of following their rote memorization, even though I aced their stupid tests.

Teachers in our schools have no clue what a "modicum of decent behavior" even means. And additionally, they have no idea what boys need to thrive and grow up successfully.

The standard for "decent behavior" is "how the average well behaved girl acts."

Blogger Guitar Man November 13, 2013 9:35 AM  

The majority of ADHD (and probably autism) cases are scapegoats for lazy teachers and parents.

Friends of ours foolishly decided to enroll their 6 year old son into public school after homeschooling for a year. Within a few weeks, the first grade teacher was sending reports back home about his inattentive behavior, and starting to prescribe him with ADHD like behavior, and even mentioned that he would probably need Ritalin to function in school. Thankfully that pushed them over the age, and he's back home where he belongs.

American society has no patience for following the rule of law in school and in society. So a boy acting like a boy is intolerable to most teachers. Vox is right, the school system is feminized and designed to work in a decidedly feminist model.

Anonymous hardscrabble farmer November 13, 2013 9:42 AM  

I've had more than a few teen age boys who work the farm over the Summer confess to having been diagnosed "ADD/ADHD" by their schools- none of them were medicated that I know of. For some odd reason they have zero problems digging holes for fence posts/splitting wood/running a chain saw/tossing hay bales, etc for 10-12 hours at a stretch. The problem isn't their attention span or their hyperactivity, it's not having an outlet for that youthful male energy. Put it to work, feed them good food, let them drink all the water they can and pay them fairly for their work and they develop not only physically and mentally, but aquire a work ethic. Most of them come back as grown men, some with families now and they always speak highly of the time they spent with us even though they worked probably as hard as they ever had in their life. You don't coddle them, fawn over them, point out every flaw or screw-up, you just keep them busy.

The feminization of the population, it's removal from the natural order, it's mindless passtimes and distractions and it's poisonous diet are clearly killing our citizenry; physically as well as spiritually, mentally and emotionally. The problem is trying to convince people that hard work, sacrifice, privation, simple pleasures are a worthwhile alternative to things like fastfood, porn and vdeoscreens. Probably every third or fourth kid we get on the farm cannot divorce themselves from their handheld devices and ennui long enough to get a toehold on what it takes to become a man, so we simply release them back to the world they prefer.

The best part is when you get a dozen or so of them all back together- our oldest son is still in his teens and has a wide range of these young men as friends- and they spend an evening camped out on one of the pastures, roasting a hog, laughing and talking into the night and you don't have to worry about what they're up to or what will become of them, you can see success written all over their future.

I feel bad for the boys out there without access to the sticks, as the SWPLs call the real world. I don't see it getting much better anytime soon.

Blogger IM2L844 November 13, 2013 9:42 AM  

Maybe this was it.

Note: This is a completely separate issue from the often touted, but still somewhat suspect (not definitive), lower crime rate correlation studies.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 9:44 AM  

@Catan,

Nothing in my comments suggest I agree with the way schooling is failing boys.

the standard for decent behaviour in reality is not that of what the 22 y/o school teacher wants it to be. yes a young female teacher wants them all to behave like little girls. but there is an objective standard of decent behaviour. and the kids acting out don't limit them selves to school. you see this in malls, grocery stores, movie theaters.

there is a difference between boys being boys and some kids being little a holes. I will repeat again because people seem to think I am only discussing boys, both genders can and do act out inappropriately.

you and josh seem to suggest there is no kid in the history of the world that acts out inappropriately and needs to be corrected. My comments are directed at the article saying I agree France has it right. they have .5% diagnosis of ADHD. they treat underlying issues that may be causing the children to act out.

Perhaps I shouldn't have just left the implication and should have baldly stated my assertion in my first comment. The reason ADHD is significantly more diagnosed in the states is single motherhood. Kids are acting out inappropriately because of the distress of either missing parents or family break down.

-AmicusC

Anonymous Catan November 13, 2013 9:45 AM  

Boys are forced to grow up in a nearly complete feminine environment (aren't 85% of teachers female?) and for some reason it is a shock to some people that some of them get antsy.

When is the last time anyone saw a female wrestle or have any competitive physical play with a boy? Women are simply not capable of providing the physical attention and teaching that they require for letting off energy.

Looking back, my life would have been so much better served if I would have been apprenticed at the age of 11 or so to someone in a trade. All those years where I would have eagerly absorbed information that would have been valuable to myself and society at large, completely wasted. I'm glad those "social studies" and "communications skills" classes were worth it, though!

Anonymous willneverpostagain November 13, 2013 9:47 AM  

The screwl teechers and administrayters don't want any trouble, it might interfere with their Obahma/Socialism/Statism worship. Boys being boys, or even girls who are a little on the tomboy side are a "disruption" and interrupt their "good order" in class. The answer of course is not to allow for human nature, but rather to drug the offenders until compliance is achieved.

I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the NEA has stock in the drug companies.

The pussification of the U.S. continues.



Anonymous Catan November 13, 2013 9:51 AM  

Your belief that any of us are suggesting that no boy is ever unruly or out of line seems false. I certainly wouldn't say such. I think most of us here are focusing on the larger picture, not exceptions.

So we can focus on more important topics than trying to prove that boys aren't all perfect. We know.

