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Saturday, March 28, 2015

The Toad of Tor croaks

This ludicrously dishonest croaking from the Toad amused me. It demonstrates how completely, how utterly, how absolutely, the SJWs in science fiction have no conception whatsoever of the zeitgeist. Teresa Nielsen Hayden, who may or may not have already been fired from Tor, croaked:
A sense of injured privilege is what PUAs, Gamergaters, and Sad Puppies have in common. Their fury at SJWs comes from a sequence of assumptions that's very common in individuals and groups that are smarting from a sense of wounded self-importance:

1. I have less power than I feel I should have.
2. I feel those people over there have power I don't have.
3. They must have stolen mine!

And poof, there's their evil enemy, made to order.

Gamergaters think gaming belongs to them, and should answer solely to their preferences. PUAs hate women who selfishly consult their own feelings and preferences, then turn them down. Torgersen wants awards to go to the people and works he thinks should win, rather than the ones the voters would naturally vote for.

In the long run, this is doomed. What the Sad Puppies are doing will not make disinclined readers love their work or respect them as authors -- readers really are stubborn that way -- but they might conceivably do a lot of damage along the way.
She might as easily have written "ribbit, ribbit, ribbit" for all that it has any relationship to reality except for her statement about Brad.  Let's identify and count the errors just from the quoted section:
  1. Pick-Up Artists do not have a sense of injured privilege. They have a sense of mastery. Because they are sexually successful men who have sex with large quantities of women much more attractive than the Toad of Tor ever was. They don't hate women who turn them down; the abundance mentality teaches precisely the opposite. She has literally NO IDEA what she's talking about here. Or she's simply lying.
  2. GamerGaters do not have a sense of injured privilege. They don't think gaming belongs to them. They have a sense of being betrayed by the gaming media, which they no longer can trust to honestly review games, and a correct sense of being attacked by people for developing the games they want to develop and playing the games they want to play. The entire core message of GamerGate is simple: fuck off and leave us alone to play what we want to play, not what you think we should be permitted to play. Again, the Toad is saying things that are demonstrably false.
  3. Yes, Torgersen wants awards to go to the people and works he thinks should win. So does the Toad of Tor. Notice the deceit here about what the voters would "naturally vote for". What is this "natural vote" and how does the Toad somehow know what it is? Isn't that what the actual vote is meant to determine?
  4. What is doomed in the long run? Long after the Toad of Tor is dead and forgotten, pick-up artists will be picking up women, game developers will be developing games, and gamers will be playing them. As for Sad Puppies, here is a prediction: Sad Puppies will outlast Patrick Nielsen Hayden's career at Tor Books.
  5. It's true that Sad Puppies will not make disinclined readers love anyone's work or respect anyone as authors. Now, I can't speak for any other supporter of Sad Puppies, but as for me, the Toad is ludicrously mistaken if she genuinely believes I give even the smallest fraction of a damn. And Sad Puppies don't have less power than they think they should have or that anyone stole their nonexistent power. This sounds a lot like psychological projection coming from someone who was until recently associated with Tor Books, the winner of the Locus Award for best SF publisher 20 years in a row and a sizable chunk of all the major science fiction awards given out over the last two decades.
  6. Our contempt for SJWs is because they are obnoxious individuals like the Toad of Tor who believe they have the right to tell other people what to write, what to read, what to develop, what to play, and for what it is natural to vote on the basis of their pinkshirted ideology. We stand for freedom. They stand for them being in control. And we do not accept it.
SJWs are the people of the lie. They are Aristotle's people who are intellectually limited to the rhetorical level. We all know that no amount of new information will change the Toad's mind. We all know that the Toad will not address any of this honestly. She will not recant her observably false claims. She'll simply tell more lies about what other people really think and produce more incoherent rhetoric. And that is why she merits nothing but the utmost contempt. As disgusting as the Toad of Tor may be on the outside, she's even worse on the inside.

All you need to know who is right and who is wrong in this is to note who is able to directly quote the other side, and who almost invariably has to resort to writing complete fiction about the other side's thoughts and motivations. I don't give a damn why the Toad thinks what she thinks. I don't give a damn what her motivations might be. All I need to know, all anyone needs to know, is what her words are in order to reach an accurate conclusion and dismiss her accordingly.

If you do feel like a safari through the SJW fever swamp, I would encourage you not to leave any comments there. You cannot engage in rational discourse with the intrinsically irrational and Making Light is not a place where you are going to find anyone even remotely capable of dialectic. Treat it like the zoo it is, just drive through and marvel at the grotesquerie.

