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Monday, June 08, 2015

An unapology, unaccepted

Tom Doherty, Publisher of Tor Books, disavows Irene Gallo's views, but does absolutely nothing to resolve the situation.
Last month, Irene Gallo, a member of Tor’s staff, posted comments about two groups of science fiction writers, Sad Puppies and Rabid Puppies, and about the quality of some of the 2015 Hugo Award nominees, on her personal Facebook page. Ms. Gallo is identified on her page as working for Tor. She did not make it clear that her comments were hers alone. They do not reflect Tor’s views or mine. She has since clarified that her personal views are just that and apologized to anyone her comments may have hurt or offended....

Tor employees, including Ms. Gallo, have been reminded that they are required to clarify when they are speaking for Tor and when they are speaking for themselves. We apologize for any confusion Ms. Gallo’s comments may have caused. Let me reiterate: the views expressed by Ms. Gallo are not those of Tor as an organization and are not my own views.  Rest assured, Tor remains committed to bringing readers the finest in science fiction – on a broad range of topics, from a broad range of authors.
D. Jason Fleming points out that Irene Gallo, Associate Publisher of Tor.com and Creative Director of Tor Books, didn't actually apologize and is clearly of the same mind still.
She does not apologize for impugning the characters of a very large number of people. She does not apologize for impugning authors who work for her employer, in particular. She does not apologize for her immaturity in prancing about demonstrating that she’s not part of a tribe she hates. She does not apologize for her bigotry in any way, shape, or form.

She only apologizes for the feelings of people who might have been hurt by what she said.

What she said, then, must still stand.
 So what did she actually say?


I don't know about the rest of the Sad Puppies and Rabid Puppies she called right-wing extremists and neo-nazis, or the authors she described as writing "bad-to-reprehensible works", or everyone she called "unrepentantly racist, misogynist, and homophobic", but as for me, I'm not hurt. So why is she apologizing for nonexistent events she hypothesizes rather than her rank unprofessionalism, her shameless bigotry, and her unprovoked attack on the right two-thirds of SF/Fdom? Especially when she still hasn't informed us whose works are bad and whose are reprehensible.

I don't want an apology. I don't expect an apology.

I expect a resignation.

Labels: ,

154 Comments:

Blogger HickoryHammer #0211 June 08, 2015 8:08 PM  

How can a person this biased be expected to make the best possible decisions on behalf of Science Fiction fandom? I wouldn't want her working for my publishing house, that's for sure.

Blogger SirHamster (#201) June 08, 2015 8:12 PM  

Your link to Jason Fleming is broken.

Blogger VD June 08, 2015 8:17 PM  

Thanks, fixed.

Blogger Jim June 08, 2015 8:20 PM  

I don't know about the rest of the Sad Puppies and Rabid Puppies she called right-wing extremists and neo-nazis, or the authors she described as writing "bad-to-reprehensible works", or everyone she called "unrepentantly racist, misogynist, and homophobic", but as for me, I'm not hurt. Why is she apologizing for nonexistent events rather than her rank unprofessionalism, her shameless bigotry, and her attack on the right two-thirds of SF/Fdom?

No no no. You've got it all wrong. That's her bragging, is what it is. She's bragging that she's helping to publish and advance "bad-to-reprehensible" works that are supported and loved by neo-nazis. She's like Leni Riefenstahl. She would only resign if she had a problem with people she saw as neo-nazis, and no longer wanted to get those ideas she characterizes as appealing to neo-nazis into bookstores and on the bookshelves of impressionable young minds.

I fully expect her to have a portrait of Herr Fuehrer hanging above her bed. Otherwise, what the heck is she doing?

Anonymous MrGreenMan June 08, 2015 8:25 PM  

Congressman Tom Lantos to Craig Livingstone is the best statement that, in light of all things, own it and resign, don't play this pretend game that Brendan Eich can somehow speak for Mozilla years in advance of being CEO yet the active assistant publisher who is actively promoting her books is somehow working in an extra-curricular manner:

"[W]ith an infinitely more distinguished public record than yours, Admiral Boorda committed suicide when he may have committed a minor mistake".

Blogger Kull June 08, 2015 8:25 PM  

Good news everyone. According to the salon at 770 Gallo's comments are entirely appropriate. Vox is a Nazi and we are all sheep nazis that do whatever he says. Sieg Baah.

I have said it before, I will say it again. The hugo thing has been an education. You just have to see these things unfold for yourself. I would have never believed these people would act like this. You can disagree with someone, even hate them, and still conduct yourself honorably.

These people can't apparently.

Blogger Daniel Shaw June 08, 2015 8:27 PM  

Former Chick-fil-a employee here. If only the "non-representative" non-apology offered by Tor had meant something when SJW tried to put my former employer out of business for far less insidious behavior. They can only hope they enjoy the support we did.

Blogger Harsh June 08, 2015 8:30 PM  

"Apology" not accepted. Until Gallo goes and Tor publishes a retraction, this household will not purchase another book published by Tor/Forge.

Anonymous Scintan June 08, 2015 8:30 PM  

I would have never believed these people would act like this.

Why not? They've been doing it for a long, long time. The only real difference is the frequency of their successes.

Blogger Torial (#170) June 08, 2015 8:31 PM  

It should also be noted that the original FB post that she was commenting in was her, and she was rejoicing in her professional capacity to make Sad Puppies sadder: " “Making Sad Puppies sadder…Proud to have a tiny part in this.” with a book link to "The Geek Feminist Revolution".

Anonymous bw June 08, 2015 8:31 PM  

right-wing extremists and neo-nazis

This is the stepping over of history that Bolsheviks like to do.
How many human beings did Communism kill in the 20th Cent vs "Nazis"??
That's what we thought.
What money and power backs the SJWs? Simply look at who they emphasize, and who you are never allowed to point out or criticize. Ding Ding Ding!!

Blogger Thucydides June 08, 2015 8:35 PM  

The same sort of people who supported Chick-fil-a are the ones flocking to support the Puppies and buy books from publishers like Baen and Castala.

My only regret is Chick-fil-a has no franchises here in Canada. I can always buy books through Amazon, getting a good chicken sandwich through the internet is a bit more challenging.

Blogger Douglas Wardell June 08, 2015 8:49 PM  

I would consider an apology, but she would have to walk me from A to Z on how she was legitimately mistaken and why she now feels differently. It would also have to be a legitimate apology without reserve. None of this "I'm sorry you feel bad" nonsense.