Anonymous DonReynolds November 13, 2013 9:54 AM  

One of the important lessons every boy should learn is that authority figures can be wrong. It is not necessarily the most important lesson, but there may come a time when that lesson will save your life and the lives of people you care about. Obedience is a good thing in a child. Any parent can explain that to you. But mixed with obedience to authority, you need a drop of caution, to alert the boy to the possibility that not all cars stay on their side of the road and they do not always stop for red traffic signals. We call it defensive driving in an automobile. We do not really have a word (that I know of) that would enable a child to reject the wrong command from authority. Rebellion would not seem the correct term, but in the end, it is the same act.

Anonymous DrTorch November 13, 2013 9:57 AM  

The problem isn't their attention span or their hyperactivity, it's not having an outlet for that youthful male energy. Put it to work, feed them good food, let them drink all the water they can and pay them fairly for their work and they develop not only physically and mentally, but aquire a work ethic.

This. Even in the early stages of broad public education in the US (when Christians could defend their choice to support it) this is how it was done. Well, out of necessity. Boys worked the farm, often going to school only a few months a year, as opposed to ten.

Oh, and I'll point out a great DC comic about this entitled "The Demon Within" IIRC. I read it in an anthology 37 years ago. Doing a quick search, I found it here

http://www.backfromthedepths.co.uk/thetheatreofterror/2011/comic-scans/the-demon-within-from-house-of-mystery-201/

So the issue is far from new

Anonymous hardscrabble farmer November 13, 2013 10:07 AM  

Thinking on this for a while I recalled something else-

When the parents of the boys came to visit the farm one of the first things the kids would do would be to take them off to a project they had worked on, fifty yards of fenceline, twenty cords of firewood heaped into a pile, a new shed- and there they would stand and beam at what they had accomplished and go into great detail about how they had done whatever it was. These seemingly mundane tasks were a point of great pride. I don't know how schools operate these days, but I understand that the idea that "everyone is a winner" so no one can be one has probably sapped them of any youthful initiative. If every single class has every single kid accomplishing all things equally,what happens to the pride of actually excelling? I'm not sure if this fits into it at all, but it was something that struck me as at least in small part, a factor.

Anonymous The other skeptic November 13, 2013 10:11 AM  

OT, but how the narrative changes to suit the purpose.

Claimed White Supremacist told he has 14% SubSaharan African ancestry

I thought the story was that we are all descended from those out of Africa, so surely we must all have "African" ancestry ...

Anonymous VryeDenker November 13, 2013 10:11 AM  

I see "ADHD" symptoms a lot in kids whose parents don't discipline them and give them boundaries. Why would a kid care to behave himself or sit still and pay attention if it's more fun to climb on stuff?

I also believe that it has to do with the kid not getting enough intellectual stimulation. But I'm no psychologist, so don't quote me.

Anonymous DonReynolds November 13, 2013 10:14 AM  

"I'm not sure I've ever seen any boys exhibit symptoms of ADHD in male environment with male teachers/leaders like Boy Scouts or sports teams"

Anonymous......"symptoms of "ADHD" frequently exist in those environments. but they are flashes in a pan as the male teachers/leaders quickly put the boy in his place and let him know that S*** ain't going to fly."

In the South, especially the rural South, men and women segregate themselves (not by any rule, but by preference). The women and girls tend to collect in the kitchen with the toddlers of both genders. The men and boys tend to be outside, in all kinds of weather, even if it is just on the front porch, the garage, workshop, or barn. When a toddler boy gets to a certain age, which I describe as when he is "no longer cute", he is turned over to the men and he begins to learn how to be a part of male society. There is some reluctance at first on everyone's part. The men think he needs to stay in the kitchen a bit longer. The women say he is scuffling with the girls and they cannot handle him. And the little boy is just a little fearful of being around the men, and so far from the food in the kitchen. There is a bit of transition involved but it is generally good-natured. Those who listen have an opportunity to learn the easy way.

Anonymous Sigyn November 13, 2013 10:16 AM  

Boys being boys, or even girls who are a little on the tomboy side are a "disruption" and interrupt their "good order" in class.

Or just smart and unwilling to do senseless, repetitive things for no reason.

I once got in trouble for writing a short essay speculating about why the teacher thought we were all retarded. It wasn't even for anything; it was just to keep myself from falling asleep in class. The teacher knew I was up to no good because I was conscious and actually doing something.

Now, a cool teacher would have been all, "This is an interesting perspective, but I'm afraid it doesn't apply to algebra class," and then given me something to do. But no, my teacher flipped out and sent me to the principal for "being disruptive" and "being disrespectful". ("Disrespectful" I earned. I probably shouldn't have asked her if snoring would be less "disruptive". Wasn't big on tact back then...)

Anonymous The other skeptic November 13, 2013 10:20 AM  

When the right people are being attacked by black gangs something will be done.

We should all claim to be Jews.

Anonymous Jake November 13, 2013 10:21 AM  

If I'm not mistaken, in the US schools also receive additional funding based on how many of their students are diagnosed with such disorders. I have a lot of teachers in my family, they see ADHD behind any and every instance of a child misbehaving, I think they're trained to do so.

In my case, my daughter was 2 years old and grandma (30+ year career as a 4th and 5th grade teacher) was already saying "she's going to have problems in school if she's not medicated". Of course she said this to my wife, not me, as she knows I wouldn't have let such an idea go unchallenged. "Well mom, good thing we don't intend for her to ever be stuck inside of a school building, and didn't you want to put ME on those drugs at one time? I turned out alright, don't ya think?"

Anonymous Cajin November 13, 2013 10:21 AM  

It's not just the meds to treat ADHD that is affecting people. I've noticed that allergy drugs such as loratadine also have emotional side-effects as well. I can't find any studies citing as much, but that hardly means anything.

