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Friday, March 06, 2015

A portrait in petty atheism

I had to laugh when Richard Carrier, a fourth-rate atheist who has aspired to the dubious mantle of Richard Dawkins, came out with the news that he is every bit as immoral and untrustworthy as one would expect a cartoon atheist to be:
Two big items of news in my personal life. Which both entail a very public change to my relationship status. After twenty years of marriage Jen and I have decided to get a divorce. Breakups are always painful, but we still love each other and remain friends, and there are few contentions between us. We wish each other all happiness. But we are no longer a good fit for each other.

Everyone always asks why, and the answer is important to my life development, so I want to relate at least the core of it, and a caveat.

Several years ago, after about seventeen years of marriage, I had a few brief affairs, because I found myself unequipped to handle certain unusual circumstances in our marriage, which I won’t discuss here because they intrude on my wife’s privacy. In the process of that I also came to realize I can’t do monogamy and be happy. Since this was going to come to light eventually, about two years ago I confessed all of this to Jen and told her I still love her but I would certainly understand if she wanted a divorce. Despite all the ways we work together and were happy together, this one piece didn’t fit anymore.

Had I known several years ago that polyamory was an actual option that works for people, I might have realized this sooner, and dealt with it better. But I labored instead to meet the cultural expectation that you are supposed to make monogamy work, and it wasn’t working. Discovering that other ways of life are possible helped me understand I shouldn’t be doing this.

Rather than divorce right away, Jen offered to try an alternative for a while to see if that would work for us. So we agreed on some rules and have had an open marriage for almost two years now, and it’s helped us work through a lot of things, and has helped us both in very different ways. But one of those things is the mutual understanding that we aren’t compatible with each other. So we have decided to amicably divorce–using a facilitator rather than lawyers, since we’re in agreement about all the material things, and have no interest in hurting each other.

The part about being open hasn’t been entirely a secret these last years (quite a few people were informed or aware, just not the general public), but Jen hadn’t come out to her family, so out of respect for her privacy I hadn’t blogged about it or discussed it publicly. But she has informed everyone close to her now, and we are no longer together. So I can make it official:

I am polyamorous.
What amuses me is all the pseudo-intellectual justifications. Even now, he can't just come out and admit it. He wants to have sex with whomever he wants, whenever he wants, without any constraints or commitments. He can't admit that he has done anything wrong, much less sinned by breaking his vows.

Considering that men like this, Richard Dawkins, and Sam Harris are supposedly the best the atheists have to offer, no wonder so few people are buying into their bullshit.

Men are fallen. Marriages fail. Mistakes are made. But it takes a truly deceitful pseudo-intellectual to try to change the narrative in this sort of ridiculous manner.

UPDATE: Carrier, who apparently has found atheism to be considerably less lucrative than Dawkins and Harris, as he only makes $15,000/year and lived off his ex-wife, has some entirely unsurprising news about atheist conferences:
Indeed, many of my friends in the atheist community are polyamorous or actively participate in the BDSM or swinging communities, some even have orgies and sex parties... at atheist conferences!
I don't mean to short-circuit your brain, but it suddenly strikes me that PZ Myers travels to a lot of atheist conferences.... Carrier readily confirms one's assumption that he is a nasty, disingenuous little prick in the comments, a pure Gamma male with delusions of Alpha. He's almost exactly the sort of atheist that most atheists are desperate to convince theists they themselves are not.

I never had any regard for him or his arguments. A few atheists had recommended him as a more worthy foe than Dawkins or Harris a few years ago, but it was very clear to me that he was just another wannabe who was in well over his head. He's an intellectual nothing who isn't even worthy of contempt.

Labels:

139 Comments:

Blogger MATT March 06, 2015 1:21 PM  

Unusual circumstances that he cant publish becauae it will violate his wifes privacy..

These men are sleazy cowards. Im not at all surprised to hear about pretebd male feminists maintaining a small harem.

Atheists have nothing to offer. Just imitation.

Blogger Nate March 06, 2015 1:23 PM  

Let me show you my shocked face...

Blogger MATT March 06, 2015 1:25 PM  

I imagine hom taking a deep breath, turning to look at his reflection in a partially obscured mirror, then looking back at the screen as he typed "I am a polyamorist". What an insufferable douchebag.

Blogger John March 06, 2015 1:26 PM  

So, is this Gamma behavior? I would imagine an Alpha, Beta, or Sigma wouldn't offer justifications for their choices a la "Fuck you, that's why."

Anonymous Wyrd March 06, 2015 1:31 PM  

This past Christmas, I read C.S. Lewis' The Discarded Image and marveled at the model he presented, especially considering the ancients viewed our immediate reality as a distorted mirror image of the Divine where we were not at the center of Creation but actually on the fringes. All things orbit God, eternal and unchanging, followed by the prime mover, then the stars, the planets, and finally we on the outskirts. How wise they were while we are so ignorant in this Science! age.

Anonymous WinstonWebb March 06, 2015 1:32 PM  

I've misplaced my Smarmy Jackass Decoder Ring, so someone please help me out here. Does his use of "polyamorous" mean he is bisexual?

Blogger David March 06, 2015 1:32 PM  

Just another screw-up in the public eye.

Why do people delude themselves into thinking anyone else gives a rat's ass about their sex lives? TMI everywhere.
Our over-sharing social-media-saturated world has rendered discourse a cesspool with awards going to those who share the most repugnant, icky details of their vices.

Atheist or theist, I see the same thing across the board. Should we judge the typical person among the faithful by the marriage of the Bakers?

Anonymous kfg March 06, 2015 1:36 PM  

"Does his use of "polyamorous" mean he is bisexual?"

Naaaaah, it just means the little bitch is a slut.

Blogger Azimus March 06, 2015 1:37 PM  

He says "Had I known several years ago that polyamory was an actual option that works for people..." but then trying it out with his wife didn't work because they're divorcing. So - it clearly doesn't work for him.

Blogger MATT March 06, 2015 1:40 PM  

His wife is a plain fattie.

Anonymous Stilicho March 06, 2015 1:42 PM  

Does his use of "polyamorous" mean he is bisexual?

Hah! Could be, but judging from the article it seems to be more "I got caught sleeping around while my wife was ill and now I need to justify my bad behavior".

Whatever happened to the honest atheists and "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law"?

Blogger Midnight Avenue J March 06, 2015 1:43 PM  

Atheism means never having to say your sorry.

