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Friday, April 10, 2015

Chicken with the Dark Lord

Brad Torgersen, the leader of Sad Puppies 3, observes the obvious:
Facebook is lighting up with outrage over the fact that the notorious Vox Day is threatening to go all NO AWARD on the Hugo ballot in 2016, if NO AWARD takes the Hugo ballot in 2015. Amidst the wailing and gnashing of teeth and blaming the family dog (me) for the fact a wild wolf (Vox) is growling at the door, I have to ask everybody: what did you freaking expect when you made it plain as day the whole reason for going NO AWARD in 2015 is to keep Vox’s imprint Castalia House (and Vox himself) off the trophy table? That’s like putting a bloody leg of beef into the water while a great white shark circles nearby. You are daring The Kurgan to play chicken with you. That is The Kurgan’s most favorite game. The wild wolf lives for danger. The wild wolf wants you to nuke it all from orbit. This is Mutually Assured Destruction....

I know Vox sure as hell doesn’t give a fuck what I think. When did he ever? He didn’t give a fuck when SFWA sent him packing. He doesn’t give a fuck who hates him. If Sad Puppies evaporates tomorrow and ceases to exist, Vox won’t give a shit at all. Because Vox doesn’t give a shit what any of us think, and doesn’t care.
That pretty much sums it up nicely. What do you say, Dread Ilk? What do you say, Rabid Puppies? Are we dogs or are we wolves?

We don't whine. We don't cry. We don't complain. We howl.

And the rabbits tremble.

Labels: ,

165 Comments:

Anonymous Titus Didius Tacitus April 10, 2015 5:01 AM  

Well duh.

Blogger JACIII April 10, 2015 5:03 AM  

Nuke and Pave.

Blogger Bruce Lewis April 10, 2015 5:05 AM  

'Never interrupt your enemy while he is busy making a mistake" - Napoleon

Anonymous Peter Garstig April 10, 2015 5:14 AM  

Going NO AWARD will be proof to the masses that the Hugo is nothing but political. I hope it goes that way.

It's rather amusing that the instance they are even remotely challenged, the SJW/rabbit front simply collapses and the collectively pile mistake on mistake for everyone to enjoy. They were completetly right: they really played on the lowest difficulty level until now.

Blogger Rantor April 10, 2015 5:16 AM  

Is Brad getting cold feet? Does he fear the DreadIlk? Or has he been hit so hard by the SJW crowd that he just lost his nerve? Sad Puppies, Rabid Puppies and Dread Ilk must see the effort through. Victory is within reach.

Blogger P.T. Barnumium April 10, 2015 5:26 AM  

I don't think Brad has cold feet, I think he understands the truth, NO AWARD is not just a weapon open to the SJW crowd.

It's something that's crossed my mind a few times recently as it reinforces their inability to think in terms of anything beyond the immediate. If they think we are here to destroy the Hugos, why would WE balk at NO AWARDing everything in sight

Blogger kudzu bob April 10, 2015 5:29 AM  

@ Bruce Lewis

"Never interrupt your opponent while he is stabbing himself over and over in his pimply face with a barbecue fork" is more like it.

Anonymous zen0 April 10, 2015 5:29 AM  

@ Rantor

Is Brad getting cold feet?

Or maybe we all just read the motherloving stories and books and act like fucking grownups for a fucking change.

No. Torgersen has gone over to the dark side. He has offered a reasonable challenge, all the while knowing the rabbits can't meet it. His micro-aggression has created an unsafe space, there will be much nose twitching and hopping about.

Blogger Remo April 10, 2015 5:34 AM  

Nope we are Honey Badgers because .... Honey Badger don't care

Anonymous Bz April 10, 2015 5:41 AM  

Torgersen is trying to be reasonable and accomodating. Haven't we seen how well that works out a sufficient number of times yet? Crush them.

Anonymous Giuseppe April 10, 2015 5:44 AM  

Life stuff getting in the way of a post I wanted to do on this precise point, but will get it done this weekend.

One thing that has become crystal clear though is that part of the reason Vox is seen as the EEEEVILLL Beast that he is, is due, partially at least, simply to the fact that most people have no intrinsic understanding of war.

There is a type of psychology that to some extent can be taught, but that really on some fundamental levels is innate, that instinctively understands budo and these people, be it in an actual trench, a streetfight or an internet flame war, naturally position themselves so as to destroy the enemy. Not inconvenience, not hurt. Destroy. Decisively and comprehensively win. That, ultimately is the brutally simple aim of war.

Such people generally recognise each other instantly, but for some reason (a subset of MPAI and the ease of modern living having killed off a healthy part of darwinian self-preservation mechanisms in most humans) they are not recognised for the poisonous, radioactive, rabid wolves they are. Calm ones mind you. The really dangerous ones are always calm. Rabidly poisonous and radioactive they may be, but it's by design, not unhappy accident.

So they go and poke this nightmare creature and then get oh so shocked when they are dismembered limb from limb.
And they blame the wolf.

I am always reminded of the classic response to this of a philosophical giant in this field:

"Puny humans! Hulk Smash! "

That's right. Keep thinking Hulk is stupid. Puny humans indeed.
They understand nothing. Nor do they understand war at all. I will be posting how I will vote in July and why in a way that will hopefully explain this a lot better, but why anyone is surprissed by Vox's actions is beyond me.

Anonymous Peter Garstig April 10, 2015 5:51 AM  

If they think we are here to destroy the Hugos, why would WE balk at NO AWARDing everything in sight.

Come on, that would be logical. Can't expect that.

Blogger Lovekraft April 10, 2015 5:51 AM  

No one with any shred of integrity blindly believes mass media anymore and has likely developed acute perception to discern progressive messaging.

Because progressives abuse their power, use intimidation and slander to shout down opposition, they are the ones who have grown smug with confidence over the decades. And with smugness comes a laziness.

Which is why this stage of the 'culture war' is long overdue and we should not take it for granted.

Let's learn lessons for future application, don't get too cocky and press forward.

Anonymous Apollo April 10, 2015 5:55 AM  

Wait, did you actually threaten to NO AWARD next year if the SJWs do it this year, Vox?

I recall you talking in theoretical terms about NO AWARD as a strategy, but I dont recall a specific and direct threat.

Blogger W.LindsayWheeler April 10, 2015 5:56 AM  

Remo, that narrator of the honey badger is gay. That's disgusting. Honey Badger Good, Gay Narrator Bad.

Blogger Cataline Sergius April 10, 2015 6:05 AM  

I'd forgotten how long that scene takes. I remembered as being twenty seconds or so.

Oh well,we never did decide on a theme song. It will do for this year.

Anonymous Omar's Running Shoes April 10, 2015 6:23 AM  

Is Torgeson the guy who played the ultimate "I'm not a racist" card the other day by posting a pic of his african wife? And that didn't work? And this is his new plan? Think of the awards?

That should not work equally well.

Better start thinking up a name for the replacement award, Hugo always sounded like a gay French child anyway.

Blogger Vox April 10, 2015 6:45 AM  

Wait, did you actually threaten to NO AWARD next year if the SJWs do it this year, Vox?

No more than anyone "threatened" to honor Mr. Noah Ward this year. I merely made a rather obvious prediction.

“If No Award takes a fiction category, you will likely never see another award given in that category again. The sword cuts both ways, Lois. We are prepared for all eventualities.”

Anonymous Tom B April 10, 2015 6:51 AM  

This is getting funnier as it goes along. It's like a real life Marx Brothers movie, with John Scalzi as Margaret Dumont. (Admit it, he does dress like her.)

Blogger Mr.MantraMan April 10, 2015 6:52 AM  

They were ruining SF at a fast clip, you don't have to be a radical to dislike that outcome, so now there are alternatives, moving on.

If the rabbits could only understand that their particular bit of asexual gayness synthetic humanity is really not that big a seller outside of their warren they might get a clue.

Anonymous Steve April 10, 2015 6:55 AM  

Giuseppe - at times like these I like to picture the Dark Lord standing on the balcony of his sinister, fang-shaped Italian castello, surveying his legion of werewolves, frost giants, and slendermen.

He puts down his jewel-encrusted goblet of chilled blood and briefly picks a stray thread from his velvet robes, before addressing the gathered Ilk in a voice that is smooth as silk and sharp as a stiletto in your ear:

"Tonight, my children, you will dine on SJW-flesh!"

The howls, snarls, and feral roars that rise up from that ancient cobbled courtyard cause a psychic reverberation that every rabbit on the planet feels as a sudden prickling of terror.

Scalzi stops admiring himself in his wife's dress and notices his nose is bleeding.