Anonymous mrl November 13, 2013 10:23 AM  

It would be interesting to know how many home schooled children are diagnosed with ADHD.

Anonymous Daniel November 13, 2013 10:47 AM  

ADHD treatments are a vaccine against liberty. Sometimes, they don't work, but think of the good of society for once!

To get your brain on drugs, sometimes you have to break a few good eggs.

Blogger Crowhill November 13, 2013 10:59 AM  

Wine, arrogance and surrendering.

Anonymous Jill November 13, 2013 11:01 AM  

I would hazard a guess that ADHD in America is at least a little bit a part of American culture, as well as a product of genetics. So many of us are the children of explorers, inventors, and pioneers--and now we're yawning our way through mind-numbing 8-hr school days. I would also hazard a guess that this spirit is more difficult to suppress in boys; hence, the rate at which boys are drugged is much higher than it is in girls.

Anonymous Supernaut November 13, 2013 11:05 AM  

While everything VD considers in this post is true about the feminization of schools and how normal boyhood aggression is demonized and declared in need of medication, ADHD is very real.... and it's related to S.A.D. (Standard American Diet).

In America, plenty of children are given pop tarts, twinkies, cupcakes, donuts, soda pop, and/or sugary cereals for breakfast.

Take a French kid (or any other kid) and give him or her that sort of breakfast everyday for a week or longer and you'll see exactly what causes ADHD.

Anonymous Jill November 13, 2013 11:07 AM  

"It would be interesting to know how many home schooled children are diagnosed with ADHD."

In my experience, homeschool parents don't readily play the diagnosis game, unless they're the type who pulled their children from school because the school "just wasn't addressing my disabled children's needs!" Those parents generally whine around about how much harder their homeschooling is than everybody else's and search for sympathy. They are truly obnoxious. But in the words of one non-whiner homeschool mom, when asked if her son was ADHD, "Yes, he probably is, but we're not going to have him diagnosed because we wouldn't treat him any differently because of a diagnosis."

Anonymous Jake November 13, 2013 11:20 AM  

ADHD is very real.... and it's related to S.A.D. (Standard American Diet).

I definitely think this is a factor. There's a notable difference in my daughter's behavior when she's eating her normal diet of fats, proteins, vegetables and fruit vs. when she gets a more mainstream SAD diet.

Anonymous TLM November 13, 2013 11:21 AM  

Young female teachers are just retards and lazy. That's it, nothing more. And I'll bet that the most medicated boys belong to single moms. People get upset but I won't let my kids around divorced single moms and their spawn. They are nothing but trouble and annoyingly whiny.

Blogger swiftfoxmark2 November 13, 2013 11:23 AM  

Isn't it amazing how parents can't sue the pharmaceutical companies?

Or that teachers are suddenly qualified to provide a medical diagnosis?

Or that the primary solution to hyperactive kids is drugs?

Or that parents are dumb enough to trust the teacher, who has little incentive to actually care about his or her students' well-being, especially in comparison to most parents?

Anonymous DrTorch November 13, 2013 11:38 AM  

It's not just the meds to treat ADHD that is affecting people. I've noticed that allergy drugs such as loratadine also have emotional side-effects as well.

My wife is physiologically affected by allergy meds, w/ similar responses as what's in your link.

My son gets very moody and sensitive as an allergy symptom, particluarly to food allergies. We cannot let him have an allergy food as a treat more than once a week.

Anonymous DonReynolds November 13, 2013 11:41 AM  

TLM...."Young female teachers are just retards and lazy. That's it, nothing more. And I'll bet that the most medicated boys belong to single moms. People get upset but I won't let my kids around divorced single moms and their spawn. They are nothing but trouble and annoyingly whiny."

There may be another proxy at work here, that begins long before they go to school. My wife and I noticed it decades ago. While it is common for single moms, it can also be seen in families that are much the same, when both parents work every day. I am talking about the kids who were raised in day care. I can spot one from a distance. They are typically noisy in public or sullen and withdrawn, vicious, potty mouthed, aggressive and defensive from one moment to the next, bullys and thugs, overlording it on the little kids. Yes, these are nearly always a product of day care warehouses.
Their parent(s) get them from day care (or school), pick up some fast food on the way home, then it is "homework" (video games or television), bathtime and to bed early. Not every day of the week, but too many days. The only adults they know well are day care workers, who are soon replaced by school teachers. No wonder.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 11:45 AM  

@hardscrabble farmer - I have yet to meet a farmer I haven't immediately liked (I realize they are out there, I just haven't experienced it).

Anonymous hausfrau November 13, 2013 11:48 AM  

I would expect diagnosis of ADHD and other such disorders to go up as Common Core becomes more entrenched. When kids who previously slid by start failing in droves they'll have to attribute it to something if they want to offset pressure to change the program.

Anonymous Supernaut November 13, 2013 11:48 AM  

They are typically noisy in public or sullen and withdrawn, vicious, potty mouthed, aggressive and defensive from one moment to the next, bullys and thugs, overlording it on the little kids. Yes, these are nearly always a product of day care warehouses.

Oh yeah. And these are the kids more likely to have parents hurriedly give 'em a pop tart or donut or sugary cereal and soda pop as a breakfast before dropping them off to the daycare warehouse facility.

The two are definitely correlated.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 11:52 AM  

And I'll bet that the most medicated boys belong to single moms. People get upset but I won't let my kids around divorced single moms and their spawn.