Polyamorists are weird - Newsflash! I worked at a hippie vegetarian food co-op for a while. They had an "all purpose room" where community groups could meet. Every other Thursday night was the "Polyamory Support Group" meeting night. They'd come downstairs after their meetings grabbing and kissing each other right in the aisles of the store. One couple couldn't wait, once, and went for it in the alleyway behind the shop.

Well and good, I suppose. It was my first exposure to such a culture and it was rather revolting.

Anonymous patrick kelly March 06, 2015 1:43 PM  

Anyone read his "historical Jesus" books? Does he bring anything new, or just regurgitated stuff that has been asked and answered for centuries?

Blogger Midnight Avenue J March 06, 2015 1:45 PM  

As to why they needed a "support group": They were weirdos and knew it, and needed to justify their existence and bad behavior. Part of the same group of people who push acceptance and tolerance without regard to the mechanics of civilization.

Certainly, life has been too easy for too long for too many.

Blogger CM March 06, 2015 1:45 PM  

Our over-sharing social-media-saturated world has rendered discourse a cesspool with awards going to those who share the most repugnant, icky details of their vices.

I often wonder if its a response to heterosexual openness...

I would never post "I got laid last night!" On facebook. However, 4+ weeks later I may announce "I'm pregnant! Due xx/xx/xx" and anyone with half a brain would know I got laid that night.

Anonymous Crude March 06, 2015 1:46 PM  

I recall that when Atheism+ was starting up, Carrier tried to run to the absolute front of that group and act as a leader.

What's up with the male feminists always treating their women like shit?

Anonymous wEz March 06, 2015 1:46 PM  

I'm just surprised that any true atheist would partake in such an archaic thing such as marriage! Let alone limiting their sexual expression and personal autonomy!? WTF.
What a sad, sad, lot of conformity they are.

Blogger Vox March 06, 2015 1:48 PM  

So, is this Gamma behavior?

Yep. The lengthy self-justification, the posing as the victim, the complete inability to take responsibility, it's all right there. You can be certain that NONE of the women involved are hot.

Anonymous Salt March 06, 2015 1:51 PM  

His wife is a plain fattie.

Richard Carrier says ... February 19, 2015 at 8:03 pm

Jen kept the cat, whom she loves dearly.


Probably the first of many.

Blogger Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus March 06, 2015 1:56 PM  

"I am polyamorous."

Which if you've ever seen his picture, is quite surprising.

Blogger ajw308 March 06, 2015 1:57 PM  

Does his use of "polyamorous" mean he is bisexual?
Might be try-sexual, he'll try anything.

Why does an athiest even bother with an institution ordained by God in the first place? "While I don't believe in God, I want everything He has to offer" It's attitudes like that that make me think atheists never matured past the spoiled selfish kid phase.

Blogger Log March 06, 2015 1:58 PM  

Because libertinism undermines atheism or atheists. Somehow.

Blogger Log March 06, 2015 2:00 PM  

Or, alternatively, "As if libertinism wasn't a selling point for atheism."

Blogger Guitar Man March 06, 2015 2:04 PM  

The comments over on his blog are just as pathetic as his admission. They're congratulating him on coming out.

Blogger Karl March 06, 2015 2:08 PM  

long, interesting read from John Gray -

What scares the new atheists

For 21st century atheist missionaries, being liberal and scientific in outlook are one and the same.

It’s a reassuringly simple equation. In fact there are no reliable connections – whether in logic or history – between atheism, science and liberal values. When organised as a movement and backed by the power of the state, atheist ideologies have been an integral part of despotic regimes that also claimed to be based in science, such as the former Soviet Union. Many rival moralities and political systems – most of them, to date, illiberal – have attempted to assert a basis in science. All have been fraudulent and ephemeral. Yet the attempt continues in atheist movements today, which claim that liberal values can be scientifically validated and are therefore humanly universal.

Anonymous Toddy Cat March 06, 2015 2:11 PM  

Wow, in terms of logic, decency to opponents, and argumentation, Carrier was the best of the lot. What does that say about the rest of them?

Anonymous Heh March 06, 2015 2:14 PM  

"I found myself unequipped to handle certain unusual circumstances in our marriage, which I won’t discuss here because they intrude on my wife’s privacy."

She got tired of wearing the strap-on and letting him call her "daddy".

Anonymous Peter Pan March 06, 2015 2:15 PM  

This kind of thing makes me wonder how long it will take before the Mormons start openly practicing again.

Anonymous Heh March 06, 2015 2:16 PM  

"I am polyamorous."

Translation -- I love all five of my fingers!

Anonymous Salt March 06, 2015 2:17 PM  

Is this the poly he's looking for? Here Poly Poly Poly...

Anonymous Tom B March 06, 2015 2:18 PM  

Carrier is a narcissistic personality. His debate with my friend JP Holding was at best a mild loss for Carrier, but to hear him tell it he fatally bitchslapped JP and pissed on his grave.

And then his feeble attempt to get the Christ-myth theory a seat at the table of legitimate religious scholarship... His book is laughable! James McGrath, a well-known NT scholar, who is a PROGRESSIVE politically speaking (he subscribes to my FB page "The Biblical Scholar's Clearinghouse" - and no, that wasn't a plug), is doing a review of Carrier's book and he's thrashing it around like a crocodile who's caught a baby gazelle.

And now he comes out as a poly!?! He just got his Ph.D, and now that he's completed that, he discards the woman who stood by him so he can diddle pimple-faced freshmen. Pathetic.

Anonymous Stickwick March 06, 2015 2:18 PM  

I've noticed more than a few atheists have similar difficulty with monogamy, and rationalize it in the same way. A lot of atheists also seem to be gammas. Perhaps their rejection of God is the Alpha-hating that Vox has been describing -- Who put this sky-daddy in charge? *I* should be in charge! Also consistent with gammahood is their reverential attitude about Mother Nature/Gaia.

Anonymous Titus Didius Tacitus March 06, 2015 2:19 PM  

Stilicho: "Whatever happened to the honest atheists and "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law"?"

Drugs.

Blogger Maple Curtain March 06, 2015 2:24 PM  

I think you're being too hard on them - they're just "differently moral-ed."

Different rules for supermen (and narcissists).

"I can do what I choose. Rules are for lesser beings."

Anonymous mistaben March 06, 2015 2:26 PM  

@Peter Pan
This kind of thing makes me wonder how long it will take before the Mormons start openly practicing again.

Right, because above all Mormons are known for being early adopters of radical socio-sexual trends.

