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Thursday, February 05, 2015

How the Hugos became a battleground

Nero chronicles the politicization of science fiction and fantasy and explains the reason for the existence of Sad Puppies:
New York Times bestselling author Larry Correia told us that SFF is currently in the grip of a “systematic campaign to slander anybody who doesn’t toe their line,” which is breeding a culture of fear and self-censorship. “Most authors aren’t making that much money, so they are terrified of being slandered and losing business,” he says. The only exceptions are a “handful of people like me who are either big enough not to give a crap, or too obstinate to shut up.”

After years on the back foot, that obstinate handful are preparing to fight back.

Sad Puppies

To the outside world, the Hugo Awards are known as the most prestigious honor that a sci-fi or fantasy creator can achieve. However, inside the community they are widely seen as a popularity contest dominated by cliques and super-fandoms. This can be seen most clearly in the dominance of Doctor Who in the TV award categories. The show’s enormous fanbase has garnered 26 Hugo nominations in the last nine years. Episodes from the show triumphed in every year between 2006 and 2012, save one.

The Hugos have an advantage, though: they are difficult for a single group to dominate if others rise to challenge them. All one has to do to vote in the awards is pay a small membership fee to the World Science Fiction Convention. For the few who are brave enough to defend artistic freedom openly, the Hugos are a good place to make a stand.

That is precisely what is now happening. Ahead of 2013’s Hugo Awards, Larry Correia began making public blog posts about his nominations, inviting his readers to discuss and agree on a shared list of Hugo nominations, and vote collectively. The idea was to draw attention to authors and creators who were suffering from an undeserved lack of attention due to the political climate in sci-fi. The “Sad Puppies” slate was born.

(The original idea was to call it the “Sad Puppies Think of the Children Campaign” – a dig at those who take their social crusades too seriously.)

What began as a discussion among bloggers has turned into an annual event. Last year’s Sad Puppies slate was extraordinarily successful, with seven out of Correia’s twelve nominations making it to the final stage of the Hugos. Among the successful nominations was The Last Witchking, a novelette by Theodore Beale, also known as Vox Day – a writer whose radical right-wing views had put him at the top of the sci-fi SJWs’ hit list. The fact that an author like Beale could receive a Hugo nomination was proof that SJW domination of sci-fi was not as complete as the elites would have liked.

In addition to humiliating the activists, the slate also triggered significant debate. Even Jon Scalzi, the privilege-checking SFWA President discussed above, was forced to admit that works of science fiction and fantasy ought to be judged on their quality, not on the politics of their authors. This greatly upset some of Scalzi’s more radical supporters, who openly called for exclusion on the basis of political belief. The debate also spread beyond sci-fi to the pages of The Huffington Post and USA Today.

Stirring up debate was, of course, precisely the point of Sad Puppies. As well as ensuring that quality works of fiction made it past the cliques at places like SWFA and Tor.com to be considered by the fans themselves, the Sad Puppies slate also forced radicals to show their true colours. Those who supported political ostracism were outed as a tiny but vocal minority. As Correia explained on his blog, the slate managed to expose the “thought police” of the community before votes had even been cast.

This year, the Sad Puppies slate returns once more, championed by Hugo and Nebula-nominee Brad R. Torgerson. Although run by conservative authors, it includes many authors and creators who are left-wing, liberal, or non-politically aligned. In this way, the slate hopes to protect what radical activists want to eliminate: diversity of opinion and political tolerance.
It's rather amusing how what is obvious to a reporter has managed to escape the pinkshirts for over a year now. We've never been into thought-policing or preventing anyone from getting published. They care more about that than they do about the history of the field, its traditions, or simply writing straightforward science fiction and fantasy.

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63 Comments:

Anonymous RandyBeck February 05, 2015 3:24 PM  

I wonder how long it will be before we see a Wikileaks-style disclosure of who voted for whom.

That said, I'm not a member and dunno if it's possible.

Anonymous fish February 05, 2015 3:41 PM  

Even Jon Scalzi, the privilege-checking SFWA President discussed above, was forced to admit that works of science fiction and fantasy ought to be judged on their quality, not on the politics of their authors.

Reluctantly I'm sure.

Anonymous Ha February 05, 2015 3:43 PM  

"To the outside world, the Hugo Awards are known as the most prestigious honor that a sci-fi or fantasy creator can achieve."

To the outside world, Hugo Awards are generally not known at all!

"A what award? For what now?"

Anonymous Ha February 05, 2015 3:47 PM  

Even Jon Scalzi, the privilege-checking SFWA President discussed above, was forced to admit that works of science fiction and fantasy ought to be judged on their quality, not on the politics of their authors.

Reluctantly I'm sure.


They only pretend it's about quality because they've got the politics locked up.