It would be very interesting to see if their is documentation regarding this. I would also bet that there is a higher percentage of boys with single moms diagnosed with ADHD as well.

Anonymous bw November 13, 2013 11:56 AM  

How come the epidemic of ADHD—which has become firmly established in the United States—has almost completely passed over children in France?

Because there is "almost completely" no such thing as ADHD as portrayed.

And if no one has mentioned it, don't forget about the $$ the govt gulags get for putting children on these wicked substances.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 12:07 PM  

For the small number of kids who really do have a problem with focus that seems impervious to discipline and exercise, I suspect it has a lot to do with diet. The French never bought into the low-fat nonsense like the US did, so I'm not surprised at all if they suffer less from mental conditions that have been tied to high levels of processed grains and seed oils.

Anonymous TLM November 13, 2013 12:07 PM  

I forgot about daycare kids. they're trouble as well. I've spent a long time in my current field and have started 3 different small companies. One is working out well, the other two failed. But if I ever truly wanted to make money while ignoring my conscious, i'd open a string of daycare centers. These places are cash cows and they don't give a shitt about the children. easy easy money, but that whole white throne judgement thing stops me from pursuing the mammon.

Anonymous concernedmum November 13, 2013 12:13 PM  

I can't seem to find any stats on the British children receiving medication for adhd, autism, or the awful, irritatingly labelled 'opposition defiance disorder'. At the school nearest to us, there are only 46 boys to the 58 girls, and as we live in a small island community, we actually know all these children and their parents personally. Of the 46 boys, 31 of these boys are on medication. It is widely talked about amongst their mothers as they sympathise with one another about the difficulties they face raising these 'difficult' boys. Now, we home educate, and of course, our local rural school is hardly an example of the whole of the UK…, but it is certainly a concerning feature for our communities future. Especially, as every local will tell you just how exceptional and amazing our local school is. Not that they are at all biased. Despite almost 60% of our community either being employed, by the local council, or by the council to work in the school.

Anonymous cheddarman, apostle of omega-3 fatty acids November 13, 2013 12:22 PM  

I think there are some nutritional causes of ADD, such as lack of omega-3 fatty acids in the diet of a mother carrying a child. Omega-3's help with brain development in the fetus, and cause brain cells to develop more connections to other brain cells. There is a growing body of scientific literature concerning this.

Taking omega-3's as an adult helps me maintain focus...not as much as a lot of coffee, but still it helps...

Anonymous Red Comet November 13, 2013 12:23 PM  

Brain nuking drugs administered at a young age is a topic not allowed when some dude that can't get laid finally decides to shoot a place up. No, it's guns (if you're left) or videogames (if you're right) because inanimate objects OBVIOUSLY have more effect on the human mind than psychoactive drugs.

They're kind of like vaccines in the area of discussion that's not allowed. I presume this is because a lot of people one talks to are likely parents who got talked into lobotomizing their kid by some quack and can't even entertain the thought that they fucked their kid up lest their carefully constructed fantasy life be shattered.

But if you want some fun with blank stares just ask people why there were no sperglords around when they were kids. Why was there no ADHD? Why did all this suddenly pop out of nowhere sometime in the 90s and 2000s?

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 12:24 PM  

For some odd reason they have zero problems digging holes for fence posts/splitting wood/running a chain saw/tossing hay bales, etc for 10-12 hours at a stretch. -- hardscrabble farmer

It's interesting: I think outdoor work like that, which most people would consider mindless repetition, actually occupies your mind on multiple levels, more so than academic or office work. Take gathering hay bales: you're thinking about the bale you're throwing onto the wagon and where you need to put it, but you're also looking ahead to see where the next bale is, and you're watching the ground to make sure you don't trip, and you might be watching the sky for birds or the trees for deer. If the tractor isn't too loud, you might be talking to the other guys on the crew. There are several different things to occupy your mind.

I've been diagnosed with ADHD, and the thing about the ADHD-type mind (whether it's a "condition" or not, or bad or not) is that your mind tends to cycle around to different things. In a job like that, that's not a problem -- it might even be a benefit, because it keeps you from getting bored. It's not so great at a desk job or in the classroom, where you need to focus on a single thing until it's finished. The kid who's smart enough can get away with daydreaming about six other things, because 1/7th of his attention is enough to keep up; but the average kid can't.

It's good to develop the discipline to sit and focus entirely on a task until it's finished. I don't think there's any evidence that sitting in a classroom for several hours a day 180 days a year instills that discipline, though. It's too general, not focused enough, ironically.

Blogger TontoBubbaGoldstein November 13, 2013 12:29 PM  

*Snaps Fingers*

"More wine, waiter, please."

Anonymous bob k. mando November 13, 2013 12:31 PM  

Sigyn November 13, 2013 10:16 AM
Wasn't big on tact back then...



dear, i haven't noticed you being 'big on tact' NOW. i suppose being the wife of a 'god' makes it hard to empathize with the hoi polloi.

*rib poke*

Anonymous Sigyn November 13, 2013 12:32 PM  

It is widely talked about amongst their mothers as they sympathise with one another about the difficulties they face raising these 'difficult' boys.

Munchausen by Proxy Syndrome, in its most socially-acceptable form.

Anonymous Sigyn November 13, 2013 12:33 PM  

dear, i haven't noticed you being 'big on tact' NOW.

Never said I was!

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 12:36 PM  

But if you want some fun with blank stares just ask people why there were no sperglords around when they were kids. Why was there no ADHD?

