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Monday, February 16, 2015

Go to Israel. Now.

I've been saying it for a while, but Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu is beating the drum even more strongly:
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Sunday urged European Jews to move to Israel after a Jewish man was killed in an attack outside Copenhagen's main synagogue.

"Israel is your home. We are preparing and calling for the absorption of mass immigration from Europe," Netanyahu said in a statement, repeating a similar call after attacks by jihadists in Paris last month when four Jews were among the dead.

The cabinet later on Sunday submitted a plan to encourage the absorption of Jews from France, Belgium and Ukraine, and would discuss immigration from other European countries at a later date. 
Jews are neither Europeans nor Christians, neither are they Muslims, so they need to get the hell out of the way and stay safely out of the way of the coming wars. Too many of them have caused too much damage to themselves, to Europe, and to the USA by idiotically encouraging third world immigration in a foolish attempt to protect themselves against Christians who never had any intention of harming them.

Sam Huntington's long-foreseen Clash of Civilizations (PDF) is approaching. Those who are opposed to Christian civilization are going to lose again; even the European seculars and pagans are beginning to understand the importance of Christian civilization. I've read one of his book and Netanyahu is a good student of not only history in general, but military history in particular, and he understands that if Europe's Jews continue to stupidly stand in the way of Europeans defending their civilization against the Muslim onslaught, they're going to be wiped out again.

That, incidentally, is why France's prime minister is desperately arguing against the Israeli prime minister's appeal to Europe's Jews. Not because he loves Jews more than Netanyahu, but because he is cynically using them as a means of keeping the nationalist leadership that will replace him at bay.

Israel should no more stand in the way of Europe defending herself against Islamic expansion than Europe should interfere with Israel defending herself Islamic aggression. It appears that Netanyahu, for one, understands that strong Christian nations in Europe are considerably better for Israel than a Muslim-conquered Europe.

At the moment, I am editing a book by a brilliant Israeli military historian that will be available later this month to newsletter subscribers. And in thinking about how Man's strategic thinking has developed, it is becoming increasingly evident that the modern militaries presently lack the theoretical means to grasp how events are taking shape or what to do with them. Forget the bromide about how generals are always fighting the last war, right now, the politicians and their military advisors are mostly caught up in entirely fictional theater based on a geopolitical structure that has very little relation to either the current reality or the global wars of the future.

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294 Comments:

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Blogger Shimshon February 16, 2015 8:04 AM  

Which book of his did you read?

Anonymous Dirtnapninja February 16, 2015 8:04 AM  

My old man used to say that the Jews were history's greatest teachers. And history's worst students.

Europes Jews got what they want, but don't want what they got. Gonna happen in North America too.

Anonymous microphone jones February 16, 2015 8:08 AM  

what book of his did you read?

Blogger Derrick Bonsell February 16, 2015 8:09 AM  

Netanyahu's coalition is in big trouble because the Arab parties have united over threats by the far right of his coalition to expel the Arabs. They're large enough of an electorate to put Bibi at risk.

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 8:13 AM  

It was "International Terrorism: Challenge and Response". I initially thought it was "Terrorism: How the West can Win", but I read it in high school and the latter didn't come out until 1987. I chose it and wrote a paper on it in tenth grade for a history class. So, I've always generally favored Netanhayu as an Israeli leader; until recently, I've found him to be somewhat disappointing.

But that's politics. Even those who have a good idea of what is necessary don't feel they can openly advocate it.

Anonymous bub February 16, 2015 8:14 AM  

Lo, I am sending for many fishers, An affirmation of Jehovah, And they have fished them, And after this I send for many hunters, And they have hunted them from off every mountain, And from off every hill, and from holes of the rocks.
Jeremiah 16:16

Anonymous an israeli February 16, 2015 8:22 AM  

Derrick,
Nobody tried to expel the Arabs from the Knesset. A four percent threshold was introduced (rather foolishly, IMO), lower than thresholds in Germany and Sweden. Muslims in Israel are about 16% of the population, so all this talk about them being expelled is the usual lefty hysteria and lies.

I don't know why you think Bibi is in trouble. The Arab parties have 11seats today and they are polling at 12. Not that big of a difference. To beat Bibi the left needs the center, and those people won't sit with Islamists and pro-hamas Arab MKs.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 16, 2015 8:25 AM  

The Left, Atheists for Allah, and a huge strategic error on their part. No one profits more from anti-semetism than organized professional jews, this is just the end state being explicitly voiced by Netanyahu.

Anonymous an israeli February 16, 2015 8:28 AM  

VD,

The French don't want the Jews to leave because:

A. It will mean the republic has failed.
B. The Jews are a handy target. With them gone, jihadists will find other targets. As long as Jews are attacked the illusion can be maintained that this is about Israel or Palestine.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 8:36 AM  

I wouldn't ascribe any particularly long-term strategy to Netanyahu's pleas. He does what any Israeli Prime Minister would do in his stead, which is calling for aliyah in the face of expected terrorism/violence against European Jewry in the upcoming decade. He's probably well-informed by the Mossad about the dangers awaiting European Jewry from Europe's growing Muslim population. He also wants more Likud voters and more bright citizens to ameliorate the Israeli economy. Above all he has to show that he is doing something, not lagging behind the events but leading. He is more of an opportunist than a brilliant strategist.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 16, 2015 8:39 AM  

FTR I would support Israel in a more vocal fashion if they would ship their Galils to this country so I could buy one.

Anonymous Anonymous February 16, 2015 8:40 AM  

Am I the only one who's a little perturbed at the way Bibi is trying to usher people around the globe according to their ethnicity?

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 8:40 AM  

Grabbing the popcorn while sitting in Tel Aviv.

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 8:46 AM  

Netanyahu's coalition is in big trouble because the Arab parties have united over threats by the far right of his coalition to expel the Arabs. They're large enough of an electorate to put Bibi at risk.

No one in the current coalition wants to "expel the Arabs." The furthest-right party, Jewish Home, advocates the annexation of Area C of the West Bank (pretty much everything except the major cities and their immediate suburbs). Research your facts.

The Arabs united so that the three Arab parties individually would not all make it into the next parliament under the new 3.5% threshold -- especially when many, if not most, Israeli Arabs don't vote.

Bibi does face a risk. The major center-left opposition party by itself is polling higher than the Likud, but it all comes down to which of those two parties can form a coalition of at least 61 seats. Forget the Arab parties -- they'd almost never sit in a government out of principle.

The real risk is if the centrist and haredi (ultra-Orthodox) parties join the center-left to form the next government, It's not inconceivable -- the haredi parties will join with anyone who will agree to continue to let them sponge off the taxpayers and not work while also avoiding army service after high school.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 8:50 AM  

Nonsense,

The lack of a given minority group is no means of determining the success/failure of a government for Frenchman.

Unless you mean its a revealing symptom: Jews leaving because the French Republic has given rise to a sizable Islamic population is most certainly a sign of failure of said republic.

On the other hand, the French have had five republic. Failure, c'est la vie. A Gallic shrug later and we'll be off to number six, only with a conspicuous lack of turbans.

Anonymous Andrew Spooner Jr. February 16, 2015 8:50 AM  

This will also have the effect of filling Israel with more voters who are more likely to vote Likud and Netanyahu. Ordinarily I would find this sort of thing sleazy, as with US immigration, but the fact that these European Jews are already Israeli citizens actually gives it a degree of poetic justice. After all, the type of person who doesn't have he good sense to move to Israel as soon as possible is not the type of person you would want voting anyway.

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 8:56 AM  

A. It will mean the republic has failed.

Why? The Republic doesn't rest upon the presence or absence of Jews.

Above all he has to show that he is doing something, not lagging behind the events but leading. He is more of an opportunist than a brilliant strategist.

It's not strategy, it's historically aware responsibility. If you look at the past massacres about which the Jews complain, aside from the 20th century, most of them were directly related to the early stages of Muslim-Christian war. The Crusades, the last gasp of Islamic expansion in Spain, and the Inquisition all featured Jewish massacres by either Muslims or Christians.

And for obvious grand strategic reasons. Being a weaker party, the Jews are usually in the position of trying to play both sides against the other. So, the other side correctly takes them out in order to not leave an enemy ally at their rear. Right now, the Jews are actively opposing and inhibiting the nationalist response to Islamic invasion in Europe. Netanyahu knows that European nationalism is going to rise with a vengeance, so he's trying to get the idiots out of there before they get swamped by it.

The nationalist response is not aimed at the Jews, but being loud and avowed enemies of it, they will be affected by it.

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 8:58 AM  

Am I the only one who's a little perturbed at the way Bibi is trying to usher people around the globe according to their ethnicity?

Choose a Name under Name/URL, please. Anonymous comments are not permitted. And don't be. Americans are the only people in the world who don't take ethnicity seriously.

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 8:58 AM  

these European Jews are already Israeli citizens

Not true. Non-Israeli Jews are not automatic Israeli citizens. To receive the automatic citizenship, they have to move to Israel first. Subtle but important difference.

Blogger Salt February 16, 2015 9:01 AM  

I never knew the French Republic was Jew-centric. Learn something new everyday. Guess the American Republic is black-centric. Never would have thunk it.

Blogger Derrick Bonsell February 16, 2015 9:02 AM  

The Arab parties just want to tip the scale towards the center left. That puts Netanyahu's coalition in jeopardy of falling from power.

I'm not sure what exactly you're protesting in what I said.

Blogger Al Cibiades February 16, 2015 9:04 AM  

IS should have leftists quaking in their boots. Their Wilsonian agenda is derailed by Christian nationalism. The clever leftists at The Atlantic are already hopping on the patriotic bandwagon and will eventually leave the Damien Walters and Lena Dunhams wondering "what happened to my country, boo-hoo."

I wonder if Eric Allen Bell will eventually be welcomed back after straying from the faithful at the Daily Kos?

Anonymous Andrew Spooner Jr. February 16, 2015 9:04 AM  

Yes, they have to move there. I find myself tickled with the fact that Netanyahu has essentially found a way to pay for votes that is in no way unethical and is actually in the best interests of the country.

Blogger Chris Mallory February 16, 2015 9:07 AM  

Now if only BiBi will work at getting the 6 million in the US to go to Israel.

http://ex-army.blogspot.com/2015/02/monday-morning-outrageous-quibcag.html

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 9:08 AM  

Samuel Scott,

"The furthest-right party, Jewish Home,"

The furthest right-wing party is Yachad, and I'm pretty sure they'd like to expel Arabs -- not from the Knesset, but generally. They are expected to receive 4 seats, which is above the required threshold.

"The major center-left opposition party by itself is polling higher than the Likud,"

Not any longer; Likud is expected to receive 25 seats, Zionist Camp only 23.

"The real risk is if the centrist and haredi (ultra-Orthodox) parties join the center-left to form the next government"

That's unlikely considering at least one centrist party, Yesh Atid, is adamant about not joining the Haredim.

Overall Netanyahu's reelection is almost guaranteed.

Anonymous jay c February 16, 2015 9:11 AM  

I've subscribed in the past, but haven't received any newsletters or announcements. I just tried to subscribe again, but it says I'm already subscribed. Has there been nothing sent in the last few months or is something not working correctly?