"We judge on quality... and conservative writing sucks, so there!"

Kinda like university departments that claim that somehow conservatives never get hired or promoted purely because they can't make it intellectually, ya know.

Blogger IM2L844 February 05, 2015 4:19 PM  

I wonder how long it will be before we see a Wikileaks-style disclosure of who voted for whom.

I bet never, but I wouldn't be too surprised to learn there's a few that vote contrary to what they spew in public to maintain their warren cred.

Anonymous karsten February 05, 2015 4:20 PM  

They only pretend it's about quality because they've got the politics locked up.

"We judge on quality... and conservative writing sucks, so there!"

Kinda like university departments that claim that somehow conservatives never get hired or promoted purely because they can't make it intellectually, ya know.


And yet many of these types believe their own bull. In their minds, political Leftism IS quality. They cannot conceive of a judgment on aesthetic criteria alone. To them, the Lefter the work, the higher quality it has, and the less Leftist it is, the poorer its quality.

Not to say that they have NO aesthetic sense, but they do have very little, and what little they have is completely subordinated to their political concerns. Subordinated, or rather, mixed in with, to the point where they can't distinguish one from the other.

Of course, in this way sci-fi is only catching up to a phenomenon that the worlds of high visual art and architecture have endured for nearly a century. This is how utter rubbish like Picasso, that good Marxist, got packaged as a painter of "genius" while the masterpieces of legitimately brilliant painters like the Academic Classicists got dismissed as "bourgeois." It's also how the designs of accomplished architects like Quinlan Terry are dismissed as "reactionary," while the Marxists such as Le Corbusier are contracted to blight our built landscape with their Internationalist, glass-and-steel monstrosities.

Blogger bob k. mando February 05, 2015 4:32 PM  

karsten February 05, 2015 4:20 PM
They cannot conceive of a judgment on aesthetic criteria alone. To them, the Lefter the work, the higher quality it has, and the less Leftist it is, the poorer its quality.



this is why it doesn't take long to get bored reading movie reviews at WSWS.org

Anonymous Heh February 05, 2015 4:36 PM  

You can't beat the aesthetic quality of feminist music!

http://moonbattery.com/?p=54846

"It turns out that instrumentation, harmony, melody, and even listenability are all aspects of the misogynistic patriarchy applied to music. But womyn are free of that now."

Blogger ManiaC Provost February 05, 2015 4:45 PM  

How is B.V. Larson? I was thinking of reading Steel World.

Anonymous Salt February 05, 2015 4:47 PM  

Oh man, Heh, I tweeted that.

Blogger Vox February 05, 2015 4:56 PM  

How is B.V. Larson? I was thinking of reading Steel World.

Go for it. He may be participating in Red Horse V2.

Anonymous Kennet February 05, 2015 5:00 PM  

"Today, no one is safe. Right-wingers like Theodore Beale face ostracization over accusations of racism (Beale is himself Native American)"

Is this the first time a journalist refers to you as a native american?

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 5:26 PM  

@Ha: "To the outside world, Hugo Awards are generally not known at all!"

That is absolutely correct. Science fiction and fantasy, while entertaining, simply have no real-world 'weight'. Neither do any of the Hollyweird awards. It is all just popularity contests.

"Kinda like university departments that claim that somehow conservatives never get hired or promoted purely because they can't make it intellectually, ya know."

Well, it is true that academics is not seen as a proper career for a conservative. Appropriate careers for conservatives is in the fields of the sciences, engineering, medicine, law, or business. Politics and theology are acceptable side-jobs. But conservatives are not suited for liberal/socialist disciplines like psychology, the "soft sciences" like history and literature, or non-Austrian economics.

These should really be eliminated from university altogether - there is no need for a university to have anything but a School of Science, School of Business, School of Medicine, and School of Law. Everything else is superfluous. However, this will not happen until conservatives accomplish dominion over the Seven Mountains, which liberals currently have control of.

Blogger ManiaC Provost February 05, 2015 5:44 PM  

Schools of Engineering, Design, and Elementary Education are crucial!

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 5:47 PM  

@ManiaC Provost: "Schools of Engineering, Design, and Elementary Education are crucial!"

By 'Design', I assume you mean things like architecture and drafting. Design and Engineering would be included under the sciences, since those things derive from science.

The soft 'science' of 'Education' is not necessary. People did not receive degrees in 'Education' prior to the domination of liberals in the university system, and they were not necessary - or needed! - to teach effectively.

Blogger Eric Wilson February 05, 2015 5:56 PM  

I loved this jab from Nero:

(Beale is himself Native American)

That might fall under Roissy's COPROP.