When I was in school 30-40 years ago, there was at most one serious discipline problem per class of 30 or so kids -- one kid who got paddled more than once (yes, they still used paddles in rural schools then) or tied to his desk. So maybe 2-3%, and I don't recall that they were more likely to be boys than girls. They were more likely to be kids whose parents were split up (rare then) or living with grandparents or another family, and generally poorer than average. So it's hard to say what the cause was: they probably didn't inherit the best genes, or have the best discipline at home, or get the best diet. Those factors tend to appear together.

Thirty years later, we have far more kids being raised by single moms or shuttled around between family and day-cares, more processed junk food, less discipline, and a more feminized society and school system. Not surprising that those 2-3% of problem kids -- especially boys -- would have multiplied.

Anonymous Thales November 13, 2013 12:39 PM  

I would expect diagnosis of ADHD and other such disorders to go up as Common Core becomes more entrenched.

I would expect (parental) wine drinking to go up as well...ugh.

Anonymous Stickwick November 13, 2013 12:47 PM  

It's probably safe to assume that, if it were entirely up to teachers, at least a third of all young school children in America would be medicated.

Medication has become an integral part of the culture here: almost 50% of the population in this country is on prescription medication of some kind. The high rate of drugging is motivated to some degree by government ties to big pharma (follow the money), but even then it would not be possible without the prevalence of humanist philosophy, which says pain or discomfort of any kind is abnormal and to be avoided at all cost. Nobody really knows the human cost of all these medications, because "modern" medicine is just a modern form of alchemy; I'm fully convinced that 100 years from now people will look back on this era of American medicine the way we look back on Medieval proto-science.

From the article: From the time their children are born, French parents provide them with a firm cadre—the word means "frame" or "structure."

How much do we see that with American parents anymore? Kids nowadays seem to do what they want, when they want. With both parents working in many families, there's no structure whatsoever. There's also this bizarre new mindset that makes parents afraid to let their children experience even momentary upset -- I once heard a father say he couldn't discipline his young son, because it would damage their friendship. I attribute it to the feminization of this country, because in days past it used to be only mothers who struggled to choose between their children's feelings and enforcing rules.

Karl Denninger notes that all this drugging of young boys comes at a very real price to society as well: "The problem with our approach is that it not only doesn't work it creates monsters. Yes, statistically, it doesn't create very many monsters. But it does create some of them and in fact the clinical trial data discloses quite-clearly that these risks and their percentage of outcome numbers are known."

This is exactly what came to mind when I saw Serenity. Pax and the Reavers.

Anonymous dh November 13, 2013 12:49 PM  

I say when talking to my friends that I am surprised any boy ever reaches the age of 10 without removing himself from the gene pool. We are naturally playful, dominant, aggressive, explosive, daring, idiotic, determined, stubborn and many other things which sound bad for adults but are normal for young boys. I would not be surprised if there really was a a small number of kids with general behavior disorders that are chemically based. But it's certainly not tens of millions.

Anonymous Stickwick November 13, 2013 12:57 PM  

Here's the scene from Serenity that explains the origin of the Reavers. Watch it and note the eerie similarity to our present drugged-up culture. Most people who take ADHD drugs, anti-depressants, and anti-anxiety meds are calmed -- but to the point that it's problematic. And then a minority of people who precipitously go off their medications experience the other extreme -- IIRC, the vast majority of mass-shooters in America in the last couple of decades were on some kind of psychotropic medication.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 1:04 PM  

The French also have a low rate of heart disease, despite eating what our govt. would call a heart unhealthy diet (the French paradox). IMHO, it's because the French lifestyle is less stressful than the typical Americans, and (again imho) stress is a greater contributor to heart disease than diet.

Is there also a tie between ADHD and stress?

When you lock boys in a classroom all day and expect them to act unnaturally (like little girls instead of little boys) it must produce a high level of stress in the boys. Is that stress coming out in the form of ADHD?

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 1:07 PM  

Most people who take ADHD drugs, anti-depressants, and anti-anxiety meds are calmed -- but to the point that it's problematic.

I tried an ADHD drug (prescription speed, essentially) for a couple months before deciding I'd rather deal with it with diet and exercise and discipline. One disturbing thing is that, while I still recognized the problems that had worried me before, I just didn't care very much about them. Emotionally, there was a certain amount of numbness. On the positive side, that freed up mental energy for useful things; but it's not hard to see how that could turn into amoral or pathological behavior. If you stop caring about anything, you might follow whatever impulse comes along.

Anonymous FUBAR Nation Ben November 13, 2013 1:14 PM  

Up to 11 years old, I was very active in sports and was somewhat of a bully in 4th grade. My parents took me to all types of psychologists, screamed at me, etc. Lo and behold from 11 years old and through my teenage years I had no interest in sports and was afraid to play them, and was painfully shy and didn't talk much. I hated school and just wanted to play video games all day and be left alone. I was also bullied a little bit. I was never put on drugs.

How do you explain that?

Anonymous Josh November 13, 2013 1:36 PM  

How do you explain that?

Puberty?

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 1:45 PM  

As a young kid, I was diagnosed ADD (early 80s, before it became fashionable) and had a great team of psychiatrists, pediatricians, and family counselors. It took all three to help me through and it was a family effort. The Ritalin was used sparingly, only "under the influence" during school hours/days and then only for a few years, with rigorous therapy and counseling to "train my brain" how to focus.