I'm also extremely disappointed in Mr. Doherty. Look, your employee libeled me and other people like me just because we disagree with her on what makes a story award-worthy. That's not an exaggeration, it's what legitimately happened. As a person of Jewish descent and a US Army veteran, I especially don't appreciate being lumped in with Nazis. If Mr. Doherty thinks this is acceptable behavior for people representing his company, I'll stop buying his books.

She's welcome to say we're idiots, but she's not welcome to call us nazis, racists, etc. There is no place for that sort of hate-speech in speculative fiction.

Anonymous Laz June 08, 2015 8:50 PM  

"My only regret is Chick-fil-a has no franchises here in Canada. I can always buy books through Amazon, getting a good chicken sandwich through the internet is a bit more challenging."

I have a paypal and UPS account. 8:00am delivery will cost at least $50, probably closer to $100 though. ;)

Blogger W.LindsayWheeler June 08, 2015 8:51 PM  

I like the hypocrisy. Remember all those people that condemn homosexuality---They are forced to resign IMMEDIATELY.

Tor Books is based in New York. New York is a liberal city. They don't eat their own. As is the rule SJW always lie, SJWs never have to be accountable. They make other people face the music but they never have to. As SJWs always lie, SJWs are always hypocrites. I bet 10 to one that Ms. Gallo approves the firing of people who condemn homosexuality but she is herself, fireproof, when her own deeds come to light.

On the other hand, what Ms Gallo has said is just normal liberal speak. Every liberals says the same thing she has said. So why does she have to resign? She isn't. Liberals/SJWs don't have morality. They are progressive, that means they are right and they can do whatever they want to. I don't see her resigning at all.

When is the last time a liberal resigned? Brian Williams was eased out. Stephenapoulos still has his job, the Clintons, the both of them, still have their jobs. Every liberal is Teflon coated. They are all Teflon princes and princesses.

Face it Tor Books is a hotbed of political correctness/Cultural Marxism.

Anonymous FP June 08, 2015 8:56 PM  

Come on guys, its just feelings. Nothing more than feelings. She said she was sorry. I mean its not like she made a dongle joke or anything. We should be deeply touched she cares enough to feel sad she hurt anyone with her broad brush. I mean, come on.

Anonymous Elijah Rhodes June 08, 2015 9:04 PM  

I don't want her or anyone else to resign. I want them to keep talking.

Anonymous A.B. Prosper June 08, 2015 9:10 PM  

The best way to spend a lazy Saturday is to do some gardening read something by Baen and/or Castalia House , grab lunch a Chick-Fil-A than take the missus (if you have one) shopping at Hobby Lobby.

The worst way? It involves almost anything by Tor.

Anonymous Gary June 08, 2015 9:12 PM  

Has Tor fired anyone? I see. Apology not accepted.

They can go to hell; plenty of other places to spend my filthy lucre.

Blogger Elocutioner0226 June 08, 2015 9:18 PM  

*I* wasn't "hurt" by her comments. I was willfully defamed and insulted. A non-apology apology by the misandrist and unrepentant libeler is insufficient. Continued employment means they're tolerant of this.

https://twitter.com/Elocutioner/status/607901353147375617/photo/1

Anonymous Godfrey June 08, 2015 9:22 PM  

Tor should fire the misandrist Christophobic bigot.

Blogger Raghnall Ó Mordha June 08, 2015 9:24 PM  

There are consequences for actions. An apology is not enough. A resignation is all that will suffice.

Anonymous p-dawg June 08, 2015 9:28 PM  

It's not the broad brush to which I object. It's the broad wielding it.

Blogger rcocean June 08, 2015 9:31 PM  

Apologies are for wimps. Why should anyone care if you force some insincere half-ass apology out of someone? Apologies only mean something when the offender says it on their own, without being forced to, and means it. And then follows it up with action.

And I'm really surprised that anyone still doing the "I'm sorry if my words offended you" shtick.

Blogger rcocean June 08, 2015 9:33 PM  

Newsflash. This just in. Hitler apologized for the Holocaust. It seems he was broken heated at all the suffering.

Now, does everyone feel better.

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 9:38 PM  

That response is an insult.

Blogger bearspaw June 08, 2015 9:38 PM  

Do not purchase Tor products.

Anonymous DanG June 08, 2015 9:40 PM  

What's all the fuss about? So she lied and smeared her employer's business partners and potential customers. At least she did not tarnish her employer's image by privately donating money to prevent the legal redefinition of marriage. It's not as if she made adolescent jokes about dongles within earshot of a sensitive woman. Now, that would have been really bad.

Anonymous Daniel #0189 June 08, 2015 9:45 PM  

I disagree that resignation is the only acceptable response.

I would also accept a firing, or, should Tor be so inclined, a crucifixion. I am completely indifferent to the myriad righteous options they have before them.

Anonymous Donn #0114 June 08, 2015 9:48 PM  

It's a non response. On Tor's part and on Gallo's part. It's "I'm sorry I hurt your neo-nazi, racist, homophobic feelings". Tor didn't stand behind its authors and she still calling us subhuman. Not good enough by a long shot.

Anonymous zen0 von Thatcher June 08, 2015 9:52 PM  

Just in case there are any moderates getting wobbly at this point:

Errors committed out of feelings of benevolence are the worst

Carl von Clausewitz per Martin van Creveld

Anonymous plan Z June 08, 2015 9:55 PM  

1. boycott Tor
2. buy only used books or pirated e-books.
3. compensate blue authors directly with PayPal donations.
4. encourage blue authors regain their copyrights held by Tor... donate money, time and legal services to get these authors self-publishing.

Blogger SirThermite June 08, 2015 10:02 PM  

Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. As much as I hope to see this clown of a "Creative Director" resign, I figured it was prudent to finish purchasing all 12 of John C. Wright's Tor-published titles available on Kindle before beginning this boycott.

Anonymous VFM 0007 June 08, 2015 10:07 PM  

I'm not entirely at ease with this. It doesn't seem just to demand that she be fired for her personal opinions. Would someone explain how it is, please?

Also, boycotting Tor means boycotting a bunch of John Wright books and I'm struggling to think through the implications of that.

Blogger rcocean June 08, 2015 10:07 PM  

Newsflash. Here's the wording of the newly found 1945 Hitler apology:

"Dear Jews - Mistakes were made. Sorry. " A. Hitler.

Anonymous The other robot June 08, 2015 10:09 PM  

buy only used books or pirated e-books.

I cannot agree with the second half of this. Buy only used books is the way I would go.

Anonymous Pax Romana June 08, 2015 10:11 PM  

[deep belly laugh] I love when people use this "apology" tactic. Not only does it prove to neutral parties that the guilty party is unrepentant about the damage they caused, but it shows that they are JUST petty enough to make it seem like the person at fault was the person libeled or injured.