Blogger ManiaC Provost February 05, 2015 6:02 PM  

The purpose of elementary education degrees is twofold: First, to attract young, maternal women with average intelligence to be in the same general area as engineering majors; second, to provide a small cadre of practical experts on prepubescent human learning.

Typically science, engineering, and design have different schools. Although there should be more synergy between them in various areas, they are different. For example, graphic design is highly competitive and subjective. Only a limited number of students can graduate. That kind of attitude doesn't work well for engineers, who must be held to an objective standard, and where we need the barely competent to graduate and do grunt work.

Blogger Danby February 05, 2015 6:13 PM  

@ManiaC
The purpose of elementary education degrees is twofold: First, to attract young, maternal women with average intelligence to be in the same general area as engineering majors; second, to provide a small cadre of practical experts on prepubescent human learning.

I can't argue the first purpose, it's obviously true. the second however, is only the ostensible purpose. The real purpose is to remove the teaching profession from direct competition with people who know something. The experience of homeschoolers show conclusively that a teaching degree is an active impediment to teaching young children. 150 years ago, before the invention of Normal Schools, elementary education, in this country at least, was handled almost entirely by young women of high-school education. Granted a high school education of 1880 was the equivalent of an Associates degree these days. The few with Bachelors degrees were often member of religious orders, or the wives of Pastors, with degrees in subjects like Biblical and Patristic Studies, or Theology. (MRS degrees are not a new phenomenon). The degrees were not in "Education" as such a specialty did not exist.

Blogger Josh February 05, 2015 6:15 PM  

Why does a university need a school of business?

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 6:23 PM  

@ManiaC Provost: " First, to attract young, maternal women with average intelligence to be in the same general area as engineering majors"

Not a function of the university and therefore not necessary. The engineers should concentrate on their maths, not women.

"For example, graphic design is highly competitive and subjective. Only a limited number of students can graduate."

So-called 'graphic design' is just more art-fart crap and really should be eliminated from the university curriculum along with all other "art" majors. If you want to learn to do art, take your trust fund and apprentice under a painter or whatever.

---

@Danby: "The experience of homeschoolers show conclusively that a teaching degree is an active impediment to teaching young children. "

It is unfortunate that homeschooled children - in my experience - simply do not adjust well to a corporate environment.

---

@Josh: "Why does a university need a school of business?"

To qualify for an executive or CEO position. Labor, like engineers, do not manage - and management shouldn't labor.

Anonymous jack February 05, 2015 6:24 PM  

@Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 5:47 PM

Clark: For an interesting and informative look into modern education or lack thereof in Britain and the USA go to Bruce Charlton's site below. This is one of his many blogs and is titled Intelligence, Personality and Genius. The man is a Prof. and must be fully tenured to talk like he does in Britain. Look to the 2012 series of posts for that blog [they run from 2012 thru to now]. Near the end of the 2012 postings is a totally devastating attack on modern schooling, which Dr. Charlton used to believe in until he did an in depth look into the reality of IQ and testing thereof. There, also, are his ideas about how to correct the mess. I think you may want to start at the blog beginning and work your way through to the current postings. Because background.

http://iqpersonalitygenius.blogspot.com/

Blogger Russell February 05, 2015 6:30 PM  

@karsten

Hear, hear!

Blogger Danby February 05, 2015 6:31 PM  

"It is unfortunate that homeschooled children - in my experience - simply do not adjust well to a corporate environment. "

You say that like it's a BAD thing. The purpose of education is not the production of worker drones. Having failed at producing people who can think, however, perhaps that's the best that American schools can aspire to.

And, having raised 11 homeschooled kids I could argue that, but it's all subjective.

Blogger Marissa February 05, 2015 6:40 PM  

Danby beat me to it - sounds like a feature, not a bug. How did the ol' bootstrappers who were taught in one-room schoolhouses or dropped out at 8th grade or who were tutored by one man ever make a name for themselves?

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 6:43 PM  

@Danby: "You say that like it's a BAD thing. The purpose of education is not the production of worker drones. Having failed at producing people who can think, however, perhaps that's the best that American schools can aspire to."

The purpose of education is to provide trained personnel for business, whether that be corporate offices or small business. There is really no other reason for organized education of any kind to exist in a capitalistic society.

Blogger Marissa February 05, 2015 6:45 PM  

It's also how the designs of accomplished architects like Quinlan Terry are dismissed as "reactionary," while the Marxists such as Le Corbusier are contracted to blight our built landscape with their Internationalist, glass-and-steel monstrosities.

Indeed - the recent WW2 monument was completely lambasted (probably had something to do with George W. Bush approving it, but still) as "fascistic" and "vainglorious". Lots of people were also butthurt because it got in the way of famous protest site. As if the wounded, dead and those others who served didn't deserve to be honored front and center. I'd rather it be there than the Washington monument, in fact but I'll keep my revolutionist opinions to myself.