One of the most important things ever told to me was by the psychiatrist (who, it turns out, was using me as a case study!) who explained to my over-curious 8 year old self that ADD is actually an adaptive trait, from an evolutionary perspective. People who are too focused miss details, like that rock that made a spark when dropped or the saber toothed tiger sneaking up behind the hunting party. They are also inherent risk takers, the benefits of which accrete to the whole of society when they pay off and only cost the risk taker if they fail. Therefore, every viable human population NEEDS ADD folks in order to move forward, survive and thrive. I left that session feeling like Superman and was able to turn my talents from frivolity into productive skills.

--JT

Anonymous DonReynolds November 13, 2013 1:56 PM  

I would expect diagnosis of ADHD and other such disorders to go up as Common Core becomes more entrenched.

Thales....."I would expect (parental) wine drinking to go up as well...ugh."

He He.....boosted even more by the overly successful wimmin.... with their cat collection, red wine, and spare batteries.

Anonymous DonReynolds November 13, 2013 2:07 PM  

"Karl Denninger notes that all this drugging of young boys comes at a very real price to society as well....."

I would only add that there is a determined effort to eradicate all traces of rural redneck from schools, media and culture too. When the SHTF, a good many people will wish there were more rednecks and fewer non-rednecks. Cannot grow these overnight.

Anonymous hausfrau November 13, 2013 2:08 PM  

There's also this bizarre new mindset that makes parents afraid to let their children experience even momentary upset -- I once heard a father say he couldn't discipline his young son, because it would damage their friendship. I attribute it to the feminization of this country, because in days past it used to be only mothers who struggled to choose between their children's feelings and enforcing rules.


Historically speaking this is a truly bizarre mindset. The parent-child relationship is so much deeper and more significant than friendship. They are trading in responsibility and discipline for the frivolous, non-judgmental, feel good vibes. Over time, a child will trust and confide in a good parent more so than friends who come and go.

Anonymous Azimus November 13, 2013 2:20 PM  

Crowhill November 13, 2013 10:59 AM
Wine, arrogance and surrendering.


Where does this come from, exactly? The French "surrender" meme? The French were kicking everyone's @ss in 100BC and continued this trend pretty much unabated for 2000 years. Then they lost one war to the Germans, and withdrew from two worthless sh*thole colonies, one of which we had to find out for ourselves just how much of a sh*thole it was, and all of a sudden they're the surrender artists and we're the mega-warriors. I mean c'mon, spot 'em a loss every now and again... we haven't exactly been winning military conflicts left and right in our contemporary history either...

Remember not every Frenchman is a coffee sipping, beret-wearing Parisian (Paris-ite). And there are some Frenchmen who would claim Parisians are not French at all.

Anonymous cheddarman, apostle of omega-3 fatty acids November 13, 2013 2:32 PM  

Sigyn,

you need to be taking a lot of fish oil supplements. Helps with brain development of the fetus. His Lordship would probably leave an inferior child out on the side of a mountain, he is Loki, after all, so you gotta make each pregnancy count...besides, it would drive his lordship to humility if his progeny were all smarter than he.

Anonymous Anonymous November 13, 2013 2:53 PM  

In RE the OP:
Heaven help society should the barriers be stripped away and it finds out truly how many monsters have created by this pharmacological and psychological assault on boys/men. I don't believe there is only a few monsters created by this attack, just that most are still contained by the system.

Anonymous Sigyn November 13, 2013 2:58 PM  

you need to be taking a lot of fish oil supplements. Helps with brain development of the fetus.

He's got me on all kinds of supplements right now. Took a couple months to fine-tune them so I didn't barf them back up, but...

His Lordship would probably leave an inferior child out on the side of a mountain, he is Loki, after all, so you gotta make each pregnancy count...

Considering he was the unwanted/deemed inferior and got this treatment himself, and turned out smart and strong after all, I don't see that happening. He may be crazy, but he's not stupid.

besides, it would drive his lordship to humility if his progeny were all smarter than he.

You want me to use his children against him? You're kinda sick, dude.

Anonymous Sigyn November 13, 2013 2:59 PM  

Where does this come from, exactly? The French "surrender" meme?

Two World Wars, IIRC. It's hard to live that down, even with La Resistance.

Anonymous hausfrau November 13, 2013 3:13 PM  

Where does this come from, exactly? The French "surrender" meme?

Two World Wars, IIRC. It's hard to live that down, even with La Resistance.

You could start well before then with the Franco-Prussian War of 1870. In fact has France won a European War since Napoleon's initial victories? The French-Indian wars? Their score card does look a little light.

Anonymous bob k. mando November 13, 2013 4:19 PM  

Azimus November 13, 2013 2:20 PM
Where does this come from, exactly? The French "surrender" meme?



AlbinoBlackSheep catalogs the amazing military history of the French since the Gallic wars. considering that the Franks were a Germanic tribe, you have to ask, "What the hell went wrong?":
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/france.html

here are the condensed rules of French Victory -
1 - "France's armies are victorious only when not led by a Frenchman." notice the emphasis on 'man', this rule has been in effect since the 1400s.
2 - "France only wins when America does most of the fighting."
3 - "When incapable of any victory whatsoever - claim someone else's".

First Rule of Muslim Warfare?
"We can always beat the French." This rule is identical to the First Rules of the Italians, Russians, Germans, English, Dutch, Spanish, Vietnamese and Esquimaux.



Sigyn November 13, 2013 2:58 PM
You want me to use his children against him? You're kinda sick, dude.




obviously, he's a 3rd degree black belt Freudian.