/facepalm

Anonymous Titus Didius Tacitus March 06, 2015 2:26 PM  

Stickwick: "Also consistent with gammahood is their reverential attitude about Mother Nature/Gaia."

Gaia is a goddess. Atheists aren't classical pagans. And they don't have the strengths of classical pagans.

When you decide your own will is supreme and neither gods nor nature have anything to say about it, the slide into the pit is smooth and steep.

Anonymous rho March 06, 2015 2:28 PM  

Yep. The lengthy self-justification, the posing as the victim, the complete inability to take responsibility, it's all right there.

Oh, you haven't even seen half of the self-important bloviating.

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 2:30 PM  

"I am polyamorous."

Which if you've ever seen his picture, is quite surprising.


It really isn't. Most polyamorous people I've met in real life or seen on the internet are unattractive.

Well, let me be more specific. The people who out-and-out label themselves as polyamorous are usually unattractive and overweight. The naturally polyamorous without-the-label, like a college athlete and his harem of sluts, are usually physically attractive people who aren't kidding themselves that they're seriously "polyamorous". They're much more honest, if not conscious, about their situation.

Blogger Jim March 06, 2015 2:32 PM  

I'm always amused by these people. "Marriage isn't for me because I prefer to have multiple partners." No shit. So does most of humanity. That's why marriage exists. If we were all swans we wouldn't need it.

OpenID lostsailor32 March 06, 2015 2:33 PM  

Her: "What are you, one of those 'pick-up artist' players or something?"

Me: "Nah, darlin', I'm just polyamorous...."

Polyamory! Now SJW Approved!®

Blogger dw March 06, 2015 2:44 PM  

"Perhaps their rejection of God is the Alpha-hating that Vox has been describing -- Who put this sky-daddy in charge? *I* should be in charge!"

Yeah its basically "I hate you Dad" writ large. Dad disapproves of their drug habit, so Hes an asshole...who also doesnt exist.

Blogger Vox March 06, 2015 2:44 PM  

Damn, you weren't kidding, rho. I had to add an update. He's like a caricature of everyone's idea of an atheist. What a joke!

Anonymous Stickwick March 06, 2015 2:45 PM  

Polyamorous... didn't these guys just used to be called swingers or wife-swappers?

Marissa: The people who out-and-out label themselves as polyamorous are usually unattractive and overweight.

Yes. I remember one old swinger trying to convince me of how wonderful his lifestyle was, because they were very accepting of all body types. Which, based on his description, turned out to mean lots of flab and wrinkles. I've seen very explicit photos of what goes on at the Folsom Street Fair, and I was frankly more disgusted by this guy's description and rationalization of his "polyamorous" lifestyle (although not by much).

Blogger Thordaddy March 06, 2015 2:48 PM  

The "tie that binds" the jihadist to the atheist is radical sexual autonomy whether that be seventy-two "virgins" for eternal smashings or some sexually ambiguous polyamorous endeavor.

Blogger Midnight Avenue J March 06, 2015 2:51 PM  

@Stickwick, my experience with the Polys was lock-step in line with Marissa's observations: fat, middle- to old-age, not conventionally attractive or even on the fringes (where some work and a good diet would help).

You're initial reply hits at the heart of the matter. They are gamma in the context of life has cheated them and they will use any tool they have to win, be it redefining mores or forcing change on society in order to make their asocial proclivities acceptable.

Blogger natschuster March 06, 2015 2:52 PM  

I was under the impression that, in women, polyamorousness is actually a sign of deep unhappiness. Women don't want to sleep around unless they are covering up something painful inside. Even the Bible says that a woman's desire ios for her husband, not fro everyone single male she encounters. Heck, even the most liberated woman gets offended by off-color jokes. That's one of the reason that it was historically considered ungentlemanly and caddish for a man to be polyamorousness. So I really don't think that being polyamorous works.

Anonymous Hope Change Hillary 2016 March 06, 2015 2:54 PM  

"I am polyamorous" = I give head

Anonymous Stickwick March 06, 2015 2:57 PM  

Indeed, many of my friends in the atheist community are polyamorous or actively participate in the BDSM or swinging communities, some even have orgies and sex parties... at atheist conferences!

I was going to say something about BDSM in my previous comment, but I thought that might've been taking it too far. Apparently not. Elaborating on what Marissa was saying, I've also noticed that, far from this 50 Shades nonsense, people who are into BDSM tend to be rather unattractive, as well. I remember flipping on the tube the last time I was in Vancouver, and seeing a CBC show about BDSM*, featuring a fat, graying couple half-heartedly spanking each other. It's hard to know whether to laugh or cry over the fact that people are willing to forgo eternity for something so pathetically sinful.

* On the public channel on a weekday at 4:00 pm, just in time for the kids to come home from school and turn on the TV.

Blogger Jassi March 06, 2015 2:57 PM  

Reading Carrier's comments over there on FTB reminds me of the Kids in the Hall skit with the heroin addicted teacher played by Dave Foley when he says-

"Me and my wife had an open relationship but I could never find a way to tell her.... So when she found out about our understanding by accident.. i guess you could say it left me scarred.."

Carrier knew he couldn't hide his cheating anymore, so he looked for some fake social movement to justify it before revealing his failures. Polyamory always seemed to be nothing more than a way for guilty-feeling sex addicts to get out of going to sexaholics anonymous meetings.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NxurA-twvI

Anonymous Huckleberry -- est. 1977 March 06, 2015 2:57 PM  

You know, someone should really tell these people that unrestrained hedonism has a sell-by date.
Orgies at 25 I understand.
Orgies at 55 reads like desperate people staving off uncomfortable thoughts of death and meaninglessness while impotently raging against the dying of their fading light.

Blogger SamuraiJack March 06, 2015 3:07 PM  

So in other words, he's a scumbag. We are all fallen but those who justify it, like Vox said, are the worst. Using terms like poly-whatever the fuck, is just hilarious. He's transparent. Another godless simpleton. I pity the moron...

Anonymous Wyrd March 06, 2015 3:08 PM  

Gaia is a goddess. Atheists aren't classical pagans. And they don't have the strengths of classical pagans.

Atheists aren't classical pagans only in the sense they cheer on Typhon instead of Zeus.

Blogger slarrow March 06, 2015 3:08 PM  

You know, I keep reading all the posts here and on Alpha Game about "gamma", and after a while I tend to get a little skeptical. Can it really be that a broad set of generalizations can really pin down an individual person? Are these personality profiles more like horoscopes than accurate descriptions of how people really live? Wouldn't I have heard more about that before now if that were true?