Blogger Marissa February 05, 2015 6:48 PM  

The purpose of education is to provide trained personnel for business, whether that be corporate offices or small business. There is really no other reason for organized education of any kind to exist in a capitalistic society.

The university exists for the discovery and development of religion, theology and the natural sciences. What an ahistorical idea that it's some kind of vocational training institute.

OpenID cailcorishev February 05, 2015 6:52 PM  

The purpose of education is not the production of worker drones.

Apparently Clark thinks that is its one and only purpose. Assuming he's not just yanking our chains.

Clark, what you describe is the purpose of schooling, and the reason the US adopted Prussia's age-regimented common school system in the mid-1800s -- to generate good little citizen worker-soldiers.

The purpose of education is to teach people to think well about important things, and ultimately to be better people. Granted, that rarely happens in a school, only when a dedicated teacher happens to run into a student who hasn't had his curiosity stomped out of him yet, and who happens to be interested in the subject at hand, and no one gets in their way.

If businesses need trained workers, there's no reason they can't train them themselves, or even set up vocational schools. But then they wouldn't be able to get taxpayers to pay for it.

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 6:53 PM  

@jack: "For an interesting and informative look into modern education or lack thereof in Britain and the USA go to Bruce Charlton's site below."

I'll take a look at it. Thanks!

---

@Marissa: "How did the ol' bootstrappers who were taught in one-room schoolhouses or dropped out at 8th grade or who were tutored by one man ever make a name for themselves?"

They did the best they could with the inefficient techniques of the pre-technological ages. Now with everything computerized, automated, roboticized, and otherwise engaging the full aspects of the Industrial and Information Revolutions, those inefficient techniques simply don't cut the mustard. Certainly, in today's modern age there will always be a select few outliers who are able to make it, but for 99.9% of humanity, doing it the "old-fashioned way" will bring poverty. Look at all the chidren born 1990-1995 who don't have a high school degree or GED; they can't get any job better than a burger flipper or garbage man. There is no chance of advancement for them; they are simply non-necessary and ultimately disposable and replaceable by machines.

Humanity just simply has to keep up with the ever-increasing pace of technological change. Those who can't fit in will simply have to be left behind and shut out. If I need an accountant, I don't need a jack-of-all-trades who knows accountancy, lawn mower repair, oil painting, and professional cake making with no degrees or certifications. I need an accountant who's certified properly with an appropriate degree.

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 7:05 PM  

@Marrissa: "The university exists for the discovery and development of religion, theology and the natural sciences. What an ahistorical idea that it's some kind of vocational training institute. "

Certainly, pre-Industrial Revolution. I don't think anyone disputes what universities were for historically. But that is not necessary in the current Information Age; if you want to learn religion and theology, you go to a seminary for that purpose. There is no need for you to know how to balance the books at a business, or do brain surgery, or manage a call center. Those are secular things.

---

@cailcorishev: "The purpose of education is to teach people to think well about important things, and ultimately to be better people."

Thinking well about important things is simply a function of natural intelligence ability, determined by genetics, while being a better person is solely derived from the morals you are taught by your faith.

"If businesses need trained workers, there's no reason they can't train them themselves, or even set up vocational schools."

If it were efficient or profitable to do so, I'm sure they would.
Since I agree with the reduction of government in the area of education, I would support removing all barriers to do this. Then we could dismantle public education in its entirety, as it would be no longer needed, and the university system in its entirety, as it would be no longer needed.

Of course, this would probably favor large corporations, as I don't believe small businesses have the resources to set up their own schools, and would probably necessitate the introduction of education-work indenture contracts, as the corporations would need to be able to recoup their education investment, but as that would be a function of the free market I wouldn't have a problem with that.

Anonymous MrGreenMan February 05, 2015 7:05 PM  

@Clak Bianco

The problem with those left behind and shut out: Eventually, when there are enough of them, they just start killing the wealthy and taking their things. Look at Zimbabwe.

Anonymous Ha February 05, 2015 7:09 PM  

Well, it is true that academics is not seen as a proper career for a conservative. Appropriate careers for conservatives is in the fields of the sciences, engineering, medicine, law, or business. Politics and theology are acceptable side-jobs. But conservatives are not suited for liberal/socialist disciplines like psychology, the "soft sciences" like history and literature, or non-Austrian economics.

I totally disagree. Conservatives are entirely well suited for the humanities. It is especially important not to concede history to the Left -- because Leftism could not survive if history were accurately taught to all children, thus exposing the numerous crimes and horrors of Leftism, and demonstrating the fallacy that Leftist policies have created "progress".

He who controls the past, controls the present, and all that.

