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Tuesday, December 03, 2013

Sex differences are hard-wired

This research on brain connections won't come as any surprise to anyone who isn't ideologically bound to the idea that sex differences are cultural, but it should suffice to explode any last vestiges of biology-based sexual equalitarianism:
“What we've identified is that, when looked at in groups, there are connections in the brain that are hardwired differently in men and women. Functional tests have already shown than when they carry out certain tasks, men and women engage different parts of the brain,” Professor Verma said.

The research was carried out on 949 individuals - 521 females and 428 males - aged between 8 and 22. The brain differences between the sexes only became apparent after adolescence, the study found.

A special brain-scanning technique called diffusion tensor imaging, which can measure the flow of water along a nerve pathway, established the level of connectivity between nearly 100 regions of the brain, creating a neural map of the brain called the “connectome”, Professor Verma said.

“It tells you whether one region of the brain is physically connected to another part of the brain and you can get significant differences between two populations,” Professor Verma said. “In women most of the connections go between left and right across the two hemispheres while in men most of the connections go between the front and the back of the brain,” she said.

Because the female connections link the left hemisphere, which is associated with logical thinking, with the right, which is linked with intuition, this could help to explain why women tend to do better than men at intuitive tasks, she added.
It's amusing how they can't help but describe their findings in a futile attempt to appeal to women rather than to offend them. It's not the map-reading that is relevant; the real takeaway here is that women are less logical on average because their right hemisphere interferes with the ability of their left hemisphere to logically process information. It's never been any secret that women are less logical; among other things, that's why women weren't permitted to vote in the first place. But now, thanks to science, we are beginning to understand that limits such as these weren't set out of simple prejudice, but rather out of the straightforward desire for societal self-preservation.

And, as the consequences have demonstrated, the West violated those limits at its peril, a mistake for which we are all, men and women alike, paying the price.

It should be fascinating to see what happens when similar studies begin providing unavoidable scientific explanations for the differences between various human population groups that everyone observes, but affects to either deny or explain away.

Labels:

164 Comments:

Blogger IM2L844 December 03, 2013 8:31 AM  

What will happen when they use diffusion tensor imaging to show that the person claiming to have the mind of a woman trapped in a man's body, or visa versa, is really just a nutcase.

Blogger IM2L844 December 03, 2013 8:33 AM  

oops! vice versa

Blogger The Observer December 03, 2013 8:47 AM  

It should be fascinating to see what happens when similar studies begin providing unavoidable scientific explanations for the differences between various human population groups that everyone observes, but affects to either deny or explain away.

Simple. Studies that contradict the narrative will be forbidden from even being carried out, or conveniently disappeared, like what was mentioned just a few posts ago. The pretty lies must continue.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 8:51 AM  

Now, the next question is, do hormone levels affect the number of connections running one way versus the other? I'd be interested to know whether men encountering more estrogen/less testosterone exhibit more feminine pathway-building.

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 8:52 AM  

Feminists constantly claim that women are more balanced than men are.

From the scans, it sure doesn't look like it.

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 8:57 AM  

It looks like women's brains are more disjointed, and that significant parts of their brain are quite underdeveloped.

In contrast, men's seem to be well developed across both hemispheres. My theory is that the hemispheres interfering with each other hinders the development of each individual hemisphere.

Anonymous Will Best December 03, 2013 8:58 AM  

I suppose that is why the man elected president since at least the 1960s is the one women would rather sleep with.

Simple. Studies that contradict the narrative will be forbidden from even being carried out, or conveniently disappeared, like what was mentioned just a few posts ago

Like with the Church several hundred years ago, the people that need to know in order to do their work will still know, even if it is kept from the general public.

Blogger IM2L844 December 03, 2013 9:09 AM  

Apparently, in my household, when the left (logical) and the right (intuitive) brain present conflicting percepts, the solution is shoe shopping.

Anonymous Edjamacator December 03, 2013 9:16 AM  

Feh, diffusion tensor imaging is just sexist, obviously.

Anonymous Stickwick December 03, 2013 9:18 AM  

Will Best: I suppose that is why the man elected president since at least the 1960s is the one women would rather sleep with.

IIRC, the 1960 presidential debates were the first to be televised, which of course worked much more in favor of JFK than droopy old Nixon. Seems women's preference to be governed by Mr. Handsome and Charming overpowers whatever other preferences they might have.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 9:19 AM  

It looks like women's brains are more disjointed, and that significant parts of their brain are quite underdeveloped.

That's a bit much to derive from straight-up connectivity. It looks to me like we're less dependent on sensory inputs and motor functions.

Which now makes me wonder if perhaps this isn't why girls function better in the modern model of school and why boys have higher rates of ADHD. You guys need to move; we don't so much.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 9:21 AM  

Seems women's preference to be governed by Mr. Handsome and Charming overpowers whatever other preferences they might have.

Well, y'know, if you have to be ruled by someone, you may as well have something nice to look at.

Anonymous Randy M December 03, 2013 9:30 AM  

The trouble is, try convincing someone with emotional interference in their logic (moreso that typical, anyway) that they are so.

Blogger Harry T. Conan December 03, 2013 9:30 AM  

"It should be fascinating to see what happens when similar studies begin providing unavoidable scientific explanations for the differences between various human population groups that everyone observes, but affects to either deny or explain away."

The Observer above is quite correct. Such studies will be quietly but brutally discontinued once the science conflicts with the ideology. Studies of racial differences were commonplace until the civil rights movement put an end to scientific advancement of understanding in these areas. One of the Left's favourite boogeymen, David Duke, provides extensive documentation of both the existence of such studies and the actions taken by the Left to successfully purge them from the public eye, in his book, 'My Awakening'.

Anonymous Stg58/Animal Mother December 03, 2013 9:33 AM  

I read a while ago that in the womb, the rush of testosterone in the male severs the Corpus Callosum, the bridge between the hemispheres. Development proceeds from there in the male on a different track. The female brain in utero retains the bridge, and develops differently. I wonder if this is the same kind of effect.

Anonymous GG December 03, 2013 9:36 AM  

"The brain differences between the sexes only became apparent after adolescence, the study found."

I would suggest that brain differences are actually present at birth, even if this study did not find them "apparent" until adolescence.

There is no doubt that women are less logical, more intuitive. Still, there's an important complimentary factor at play between the sexes and both logic and intuition are needed in the world.

Also, I don't know how to explain it, but intuition and emotion sometimes cause women to make the correct decisions, even when male objectivity has made a quite logical argument for the opposite. Politics for example, some early female opposition to our current leadership could fairly be labeled emotional, intuitive, whereas it would have been much more logical to conform and adapt.

Anonymous RC December 03, 2013 9:38 AM  

Fascinating but obvious from a black box perspective since ancient times. As technology allows us to gain understanding of how the black box functions, the equalitarian caterwauling must increase to obscure plain facts. And it will: "That front-to-back connectivity caused increased rates of murder and rape. Side-to-side connectivity qualifies one to nurture, understand, empathize, and be president.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 9:41 AM  

Also, I don't know how to explain it, but intuition and emotion sometimes cause women to make the correct decisions, even when male objectivity has made a quite logical argument for the opposite.

Stopped clocks, in both cases. Neither intuition nor logic necessarily lead to righteousness.

Anonymous MrGreenMan December 03, 2013 9:45 AM  

You know, I saw some flatulent manginas and empty-headed feminists complaining about the lack of female entrepreneurs in Silicon Valley, and the consensus solution they got to was "raise our daughters differently". Now, this can either be an empty platitude or this can be a real hatred of the feminine; after all, they must have ben saying - force those girls to be boys; with feminists, I think it's the latter.

This science suggests that they're never going to turn women into men; they're just going to make everybody unhappy.

I must be just a lecherous old man because, liking the difference and all, I wanted everybody to be the best of whatever they happen to be, and not be a mediocre version of something they aren't.

Anonymous Stickwick December 03, 2013 9:49 AM  

Sigyn: Well, y'know, if you have to be ruled by someone, you may as well have something nice to look at.