And then I find out about people like this Richard Carrier and read his confession and follow the conversations stemming from rho's link and HOLY CRAP! It's twue! It's all twue! The verbal diarrhea, the insistence that he is right and all others are wrong, declaring victory in the face of all available evidence, and the utter lack of other-awareness that makes him think he's winning mightily when he's losing badly.

And once again, one of these "modern" bravehearts thinks he's breaking new ground by embracing his "polyamory" but doing so in an oh-so-ethical manner. I hate to keep reaching for The Gods of the Copybook Headings, but dang me if it just keeps being right about so much:

On the first Feminian Sandstones we were promised the Fuller Life
(Which started by loving our neighbour and ended by loving his wife)
Till our women had no more children and the men lost reason and faith,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "The Wages of Sin is Death."

Anonymous Daniel March 06, 2015 3:10 PM  

Shudder.

I bet those parties look like a pale version of Cthulhu's face.

...or if you prefer, a flying spaghetti monster.

Never visit VP within an hour of eating. Never.

Anonymous Huckleberry -- est. 1977 March 06, 2015 3:15 PM  

Never visit VP within an hour of eating. Never.

Don't follow the links in the comments at any rate.

Anonymous Daniel March 06, 2015 3:18 PM  

I think Gamma needs a subset: Polygamorous - Gammas who are too old and ugly to maintain a single co-dependent relationship so they instead elect to have sporadic semi-committed relations with a pile of manatees.

He's a Carrier, all right.

OpenID cailcorishev March 06, 2015 3:20 PM  

Does his use of "polyamorous" mean he is bisexual?

It means he wants everyone to know (or think) he gets laid a lot. The whole thing is one long humble-brag.

Anonymous Randy M March 06, 2015 3:21 PM  

If you want to see an intersectionality train-wreck, you can check out Starslatecodex defending the 'polyamory community' from charges of racism. Brings into focus the contradictions built into the sjw coalition of the fringe, as I think Steve Sailer calls it.
(Scott's a pretty interesting writing all in all, it just gets cringe inducing when he turns to his romantic life)

Anonymous kh123 March 06, 2015 3:26 PM  

A brave, free spirit who blames society for his having followed its lead (PRESSURE!) and for his own personal failures.

Presidential material.

Anonymous Wyrd March 06, 2015 3:26 PM  

Scott Alexander makes a fool of Nick Land yet again.

Anonymous BluntForceTrauma March 06, 2015 3:28 PM  

In an article on FreeThoughtBlogs.com entitled "The Eros of the Podium" PZMyers leaves a couple comments that he, himself, has been propositioned at conferences but "gently" declined.

Link: http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterfliesandwheels/2013/08/the-eros-of-the-podium/#comment-612602

Anonymous kh123 March 06, 2015 3:30 PM  

"...sporadic semi-committed relations with a pile of manatees."

Safe bet he's an evolutionist, so why not. If Jane Goodall and Dian Fossey could do it.

Anonymous Daniel March 06, 2015 3:36 PM  

PZMyers leaves a couple comments that he, himself, has been propositioned at conferences but "gently" declined.

Gentle decline, what is that? A euphemism for erectile dysfunction?

Or maybe a passage from Rapeshirts:

"He gently declined into her soft, blubbery conference proposition..."

Anonymous Samson J. March 06, 2015 3:38 PM  

This isn't surprising in the least. In our age, sexual sin is the number one driver of atheism.

It usually happens in college. People will try to portray the causality in a certain direction: "I read a bunch of arguments demolishing Christianity, and then I realized... why bother refraining from sex?!?" That's what they'll *say* - but the truth is the opposite: they started having sex and turned to atheism to justify it.

I've seen this time and again from internet atheists. I mention this for the benefit of those who may be new or weak in the faith.

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 3:38 PM  

I've also noticed that, far from this 50 Shades nonsense, people who are into BDSM tend to be rather unattractive, as well.

Yes, it seems that the people who are loudest about their deviant sexuality are typically the most unattractive. Even in homosexuals this is apparent, but less so.

Anonymous Quartermaster March 06, 2015 3:41 PM  

"Does his use of "polyamorous" mean he is bisexual?"

It means he's not faithful to one woman. He simply refuses to grow up and have an adult relationship with one woman.

Anonymous anon69 March 06, 2015 3:43 PM  

My wife and I happened to meet another couple on our honeymoon that happened to be swingers.

The other couple was surpisingly attractive. They picked up that we were *not interested* but we had nice conversation over cocktails because we were simply curious about the lifestyle.

The way they did it was that they only hooked up with other couples, and they only swapped partners with the partners in the same room. Basically, your hotel with double beds scenario. Doing it this way seemed to make it a shared experience for them *as a couple*. Mentally, they were having sex with each other, even though physically they were being stimulated by someone else.

Not my cup of tea, but I would sort of see how structuring infidelity in such a cooperative way is relativly sane, at least compared with swingers and polyamory people.

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 3:44 PM  

However, Carrier has occasionally made creepy posts about bizarre sexual topics that seem out of place for a blog focused on philosophy. Examples of this include a philosophical discussion regarding gangbangs, a post that briefly discusses the artistic value of “throat-gagging” and “facial cumshots” in pornography, and another post where Carrier laments the lack of response he received from appearing in erotic art (the erotic picture is included in the post for those interested),

I'm a normal (straight) woman. I don't understand why a man would want to appear in erotic art, as most women are not turned on by the visual of a man sexily hamming it up for the camera (which is why erotica is more popular among women). Is this guy part-fairy?

Blogger Vox March 06, 2015 3:47 PM  

And then I find out about people like this Richard Carrier and read his confession and follow the conversations stemming from rho's link and HOLY CRAP! It's twue! It's all twue! The verbal diarrhea, the insistence that he is right and all others are wrong, declaring victory in the face of all available evidence, and the utter lack of other-awareness that makes him think he's winning mightily when he's losing badly.

Sometimes you have to see before you can believe. But what some fail to keep in mind is that I didn't INVENT anything. There was nothing creative about it. I merely OBSERVED and DESCRIBED.

Blogger bob k. mando March 06, 2015 3:56 PM  

BluntForceTrauma March 06, 2015 3:28 PM
PZMyers leaves a couple comments that he, himself, has been propositioned at conferences



and, thence, we observe the amazing powers of even the most ersatz Extrinsic Alpha.