Labels:

42 Comments:

Anonymous bearspaw March 28, 2015 9:16 PM  

Jeez man, you're burning the midnight oil over there.

Blogger Bard March 28, 2015 9:26 PM  

"grotesquerie"
What a great word!

Anonymous kfg March 28, 2015 9:33 PM  

"This sounds a lot like psychological projection . . ."

The projection is in the grand lie out of which all the smaller lies are built. You see, there is a name for the syllogism presented:

Patriarchy Theory.

Anonymous Projection indeed March 28, 2015 9:39 PM  

1. I have less power than I feel I should have.
2. I feel those people over there have power I don't have.
3. They must have stolen mine!


This is exactly the rationale behind all the attacks on white male privilege -- "Ah is powerless, an' evil whitey done stole mah privlege!"

Not the first time, nor surely the last, that the Left projects its own thought processes onto its opponents.

Anonymous pseudotsuga March 28, 2015 9:49 PM  

It baffles me that people such as her can't see the contradiction in the statement that Puppies voters want awards to go to the people and works they think should win, rather than the ones the voters would naturally vote for.
The fail is strong with this one...but like you point out, Vox, it's all hat and no cattle.

Anonymous Scintan March 28, 2015 9:55 PM  

Hayden's way off on this one. She really needs to improve her psychoanalytical abilities.

Anonymous Aeoli Pera March 28, 2015 10:06 PM  

The point of her propaganda is to cast the out-group in a light that makes them look weak. It is a rallying cry for a mob of cowards. The intended audience is the in-group, which means she will feel unpleasant if anyone messes with the sanctity of her narrative.

This is a sea change from propaganda that serves the purpose of humiliation (ex. sending employees to social skills training), to solidify a sense of subjugation in a conquered populace. Therefore, this may be interpreted as a symptom of fear, rather than the contempt it pretends to convey toward a weaker enemy. If the out-group is so weak, why does she feel the need to say so? It's like C.S. Lewis said, "No man who says, 'I'm as good as you,' believes it. He would not say it if he did."

Anonymous p-dawg March 28, 2015 10:08 PM  

He wants the awards to go to the books he wants to win the awards? WHAT? The NERVE of that guy. I tell ya. What a strange position for a person to hold, to want the awards to go to the books they like best.

Blogger Laramie Hirsch March 28, 2015 10:09 PM  

"If you do feel like a safari through the SJW fever swamp, I would encourage you not to leave any comments there. You cannot engage in rational discourse with the intrinsically irrational and Making Light is not a place where you are going to find anyone even remotely capable of dialectic. Treat it like the zoo it is, just drive through and marvel at the grotesquerie."

Speaking of fever swamps, maybe this is a sign that I should just stay off the atheist forum I've been participating on. I feel like I've been wading through sludge in my mud boots this month. Most of the posts there were a rainshower of filth and vulgarity.

OpenID vitasbrennus March 28, 2015 10:14 PM  

Like all leftists, she is engaging in pretty obvious projection, particularly in reference to Gamergate. It is the Social Justice Warriors who want to ban anything they dislike. Gamergaters, on the other hand, don't care if the Zoe Quinns of the world make crappy games, as long as they are not forced to play them, and can still buy the games they want. One side wants freedom, and the other, totalitarianism.

Blogger Yohami March 28, 2015 10:15 PM  

"1. I have less power than I feel I should have.
2. I feel those people over there have power I don't have.
3. They must have stolen mine!"

Projection

Blogger Cecil Henry March 28, 2015 11:02 PM  

This anger is all just envy and projection.

1. I have less power than I feel I should have.
2. I feel those people over there have power I don't have.
3. They must have stolen mine!


This is exactly the attitude of the SJW's!!!

Exactly. Otherwise just leave others alone to their own choice and freedom. But no. Because envy.....

Anonymous Daniel March 28, 2015 11:10 PM  

An exorcism is in order. I pity the amphibian that has been so rudely occupied by such a lesser demon. Even the swine of Legion met a swift and merciful death off a cliff.

Anonymous Heaviside March 28, 2015 11:38 PM  

"1. I have less power than I feel I should have.
2. I feel those people over there have power I don't have.
3. They must have stolen mine!"

This is a perfectly reasonable set of attitudes to have, at least, the first two.