Tempest-Bradford's arm hair stands on end as if electrified.

Seanan puts down her bucket of chicken, suddenly no longer hungry.

Back at Castello Malevoxo, the Dark Lord scratches behind the ears of his favourite pet jaguar.

"Soon, my pet. Soon..."

Blogger Vox April 10, 2015 7:13 AM  

Seanan puts down her bucket of chicken, suddenly no longer hungry.

That was worthy of a cruelty artist. I award you 3 Voxels.

Blogger Sam Hall April 10, 2015 7:17 AM  

"Tonight, my children, you will dine on SJW-flesh!"

But, they are so tasteless!

Blogger Cataline Sergius April 10, 2015 7:17 AM  

The Kurgan

Giuseppe

Blogger James Dixon April 10, 2015 7:24 AM  

> What do you say, Dread Ilk? What do you say, Rabid Puppies? Are we dogs or are we wolves?

You have to ask? You know us better than that, Vox. :)

There's a scene in one of the Dorsai stories where one of the Graemes faces down a group of toughs who were supposed to rough him up before allowing him to pass. They decide not to do so, much to the surprise of their employer. Dickson's comparison goes something like "...for a dog will fight and losing run away, but a wolf loses but one fight, and in that fight he dies."

Anonymous trk April 10, 2015 7:25 AM  

No truer words have been spoken about this blog.

Anonymous jack April 10, 2015 7:36 AM  

Nice artwork. I'm saving it to backup media [just in case, you know]

Voxel, eh? Yeah that works.

Anonymous Giuseppe April 10, 2015 7:39 AM  

Cataline Sergius,
That actually cracked me up!
When it gets to the spoils of war my friend, I hope you are in my legion. I'll see to it you get first pick of the gold and slaves of the defeated SJWs

Anonymous philip April 10, 2015 7:43 AM  

I'm hungry for some rabbit viscera.

Blogger Salt April 10, 2015 7:46 AM  

Being subjective about this, I'm all for nuking the Hugo. SF/F shall continue with or without that bloody award. What I do give a fuck about is the entertainment value. 40 bucks, and yes... I'm being entertained at the moment.

Anonymous RL April 10, 2015 7:48 AM  

Wolves.

Blogger sysadmn April 10, 2015 7:50 AM  

This is getting funnier as it goes along. It's like a real life Marx Brothers movie, with John Scalzi as Margaret Dumont. (Admit it, he does dress like her.)

But hey guys, she can totally lift more than me! -- Scalzi

Blogger sysadmn April 10, 2015 7:56 AM  

Reminds me of A Voice for Men: when called out for using the phrase "Fuck their shit up", they doubled down:

I mean it literally. I want your shit fucked up in a permanent and irreversible way. I want the harsh, unforgiving light of truth to shine on you and other hateful swine that spread bigotry and violence under the guise of advancing the cause of women. I want the public to see (which they can HERE) the hateful, pro-violence cult of monsters Betty McLellan supports at Radfem.com.

I want the public to see (which they can, HERE) the disgraceful nature of Tory Shepherd’s dishonest, yellow propagandizing, which she pawns off as journalism in order to protect advocates of violence and hatred.

I want the public to see (which they can, HERE) the outrageously deceptive and dishonest tactics of Michael Flood, who, after taking on the false identity an estranged father, gained access to the organization Fathers4Equality and sent abusive emails to Australian MP’s in their name.
...
Folks, it does not matter much whether we push the envelope to the edge or whether we take painstaking care to reach the ridiculously unreachable goal of speaking hard truths while offending no one. We are dealing with liars and bigots. They have no sense of honor or decency. When I call Michael Flood a sociopathic pig, it is not an adolescent ad hominem used in the absence of substance, but an unavoidable conclusion rooted in the reality of his conduct as a human being.

Anonymous p-dawg April 10, 2015 8:05 AM  

I'm waiting for the outraged screeds about how could you possibly threaten to No Award because dammit, that's THEIR threat....

OpenID bc64a9f8-765e-11e3-8683-000bcdcb2996 April 10, 2015 8:06 AM  

I disagree with some of the premise.
That should be Wild Wolves with freakin' LASERS on their heads.
But that's just me.

Anonymous ConantheCimmerian April 10, 2015 8:16 AM  

He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing.

Anonymous Tom April 10, 2015 8:20 AM  

"Seanan puts down her bucket of chicken, suddenly no longer hungry.

That was worthy of a cruelty artist. I award you 3 Voxels."

Important correction about knowing your enemies. Skinny people don't realize this, but everything cause us fattie McFattie land whales to eat more. Things are going bad? Oh no, I'll eat to feel better. Things are going good? Oh joy, I'll eat to celebrate. Things are boring? Hmm, better eat something new and different.

What that should have said was, "Seanan's eyes twitch nervously around the bare room as she plunges her grease glistening flipper back into the bucket for more of the soothing fried fowl."

Just saying food is a drug to most of us terrestrial cetaceans.

Another point that has always bothered me. Rabbits aren't fat, their meat is actually quite lean. And delicious. Tasty. Savory. Aaaaannnnggg *drool*

Blogger Student in Blue April 10, 2015 8:28 AM  

No Tom, bad!

We let our prey squirm around helplessly first. It is tradition. Do I need to break out the water spritzer?

Anonymous WinstonWebb April 10, 2015 8:30 AM  

“Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.”

Anonymous Alexander April 10, 2015 8:31 AM  

The only thing even remotely disappointing is that this wasn't so obvious to every party involved that it needed to be put in writing.

Anonymous Jon Bromfield April 10, 2015 8:33 AM  

A SJW friend of mine has asked, half-seriously, what are Vox's terms of surrender.

Clearly this threat (promise?) to vote No Award in 2016 is causing panic.

But it's a good question.

Vox, what are your terms? What is not negotiable?

Anonymous Steveo April 10, 2015 8:38 AM  

First, methinks Brad is just warning the Pink SFrs in the strongest means he can muster... presumably because they may be too stupid to understand the consequences of their toddler like machinations.

Second, GRRM swings & misses... then throws the bat at his own dugout:

GRRM - excerpt from Guardian article here.

George RR Martin has waded into the “nasty, nasty fight” surrounding this year’s Hugo awards, laying out why he believes that a group of rightwing science fiction writers have “broken” the prestigious prize beyond repair.

and

“If the Sad Puppies wanted to start their own award … for Best Conservative SF, or Best Space Opera, or Best Military SF, or Best Old-Fashioned SF the Way It Used to Be … whatever it is they are actually looking for … hey, I don’t think anyone would have any objections to that. I certainly wouldn’t. More power to them,” he added. “But that’s not what they are doing here, it seems to me. Instead they seem to want to take the Hugos and turn them into their own awards.”

Swing & a miss: GRRM -the rightwing didn't break anything - the leftist panty waists & perverts twisted most the integrity out of the Hugo rag awhile ago. SP & RP merely held a very public mirror up to the freak show and the cock roaches have been dancing about ever since... now that it's going viral and they will forever be known for it (notice in the future scheme of things when the tide turns there are always well known public events that become demarcation lines - high tide if you will) & these narrative controlling bozos are such short-term thinkers that they don't even see their drywall statues crapped on. Brad's frustrated because he knows they just can't stop the tantrums. Get it? All Hugos will be made scorn because they stacked the decks for years! Does it mean Great, or at least really good... or not?

Throwing the bat: Holy crap, he lays out the clear point of the matter & still can't grasp the real problem, indicating the Hugos are now a leftist contrivance, jazz hands for the SF Caesars of social whining & victim consecration. Notice: "If the Sad Puppies wanted to start their own award … for Best Conservative SF..."

They can't understand that Vox acknowledges all quality writing, but the Hugos are no longer about quality - the rabbits did that, not SP or RP. GRRM even throws the Ad Hom at John C Wright just because... we know why GRRM. Get a clue G - the Hugos should be a real award, celebrating quality writing NOT pop-ups of popular ideology & political correctness.

Go Wolves.


Blogger Markku April 10, 2015 8:38 AM  

He doesn't understand this at all. Our side cannot be even organized to go NO AWARD unless they go first. Our side loves payback, but it would be almost impossible to get them to draw first blood. Surrender is not necessary, just taking no action will achieve the same effect. Not because Vox is so gracious, but because our side is as difficult to herd as cats.

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 8:39 AM  

"A SJW friend of mine has asked, half-seriously, what are Vox's terms of surrender."

***chuckle***

They think we'll let them surrender....

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 8:42 AM  

am I the only one that is savoring the delicious irony of leftists complaining about entryism?