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 9:12 AM  

Seems pretty short-term thinking by the Arabs in Israel: if they're actively demanding the canaries be left in the coalmine, and then (unexpectedly!) the canaries all get slaughtered...

... Well, Israel might not use European Reconquista Mk. II to permanently pacify its borders... but it will certainly take care of the trouble at home.

Course, at least they could claim they are probably screwed no matter what the do in the long run... but if the Jewish left sides with them in exchange for temporary leadership...

There isn't enough popcorn in the world.

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 9:13 AM  

Jack, the issue at hand was the furthest right-wing part in the current government.

Different polls say different things; most likely the averages of them put Zionist Camp and the Likud at around neck-and-neck. But yes, it's all about who can form a coalition in the first place. It's likely going to be Bibi, but it's less then guaranteed.

Anonymous Ryan ATL February 16, 2015 9:14 AM  

didn't someone in the 1930s also try this

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 9:17 AM  

I just tried to subscribe again, but it says I'm already subscribed. Has there been nothing sent in the last few months or is something not working correctly?

We had a problem where it was set to a two-step subscribe-activiate process on signup and we didn't realize it. I activated about 200 people who were affected by that and all the new signups are automatically activated. You'll get the next one.

Anonymous Steve February 16, 2015 9:21 AM  

Is it just me, or are Israeli girls smoking hot? I don't think I saw a single fatty in Tel Aviv.

Certainly they're a couple of points better than run-of-the-mill British girls, though possibly not the French.

Bibi should buy some advertising in Western European TV showing off the stacked and packed babes of the IDF.

If you build it, they will come.

Anonymous bsrealm February 16, 2015 9:23 AM  

there's an interesting profile of netanyahu doing the rounds now.

link attached.
http://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CB0QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.researchgate.net%2Fprofile%2FShaul_Kimhi%2Fpublication%2F235330077_The_psychological_profile_of_Benjamin_Netanyahu_using_behavior_analysis%2Flinks%2F0fcfd510e2105713b4000000.pdf&ei=6_zhVO-aLIbluQTzgYHwBQ&usg=AFQjCNEVFB2yVJKCR65GNdvSYNthDaxKNQ&bvm=bv.85970519,d.c2E

i'm not a fan of freudianism, it being glorified quackery but this is pretty decent work.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 9:24 AM  

Vox,

Everything you describe is correct, I just take the contention that Netanyahu is acting upon a "historically aware responsibility" with a grain of salt. I'm not suggesting that he doesn't see what's coming; one has to be blind or dimwitted not to realize that the Jews of Europe need to make aliyah before the bloodshed begins - but, I'll put it this way, he's probably more concerned about the political gain this Jewish immigration (or at least the plea for Jewish immigration) will yield for him than about any lofty ideals of saving the Jews.

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 9:28 AM  

Is it just me, or are Israeli girls smoking hot? I don't think I saw a single fatty in Tel Aviv.

Mandatory military service for two years (and three for men) after high school and consuming a Mediterranean diet rather than McDonalds will do that to you.

Bibi should buy some advertising in Western European TV showing off the stacked and packed babes of the IDF.

Actually, that's been done. Israel had a big marketing and PR push a few years back showing hot girls in bikinis as a "rebrand" away from war and such. An IDF soldier and model was on the cover of something, there were tons of other articles, and such.

There's a separate marketing push to brand Tel Aviv as the gay capital of the world -- Gay Pride Day here is huge -- and an island of freedom for gays and lesbians.

Anonymous Salt February 16, 2015 9:31 AM  

Given its area, topography, and economic infrastructure, what size population can Israel sustain?

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 9:33 AM  

Given its area, topography, and economic infrastructure, what size population can Israel sustain?

Like in Manhattan, the answer is, "How high can you build?"

But given another large migration, there will be political issues with more Israelis moving to live in Judea and Samaria once the rest of the country gets too crowded and expensive.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 9:39 AM  

"Mandatory military service for two years (and three for men) after high school and consuming a Mediterranean diet rather than McDonalds will do that to you."

I'm don't think the mandatory military service is responsible for the girls' rather fit figures. Most girls are not recruited to combat units, and they (the majority) gain weight during their military service, or so many of them complain. It's probably mostly the diet. Genes are also involved somehow.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 9:40 AM  

Americans are the only people in the world who don't take ethnicity seriously.

Leftist Americans take ethnicity very seriously. That is why they have been able to effectively use non-European immigration to attack America. Amusingly, they also think that it is a phenomenon they can control. You're right, though, that normal Americans don't think about it much, but that is changing. Hopefully, at a sufficiently rapid pace.

Anonymous Silas Phelps February 16, 2015 9:41 AM  

"Too many of them have caused too much damage to themselves, to Europe, and to the USA by idiotically encouraging third world immigration in a foolish attempt to protect themselves against Christians who never had any intention of harming them."

There you go again praying for our persecutors not to be held to account for their crimes.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 9:48 AM  

Salt,

"Given its area, topography, and economic infrastructure, what size population can Israel sustain?"

If the Negev and Judea & Samaria are wholly, systematically populated, and the population all lives crowded in colossal skyscrapers all over the country, then I'd say 40 or 45 million at most. And this will be a horrible, de-humanazing nightmare.

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 9:49 AM  

idiotically encouraging third world immigration in a foolish attempt to protect themselves against Christians who never had any intention of harming them

No, that's not why U.S. Jewish groups tend to support pro-immigration policies general.

It's because they -- via their ancestors -- are relatively-recent immigrants themselves! It's immigrants supporting immigrants. It's supporting labor unions and the Democratic Party because those ancestors worked in factories right off the boat. It's helping to protect minority rights because they see themselves as a minority as well.

It also comes down to an altruistic desire to help people as they see in need -- though one can argue whether it's a misguided desire -- as a religious imperative.

No, it's not some grand, anti-Christian conspiracy. In every country, people vote for their own perceived self-interests. It's why Israel has a right-wing majority but American Jews are largely left-wing.

Anonymous That Would Be Telling February 16, 2015 9:49 AM  

Mr.MantraMan: No one can import an assembled gun like the Galil into the US unless it's for the government. The law is 18 U.S.C. § 922 (r) and the ATF enabling rules are complicated with some notable gotchas. For example, a SKS rifle can be imported whole, but standard modifications, if they don't satisfy the rules, can make them illegal.

So foreign companies have to establish manufacturing facilities in the US so that the rifles they produce don't have "too many" foreign parts, and an owner of one of these can accidentally convert it to an illegal one if he unwittingly replaces one of the listed parts that was made in the US with one that was made abroad, which are often more available because they're service rifles over there.

So we can presume IMI, or any potential US partner, has decided it was just not worth the cost and effort after GHWB's import ban, especially since the US domestic "assault weapon" market is so competitive. and healthy.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 9:53 AM  

If the Negev and Judea & Samaria are wholly, systematically populated, and the population all lives crowded in colossal skyscrapers all over the country, then I'd say 40 or 45 million at most. And this will be a horrible, de-humanazing nightmare.

Well, if you can sufficiently destabilize the Hashemite Kingdom, once the West Bank is full you can expand the program over the Jordan...

As a side note, I find it amusingly ironic that the self-styled Islamic Caliphate has managed to, quite literally, royally piss off the man with the strongest claim to be a legitimate Caliph.

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 9:53 AM  

If the Negev and Judea & Samaria are wholly, systematically populated, and the population all lives crowded in colossal skyscrapers all over the country, then I'd say 40 or 45 million at most.

There are only about 14 million Jews in the world + the 2 million non-Jewish citizens of Israel, so that's not too bad.

Anonymous An Israeli February 16, 2015 9:55 AM  

VD,

I didn't say that France would have failed but that the Republic would have. The French Republic has certain ideals and those would be exposed as illusions, not to say delusions, should the Jews, all or most or even many of them, would be driven out.

Anonymous Silas Phelps February 16, 2015 9:57 AM  

Don't out-think yourself, Samuel Scott.

Jews do what they do because it's their nature to do what they do.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 10:02 AM  

It also comes down to an altruistic desire to help people as they see in need -- though one can argue whether it's a misguided desire -- as a religious imperative.

That must be why they've opened the door to such immigration in Israel. Oh, wait...

Sam, if someone "invites" a thief into my home, I see no reason not to invite a thief into his... shall we discuss the Palestinian "right of return" in this context?

In every country, people vote for their own perceived self-interests. It's why Israel has a right-wing majority but American Jews are largely left-wing.

Yep. American Jews are a rather short-sight lot. How many Jews did the socialists kill in the 20th century? I'll never understand the Jews' affinity for socialism. Because that's what we're talking about when we discuss Jews' anti-white/anti-western bias: socialist Jews. A label which describes a disproportionate number of Jews in the West.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 16, 2015 10:05 AM  

I know about the laws governing imports of guns, but since we are literally in a death spiral as far as law goes here in the FUSA all it takes is for someone to lay a bribe and next thing you know those two broads in California who bought their senate seats would champion Galil imports and doofus the president from Chicago via Rahm Israel Emanuel would sign off on it as long as a certain percentage went to deserving holy minorities. FUSA indeed.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 10:06 AM  

The reason Jews support mass third-world immigration to the West is because they are terrified of being the largest, most salient (non-Western) minority; particularly as Jews are vastly overrepresented among the upper echelons of society. That's also why Jews have been at the forefront of the Feminist/homosexual/transsexual agenda.

Jews support all possible minorities so less attention will be paid to Jews themselves, and to be able to muster these minorities as allies of the Jews against the White Christian majority, which may, from the Jewish perspective, rediscover its anti-Semitism at any moment and begin persecuting Jews. Jewish behavior is, as always, best explained by understanding that Jews are terrified of anti-Semitism and annihilation, and will do everything within their power to diminish the prospects that the Christian majority will turn against them. If that means importing Africans and Mexican and Arabs, if that means propagating for "racial equality" and gay-acceptance and tranny-acceptance and for whatever other ethnic/sexual minorities there are, then that's what the Jews will do.

None of this is said out of hatred of Jews; one just needs to understand that Jews are motivated by immense fear, a historically justified fear at that. It's that simple.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 16, 2015 10:06 AM  

One thing I'm glad is that the taboos of the post 1945 world order are being taken apart.

Anonymous jay c February 16, 2015 10:06 AM  

Bibi should buy some advertising in Western European TV showing off the stacked and packed babes of the IDF.

GOD! GIRLS! GUNS! PIE! blog used to have a regular feature for IDF Death Babes.

Blogger Joshua Dyal February 16, 2015 10:10 AM  

Interesting topical blogpost from AC on this question. http://www.anonymousconservative.com/blog/rabbits-vs-wolves-jewish-edition/

Blogger Laguna Beach Fogey February 16, 2015 10:11 AM  

+1000

This.

Anonymous Silas Phelps February 16, 2015 10:16 AM  

""Too many of them have caused too much damage to themselves, to Europe, and to the USA by idiotically encouraging third world immigration in a foolish attempt to protect themselves against Christians who never had any intention of harming them."