In a different world than this one, the Republicans would find a Mr. Handsome and Charming to put up against Hillary in 2016, and we could discern the hierarchy of female preference. In the absence of logic, does the Grrrl Power! / leftist thing overcome the Handsome and Charming thing or vice versa?

Harry T. Conan: The Observer above is quite correct. Such studies will be quietly but brutally discontinued once the science conflicts with the ideology.

The truth can't stay hidden forever. The problem with spinning a narrative for this subject is that, as with global warming, people can see for themselves what's going on. You can only push an alternate narrative so far. Most people, on some level, discern that there are significant differences and act on them, even if they feel guilty about it. The coming economic and societal collapse will only turn up the contrast on those differences. As soon as the illusion of safety and security is ripped away, women will stampede in the direction of whatever will give them any sense of a return to safety and security. At that point, people will be open to frank discussions about those differences.

Blogger buzzardist December 03, 2013 9:52 AM  

Which now makes me wonder if perhaps this isn't why girls function better in the modern model of school and why boys have higher rates of ADHD. You guys need to move; we don't so much.

This is a big part of it. The food that we eat also does a lot to contribute to behavioral disorders, but forcing kids, especially boys, into seats for hours a day is probably the single largest cause of ADHD diagnoses.

I see this in my own son--he performs well in school and stays focused there, but by the time he gets home, he's unable to contain himself any longer. For several hours, he is just moving, moving, moving, and can't stay still or focus for anything. Then, after that's out of his system, he reverts to his normal self and can start to focus again. And we don't own a TV, so I can imagine a boy who spends several hours watching TV at home each day going through most of that fidgeting at school and getting labeled defective because of it.

Anonymous Will Best December 03, 2013 9:53 AM  

I think this is the thread winner in the comments

The differences between men are more significant than the differences between men and women, as indeed are the differences between women. This article is racist, and shows how far the Independent has fallen.

runner up being

But even if we assume it is indeed reflecting something real and substantial – that men and women are using different parts of the brain to respond to some stimulus or other – it does not imply a different conceptual or emotional result. Men and women can reach the same results in terms of thought and behaviour using different neural pathways, and this may relate, in part, to the size of our brains.

When this is your core constituency you don't even have to worry what the science says

Anonymous Stingray December 03, 2013 9:53 AM  

I saw this on Drudge this morning and got a very good laugh at the map reading comment and the writers apparent fear of going much further in the differences of men and women.

I was surprised that they only noticed this after adolescence as it is very apparent the young boys and girls are very different as well. I have to think this has more to do with just hormones and wonder if they left anything intentionally out.

Blogger Doom December 03, 2013 9:58 AM  

I feel like Merlin, living backwards in time, remember the future if foggily, while only being able to sort of figure what happened in the past. Why?

Because I thought the different brain wiring was already settled by (real) neuro-science. Gah! I suppose next you will tell me that the different species of men isn't yet defined and the troglodytes of academia are still insisting on "races of men" and no differences? Damned kids anyway.

Anonymous Stephen J. December 03, 2013 10:02 AM  

Eh, most neuroscience is usually to be taken with more than a few grains of salt. It's also worth noting that if this study was blind, as most statistical compilations are, they probably haven't accounted for individual neuroplasticity over time -- what you get a lot of training and practice in at various times in your life makes a significant difference to how the brain works. And given the poor record of replicability in scientific papers these days, that's only further reason to wait and see.

The trouble with logic is that if you start with bad premises you get bad conclusions. The trouble with intuition is that if you get good conclusions despite bad premises, somebody else may think the premises are good.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 10:06 AM  

It's also worth noting that if this study was blind, as most statistical compilations are, they probably haven't accounted for individual neuroplasticity over time -- what you get a lot of training and practice in at various times in your life makes a significant difference to how the brain works.

This is something I was wondering about--how much and how far those effects reach--especially in light of that business with habitual dishonesty altering one's brain.

Anonymous Dice Clay December 03, 2013 10:11 AM  

I got yer hemisphere right here, baby.

Anonymous dh December 03, 2013 10:12 AM  

Stephen--

I had heard some public media reports that neuroplasticity is turning out to be not reproducible. Is the science behind it still considered sound?

Blogger buzzardist December 03, 2013 10:16 AM  

Also, I don't know how to explain it, but intuition and emotion sometimes cause women to make the correct decisions, even when male objectivity has made a quite logical argument for the opposite. Politics for example, some early female opposition to our current leadership could fairly be labeled emotional, intuitive, whereas it would have been much more logical to conform and adapt.

I object that it would have been logical to conform or adapt to the current leadership. What the current leadership wants was plain from the start, and it was plainly destructive. I can find no logic behind accommodating this, except that one engages in willful ignorance before applying that logic.

This said, there is no rule that intuition and logic cannot arrive at the same conclusion. Often, they do. It's wrong to think that logic and intuition are always opposed. Women, too, are capable of logical arguments and decisions. But women generally only follow their logic when it doesn't conflict with intuition. In the absence of strong intuition, women may resort to logic, but if their intuition is strong, logic becomes irrelevant. Men tend to work the other way. But most of the time for both men and women, logic and intuition probably coincide. The sexes simply process and react to those impulses and thought processes differently in how we form decisions and behave.

It's also true that intuition sometimes gets decisions right where logic does not. We're imperfect creatures. Logic fails us. Intuition fails us, too. We make mistakes. In some contexts, intuition may well be the better guide. But where intuition may serve well for relationships and for here-and-now material concerns, it can be alarmingly bad at dealing with matters of wealth, long-term planning, liberty, and government.

Anonymous ZeeTee December 03, 2013 10:16 AM  

This would also help explain why women are slow. Their actions are slowed by jumping hemispheres. Where as male brain stays within one thus alowing them to go through the OODA loop faster. However this also explains why men have problems, once motivated to action, to stop from causing themselves emotional harm. PTSD is often a case of emotions having to be justified after the fact. Men can switch off the emotional side and do dang near anything and deal with the emotional fall out later.

Women on the other had deal with it at that moment. This would also raise some interesting questions about the fitness of women who harm children. At some point in the decisions process they choose to over ride their emotions (or their emotions were geared to inflicting harm) and commit harm on a child. The male could just be in "go mode" and not be thinking of the emotions at all.

Anonymous The other skeptic December 03, 2013 10:21 AM  

Now they are whining about computer games

Anonymous The other skeptic December 03, 2013 10:26 AM  

Don't forget racial differences

Anonymous The other skeptic December 03, 2013 10:30 AM  

what you get a lot of training and practice in at various times in your life makes a significant difference to how the brain works.

That's a load of crap.

For example, consider the visual word form area that some researchers claim to exist. If you have it, reading is easier. If you don't, reading is harder. No amount of training will rewire your brain to make reading easier.

Your argument is akin to that stupid argument about requiring 10,000 hours of training to become proficient at something.

No amount of training will allow you to run the 100m as fast as those juiced up guys if you do not have those West-African genes in the first place.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 10:39 AM  

The differences between men are more significant than the differences between men and women, as indeed are the differences between women. This article is racist, and shows how far the Independent has fallen.

Racist against the race of women.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 10:41 AM  

For example, consider the visual word form area that some researchers claim to exist. If you have it, reading is easier. If you don't, reading is harder. No amount of training will rewire your brain to make reading easier.

Or spacial reasoning. I'm assuming that's not something that can just be fixed by training your brain.

Anonymous Moar Bad December 03, 2013 10:48 AM  

Leftist Lies Destroyed as Scientists Discover the Gene Which Causes Brain Size and Intelligence

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 10:48 AM  

Skeptic, he has a point. There's a range of potential within which a person can train himself to function, and the things you take in, physically or via the senses, affect the way your brain responds and even runs.

Also, there is that study that reflects that born-again Christians' brains will literally rewire themselves. That may be miraculous, or it could be normal, since the brain clears pathways it no longer uses to make room for new ones.

It's not all one or the other; there's ground between absolute malleability and absolute determinism.

Anonymous Stephen J. December 03, 2013 10:54 AM  

"I had heard some public media reports that neuroplasticity is turning out to be not reproducible. Is the science behind it still considered sound?"