Blogger Markku April 10, 2015 8:42 AM  

They will, however, go first. They cannot help it. And by doing so they hand us the necessary nuke. We couldn't achieve all this without their help.

Anonymous Nathan April 10, 2015 8:44 AM  

Not a big fan of the idea myself, not for No Award. However, if the quiet rumors are true and someone gets SWATted, I'm all for smashing the toy (the Hugo Awards) forever.

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 8:45 AM  

"They will, however, go first. They cannot help it. And by doing so they hand us the necessary nuke."

I think you under-estimate the willingness of the Ilk to nuke and pave for sake of nuking and paving.

Many of us already have that itch right now. Why wait? Nuke it now. Blow it to hell and bathe in their tears.

Look around. The Ilk are dying to do just that.

Blogger Vox April 10, 2015 8:45 AM  

Vox, what are your terms? What is not negotiable?

Terms? What are these "terms" of which you speak? Do you negotiate with the whirlwind?

Besides, I am reliably informed that I am "abysmally stupid", "mentally ill", "a tad unbalanced" and so forth. Frankly, I don't think I can trust myself to be sufficiently competent to be entrusted with such great responsibility.

No, I had better sit here in the shadows on my throne of bones, drinking SJW blood from my skull-goblet, contemplating events to come.

Blogger Markku April 10, 2015 8:46 AM  

That would be explicitly to say, for example, that John C. Wright is worthy of NO AWARD. I mean, maybe some of you in fact think so. Doesn't concern me. This is an award for authors, not publishers.

But that's what it is saying.

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 8:48 AM  

"a tad unbalanced"


....


Well... you have to admit...

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 8:50 AM  

"That would be explicitly to say, for example, that John C. Wright is worthy of NO AWARD. "

Mr Wright's legacy is secure. Nuking or no.

Anonymous Stingray April 10, 2015 8:54 AM  

Mr Torgersen obviously cares a lot about the Hugos. He doesn't want to see them die. My question is, why? If they vote No Award this year, and the Sad Puppies does next year and the whole thing blows to hell, the outcome that he is looking for will likely be the same. Sci/Fi writers are going to keep on writing.

I don't see Vox, or Mr. Wright, or Mr. Torgerson or anyone else who actually loves Sci'Fi giving up writing because the Rocket fell from the sky. The people who will give up are the exact people who ruined the award anyway. So, is this because he has an child-like love for the Hugos?

If this is the case, I admire him for his valiant effort in saving it. But the Hugos are not, anymore, what he fell in love with. What happens will happen and Sci/Fi is going to better off no matter what.

Anonymous Jon Bromfield April 10, 2015 8:59 AM  

I agree there can be no compromise with these lunatics.

If the SJWs nuke the awards by voting No Award, we'll make the rubble bounce.

Forever.

OpenID cailcorishev April 10, 2015 9:00 AM  

They think we'll let them surrender....

Guess they've never read Ender's Game. Why try to understand your opponents by reading their seminal works, after all, when you can just project how they think?

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 9:00 AM  

reading GRRM's latest nonesense... I am sorely tempted to replace "puppies" with "homosexuals" and WorldCon with "The Presby Church" and republish it.

Entryism is bad when conservatives do it! But its great when gay liberals do it.

Blogger Cameron Byers April 10, 2015 9:01 AM  

If this year's docket does go nuclear (I'd rather hope it doesn't, but it would be amusing), I humbly submit that next year's campaign be titled 'Crispy Puppies' or something else equally evocative of radioactive canines.
Perhaps something less edible sounding though, we wouldn't want it to be done in poor taste.

OpenID cailcorishev April 10, 2015 9:09 AM  

A commenter at Larry's site nailed it: GRRM is like a teacher who gets called to break up a fight on the schoolyard which started because a kid who's been bullied for months finally fights back. The teacher doesn't care about issues of justice or first punches; he just knows it was peaceful until this kid (the one that fought back) got feisty, so he punishes them equally in hopes things will go back to how they were.

That's giving Martin the benefit of the doubt and assuming that he's really as oblivious as he's acting.

Anonymous Difster April 10, 2015 9:10 AM  

The SJWs will try and may succeed in blowing up the Hugos. I do hope so.

I posit that science fiction will be better for a complete annihilation of the Hugos in 2016 and beyond. We don't need to change the gatekeepers, we need to destroy the gates.

Blogger Salt April 10, 2015 9:10 AM  

Brad's so worried over the precious Hugo. "Will anybody listen to me?"

No, Brad. This is a duel, and they get first shot. It's axiomatic at this point they shall take their best shot. It's also observable they are aiming badly. The rabid puppies, on the other hand, are zero'd in.

One or the other IS going down; the Hugo or the rabbits themselves. Either way, the rabbits lose. The puppies are in the house, bringing in good SF/F, and the puppies are not going to leave. The puppies are not going to kick anyone out. The puppies love a good fight; bring your best (book).

If the opposition had any ability to understand what you are asking of them, "If the people who hate Vox bork the Hugos in 2015, they are the biggest assholes SF/F has ever seen in its history", we'd not be here in the first instance. They'd not be rabbits. But they are.

"If Vox borks the Hugos in 2016, he is the biggest asshole SF/F has ever seen in its history."

No, Brad. Vox, and the rabbid puppies, are playing the game as set by the rabbits and within the Rules. What you do understand is what he, and the rabbid puppies, are willing to do - pull the trigger. What you cannot comprehend is that doing so is the moral high-ground.

This is a fight for The Prize

No, Brad. This is why you don't get it. You do not comprehend what the target is.

Anonymous joe doakes April 10, 2015 9:14 AM  

SJW: I win again, yeah me!

Vox: You cheated. Play fair or I burn it down.

[long interval of wailing, whining, whispering, whimpering]

SJW: What are your terms?

Narrator: Our Hero now knows he's gained the upper hand, but he cannot show weakness. How will he master the savage creature? Tune in next week for another thrilling episode of . . . .

Anonymous Eric Ashley April 10, 2015 9:14 AM  

That's a beautiful picture.

Blogger Cameron B April 10, 2015 9:16 AM  

Pardon, but 'Nuclear Poodles' comes to mind... but that might already be a grunge rock band name.

Blogger Student in Blue April 10, 2015 9:18 AM  

@Nate
Well... you have to admit...

Well, Tad is certainly unbalanced, but I'm not so sure about this charge that Vox is Tad...

wait a minute...

I've never seen Tad and Vox in the same room!

Anonymous Lulabelle April 10, 2015 9:21 AM  

"We are prepared for all eventualities."

That must've made their blood run cold. It gives me a little shiver - and hell, I'm on your side.

Blogger Antonio From Spain April 10, 2015 9:24 AM  

Vox Day, The Most Hated Man in Science Fiction, Great White Shark, The Kurgan, The Wild Wolf…

Vox, I say your skill at amassing titles must be making the Duchess of Alba green with envy.

Anonymous Stg58 / Animal Mother April 10, 2015 9:26 AM  

Name next year's slate #SarahConnorclutchingafence.

Blogger Salt April 10, 2015 9:34 AM  

OT, sort of -

I am against all these proposals. If indeed I am at Spokane, and if I can get myself up in time for the business meeting, I will vote against every one of them.

Most of them, frankly, suck. And the mere fact that so many people are discussing them makes me think that the Puppies won. They started this whole thing by saying the Hugo Awards were rigged to exclude them. That is completely untrue, as I believe I demonstrated conclusively in my last post. So what is happening now? The people on MY SIDE, the trufans and SMOFs and good guys, are having an endless circle jerk trying to come up with a foolproof way to RIG THE HUGOS AND EXCLUDE THEM. God DAMN, people. You are proving them right.

Anonymous 0007 April 10, 2015 9:36 AM  

Giuseppe -
Unless someone is/was looking for a basement kitchen-slave(always out of sight/mind), I doubt there are any SJWs worth using for anything except low-grade fertilizer. We aren't talkin' about Keldera- level bimbettes over there...
OTH if the DI did decide to go all-in in 2016, I would have to give serious thought to spending $40 to watch the tower fall.

Anonymous dh April 10, 2015 9:38 AM  

There is an interesting ongoing thread at Making Light, moderated by Bruce Schenier, intended to come up with ways to modify the Hugo nomination process to be resistant to block voting and slates.

It's comical because despite having a world renowned leading expert on their side, virtually every single proposal is more easily gamed. Some of them are comically bad. TTFOT actually would like to consider releasing the identities of who nominated which works. Other proposals include using an algorithm to detect slate voting and under-weighting those votes. The concept that a numerically superior foe could use that algorithm to defeat nominees by block voting an anti-slate along with a real slate never occurred to them.