Wouldn't you just love to have Vox Day give the eulogy at your daughter's funeral after her niggerdeath:

"Lord, bless these coons, they knew better but bashed my girl's skull in after raping her over several hours anyway. Please, Dear Mighty Lord God Creatorman, let them have their homeland wherein they may grow to abundance. For what should it profit a man this his own child be raped and killed without blessing her rapists and killers?"

Thus spake the Southern Baptist.

Anonymous Stililcho February 16, 2015 10:21 AM  

to muster these minorities as allies of the Jews against the White Christian majority, which may, from the Jewish perspective, rediscover its anti-Semitism at any moment and begin persecuting Jews

Because the potential for anti-semitism among their Christian friends is a greater threat to Jews than the rabid antisemtism of Mohammedans or the brutal indifference of pagans? Not buying it. Moreover, if fear of Christian anti-semitism were the motivating force, then Jews would have to be collectively dumber than a box of rocks to think that importing 60 million Roman Catholic hispanics into the U.S. to replace the white protestants is going to DECREASE the likelihood of anti-semitism.

one just needs to understand that Jews are motivated by immense fear,

Can't argue with that.

a historically justified fear at that.

Justified by what, precisely?

If a justified fear was a motivating factor, one would expect to see Jews broadly opposing socialists given the 20th century body count.

Blogger Laguna Beach Fogey February 16, 2015 10:25 AM  

one just needs to understand that Jews are motivated by immense fear, a historically justified fear at that. It's that simple.

This is a perfect reason to expel these unhealthy, neurotic misfits from Europe and North America.

The problem facing us isn't just the growing numbers of Muslims, it's the presence of Jews, as well. For some reason conservative Christian Americans ignore this.

Anonymous Silas Phelps February 16, 2015 10:32 AM  

"For some reason conservative Christian Americans ignore this."

Because Pastor Hagee said they should, so they do what he said they should.

No amount of Mensa Magic IQ can overcome the childhood inbuilt drive to bless the Israelites. Vox has said it over and over and over, ad nauseam, that no matter what harm they do to his kin he blesses them, because his old man told him so when he was done but a kid.

The rest of his Mensa IQ is spent justifying that to himself.

*Note: *He* isn't in America to face the consequences. He fled to a Roman Catholic nation to baptise *them* in the name of his Jew loving Lord, seeking succour in their safety.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 10:35 AM  

Stililcho,

"Because the potential for anti-semitism among their Christian friends is a greater threat to Jews than the rabid antisemtism of Mohammedans or the brutal indifference of pagans? "

Jews don't (or didn't) see Christians as allies, because of historical mutual animosity. Also, and this is the important part which you miss: White Christians are a *majority*. Jews are not afraid of being persecuted by another minority (well, now they are starting to, heh), but by being persecuted by the majority, which is straight, White, and Christian.

"Moreover, if fear of Christian anti-semitism were the motivating force, then Jews would have to be collectively dumber than a box of rocks to think that importing 60 million Roman Catholic hispanics into the U.S. to replace the white protestants is going to DECREASE the likelihood of anti-semitism."

No, you don't understand. The point is not "decreasing anti-Semitism" in general. Jews know well that Muslims and Mexicans are anti-Semites. Jews aren't dumb. But these are minorities, outcasts, outsiders; people who do not identify with the majority, people who may arouse antagonism among the majority and thus attention will be averted from the Jews. Jews want Gentiles, specifically the White Christian majority which hosts them, to direct its attention towards blacks, Muslims, gays, whatever – and not see the Jews. Jews don't want to be the largest and most salient minority.

"Justified by what, precisely?

If a justified fear was a motivating factor, one would expect to see Jews broadly opposing socialists given the 20th century body count."

2,000 years of Jewish-Christian animosity versus a single century of Socialism? Dude, it's not the body count. It's the history. Also, many Socialists were Jews (an understatement), so naturally Jews see it as more kosher than Christianity.

Anonymous Susan February 16, 2015 10:35 AM  

Jack Truman,

I don't know if you are aware of this or not, but Netanyahu's older brother died during the rescue of Jewish hostages in Entebbe back in the 70's IIRC. I think he was the only fatality. The movie that was made was actually pretty decent.

So he has a family history of trying to actually do something to save his people. It isn't all politics with him.

Anonymous Silas Phelps February 16, 2015 10:41 AM  

One can only but admire Netanyahu calling his own people to their own land and compare it to Vox Day, who laughs at his national brethren, ensconsed afar away from them, urging them on to fight his wars.

We need our own Netanyahu's and to purge the Vox Days.

Blogger wrf3 February 16, 2015 10:41 AM  

S. Scott wrote: Like in Manhattan, the answer is, "How high can you build?"

Water source?

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 10:44 AM  

It's because they -- via their ancestors -- are relatively-recent immigrants themselves! It's immigrants supporting immigrants. It's supporting labor unions and the Democratic Party because those ancestors worked in factories right off the boat. It's helping to protect minority rights because they see themselves as a minority as well.

I am sure that is part of it too. But regardless, I don't care about the why. I care about the what. They are not on the side of Western civilization. So, they will be better off not being in the West when the Men of the West ride again.

There you go again praying for our persecutors not to be held to account for their crimes.

I am less concerned about holding people accountable than avoiding unnecessary bloodshed. Everyone has suffered enough.

Anonymous zen0 February 16, 2015 10:45 AM  

> Am I the only one who's a little perturbed at the way Bibi is trying to usher people around the globe according to their ethnicity?

I'm sorry, you have the wrong room. The Fainting Couches are down the hall.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 10:47 AM  

Susan,

I know of Yoni Netanyahu's fate. That's a touching personal story for Bibi Netanyahu to be motivated by, and to publicize, but well, I prefer judging politicians on the basis of material interests, not on the bsis of possible emotional factors that may or may not influence them to whatever degree.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 10:49 AM  

people who may arouse antagonism among the majority and thus attention will be averted from the Jews

That's would be a rather interesting strategy since it is actually directing more attention towards the Jews who support the policy.

2,000 years of Jewish-Christian animosity

So I'm to believe that long-term "animosity" causes Jews more fear than, say, a worldwide religious movement dedicated in part to eradicating Jews or a trans-national political religion with a recent body count in the millions? Show me, precisely, what Christians have ever done to Jews that remotely compares to what Arabs/Mohammedans have recently tried to do to Jews and what socialists have recently done to Jews.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 10:50 AM  

Who cares? Even if Netanyahu is completely politically self-serving, it:

1) Takes an intelligent and hostile minority group out of the west and
2) Could save hundreds of thousands of Jews from dying in the coming crossfire.

I'm not inclined to look for reasons to break the solution.

Anonymous Silas Phelps February 16, 2015 10:52 AM  

I am less concerned about holding people accountable than avoiding unnecessary bloodshed. Everyone has suffered enough.

You constantly exhibit that your primary concern is that the Jews do not suffer and show scant regard that your brethren have suffered at their hands. The Sermon on the Mount wasn't spoken to exonerate and adulate the Pharisees. You seem to take the stance that it was.

What you are less concerned about is Whites or Christians and what you are most concerned about are Jews.

Blogger Shibes Meadow February 16, 2015 10:53 AM  

Genuine LOL. I was just about to post that same link!

Anonymous zen0 February 16, 2015 10:55 AM  

@ Jack Truman

I'm not suggesting that he doesn't see what's coming; one has to be blind or dimwitted not to realize that the Jews of Europe need to make aliyah before the bloodshed begins -

Why did so many Jews remain in Germany in the 30's?

Speaking of which, I just found out that the Altar Of Zeus in Pereganum (called the "Seat of Satan" in Revelations) was dismantled and sent to Germany where it was reassembled in 1930. It inspired Hitler so much he commanded Albert Speer to use it as a template to design the Nuremberg stadium. It was on the Altar of Zeus that the Christian Martyr Antipas was killed.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 10:59 AM  

"That's would be a rather interesting strategy since it is actually directing more attention towards the Jews who support the policy."

You call it "interesting"; I have other words for this strategy. I think one issue with Jews is an inability to stop before it's too late. Though maybe this will change as Islam grows stronger in the West.

"Show me, precisely, what Christians have ever done to Jews that remotely compares to what Arabs/Mohammedans have recently tried to do to Jews and what socialists have recently done to Jews."

Expulsions, pogroms, economic restrictions, blood libels, Inquisition, more expulsions, more pogroms, holocaust. Is that enough? Yes, Islam and Socialism are just as horrible, if not moreso; but the former is less relevant to European Jews (Ashkenazim), and the latter was very Jewish in nature so it can be rationalized, at least as long as Jews lead the way.

Blogger Joshua Dyal February 16, 2015 11:00 AM  

If a justified fear was a motivating factor, one would expect to see Jews broadly opposing socialists given the 20th century body count.

Of the various guises of socialism, only the Nazis were anti-Jewish. The others were either completely unconcerned about the Jews (Chinese, Vietnamese, Korean, etc.) or were over-represented by Jews, who in many respects, can be said to have led the movements--bolshevism, Italian fascism, etc. Why would the Jews fear an ideology with a high body count, if the body count is mostly those of their perceived enemies, and the deaths were to a great degree, at their direction?

I admit, I'm not really very familiar with where the various guises of Latin American socialism place Jews in their ideological worldview. But given the vanishingly small number of Jews that live in Latin America, I'd be inclined to suggest that they don't care.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 11:05 AM  

"Why did so many Jews remain in Germany in the 30's?"

Because they believed that Europeans, upon becoming secular and even liberal, have "changed", so they can be trusted not to persecute their Jews neighbors. Quite a bitter lesson it was.

Blogger Doom February 16, 2015 11:08 AM  

While it might be a good idea, on one hand, it is a terrible idea on the other. I actually wondered, for a while, when I learned that muslim nations have the bomb, why Israel wasn't destroyed. They are, I believe at this point, waiting for the next to close with more fish for the taking. They are working to force more Jews into the killzone. For a people who do not care about their own lives, the threat of nuclear retaliation means nothing, especially if they can nearly completely wipe out their enemy.

In one sense, given what Jews seem to foment politically, I don't care. If you dig a grave, you will probably won't have much choice but to enter it. And they most certainly have dug. Treacherous duplicity through the false leadership in a genetic war on various peoples always comes back to bite. And so it will be. Some will remain, the bible discusses this. But it doesn't have to be many. Same with arabs... muslim or not.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 11:11 AM  


I'm sorry, you have the wrong room. The Fainting Couches are down the hall.


Where have I heard that before? Oh, yeah...


A: SHUT YOUR FESTERING GOB, YOU TIT! YOUR TYPE MAKES ME PUKE! YOU VACUOUS TOFFEE-NOSED MALODOROUS PERVERT!!!

M: Yes, but I came here for an argument!!

A: OH! Oh! I'm sorry! This is abuse!

M: Oh! Oh I see!

A: Aha! No, you want room 12A, next door.

M: Oh...Sorry...

A: Not at all!

Anonymous NRx20 February 16, 2015 11:11 AM  

Of course, NRx had this solution in hand.... 3 years ago. Nice of Vox-Gay to finally keep up with Twitter from 2013. Fact is, the Jew is using The Black as muscle against you. And you are left there helpless. Well, what are you going to do about it, Whitey? Just sit there? Of course not! You are going to join with us. Get on Twitter and join us in NRx. An organization of decent, law abiding white folk. Just like you!