Blogger Danby February 05, 2015 7:12 PM  

@ Clark
Look at all the chidren born 1990-1995 who don't have a high school degree or GED; they can't get any job better than a burger flipper or garbage man. There is no chance of advancement for them; they are simply non-necessary and ultimately disposable and replaceable by machines. "

What world do you live in? honestly? Cause it bears no resemblance to the one I live in.

Beyong the age of 24, no-one outside of accrediting agencies and schools give a crap about your education. when I have been in a hiring position (and I have, many times) the only question I have is "what can you do for me, here, now?"
As an example, my son-in-law. 29, homeschooled, works in IT for a schools consortium, doing system admin, DBA and storage work. He will likely be moving into the management slot when his boss retires in 2 years. Doing fine, no diploma at all.

Blogger Marissa February 05, 2015 7:14 PM  

This "my idea of history is inevitable" nonsense is plain silly. No wonder the neo reactionaries sound as out of touch and technocratic as the Marxists.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis February 05, 2015 7:16 PM  

I need an accountant who's certified properly with an appropriate degree. No you don't. All you need is someone who understands GAAP and has math ability of a high school graduate. The vast majority of jobs do not requirement college level education and technology should make this more true, not less. How people think that degrees somehow impart special skills for jobs that did not require/need said degree 40 years ago is astounding. The real proof is the fact that most people work jobs completely unrelated to their degree which by definition means they had to learn how to do the job on the job.

Blogger Danby February 05, 2015 7:18 PM  

@Clark
In fact, in tech subjects, your education is essentially worthless when it comes to doing the actual work. You will learn on the job, supplemented by short courses supplied by vendors (when your employer will pay for them, none of mine have for the last 12 years). You start as a junior, and as you demonstrate the ability to do the work and keep up with the technology, you become a senior.

OpenID cailcorishev February 05, 2015 7:44 PM  

The real proof is the fact that most people work jobs completely unrelated to their degree which by definition means they had to learn how to do the job on the job.

Yes. The standard pro-college mantra that I've been hearing all my life is, "It doesn't matter all that much what degree you get. The important thing is that you get a degree, because that shows employers you're smart enough and disciplined enough for them. Just get any degree and you'll be fine."

It seems to be true: back when I was managing a pizza shop, I had several college graduates working for me, and none of them majored in pizza making. In fact, I don't think I even asked what their majors were. I just made sure they could count to 37 -- the number of pepperonis on a large.

Anonymous jack February 05, 2015 7:55 PM  

@ Clark

Re: that info on visiting Bruce Charlton's site and the blog in question. The mentioned material is near the 'beginning' of the blog entries for 2012 not the end.
The attack on modern education and remedies thereof.

http://iqpersonalitygenius.blogspot.com/

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 8:01 PM  

@MrGreenMan: "The problem with those left behind and shut out: Eventually, when there are enough of them, they just start killing the wealthy and taking their things. Look at Zimbabwe."

Yes, that's what the liberals want and why they promote socialism. Once you remove all market restraints imposed by government, people will have the ability to properly upgrade themselves into the standards required by technological industrialized civilization and be productive. Or they can join a Private Defense Agency and be used as cannon fodder. Either way.

---

@Ha: "Conservatives are entirely well suited for the humanities."

You've fallen into the trap designed by liberals. With the advent of the Industrial and Information Revolutions - call it the Technological Age for short - there's no reason to have 'professional' humanities. It does not need to be taught. It can be relegated to other amateur entertainments, like acting and art and dance and so on.

There is simply no place for history or sociology or whatnot in the world of business and capitalism, just as there is no place for underwater basket weaving. (Unless you can find a market for it.)

---

@Danby: "Beyong the age of 24, no-one outside of accrediting agencies and schools give a crap about your education. when I have been in a hiring position (and I have, many times) the only question I have is "what can you do for me, here, now?"

I do not find that to be true for law firms, nor when I was admitted to the bar.
Nor have I found that to be the case in the corporate arena, no matter how relaxed the Human Resources department.

This may be true for small business as they have more relaxed standards, but I can't speak for that - I don't do small business. But then, small business on average doesn't make all that much money either, in comparison to the Fortune 500.

---

@Marissa: "This "my idea of history is inevitable" nonsense is plain silly."

It isn't inevitable; it's just technology.
Fact: Burger flippers will be replaced by robots. Those robots are beginning to be put into production now.
Fact: Picker robots will replace human crop pickers within 10 years.
Fact: Welding robots will replace welders entirely in 20-30 years.
Fact: Within 40 years, software will take the place of secretaries almost entirely.


Unless something happens to stop technological progress on those fronts, these things will happen. They're beginning to happen now. As work proceeds on these fronts, it will be cheaper to do this than hire a person - just as manufacturing in the USA has been taken over by robots.