It occurs to me that, their best possible scenario is that any rule change is in effect for 2017, and that they literally cannot wait to try to figure out how to change the rules to revert the system to producing the average result.

I've known Bruce Schenier's work for a long time, and his politics are strongly libertarian and also left-leaning. He's also a fairly serious scientist, though not a scholar or leading-edge crypto-analyst or anything. He was forced to admit that he does not even have the data available to prove scientifically that a slate has occurred. I've directly calling him out on it, and I would somewhat surprised if he doesn't continue to backpedal from his initial claims that sounded a lot like "the science is settled". I would note that he has already floated the topic of getting access to the raw nominating data early, so it can be used to prepare options for rules change. If a consensus emerges that the data is needed before changing the rules, and the Worldcon voting organizers don't release the data, it could push out rules changes designed to re-favor the mean result to at least 2018.

Anonymous dh April 10, 2015 9:41 AM  

If this year's docket does go nuclear (I'd rather hope it doesn't, but it would be amusing), I humbly submit that next year's campaign be titled 'Crispy Puppies' or something else equally evocative of radioactive canines.

No, the solution for next year is to find the most banal, most useless, most creatively horrible books to nominate across the field. Ben Bernakes book, whatever books political candidates publish, a Farsi dictionary (for diversity), a Telephone book published from Ranchocugamonga, the scriblings in the rest room at a truck stop for best-fan writing,

These idiots have no idea what nuclear means. It means that the 2016 awards will be ruined, and the 2017 won't even be in the news. I swear they'd find a way to lose a tic-tac-toe.

Anonymous Viking April 10, 2015 9:43 AM  

Dogs are great, but wolves are awesome.

Anonymous Alexander April 10, 2015 9:46 AM  

What dh said.

It's cute that they consider a 'no award' campaign the worst way we could retaliate to the same being done to us.

When someone punches you, you don't punch back just as hard... As the new tale from the Brothers Ilk goes, "Once there was a little girl who poked a bear..."

Blogger Markku April 10, 2015 9:47 AM  

No, the solution for next year is to find the most banal, most useless, most creatively horrible books to nominate across the field.

I guess it would be a good time to remind you that Vox offered publishing contract to Andrew Marston.

Blogger CM April 10, 2015 9:47 AM  

That's giving Martin the benefit of the doubt and assuming that he's really as oblivious as he's acting.

I don't read his blog much... just drop in for tidbits on SoIaF, but he doesn't seem to care or want to talk about it.

His commentors keep bringing it up. I don't think he likes the drama, but its gotten so bad, perhaps he feels he needs to say something - and he just sees both sides as disrupting his little fiefdom of fantasy pursuits.

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 9:47 AM  

"No, the solution for next year is to find the most banal, most useless, most creatively horrible books to nominate across the field. Ben Bernakes book, whatever books political candidates publish, a Farsi dictionary (for diversity), a Telephone book published from Ranchocugamonga, the scriblings in the rest room at a truck stop for best-fan writing, "

****chuckle****

oh my dear DH... you have no idea how perilously close to reality this almost was... for this year.

Blogger Markku April 10, 2015 9:49 AM  

Greatest Hugoman 2016

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 9:49 AM  

"I guess it would be a good time to remind you that Vox offered publishing contract to Andrew Marston."

And the Greatest Swordsman in all of Cantatonia as well I hope...

Anonymous dh April 10, 2015 9:51 AM  

Nate, I could only imagine it was already debated. I mean, who would not love to see Best Non-Fiction Work turn into a debate among the ilk on which Bible translation is worthy of a Hugo - I've got my money on New American, but I am guess King James would probably win out.

I actually kinda of hope that stumble into a rule change blindly. It will be all the more sweet that they'll screw it up, and make the process even more friendly to a numerically superior foe.

If they had any brains at all they'd be finding a way to get Larry a Hugo or lifetime achievement award.

Blogger Nate April 10, 2015 9:54 AM  

"If they had any brains at all they'd be finding a way to get Larry a Hugo or lifetime achievement award."

If they had a brain they would vote the puppy slate down the line... and give John Wright a standing ovation.

Anonymous Scintan April 10, 2015 10:05 AM  

Honestly, I don't think any of the choices we have now are good ones. All roads seem to lead to perdition, but each of us will need to walk the one we think best. Meanwhile, I urge everyone who is reading this to go to the Sasquan website and join the convention. Attend if you can; if not, join as a Supporting member, just as the Puppies did. It is too late to nominate, but not too late to vote. The Puppies will be getting out their vote, you can be sure. We need to do the same, unless we care to see some poor guy hand Vox Day a rocket.

Mr. Martin seems to have a basic grasp of the overall predicament, but no understanding beyond that.

I'll give him some credit though. I wasn't sure he'd even figure out the first part.

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 10:18 AM  

@ Steve

"He puts down his jewel-encrusted goblet of chilled blood and briefly picks a stray thread from his velvet robes, before addressing the gathered Ilk in a voice that is smooth as silk and sharp as a stiletto in your ear: "Tonight, my children, you will dine on SJW-flesh!"

Bravo, bravo. The muse has touched your pen with fire. You are a true wordsmith, sir.

Blogger Daniel April 10, 2015 10:18 AM  

I have explicitly approached the less entrenched with the most likely route towards the destruction of the Hugos, pointing out that even Tor's security guy advises that the best route is to do nothing and vote for the best available candidates.

They of course assume that I am lying and say, "So what you seem to be saying is that if we don't do what you want, you are going to nuke the Hugos? EVERYBODY VOTE NO AWARD!!!"

Their slogan should be "We committed suicide and it's all your fault."

Blogger Didact April 10, 2015 10:18 AM  

HAIL AND KILL.

OpenID UnderwaterOperative April 10, 2015 10:19 AM  

"If they had any brains at all they'd be finding a way to get Larry a Hugo or lifetime achievement award."

No. Larry has already put the kibosh on that idea. In fact, he nuked it.

"I got a nomination for my novel Warbound last year. The people I’m trying to expose rose to the occasion, formed lynch mobs and started attacking. I got a nomination again this year, for my novel Monster Hunter Nemesis, but I refused the nomination, specifically to prove that this isn’t about me wanting a Hugo. Apparently that still isn’t enough.
Allow me to demonstrate my conviction, and state for the record that I will never accept a Hugo award nomination for myself. However, I will continue to assist other authors who I believe have been unfairly blacklisted and shunned get theirs."

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 10:26 AM  

@ SteveO

"GRRM even throws the Ad Hom at John C Wright just because... we know why GRRM"

Disappointing, because Mr Martin and I have worked together in the past (SONGS OF THE DYING EARTH), and he gave one of my stories one of the finest compliments I have ever received.

Am I the only professional in the field? The only one with a sense of professional courtesy? Don't belittle the people with whom you work. Is that a hard rule to understand and obey?

Anonymous WinstonWebb April 10, 2015 10:26 AM  

Didact +1 for Manowar reference.
"Blood of a King" lyrics would fit this situation nicely as well.

Blogger darkdoc April 10, 2015 10:28 AM  

For SJW authors, the Hugos are not only about political ideology, but also about money. Getting recognition, an award, and book sales. Book sales for books that could rarely stand on their own merits. Because they are shitty.

To one degree or another, It is always about the money, eventually.

Blogger JaimeInTexas April 10, 2015 10:36 AM  

My only interest in this Hugo fiasco is how it is a microcosm of the culture war.

"Crispy Puppies"

Many years ago, when Rush Limbaugh was actually funny, there was a guy (I think his name was Mitch from the mountains somewhere) that would call the show and talked about picking stray dogs and making tacos ...

Puppy Tacos

http://www.joe-ks.com/archives_feb2012/PuppyTaco.jpg

Blogger JaimeInTexas April 10, 2015 10:37 AM  

"Tonight, my children, you will dine on SJW-flesh!"

Oh, great. Know we will have to endure the endless meme on how the Dread Ilk endorses cannibalism.


Anonymous Porky April 10, 2015 10:38 AM  

"Allow me to demonstrate my conviction, and state for the record that I will never accept a Hugo award nomination for myself."

This is where their brains get gooey and sputtery. The thought that someone genuinely does not care about a trophy is truly unthinkable to them.

'How can you not want a $#^%* HUGO award??? You must be stupid or evil or both!!!!!'

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 10:40 AM  

Gentlemen, those of you who are criticizing Brad Torgersen for his remarks are, if I may so say without offense, missing the point.

You regard it as a sign of weakness to ask the other side to calm down and vote for merit.