Anonymous cheddarman, apostle of omega-3 fatty acids November 13, 2013 6:03 PM  

You want me to use his children against him? You're kinda sick, dude. - Sigyn

Not in the slightest. A Loki pre-occupied with his trickster offspring is a Loki less likely to, well, be Loki in our world.

Besides, on does not have to be a genius to note that the feminine imperative requires a mother to root for the children when they are in a power struggle with their father, as they are slightly more than half of her DNA

Anonymous DonReynolds November 13, 2013 6:43 PM  

Thanks Azimus. Not everyone here is big on reading history, as you can tell by some of the posts. Ask any thoughtful Brit who has killed more of the English and he would not say Germans. He would say the French. The famous battle of Waterloo was so close that it could have been won by either side. (Disclaimer: I am not part French nor are any of my relatives, but I am glad to call them friends and allies.)

Sigyn....."Two World Wars, IIRC. It's hard to live that down, even with La Resistance."

Excuse me. The French did not lose WWI. They fought gallantly for the entire war. But you are correct, they were defeated by the Germans in WWII and occupied. So was nearly all of Europe.

hausfrau....."You could start well before then with the Franco-Prussian War of 1870. In fact has France won a European War since Napoleon's initial victories? The French-Indian wars? Their score card does look a little light."

You did not mention the Franco-Austrian War of 1859 or the Crimean War or the fact that the French are the only ones who ever burned Moscow to the ground.

Ben Franklin said that every American has two countries, his own and France. French direct participation in the American Revolution made our own independence a reality. The great victory at Yorktown would not have been possible without the French regulars and the French navy. The British at Yorktown thought they were only fighting the French and when they tried to surrender, the French heaped one last insult on the British by having them surrender to George Washington. (Cornwallis refused and sent his deputy and Washington did likewise.)

Napoleon did not just have some initial victories....it took six separate coalitions to finally defeat Napoleon. (If you want to argue that Napoleon was Corsican and not French, then I will expect you to also argue that Hitler was not German but Austrian. But I can assure you that his armies, that were seldom defeated, were very much French.)

During the US Civil War, France invaded and occupied Mexico (1861-67), and the eventual victory of Juarez over the French Legionaires leaves us with Cinco de Mayo and the only holiday in the French Foreign Legion ...... Camerone Day.

bob k. mando......"the amazing military history of the French since the Gallic wars. considering that the Franks were a Germanic tribe"

The east Franks were Germans. The west Franks were French. The Carolingian Empire, which began with Charlemagne, lasted almost a century and had a population between 10 and 20 million people. The Frankish kingdom lasted from the 5th to the 9th centuries. Maybe you heard of Charles Martel (the Hammer of Europe) who stopped the Muslim invasion at the Battle of Tours. He started what later became the Carolingian Empire and was Charlemagne's grandfather.

Anonymous Azimus November 13, 2013 8:13 PM  

DonReynolds November 13, 2013 6:43 PM
Maybe you heard of Charles Martel (the Hammer of Europe) who stopped the Muslim invasion at the Battle of Tours. He started what later became the Carolingian Empire and was Charlemagne's grandfather.


Many good points Don Reynolds. What escapes most people who like to point to the two world wars is that France actually won both wars. It doesn't matter how bloody the fighter is, the last fighter standing is the winner and that was France.

I will say that France was broken forever as a martial power at Verdun. If people only understood the inhuman, scientific, mechanical savagery of that battle, they would understand why the French sat behind the Maginot Line 22 years later and waited. Alistair Horne's book "Death of a Generation" is a great depiction of it. In fact, all Horne's stuff is good to really get to know France and the history of her soldiers and leaders. I also liked "How Far from Austerlitz"

Anonymous SirHamster November 13, 2013 8:29 PM  

[i]What escapes most people who like to point to the two world wars is that France actually won both wars. It doesn't matter how bloody the fighter is, the last fighter standing is the winner and that was France. [/i]

Considering Vichy France supported the other side, it's hard for France not to "win" the 2nd World War.

As for the definition of last fighter standing - with France being broken as a fighter by WWI, do you consider that winning?

Anonymous Sigyn November 13, 2013 8:56 PM  

Not in the slightest. A Loki pre-occupied with his trickster offspring is a Loki less likely to, well, be Loki in our world.

Don't get too sure of that. You get cocky, you walk onto our lawn...he gets annoyed. And then heads on pikes. Very awkward.

Besides, on does not have to be a genius to note that the feminine imperative requires a mother to root for the children when they are in a power struggle with their father, as they are slightly more than half of her DNA

Yeah, when I start meeting the requirements of the "feminine imperative"--whatever the heck it is, considering it keeps changing every time I read about it--I'll be sure to do that one, too. *eyeroll*

Anonymous hausfrau November 13, 2013 9:16 PM  

As for the definition of last fighter standing - with France being broken as a fighter by WWI, do you consider that winning?

Perhaps that would called a Pyrrhic victory? But, yes, I suppose that is a victory all the same. Thanks Don Reynolds. Very informative historic run down.

Anonymous DonReynolds November 13, 2013 9:27 PM  

Azimus...... "What escapes most people who like to point to the two world wars is that France actually won both wars. It doesn't matter how bloody the fighter is, the last fighter standing is the winner and that was France."

I concede your point. When Berlin was divided into four zones of occupation after the war, with the British sandwiched between the American and French, and the Soviet in the east.

SirHamster......"Considering Vichy France supported the other side, it's hard for France not to "win" the 2nd World War."