If you think something will stop the technological progress, I'd be happy to know it.

---

"he vast majority of jobs do not requirement college level education and technology should make this more true, not less."

If technology means that I do not need the college level education, then I don't need the people either. Software and automation can do just as good a job as a grunt. Even better, in fact, as the software and automation don't have sick days, require rest, and so on.

I should point out that this is why legal secretary and paralegal positions are quickly becoming non-growth positions. They're being replaced by software.

"The real proof is the fact that most people work jobs completely unrelated to their degree which by definition means they had to learn how to do the job on the job."

I honestly do not know anyone who does not work in their degree, so I am unable to speak to this.

Anonymous Voice of Knight February 05, 2015 8:13 PM  

Legal assistant and paralegal positions are becoming non growth...

When were they ever growth positions?

Anonymous WaterBoy February 05, 2015 8:16 PM  

From the article:

"Redshirts author John Scalzi"
"New York Times bestselling author Larry Correia"

Uh huh...why isn't it 'New York Times bestselling author John Scalzi', huh? HUH?

BIAS! DISQUALIFY!

*in before Scalzoid does*

Blogger SirHamster February 05, 2015 8:20 PM  

It isn't inevitable; it's just technology.
Fact: Burger flippers will be replaced by robots. Those robots are beginning to be put into production now.
Fact: Picker robots will replace human crop pickers within 10 years.
Fact: Welding robots will replace welders entirely in 20-30 years.
Fact: Within 40 years, software will take the place of secretaries almost entirely.


Fact: You incorrectly used "Fact" instead of "Prediction".

Anonymous Ha February 05, 2015 8:32 PM  

You've fallen into the trap designed by liberals. With the advent of the Industrial and Information Revolutions - call it the Technological Age for short - there's no reason to have 'professional' humanities. It does not need to be taught. It can be relegated to other amateur entertainments, like acting and art and dance and so on.

Shrug. Doesn't alter my point. However history is produced and distributed, conservatives need to make sure they are producing and distributing it.

There is simply no place for history or sociology or whatnot in the world of business and capitalism, just as there is no place for underwater basket weaving. (Unless you can find a market for it.)

Wrong. The past affects the present. If you don't understand the past, you will not understand the present business environment -- especially because the present business environment is increasingly affected by political considerations that have deep historical roots.

Anonymous karsten February 05, 2015 8:39 PM  

"I totally disagree. Conservatives are entirely well suited for the humanities. It is especially important not to concede history to the Left -- because Leftism could not survive if history were accurately taught to all children, thus exposing the numerous crimes and horrors of Leftism, and demonstrating the fallacy that Leftist policies have created "progress".

He who controls the past, controls the present, and all that."


Exactly.

The entire effort to drive traditionalists out of the humanities was the first and most obvious Leftist scheme. Prior to WW2, there was a long and rich history of traditionalist arts-and-humanities study in Europe, especially in Germany (which is one reason why Germany was better able to resist the Leftist takeover until the entire nation was occupied and that traditionalist legacy criminalized, after the war).

It was the driving of traditionalists OUT of the arts and the humanities that created the Leftist-dominated culture that we have today. Traditionalists were kicked out of those fields after the war as surely as the Prussians were expelled from their homelands, and are today made to feel no more welcome than a Prussian would be if he announced his desire to take back his ancestral property in Breslau or Königsberg.

It's highly telling that among the most important voices that we have on the true Right are Drs. Kevin MacDonald and Ricardo Duchesne (professors of psychology and social science, respectively).

Imagine if there were more.

In fact, nothing could be more important to winning the cultural war than restoring a traditionalist element in the humanities and the arts.

And anyone who argues otherwise, who argues that traditionalists have no place in the arts or humanities, is engaging in a sly misdirect and is a Leftist fifth column. Truth.

Blogger Danby February 05, 2015 9:13 PM  

Okay, I'm calling "troll" on Clark
He's either a troll or a barely-normal IQ aspie.

Blogger bob k. mando February 05, 2015 9:16 PM  

Clark Bianco February 05, 2015 6:43 PM
There is really no other reason for organized education of any kind to exist in a capitalistic society.



really?

then the only question now being whether or not you think raising your child to be a mindless drone is in his best interest.


Government schooling is about "the perfect organization of the hive."
H.H. Goddard, Human Efficiency (1920)

Blogger Marc DuQuesne February 05, 2015 9:20 PM  

Sasquon updated the online membership list as of the end of January. The previous update had been on January 7th. A little noodling around with the numbers shows that in the last 3/4 of the month membership grew from 3464 to 4872. 1408 total new members. Supporting members went from 1229 to 1732.