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 11:12 AM  

Alexander,

"I'm not inclined to look for reasons to break the solution."

Neither am I, and hopefully Netanyahu succeeds in convincing as many Jews as possible to make aliyah. It's a win-win solution for both parties. If he won't convince them, they will be convinced by other means.

Anonymous Samuel Scott February 16, 2015 11:15 AM  

Doom,

The only Islamic country that has "the bomb" is Pakistan, and they're surely more concerned with India.

However, if Iran does get the bomb, I'd be counting down the days until Egypt and Saudi Arabia get it too in response (Sunni vs. Shi'a).

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 11:22 AM  

Hebraeus eunt domus.

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 11:25 AM  

Stilicho and others,

What you should have in mind when trying to analyze Jewish behavior is the majority-minority angle. It's not about which religion/ideology is worse for Jews: Christianity, Paganism, Islam, or Communism. No. It's about which religion/ideology is dominant; what unites the majority and excludes the minority. So one shouldn't be astonished seeing Jews promoting Jew-hating Muslims at the expense of Jew-neutral Christians; since the threatening majority is Christian, this strategy makes sense to many Jews.

In the following decades we shall see how this strategy plays out in the long term.

Anonymous Daniel February 16, 2015 11:26 AM  

Being a weaker party, the Jews are usually in the position of trying to play both sides against the other. So, the other side correctly takes them out in order to not leave an enemy ally at their rear.

"In class and ideological conflicts, the key question was "Which side are you on?" and people could and did choose sides and change
sides. In conflicts between civilizations, the question is "What are you?" That is a given that cannot be changed."

Q: What are you?
A: I'm...I'm...I'm not a rabbit. Really I'm not.
Q: Yeah, right. About those ears...

Anonymous The other skeptic February 16, 2015 11:26 AM  

Because they believed that Europeans, upon becoming secular and even liberal, have "changed", so they can be trusted not to persecute their Jews neighbors. Quite a bitter lesson it was.

Well, in truth they forgot that their penchant for financial shenanigans and for meddling in the host country's culture (eg, enacting laws to prevent blow-back from their other activities) would lead to much antipathy towards them.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 11:26 AM  

Expulsions, pogroms, economic restrictions, blood libels, Inquisition, more expulsions, more pogroms, holocaust. Is that enough?

No.
Expulsions? Sorry your guest visa has expired please move along.

Economic restrictions? Sorry, you can't be farmers. To the bank/jewelery store/craft shop with you!

Blood libels? Y'all suck. Really bad. So there! Sticks and stones....

Pogroms? Ah, now we're getting somewhere. I asked for specifics, give me times, places, body counts.

Inquisition? Ditto. Please add the numbers of Christians considered heretics that were subjected to the inquisition for comparison.

Holocaust? 1) Not Christian, 2) explicitly socialist. Might as well add in Stalin's murders of Jews because he was a student at a Christian seminary.

very Jewish in nature so it can be rationalized, at least as long as Jews lead the way

Well, it would be foolish, but man is a rationalizing creature. "It's ok as long as other Jews are murdering Jews (socialists in Russia), but it's bad if non-Jews are murdering Jews (socialists in Germany)."

Anonymous JACK February 16, 2015 11:30 AM  

I don't blame the Jews for wanting to abandon the continent after the tragedy with the Germans last century. What would worry me is that, with so many Jews concentrated in Israel, is that a single decent nuclear device would eradicate most of Jewry in the Mideast and Europe.
If that happens I suppose there are still the Jews elsewhere particularly here in the USA.

Anonymous jack February 16, 2015 11:31 AM  

Opps, that last comment should have profile of jack not the caps.

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 11:34 AM  

We need our own Netanyahu's and to purge the Vox Days.

A bit late for that. Furthermore, you appear to have forgotten that I am Native American.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 11:35 AM  

@Jack, you may be correct that it is a minority vs majority thing rather than any rational assessment. That's where I think your rational historical explanation falls short: to be historically, rationally based it must be true. The incidence of pogroms, inquisitions, are greatly exaggerated in the popular mythos, so they don't satisfy the truth component. Which brings us to rationalization instead of reason if enough Jews simply believe the myths.

Anonymous Daniel February 16, 2015 11:36 AM  

Why did so many Jews remain in Germany in the 30's?

Faith in the labor theory of value.

Anonymous RFJ February 16, 2015 11:36 AM  

"Hebraeus eunt domus."

Hebrews they go the house?

Blogger Jack Truman February 16, 2015 11:39 AM  

"No.
Expulsions? Sorry your guest visa has expired please move along.

Economic restrictions? Sorry, you can't be farmers. To the bank/jewelery store/craft shop with you!

Blood libels? Y'all suck. Really bad. So there! Sticks and stones....

Pogroms? Ah, now we're getting somewhere. I asked for specifics, give me times, places, body counts.

Inquisition? Ditto. Please add the numbers of Christians considered heretics that were subjected to the inquisition for comparison.

Holocaust? 1) Not Christian, 2) explicitly socialist. Might as well add in Stalin's murders of Jews because he was a student at a Christian seminary."

But history itself doesn't matter; its perception does. Jews perceive the Christian/White world as inherently hostile. Was not Israel occupied by Whites two millennia ago, who then expelled the Jews? But even if this whole account is fake, the Jews believe it is true, and are guided by it.

You can economically/morally/aesthetically rationalize all actions of Europeans against Jews (and vice versa), but the fact remains that Jews have traditionally perceived themselves as victims of Christian, White hatred. Is it true? How much of it is true? 100% irrelevant.

Holocaust was White, and committed/abetted by many devoted (White) Christians even though Hitler could be an atheist (and he wasn't). These are Whites killing Jews, and that's what's important here.

"Well, it would be foolish, but man is a rationalizing creature. "It's ok as long as other Jews are murdering Jews (socialists in Russia), but it's bad if non-Jews are murdering Jews (socialists in Germany).""

If Stalin didn't purge many Jews, many could have been saved; and many have indeed been saved, in fact, when he died prematurely. Socialism does not necessitate the murder of Jews qua Jews, so this whole discussion is moot.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 11:44 AM  

Hebrews they go the house?

Monty Python, Life of Brian

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 11:45 AM  

Faith in the labor theory of value.

FTW!

Anonymous Hrw500 February 16, 2015 11:46 AM  

A bit off-topic, I saw this post Mike Smith's political commentairy where a commenter talked about a guy named Siener van Rensburg from South Africa who did some predictions about Europe. It could be interesting to compare it with Tom Kratman's predictions in his novel "Caliphate".

Could be possible then Benjamin Netanyahu had heard of Siener's predictions or is it just a coincidence?

Anonymous Anubis February 16, 2015 12:11 PM  

"There's a separate marketing push to brand Tel Aviv as the gay capital of the world -- Gay Pride Day here is huge -- and an island of freedom for gays and lesbians." "Given its area, topography, and economic infrastructure, what size population can Israel sustain?"

Perhaps these are related and they plan to give the Dutch competition for the land of Dykes title. But the real question is do they really want bacon eating gay secular Jews moving there, since only the religious are breeding it might not work out for any gays that live long enough to grow old.

Anonymous An Israeli February 16, 2015 12:38 PM  

Anubis,

The religious are not the only one multiplying in Israel. Among secular Jews the birth rate is close to 3 and rising.

Blogger CarpeOro February 16, 2015 12:40 PM  

First pogrom of Jews in Europe? Muslim Cordoba for the win. A second Muslim pogrom was the reason a number of Jews joined William of Normandy when he invaded England in 1066. Reason for the pogroms? The Jews that had aided them in conquering most of Spain were no longer needed. They were removing a group they worried might turn on them also in time. Not to mention the usual Muslim motivation: looting the Jews that had grown wealth in the slave trade (of Christians of course).

Blogger Joshua Dyal February 16, 2015 12:40 PM  

But the real question is do they really want bacon eating gay secular Jews moving there, since only the religious are breeding it might not work out for any gays that live long enough to grow old.

I've never heard any report from any credible source that Israel is a particularly religious country.

Anonymous Anubis February 16, 2015 12:42 PM  

"In class and ideological conflicts, the key question was "Which side are you on?" and people could and did choose sides and change
sides. In conflicts between civilizations, the question is "What are you?" That is a given that cannot be changed."

This would be why Jews pushed for non-jews to be circumcised after WWII using false data from black African tribes. They held "small arm checks" to catch escaping jews, and since they where the only men circumcised they couldn't lie about it.

Anonymous Anubis February 16, 2015 12:57 PM  

"I've never heard any report from any credible source that Israel is a particularly religious country."

The point is that only the religious Jews are breeding, & that secular Jews complain that they don't serve in the military. In fact Samuel Scott said above about religious/Orthodox Jews "let them sponge off the taxpayers and not work while also avoiding army service after high school." If one side keeps having kids while the other has abortions +death in battle which side will win?

Bacon eating gay/lesbian jews don't breed but look at what several children of LGBTQQSTIRLEK said coming out against gay marriage.
http://therightscoop.com/children-of-homosexuals-speak-out-against-same-sex-marriage-tell-of-unpleasant-upbringings/
"Dawn Stefanowicz said her gay father was so preoccupied with sex that when she was in high school and brought home a male classmate, both her father and his lover propositioned him for sex."

"the gay community has never in my lifetime put children first as anything other than a piece of property, a past mistake or a political tool to be dressed up and taken out as part of a dog-and-pony show to impress the well-meaning,”




Blogger JohnG February 16, 2015 12:57 PM  

"Forget the bromide about how generals are always fighting the last war, right now, the politicians and their military advisors are mostly caught up in entirely fictional theater based on a geopolitical structure that has very little relation to either the current reality or the global wars of the future." Vox

I don't think that's it, precisely. I taught Army Captains, and what you can get out of them in private is entirely different than what the official party line is. Especially the ones that did a few tours in Iraq and Afghanistan. The guys in leadership now are the guys that got in the service at the same time I did - I don't think the majority of them are stupid or unobservant, but they are all politicians in the Flag Officer ranks, and all have that $10,000/mo. retirement and juicy consulting position hanging over their head if any of them have a Freudian moment of honesty (McChrystal)...

Interestingly, the last QDR (I think, maybe the one prior) suggested that Counterinsurgency would be the future as far as the eye could see... but in 2012, leadership starting back-burnering COIN and pushing everybody back to big conventional operations. Everybody at the conferences was saying "what?" - The administration is going to dictate strategy regardless of reality, and leadership is going to say "yes, sir, three bags full!" Having said all that, ours and Western Europes provocation of Putin, might make training to Fulda Gap scenarios a good idea.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 1:15 PM  

"Jew, go home!"

A phrase that's not just for anti-Semites anymore. Who cares what the reasons are (i.e. Jew-hatred in Europe, rise of Islam, European nationalism, etc. ) the message to us should still be clear and it is a message we ignore at our peril. Bibi is not the only voice in wilderness:

"When all these blessings and curses I have set before you come on you and you take them to heart wherever the L-rd your G-d disperses you among the nations, and when you and your children return to the L-rd your G-d and obey him with all your heart and with all your soul according to everything I command you today, then the L-rd your G-d will restore your fortunes[a] and have compassion on you and gather you again from all the nations where he scattered you. Even if you have been banished to the most distant land under the heavens, from there the L-rd your G-d will gather you and bring you back. He will bring you to the land that belonged to your ancestors, and you will take possession of it. He will make you more prosperous and numerous than your ancestors."