It would be very easy to confuse the government with the nation. The French government surrendered in June 1940 and was reformed as the Vichy government under Petain. The Germans kept 2 million French soldiers in Germany as forced laborers to guarantee Vichy compliance with the terms of the surrender. The north and west of France was occupied by the Germans and administered by the army. The other half of France was governed by the Vichy government for two years and five months, until the Germans decided to occupy the entire country. Col. Charles de Gaulle created a new French government in exile and recovered a number of the French foreign colonies and possessions, even created a Free French Army with Allied support. This is the government that returned to France in June 1944 and liberated France from the Vichy government and went on to represent the French nation at the end of the war.

This was very similar to the experience of a number of countries that were overrun and occupied by the Germans in WWII, the Dutch, Polish, Czech, and Norwegian governments in exile are familiar examples. The Italian experience is terribly confusing, having been on the side of the Axis and the Allies during the war, surrendering while still occupied by the Germans in September 1943. The experience in Finland is also confused, being on the Soviet side and the German side at different times.

Anonymous A Visitor November 13, 2013 11:24 PM  

All the while, schools are eliminating everything that a boy might be able to let steam off with, recess, physical education, competition…

Ain't that the truth? I'm so glad I went to grade school in the '90s when we still had recess. I remember cutting my knee pretty profusely one day during soccer. I can't remember if it got bandaged up or not; I do remember I kept on keeping on though.

Vox is right, the school system is feminized and designed to work in a decidedly feminist model.

It is hard to believe that 60, just 60 years ago, they had marksmanship classes in high school. I always think of my grandparents (the ones that are still alive who were born in the late '20s and early '30s) and all the change they saw (for better and worse) that happened to the U.S. and our society. I think it'll be up to those of us (as beta as this sounds) to carry it on in small groups.

The feminization of the population, it's removal from the natural order, it's mindless passtimes and distractions and it's poisonous diet are clearly killing our citizenry; physically as well as spiritually, mentally and emotionally. The problem is trying to convince people that hard work, sacrifice, privation, simple pleasures are a worthwhile alternative to things like fastfood, porn and vdeoscreens. Probably every third or fourth kid we get on the farm cannot divorce themselves from their handheld devices and ennui long enough to get a toehold on what it takes to become a man, so we simply release them back to the world they prefer.

The best part is when you get a dozen or so of them all back together- our oldest son is still in his teens and has a wide range of these young men as friends- and they spend an evening camped out on one of the pastures, roasting a hog, laughing and talking into the night and you don't have to worry about what they're up to or what will become of them, you can see success written all over their future.
A few thoughts:

Whenever I'm with friends or family (or speaking with anyone), I make a point to turn my cell phone off beforehand or, increasingly, leave it at home. If I get in a wreck, get marooned in the middle of nowhere, I'll survive. Some of my best memories in life have been hunting with my dad and his friends. It's an all day event and at night, we hang our kills to let them drip out, and drink. Every day, regardless of whether I got something or not, I've been hunting I never care what is going on in the world. I enjoy watching and seeing things most people never will. What I can not understand about my generation, for the life of me, is how they prefer to stay sheltered and safe in cities, never getting out to hunt or do as hardscrabble farmer's sons do.

I watched Police Academy on Sunday and it's amazing as recently as the 1980's how un-pc movies were.

I would hazard a guess that ADHD in America is at least a little bit a part of American culture Like fibromyalgia?

Anonymous cheddarman, apostle of omega-3 fatty acids November 14, 2013 8:42 AM  

"Not in the slightest. A Loki pre-occupied with his trickster offspring is a Loki less likely to, well, be Loki in our world." - cheddarman

"Don't get too sure of that. You get cocky, you walk onto our lawn...he gets annoyed. And then heads on pikes. Very awkward." - sigyn

Sigyn, I see the sons of Loki being like the Katzenjammer Kids with supernatural powers... Just being themselves, and lighting flaming bags of dog poop on the door steps of Thor, Odin, and the Valkyries, is going to leave your lordship walking on eggshells in Asgard...not to mention all of the other mischief they will cause...so, by all means, take as much fish oil as you can

Sincerely

cheddarman, Apostle of omega-3 fatty acids

Anonymous Sigyn November 14, 2013 12:54 PM  

Sigyn, I see the sons of Loki being like the Katzenjammer Kids with supernatural powers... Just being themselves, and lighting flaming bags of dog poop on the door steps of Thor, Odin, and the Valkyries

I actually can't help but giggle at this.

And then I remember that I'm Mommy, and they'll probably prank me, too. And he'll probably help them, because Mommy is a fun target. *sigh*

Anonymous Anonymous November 15, 2013 12:20 AM  

A few years ago I did some rather useless internet research on ADD/ADHD. I specify the word 'useless', because not only did I not find an answer to my particular question, but apparently my question is so horribly politically incorrect, that nobody else has even asked it.

The question is this: If, in fact, ADD and ADHD are real diseases, and really require Ritalin as a treatment, then what percentage of the children of the political elites in this country are being given Ritalin. If ADD/ADHD are real diseases, then it would be expected that the children of political elites would suffer from that disease just like all other children, and since the political elites want to convince us mere peons how wonderful Ritalin is, surely they would trumpet the fact that many of their own children are on it. If any of them are, in fact, on it. Yet there seems to be no information at all on that subject, and nobody other than myself ever seems to have thought to even ask about it.

The silence is resounding and I hear crickets chirping.

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