Good question; I don't know. It's as likely to be sound as anything else coming out of neuroscience and the scientific establishment these days. (And yes, that's an ironic remark.)

More seriously, the problem is that the standard of reproducibility required for valid empirical verification may simply not be possible between individual human beings; there are simply too many unique and unknown factors. Which is another reason to be skeptical of studies such as these, whatever intuitive impressions they seem to be confirming or disproving.

Anonymous GG December 03, 2013 10:54 AM  

"But where intuition may serve well for relationships and for here-and-now material concerns, it can be alarmingly bad at dealing with matters of wealth, long-term planning, liberty, and government."

Buzzardist, perhaps we're confusing objectivity with logic? Women are quite capable of using logic, reason, and intuition all at the same time. What often seems lacking is any objectivity. It's not that our brains are stunted, it's that they're hyper wired. Attempting to be simple and objective for long periods of time is actually quite difficult for most women. Everything becomes personal, emotional, related to something else.

Anonymous Anonymous December 03, 2013 11:02 AM  

The pretty lies must continue.

They must continue, because if there is one unifying doctrine of leftist utopian society - it is the undeniable maxim of fairness. This doctrine is applied to every field of study - philosophy, science, theology, economics. The only acceptable philosophical position is where all people are situated impartially as equals, because fairness. Brain studies highlighting gender differences are inherently bad, because fairness. All churches should ordain women, because fairness. Taxes should be raised for school funding, because fairness. As the superfreak sayeth, "Fairness is a hell of a drug."

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 11:02 AM  

Women are quite capable of using logic, reason, and intuition all at the same time. What often seems lacking is any objectivity.

Feel free to redefine terms all you want, but you're wrong.

"using logic, reason, and intuition all at the same time" = rationalization hamster, not logic or reason.

"objectivity" = logic and reason.

Saying girls can do logic too, just subjective logic, doesn't make subjective logic logic anymore than calling gay marriage marriage makes it marriage.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 11:08 AM  

Josh, your definitions are both self-serving and ridiculous.

Rationalization hamster = what I already want to believe + reason ex post facto to justify it - logic

Objectivity = an assessment of something without color of individual perspective or opinion

Anonymous willneverpostagain December 03, 2013 11:13 AM  

When I was reading about women's development of both hemispheres......wait, are we talking about brains here?

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 11:14 AM  

Rationalization hamster = what I already want to believe

Wait...could that be...intuition?

Objectivity = an assessment of something without color of individual perspective or opinion

Can you have logic that is not objective?

Anonymous GG December 03, 2013 11:14 AM  

"objectivity" = logic and reason."

I disagree, Josh. I think there's a huge difference between "objectivity" and "logic." Objectivity is that part of the male brain that many women really appreciate, it's detached, unemotional, it offers clarity. Logic on the other hand, is more reasoned, elaborate, and often debatable. One man's definition of logic is not always another's. Objectivity however, is pretty cut and dry, based on not much more then unbiased observable reality with a quick fix. For the most part, men will all agree on what they perceive as objective reality.

Anonymous Curlytop December 03, 2013 11:19 AM  

@GG
Just curious: have you studied both Formal and Informal Logic?

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 11:19 AM  

GG, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 11:21 AM  

Wait...could that be...intuition?

No. The dictionary indicates that intuition is "direct perception of truth, fact, etc., independent of any reasoning process; immediate apprehension". Other definitions follow suit.

Intuition observes a proposition and draws a conclusion. A hamster assumes a conclusion and seeks confirmation. The ironic bit is that the hamster applies reasoning--poorly, but applies it--while intuition makes no such pretenses.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 11:24 AM  

GG, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Well, so much for intelligent discussion. We're now down to quoting movies in an effort to shut down the opposition.

Anonymous Millard Philmore December 03, 2013 11:25 AM  

Sigyn - there is that study that reflects that born-again Christians' brains will literally rewire themselves

Interesting. Do you have a link handy?

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 11:26 AM  

Interesting. Do you have a link handy?

Unfortunately, no. I can try to track it down, but it may take me a while. I lost all my bookmarks in the Great Laptop Crash of '13.

Blogger Harry T. Conan December 03, 2013 11:28 AM  

"The truth can't stay hidden forever. The problem with spinning a narrative for this subject is that, as with global warming, people can see for themselves what's going on. You can only push an alternate narrative so far."

Point taken...it may well be that in the Internet age it will not be possible to suppress information as easily as it was in the 60s. However, it remains possible for universities/scientific institutions to refuse funding and expel unpopular ideas from the Academy - see Intelligent Design and teleology in general. Certainly the criticisms of Darwinism are out in the popular domain for all to see, but at a policy and culture -making level, the voice of atheistic scientism remains barely contested and I don't see it getting any better for complementarians/teleologists/racialists any time soon. In fact, I see it getting only worse as the ideologues drop all pretence of scientific objectivity and begin herding us into euthanasia centres.

Anonymous GG December 03, 2013 11:29 AM  

"GG, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard."

Thank you, Josh. I'm sorry, but you're incorrect. Intuition does not belong only to the realm of women, men often make good use of it, too. You can use whatever definition you prefer, but basically it is simply, "immediate apprehension or cognition without reasoning or inferring." Intuition sometimes happens so quickly, there simply isn't time to reason or apply logic. It's not to be confused with a knee jerk emotional reaction, which is something else entirely.

Anonymous Alexander December 03, 2013 11:30 AM  

Well really, what was Josh supposed to say?

"That is a lucid, intelligent, well thought-out objection. Overruled."?

I think not.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 11:31 AM  

We're now down to quoting movies in an effort to shut down the opposition.

I certainly don't desire to watch GG take over the thread with insane ramblings about how objectivity and logic are totally different. Because hamster.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 11:34 AM  

And...found it.

That wasn't so hard after all.

Anonymous Alex December 03, 2013 11:36 AM  

Thinking is for the gloopy ones.

The oomny ones use, like, inspiration and what Bog sends

Anonymous allyn71 December 03, 2013 11:36 AM  

"In a different world than this one, the Republicans would find a Mr. Handsome and Charming to put up against Hillary in 2016, and we could discern the hierarchy of female preference. In the absence of logic, does the Grrrl Power! / leftist thing overcome the Handsome and Charming thing or vice versa? " - Sigyn December 03, 2013 10:06 AM

The Democrats already pretty much did that for us in 2008. Their wasn't any ideology differences to compare, it was Grrrl Power vs. Handsome and Charming.

The democrat women split their vote in support of Obama (Young reproductive age women for Obama, Older women Hillary) and that doomed Hillary as she lost to much of what she thought was her base.

Enough women preferred an effeminate pickle puffer with a smile to a member of the sistherhood that it doomed Hillary's chances. See Obama girl as an example.

If anything, this is a better example than Rep. vs. Dem, there was no ideology differences to cloud things.

Anonymous Joshua December 03, 2013 11:39 AM  

I encountered this story (and another about biological differences) on the HadEnoughTherapy blog. Good stuff. I'm growing tired of the "egalitarianism-at-all-costs" that many Christians preach, while trying to find exotic work-arounds for Paul's admonitions to men and women that line up precisely with the biological differences men and women have.

This is ideology before biology -and- religion, and it is a form of idolatry. I'm glad that this stuff is being reported, so people have no excuse for their idolatry.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 11:43 AM  

I certainly don't desire to watch GG take over the thread with insane ramblings about how objectivity and logic are totally different.

And, of course, your personal preferences are relevant to the rest of us.

By the way, I can objectively demonstrate that logic and objectivity are not identical.

To be logical may require objectivity, but to be objective does not always require logic. I may objectively say "The sky is blue" without recourse to logic at all.

If you're going to split hairs over definitions, it would behoove you to know what those definitions are first.

Anonymous Noah B. December 03, 2013 11:44 AM  

"I read a while ago that in the womb, the rush of testosterone in the male severs the Corpus Callosum, the bridge between the hemispheres. Development proceeds from there in the male on a different track. The female brain in utero retains the bridge, and develops differently. I wonder if this is the same kind of effect."