Much of the attending membership boost was probably in anticipation of the price increase in February, but there was no price savings at all involved in the at least 502 new supporting memberships, which would seem to be primarily puppy driven, whether in support or opposition should be shown in the eventual vote totals.

Blogger Marc DuQuesne February 06, 2015 12:04 AM  

Make that 515 new supporting members. 12 supporters converted to attending, and an "erling mork" left the list completely, though his guest remains.

Anonymous Jack Amok February 06, 2015 2:43 AM  

I honestly do not know anyone who does not work in their degree, so I am unable to speak to this.

What field do you work in?

OpenID cailcorishev February 06, 2015 7:16 AM  

Jack, he said he was admitted to the bar, so I assume he's a lawyer. So he may be telling the truth, since that's one of the professions that has a strong cartel that uses a specific degree to keep down the competition.

He also said he works in the area of corporate HR -- so a guy with a credentialist occupation in a credentialist field who favors credentials. Imagine that.

Blogger Shibes Meadow February 06, 2015 9:13 AM  

Folks, if you can, click through to the article and check out the combox. Laffs ahoy!

Blogger John Wright February 06, 2015 9:31 AM  

"The purpose of education is to provide trained personnel for business, whether that be corporate offices or small business."

This is not just wrong and stupid, it is blasphemy.

There are two types of education: liberal education and trade school.

The purpose of liberal education is to make brave, free men out of idiotic youths by exposing them to the great works of the past, that they will (1) learn to think for themselves, including (for those able to shoulder it) abstract thinking; and (2) learn the nature of virtue and vice by past examples; and (3) know what to say when asked to justify their works, their lives, and their loyalties to the commonwealth by those who wish to overtake or destroy all these things.

The purpose of trade school, like a law school or medical collage, is to learn a trade or master the secrets of a guild. The purpose of a guild, such as the American Bar Association, is to exclude talented amateurs, lower the number of practitioners, and raise their fees and rates.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis February 06, 2015 10:13 AM  

If technology means that I do not need the college level education, then I don't need the people either. Software and automation can do just as good a job as a grunt. Even better, in fact, as the software and automation don't have sick days, require rest, and so on.

You are making the mistake of equating a college degree with ability level and that some how a person without a college degree somehow does not have the ability technical jobs. How exactly does a degree in English, History, Sociology etc give me any indication that a person is any more capable of doing office work at a greater degree than a person who does not have a degree? Objectively how would those degrees insulate an individual from being crowded out by automation be it virtual or machine. The answer is that it doesn't.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis February 06, 2015 10:17 AM  

I honestly do not know anyone who does not work in their degree, so I am unable to speak to this.

That comment strongly suggest that you either work in some sort of regulated field that requires licensing or your an academic, neither of which make up the majority of employment opportunities in this country. I work in construction management. My degrees are in finance and humanities. My wife works as a business analyst for a fortune 500 company, she got her degree in English. I have a friend who is working his way up into hotel management, he doesn't have a degree (and yet there are universities offering degrees in hotel management).

Blogger Feather Blade February 06, 2015 11:46 AM  

Fact: Picker robots will replace human crop pickers within 10 years.

False. There are many crops, especially of the berry variety, that are too delicate for mechanical harvesting.

Unless you goal is to have jam straight out of the field.

Anonymous Jon Bromfield February 06, 2015 12:42 PM  

HR depts. require a college diploma (even if unrelated to the job) because they're not allowed to give IQ, literacy, or other tests (biased against certain minorities, don't you know).

The assumption (clearly erroneous) is that if you've managed to get a degree you must have at least average intelligence, can read and write at high school level, do basic math, and are teachable.

Anonymous Darth Toolpodicus February 06, 2015 1:40 PM  

Clark puts way too much stock into how much brainpower is needed, and probably has no clue about what robots can and cannot do.

If everybody had 140+ IQ:

*the garbage still needs collected
*pipes still need fixed
*wrenches still need turned

Along with a whole host of needs and tasks that don't require super intellectual horse power and will always be cheaper to have a trained human do than not.

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 06, 2015 4:33 PM  

@SirHamster: "Fact: You incorrectly used "Fact" instead of "Prediction"."

No, these technologies and robots already exist. You can Google to look them up. So it is a fact that they exist and the timeframes provided are the expected timeframes for the technologies and robots to mature and be introduced mainstream. Unless, of course, something happens to halt that - civilization collapse, ending of projects, so on.

---

@bob k. mando: "then the only question now being whether or not you think raising your child to be a mindless drone is in his best interest."

That would depend on whether I want my child to be labor or management.

---

@Feather Blade: "False. There are many crops, especially of the berry variety, that are too delicate for mechanical harvesting."

They've managed to surmount that problem. See here.