I regard his post as a courteous gesture. In a duel, before the two men shoot at each other, the judge asks if everything has been done to avoid the mortal combat. This is not done so that one side or the other will back down -- they almost never do -- it is to clear the conscience on both sides.

No one can later claim he was not forewarned. No one can later claim he was not given one last clear chance to jump free from the train going over of a cliff.

It is similar to when the priest at a wedding asks if there are any objections: purely a formality, but it means that if someone later wants to speak up, he can be told he had his chance, he blew his chance, and now he can shut up or be shut up.

It is not a sign of weakness on Brad's part. It is indeed granting the enemy a courtesy to which they are in nowise entitled, but it is done for the sake of form.

It is like running up the Jolly Roger. Now you have seen our flag. Once your throat is slit, it is too late to complain.

Blogger JaimeInTexas April 10, 2015 10:41 AM  

I googled and found that it was "Mick from the high mountains of New Mexico."

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 10:45 AM  

"To one degree or another, It is always about the money, eventually. "

A private conversation with a well placed and influential editor in the New York publishing house was rather eye opening to me. It seems the Hugo, at one time, predictably bumped up sales for a work that won by a thousand books sold. Now, thirty.

Think of that. The Hugo might, might, give you extra money enough for a nice meal, if that. No one is buying a replacement washing machine by selling thirty extra books.

This means the Hugos mean nothing, represent nothing, and are no longer a sign of read-worthy work.

Until this year. Gentlemen, delightful as it is to go all Death Star on the Hugos and blow it into asteroids (and what true science fiction fan does not delight in seeing cities nuked and worlds fried like eggs?) more delightful, to me, at least, would be to rip the award from the greasy pale fingers of the Morlocks, give a good spit shine, and make it mean again what it once meant.

I feel I owe Frank Herbert the attempt.

Blogger Salt April 10, 2015 10:50 AM  

Gentlemen, those of you who are criticizing Brad Torgersen for his remarks are, if I may so say without offense, missing the point.

Nah. The point was made a long time ago. What Brad is saying was said long ago.

more delightful, to me, at least, would be to rip the award from the greasy pale fingers of the Morlocks, give a good spit shine, and make it mean again what it once meant.

That's still a possibility regardless that the black flag has been hoisted.

Anonymous Alexander April 10, 2015 10:54 AM  

Something else these idiots don't want to grasp.

They keep moaning about how these phantom group of new authors who have never won were forced off the ballot by the puppies...

Now, sidestepping the issue that there's not some magic group that owns the ballot and any nomination process that results in their exclusion is unjust... just what are they going to say when surprise! instead of 'new, exciting authors' the results show that we were being set up for another round of Scalzi & Friends.

Blogger Daniel April 10, 2015 10:55 AM  

"Chicken with the Dark Lord" should be a donation level award for the Kickstarter.

Anonymous Alexander April 10, 2015 10:58 AM  

I take it that Brad is making one final overture. The peace process is effectively over, but the devestation is such that it is worth the final offer.

But Brad isn't haggling. He's made the good faith effort and noted that if the SJWs continue to libel us in the press and to blacklist on principle... well, then it won't matter, because sad puppies will defect to the rabid, and it'll be nuked.

It's a final act of mercy that does him credit. We implore your withdrawal from the battlefield before all of you and yours are destroyed.

Anonymous Anonymous April 10, 2015 10:59 AM  

Giuseppe said:

"The really dangerous ones are always calm."

Michael Corleone settles all family business:

https://youtu.be/8vZx7yF_a7M

The most chilling scene in The Godfather. Michael's preternatural calm before he has Carlo whacked is just astounding. The SJWs really don't know what they're letting themselves in for.

Blogger Joshua Dyal April 10, 2015 11:01 AM  

Brad's an idealist who would prefer to see the Hugos preserved and rehabilitated rather than destroyed beyond repair. In spite of GRRM's obnoxious claim, that is still a possibility.

And you cave really fault a guy for that. I do believe, however, that he still fails to realize the true scope of the existential struggle for our very civilization that we're in. The Hugos aren't the big picture, they're just one small front in the greater culture wars.

Anonymous Anonymous April 10, 2015 11:02 AM  

W LindsayWheeler said:

"Remo, that narrator of the honey badger is gay. That's disgusting. Honey Badger Good, Gay Narrator Bad."

Yes, but Honey Badger is BADASS. Honey Badger don't give a shit. That sort of outweighs Gay Narrator.

Blogger Daniel April 10, 2015 11:05 AM  

Strategically, John, the SP/RP campaign gives the award its best shot at redemption, even if the army of RP/SP don't care about its redemption. Now, some do, some don't and some are even openly hoping for the bomb to go off.

But if you want the awards to be saved, you actually need the nuke/instigators to be willing to go there. You couldn't possibly save them otherwise. If we aren't willing to do it, the SJWs have leverage: "Oh, these dopes still actually love this award we denigrate and trade like a whore. As much as they hate our abuse of her, they certainly would never risk her life in order to save her from us."

The moderate hero - the risk averse hero - stays silent while the problem grows, then seeks compromise when he has no leverage to do so. The hero who succeeds, risks all. This isn't about burning the village to save it - not exactly. It is about risking burning the village in order to keep it from certainly burning.

Anonymous GreyS April 10, 2015 11:06 AM  

This entire thing could have been avoided had Scalzi mobilized his 50,000 daily readers. Or 5% of them, anyway.

Anonymous AlteredFate April 10, 2015 11:16 AM  

That's going to leave a mark.

Blogger Vox April 10, 2015 11:24 AM  

Gentlemen, delightful as it is to go all Death Star on the Hugos and blow it into asteroids (and what true science fiction fan does not delight in seeing cities nuked and worlds fried like eggs?) more delightful, to me, at least, would be to rip the award from the greasy pale fingers of the Morlocks, give a good spit shine, and make it mean again what it once meant.

The dreadwolves are whining and pulling against their iron chains at the scent of blood. The Dark Lord smiles and sips from his chalice. "Patience, my friends," he counsels. "Anticipation only whets the appetite."

Anonymous Nobody of Import April 10, 2015 11:26 AM  

Heh...

1) I don't think Brad's getting cold feet. He's just stating that he'd rather that we didn't go absolutely nuclear if at all possible. Most of us would. But...in the same vein...if they're going to nuke it from orbit, it's time to salt the scorched earth completely. If they're going to take their ball and go home, make sure you hole the fucker good so that they don't have it either.

2) The SJW's gnashing and wailing is sweet to most's eyes and ears. The tears...they're very tasty...especially chilled like a fine wine. Having said this, most Progbot SJW's don't have the guts to go do this thing. They don't want their toy, their safe little world wherein their feelings are validated...even if it no longer fully does that. They have their comfortable spot and most Pesonality Disordered individuals want some semblance of the little world they live in rather than destroying it by their own hand- they'd be invalidating themselves hard. (Ever seen an NPD or BPD snap and go catatonic into a little ball? This would DO that to much of this bunch.)

Anonymous Daniel April 10, 2015 11:28 AM  

Good point GreyS. Super simple solution - Scalzi needs to finally mobilize his forces, as he has never done that before, as evidenced by his multiple Hugo losses, be the good guy, and ride in on his high horse.

White horse.

Damn autocorrect.

Anonymous Daniel April 10, 2015 11:31 AM  

Brad's on the front line, taking flak. He made a minor but unnecessary and counterproductive sacrifice in the heat of it, but let's not get bogged down in run-of-the mill error, when most of the warning shots hit the mark, so to speak.

Blogger IM2L844 April 10, 2015 11:34 AM  

Je suis lèse-majesté

Anonymous Donn April 10, 2015 11:36 AM  

John Wright, this will change the way the Hugo affects the winners. It's gotten bigger and bolder this year at least and people will notice.

That said, I say it is time to grab your trench knife, Colt .45 auto and get down into the trenches with them. Hell yes bring a knife to a gun fight. And bring a gun, a tomahawk and a brace of grenades.

We've crossed no mans land, broken into their trenches and are sending them reeling towards the rear. Keep up the pressure until they throw down their arms and yield. We've beaten them on their own ground and made it ours. Have you read the comments over at EW? They got massacred.

If somebody actually interviews Vox or Larry over this it, it will be another rout. Go Nuclear? That's all they have left and there'll be nothing but 'blue on blue' for them. Now would be the time for them to wave the white flag, negotiate a truce, and vote as their conscience dictates for the best works.

Right now their press release was a circular firing squad. And which genius on their side made the 'press release'? That was the worst idea they've had so far. Yes please keep slandering people including gamergate. Now they have a chance to say, 'stop the madness'.