Blogger Stephen Ashby June 08, 2015 10:14 PM  

I don't want an apology. I don't expect an apology.

I expect a resignation.


You expect a resignation? I can see why you want one, but I don't see what would lead you to expect it. Personally I expect Tor will simply pretend the matter is dealt with, and if you don't accept that then they will claim you're the one being unreasonable.

Blogger Stephen Ashby June 08, 2015 10:15 PM  

I don't want an apology. I don't expect an apology.

I expect a resignation.


You expect a resignation? I can see why you want one, but I don't see what would lead you to expect it. Personally I expect Tor will simply pretend the matter is dealt with, and if you don't accept that then they will claim you're the one being unreasonable.

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 10:16 PM  

Wrong nomenclature VFM 0007. Post under an official badge ID if you want a response.

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 10:19 PM  

I expect one too, because of GamerGate.

Blogger Jake June 08, 2015 10:21 PM  

"I'm not entirely at ease with this. It doesn't seem just to demand that she be fired for her personal opinions. Would someone explain how it is, please?"

You're using the wrong rule book. We decent civilized folk would like to play by those rules, but our enemies insist on playing dirty. This is just making sure these people experience a small taste of the kind of stunts they've been using for years. Of course a senior level employee making public statements of this sort far exceedes the "sins" of their past targets.

Blogger Plump Pleasant Plumber June 08, 2015 10:21 PM  

Once again, only protesters in front of the Tor office will work.

Anonymous Peter Pan June 08, 2015 10:21 PM  

33. VFM 0007 June 08, 2015 10:07 PM

I would just like to point that Vile Faceless Minion Triple-O-Seven has finally made his appearance.

Also, I just want to ask you...

...Do you have an invisible-er car?

Anonymous zen0 June 08, 2015 10:23 PM  

Tom Doherty's FULL statement per the link shows he is presenting a rational face about the situation.

What he needs to do is take the next step and make an executive decision about the inability of Tor to present a believably rational face as long as they harbour SJW nitwits.

Of course he hopes it all goes away, but he should recognize it will be better in the long term.

I would encourage him in this endeavor, except the comments section does not seem to want to respond to my attempts at access.

Well, circling the wagons does help concentrate the defensive forces,

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 10:24 PM  

This is what happens when Gallo serves whine before it's time.

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 10:25 PM  

Wrong. See also GamerGate.

Anonymous zen0 June 08, 2015 10:27 PM  

@ Stephen Ashby

> I expect Tor will simply pretend the matter is dealt with,...

As expected.

Long game, S.A.

Anonymous The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 10:29 PM  

Wrong nomenclature VFM 0007. Post under an official badge ID if you want a response.

I've seen lots of variants used, but I believe this is one of the options given by our Supreme Dark Lord. If it's not, I'll track down the post we're he gave them and check.

Anonymous Scintan June 08, 2015 10:31 PM  

Personally I expect Tor will simply pretend the matter is dealt with, and if you don't accept that then they will claim you're the one being unreasonable.

How's that strategy been working out for the SJWs of Worldcon?

OpenID crazdmadman June 08, 2015 10:33 PM  

LOL...following some of the "tor-dot-com" twits tonight is delicious

1- Private pages are private and not associated with people
2- Doherty is sexist for not going after Jim Frenel (howeverit is spelled) publicly
3- Doherty is sexist for not going after PNH
4- They arent going to be associated with anything to do with Tor ever again

Anonymous ChicagoRefugee June 08, 2015 10:35 PM  

#TorBoycott

Let's make it happen people.

You can always personally compensate the authors you/we favor by remitting them the price of any of their books you source for free.

#TorBoycott

Anonymous The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 10:36 PM  

Also, I just want to ask you...

...Do you have an invisible-er car?


I'm afraid I don't get the reference. Something to do with Megamind?

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 10:37 PM  

Nope, just badge checking, the King's Man 0007. Don't swear it. My response to your original question is this:

Don't get wobbly. The enemy is standing in the public square and screaming obscenities against her employer and her consumers. This is a direct attack if there ever was one.

If it is any consolation, she doesn't work for you. Her fate is not in your hands. What is in your hands is the ability to ask Tor to do the right thing for once.

Anonymous Bob June 08, 2015 10:37 PM  

Peter Grant speaks out:

http://bayourenaissanceman.blogspot.com/

Anonymous Peter Pan June 08, 2015 10:40 PM  

Yes, well, has anyone seen her nose yet? I never realized that it was so famous that the Mexicans named a salad after it. Pico de Gallo... "Gallo's Beak." It's so big I'm not surprised she wasn't able to stop herself from sticking it where it didn't belong. She probably couldn't help it.

Also, I think I lost my appetite.

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 10:40 PM  

You clearly aren't used to playing offense. We have the ball, and are running with it, and you want us to stop and consider the consequences of scoring a touchdown.

Anonymous MrGreenMan June 08, 2015 10:40 PM  

Why has Mr. Tor not pulled his endorsement of one of these horrible authors? If you click through "Tom Doherty", you get two posts, one of which is a pean to Kevin J Anderson as a classic style of Sci-Fi ("This is such a story. It’s the kind that hooked me on science fiction so may years ago."...so, I think that makes Doherty a little bit of a fascist by his staff style guide, too, right?)...and yet Mr. Anderson was on the puppy slate for the big prize?

Anonymous The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 10:42 PM  

You're using the wrong rule book.

I'm not sure I can put my rule book aside for theirs. I'd like to, but I'm not persuaded that I ought to yet.

Anonymous Peter Pan June 08, 2015 10:45 PM  

53. The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 10:36 PM

I'm afraid I don't get the reference. Something to do with Megamind?


Merely 007 takes his Aston Martin for a drive in the snow.

Anonymous Daniel #0189 June 08, 2015 10:49 PM  

Then take a breather on the bench, 0007. That's fine. You don't need to chat about it, though.

Anonymous The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 10:52 PM  

If it is any consolation, she doesn't work for you. Her fate is not in your hands. What is in your hands is the ability to ask Tor to do the right thing for once.

I'm still hung up on whether or not this is the right thing, but this is helpful. Thanks.

You clearly aren't used to playing offense. We have the ball, and are running with it, and you want us to stop and consider the consequences of scoring a touchdown.

I'm not trying to interfere. Don't stop and consider anything on my account. I'm aware that my hesitance is reducing the strength of the team, but that's why I'm looking for answers. If I can settle this stuff I'll play hard. There might be others with the same concerns reading this who can be persuaded, too.