"PZ Myers
Except…I was really surprised the first time a woman at a conference offered me her hotel key. I know I’m not personally attractive or otherwise appealing in any physical way, and it was simply that eroticism of intellectual stimulation, as you mentioned, and the impulse to indulge in a fleeting crush. You know speakers get a little edge from that position when I’m getting sexual opportunities!"


a "fleeting crush"? a one night stand after a speech is a "fleeting crush"?

yeah, i had a "fleeting crush" on that stripper, that's why i was putting dollas in her coochie to make her holla.

i was just being true to my emotional self.

there's nothing these people can bring themselves to tell the truth about.


also, remember the Atheist bimbo who moved to NV and became a whore? you think she wasn't doing this, for free, previously?

Anonymous Peter Pan March 06, 2015 3:57 PM  

@mistaben
Right, because above all Mormons are known for being early adopters of radical socio-sexual trends.

/facepalm


No, they aren't. But they do have a history of polygamy. It's not hard to see them returning to it considering the tenants of it still exist in their doctrine. A large reason they don't currently practice is because of the formerly high social and legal pressure on them to cease. As both of those pressures begin to erode, it's not exactly outside the bounds of reason to speculate when they might return to it.

Blogger Danby March 06, 2015 4:01 PM  

1) all men are "polyamorous" by nature. To quote Zeus "I'm gonna stick my dick in it."
Somehow his undisciplined behavior is okay if he gives it a pseudo latin/greek name.

2)Carrier laments the lack of response he received from appearing in erotic art"
I don't understand why a man would want to appear in erotic art


If he's doing porn for the chance to bang hot chicks, he doesn't care about the camera. If he's doing it for money he's just a porn actor. If he's doing it for audience response, he's gay.

Blogger bob k. mando March 06, 2015 4:02 PM  

Marissa March 06, 2015 3:38 PM
Yes, it seems that the people who are loudest about their deviant sexuality are typically the most unattractive.



you ain't kidding.

i worked with a guy in Sun Prairie who claimed to be a Dom ... with his own dungeon.

he was skinny but had nothing else going for him. even had bad teeth.

he would often regale us with tales of his adventures ( whether we wanted to know or not ). most amusing was the time he was complaining about a woman who had packed on 50+ lbs since she had taken her photo and how he had to drink a six pack in order to 'service' her.

i was just sitting there wondering how much SHE had had to drink in order to let him tie her up ...

this is, of course, amusing he's not just making the whole thing up.

Anonymous Homesteader March 06, 2015 4:03 PM  

It's the utter banality of it. Do they flatter themselves that it's new? That the utter tediousness of their enslavement to appetite somehow escapes our gaze?

Pauline Reage. De Sade. John Cleland. Ovid. The O.T. Kama Sutra. etc.

Oh, wait. We're Americans. Special. History's that irrelevant subject we no longer bother with. Because Grad skool, and feelings.

God, I loathe these insects.

Blogger Danby March 06, 2015 4:06 PM  

And the CJCLDS has never repudiated polygamy, simply instructed the faithful that it's inappropriate at this time.

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 4:08 PM  

If he's doing porn for the chance to bang hot chicks, he doesn't care about the camera. If he's doing it for money he's just a porn actor. If he's doing it for audience response, he's gay.

"another post where Carrier laments the lack of response he received from appearing in erotic art (the erotic picture is included in the post for those interested)"

I have no desire to look at his post which includes his picture, but I assume this "art" only involves Carrier, and the closest woman is miles away. It is not traditional pornography.

Anonymous Stickwick March 06, 2015 4:18 PM  

However, Carrier has occasionally made creepy posts about bizarre sexual topics that seem out of place for a blog focused on philosophy. Examples of this include...

Reminds me of one of the theater professors I knew, who held the record for most complaints lodged against a professor by students. His schtick was to show explicit pornography in lectures, and to talk about penises. A lot. Students didn't know what any of this had to do with theater, and his attempts to tangentially relate this stuff to the subject of the course were less than convincing. (You will all be stunned senseless to know that he was married to one of the women's studies professors, who was a flaming nutbar.) For some reason, people who indulge in deviant behavior just can't help themselves, and feel compelled to talk about it. I dunno if it's catharsis or an attempt to gain absolution or what, but they seem to look for any excuse, no matter how flimsy, to talk about their weird interests.

Blogger Danby March 06, 2015 4:18 PM  

Then not just gay but FABULOUS!
Look at me everybody! See my penis!

Blogger CM March 06, 2015 4:23 PM  

I dunno if it's catharsis or an attempt to gain absolution or what, but they seem to look for any excuse, no matter how flimsy, to talk about their weird interests.

An attempt to FEEL normal? Like they project thinking normal people talk about it all the time.

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 4:30 PM  

For some reason, people who indulge in deviant behavior just can't help themselves, and feel compelled to talk about it. I dunno if it's catharsis or an attempt to gain absolution or what, but they seem to look for any excuse, no matter how flimsy, to talk about their weird interests.

So true. That professor sounds awful!

Anonymous patrick kelly March 06, 2015 4:32 PM  

@Vox:"Sometimes you have to see before you can believe. "

I've read some of the exchanges and comments between him and other "historical Jesus" authors. None of his schtick is new or enlightening, just the same ole' stuff that's been asked and answered for centuries. Even Ehrman schools him quite hard.....

Blogger bob k. mando March 06, 2015 4:40 PM  

Stickwick March 06, 2015 4:18 PM
I dunno if it's catharsis or an attempt to gain absolution or what, but they seem to look for any excuse, no matter how flimsy, to talk about their weird interests.



they're seeking to socially normalize their behavior.

and why shouldn't they? it's a strategy that's working out fantastically well for the queers.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2015/03/04/abc-familys-the-fosters-airs-youngest-ever-gay-kiss-between-two-13-year-old-boys/


you got that? this is considered fair fit for the "ABC Family" channel.

Anonymous George March 06, 2015 4:45 PM  

I just think it's humorous how these people "come out" as polyamorous. Born that way!

Blogger CM March 06, 2015 4:48 PM  

you got that? this is considered fair fit for the "ABC Family" channel

The only time ABC Family has anything family oriented is weekend nights when they marathon disney movies or HP. Very rarely do they have something any teenager shouldn't turn beat red watching in front of mom & dad.

Anonymous daddynichol March 06, 2015 5:07 PM  

Dr. Dick Carrier. Apt name for a human Petri dish for communicable diseases. To good doctor should realize that it's not his intellect that's leading him around.