It certainly sounds like this must be related to the recent finding. Of course, it's a recurring problem with science reporting that old knowledge is claimed to be something new, and journalists are particularly susceptible to making this mistake because their scientific knowledge tends to be quite shallow. So I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that most of what's been reported here is already well known by serious neuroscientists.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 11:47 AM  

To be logical may require objectivity, but to be objective does not always require logic.

Can you have subjective logic?

Anonymous civilServant December 03, 2013 11:48 AM  

It's never been any secret that women are less logical; among other things, that's why women weren't permitted to vote in the first place.

Not to mention the lower classes.

I have asked many times but to my knowledge have never yet been answered. When all of the disqualifications for self-governance that are dreamed about here are implemented then tell me - who will be left? Who will be permitted self-governance? Who will be the citizens and who will be the serfs/proles/helots/sex-slaves?

Anonymous MendoScot December 03, 2013 11:49 AM  

Simple. Studies that contradict the narrative will be forbidden from even being carried out, or conveniently disappeared, like what was mentioned just a few posts ago. The pretty lies must continue.

I was thinking about a 20 year old case of this in the shower, this morning. Back then, the NIH (maybe NSF, memory and such) funded a study to look at the genetic contribution to violence in the USA. Of course, the progs got wind of it eventually and had it shut down - a special panel was convened to investigate and they pulled the grant (oddly enough, no one mentioned the Spanish Inquisition).

Anyway, my boss at the time had access to the deliberations of the panel and the preliminary data the study had produced. Turns out there was only one racial group that showed a genetic propensity to violence, and it wasn't the vibrants...

...it was the Scots/Irish.


That's a bit much to derive from straight-up connectivity.

dTI measures functional connectivity. The signal is generated by the electrical activity of axons producing anistropy in the perimembrane water, thus the more active the pathway, the stronger the dTI signal. In a sense, they are indirectly measuring the flow of information along long white matter tracts.

The only part of the brain where right-left connectivity was greater in men than in women was in the cerebellum, an evolutionary ancient part of the brain that is linked with motor control.

Bwahaha! This is so wrong. The cerebellum has extensive cognitive funcions, not just in learning and memory, but in executive control as well. And it has both ancient (archeocerebellum), old (paleocerebellum) and new (neocerebellum) sections. Funnily, the newest is also the largest in humans.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 11:50 AM  

Can you have subjective logic?

Irrelevant. If I can be objective without using logic--and I can--then logic and objectivity are not identical.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 11:54 AM  

It's quite relevant, actually, given GG's claim that women can use logic, but not objectively. I'm not arguing that logic and objectivity are the same, but that logic has to be objective. If it's not objective, it's not logic. Logic free from objectivity is not logic, but the rationalization hamster.

Anonymous realmatt December 03, 2013 11:56 AM  

Its not that blacks aren't good at reading writing and mathing its that they're really good at jumping and running

Blogger swiftfoxmark2 December 03, 2013 12:03 PM  

I just love how they take about multitasking as if it is a good thing. I've seen women multitask. They get overwhelmed and freak out because they have too many things going on.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 12:03 PM  

In relevant part, GG's comment:

Women are quite capable of using logic, reason, and intuition all at the same time. What often seems lacking is any objectivity. It's not that our brains are stunted, it's that they're hyper wired. Attempting to be simple and objective for long periods of time is actually quite difficult for most women.

Her statement appears to be that we are capable of using logic and objectivity, but it goes against our nature to do it beyond short bursts. Granted, this is subjective, but then again, I'm not the one getting emotional about this.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 12:05 PM  

They get overwhelmed and freak out because they have too many things going on.

That's a failure of organization, not a failure of brain. Not many people have decent organizational skills anymore, and those are crucial for effective multitasking.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 12:08 PM  

I just love how they take about multitasking as if it is a good thing. I've seen women multitask. They get overwhelmed and freak out because they have too many things going on.

Fighter pilots have to multitask all the time. And they tend to be men. Hmm...

Blogger Retrenched December 03, 2013 12:10 PM  

"It's amusing how they can't help but describe their findings in a futile attempt to appeal to women rather than to offend them."

The Althouse Rule strikes again...

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 12:11 PM  

Fighter pilots have to multitask all the time. And they tend to be men. Hmm...

Describe the multiple tasks, please. I am unfamiliar with fighter piloting, and before I start hypothesizing, I would like a clearer picture.

Anonymous Stg58/Animal Mother December 03, 2013 12:11 PM  

Noah B.

I think you are correct. We do forget this knowledge has already been learned. These new tactical ways of fighting are so new! Holding rifles in certain ways to promote the stability of the firing platform is "new" information, but I saw a picture of an allied soldier in WWII holding his rifle with the forward hand extended almost straight out, with his hand cupping the stock just like the three gun shooters do with vertical and AFG grips do nowadays.

Nothing new under the sun.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 12:14 PM  

Describe the multiple tasks, please. I am unfamiliar with fighter piloting, and before I start hypothesizing, I would like a clearer picture.

Maneuvering the plane, talking to ground control/awacs, monitoring instruments, visually identifying the bogey, etc. All at mach 1+ with significant g forces. And maybe getting shot at.

Anonymous Jack Amok December 03, 2013 12:17 PM  

I'd be interested to know whether men encountering more estrogen/less testosterone exhibit more feminine pathway-building.

Yo Gamma gamma. I suspect childhood (and wombhood) exposure to soy and BPA may be the reason for so many gammas. Hope you're not drinking anything out of plastic bottles, oh soon-to-be large-as-a-house.


Such studies will be quietly but brutally discontinued once the science conflicts with the ideology

Or else used by the coming American Sulla as justification for deportations and disenfranchisement.


When all of the disqualifications for self-governance that are dreamed about here are implemented then tell me - who will be left? Who will be permitted self-governance?

Am I the one making the call? Excellent. Government employees, for one category, won't be allowed to vote. If the net cash flow is from the Government to you, no vote for you.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 12:20 PM  

Am I the one making the call? Excellent. Government employees, for one category, won't be allowed to vote. If the net cash flow is from the Government to you, no vote for you.

I agree with this, even if people complain that it disenfranchises the troops.

Blogger RobertT December 03, 2013 12:22 PM  

For some reason, I got the impressions somewhere along the line that all of this stuff was already understood. The brain is a fascinating subject. Very curious how such a complex contraption could arise from pure chance.

I've just finished reading Grain Brain by David Perlmutter, a physician who has written several books about the brain. He was involved in the initial discoveries along these lines and now operates an Alzheimer's practice. Great book that takes several steps beyond Gary Taubes' Good Calories; Bad Calories. Fascinating book that ties most degenerative issues to diet. If you're getting older and are worried about deteriorating intelligence, forget about it. It's an old wive's tale ... if you eat right. This book even recommends brain friendly supplements and explains what they do for you. According to Perlmutter, if you are already noticing deficiencies, reversing them may be possible through exercise, a calorie deficient diet and [diet + supplements].

Anonymous Noah B. December 03, 2013 12:25 PM  

"Maneuvering the plane, talking to ground control/awacs, monitoring instruments, visually identifying the bogey, etc."

In this kind of setting, feelings are a needless and deadly distraction. The ability to suppress emotion, at least for brief periods of time, is key.

Anonymous Bah December 03, 2013 12:26 PM  

If you need to "multitask" then you have failed at logic.

Prioritize the tasks and do them one at a time in order of priority.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 12:30 PM  

If you need to "multitask" then you have failed at logic.

Prioritize the tasks and do them one at a time in order of priority.


Do you cook much?

Anonymous Bah December 03, 2013 12:42 PM  

Yeah, and it doesn't require multitasking -- or if it does, you're doing it wrong. The whole point of a "recipe" is that it is a set of instructions that you step through one instruction at a time.

Anonymous stilicho December 03, 2013 12:43 PM  

Logical women are akin to dancing bears

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 12:48 PM  

Maneuvering the plane, talking to ground control/awacs, monitoring instruments, visually identifying the bogey, etc. All at mach 1+ with significant g forces. And maybe getting shot at.