Anonymous Stg58 / Animal Mother April 10, 2015 11:40 AM  

The hate keeps me warm. Oh sweet Jesus I love this. Why? The SJW'S are the Pop Warner division of the communists, socialists, progressives and Marxists that are ruining this country, slaughtering unborn children, plunging us all into real war etc.

No Mercy, no quarter, no surrender. Total and utter defeat. How many of us have had fathers or family members put in jail by their allies?

There is no substitute for victory.

Anonymous Earl Ragnar cheddarman April 10, 2015 11:44 AM  

My Leige,

The German in me would rather destroy them though a triple envelopment followed by a cauldron battle.

The Irish/Scot in me would like to play head hurling with the spoils of war.

However, I will obey.



Anonymous cheddarman April 10, 2015 11:46 AM  

"Yes, but Honey Badger is BADASS. Honey Badger don't give a shit."

The Honey Badger is a true Sigma type.

Anonymous DeepThought April 10, 2015 11:51 AM  

It's almost as if Brad does not like you. I noticed he trys to paint you as out in left field?

Am I the only one who notices this? It's almost as if Brad would rather have Vox shut up.

Anonymous FP April 10, 2015 11:51 AM  

"A SJW friend of mine has asked, half-seriously, what are Vox's terms of surrender."

The same terms they demand. Unconditional surrender.

I'd like to nominate for 2016, "If you were a Murloc Astronaut from Mars, my love." for best fanfic.

Also best non fiction should be "If you were a Japanese Invasion Fleet, would you invade the west coast, my love?"

Anonymous AlteredFate April 10, 2015 11:55 AM  

"You’ve had a couple of decades to get your lunatic fringe (and there are dozens, if not hundreds of them) on a leash. You haven’t. Screeching about Vox Day a hundred times doesn’t make up for it."

I get what he's saying but I don't like the implication that Vox is the "right-wing" equivalent of their child-molesting-gender-confused-gamma-aspy-mid-wits. He's not. Vox is a philosopher and grand strategist. They have no equivalent on their side, as we have no equivalent of their "lunatics" on ours. Because this it is not about the nature of right and left, but of right and wrong.

Anonymous Steveo April 10, 2015 11:55 AM  

Indeed.

OT - I'll take the opportunity to thank you for rekindling my interest in great sci-fi (City Beyond Time - Tales of the Fall of Metachronopolis was the start & I'm working my way through your other work now).

Anonymous Steveo April 10, 2015 11:56 AM  

The above post didn't get the @ John C Wright intended...

Blogger dw April 10, 2015 11:57 AM  

"A SJW friend of mine has asked, half-seriously, what are Vox's terms of surrender."

I would say...there are none. You and your kind have made surrender, your own I mean, impossible. Forty years of accomodating and retreat have proven your side's utter depravity. There is no going back, now that we have seen what's at stake, what the SJWs want. Peace was never an option after that. I hope shitting on Western civilization was worth it, because the pendulum is about to swing back with a vengeance, and this time it's been sharpened.

Blogger Vox April 10, 2015 12:02 PM  

Am I the only one who notices this? It's almost as if Brad would rather have Vox shut up.

As the spokesman for SP3, I have no doubt that he would. It's not like we really know each other at all. I think he's a good man, albeit overly inclined to moderation and the tolerance of evil. He thinks I am the ruthless leader of a wild wolf pack whose true goals are unknown, but probably destructive.

But whatever we might think of each other, we both find ourselves faced with the same enemy. So, I will take no shots at him, in public or in private, regardless of what he may say.

Anonymous WinstonWebb April 10, 2015 12:05 PM  

"He thinks I am the ruthless leader of a wild wolf pack whose true goals are unknown, but probably destructive."

Then he has sage-like wisdom.

Anonymous Jack Amok April 10, 2015 12:09 PM  

I think you under-estimate the willingness of the Ilk to nuke and pave for sake of nuking and paving.

It's still "they went first" but like WinstonWebb's quote, once you goad a man into hoisting the black flag, it's not coming down for a while.

There is an interesting ongoing thread at Making Light, moderated by Bruce Schenier, intended to come up with ways to modify the Hugo nomination process to be resistant to block voting and slates.

There is no solution to avoid block voting so long as voting is allowed. You really only have three choices for how you give awards. You can base it on pure sales (that's the real "fan's award" but of course you'd have to deal with publishers cooking the books), you can base it on votes from a broad group as it is now (which means block voting will happen), or you can have some small, select commitee that decides. Personally, if you care about the award's brand, the last is the only thing that makes sense, and then the brand will be whatever thhe small, select committee makes of it.

Of course, that's what the SJW's thought they had, a small(ish) select group that they'd used entryism to capture. But they forgot to pull up the ladder after themselves.

Anonymous Bz April 10, 2015 12:13 PM  

From a link above to GRRM (http://grrm.livejournal.com/418643.html):

"The fandom I joined in 1971, the fandom I love, is open and friendly and welcoming, and has room for every shade of political opinion and literary taste. Those are values worth defending, a culture worth fighting for."

The fellow's just a teeny bit out of touch, isn't he? Or perhaps he means "every (pink) shade ...".

Yes, I suppose he does:

"But let's not give in to our worst impulses. I do not want to disenfranchise anyone. (Well, okay, maybe a few, rabies is dangerous)."

Anonymous clk April 10, 2015 12:14 PM  

"This means the Hugos mean nothing, represent nothing, and are no longer a sign of read-worthy work"

In 50 years of life I have probably bought > 500 or so paper back Scifi books (this doesnt include kindle type ebooks which dominates my pleasure reading buying for last ) ...some were list rate, others 2nd hand books but thats still a fair amount of money... ... I am not sure how pre internet/amazon I picked which books I would read .. sometimes it was purely on the cover art (and yes having scantily clothed women on the covers does or did sell books), sometime just by the author or subject (I have bought a lot of Star trek books)...

But I have never, ever bought a book based on a Hugo's award (or any other award) .. I didnt even know what a Hugo was until I recently ... so I wouldnt worry too much whether the Hugo's survive ... If you want me to buy a book now.. just make sure its available as an ebook and not too expensive... give me well crafted sentences, real characters and try to make the science consistent and I will buy and read it...


Blogger wrf3 April 10, 2015 12:16 PM  

An absolutely brilliant comment by "DungeonMaster" over at National Review: In my lifetime SF has gone from dangerous visions to safe spaces.

Vox, it's time for Castalia House to produce this generation's "Dangerous Visions". While some are trembling at a future filled with Sad and Rabid Puppies, as entertaining as it may be, it doesn't quite fill Ellison's shoes.

Anonymous Salt April 10, 2015 12:16 PM  

So, I will take no shots at him, in public or in private, regardless of what he may say.

"I couldn't do it, so I swerved. I couldn't hit him."

"That's okay, I understand your position. I got him with my door."

Anonymous Stingray April 10, 2015 12:16 PM  

I don't like the implication that Vox is the "right-wing" equivalent of their child-molesting-gender-confused-gamma-aspy-mid-wits. He's not.

Being a Racist, Misogynistic, Dipshit is a far, far worse crime that anything you listed. (I'm drawing a blank on something in their description).

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 12:20 PM  

"Vox, it's time for Castalia House to produce this generation's "Dangerous Visions"."

Glad you asked. I submitted a story to an anthology meant to do exactly that.

More info as it comes out.

Blogger wrf3 April 10, 2015 12:36 PM  

John Wright wrote: More info as it comes out.

Squeee! Wait, can a Rabid Puppy squeee?

Also, I read somewhere that you might be appearing at a Con in Atlanta in the future. Anything confirmed, yet?

Blogger James Dixon April 10, 2015 12:36 PM  

> (I'm drawing a blank on something in their description).

Homophobic.

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 12:37 PM  

@Daniel "But if you want the awards to be saved, you actually need the nuke/instigators to be willing to go there. "

NO PROBLEMO! Hear, hear, and I agree, and maybe we should nuke the awards this year just to 'encourager les autres' and show the dimwits we mean freakin' business. I say this knowing darned well that my six nominations will be nuked in the process.

Listen. As Winston Webb, upthread, quotes HL Mencken, “Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.”

I have already spit on my hands.

I would like, as a matter of form, for the Morlocks to be told we are prepared to Death Star the planet -- Dantooine is too remote to make an effective demonstration -- so that later, when THEY LIE and say they were not warned of the coming storm, they can have the punishments divine justice pours down on falsifiers in the Eight Circle of Hell in addition to the punishments they have earned as Flatterers, Hypocrites, Evil Counselors and Sowers of Discord.