Anonymous ChicagoRefugee June 08, 2015 10:53 PM  

I'm not sure I can put my rule book aside for theirs. I'd like to, but I'm not persuaded that I ought to yet.

Are/were you a fan of the Unilateral Disarmament movement? Because that is, in essence, what you are advocating.

Allow me to quote a fellow Ilk (whose name I am ashamed to have forgotten) -

It's simple game theory. No strategy has ever beaten retaliation for maximizing global outcome. THREAT of retaliation keep the other side honest, so you might argue that we are just doing the moral thing.

Anonymous The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 10:54 PM  

Then take a breather on the bench, 0007. That's fine. You don't need to chat about it, though.

Fair enough.

Anonymous The other robot June 08, 2015 10:54 PM  

Tom.doherty@tor.com

Probably disabled by now.

Anonymous zen0 June 08, 2015 10:54 PM  

55. Bob June 08, 2015 10:37 PM

Peter Grant speaks out:

http://bayourenaissanceman.blogspot.com/


Bravo, Mr. Grant. Well spoken.

Anonymous zen0 June 08, 2015 11:01 PM  

@ The Kings Man 0007

I'm aware that my hesitance is reducing the strength of the team, but that's why I'm looking for answers.

You're not even on the field. You are in the stands.

We don't even know who is on the whole team anyway. That is how revolutionary movements are constructed.

See > 30. zen0 von Thatcher June 08, 2015 9:52

Blogger Joel C. Salomon June 08, 2015 11:02 PM  

Mr Doherty’s choice of website for posting Tor’s apology does belie suggestions that have been made of a meaningful divide between Tor.com and Tor Books.

Anonymous Peter Pan June 08, 2015 11:02 PM  

@The King's Man (0007)

On the subject of minion numbering, from a former post:

"Shadow of Shadows, can we use our number here?"

The measure of the depths of my total indifference can only be grasped by contemplating the outer limits of SJW deceit. That being said, it appears the favored usage is "name (#)". Violators will be handed over to the Grand Strategikon for his ongoing experiments in crucifixion variants.


In other words, do whatever you want, as long as you're not anonymous. But you might be used in a crucifixion experiment.

Anonymous The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 11:02 PM  

@ChicagoRefugee

I don't want to sow doubt and I respect Daniel as a more senior VFM, so I'll stay quiet on this topic now. Thanks for your response.

Anonymous The King's Man (0007) June 08, 2015 11:06 PM  

@Peter Pan

Thanks, that's the post I'm following. Note it doesn't say: name (#number). I've replaced the # with my number.

Anonymous VFM #0247 June 08, 2015 11:06 PM  

Over at Mad Genius Club Dave Freer speaks on Macmillian's Code of Conduct. If you go to Macmillian's website, look at the bottom of the webpage on the left hand side under 'About' for the pdf.

There's nothing stated specifically about statements made by employees on social media, but the introduction by the CEO does speak to how employees conduct themselves when dealing with the public. On page 2, there are general guidelines to determine if an action meets the criteria for misconduct.
"RECOGNIZING POTENTIAL MISCONDUCT
In deciding whether a violation of the Code has occurred or is about to occur you should ask yourself:
•Could this conduct be viewed as dishonest, unethical or unlawful?
•Could this conduct hurt Macmillan – e.g., could it cause us to lose credibility with customers or business partners?
•Could this conduct hurt other people – e.g., other employees or customers?
•Would I be embarrassed to see this conduct reported in the newspaper?
•Does it feel wrong?
If the answers to any of these questions is “Yes” or “Maybe”, a potential issue exists that needs to be reported."

I am an educator, and we have professional guidelines as to what we can say in social media. If a colleague would have made those statements, at a MINIMUM there would be a written reprimand placed in the persons file. Even though every person has freedom of speech, every person has to be cognizant that they represent the organizations they work for and with. Just the fact that she denigrated authors from her publishing company should have earned her a reprimand and instructions to keep her trap shut.

OpenID xsyq June 08, 2015 11:07 PM  

Eric Flint decides to join in lambasting Ms. Gallo.

Anonymous Thales June 08, 2015 11:13 PM  

That kind of "I only speak for myself" weasel wording doesn't save jobs when SJW's whip out their daggers -- why do SJW's expect different treatment? If you give no quarter, you will get none yourself. Simple as that.

Anonymous Peter Pan June 08, 2015 11:14 PM  

72. VFM #0247 June 08, 2015 11:06 PM

"RECOGNIZING POTENTIAL MISCONDUCT
In deciding whether a violation of the Code has occurred or is about to occur you should ask yourself:
•Could this conduct be viewed as dishonest, unethical or unlawful?
•Could this conduct hurt Macmillan – e.g., could it cause us to lose credibility with customers or business partners?
•Could this conduct hurt other people – e.g., other employees or customers?
•Would I be embarrassed to see this conduct reported in the newspaper?
•Does it feel wrong?
If the answers to any of these questions is “Yes” or “Maybe”, a potential issue exists that needs to be reported."


Does it specify who can file a report? Because I'm pretty sure that "Yes" is a legitimate answer for four out of five of those, and "Maybe" for the fifth.

Anonymous zen0 June 08, 2015 11:18 PM  


Dear The Kings Man 0007


In the Bolshevik Revolution (10 days that shook the world) 350,000 committed men and women out of a population of 150 million decided the fate of a country for the next century.

My antiqueCanon Card FC-53 metric converter calculator informs me that is only 2.33333>%

For $%#%s Sake.

Get a grip.

The Gulag bekons. Best to run with the Strong Horse, like Bin Laden said.

Anonymous zen0 June 08, 2015 11:36 PM  

@ 75. Peter Pan
> Does it specify who can file a report? Because I'm pretty sure that "Yes" is a legitimate answer for four out of five of those, and "Maybe" for the fifth.

Go ahead. Tell them I said it was ok. The worst they can do is ignore you. You would be surprised what power an insignificant cipher like yourself can have if you follow protocol.

Blogger 712lippy13 June 08, 2015 11:36 PM  

Sure looks like she used a work computer and work time to make the post.

Anonymous zen0 June 08, 2015 11:41 PM  

At the risk of liking to here myself talk, Facebook and Twitter are a Godsend for non-State surveillance teams.

The condition of communications made vast differences in the shape of warfare over time. This is no different.

Blogger ray June 08, 2015 11:49 PM  

These Tor people, whoever they are, will continue to be associated with Gallo until they disassociate themselves from attack-politics, ideologues, and her.

I despise politics, including right-wing politics, and resent being correlated with any of this nonsense. Political people bore me, fast.