Thank you. My impressions:

1. Not to diss fighter pilots, but most of these tasks sound like driving a car, but faster and in three dimensions. This includes carrying on a conversation with someone, either via cell phone or right there in the cab with you. Granted, magnitude increases, but on the whole, this is just multitasking plus stress--though we can agree that women's particular emotional make-up does not lend itself to handling stress effectively.

2. Are fighter pilots ordinary men, or exceptional men? IOW, could most men become fighter pilots?

3. Women do not typically aspire to be fighter pilots; men are more likely to want that job.

4. Are women typically as capable of handling the physical strains involved in piloting a fighter jet?

I say this so you can see why I resist "but fighter pilots!" as an argument against women's greater potential (not necessarily raw performance) for efficient multitasking.

Anonymous Jack Amok December 03, 2013 12:50 PM  

Yeah, and it doesn't require multitasking -- or if it does, you're doing it wrong. The whole point of a "recipe" is that it is a set of instructions that you step through one instruction at a time.

So do you eat your green beans first, then the roast beef, then the scalloped potatoes, or do you prefer a different order? And is the kitchen one giant heap of dirty pots, pans and measuring cups when the food is ready?

And clearly we're not talking about a commercial kitchen, are we.

Blogger Doorstop December 03, 2013 12:51 PM  

"Yeah, and it doesn't require multitasking -- or if it does, you're doing it wrong. The whole point of a "recipe" is that it is a set of instructions that you step through one instruction at a time."

Hahahah....there's cooking, and then there's making a dish to pass for the company picnic. Sounds like you're describing the latter, Bah.

Anonymous Stickwick December 03, 2013 12:53 PM  

Harry T. Conan: However, it remains possible for universities/scientific institutions to refuse funding and expel unpopular ideas from the Academy - see Intelligent Design and teleology in general.

Oh, yes, the academic world will likely continue to do that. (Although, see the case of sociologist Mark Regnerus for an interesting fight over academic freedom. IIRC, the university ended up supporting him against charges of badthink in his controversial study on homosexual parents.) In any case, it won't matter much, since formal academia will become less and less relevant in the future.

allyn71: The Democrats already pretty much did that for us in 2008. Their wasn't any ideology differences to compare, it was Grrrl Power vs. Handsome and Charming.

Yeah, I guess, sorta. Romney had the executive good looks, but I never thought of him as charming. He certainly didn't have the bad-boy charm of either JFK or Clinton. Rather, he seemed kind of bland and plastic, like a Presidential Candidate Ken doll with the Bonus Religious Virtues accessory kit. Not exactly catnip for women.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 12:53 PM  

Yeah, and it doesn't require multitasking -- or if it does, you're doing it wrong. The whole point of a "recipe" is that it is a set of instructions that you step through one instruction at a time.

Cooking more than one dish, however, is not such a linear process. You will have multiple processes ongoing at once. You have meat, you have potatoes or whatever, you have vegetables, you're prepping a salad, and you are probably also washing some dishes unless you have the world's biggest surface area of counter space. Oh, and you're probably setting the table, too, if you want to eat like civilized people.

No, it's not STRESSFUL if you're organized and time everything right, but it's still multiple tasks that must be managed at once.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 12:56 PM  

Not to diss fighter pilots, but most of these tasks sound like driving a car, but faster and in three dimensions.

There's a reason why the "women driving fails" category exists on YouTube...

Anonymous TWS December 03, 2013 1:02 PM  

Sigyn

The wife and I were just discussing the problems women have doing carrier landings. But of course the risks are worth it because Diversity. If diversity doesn't win thats the real tragedy when a woman has to ditch or get waved off.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:05 PM  

There's a reason why the "women driving fails" category exists on YouTube...

And if you type in "men are stupid" in the search window, it returns over 1.7 million results.

It's a good thing I don't regard YouTube users as authorities on life, isn't it?

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:07 PM  

The wife and I were just discussing the problems women have doing carrier landings. But of course the risks are worth it because Diversity. If diversity doesn't win thats the real tragedy when a woman has to ditch or get waved off.

Yes, I'm aware of this, but we're talking about multitasking, not spatial or motor skills. "But fighter pilots!" does not disprove the proposition that women are more potentially capable of multitasking than men are.

Blogger Bernard Brandt December 03, 2013 1:10 PM  

Part of the problem here is that too many of the science media, and too many people commenting here, are assuming that the initial findings of Roger Sperry remain correct: that the left cerebral hemisphere deals with verbal phenomena, while the right deals with non-verbal phenomena. A good layman's presentation of this material can be found in Iain McGilchrist's The Master and His Emissary

A more accurate view, or at least one which is closer to current findings, is that the left hemisphere addresses close-focus processes (e.g., attention to detail, semantics, melody, etc.), while the right hemisphere deals with broad-attention processes (e.g. observation of background, syntactics, background sounds, etc.). As verbal behavior is a complex of integrated right and left brained functions, it should not be surprising from the recent study now cited that women would be better at verbalizing than men.

On the other hand, I think that several conclusions can be drawn from the recent study:

1. It would appear that men tend to work with two parallel tracks: close attention and far attention, simultaneously. This would make them better hunters and warriors.

2. This dual processing system in men would appear to integrate more in the way of executive, motor, and pan-sensory functions. This, by the bye, would explain why men are more quickly able to exercise their common sense or sensus communis than women. (I suggest that argumentative readers go through the wikipedia article on 'common sense' before beginning their disputations on this point).

3. This dual process involving a deeper integration of pan-cerebral functions could explain the reason why the creative process in men (as related by Koestler) involves intense study of a problem, prolonged contemplation, and then sudden insight: that process of cogitation has gone from the left to the right hemisphere, and then back again. It would also explain why the overwhelming majority of scientific, artistic, and literary creative breakthroughs have been (and will continue to be) accomplished by men.

4. The study would also explain why verbal instruction in childhood education works better with girls than with boys. Further, if McGilchrist is correct, a sole focus on semantic and close attention processes would tend to make worse the tendency for left brain activity to suppress right brain activity in males. A more pan-sensory and pan-motor activity approach (i.e. games and sports) would therefore be needed for boys, if people were actually interested in educating them.

I can think of more consequences from the underlying study, but this would appear to be enough to start with.

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 1:14 PM  

Sigyn, go check out the online combat flight simulator community.

Let's just say that nobody here would be surprised by the gender breakdown there.

Flying requires good spatial skills, something men are naturally better at.

Anonymous civilServant December 03, 2013 1:14 PM  

1. Not to diss fighter pilots, but most of these tasks sound like driving a car, but faster and in three dimensions.

While tracking targets and friendly aircraft and aircraft state and fuel state and missile lock and enemy lock. While evaluating your maneuverability in contrast to target maneuverability. While someone is trying to kill you and can kill you if you make a mistake.

Someone described it as physical combat while playing a piano.

2. Are fighter pilots ordinary men, or exceptional men? IOW, could most men become fighter pilots?

Almost anyone can fly an aircraft. Some can fly it well. A few can fly it well and fight. A handful can fly it well and fight and win. A tiny handful can fly it well and fight and win and are willing to take the risk. For the United States the pilot is worth far more than the aircraft he flies.

3. Women do not typically aspire to be fighter pilots; men are more likely to want that job.

It requires a certain highly-disciplined highly-competent arrogance. Few women are arrogant and those that are tend to be undisciplined.

4. Are women typically as capable of handling the physical strains involved in piloting a fighter jet?

Few men are. Aircraft capabilities now far exceed human. For decades the dream has been for unmanned aircraft to take advantage of the higher maneuverability then possible. Soon this will be implemented.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:19 PM  

That's what I thought, that fighter pilots are already highly-selected, extraordinary men with specific skill sets. In other words, they're like a genius woman or one who's faster/stronger than the average man: not even close to representative.

So, while they're awesome, they're not a good counterpoint to "women have greater potential performance at MULTITASKING than men have." Which was what I was saying.

Anonymous SirHamster December 03, 2013 1:20 PM  

Describe the multiple tasks, please. I am unfamiliar with fighter piloting, and before I start hypothesizing, I would like a clearer picture.