Anonymous BluntForceTrauma March 06, 2015 5:14 PM  

@Samson J. and yours of March 06, 2015 3:38 PM: I agree.

I could see the relief on my college-mates faces as they learned that the "Higher Criticism" school debunked the veracity of the Bible. "Thank you, Jesus, that they've demolished my requirement to obey Christian teaching!"

Almost all philosophies (like rock bands) are fancy excuses to justify banging hot chicks.

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 5:22 PM  

I regretfully went to the link in Vox's update where Carrier is defending himself (poorly). He was criticized for liking his own posts and here's his response:

Liking is called promotion. Promotion is what artists and writers and thinkers do to increase the chance people will notice and read their work, so their ideas will have a greater impact on society.

So unless you think all published writers and academics are narcissists merely because they market their work and ideas, you kind of suck at diagnosing psychological disorders. (Or even understanding what they are. Narcissism is not any manifestation of self interest or the seeking of goals. Otherwise all Christians are Narcissists because they actively pursue their own eternal life. And you are a narcissist because you so desperately wanted others to read your thoughts, you went out of your way to publicly publish them just now.)

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 5:27 PM  

Another comment by a woman who allowed this slime into her, uh slime: Husband knew I had sex with Richard the moment I got home from actually doing it. He giggled about it.

Blogger IM2L844 March 06, 2015 5:36 PM  

Atheism is nothing more than a systematic justification for short time preferences.

Anonymous Heh March 06, 2015 5:38 PM  

"Whatever happened to the honest atheists and "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law"?"

Aleister Crowley was a lot of things, but neither honest nor atheist was one of them.

Anonymous Educated Progressive March 06, 2015 5:44 PM  

"Carrier, who apparently has found atheism to be considerably less lucrative than Dawkins and Harris, as he only makes $15,000/year and lived off his ex-wife"

You can mock us, but those of us who devote ourselves to reason, logic and science are not after money or jobs or wealth.

Those who deny science (like Vox Day) are often greedy, or have rich dads, or work for corporations.
Ironically, the Christian gets his job or wealth by screwing over others, or defiling the Earth. This why evangelicals and Catholics vote Republican. It also explains their warmongering, homophobia and racism.

I am proud of my unemployment. Just as I am proud to vote Democrat, and proud to support Reason, Logic, Science and Atheism, and proudly Gay.

In many ways, we atheists are more like Jesus than you Christians in turning away greed and money. We atheists love Humanity more than money, we love Humanity more than the Church.

Blogger CM March 06, 2015 5:49 PM  

Ironically, the Christian gets his job or wealth by screwing over others, or defiling the Earth.

/beat head on wall

Its more painless than responding.

On a slightly related deviant note, Florida is trying to pass a transgender non-discrimination bill.

TX doesn't have this, does it? I want to move to TX.

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 6:08 PM  

CM, in Houston we have just such a law, thanks in part to our lesbian mayor.

Blogger CM March 06, 2015 6:13 PM  

Marissa,

How is it affecting your community?

Blogger Marissa March 06, 2015 6:17 PM  

CM, I don't know, I haven't really looked into it. But what it basically means is that men can use women's bathrooms and vice-versa. You can see how that gets really hairy when children are using the john. I don't go to the queer parts of Houston, so I haven't experienced anything myself. This was pushed by City Council and even though a very large petition was signed to put this issue on the ballot as a referendum, some dubious disqualification of the petition came from either city hall, the county or the state.

Anonymous Ugh March 06, 2015 6:30 PM  

"I don't go to the queer parts of Houston,"

You know the world has pretty much ended when Houston, or any city in Texas, even HAS a "queer part".

Blogger Guitar Man March 06, 2015 6:45 PM  

Ugh, not familiar with the queers and steers?

Blogger CM March 06, 2015 6:48 PM  

Ugh, not familiar with the queers and steers?

His name is so fitting. Ugh is right.

Anonymous tiredofitall March 06, 2015 6:49 PM  

"Reminds me of one of the theater professors I knew, who held the record for most complaints lodged against a professor by students. His schtick was to show explicit pornography in lectures, and to talk about penises. A lot." - Stickwick

Funnily enough I think I found video of your professor in action.

Anonymous Red Comet March 06, 2015 6:55 PM  

Atheists worship leftism with a fanaticism that would put the devotion of the average churchian to shame.

You want to black knight an atheist group hard then accuse them of being an Islamophobic hate organization.

Blogger Kirk Parker March 06, 2015 7:20 PM  

Wyrd,

Nice of you to cite The Discarded Image. It's on my short list for the Most Underappreciated Book of Modern Times award (Abolition of Man, another Lewis volume, is also a contender, but it isn't quite as strong in the "unrecognized" department.)

Blogger Kirk Parker March 06, 2015 7:40 PM  

Vox,

"I didn't INVENT anything. There was nothing creative about it. I merely OBSERVED and DESCRIBED."

No kidding. The stuff that my dear wife comes up with from time to time (and heck, even my wonderful, dearly departed non-drama-queen stoical Scot/Swedish mother) that confirms the red-pill view of these things is amazing.

OpenID trunthepaige March 06, 2015 7:43 PM  

Funny this guy sound exactly like JT Eberhart. All I need to hear is that he also tells sob stories about his mental health trying to get his loyal atheist followers to send him money and we have a carbon copy. These guys are worthless less than honest wimps

Anonymous BigGaySteve March 06, 2015 7:47 PM  

"Orgies at 55 reads like desperate people staving off uncomfortable thoughts of death and meaninglessness while impotently raging against the dying of their fading light."

That's why gay billionaires end up breaking up with boyfriends when they hit 21, they are too old for them. http://www.wehoconfidential.com/2012/02/gay-billionaire-david-geffen-is-back-on.html

"Does his use of "polyamorous" mean he is bisexual?"
He is implying he is like Brigham Young but without the responsibility.

"I don't go to the queer parts of Houston,"
I have been to Houston, are there any nice/clean parts? You forgot about how the lesbian mayor was demanding copies of all the churches sermons, because she thought they where talking about her. http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/oct/15/houston-backs-off-church-sermon-subpoenas-in-trans/?page=all

Atheists worship equalism their core belief that no one is better than them.

Anonymous Blastman March 06, 2015 7:48 PM  

most amusing was the time he was complaining about a woman who had packed on 50+ lbs since she had taken her photo …

And we wouldn't want to call her fat … cause you know … fat shaming. She's … "food enhanced".