(for the record, the penalties include being buried in excrement, forced marching in lead robes, burning with tongue of fire, and being severed eternally by a demonic swordblade. Falsifier are plagued with scabs or turn on each other as beasts.)

If our side does not make this gracious gesture, the punishments they bring on themselves will be less.

And we cannot have that.

Look -- I hate to get emotional. It is bad for my Vulcan digestion. But the Hugos used to mean something, and now they don't. A little bit of light and glory have departed the world.

Those who snuffed that light, hating a brightness they could not ignite themselves, must pay.

Blogger doofus April 10, 2015 12:38 PM  

"Besides, I am reliably informed that I am 'abysmally stupid,' 'mentally ill,' 'a tad unbalanced' and so forth. Frankly, I don't think I can trust myself to be sufficiently competent to be entrusted with such great responsibility."

I like to call this the "George Bush Effect." Anyone that the SJWs dislike, they disparage as being "illiterate," "ignorant," "anti-intellectual," and (to quote Bugs Bunny) "whatta maroon!" Then, as they inevitably do in the course of their thoughtless imposition of bizarre rules and brainless philosophies, they screw up and find that their purportedly ignorant foe has done an end run around them, they immediately declare him an "evil genius!" and "worstest person in the world."

So, Vox, you are an ignorant hateymchater stupid, ignorant bigot whose Machiavellian machinations reveal the depths of vileness in your soul.

Or something.

David

Blogger James Beech April 10, 2015 12:39 PM  

No award! Heavens forbid, oh my gosh. This is, after all, SERIOUS stuff.

Well. On second thought, screw the sjw's.

Anonymous Valiant April 10, 2015 12:41 PM  

*Growl* *Growl* *Yowlllllllllllllllllll*

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 12:41 PM  

@ Gray

"This entire thing could have been avoided had Scalzi mobilized his 50,000 daily readers. Or 5% of them, anyway."

Gentlemen, I would like to nominate Gray for this year's Vox Award, in the category of 'Comment shorter than a Haiku, yet sharper than a samurai sword, cutting to the bone in one stroke.'

Well said, sir. Well said indeed.

Anonymous Stingray April 10, 2015 12:41 PM  

I can't believe I forgot the most important one . . .

Anonymous Darth Toolpodicus April 10, 2015 12:44 PM  

"Dangerous Visions"

...sounds like a fan-freaking-tastic anthology title

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 12:44 PM  

@ SteveO
"The above post didn't get the @ John C Wright intended"

Friend, I am pretty sure I understood the gist anyone. I am the only one here who wrote that book.

You are most welcome. I live to serve.

Blogger ScuzzaMan April 10, 2015 12:51 PM  

Certainly, if the rabbits No Award the fuck out of everything this year, then everyone opposed to them should double down on No Award next year.

If for no other reason than to watch the rhetorical gymnastics necessary to disavow their own tactic.

Again.

Anonymous Salt April 10, 2015 1:04 PM  

Honestly, I don't think any of the choices we have now are good ones. All roads seem to lead to perdition, but each of us will need to walk the one we think best. Meanwhile, I urge everyone who is reading this to go to the Sasquan website and join the convention. Attend if you can; if not, join as a Supporting member, just as the Puppies did. It is too late to nominate, but not too late to vote. The Puppies will be getting out their vote, you can be sure. We need to do the same, unless we care to see some poor guy hand Vox Day a rocket.

Whether Vox Day deserves one or not, right? As I said an another comment there concerning another soul, "Bar the door, Katie, it's that [Vox Day] again! He ain't our kind!"

I do hope he brings out his kind, in droves. The Battle of Megatonnage. Sweet!

Blogger John Wright April 10, 2015 1:08 PM  

@wrf3

Here is the official announcement, which I have edited only very slightly to correct some unintentional errors:

"ABC DeepSouthCon 54, to be held in Roswell, GA in May 2016, has announced its guest of honor slate.

"Author John C. Wright, a Nebula nominee in 2006 for his novel Orphans of Chaos, is Guest of Honor.

"Wright’s lovely and obedient wife, who writes under her pen name of L. Jagi Lamplighter, is a special guest of the convention. She is the authoress of the Prospero’s Daughter trilogy.

"Mr and Mrs Wright live in Virginia with their children and with a witch in the basement.

"Mr Wright is a homophobic misogynist rightwing bigot who seeks the destruction of the human race, so that he and his people can emerge and take command of the surface.

"He takes his orders from the Pope, who is a communist lizard creature from a dark world orbiting Alpha Draconis, also called Thuban.

"Clarification: It is the star is also called Thuban, not the Pope. The Pope is called Francis, or, by his posse, Frankie or 'The Frankster'.

"Thuban was the pole star in 3000 BC, which paleoparapsychologists have established to be the year the hairy cannibal Gnophkehs overcame many-templed Olathoe and slew all the heroes of the land of Lomar, and brought the primordial Pnakotic Manuscripts made by waking men in forgotten boreal kingdoms into the land of dreams."

You are probably wonder what part I edited. The official announcement had hyphenated 'Gnophkehs' as 'Gnoph-kehs' It is a common error.

The rest of the announcement, however, makes no mention of evil stars nor oneiromantic anthropophages. No mention at all! I wonder at how oddly it is written.

"Bill Ritch, head of the popular Atlanta Radio Theater Company, has long been active in Southern fandom. He ran the film program at ConFederation, the 1986 Worldcon in Atlanta. He’s also been seen in his Tom Baker costume working pledge breaks during Dr. Who broadcasts on Georgia Public Television.

"The Toastmaster will be Wendy Webb Nesheim, Ph.D. who has served in that role at many cons, especially Chattacon. She works in the medical field, specializing in humanitarian disaster assistance. Wendy is also the daughter of the past Southern SF writer Sharon Webb.

"The Fan Artist Guest of Honor is Chattanooga-based artist Julia Morgan-Scott, a regular contributor to Southern fanzines over the years."

Anonymous Geoff April 10, 2015 1:12 PM  

Whenever I'm tempted to show SJWs some mercy, I will remember that that they deserve their punishments as "Flatterers, Hypocrites, Evil Counselors and Sowers of Discord."

Well said, John.

Anonymous Porky April 10, 2015 1:20 PM  

Nuke!....Nuke!.....Nuke!.....Nuke!......

Blogger Russell April 10, 2015 1:26 PM  

Ragnarök is coming.

Anonymous Anonymous April 10, 2015 1:30 PM  

The greater the spurious vitrol, the greater the truth of the statement.

Blogger Ray Mota April 10, 2015 1:32 PM  

The greater the spurious vitrol, the greater the import of the truth.

OpenID cailcorishev April 10, 2015 2:09 PM  

"But let's not give in to our worst impulses. I do not want to disenfranchise anyone. (Well, okay, maybe a few, rabies is dangerous)."

It's little comments like that that make me suspect he's feigning the disinterested, above-it-all pose. In most of what I read he seems like the teacher who just found one boy beating the snot out of another and doesn't know (or care) who started it. But whenever he does take a little jab or object to a particular term, it's always in the same direction. After a while, it's hard to believe that's an accident.

It's a standard concern troll tactic, really: claim to object to bomb throwers on both sides, but somehow only get around to identifying one side's. He's a talented enough writer to do it better than most.

Blogger Danby April 10, 2015 2:14 PM  

"The only thing even remotely disappointing is that this wasn't so obvious to every party involved that it needed to be put in writing."

Well, I've confessed before to not really being a strategic thinker. This was not on my list of counter moves. I have to say though that it made me laugh out loud. Once it's pointed out, it's both obvious, and obviously devastating to the other side.

Frankly, this is what most normal men have been waiting for, an opportunity to fight back against this SJ bullshit, with a general in charge who we know won't abandon us on the field, or even reach an accommodation with the enemy. They only way they can win is if we abandon the fight, but we have been abandoning the fight, and abandoning other men to the savage mob for decades now. It's about time to put a fucking stop to it.

When I read Brad's piece, I could almost hear Will Smith
"He'll do it,Jeebs. That man does not look stable. He's crazy when he's like this."
"He's always crazy."
"Why don't you get a massage? Take a cruise."
[SF weapon sound]
"Drop the weapon. Hands on your head!"
"I warned him. You warned him."

Anonymous Mr.A is Mr.A April 10, 2015 2:34 PM  

"GRRM: Honestly, I don't think any of the choices we have now are good ones. All roads seem to lead to perdition, but each of us will need to walk the one we think best."