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 06, 2015 4:35 PM  

@Ha: "Shrug. Doesn't alter my point. However history is produced and distributed, conservatives need to make sure they are producing and distributing it."

I don't disagree with that. I simply disagree that those things should be "professional". They should be relegated back to where they belong, the amateur/hobbyist section.

---

@ karsten : "In fact, nothing could be more important to winning the cultural war than restoring a traditionalist element in the humanities and the arts."

I agree.

"And anyone who argues otherwise, who argues that traditionalists have no place in the arts or humanities, is engaging in a sly misdirect and is a Leftist fifth column. Truth."

I don't say that traditionalists have no place in the arts or humanities. I would say the opposite.

What I disagree with is this:

"It's highly telling that among the most important voices that we have on the true Right are Drs. Kevin MacDonald and Ricardo Duchesne (professors of psychology and social science, respectively)."

There should not be professors of psychology or social science. These should not be academic disciplines. It should be "Dr. Kevin McDonald, an electronic engineer who is an amateur psychologist" and "Dr. Ricard Duchesne, programmer and amateur of social science". Psychology and social science simply do not rate professionalism, being non objective-oriented, just like music or art.

---

@John Wright: "The purpose of liberal education is to make brave, free men out of idiotic youths by exposing them to the great works of the past, that they will (1) learn to think for themselves, including (for those able to shoulder it) abstract thinking; and (2) learn the nature of virtue and vice by past examples; and (3) know what to say when asked to justify their works, their lives, and their loyalties to the commonwealth by those who wish to overtake or destroy all these things. "

1) Those things are the jobs of your parents and church to teach you, not universities.
2) Those great works of the past have nothing to do with making sales or raising quarterly profits. They're great reads and informative for personal ethics and morals, but get caught on the job reading Moby Dick when you're supposed to be working and you'll be canned quick-march.

Anonymous Clark Bianco February 06, 2015 4:36 PM  

@Danby: "Okay, I'm calling "troll" on Clark. He's either a troll or a barely-normal IQ aspie."

I'm very disappointed that you would think this. My writings (follow the link) show otherwise.

---

@Jack Amok: "What field do you work in"

Law.

---

@Cogitans Iuvenis: "How exactly does a degree in English, History, Sociology etc give me any indication that a person is any more capable of doing office work at a greater degree than a person who does not have a degree?"

That's just it. There shouldn't be degrees in English, History, Sociology, etc. Those degrees shouldn't exist because those are liberal arts and thus the realm of amateurs. Now, you would be able to tell how capable a person is of doing office work by comparing someone with a degree in engineering, emphasis mechanical, versus one with a degree in business management, emphasis office management...

"That comment strongly suggest that you either work in some sort of regulated field that requires licensing or your an academic, neither of which make up the majority of employment opportunities in this country."

See above.

"I work in construction management. My degrees are in finance and humanities."

I'm sorry to hear that. Did you choose not to work in finance and lower yourself to construction management or were there other extenuating circumstances?

Anonymous Darth Toolpodicus February 06, 2015 7:08 PM  

@clark

"No, these technologies and robots already exist. You can Google to look them up. So it is a fact that they exist and the timeframes provided are the expected timeframes for the technologies and robots to mature and be introduced mainstream."

Complete B.S. This is what one would expect to hear from a Kurzweil Fanboy...next you're going to be predicting the Singularity as fruit pickers and robots meld into awesome Mechs that stalk the orchards, a quantum leap forward into new horizons of produce.

Rather than unpack-in-detail the fail in your assertion, I'll summarize by saying while your "harvest-bots" may find some applications where they make economic sense to employ; there will always be a large segment where they either do not make economic sense or simply cannot be employed. Something that could be said for many "manual" occupations. Google articles to the contrary notwithstanding.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis February 06, 2015 11:49 PM  

I'm sorry to hear that. Did you choose not to work in finance and lower yourself to construction management or were there other extenuating circumstances?

Why do you assume it is a lowering? If you go by starting salaries than construction management would be a rung up from finance. Where I live, in Seattle, a person right out of college that becomes a project engineer for a construction company would earn at the minimum 10k more than someone who is an entry level financial analyst. In fact, when I moved from an analyst role at one company to an internship at a construction company my pay did not differ by all that much. The only downside of construction versus finance, from what I have seen, is that the stress levels and turnover rate are much higher. That being said, I would argue that my earning potential is probably higher given my particular situation since I want to get into real estate development and developers pay a lot of money for people who actually have hands on experience in getting a building built.



Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis February 06, 2015 11:53 PM  

That's just it. There shouldn't be degrees in English, History, Sociology
You and I are in agreement for the most part, or rather, if those degrees should exist, then they should be made so difficult that only the truly most dedicated would ever acquire them. My second degree is in the liberal arts and earning it was a joke.

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