In the Eighties when I overlapped some Prog circles in San Francisco, I marveled when confronting my leftie friends about the thug-nature of feminism, or Equality, or racialist predations. The response was always the same, Well you don't want Reagan do you?! Or bush etc.

Point being, Gallo's reliance on infantile, dualistic p.c. bullying is reflexive in a large portion of The Almighty People. Everything reduces to Them or Me, left or right. It's not an ideology it's an existential security blanket, and yeah I'm sick of the Right too.


But sicker from too much Gallo at the moment.

Anonymous FriarBob June 08, 2015 11:50 PM  

I snickered and outright eye-rolled at some of the blather in Flint's attack on Gallo... but to give the moron credit, at least he sees HER words are (at best) incorrect and (mostly) outright idiotic and foolish.

His own... well... it IS harder to see your own errors, as we all know. But to call himself a socialist and then turn around and in the very next sentence condemn others for calling him a commie.... as if there was anything more than the most trivial of differences between them... sigh, well one miracle at a time, I guess.

Blogger Daniel June 08, 2015 11:51 PM  

Flint, SJW liar, can't tolerate half of Gallo's lies. The other half he is fine with. When she lost the SJW set, you know it is curtains.

Blogger kh123 June 08, 2015 11:56 PM  

"This is what happens when Gallo serves whine before it's time."

The polite version of the Sobchak Credo.

Blogger ScuzzaMan June 09, 2015 12:07 AM  

We have not yet begun to fight.

Blogger beerme #0183 June 09, 2015 12:10 AM  

Mr Doherty’s choice of website for posting Tor’s apology does belie suggestions that have been made of a meaningful divide between Tor.com and Tor Books.

I noticed that too. Once again they prove Vox's point that SJWs always lie.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 09, 2015 12:11 AM  

For the benefit of anyone with similar concerns to mine, here's how I've resolved them. Gallo has publicly attacked the livelihoods of a number of authors. Her own livelihood is, therefore, fair game.

Blogger Cail Corishev June 09, 2015 12:18 AM  

I'm not entirely at ease with this. It doesn't seem just to demand that she be fired for her personal opinions.

Being "just" means giving people what they deserve. It's no more just to stand by and watch one man mug another than it is to join in and help the mugger.

So, what do people deserve who have tried to drive heterodox opinions out of a genre that's predicated on openness to ideas, who have tried to drive people out of polite society and destroy their livelihoods for having the wrong opinions, and who have done their best to pad their own wallets in the process? What do you suggest, a stern talking-to and a timeout? Should we assume they've learned a lesson and offer to forgive and forget?

No, a resignation (or better a firing) is what they deserve, at the least, and what needs to happen to get through the thick skulls of their comrades. It's the treatment they've gleefully given to others, and there would be no question about it if the tables were turned. These are the rules they insisted we play by.

Blogger automatthew June 09, 2015 12:24 AM  

I will not be satisfied with a resignation. I will not be satisfied with a firing.

I want an auto-da-fé.

I want her in a dunce hat. I want to see her looking at a handler to make sure she's saying the right thing.

Inquisition is on.

Anonymous Rolf June 09, 2015 12:31 AM  

How's the saying go? "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery?"

No, that's not it.... Oh, yeah, I remember:

"Seppuku is the sincerest form of apology."

Anonymous Jack Amok June 09, 2015 12:33 AM  

Carl von Clausewitz per Martin van Creveld

Speaking of which, where's the next quiz? I'm sure I've forgotten at least one obscure French theorist by now...

Blogger SirThermite June 09, 2015 12:33 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Elocutioner0226 June 09, 2015 12:35 AM  

This reminds me of another quote I saw recently...

"For the purposes of assessing the impact of your words, it doesn't matter whether they're supported by the evidence or not -- we're talking perceptions here.

The people who live and work and pitch their tents in this field have long memories. You'll have to share the same field with them for a long time -- decades, maybe -- if you want to be in it at all. And you've just offended 75% of them? This is Not Clever.

You may not need them now, but you have no idea what your circumstances will look like in ten years' time. Twenty years. Thirty. Five minutes hence. (Etcetera.) Pissing people off for no good reason is counter-productive. In a corporate environment it's sometimes termed a career-limiting move. I think you just made a career-limiting move."

Blogger SirThermite June 09, 2015 12:37 AM  

To SJWs and those under their sway, racism, misogyny, homophobia, and neo-nazism are not minor charges, and in some corporate environments are even fire-able offences. Whether anyone here personally felt "hurt" by Gallo's use of these labels (I doubt it), she and other SJW's have consistently used them them as a weapon to smear, intimidate, belittle, and even get people fired. So let her face the same consequences for drawing that weapon.

Anonymous Jack Amok June 09, 2015 12:38 AM  

Being "just" means giving people what they deserve. It's no more just to stand by and watch one man mug another than it is to join in and help the mugger.

This is exactly right, 0007. Civilized men treat other civilized men civilly, but they must treat barbarians barbarously. It is a betrayal of civilization to treat a barbarian as you would a civilized man.

Blogger Danby June 09, 2015 12:38 AM  

I'm not entirely at ease with this. It doesn't seem just to demand that she be fired for her personal opinions.

13. There is no compromise. There is no live-and-let-live. These people literally want you dead. They must be humiliated, driven out, and never ever allowed any authority.

They want you dead.

Anonymous pseudotsuga* June 09, 2015 12:47 AM  

I absolutely detest the non-apology-apology.
So she thinks her apology will change my mind?
I don't care.
If she is unprofessional enough that her judgment is so clouded that she can't tell if she is speaking for herself or for her employer, then she needs to be re-employed to match her skill levels. Perhaps Cosmopolitan is hiring...

Blogger Daniel June 09, 2015 12:55 AM  

Exactly, pseudotsuga*. Tor just made things worse. By not instantly turning the flamethrower onto such incendiary suicidal expressions, they are letting the flaming ninny run about the house, catching the curtains alight.

You can't simultaneously run a business and let your staff run it into the ground.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 09, 2015 12:57 AM  

This is exactly right, 0007. Civilized men treat other civilized men civilly, but they must treat barbarians barbarously. It is a betrayal of civilization to treat a barbarian as you would a civilized man.

This particular case is settled for me now, but I'm interested in this more general idea of treating barbarians barbarously. Are we to adopt their standards of behaviour without regard for what's right and good?

Blogger Daniel June 09, 2015 1:05 AM  

It is right and good to have the enemy driven before you and hear the lamentations of their women. Do you know what the barbarian calls the civilized man who is civil to him?

Lunch.