Even the Grand Master begins to perceive the intricacies of the Xanatos Gambit. Were that he was not so willing to disenfranchise the "rabid" SF/F fans. He should know that a door open a crack is wide open.

GRRM's unwillingness to call out the SWJs and ask for cooperation means that he himself has asked Westeros into the Hugos ... and Winter is coming.

Blogger Noah B April 10, 2015 3:08 PM  

To quote Slim Pickens:

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

Blogger Zeke OF Confettii April 10, 2015 3:10 PM  

John, Mrs. Wright is invited mostly for her own marvelous writing but in the hope that she could provide adult Superversive supervision to an entity of the fourth density.
Would you please get back in your chair, and sub-create?

Anonymous still-life April 10, 2015 3:43 PM  

"Is Torgeson the guy who played the ultimate "I'm not a racist" card the other day by posting a pic of his african wife? And that didn't work? And this is his new plan? Think of the awards?"

That's because he doesn't understand what racist means today to those people. He's assuming the old definition:

"racist: One who has hatred or intolerance of another race or other races."

Racist is now known to be a word of power. Minorities get a +5 attack points and do not require any artifacts to invoke it. Whites must first have a Cloak of Self-Righteousness and have mastered the Check Your Privilege ward. Target will be silenced and discredited. NOTE: Target must first believe in the power of the word in the first place, otherwise, attack will fail.

Anonymous Giuseppe April 10, 2015 4:11 PM  

0007,
We're talking purely simple manual labour here.
You know, clean the moat, feed the warhounds the flesh of other rabbits, clean the stables.
As we're all mysoginist racists obviously we already have our fill of willing and eager slavegirls, why would we want to mire ourselves in the lardness of unwashed SJW landwhales?

I mean, we may be perverse evil doers of the worst kind, but we have standards sir!

Anonymous Anubis April 10, 2015 4:41 PM  

"blaming the family dog (me"

Was I the only one to wonder if he was Lena Dunham's Jewish boyfriend that happened to be a furry?

"Squeee! Wait, can a Rabid Puppy squeee?"

I think you are looking for the queer puppies mentioned earlier

"Racist is now known to be a word of power. Minorities get a +5 attack points and do not require any artifacts to invoke it."

Did Vox ever get a trading card like Steve Sailor and Jared Taylor did? http://www.unz.com/isteve/steve-sailer-trading-card/ Ability Stereotype threat: Gains one bonus attack for each protected group the target belongs to

"Tonight, my children, you will dine on SJW-flesh!" But, they are so tasteless!"

They are as bitter as their tears. Didn't Vox offer up dinner with him as a kickstarter reward? Perhaps the SJWs will cough up some cash to have Chicken with the Dark Lord to beg for mercy.

racist: One who has hatred or intolerance of another race after meeting non Asian minorities.

Anonymous Giuseppe April 10, 2015 4:54 PM  

"He thinks I am the ruthless leader of a wild wolf pack whose true goals are unknown, but probably destructive."

Then he has sage-like wisdom.


No. Whoever actually thinks that at very best can be said to not understand the other side. At best they know themselves, but clearly they are no master strategists.

There is almost nothing Vox does that doesn't have a precise aim. Some may be more conscious and direct than others, but I would bet almost any money that even his most off-hand actions in this (or any other) culture war is guided by an underlying principle of strategy that by now has become integral to the man.

I recognise many parallels with him, and it would be very interesting to know him better to note the differences. My current thought is that of the four type of men Clausewitz describes, Vox is the fourth type, the one truly most viable as a successful general.

I personally recognised myself when first reading On War as the third type, which can be a superb tactical commander of sometimes unmatched skill, but not temperate enough for the command of the broader war. The similarities I have with Vox are more than a few, but the main difference I note in our temperaments are that his level of patience is higher than mine (which I attribute to his faith) and while I think our ability to see the long game is probably similar, his ability to effectively direct the long game is almost certainly better.

I wonder at his reactive ability in the field under unexpected and sudden fog-of-war situations, but I suspect he would likely react in a somewhat pre-informed manner due to his sense of the bigger picture, and this is very often more than enough to get his side to come out victorious. My own strength lies precisely in this aspect. It is a skill only somewhat informed by the larger picture, so while in the sudden, extreme and unexpected fog-of-war, chaos and madness is where I would put my money on me rather than Vox, overall, I still think Clausewitz had it right.

The parallels lie in the fact that while my strength might be in the specific man-to-man level of combat, and his on the grand scale of the total battle, there is a similarity of informed, experienced instinct that allows you to react naturally in a way that is difficult to break down into specifics but still usually ends up in placing you in the right position, whether that be behind the enemy with a your Gerber mkII at his throat, or wheeling your cavalry so as to crush his exposed flanks while your reserve infantry presses the frontal charge.

Anonymous WinstonWebb April 10, 2015 4:54 PM  

Excellent news!
Amynda has entered the fray!

Anonymous Alexander April 10, 2015 5:21 PM  

Didn't Vox offer up dinner with him as a kickstarter reward?

The way it was worded, I believe the reward was being allowed to sit in the corner and watch Vox and Spacebunny have a dinner for two.

You get to be a house minion.

Anonymous Rolf April 10, 2015 6:34 PM  

If I may quote Colonel Lag:

“Sun Tzu and others have written a lot of words on the strategies of deception. Maskirovka. But sometimes the only way to really win is to march in the front door flags flying, kick every ass in the place, mount their heads on pikes, burn it all to the ground on your way out the door, and go home. Leave nothing but smoking corpses and wreckage in your wake. Doesn’t leave a lot of room for misunderstanding or media spin. Now is such a time.”

Seems apropos.

Blogger LP 999/Eliza April 10, 2015 6:42 PM  

nein to all 3. I take notice not cry. Watch the opposition and let the time pass or bide my time until I comment.

what pure fun and its all to support a great cause...of valor!

Blogger LP 999/Eliza April 10, 2015 8:42 PM  

another fair response is cold objectivity that is where the sjw throws themselves to the ground kicking and screaming for atttttention.

Blogger IM2L844 April 10, 2015 9:00 PM  

Excellent news!
Amynda has entered the fray!


It's hard to stomach such malicious tripe. Amanda Marcotte can't imagine that we have wives, girlfriends, sisters, daughters and mothers who are proud of the men we are. Educated, successful and honest men of integrity with the courage of our convictions. She also doesn't understand that there are many women here among us too. Smart, capable and honorable women with husbands, boyfriends, sons, brothers and fathers who adore them, treat them with honor and respect and who would defend them with their lives if necessary.

People like Amanda really hack me off because they are nothing more than useful idiots who are utterly clueless about everything they claim to have so much contempt for. She doesn't even understand her own side of the argument let alone ours. There is so much more I could say, but the only thing she needs to know from me is that I wouldn't bother to piss on her if she were on fire.

Blogger bob k. mando April 10, 2015 10:06 PM  

Cataline Sergius April 10, 2015 6:05 AM
Oh well,we never did decide on a theme song.


i already suggested 'Bad Craziness' from D.A.D.

then, of course, there's Motorhead
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_JF8oSxXtM


... the Evil Lord of Evil, as a slavering wolf, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour ...



Markku April 10, 2015 8:42 AM
They will, however, go first.


they already went first last year.



cailcorishev April 10, 2015 9:09 AM
That's giving Martin the benefit of the doubt and assuming that he's really as oblivious as he's acting.



GRRM is a Socialist.

he may make some reasonable sounding noises on occasion, but his heart is with the Toad.



John Wright April 10, 2015 10:26 AM
Am I the only professional in the field?



a - see above. socialists always demand political re-education for dissenters. they don't care about your skill
b - i realize you are speaking rhetorically, but i would point out that you seem to be allied with several other authors who are attempting to return 'professionalism' to the field

Blogger Longstreet April 10, 2015 11:40 PM  

It is indeed granting the enemy a courtesy to which they are in nowise entitled, but it is done for the sake of form.

"Some people did not like this ceremonial style. But after all when you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."
Winston Churchill

Blogger Longstreet April 10, 2015 11:41 PM  

It is indeed granting the enemy a courtesy to which they are in nowise entitled, but it is done for the sake of form.

"Some people did not like this ceremonial style. But after all when you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."
Winston Churchill

Anonymous Morgana du Lac April 11, 2015 2:00 AM  

I'm enjoying this entire kerfluffle wayyyy too much. But still....OG ilk gotta keep it real.

"He puts down his umbrella-and-pineapple-wedge garnished daquiri colada and briefly picks a stray thread from his purple and gold soccer jersey, before addressing the gathered Ilk in a voice that is smooth as silk and sharp as a stiletto in your ear: "SKOL!"

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