-------------------------------------

Maneuvering the plane, talking to ground control/awacs, monitoring instruments, visually identifying the bogey, etc. All at mach 1+ with significant g forces. And maybe getting shot at.


From what I've read, another factor to consider is that men/women may have different multi-tasking failure modes. It was claimed that men tend to tunnel vision on one task (which may be the wrong one in terms of priorities), while women get paralyzed with indecision. When flying a plane in combat, the former failure mode is preferable. (still looking for my source)

Interestingly, wiki's article says that the gender superiority in multitasking is a myth; points out contradicting studies - one finds women better, another finds men were better. Basically, "Science! We Don't Know Yet"

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 1:23 PM  

No, Sigyn. Plenty of men fly simulators for fun. They aren't "highly selected". They are self selected. Men.

Overwhelmingly men.

Also, if women were just as naturally capable of driving, they would make it into NASCAR at the rate of more than one per century or so. The corporate suits would LOVE a successful woman driver. It's not for lack of trying.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 1:28 PM  

A University of Michigan study of 6.5 million two-car collisions found that crashes in which both drivers were women are more common than those in which both drivers were men.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:37 PM  

They are self selected. Men.

Right, and most women aren't interested, therefore fighter pilots will just based on that be overwhelmingly male. I'm glad you agree. It's just one reason of many that "but fighter pilots!" is not useful for the topic at hand.

Anyway, Catan, playing a simulator is not formally piloting a fighter under life-or-death circumstances, with the attendant physical and psychological strains. You unfortunately remind me of this one kid who claimed to be a crack shot because he could get high scores in Dog Hunt or whatever. Most men cannot be real fighter pilots.

Furthermore, again, you miss the point. This is not about reflexes, motor skills, or physical strength; this is about straight up multitasking. Josh brought up "but fighter pilots!" as an alleged proof that the average man is as good at or better than women at straight up multitasking.

My response was and is that there are other factors involved in being a fighter pilot that go well beyond multitasking--that, in fact, fighter pilots are EXCEPTIONAL in many ways--and so this is no more a useful example than Stickwick is of the average woman's ability to handle physics.

Stay on target.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:39 PM  

A University of Michigan study of 6.5 million two-car collisions found that crashes in which both drivers were women are more common than those in which both drivers were men.

Spatial, motor, and reflex. I don't dispute that men are better with those, never have. But what does this have to do with multitasking, exactly?

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:42 PM  

Boys, remember: You don't have to be better at everything to have value. As long as there are spiders in the bathroom, we will always need you.

Anonymous Giraffe December 03, 2013 1:44 PM  

Spatial, motor, and reflex. I don't dispute that men are better with those, never have. But what does this have to do with multitasking, exactly?

Just because women are better at multi-tasking doesn't mean it is a good idea when a task is unsafe if not given your full attention. Some of the accidents might be related to spatial, motor, and reflex, and some may be due to multi-tasking. Like the young lady that drove her car into a bridge rail while texting.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:46 PM  

Just because women are better at multi-tasking doesn't mean it is a good idea when a task is unsafe if not given your full attention.

Okay.

Anonymous Lysander Spooner December 03, 2013 1:52 PM  

The 'Line" in Team America may be apropos;

Guy in Bar: See, there's three kinds of people: dicks, pussies, and assholes. Pussies think everyone can get along, and dicks just want to fuck all the time without thinking it through. But then you got your assholes, Chuck. And all the assholes want us to shit all over everything! So, pussies may get mad at dicks once in a while, because pussies get fucked by dicks. But dicks also fuck assholes, Chuck. And if they didn't fuck the assholes, you know what you'd get? You'd get your dick and your pussy all covered in shit!

Anonymous farmer Tom December 03, 2013 1:54 PM  

I haven't had time to read all the comments, so if someone else already said this, I apologize in advance.

Ladies, how do you feel about this article?

Anonymous civilServant December 03, 2013 1:54 PM  

From what I've read, another factor to consider is that men/women may have different multi-tasking failure modes.

They have different failure modes period.

In basic training on the grenade range when males drop the grenade they hurl it to the ground in front of themselves. When females drop the grenade they drop it behind themselves while pulling back to throw it.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:57 PM  

Ladies, how do you feel about this article?

Nauseous and light-headed.

No, wait, that was my morning sickness.

I didn't feel anything, really. Was I supposed to?

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 1:59 PM  

This is not about reflexes, motor skills, or physical strength; this is about straight up multitasking.

Video games.

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 1:59 PM  

Sigyn admits she doesn't know the first thing about flying, but yet she has enough knowledge to dirisively label realistic flight simulators "Duck Hunt".

Simulators that World War II flight commanders would have killed to get their hands on, because it would have saved many, many men and planes.

I've had about enough of this "female intuition" that I can stand for one day.

Just because flying requires motor and other skills, doesn't mean that it doesn't require multitasking as well. Lots of it.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 2:00 PM  

I do enjoy this "no true multitasking" Scotsman goal post moving.

Anonymous Stickwick December 03, 2013 2:10 PM  

farmer Tom: Ladies, how do you feel about this article?

Pretty upset, actually. All this "brain" stuff is just a distraction from the real point of the article, which is to make us all feel fat and inadequate.

Anonymous Lysander Spooner December 03, 2013 2:14 PM  

Ladies, how do you feel about this article?

Makes Gigi go all tingly, at least that's what the wife tells me.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 2:23 PM  

I've had about enough of this "female intuition" that I can stand for one day.

So have I, especially because the people displaying it have all been men. So much for men being logical; you can't even respond to the points I make without loading them up with your own emotional baggage and self-serving presuppositions and then pretending that's what I clearly meant.

But I'm used to that now. You do it all the time.

Seriously, Catan, you may want to think I've been saying that I could be a great fighter pilot, but that's not it. This is about, as I have said many times but apparently escaped you and the other "objective" males, this is about STRAIGHT UP MULTITASKING potential. Fighter pilots are exceptional men in many ways, and therefore are not representative of men as a whole when it comes to their capacity for any particular neurological function, anymore than Stickwick is representative of women as a whole.

That is why "but fighter pilots!" doesn't work as a counterpoint. It does not, not intuitively, not logically, not objectively, not with any modicum of reason. There are too many other variables.

I do enjoy this "no true multitasking" Scotsman goal post moving.

I thought that might be why you do it. Thanks for the confirmation.

Conversations get boring when I repeat myself over and over, and yet people see something different every single time--none of which is related to anything I actually said. It's so ironic, considering that people have interpreted the study in the OP as saying that men are more objective and logical and less emotionally-driven...

Anonymous tiarosa December 03, 2013 2:29 PM  

I've missed reading you, Farmer Tom.

How do I feel? Not sure, but I thought this was old news. Aren't there ten- or twenty- year old studies showing the brain difference? Or is this one just more specific?

Anonymous Noah B. December 03, 2013 2:33 PM  

So why do you think women are inherently better at multitasking? Cooking is a good example, but the ability to prepare several dishes and have them ready at the same time comes with practice. I haven't seen many women, or men for that matter, who can do this well the first time they try.

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 2:39 PM  

Let's put it this way: I have seen so many men exhibit exceptional multitasking in so many different arenas, and so many different fields, and so many different competitive situations, that you will have to prove that women can match up, we don't have to prove the opposite to you. Men can multitask well, and FAST.

You can't just wave away every data point because it doesn't measure "true" multitasking. I'm not saying that you think you could be a great pilot. What I am saying is that you are discounting the incredible multitasking skills that it takes, just because it also requires other skills.

Anonymous Athor Pel December 03, 2013 2:40 PM  

" Sigyn December 03, 2013 1:07 PM
...
Yes, I'm aware of this, but we're talking about multitasking, not spatial or motor skills. "But fighter pilots!" does not disprove the proposition that women are more potentially capable of multitasking than men are."



Are you actually saying that performance of spatial and motor skills don't count as tasks in regards to "multitasking"?

Yer funny.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 2:41 PM  

Re: cooking, look at how many professional cooks are men.