"The L-rd your G-d will circumcise your hearts and the hearts of your descendants, so that you may love him with all your heart and with all your soul, and live. The L-rd your G-d will put all these curses on your enemies who hate and persecute you. You will again obey the L-rd and follow all his commands I am giving you today."

"Then the L-rd your G-d will make you most prosperous in all the work of your hands and in the fruit of your womb, the young of your livestock and the crops of your land. The Lord will again delight in you and make you prosperous, just as he delighted in your ancestors, if you obey the L-rd your G-d and keep his commands and decrees that are written in this Book of the Law and turn to the L-rd your G-d with all your heart and with all your soul." (cf. Deut. 30)

To an earlier comment about why Jews stayed in Germany. Short answer: we have a history of mistakenly thinking that we can assimilate ourselves into safety and that our assimilation will provide us immunity from being persecuted by our host countries. Assimilation and forsaking the Torah is why we are scattered hither and yon in the first place, how is more assimilation and disobedience going to ameliorate our situation in exile? This illusion that the nations will accept us the more we become like them continues to be our undoing. When assimilation fails us, we organize, cry "Never again!', lobby, and legislate protections for ourselves, which only serves to make us more of a stench in the nostrils of our host countries for all the wrong reasons.

Two plus two is still four, and if we continue to insist otherwise, G-d will see to it that the nations will give us a remedial course in basic mathematics.

Anonymous Tim N February 16, 2015 1:32 PM  

Vox,
A claim like "and to the USA by idiotically encouraging third world immigration in a foolish attempt to protect themselves against Christians who never had any intention of harming them." needs some serious evidence backing it up.

As a matter of face, it was you who also said that the Jews encouraged the Muslims to try to sack Spain again and the murder of many at Otranto.

But, when have you actually supported these claims?
Saying them is one thing, the Jews encouraged immigration to the US/the Jews enflamed the Muslim resolve to reconquer Spain, but proving them is vastly another thing.

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 1:50 PM  

needs some serious evidence backing it up.

It has serious evidence backing it up. You can go find it yourself if you like. It's not my job to educate you.

But, when have you actually supported these claims?

I don't need to support those claims. It is a well-known historical fact recorded in the Jewish Encyclopedia that the Jews encouraged the Muslims to invade Spain again. Guy Gavriel Kay even draws upon that in his novel The Lions of al-Rassan. The Jews had nothing to do with the massacre at Otranto.

You know nothing about Jewish history. And that's not my problem. You should probably learn to shut the hell up when the educated people are talking. Perhaps you would learn something.

Blogger Akulkis February 16, 2015 1:51 PM  

"FTR I would support Israel in a more vocal fashion if they would ship their Galils to this country so I could buy one."

I'm sure they are more than willing to do so.
The problem is that Congress has banned the importation of firearms except for those used by military. (M67 LAW and its successor, the AT4 are both imported from Sweden)

Blogger Danby February 16, 2015 1:56 PM  

Oh, how cute!
TimN wants to pull "rules of the blog" on the blog owner!

This stuff has been gone over and over here. If you were not party to the conversation, don't deny it happened. If you were, then you're an obtuse and dishonest hack. Even the Jews here have acknowledged that Jews do encourage and have encouraged limitless immigration of non-European populations to the US and Western Europe.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 2:13 PM  

If it's okay to make a law that it's illegal to deny the Holocaust, I expect someday soon it will be illegal to deny that the Jews were supportive on the Islamic invasion of Europe.

And how could any forward thinking individual have a problem with that?

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 2:19 PM  

That wouldn't make tactical sense. NOTHING makes the Average Joe think, "hmm... I wonder what they are hiding about the Holocaus" like that law. It's probably the absolute number one favorite thing in the world for every antisemite out there.

Anonymous Sam the Man February 16, 2015 2:20 PM  

Rabbi B

האם אתה אגוזים?

Actually as I think about the deeper meaning of your post, you may have something there. But there is a problem I see:

If a Jew is openly successful in a nation and does not assimilate, takes care of his own and keeps to his own, he and his family becomes a target. The fact is a lot of eastern European prejudice towards Jews was because of the unreformed nature of the successful Jewish society in their midst.

Now In Germany prior to WWI, and in Holland and Denmark, The Jews were for the most part assimilated. Heck the reformed movement came out of those areas. But that did not save them when things went to heck in 1939…..So in that I see your point. But as I read the accounts of why folks developed hostility towards Jews it was because of a supposed non assimilation of Jews into the larger society. So the Gentiles thought Jews favored their own religion over the nation they lived in and did not, when the nationalist wars began, truly commit themselves to the nations they lived in but held themselves apart and above the fray, while profiting from it. A slur no doubt but like any slur there are isolated facts that would support that argument if one were looking to reinforce preconceived notions.

In essence you are saying the only hope is for Jews to migrate back to Israeli. I think there is another way; like that we have in America. One can be an American and a Jew. There is no conflict in that, just and a person can be American and a Methodist or a Catholic. The private faith of an individual and the public life can be separate. The prime requirement of course is that the persons loyalty be to the US and our nation, not some abstract view of Jews as a separate people who hold themselves apart from the rest of their countrymen (US ones that is). I suppose this is a double reformed Jew, but do you not see this as a possibility?

Anonymous harry12 February 16, 2015 2:24 PM  

Some Galils are offered for sale; quite costly.

Blogger MATT February 16, 2015 2:26 PM  

Sam the Man, come to NYC and tell me Jews keep to themselves.

Jews want to be with Jews. Chinese with Chinese and so forth.

It doesnt matter what your theory is. History tells a different story and in that story, Jews overstay their welcome no.matter where they go. Orthodox or pornstar. They're Jews and their religion isn't even the glue. It's just a base.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 2:40 PM  

I don't believe that western European Jews were assimilated. They may have been more so than other Jews, but I don't think Jews really know what the word means. Understandable, y'all being a tiny group that has had to fight to maintain its culture, ethnicity, and religion... but yeah.

Documentation just isn't that thorough in the average guy's life before computers, and all you need is a good flood or war or fire coming through your town and records getting destroyed, or some local clerk misfiling and misspelling or smudging his ink to muck things up. If Jews *really* wanted to assimilate, they could move to a city, spread out from each other, adopt the culture of the gentiles, marry the gentiles, lose the last name that gives the game away for miles around, abandon circumcision, become Christians, and call it a day.

Or did you think you could assimilate by not doing those things?

Jews never assimilated. They may have 'secularized' or reformed or whatever it is that Jews say other Jews did, I don't know. But I do know that when I look with my own lying eyes at what Jews today claim means assimilation when they stick out so obviously its comical... I can only imagine it was exactly the same 100 years ago.

Non-assimilation is fine; believe me, I look at most of the world and feel pretty damn grateful that I'm an Anglo-Saxon: I certainly don't want to have to try and pass as something else. But you won't get anywhere insisting you were really, really, good at hiding and everyone else is to blame for not making you feel at home.

Blogger Dewave February 16, 2015 2:42 PM  

"I didn't say that France would have failed but that the Republic would have. The French Republic has certain ideals and those would be exposed as illusions, not to say delusions, should the Jews, all or most or even many of them, would be driven out"

Nice attempt to shift the goalposts. First you assert the republic will fail if jews leave, then when called upon that statement, attempt to shift to talking about them being driven out.

It is immediately obvious that a foreign group choosing to leave voluntarily cannot possibly Mean the failure of the french republic. Depending on the group, a forced departure may not either.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 2:44 PM  

Markku,

True. But that doesn't mean it won't happen. I think the hate/blasphemy/denial speech laws are going to swing back against the original creators, if for no other reason that they are so reviled, a large number of people of going to gleefully turn the weapon around... even if the better case were to dismantle it.

Blogger Danby February 16, 2015 3:12 PM  

"It is immediately obvious that a foreign group choosing to leave voluntarily cannot possibly Mean the failure of the french republic. Depending on the group, a forced departure may not either."

That is not immediately obvious at all.
The Vme Republique was founded following the Algerian War, and one of the aims was to prove the universality of the ideals of the Republic, the elaboration of the Revolutionary ideal of Eglite'.
Of course, the original ideal of Egalite' was that the peasant and working classes were equal to nobility and royalty, that the station of one's birth were irrelevant to Justice and should be irrelevant to Law, as they were acknowledged to be irrelevant to God. That the the poor and the rich were equally French, and equally endowed with rights, and equally entitled to the protection of the French law.

In the 60's the 4th Republic failed largely due to the fallout of the Algerian War. The elites convinced themselves that the reason that the war happened was because they had not assimilated Algeria sufficiently into the life of the country. So they set out to prove that they weren't Nazis by inviting essentially all of North Africa into their country, especially Moroccan Jews, on an equal basis with the native French.
It still mystifies the French intellectual classes that the Algerians, Tunisians, and Moroccans haven't become French yet. But they blame it on the lower class French, and double down. Because doubling down is the only possible response to failure.
When the semi-multicultural experiment fails, as it is in the process of doing, the Republique itself will be seen to have failed, and the French will replace it with something else.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 3:13 PM  

"If a Jew is openly successful in a nation and does not assimilate, takes care of his own and keeps to his own, he and his family becomes a target. The fact is a lot of eastern European prejudice towards Jews was because of the unreformed nature of the successful Jewish society in their midst."

And I would argue that this is exactly how we should be behaving in our host countries. And I certainly concede your assertion that Jews who are behaving themselves may still find themselves to be targets (i.e. Daniel, Mordechai, Esther, etc.). Yet, regardless of how we are treated, the fact remains, we will always be guests, and as guests there are simply no guarantees, and I am not so sure that the guests have any grounds for re-writing the rules when the host chooses to behave badly towards us. It's still his house at the end of the day.

If we refuse to leave when it is clear we are no longer welcome, we must be prepared to suffer, and to suffer well, or we can simply leave - especially now that we have a homeland to which we can return and that Israel is willing to spend tens of millions of dollars to help with our return.

I do not believe, however, that the nations are off the hook completely. I believe that G-d has a long memory, and that the nations will be held accountable, not by us, but by G-d for how the Jews were treated. Our job is simply to remain faithful to our calling, come what may, and seek only the good of all the nations to where we have been scattered.

"But as I read the accounts of why folks developed hostility towards Jews it was because of a supposed non assimilation of Jews into the larger society."

I have no doubt that this is the perspective of many. But my question remains: How did our assimilation, which birthed the Reform movement in 19th century Germany, work for the welfare of our host nations? If we are honest, were we really not just seeking our own welfare at the end of the day?

In the book of Esther, the stated premise for our persecution which became state policy was that there was a people scattered throughout the kingdom of Persia whose laws and traditions were not like the Persians etc. That we were set a aprt. And yet, Mordechai, when he learned of a plot to assassinate the King, saw to it that the King's life was preserved. Even when Esther approached with her request, she stated that if the decree had only been to enslave the Jews, she would not have bothered the King with any request. She was also under no illusions that her request that her life and the lives of her people would be spared. (If I perish, I perish . . . )

My point is that both Mordechai and Esther were seeking the welfare of Persia, and I believe that G-d honored them and this was evidenced by the great deliverance he wrought for us during that time. Mordechai remained very much set apart, and yet ended up being highly exalted for remaining faithful. The same can be said of Daniel.