Lunch, who happens to have a lovely wife and some children with strong backs.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 09, 2015 1:12 AM  

Lunch, who happens to have a lovely wife and some children with strong backs.

Now, see, if a barbarian were to try to eat me, I'd have no problem making him die so as to go on living with my lovely wife and strong-backed children. I wouldn't consider that barbarous, though.

Blogger Daniel June 09, 2015 1:15 AM  

Likewise I would not consider the removal of SJWS from positions of industry to be uncivilized, particularly during a failing economy.

Anonymous Phil Mann June 09, 2015 1:26 AM  

Wow, this is funny!

Coincidentally, I just today emailed Andrew Weber at MacMillan regarding Ms. Gallo's unfair, and indeed potentially libelous, statements.

And just a few hours later Tor offers-up this non-apology apology?

Hmm...

Better men than I have opined on when an apology does not pass muster. In fact, I believe Mr. Scalzi, himself had something to say about that not too long ago. I just can't quite remember...

Anyway, just to be safe, Ms. Gallo clearly has to go. There is "no place" in the publishing world for those of her ilk. There are no doubt plenty who can serve as "Associate Publishers," and the career of one woman is a small price to pay considering the principles that are at stake.

Blogger Brad Andrews June 09, 2015 1:51 AM  

She's sorry she got caught....

Blogger Daniel June 09, 2015 1:55 AM  

Not that sorry, or she would have actually apologized rather than vaguely indicate that such apologies exist..

Blogger Minion777 June 09, 2015 2:08 AM  

Time to escalate the issue to the governing body that fined Macmillian for corruption:
https://intlbankforreconanddev.ethicspointvp.com/custom/ibrd/_crf/english/form_data.asp

Let them know the extent of the issue, they will act. Macmillian is on a tight leash.

Anonymous Bz June 09, 2015 2:11 AM  

This is a step in the right direction, though as noted inadequate and apparently insincere. I would however note that there are several more senior managers at Tor who have behaved unprofessionally and deplorably.

For example, given what we have heard, it might be suitable that PNH would write "I'm sorry I rigged the Hugo Awards for the benefit of Tor". Among other things.

Blogger rho June 09, 2015 2:33 AM  

Even though every person has freedom of speech, every person has to be cognizant that they represent the organizations they work for and with. Just the fact that she denigrated authors from her publishing company should have earned her a reprimand and instructions to keep her trap shut.

Seems to me that Tor is reaping what they had sown. A publisher is, after all, merely a box containing a collection of replaceable cogs; a machine that takes the labor of writers as input, and outputs money on the other side.

The machine can be built with fewer cogs. Some have built the machine with one cog. If your machine has a lot of cogs, it depends greatly on the perceived quality of the nameplate on the side of the box to attract input.

Tor's got a cog that, due to faulty manufacturing or failure to perform proper maintenance, makes a habit of chewing up half of the input before it can be rendered into money. Tor decided to keep that (replaceable) cog, maybe taking it out and blowing on it like an NES cartridge before slotting it back in.

(I suppose it might be insulting to people in the publishing business to be thought of as a cog in a money-printing machine, but it shouldn't be because that's what you are. If you were a great artist, you'd be doing that; you're not, that's why you work at a publisher. What should be insulting is that the lowliest greeter at Wal-Mart is a better cog than you are.)

Tor has engendered this environment, through hiring and disciplinary practices, and therefore Tor bears responsibility. And the ultimate responsibility for Tor lies at the head of the company.

Irene Gallo didn't call you a Nazi. Tom Doherty did.

Anonymous rubberducky June 09, 2015 3:00 AM  

Well, she did apologize. I'm sure she didn't want to, and that she was chafing at the bit while she did. But she did it. I'm more lenient than most here on the form of her apology. She said, "I apologize to anyone hurt by my comments." Yes, that's boilerplate. It's also a half-hearted apology, but it's also one based on what's become a regrettably standard form. This is the best you can expect from an SJW.

It is a win, no question. She has prostrated and offered the best than anyone could expect from her. Her act is one of submission and contrition. It's imperfect, true. But this is a win.

Of course, my inner BDSM Dom is, actually, heartened by the win but also very saddened. Because this slave needs a lot more work (that who wants to put in).

Anonymous Wojciech Majda June 09, 2015 3:32 AM  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qR0Uke2XNI

Blogger Jim June 09, 2015 3:37 AM  

This is the best you can expect from an SJW.

Which is why there is no place for SJWs in the professional world. And it's not a "win." It has become standard form because it has, in the past, been used to brush these matters under the rug and escape accountability, because we allowed it to be used thus. No more. If they are sorry for anything, let them prove it by actions. Until then, they have apologized for nothing.

Blogger Eric June 09, 2015 3:39 AM  

It should also be noted that the original FB post that she was commenting in was her, and she was rejoicing in her professional capacity to make Sad Puppies sadder: " “Making Sad Puppies sadder…Proud to have a tiny part in this.” with a book link to "The Geek Feminist Revolution".

Which is yet another layer of irony, given the sad state of Greece today.

Anonymous ChicagoRefugee June 09, 2015 3:47 AM  

Geek not Greek, I'm afraid, though to be honest, I read it that way myself at first.

Lysdexics Untie!

Anonymous Beau June 09, 2015 3:49 AM  

Well, she did apologize.

No, she did not. She never repudiated her statement. Neither has her publisher. Did she say, "I was wrong."? She did not. Did he say, "Our senior managers are responsible for how they publicly represent us."? No, he did not. Her "apology" is nothing more than an additional insult insisting those who disagree with her diatribe are flawed people.

OpenID xsyq June 09, 2015 3:57 AM  

"I'm sorry you didn't like what I said" =/= "I'm sorry for what I said".

It's the difference between being sorry you got caught and being sorry you actually did it.

Anonymous ChicagoRefugee June 09, 2015 4:02 AM  

Oh, everyone? Please mentally substitute a period for the comma after the word "afraid" in post #112 above.

Thank you for your cooperation.

/Grammar Nazi

Blogger rho June 09, 2015 4:43 AM  

No, she did not. She never repudiated her statement. Neither has her publisher. Did she say, "I was wrong."? She did not. Did he say, "Our senior managers are responsible for how they publicly represent us."? No, he did not. Her "apology" is nothing more than an additional insult insisting those who disagree with her diatribe are flawed people.

John C. Wright accepted her apology on its face. He was included in the insulted, and he obliged when offered reconciliation.

Catholics!

Anonymous Carl June 09, 2015 5:03 AM  

Errors committed out of feelings of benevolence are the worst.