Anonymous TWS December 03, 2013 2:50 PM  

Sigyn within a narrow range of activities, I am sure women are better at handling the multitask. However, not all evidence of brain differences is evidence for or against multitasking. For instance, men interested in fighter pilots ignoring what a woman is interested in. Or the point she's trying to make.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 2:51 PM  

Are you actually saying that performance of spatial and motor skills don't count as tasks in regards to "multitasking"?

No, performing multiple tasks at the same time is obviously not multitasking because of no true multitasking Scotsman.

Anonymous Sigyn December 03, 2013 2:56 PM  

I'm bowing out. Not because you're right, not because I've run out of logic, but because I let myself get so irritated that I'm having heavy contractions.

I'm going to go lie down until it stops. Later.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 2:56 PM  

I thought that might be why you do it. Thanks for the confirmation.

Where did I do that?

Anonymous Anonymous December 03, 2013 2:57 PM  

Ladies, how do you feel about this article?



Every time one of these types of studies get published the blue peg commenters come out of the woodwork to sing their own song about how useless women are because they aren't men, and the pink pegs try to argue the points of the article/subject/whatever to prove how awesome they are without sounding like a Jezebelly. I feel bad for both.

Anonymous Noah B. December 03, 2013 3:07 PM  

Sigyn does have a point though. Women can talk on the cell phone, listen to the radio, do their hair, put on their makeup, update their Facebook status, eat breakfast, and plan their day, all at once and while driving. That takes some serious skill.

Anonymous VD December 03, 2013 3:10 PM  

Conversations get boring when I repeat myself over and over, and yet people see something different every single time--none of which is related to anything I actually said.

Are you seeing the pattern there, Sigyn? As I once told Sam Harris, if everyone is failing to understand what you mean, it is very unlikely that the problem is on their side.

The thing is, I suspect everyone understands what you said, but they are replying to the implicit argument underlying your words. Instead of repeatedly repeating yourself concerning fighter jocks, why don't you provide an example that you believe would have served as a better, more comprehensive illustration?

Otherwise, it appears you may be disputing the entire case and not merely the one example.

Anonymous Josh December 03, 2013 3:10 PM  

That takes some serious skill.

And collateral damage.

Anonymous Noah B. December 03, 2013 3:12 PM  

"And collateral damage."

First responders gots to eat too.

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 3:32 PM  

For instance, men interested in fighter pilots ignoring what a woman is interested in. Or the point she's trying to make.

So because women aren't interested in piloting, it's not an example of exceptional multitasking skill in men?

Just like pilots are supposedly 'highly selected', so that doesn't count either, except for all the men who love to fly simulators. But that doesn't count, because Duck Hunt.

If there were some counter point offered, clearly showing female superiority in some area that requires significant multitasking, we'd have something to discuss here. But instead, all data points have been shifted aside, and we are to just go on the implicit assumption that until we find the perfect comparison, we just have to assume equality despite plenty of personal experiences and plenty of imperfect comparisons. Hell, men even are more common as chefs.

I don't assume equality by default. The evidence seems to lean in one particular direction so far.

Do CEOs multitask? That doesn't require super fine motor control, but yet...most are men. But that data point probably needs to be thrown out too, because patriarchy.

Anonymous Peter December 03, 2013 3:35 PM  

I have no hesitation in accepting that women can multitask to a greater degree. I have heard that stated by an F/A18 Pilot-Instructor. (Male).
However, I am also aware of studies showing that multi-tasking is not as productive or effective as focusing on one task at a time, even in very short bursts as required.
The weakes of multitasking appears to be that inability to really focus and exclude that which is irrelevant to the moment.

....... and yes, GOOD logic is objective. It is based on rules, not upon what we want it to be or whether we like the results. The same goes for the selection of the premises to which we apply logic in order to reach conclusions. Premises are true/untrue and accurate/inaccurate according to objective standards, not according to what we want.
You can take untrue premises and apply faulty logic to them, but if you reach a true and useful conclusion, it will be by accident.

Anonymous Stickwick December 03, 2013 3:37 PM  

Noah B.: Women can talk on the cell phone, listen to the radio, do their hair, put on their makeup, update their Facebook status, eat breakfast, and plan their day, all at once and while driving.

Heh, they sure can. My grandma did all of this stuff while driving, but instead of using a cell phone / FB she was smoking a cigarette and drinking coffee. It was impressive. So was the frequency with which she got into wrecks.

Anonymous TWS December 03, 2013 3:42 PM  

I wonder if these right left pathways have anything to do with the way men and women respond differently to visual sexual stimulation? Men and women were asked about their interests then shown porn of all kinds and their arousal was measured.

Men responded physically as their stated interests would lead you to expect i.e. straight to straight, gay to gay, etc. Women responded physically to everything even to the control, chimps having sex.

Why women respond physically to everything was unexplained but different wiring might account for it.

Anonymous Anonymous December 03, 2013 3:47 PM  

Though men are wired "front-to-back", the article makes no mention of whether one side is dominant or not. Could this mean men are more specialized than women, whatever the endeavor? It seems like all the best examples are men: artists, scientists, etc.

Anonymous patrick kelly December 03, 2013 3:49 PM  

Men can multitask just fine, it's just that when we are around women, or maybe certain women, we really would rather not.............pay attention.............to anything other than the game on tv...our sammich, and our beer......or equivalent......

I have drank coffee, smoked a cigar, channel surfed for talk radio, worked a mobile CW contact, and driven through rush hour traffic all at the same time........ok, I was much younger, and would not try it again, or recommend anyone else do it...just braggin'........

Anonymous LL December 03, 2013 3:55 PM  

@farmer Tom, I'm going with the NAWALT defense. I have to print out maps of everything (my garmin yammering at me makes me BATSHIT so I turned off the sound about 2 minutes into the first time I used it) and while studying mathematics, my mentor had to always draw me pictures so I could understand because I'm very visual, which is contrary to most women. I feel as if I am pretty logical, but then on the other hand, I just said "I feel..." so maybe that discounts my opinion. I'll tell you this much, I limit my personal time with other women because I want to choke them the fuck out with their nattering and whatnot. *shrug*

Anonymous Noah B. December 03, 2013 3:58 PM  

Just a thought, another way to interpret those images would be that men keep reason and emotion largely separate from one another, or to put it in a way that might resonate with women, men almost have a split personality. While there is that logical left brain we've all been focusing on, the right brain is of course still there humming along, but it isn't as well connected to the left hemisphere as is the case in women. So -- while this might not seem like a very flattering possibility for men, I would speculate that men's emotions are not as grounded in reality as those of women. Which could be why many of our emotional responses, when we express them, sometimes come across as absurd or infantile to the fairer sex.

The flip side would be that for women, distinguishing reason from emotion is much more difficult because of the high degree of interconnection between the hemispheres.

Anonymous Peter December 03, 2013 3:59 PM  

mattse...

It has been observed that men do better at abstract.

Mathematics and physics are the most abstract of the science.... and they are almost completely dominated by men.
Music is the most abstract of the arts, and there is a dearth of truly great female composers.
....... and how many genuinely great female philosophers can you name? Even one?

Blogger stareatgoatsies December 03, 2013 4:02 PM  

Are you actually saying that performance of spatial and motor skills don't count as tasks in regards to "multitasking"?

Seems to me like she's saying fighter pilots are a bad test-case because even if women were better multi-taskers in general, their fighter-pilot performance would be inferior overall anyway due to the fact that their less-degraded but coming from a lower base-line visio-spatial capabilities would unfairly bias the results in favour of men.

I could word it better but, if you parse it, it should make sense.

Anonymous Catan December 03, 2013 4:14 PM  

Yes, the spatial abilities favor men in piloting.

What about chefs? Can we explain that one? CEOs?

I think the point that men excel at abstract thinking is a good one. That also dovetails well with spatial ability. I also think that type of thought process is useful for a lot more situations than the opposite, 'non abstract' way of thinking.