"One can be an American and a Jew."

I disagree. One can live as an American and be a Jew. We are guests and our calling is irrevocable. I sense that our welcome is wearing thin, and it's not productive to wring our hands and sit around lamenting why this is so. It's time to start packing - the sooner the better. A wise man sees trouble coming and plans accordingly.

If we insist on chartering a boat to Tarshish, contrary to G-d's wishes, it is only a matter of time before we find ourselves tossed overboard by the ones with whom we sought refuge.

The problem, as I see it through my limited perspective, is that we are ultimately seeking refuge from G-d and our collective and individual responsibility to Him; but He cares far too much for us and for His great Name to let us continue misrepresenting Him in this world. Assimilation always begins with a rejection of His Torah, and that has never turned out well for us - ever.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 3:13 PM  

Well, as of early 2014 it's already illegal in Russia to "denigrate Russia's Second World War record", punishable by up to five years in jail.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 3:17 PM  

They talk a good, Christian game, but those kind of things tell me that they still are as much Russkies as ever.

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 3:21 PM  

In essence you are saying the only hope is for Jews to migrate back to Israeli. I think there is another way; like that we have in America. One can be an American and a Jew

France tried that first. How is that working out? Unless you're willing to renounce all allegiance to Israel, you can't be an American. Now, you can legally, just as Boris Johnson can legally be Prime Minister of Britain and President of the USA, which shows how ridiculous the legal concept of "dual citizenship" is.

Anonymous Sam the Man February 16, 2015 3:34 PM  

Matt,

Thanks for the comment but this was a serious question for the Rabbi.

But to your point, New York is a special case; the folks up there are living in la-la liberal land. Same is true of North Jersey and Connecticut. In the rest of the country, short of ultra-orthodox and orthodox communities I am not so sure that is the case. Between the military services and various social organizations that are nonsectarian based I think assimilation works quite well. Heck I belong to a Gun club in what some would see as the edge of pennsl-tucky and I have not run into any raving anti-Semites here. Not once in nearly 25 years. So I think assimilation can be a success.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 3:42 PM  

"I don't believe that western European Jews were assimilated.'

It doesn't matter. The point is, we worked hard to be accepted everywhere, no matter the price.

"They may have been more so than other Jews, but I don't think Jews really know what the word means."

In 19th century Europe (primarily Germany) it was called 'Emancipation', and it meant adapting to the European-Christian culture as much as we possibly could so that we could benefit from it as much as we possibly could. We changed our prayer-books to model Christian hymnals, we introduced choirs into our synagogues, we lobbied the civil authorities to outlaw the study of Talmud and Jewish day schools, etc.

This entire period of enthusiastic and coveted "Emancipation" would serve to lay much of the groundwork for the inevitable suffering that European Jewry would endure beginning in the 1930s. The "emancipation" would ironically undermine the very objectives its advocates and faithful adherents had sought to achieve. We sought "emancipation" only to end up as slaves behind barbed wire once again.

Anonymous not seeing it February 16, 2015 3:43 PM  

"the L-rd your G-d"

This ain't Wheel of Fortune. Using vowels doesn't cost $200 here.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 3:48 PM  

Hahaha, I had conjecture about that "G-d" thing, but I just checked it up, and I would NEVER have guessed that explanation

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 3:50 PM  

"This ain't Wheel of Fortune. Using vowels doesn't cost $200 here."

Just goes to show you how cheap I am.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 3:52 PM  

@ not seeing it

Good one ...

Anonymous zen0 February 16, 2015 3:58 PM  

@ Rabbi B

I sense that our welcome is wearing thin, and it's not productive to wring our hands and sit around lamenting why this is so. It's time to start packing - the sooner the better. A wise man sees trouble coming and plans accordingly.

I was at a lunch a couple of weeks ago with a man whose family left Germany in the 30's and came to America. When he was 5, the Brown Shirts would gather near his house and sing the Horst Wessel Lied (song) about the Nazi martyr. They would do this and march up and down the street with a couple of stops for a speech or two.
He says he can still sing it to this day (I was afraid he might start doing so in the restaurant.).

Anyway, his parents left and became doctors in the US and got rich.

Anonymous Sam the Man February 16, 2015 3:58 PM  

Rabbi B

Thanks for your response, not what I wanted to hear but I will ponder your words.

If what you say it true and I fear it might be, than what is an assimilated Jew to do? What if one feels that one is more at home in American culture than in Jerusalem, despite any prayers to the effect of “next year in Jerusalem”? As an example, let’s say a Northern European Jew likes guns like the European stock does; well you cannot practically own them in Israeli. Yes I know that the cultural tradition of arms in Israeli is one of they are tools, not objects of value, but the fact is there might be sufficient blood or cultural ties from the European time to give one a decidedly American view on the topic of guns and ownership of same. Given that one area (as an example), I can say a fellow can be Jewish and an American with full allegiance to America. So… by your reasoning if a chap prefers it here in the US of A because of something like that is he no longer a “real” Jew? If the orthodox and ultra-orthodox get to define what is Jewish, there will be a lot of Jews without a home. It seems to me one of the problems of Judaism on the real level is folks see those less observant as a bunch of heretics and those more observant as a bunch of zealots. I guess it has always been so, at least since the 18th century.

I still do not see the US as hostile to Jews. Quite the contrary.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:00 PM  

Except, I see some serious mission creep here. I mean, didn't you guys substitute adonai for YHWH precisely to avoid saying His name? And now "Lord" - that exact word - is the name too? I can see where this is going. Like with euphemisms, you are going to constantly run away from the "naminess" looming in the horizon, and keep on jumping to the next one. I mean, if Lord has already acquired it, then what's to prevent L-rd from acquiring it by that very same logic. And now you can't delete nor erase that either.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 4:02 PM  

Heck I belong to a Gun club in what some would see as the edge of pennsl-tucky and I have not run into any raving anti-Semites here. Not once in nearly 25 years.

No one outside of Abe Foxman or Morris Dees would expect to find it there and even they don't really believe it's there, they just find it convenient (and lucrative) to do so. If you want to see anti-semitism in the U.S. just visit the local DNC headquarters, the Berkley campus, Dearborn, or the DailyKos blog...you'll find plenty.

So I think assimilation can be a success.

Unless you're willing to renounce all allegiance to Israel, you can't be an American.

I would add that you must also renounce allegiance to Jews as a group separate from Americans within the U.S. as well or you're just transferring your allegiance from Tel Aviv to Brooklyn.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:08 PM  

"If what you say it true and I fear it might be, than what is an assimilated Jew to do?'

Just try to absorb the fact that your assimilated status is not a guarantee for your safety. History should be enough of a warning, rather than your inability to interpret the present situation in the US. The question comes down to WHO YOU ARE. As it is going now, ISIS and the rest of the world could care less if you daven shacharis or hit a Chinese restaurant on Christmas - unless you are going to change your name and reinvent your identity completely, the host is going to make his wishes known and it will become clear how unwelcome you really are.

Have you ever spent any time in Israel?

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:12 PM  

The European branch of our family dates it's open to the reign of Louis 14. Jews are both European and Christian in some cases. If you insist on being tribal, then take care of your own and leave us alone. European Jews can handle themselves just fine without your help or advice. Every time you Anglo Saxon Christians try to tell us what to do, we end up getting hurt. If you think that's going to happen again then you not well measured our resources.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:16 PM  

@Markku

The hyphenated forms are just a way to demonstrating respect (in writing) for a Name that is revered. I don't believe that my hand will fall off if I write Lord or God, but I understand and appreciate the origins of the tradition and so it is a tradition that I respect and try to honor whever I can. Perhaps it could be considered somewhat akin to capitalizing pronouns when referring to God or His Son. (I don't know that Greek had capital letters to achieve this - but we do it in English anyway).

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:18 PM  

Well, that's what I guessed. But I guessed wrong. Actually it turned out that if you Rabbis write "Lord" or "God" to any document, physical or electronic, then you have to either archive it indefinitely or bury it in a cemetary. If you use the dash, then it's not the proper name, and you can delete it.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:19 PM  

"Unless you're willing to renounce all allegiance to Israel, you can't be an American. "

This just goes to show how shallow and uninformed is your understanding of both Jews and America.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:20 PM  

"Every time you Anglo Saxon Christians try to tell us what to do, we end up getting hurt."

How are we going to get hurt by going home and living among our own?

"If you think that's going to happen again then you not well measured our resources."

How well did that go for us 80 years ago?

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:23 PM  

"As it is going now, ISIS and the rest of the world could care less if you daven shacharis or hit a Chinese restaurant on Christmas - unless you are going to change your name and reinvent your identity completely, the host is going to make his wishes known and it will become clear how unwelcome you really are."

I'd bet dollars to bagels you are no rabbi. Further, you think Isis and "the rest of the world" is equatable? What a fucking stooge.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 4:24 PM  

Every time you Anglo Saxon Christians try to tell us what to do, we end up getting hurt.

What are you talking about?

Jews are both European and Christian in some cases

Well, they are half Italian by all accounts. And Rabbi B does believe that Jesus is the messiah...

European Jews can handle themselves just fine without your help or advice.

What, the red man isn't even allowed to agree with Bibi? But how is hurting you even possible given this statement:

If you think that's going to happen again then you not well measured our resources. ???\

Sometimes being the Chosen People means that you are chosen for an ass-whuppin' because you are an obstinate, pig-headed people who waste time arguing with God instead of following his commands. Personally, I don't have any particular desire to be standing next to the guy holding a lightning rod and arguing with God during a thunderstorm.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:24 PM  

Actually it turned out that if you Rabbis write "Lord" or "God" to any document, physical or electronic, then you have to either archive it indefinitely or bury it in a cemetary.

Certainly. Another aspect which further augments the 'reverence' point. We are concerned, lest His name be defaced, even inadvertently.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 4:25 PM  

Rabbi B,

The key I think is, "as much as we possibly could."

Sure, you may have made Synagogue more like Church... but assimilation would have had you abandon the Synagogue entirely *and go to an actual church*.

Assimilation means that when the guys with pitchforks and torches looking for the Jews, they go "Hey, let's go get Josh, he's our buddy and I bet he'd help us out." not, "Hey, let's leave Josh alone even when we do this because he's a great guy."

Assimilation is none of your neighbors even knowing that your grandparents were Jews, because it never crosses your mind to care about it yourself, let alone share it with anyone.

I don't think Jews should do that. You don't think Jews should do that. But if Jews insist on doing it, I'd like to give them a heads up that what they thought was a really good way of blending with the gentiles... really wasn't.

So Sam the Man, if you want to be an American, be an American. And by that, unless you tell me otherwise, what you really mean is you want to be an Anglo-Saxon.

Well then: don't celebrate Jewish holidays, don't go to synagogue. Don't mention even casually in conversation about your Jewish mother doing Jewish mother things. Don't turn politics into all about Israel, don't base things on is it good for the Jews.