OpenID trunthepaige March 06, 2015 7:55 PM  

I noticed that some of you guys are hung up on the idea of lots of girls and orgies and all that. Have any of you guys seen the girls who go to atheist conventions? They are not very attractive girls. But then the guys at those conferences are even worse looking and out number the girls 10 to 1. Likely those orgies are mostly sausage parties

Anonymous sapoo March 06, 2015 8:03 PM  

"He's almost exactly the sort of atheist that most atheists are desperate to convince theists they themselves are not."

Best quote ever.

Blogger Eric Hanson March 06, 2015 8:22 PM  

So, it took him 17 years to get the nerve to extra-marital his junk? Then another three years to come to the conclusion that he's polyhorny? Did he also come to realize he's an atheist in that time? or was he already "enlightened"? The fact that so many are unable to navigate the logical conclusions of the their belief (or non-belief) amazes me.

Blogger Eric March 06, 2015 8:30 PM  

Gentle decline, what is that? A euphemism for erectile dysfunction?

In a way, probably. If a 450 pound woman approaches and invites me to an orgy, my philosophical proclivities aside, I'm not going.

Anonymous Ugh March 06, 2015 8:35 PM  

Ugh, not familiar with the queers and steers?

It was funny the first time a drill instructor said it in 1898. Since then, not so much.

Blogger Corvinus March 06, 2015 8:48 PM  

Another comment by a woman who allowed this slime into her, uh slime: Husband knew I had sex with Richard the moment I got home from actually doing it. He giggled about it.

@Marissa
Heh. Not surprised at all.

Blogger Guitar Man March 06, 2015 9:14 PM  

Humor is not in these days.

Anonymous Wyrd March 06, 2015 9:24 PM  

Wyrd,

Nice of you to cite The Discarded Image. It's on my short list for the Most Underappreciated Book of Modern Times award (Abolition of Man, another Lewis volume, is also a contender, but it isn't quite as strong in the "unrecognized" department.)


The Abolition Of Man is up next on my Kindle once I finish Aquinas' Summa Theologica.

Anonymous The other skeptic March 06, 2015 11:02 PM  

Payback is a bitch!

Blogger Retrenched March 06, 2015 11:07 PM  

The polyamorous community is made up of low ranking people of both sexes who have lots of indiscriminate sex with one another, who then try to convince themselves that being very active sexually makes them SMP winners.

Anonymous NateM March 06, 2015 11:14 PM  

"4th Rate Atheist"

Exactly how does one rank a "1st" Rate Atheist. That's like ranking the Downs Syndrome kid with the least overall chromosomes

Anonymous The other skeptic March 06, 2015 11:21 PM  

Exactly how does one rank a "1st" Rate Atheist. That's like ranking the Downs Syndrome kid with the least overall chromosomes

So, I am not sure if you will understand this, but Downs Syndrome kids have Trisomy 21, that means they all have 47 Chromosomes.

Blogger Ragin' Dave March 06, 2015 11:34 PM  

Polyamorous = I don't respect my wife enough to be faithful to her.

Pathetic.

Anonymous Jack Amok March 06, 2015 11:35 PM  

Yep. The lengthy self-justification, the posing as the victim, the complete inability to take responsibility, it's all right there. You can be certain that NONE of the women involved are hot.

Yes, Gamma behavior, but it's odd. Most of the men I've seen describe themselves as polyamorous seem like badly broken Omegas. Hey! They've Dual-Classed!. And no, none of the chicks are hot. Ghastly for the most part. They'd make a normal man's balls crawl up into his abdomen and hide beneath his liver, hoping some alcohol will seep out and anesthetize them.


seeing a CBC show about BDSM*, featuring a fat, graying couple half-heartedly spanking each other.

Their kink wasn't BDSM. It was Exhibitionism. Not many people want to watch ugly people have sex, but if they're spanking each other...

Anonymous NateM March 06, 2015 11:36 PM  

Correct. So given all those effected have an extra copy of that chromosome, identifying those amongst them with the normal amount of chromosomes would be as pointless as, say, explaining a Down's Syndrome joke to someone on the intetnet

Blogger bob k. mando March 06, 2015 11:43 PM  

http://i3.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/012/132/thatsthejoke.jpg

Blogger rumpole5 March 07, 2015 12:09 AM  

"[H]e was just another wannabe who was in well over his head. He's an intellectual nothing who isn't even
worthy of contempt."
I wish Vox would cut out the euphemism and tell us what he really thinks!

Anonymous rho March 07, 2015 12:18 AM  

I wonder if the key component here is submission. Alpha, Beta, Delta, Sigma, whatever your classification may be, if you cannot submit you are classified as Gamma.

Submission presupposes order. Alphas gravitate towards the top of the order, other classifications recognize the order to varying degrees, and Sigmas deliberately stand outside of the order. Gammas reject any order where they are not at or near the top. The AG posts touched on this.

Maybe it's about submission. Gammas will not submit; submission is introspection, and introspection is disastrous, because if it's not all about you and what you think, then it's regressive. Atheism is attractive to the Gamma because it perfectly circumscribes the limits of the Gamma's ability to submit--"me and mine, and no other."

(This theory suggests there are no Christian Gammas. I can hit seven with a rock from where I stand, so either the theory is bad or they are shitty Christians.)

Anonymous clk March 07, 2015 12:59 AM  

"Yep. The lengthy self-justification, the posing as the victim, the complete inability to take responsibility, it's all right there. You can be certain that NONE of the women involved are hot."

Ok so if the women that he was having affairs with were hot, and instead of trying to justify his actions with this poly crap he just came out and said hey, I want to trade in my old wife for a new, younger one(S) so if you dont like it sod off.. he would been an alpha and you would be ok with that behavior ? .... you dont have to answer. .. this is a rhetorical question.

Blogger GoldRush Apple March 07, 2015 1:07 AM  

A couple of years from now Carrier will write that he is an "open and 'proud' polyamorous." That's usually how it goes for such people who are sexually messed up.

I also noticed that he and his (now ex) wife of 20 years there was no mention of children. Is his wife anyway religious? Maybe she's also an atheist. Why no kids from two decades of marriage? It seems a bit pointless to get married and have none if both parties are capable. It's like he wanted what the religious had without the kids, then he excuses his infidelity for "not cut out for monogamy," asks for an open relationship with his wife, they later divorce and declares himself part of the sexual perverted in "coming out party" as a polyamorous. Paint by the numbers.