Anonymous Athor Pel December 03, 2013 4:15 PM  

"Noah B. December 03, 2013 3:07 PM

Sigyn does have a point though. Women can talk on the cell phone, listen to the radio, do their hair, put on their makeup, update their Facebook status, eat breakfast, and plan their day, all at once and while driving. That takes some serious skill."



or a serious misapprehension of risk while taking full and continual advantage of every prayer said for her by her parents and grandparents

Blogger stareatgoatsies December 03, 2013 4:37 PM  

Well CEOs have secretaries... And often a lot of effort devoted to letting them focus on one thing at a time. Chefs, other professions... That mens' IQs etc. have a wider distribution than womens' do could account for top performers in many fields being men, even those that require a lot of multi-tasking, not to mention overall drive to be the 'best'.

If you want to draw conclusions about men vs women, you need to ask how to Average Joe and Average Jane differ?

I'm agnostic but lean towards believing that Average Jane is a better multi-tasker... I worked as a waiter once and was routinely out-performed by Average Janes.

Blogger Duke of Earl December 03, 2013 5:33 PM  

Men and women are different?

Who knew?

Anonymous TWS December 03, 2013 5:39 PM  

I worked at a bank in the eighties. Lots off good looking secretaries. Most of them couldn't type. I would say they distracted the men more than vice versa

Anonymous automatthew December 03, 2013 5:47 PM  

Women only multitask "better" when the tasks are boring. They have a higher tolerance for repetitive tedium than men. Man's mind wanders when the work is dull.

After high school, I worked as a breakfast cook and had no trouble handling many orders at once. Sometimes I had to stay and help the lunch cooks, and I tended to fail miserably. Steaks are boring; fried eggs and omelets are not.

Anonymous Lana December 03, 2013 5:52 PM  

farmer Tom: Ladies, how do you feel about this article?

I felt validated as it confirmed my intuition and personal experience.

Anonymous MendoScot December 03, 2013 6:06 PM  

I do enjoy this "no true multitasking" Scotsman goal post moving.

Well, since Josh has invoked me...

The neurophysiological evidence is against true multitasking. It appears we just switch our attention back and forth between the tasks more or less rapidly, depending on the cognitive load (higher load => slower switching).

Under this model, the fighter jock is an example of trained integration. He isn't carrying out multiple separate tasks simultaneously; by repetition he has made them one, albeit rapidly adapting, task.

Nonetheless, the different components of that task may be stored in different parts of the neocerebellum.

Anonymous DonReynolds December 03, 2013 6:28 PM  

Of course, one example may not prove the general case, but this is a good example of how the female thought process can take the same information available to everyone and come to an entirely different conclusion.....

http://blog.trutv.com/dumb-as-a-blog/2012/10/22/lady-thinks-deer-should-cross-the-street-elsewhere/index.html

She may not be dumb. I would hate to say that about anyone, but she seems to get cause and effect backwards.

Anonymous DonReynolds December 03, 2013 6:34 PM  

LL..... "I'll tell you this much, I limit my personal time with other women because I want to choke them the fuck out with their nattering and whatnot."

Assuming you are not a lesbian, you can actually do that. Heterosexual men, on the other hand, have no other choice. Ha Ha.

Anonymous Peter December 03, 2013 7:00 PM  

CEO's are predominantly male because the average male spends more time at work, takes fewer breaks and in general makes fewer compromises between work and lifestyle.

Then there is the issue that women in higher education tend to lean more towards qualifications that are less useful in the business sphere. Women actualy start more businesses, but are less likely to grow a business to the point where the title "CEO" is appliccable, even if the business is viable.

Anonymous Peter December 03, 2013 7:01 PM  

DonReynolds....

Maybe that is the reason why hetero men are less likely to marry, and if they do, to marry later.

Anonymous LL December 03, 2013 7:45 PM  

Oh, I'm straight and I am glad I can just be "too busy" for girlie get-togethers. I have a sister...she is the Queen Bee of senseless chitchat and I am the only one who smokes so I bail to the back porch as soon as she settles in to talk us to death. I can see the glazed eyes of my dad thru the window every time and I feel so sorry for him!!

Anonymous MendoScot December 03, 2013 9:10 PM  

I meant to post this on the earlier thread. The case of the Midwife Toad is a biased but not inaccurate description of the professional and personal destruction of a scientist, Paul Kammerer, by his Darwinian fanatic colleagues. He was accused of adhering to discredited ideas - specifically Lamarkism - and of faking data that had been examined in detail by people opposed to his concepts.

Never mind. He was a heretic and was driven out of the Academy.

These days we would call him an epigeneticist, and give him an entire fucking department.

Blogger Nate December 03, 2013 10:08 PM  

Just so we're clear...

According to Sigyn... when i am drumming I am not multi-tasking. Even though my left foot is doing one thing... my right foot is doing something totally different... my left hand is doing a third completely different thing... and my right hand is doing a fourth different thing... all at the same time. And all of these things vary wildly over time... of and sometimes I sing.

But see that's not multitasking right? That's just drumming. To be multitasking I would have to be doing all those things... while putting on make up.

Right Sigyn?

Anonymous LL December 03, 2013 10:13 PM  

Nate, I can't even do the XBox control, nor the nunchuck attached to the Wii remote so I say you are multitasking like a BOSS.

Anonymous timpaul December 04, 2013 1:48 AM  

Imago Dei, in the created sense. The Ilk wakens from their dogmatic slumber. Yes, N.

Blogger Vickie December 04, 2013 3:19 AM  

I can't believe you dorks. I am female and I don't remember men wanting to make a 'science experiment' out of me. IF YOU HAVE THAT MANY PROBLEMS WITH FEMALES - GO GAY OK. Men whine more than women and yes they do. You do not know how often I could not get those girls - er men to even tell me what exactly they thought they were doing. Most often it had to do with sex or dragging me home or who knows. I am in an I hate men mood. They used to pass I don't know anymore. They are bigger girls than me now and I wasn't the 'butch' type. If women annoy you that much - Go GAY. I am to old for this. I am not sure what something really bad happened with all this. Just go gay - but don't you ever use me as a damn science experiment. You men are a trip.'

Anonymous Toby Temple December 04, 2013 6:19 AM  

Vickie. Shut the f@$k up.

Blogger Lud VanB December 04, 2013 9:57 AM  

Since all this science stuff is just a bunch of hooey anyway why do you care?

Anonymous Toby Temple December 04, 2013 10:04 AM  

Its about the children, Lud VanB! Think of all the children!!!

Blogger LP 999/Eliza December 04, 2013 1:27 PM  

Indeed, not a suffragette, smiles!

Blogger Matamoros December 04, 2013 4:56 PM  

Stg58/Animal Mother I read a while ago that in the womb, the rush of testosterone in the male severs the Corpus Callosum, the bridge between the hemispheres.

No, both sexes use the corpus callosum for brain hemispheric integration. Problems with ADD, dyslexia, etc. have been shown to be tied in with problems of the transfer, or hand off, from one hemisphere to the other. This is why dyslexics commonly read better on the edges of the pages, but have problems as they move to the center - where the hand off to the other hemisphere takes place.

Blogger Matamoros December 04, 2013 5:00 PM  

The differences noted in brain connections are interesting in that the pre-frontal cortex is the real seat of logic and reason. The fact that male brains use the front of the brain (pre-frontal cortex) in a front-back manner on the same side, while females use their brains in a left-right manner, shows that they are not able? to use logic and reason as does a man.

This is also what St. Thomas (Summa Theologica) states as he writes that woman is subject to man because in the male reason predominates – “For good order would have been wanting in the human family if some were not governed by others wiser than themselves. So by such a kind of subjection woman is naturally subject to man, because in man the discretion of reason predominates.” ST q.92, a.1, Reply to Objection 2:

And – “Reason in man is rather like God in the world." (Aquinas, Thomas Opuscule II, De Regno)

Blogger abcdefgh December 04, 2013 6:39 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger abcdefgh December 04, 2013 6:40 PM  

Every time one of these types of studies get published the blue peg commenters come out of the woodwork to sing their own song about how useless women are because they aren't men

I don't see anyone saying women are useless, merely inferior, clearly inferior. It seems quite typical for such a pronouncement of inferiority to be met with accusations that the pronouncer hates that which they merely consider inferior.

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