In short, think about your Jewish heritage as much as you think about the half-Swahili, half-Ainu parts of your heritage.

If it sounds emotionally painful, it's because it is. Rabbi B is right to tell you it's a mistake.

Berezof... and yet you insist on moving to places with heavy concentration of Anglo-Saxons. Funny, that.

And yes, tell us more about the immeasurable quantity of your 'resources'.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 4:26 PM  

If you insist on being tribal, then take care of your own and leave us alone.

Physician, heal thyself.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:26 PM  

"I'd bet dollars to bagels you are no rabbi.'

Yeah, I get that a lot when folks won't speak to my comments.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:27 PM  

But that reasoning leads to the very problem I mentioned. "Lord" is not His name - it is an earlier attempt at AVOIDING His name. If that has already "contracted" the name, then L-rd will do it by that very same logic.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:27 PM  

"How are we going to get hurt by going home and living among our own? "

I am home and I do live among my own.


"How well did that go for us 80 years ago?"
Who gives a shit. If you think 2015 is 1938 then you need to get back in your old fetal position and not bother anyone with your thoughts.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:30 PM  

Soon you'll be writing an md5 sum of "---d"

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:31 PM  

"Physician, heal thyself."

Jews don't kill Christians how to be Christians or where to live. So shut the fuck up.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:33 PM  

Jews don't kill Christians

You should stop thinking about killing Christians at least while you're commenting. It just leads to Freudian slips.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:35 PM  

""Lord" is not His name"

But it is the English equivalent. Hebrew words can be spelled defectively if necessary. The hypenated version or writing "Elokim" instead of "Elohim" is just a way of spelling defectively in English to convey the same idea that is expressed when doing so in Hebrew.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:36 PM  

"And yes, tell us more about the immeasurable quantity of your 'resources'."

They are such that the majority of people in the world over have vowed to never let Nazi Germany happen again.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:37 PM  

But it is the English equivalent.

No, it is the English equivalent of adonai, which was the very word you used in place of YHWH. And by the exact same reasoning as Christians used Lord (or LORD in all caps in KJV time).

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:40 PM  

Markku, you have no integrity.

Blogger Rek. February 16, 2015 4:40 PM  

10 Hours of Walking in Paris as a Jew

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AltyhmrIFgo#t=86

Some sort of pity contest ... Gamma tops.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:41 PM  

That's ok, because integration has failed anyway

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:43 PM  

No, it is the English equivalent of adonai . . .

That's fine. Anything other than Hebrew is going to be inadequate when we are dealing with transliterations. As I mentioned, substitutes for "the name", such as Hashem, Adonai, etc. other than the un-pronouncable name that could only be uttered by the High Priest once a year, are common in the Hebrew. Again the hyphenation-tradition, if you will, is an attempt to convey the same idea.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:44 PM  

@Berezof

Do you live in Israel?

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:45 PM  

Well, I say "Yahweh" whenever there might be any confusion. And with THAT, I would perhaps be a bit careful in what context I say it. But I should think I'm pretty safe with "God" and "Lord", as they already serve that very purpose.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 16, 2015 4:46 PM  

Basically this is the old Zionist ploy to get other jews to move to Israel, much ado about nothing except who moves up the Left's hierarchy muslims up jews down.

Even Drudge put the Christian beheading up above the usual some jew got called a bad name in Paris story, so that is the big story.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 4:47 PM  

Really, the majority of people in the world?

A billion Chinamen, all particularly giving a shit about the Holocaust? A billion Indians.

Billion+ Muslims on the planet who if they agree the Holocaust happened don't see it as a bad thing.

And frankly, nobody's wringing any hands over the Armenians, Rwanda, or Ukraine, so I don't think there's anything special about not giving two shits about atrocities happening to someone else.

As to never again, too late. Jews are observably being driven out of Europe. If the multicultural parade continues, those who do not will no longer be in Europe but under it.

But you are of course correct: as an Anglo-Saxon, whether your people live or are systematically slaughtered in car-load lots is absolutely none of my concern. No doubt you have the resources to take stock of the matter at hand.

Anonymous Berezof. February 16, 2015 4:48 PM  

Rabbi BFebruary 16, 2015 4:44 PM
@Berezof

Do you live in Israel?"

No. Where are you a Rabbi and why do you attempt to disempowerJews by telling lies and siding with the anti Semites?

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 16, 2015 4:50 PM  

Crossing over into spamming territory, but let me mention that since graffiti is in the news how about the Crusader's Cross becoming the next piece of street art? Even the people who own Viking Tactics have it in their lineup, shit I like it guns and crosses and fuck the politically correct.

Anonymous Sam the Man February 16, 2015 4:52 PM  

Quote

Unless you're willing to renounce all allegiance to Israel, you can't be an American.

Unquote

Hmmmm………..Not sure I agree. Let’s say a Jewish American would refuse to go to war against Israeli if the US declared war on Israel. It does not make him not an American to refuse to go to war if he thinks it is wrong. All loyalty is conditional. If you ask a Catholic will he go help conquer the Vatican he would say no (at least I would expect him to). Same thing for an Anglican if you asked him to lead an air-raid to help firebomb Westminster cathedral, he likely would not so it. There are proper limits to one’s loyalty to any secular authority and loyalty to G-d (or principle from that source) comes first, or should. If you put the nation ahead of principle, you have just made the state your living G-d. Ponder that.


Rabbi B.

In truth to the real nature of your question….. no. That is, no possibility of getting the feel of the country outside of El Haifa and Jerusalem. Given that one could not get the feel or gist of the US by just seeing New York and long island, the same is true of Israel. But one need not spend much time in Jerusalem, after the experience of the western wall , well it is a harsh existence. The settlements around Jerusalem are very bleak; it is like living in a barracks state, with all the check points and security measures. Frankly the Arab males sitting around during the week doing nothing is an image that does not sit well either. I don’t see how one could be anything but a rabid nationalist, based on very limited knowledge of Jerusalem and the surrounding settlements. Never seen Masada, the Dead Sea, the hills above Jerusalem (always wanted to see the road carved to get to Jerusalem in the 48 war) or the north, where I am told there are some actual trees. I am afraid that the time in Europe left my kin with a real affection for trees and foliage you can walk through. The desert, be it outside of San Diego, Israel or Arizona just does not work for me. I feel much more at home in Sweden, Switzerland or in Pennsylvania.

Blogger Danby February 16, 2015 4:53 PM  

@Berezof,
If you think you are scoring points here, or persuading anyone of anything, you are sadly in error. All you are doing is demonstrating an arrogant lack of manners, and inability to present actual arguments, and a remarkable propensity for unprovoked ad-hominem attacks.

So fuck you. get the fucking hell out of my country, you arrogant pig.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:53 PM  

"Where are you a Rabbi and why do you attempt to disempower Jews by telling lies and siding with the anti Semites?"

In the United States, where I am currently seeking another s'micha through a Yeshiva that operates under the auspices of the Chief Rabbinate of Israel, Pirchei Shoshanim.

" . . . and why do you attempt to disempower Jews by telling lies and siding with the anti Semites?""

Read my earlier comments again. Where do take issue, precisely?

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 4:54 PM  

If you insist on being tribal, then take care of your own and leave us alone.

Do you insist on being tribal? Do you insist on Western nations accommodating your desire to live there without abandoning your heritage and loyalties to the tribe?

Jews don't kill Christians how to be Christians or where to live.

Let's go to the tape:

Abe Foxman: "Gibson bloodied the Jews by portraying them as such villains," said Foxman, who was among the Jewish leaders who a decade ago spoke out bitterly against Gibson's brutal recounting of Christ's crucifixion, saying its depiction of sadistic Pharisees and stereotypical characters fanned the flames of hatred against Jews.

But he has no problem with "Son of God."

"The story of the crucifixion and the way it has been used through the centuries has never been good for the Jews," he said.

"Having said that, 'Son of God' is the most sensitive, caring depiction of the story of Jesus that I have ever seen. The producers have done everything possible to put the events into historical, political and psychological context."


and
"to target Jews for conversion is disgraceful, insulting, and dangerous." He contends the Southern Baptist Convention is "part of a deceptive movement ... whose real goal is to convert Jews to Christianity. These efforts should be stopped once and for all ... the Southern Baptist leadership continues to show its disrespect and disregard for the validity of Judaism and the Jewish people."

or this (from 972mag.com);
Much has been made of the inept appearance of Michael Oren – American Jew turned Israeli ambassador to the United States - on 60 Minutes, in which he admitted that from time to time he calls up senior TV brass to make certain they censor the work of their writers and editors. This morning, Haaretz reported (Hebrew) that the Prime Minister’s Office was intimately in the loop...

The 2010 State Department report on religious freedom in Israel and the occupied territories found that the Israeli Ministry of the Interior (MOI) is harassing Christian priests by demanding they renew their visas time and time again. It limits the number of visas Christian religious workers receive, and makes onerous demands on them. The visa application process, when successful, takes months. During 2010, the MOI refused to renew the Jerusalem Anglican bishop’s residency permit, claiming that he was involved in forgery. The bishop denies the claim, and it is noteworthy that he was not indicted.

The MOI further refuses to grant recognized legal status to several old churches in Israel, all of them Protestant. Four Christian churches are waiting years for recognition of their legal status: the Ethiopian-Orthodox Church, the Coptic-Orthodox Church, the Evangelic Lutheran Church, and the United Christian Council.


So shut the fuck up.

Fill in the blank "the _____ cries out in pain as he strikes you"

Anonymous Sam the Man February 16, 2015 4:55 PM  

Rabbi B

Is this true?

And Rabbi B does believe that Jesus is the messiah...


Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 4:56 PM  

@Sam the Man

Truth is sometimes stranger than fiction.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 4:58 PM  

I don't get how this is odd or surprising. My congregation has been talking about Messianic Jews for at least two decades.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 4:59 PM  

"But you are of course correct: as an Anglo-Saxon, whether your people live or are systematically slaughtered in car-load lots is absolutely none of my concern. No doubt you have the resources to take stock of the matter at hand."

That's the difference between Jews and you. Jews would care if you and yours were being slaughtered and would insist on helping. It's why most Jews and most people in the world are better than you.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:00 PM  

"I don't get how this is odd or surprising. My congregation has been talking about Messianic Jews for at least two decades.'

Yes, but you have to remember, the "Messianic" part is often the Great Disqualifier.

Anonymous Stilicho February 16, 2015 5:01 PM  

Berezof smells like Rome or Die

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 5:01 PM  

Though, in my experience, at this juncture someone always thinks to score cheap points by going "Messianic Jews?! Oh, you mean Chriiiistians.

No, I don't mean Christians. I mean that subset of Christians who are of Jewish descent, and who have exercised their Christian liberty to keep the Old Testament customs and feasts.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:07 PM  

@Sam the Man

You might find life here pretty good for yourself now, but I'm telling you, when the SHTF Israel is going look like the Garden of Eden to you. My suggestion is that get yourself a six-month visa and find a moshav or something similar where you can experience what life is really like there.

Of course it will be a dramatic adjustment, but not like the adjustment I sense is coming our way.