Blogger rho June 09, 2015 5:19 AM  

Errors committed out of feelings of benevolence are the worst.

Benevolence beyond reason is the heart of Christianity.

Blogger W.LindsayWheeler June 09, 2015 5:41 AM  

Vox, one step in this process is that one has to contact journalists of Sci/Fi journals and magazines and have an article done. One also needs a catchy phrase to describe this whole situation. You need press coverage. One has to get journalists involved.

On the other hand, Ms. Gallo is the mainstream. She lives in a society that taught her that. We are the ones on the outside. So how can one resign/be fired, when one is just spouting the mainstream?

Blogger Cail Corishev June 09, 2015 6:07 AM  

Are we to adopt their standards of behaviour without regard for what's right and good?

No, we're to hold them to their standards of behavior because of what's right and good.

What's with the lame straw men from a minion?

Blogger Brad Andrews June 09, 2015 6:19 AM  

Her "apology" is nothing more than an additional insult insisting those who disagree with her diatribe are flawed people.

Exactly Beau.

Anonymous Giuseppe June 09, 2015 6:35 AM  

Personally I don't want her resigning. I want jer fired on her ass.

Posted this at Eric Flint 's blog: (because remember - give them.no quarter!) they either face reality in toto, or we continue right on to the tilling their lands with salt.

Eric,
You are either an idiot or a liar.
I am an UNREPENTANT rabid puppy supporter, so according to you I am a racist, sexist, homophobic bigot.
You moron. The longest relationship I had, spanning over a decade is with a girl of decidedly brown colouration. I have more brown people in my actual family and my only "bigotry" is towards dishonest hypocrites.

As for my politics, I essentually have none. The closest I come to it is Lysander Spooner's unmatched essay Natural Law, or the Science of Justice.

If you think me "rude" you should consider that you made demonstarbly false accusations about me and my character without knowing me or any of the other many like me who are simply sick to death of dishonest poseurs like you and your ever-status-aware kind.

If you have any integrity, retract your baseless accusations and don't censor this comment.

Blogger totenhenchen June 09, 2015 6:47 AM  

The non-apology apology is the western Left's limp-wristed version of Maoist jiǎntǎo.

Anonymous Giuseppe June 09, 2015 6:47 AM  

The king's man,
This particular case is settled for me now, but I'm interested in this more general idea of treating barbarians barbarously. Are we to adopt their standards of behaviour without regard for what's right and good?

Actually no. The barbarous man must be treated more barbarously than be himself is, BUT within a structure of law/justice that is absolutely clear and just. I.e. You kill and rape my kid, I wipe out your whole extended family. That is the general way these things get applied.

In a semi-ideal world, instead of his whole extended family you just get him, but can take three weeks to dismember him alive. In public.

It is the only way to civilise the barbarous.

Is it in accordance with God's will? No. Is it necessary? Unfortunately, given our fallen natures and world, yes.
Is it for everyone? No.
Only the Platonic version of warriors need apply. Those who do those things normal people can't and won't, in order to safeguars them.
Of course, because of this, warriors should be held to the very highest codes of conduct.
The murder and barbaries they commit should be directed by ethics, not personal sadism, thirst for power, etc etc.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan June 09, 2015 6:56 AM  

Language meant to incite violence, yes she should be fired. I'll bet if you go thru her scribblings on whatever media she is also a racial theorist of the highest order and hence a racist, they all are, race theory being a leg of SJW rhetoric.

Blogger 8to12 June 09, 2015 7:17 AM  

Or, maybe this is a straightforward business decision on Tor's part.

Castilla House (like other alternative publishing houses) competes directly with Tor's business model. The puppies campaigns exposed the fact that the quality of Tor's recent books may not be all that. Together, they pose a direct threat to Tor as a business.

Since Tor is committed to its business model and authors (at least committed enough that they can't change direction quickly), then the logical answer would seem to be to try to eliminate the competition. In this case, by disparaging it.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 09, 2015 7:49 AM  

No, we're to hold them to their standards of behavior because of what's right and good.

Treating barbarians barbarously, then, is to hold them to their standards of behaviour, but not to adopt their standards of behaviour. The distinction's not clear to me right now, but I'll give it some thought.

What's with the lame straw men from a minion?

They're lame straw men in the same way that a fork is a lame knife. I'm genuinely seeking understanding here. Perhaps unfitting for a minion, but a minion unconstrained by conscience can only be a better minion than one constrained.

Anonymous black knight June 09, 2015 8:36 AM  

John C. Wright accepted her "apology" full stop. He knows where his bread is buttered.

Anonymous p-dawg June 09, 2015 9:14 AM  

@Giuseppe:

I think you have forgotten. When the Creator gives the command to make war, He also specifies how it is to be done: Total annihilation of the enemy, including women and children, oxen and beasts of burden, everything. It is therefore reasonable to conclude that this mindset is acceptable to the Creator.

Blogger Elocutioner0226 June 09, 2015 9:16 AM  

He laid out his reasons. I disagree with him but you called an honorable man a sellout. Seems you are a black knight after all. Thanks for revealing yourself.

Comment by John C Wright:
Monday, June 8th 2015 at 1:01 pm |
There is no damage to me. I would lose money, which is trash. I would keep my honor, which is gold.

Anonymous p-dawg June 09, 2015 9:23 AM  

Gotta love the "logic" of Eric Flint."I’ve been mostly arguing against the Sad Puppies not out of animosity—several of them are friends of mine and none of them are people I dislike—but because I am trying to persuade them that their analysis of the situation is faulty and the course of action they’ve adopted is futile at best.

I will continue that debate. But I can’t possibly succeed in my goal, or even make any significant progress, if the people I’m arguing with are not only convinced that they’re being slandered but actually are being slandered."

So...you're going to keep trying to convince people that what you acknowledge is happening RIGHT NOW never happened? What kind of idiocy is that?

Blogger VD June 09, 2015 9:44 AM  

So...you're going to keep trying to convince people that what you acknowledge is happening RIGHT NOW never happened? What kind of idiocy is that?

He believes in the Labor Theory of Value. He can believe in EIGHT impossible things before breakfast.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 09, 2015 9:49 AM  

Giuseppe, I appreciate your response. Your take on Jack's comment is clear to me.

Blogger Elocutioner0226 June 09, 2015 9:56 AM  

I'm sure he'll come around after another genocide or two.

Anonymous Giuseppe June 09, 2015 10:04 AM  

P-dawg,
No. I do not believe that is God's will. Nor His nature. The OT is a mishmash of stuff and easy to misinterpret in various ways. Least of which is which "God" is actually "talking" throughvit at any given time.