I'm sorry, but that's a bit laughable if not downright predictable.

Blogger Doom March 07, 2015 1:20 AM  

Atheists, agnostics with a stick up their asses I mean, can't sin... within their worldview. Actually, as a faithful, if fallen, Christian, I don't know that their sins are against my God. By not being a party to sin or salvation, their actions really... don't matter. Oh, of course, I would hope they would see the light, so to speak. But they aren't considered sinful unless they do know, admit it, and choose otherwise anyway. However, as such, they can't truly be considered neighbors... something you discussed not so long ago. The same way a dog cannot be considered sinful if it bags the nextdoor bitch. While they aren't animals, probably, atheists are taking on that mantle. They don't have proscriptions. I'm not putting this out right, but it's in there.

I've been to Burning Man, and some other events. I have seen these things. I used to go to more... intense things in my late teens, early twenties. Before I saw the light. I don't go there to judge, if I do speak when... asked. Being asked can become rare, and has been sought. Though you should have seen Desert Cat squirm when I approached a group he was with, as he suspected (rightly usually), with something on my mind to say. :) To his *cough* surprise, I, or we, haven't been tossed (at least yet).

Never mind, just... trying to wrap my mind around some things and clarify, at least as how I see things. Yeah, I speak like I write, in real life. Not dead yet, all I'm saying.

Anonymous Heaviside March 07, 2015 1:21 AM  

>For 21st century atheist missionaries, being liberal and scientific in outlook are one and the same.

>When organised as a movement and backed by the power of the state, atheist ideologies have been an integral part of despotic regimes that also claimed to be based in science, such as the former Soviet Union.

It's dumb to criticize New Atheists on the grounds that murderous illiberal groups were also atheistic, because clearly liberalism is far more sacred to the New Atheists than atheism, even if they aren't self-aware enough to realize that and say it explicitly.

Anonymous rubberducky March 07, 2015 1:52 AM  

I once hooked up a male friend with a woman who was a committed atheist. On their first and last date they went to a PZ Myers lecture, and according to my friend absolute bizarre hilarity ensued after an awkward and juvenile lecture by Mr. Myers followed by a BDSM themed after party.

My friend's take after all that was, "Some people just shouldn't reproduce. They just shouldn't."

Blogger Corvinus March 07, 2015 2:00 AM  

(This theory suggests there are no Christian Gammas. I can hit seven with a rock from where I stand, so either the theory is bad or they are shitty Christians.)

Yeah, many people including myself call them Churchians. Think of obnoxious tradcons who put women on pedestals, adopt Africans, and take Puritan attitudes toward sexuality.

Anonymous FP March 07, 2015 2:05 AM  

The doc's comments on the blog there are hilarious. Apparently he was the house husband in his marriage.

Anonymous rubberducky March 07, 2015 2:13 AM  

Gaia is a goddess. Atheists aren't classical pagans. And they don't have the strengths of classical pagans.

Classical pagans persecuted Christians for the crime of atheism. Pure instance on only one god was enough to get counted as godless, as insensitive to the vast panoply of divine forces. Pagans thought monotheism to be traitorous enough as to betray the whole idea of the divine.

If Rome was so willing to feed St. Ignatius to the lions, imagine what they'd cook up for today's unbelievers.

Anonymous rho March 07, 2015 2:15 AM  

Yeah, many people including myself call them Churchians. Think of obnoxious tradcons who put women on pedestals, adopt Africans, and take Puritan attitudes toward sexuality.

I'm the one hucking rocks. Maybe I'm a shitty Christian.

Point is, understand your brother. Love him when he falls.

But don't stop practicing your rock-hucking skills.

Anonymous FrankNorman March 07, 2015 5:49 AM  

This reminds me of an old quote from that photogenic woman with a knack for soundbites, Anne Coulter:
"No wonder liberal woman think men are pigs; their men are pigs!"

Anonymous Titus Didius Tacitus March 07, 2015 6:10 AM  

rubberducky: "If Rome was so willing to feed St. Ignatius to the lions, imagine what they'd cook up for today's unbelievers."

I don't think I can. But it's a beautiful topic to daydream about.

Blogger Galt-in-Da-Box March 07, 2015 7:02 AM  

" I found myself unequipped to handle certain unusual circumstances in our marriage, which I won’t discuss here because they intrude on my wife’s privacy"
=
Hollywood marriage.
This went on for decades in "the land of fruits and nuts" whiles everyone bought the lie that the folks on TV were pillars of the community/shining examples to live by.
In reality, most of them hated - as they do today - God and His Word, screwed anything that walked or didn't, and gays married lesbians to "look good" in front of the cameras.
I've stated before that "athiest" is usually code for doper/drunkard/fagit of some combination thereof, and no evidence has arisen to prove otherwise. It rarely if ever indicates they do not worship, they just worship something other than God...usually a manufactured ("natural") right to NOT Think & live like a stupid freaking animal.

Blogger LP 999/Eliza March 07, 2015 9:32 AM  

See!! If there is a man in a dress at a conf for anti's or lit something else is going on afterwards or during.

Carrier says he can fall in love with multiple persons. Again, Irrelevant. As Vox stated above, whatever he wants and now he wants to share this old found freedom.

Hopefully the wife got away from Carrier. Call Poly, O, whatever, you wicked and perverse generation sow sexual sins reap its rewards.

The O term; With who? Ugly Times.

Blogger rcocean March 07, 2015 2:04 PM  

PZ meyers posted a picture of some of buds at a Atheist convention - a more dismal group of people is hard to imagine. I guess Ugly people have sex too, otherwise their wouldn't be so many of them. But its better not to think of it.

Blogger rcocean March 07, 2015 2:07 PM  

It is interesting though how are small number of deviants and leftists have been able to push their beliefs on society so that it's now the "New Normal". The unwillingness of Christians to fight - intelligently - in the public square against them is astounding.

Anonymous aeou March 08, 2015 3:39 AM  

Carrier is part of atheism+. Basically SJWS tried to do a takeover of atheism in the US and caused a schism (see elevatorgate). The old rationalists find them more disgusting than you guys do.

I've had some experience with gang bangs and orgies and what others have said is spot on. It is full of ugly broken people. A fraction of the men are fairly normal, some even above average. But they are outnumbered by absolute freaks that should be wearing beige trenchcoat while lurking in dark alleys. The women are broken, fat or old. Last time I went I took 100mg of sildafenil and still could not get it up. That scene was not for me.

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