Anonymous berezof February 16, 2015 5:09 PM  

"So fuck you. get the fucking hell out of my country, you arrogant pig."

I'll tell you what I'll tell anyone else: This Jew is amongst his own in his own country. So get with the program and leave your jew hating thoughts behind.

Anonymous berezof February 16, 2015 5:13 PM  

"Do you insist on being tribal? Do you insist on Western nations accommodating your desire to live there without abandoning your heritage and loyalties to the tribe?"

I was born in this country. So was my mother and father, my grandparents, my great grandparents and my great, great grandparents. I'm a Jew loyal to America and to my family. You have no clue about what you are trying to talk about. You know nothing about jews.

My heritage is an American heritage, a French heritage and a jewish heritage. I have friends whose heritage is American, Christian and Polish. Abandonment of one's ethnic or religious heritage is no requirement of being of American heritage.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 5:15 PM  

"
You might find life here pretty good for yourself now, but I'm telling you, when the SHTF Israel is going look like the Garden of Eden to you. My suggestion is that get yourself a six-month visa and find a moshav or something similar where you can experience what life is really like there."

How exactly will the shit hit the fan for me and you in America, the most accommodating country in the world for jews where antisemitism is found nearly nowhere, except occasionally on the internet?

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:16 PM  

"Abandonment of one's ethnic or religious heritage is no requirement of being of American heritage.'

How much of a difference do you think that makes to the ones who hate us and want us to leave?

Blogger Danby February 16, 2015 5:17 PM  

@Berezof, you ignorant slut,

I don't hate Jews. I like Jews. I know, right? A Catholic who likes Jews, who'da thunk it?

I hate you.

Blogger S1AL February 16, 2015 5:17 PM  

@berezof - if America went to war with Israel, would you support America? If the answer is yes, you're not the problem.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 5:18 PM  

"How much of a difference do you think that makes to the ones who hate us and want us to leave?"

Why do you think this miniscule number has any influence or impact at all? I'm sure it makes no difference to him. But he'll stay securely under his rock.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:20 PM  

How exactly will the shit hit the fan for me and you in America, the most accommodating country in the world for jews where antisemitism is found nearly nowhere, except occasionally on the internet?

Could not the same be said of Europe from 1830-1930? Of course, they didn't have the internet . . .

Blogger Danby February 16, 2015 5:20 PM  

@S1AL
That's entirely too theoretical.
The better question is:
"If you were serving the IDF during the 6-day war, and were ordered to fire on the Liberty, would you pull the trigger?"

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 5:21 PM  

When you think of that miniscule number, Berezof, I wonder if you might be thinking of the Anglo-Saxon in specific - you know, the group that you denigrate as morally lower than Jews. Because they are not the only ones in America.

How about blacks and Mexicans? How do they feel about jews?

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 5:21 PM  

"@berezof - if America went to war with Israel, would you support America? If the answer is yes, you're not the problem."

The number of jews in America who would support Israel in a war between the U.S. and Israel. is miniscule. And there is no "jewish problem" or problem with Jews in America. Americans of the Jewish faith are every bit as loyal, hardworking, essential and patriotic as Americans of the Christian faith and to suggest otherwise is to display the kind of ignorance that makes you someone to ignore.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 5:23 PM  

"Could not the same be said of Europe from 1830-1930? Of course, they didn't have the internet . . . "

You think the conditions and history that led to the Third Reich are extant in the U.S. or could be? Really? This is what you are warning people about? This is your premise. Please go on and demonstrate your comparison.

Blogger S1AL February 16, 2015 5:25 PM  

Actually, my experience with Jews in America indicates to me that many of them are actually very unpatriotic. Granted, many of them are also very liberal so that's not surprising...

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 5:27 PM  

"When you think of that miniscule number, Berezof, I wonder if you might be thinking of the Anglo-Saxon in specific - you know, the group that you denigrate as morally lower than Jews. Because they are not the only ones in America."

Denigrate Anglo Saxons. You are both stupid and illiterate. Those morally lower than most jews are those that would not care if Jews were being slaughtered...like Alexander admitted.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 5:29 PM  

I see, yes, when I read the message again, the "you" was probably referring to the individual, and not the collective.

Anonymous Sam the Man February 16, 2015 5:32 PM  

Rabbi B
Does the following describe your beliefs?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messianic_Judaism

If you believe something like the above… well what is the problem with assimilation, especially in the US of A. If you actually believe Jesus is the messiah, what is your stance on Jews that are intermarried and have say a catholic wife who does not convert? Is not the entire Messiah thing pretty much the dividing line between Jews and that spin-off sect the Christians?

How do you answer the fact that Jesus is not of the correct blood line? Now Christians please stop reading at this point……….….Don’t cheat because I do not mean to insult anyone or start a fight………….. How do you deal with the fact Jesus was likely the son of a roman soldier?

I am not asking these questions to start a fight, to insult Christians or insult anyone beliefs. I am just very confused.

Blogger S1AL February 16, 2015 5:34 PM  

@Sam the Man - really, quoting the Jesus seminar isn't insulting to anyone except yourself.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:35 PM  

"Please go on and demonstrate your comparison.'

1. The time frame and conditions thereof are similar to 1860-1930 (Emancipation really comes into its own by 1860 in Europe) and parallels 1945-2015 rather well.

2. Our economy, which is hanging by a thread. Where do you think the blame is going when it blows up? The Mexicans?

3. The rising influence of Islam and it's open embrace by the West. Jacob and Esau may have buried the proverbial hatchet at one time, but, call me crazy, I have a sneaking suspicion that Esau remembers where it was buried.

4. Immigration (a point that has already been made).

5. Above all, and most of all, assimilation and rejection of Torah (as I argued above).

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 5:35 PM  

No, that's not the Jesus Seminar, that is the standard position of Jewish rabbis.

Blogger S1AL February 16, 2015 5:36 PM  

Except that he's operating from the assumption that B is Messianic, so...

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:36 PM  

@Sam the Man

Send me an email. I would be more than happy to dialogue further if you are genuinely interested.

rebbaruch@gmail.com

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:37 PM  

rebbaruch10@gmail.com

typing too fast.

Blogger Rabbi B February 16, 2015 5:38 PM  


Trying to be a gracious guest here at VP. :)

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 5:38 PM  

As for a fight not happening, the proverbial snowball in hell would go "nigga, u screwed!" about those chances.

Blogger S1AL February 16, 2015 5:40 PM  

Eh, I don't see the point in fighting with someone who actually holds to that position.

I am more interested in commentary on the difference between Jews in America and Europe.

Blogger Markku February 16, 2015 5:41 PM  

YOU don't see, yes. But to a certain set of our commenters, that would be like saying "Talmud" in a parrot house run by Stormfront.

Blogger S1AL February 16, 2015 5:45 PM  

I grew up around vocal, militant atheist/anti-Christian types. My response has developed to one of point-and-laugh. They're as susceptible to mockery as they think everyone else is.

Anonymous Alexander February 16, 2015 5:55 PM  

Which is it Berezof: do you want the Anglo-Saxon to shut up and go away, or do you want the Anglo-Saxon to help you out? Cause I'm a little confused.

And no, Jews are not special in that regard. I do not see Jews saying 'never again' about the Holodomor. I do not see Jews berating the Turks over Armenia, or the Greeks, or the Kurds. In fact, I see much wringing of hands that the Turks are the good guys in the region and it's a shame to see them following Erdogan. I do not see the Jews weeping tears for Rwanda. Hell, I saw plenty of Jews who ignored the dead European natives and went straight to THEY WENT TO A KOSHER MARKET, THEY HURT THE JEWS!

Your people are like anyone else's - put themselves first, and an atrocity that happens elsewhere is someone else's business. If it's like the Holodomor and it can be traced back to the times when the Jews were heavily in the leadership in the USSR, it *especially* needs memory-hole.

So fuck you and your false morality. And you strike me as the type that wouldn't particularly care if every Anglo dropped dead this time tomorrow, so you'll forgive me for not being oh-so eager to make sure you know that I'm ready and willing to be your super best friend.

That being said, you need to realize that someone saying "Jew, go home!" in 1923 may very well hate Jews on principle. In 1933, he may be very much a friend.

Anonymous Berezof February 16, 2015 6:05 PM  

"Which is it Berezof: do you want the Anglo-Saxon to shut up and go away, or do you want the Anglo-Saxon to help you out?"

Just you shutting the fuck up will suit me just fine.

"And no, Jews are not special in that regard. I do not see Jews saying 'never again' about the Holodomor. I do not see Jews berating the Turks over Armenia, or the Greeks, or the Kurds"

They have in my temples.

Blogger Vox February 16, 2015 6:06 PM  

I still do not see the US as hostile to Jews. Quite the contrary.

No one saw France or Britain as hostile to the Jews ten years ago. And they didn't have their economy being raped by Jews running their central bank.

Every time you Anglo Saxon Christians try to tell us what to do, we end up getting hurt. If you think that's going to happen again then you not well measured our resources.

That's because you don't LISTEN when we warn you, just like you're not listening now. And your resources are meaningless. Jews owned up to 90 percent of various industries in Berlin prior to 1933. How did that work out for you.

They are such that the majority of people in the world over have vowed to never let Nazi Germany happen again.

It's cute to see you put your faith in Holocaustianity. The Chinese killed 50 million of their own without breaking a sweat. They don't give a damn about you. The Europeans mostly hate you. The White Americans are getting sick of you. The Muslims hate you. The Hispanics, Blacks, and Native Americans don't have an opinion and don't really count anyhow.

Listen to your Prime Minister. Listen to people who don't hate you. Go to Israel. And keep in mind that the Nazis weren't even seriously trying to wipe out the Jews, it barely made their top ten list. And they managed to kill around half despite fighting a two-front war at the same time.

If that had been their priority, every single European Jew would have been dead by December 1942.

Anonymous Sam the Man February 16, 2015 6:11 PM  

If I insulted anyone’s beliefs I apologize, I do not mean to. I have asked Christians to explain things in good faith in the past and have had them do so to my edification. I am grateful for that, some folks here know a great deal about the subject and are excellent teachers. That said some Christians believe that Jews are ignorant about Jesus and if they just stopped to listen they would all convert. But please consider this; Jewish people are not uneducated about Christianity. There are certain traditions that explain why the traditional Christians beliefs are ……well….in error. The fact that the lineage is not correct is one of them and this goes back to a very early day, it is not some later tradition put on to insult anybody. If somebody did take offense, please be aware at times things said on this forum could be interpreted to be of offense to Jews, when one gets to matters of faith one must be prepared to hear things that are not exactly comfortable or what one wants to hear.

By the same token I have heard Christians point out that Jews get mired on the mud and so miss the main point of the entire Messiah thing. I get that; if you accept the entire Jesus divinity thing and all the rest that follows I can see how some of the disputed details are no longer important. I asked the question as I really do not get the entire Messianic Jew thing unless it is sort of a James brother of Jesus early Christian faith thing. The blood line issue really matters for reasons that are too long to write up, hence my question of the good Rabbi and I will leave it at that. In any case I have plenty of real respect for the Christians and see no source of lasting conflict between the respective paths taken in faith to G-d. I will shut my trap now.

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