Furthermore, theologically, the murdering of innocent children (women at least never are innocent! :-) ) simply does not stack up.
But then, it is my contention the OT was the first attempt at getting a bunch of monkeys into the spaceship that would save them, and the best way to do that is to speak to them in language a monkey can grasp.
The NT is step 2 in this ongoing process.

Theologically, the killing of your enemy is not the direct will of God. Only his indirect will. In that a loving God necessarily implies the concept of Justice.

Anonymous Giuseppe June 09, 2015 10:07 AM  

The King's man,
You're welcome sir. The ilk are kind and have always helped educate me in their various ways. If I can at times return the favour it is only the least I can do.

Anonymous Jack Amok June 09, 2015 10:26 AM  

Are we to adopt their standards of behaviour without regard for what's right and good?

If you are civilized, you treat another man according to his behavior. If he is civilized, then you treat him with civility. If he is a barbarian, you treat him as a barbarian. Treating a barbarian as a civilized man not only allows the barbarian to continue his behavior, it cheapens the civility of other civilized men by rewarding the undeserving barbarians with the same reward the civilized men have earned.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 09, 2015 10:48 AM  

I agree completely with that comment, Jack, but you seem to have taken a step back from your previous one. To say "treat a barbarian as a barbarian" is not the same as saying "treat a barbarian barbarously". Or have I misunderstood you?

Anonymous Paul June 09, 2015 12:20 PM  

"My only regret is Chick-fil-a has no franchises here in Canada. I can always buy books through Amazon, getting a good chicken sandwich through the internet is a bit more challenging."

None on the west coast of the US yet, either (I think they're coming next year). I always make a point, when visiting other areas of the country, to make a stop at one.

Anonymous Oaktownie June 09, 2015 4:10 PM  

There are Chick-fil-as in California, FWIW.

Gallo needs to be forced out by any means necessary. Her characterization of the puppies is sincere. Her non-apology is not. It's what she really believes and that she felt no compunction at all about writing that publicly says it all. It came on a post about how some progressive twaddle book would make the puppies sadder after all. It's how they think. It's not in their belief system that someone can disagree with them and not be completely evil. Time to fight back.

Anonymous Forrest Bishop VFM #0167 June 09, 2015 4:58 PM  

139. Paul June 09, 2015 12:20 PM

"My only regret is Chick-fil-a has no franchises here in Canada. I can always buy books through Amazon, getting a good chicken sandwich through the internet is a bit more challenging."

None on the west coast of the US yet, either (I think they're coming next year). I always make a point, when visiting other areas of the country, to make a stop at one.


There is a new one in Bellevue, WA, on 8th NE at the 405 exit, just across the interstate from the downtown core where lots of big IT companies live. It is doing a landslide business. The parking lot packs out and waiting lines form. The old Chevron station to the East has had to post a sign on the corner of their lot-

NO CHICK FIL A PARK
WE TOW (paraphrased)

Free advertizing.

Anonymous p-dawg June 09, 2015 5:57 PM  

@Giuseppe: I recommend that you re-read Deuteronomy 20. It's not always necessary to exterminate every enemy, but there are several specific cases given where that was the requirement. If you know of any living Hitʹtites, Amʹor·ites, Caʹnaan·ites, Perʹiz·zites, Hiʹvites, or Jebʹu·sites, let me know. Again, I did not say that you should always follow that mindset, just that it isn't, in and of itself, necessarily anathema to the Creator, since He has at times not just endorsed it but demanded it, and during the one occasion I can think of where that order was not followed, the congregation suffered for it.

Anonymous Jack Amok June 09, 2015 10:00 PM  

To say "treat a barbarian as a barbarian" is not the same as saying "treat a barbarian barbarously". Or have I misunderstood you?

You indeed have misunderstood me, perhaps willfully so. Treat him as a barbarians and treat him barbarously are the same thing.

Just to be so clear as to eliminate any possibility of accidental misunderstanding...

A man who treats a civilized man in a barbarous manner is a barbarian, and should be treated barbarously in return by all civilized men.

Anonymous Jon H June 09, 2015 11:49 PM  

"I expect a resignation."

Of course you do, you mental defective. Your crook daddy didn't teach you right.

Anonymous The other robot June 10, 2015 12:22 AM  

This is the most fun I have had from spending $40.

Blogger The Overgrown Hobbit June 10, 2015 12:32 AM  

56. What's wrong with that nose? It's adorable. My J-man has the exact same--

Oh. Right. You weren't writing about the greyhound. Never mind.

Blogger John Wright June 10, 2015 1:56 AM  

"Also, boycotting Tor means boycotting a bunch of John Wright books and I'm struggling to think through the implications of that."

I will send them to you privately, free of charge. I cannot accept money for them, because Tor is the publisher, and I will not undermine them.

But I can privately show a manuscript to a friend.

I cannot ask any friend of mine to pay my publisher his hard earned money for my space stories when that money also goes to someone who insults him in public.

Once Irene Gallo is fired, you may buy the books from Tor, and all will get their due, merely late. If they are not good enough to read twice, they are not good enough anyway, right?

Go to my website at http://www.scifiwright.com/ and scroll to the bottom. My email is there.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 10, 2015 4:47 AM  

You indeed have misunderstood me, perhaps willfully so.

All I can do is state again that I'm genuinely seeking to understand your point of view, Jack. If it's right for me to share it, then I sincerely want to. This form of communication is clearly suboptimal, though, and I don't want to try your patience, so I won't ask any more questions without you inviting me to.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 10, 2015 5:00 AM  

Mr Wright, I marvel at the shrewd and honourable manner in which you have allayed my concerns. Perhaps the boycott will come to a swift conclusion, but should it not, I will take you up on your offer, and I commit now to purchasing the books from Tor should the boycott subsequently be ended.

Blogger Cail Corishev June 10, 2015 5:57 AM  

All I can do is state again that I'm genuinely seeking to understand your point of view, Jack.

I doubt this, but one more comment ought to decide it. Make it a good one.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 10, 2015 6:15 AM  

I respect you, Cail, so I'm willing to try to persuade you. What would it take to do that?

Blogger Cail Corishev June 10, 2015 8:03 AM  

I respect you, Cail, so I'm willing to try to persuade you. What would it take to do that?

Stop it. Don't try to persuade me you're not a concern troll, just BE not a concern troll. That's my default assumption until someone proves otherwise, so problem solved.

Blogger The King's Man (0007) June 10, 2015 8:16 AM  

The concern troll charge is easily refuted, but clearly I need to earn some cred here, so I'll respect your demand and leave it at that.

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