Blogger Bard March 29, 2015 12:37 AM  

Reminds me of the part in Hancock, when the criminals are discussing getting back the power Hancock stole from them after he stuck the one prisoner's head in the other prisoner's ass. Is that what happened to her?

Blogger Derrick Bonsell March 29, 2015 12:44 AM  

"This is a perfectly reasonable set of attitudes to have, at least, the first two."

There's nothing inherently wrong with the first two as long as you use them as reasons for self-improvement instead of whining about them.

Anonymous 204 March 29, 2015 1:25 AM  

For a second I thought she had died.

Anonymous The artist, also known as Brad March 29, 2015 1:27 AM  

I was bleakly amused that she thinks "would naturally be voted for" is a thing forever on her side. If the total voting body of a Worldcon were to ever reach 20,000 or more members, and span the range between indie fiction fans, paranormal fiction fans, gamers and game fiction fans, etc., she might experience a very rude awakening. What she actually means is, "would naturally be voted for by everyone who is part of the thousand-person-average club known as TruFen." She is one of the SMOFs happily boarding up and shuttering the SF/F ghetto from the nasty outside world. Which, by the way, when she wasn't looking, constructed a gleaming city and freeway around her little personal shantytown.

Blogger maniacprovost March 29, 2015 1:30 AM  

Is that what happened to her?

Well, first she would have to remove her head from her rectum to get to that point.

Anonymous Heaviside March 29, 2015 1:30 AM  

>There's nothing inherently wrong with the first two as long as you use them as reasons for self-improvement instead of whining about them.

Self-improvement can't substitute for political activity. If other people are willing to genuflect before whiners, then that's real influence. It sustains a multi-billion dollar industry of diversihires and a similarly large network of patronage and largesse. The problem is that only the complaints of designated victim groups count, or else white people and conservatives could just whine their way to success.

Blogger Noah B March 29, 2015 1:56 AM  

Hardly surprising she has never actually spoken to a PUA

Blogger ScuzzaMan March 29, 2015 2:26 AM  

"All you need to know who is right and who is wrong in this is to not who is able to directly quote the other side, and who almost invariably has to resort to writing complete fiction about the other side's thoughts and motivations."

Seems obvious what you're saying here, but this sentence needs a little work in the first half.

Blogger Noah B March 29, 2015 3:08 AM  

And therefore never send to know for whom the toad croaks; it croaks for thee.

Anonymous Clay March 29, 2015 4:17 AM  

I know this is stoopid....but I have to ask:

Is this an allusion to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toad_the_Wet_Sprocket

Blogger Expendable Faceless Minion March 29, 2015 4:43 AM  

VD: Typo?
who is wrong in this is to **not** who is able to directly quote

possibly "note" ?

Blogger Vox March 29, 2015 4:53 AM  

VD: Typo?

Yes.

Is this an allusion

No, it is a reference to her appearance. Google at your own risk.

Anonymous A.B. Prosper March 29, 2015 5:00 AM  

I have to say Fever Swamp is a wonderful analogy. Thanks for that.

Blogger Rantor March 29, 2015 6:26 AM  

I too read the title and expected an obituary.

Blogger Cataline Sergius March 29, 2015 6:27 AM  

I wonder what touched off this festival of projection by Baroness Harkonnen?

I heard she was depressed for while after getting tossed under the Tor bus. Is this what passes for her manic phase following that? Most manic/depressives have unusually strong bouts of creativity during their upcycle. I know one that can crush out 150,000 words in a week. Is a spurting gout of particularly malignant bile her version of godlike creativity? Quite possibly in her case. A foam flecked public display seething, bitter hatred, may perhaps be the our Toad's version of feeling unusually positive about the world.

Or perhaps and I am really just guessing here. She has reason to think the Sad Puppies did a lot better than we were supposed to this year. I know Mike Williamson has been privately informed that he is on the list this year's list. Have others been informed? More to the point, have some not been informed?

She and her...I dunno...husband I guess you'd have to call him, have been at this game for a while. They have to have a feel for it by now.

And they do not like what they are feeling.

Anonymous Steve March 29, 2015 7:51 AM  

Hmm...

Pick Up Artists - the good ones (like Roosh) are men who help other men improve themselves and enjoy more success with women. They don't hate women, they are huge fans of women. But not hideous she-beasts like Hayden.

Gamergaters - I'm a married man with children, my own home, and a full time job. In what little spare time I have, I'd been enjoying computer and video games for about three decades before a bunch of hysterical twentysomething Tumblrinas came along to tell me I was a cisgendered patriarchal shitlord who lives in his Mum's basement and oppresses women.

And that I'd been enjoying games wrong, and they'd tell me what's what.

SJW's: a collection of freakish social outcasts who spend all their time tweeting racist conspiracy theories about white men. Whether it's Big Tempest Bradford's race-hate reading list or Gigantor McGuire's White Dude Parade.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan March 29, 2015 8:04 AM  

I gazed upon their zoo, if you ask me their weak point is that they touch on "race", and they do this a lot. And none of them could withstand even a brief interrogation over their "beliefs" as expressed thru their rhetoric.

As I'll say again conservatives put too much into what the Left really, really, really means and not into what they are saying. Kind of like conservatives are the kind who imagine the Wizard of Oz has control of a Death Star when all he has is cow bell and a smoke bomb.

Blogger Franz Lionheart March 29, 2015 8:56 AM  

Baroness Harkonnen

Lol, Sweet! Heavily competes with Vox's terminology of the Toad of Tor.


Blogger Franz Lionheart March 29, 2015 8:57 AM  

Heavily

Lol. I see what I did there.

Blogger Laguna Beach Fogey March 29, 2015 9:36 AM  

Pick-Up Artists do not have a sense of injured privilege. They have a sense of mastery. Because they are sexually successful men who have sex with large quantities of women much more attractive than the Toad of Tor ever was. They don't hate women who turn them down; the abundance mentality teaches precisely the opposite.

Exactly. SJWs, white knights, and tradcons continue to believe otherwise.

Anonymous p-dawg March 29, 2015 10:54 AM  

@Derrick Bonsell: Precisely. It's the difference between motivation and envy. Motivation is seeing your neighbor's new car and working hard to save up enough money to buy your own car. Envy is seeing your neighbor's nice new car and immediately buying a nicer one for payments you can't really afford, which leads to repossession and possibly unemployment, etc. In each case, there are natural consequences depending on how you decide to approach the same input, the neighbor's new car. I find it interesting that the natural consequences tend to line up with the Scriptural admonishments in that area. This can be seen in other areas as well.

Blogger Feather Blade March 29, 2015 1:00 PM  

Self-improvement can't substitute for political activity.

Self-improvement is an excellent substitute for political activity. The former makes you better, the latter only make everyone worse. these do not produce equivalent conditions.

Envy is seeing your neighbor's nice new car and immediately buying a nicer one for payments you can't really afford,

Cutting off you own nose to spite your neighbor's face is low-level stuff and stupid.

Really advanced envy involves political activity to outlaw that nice new car your neighbor just bought.

Anonymous Heaviside March 29, 2015 2:19 PM  

>Self-improvement is an excellent substitute for political activity. The former makes you better, the latter only make everyone worse. these do not produce equivalent conditions.

The point of politics is to leave your enemies worse than you found them. You can accord someone's private moral virtues infinitely higher worth than their ability to change society, but then society will bend to those who have no respect for virtue.

Anonymous WaterBoy March 29, 2015 2:41 PM  

1. I have less power than I feel I should have.
2. I feel those people over there have power I don't have.
3. They must have stolen mine!


AKA The Feminist Mantra

The Mantra is OK, so long as it's only applied to minority demographics.

Anonymous p-dawg March 29, 2015 3:17 PM  

@Feather Blade: "Cutting off you own nose to spite your neighbor's face is low-level stuff and stupid."

Indeed. And, since MPAI, the normal mode for buying a car today is to finance it over several years, buying one car for yourself and one-three cars for the bank. See also: Home "ownership".

"Really advanced envy involves political activity to outlaw that nice new car your neighbor just bought."

Just another example of a natural consequence of reacting poorly to what your neighbor does.

Blogger James Dixon March 29, 2015 7:20 PM  

> And, since MPAI, the normal mode for buying a car today is to finance it over several years, buying one car for yourself and one-three cars for the bank.

While in general true, most of the manufacturers have been offering 2% or lower (many times 0%) interest rates for years now.

Anonymous Titus Didius Tacitus March 29, 2015 11:36 PM  

"Really advanced envy involves political activity to outlaw that nice new car your neighbor just bought."

The moral basis of Communism: Neighbor's goat, too, must die.

Self-improvement is no substitute for stopping Communists from taking over.

Anonymous Sevron March 30, 2015 1:41 PM  

Googled her picture. Feel sad and empty now. Must pray that the Sun is still real, that there's a chance I'll feel warm again, before I leave this restaurant.

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