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Monday, July 27, 2015

Nature beats nurture

Genetic science is not only destroying the last 50 years of educational policy, but social policy in general. The fact that up to 65 percent of the difference in academic results are genetic also explains why the post-1965 and post-1986 waves of immigration are destined to reduce the USA to Second World status:
Genes influence academic ability across all subjects, latest study shows 

The researchers analysed genetic data and GCSE scores from 12,500 twins, about half of whom were identical. Results in all subjects, including maths, science, art and humanities, were highly heritable, with genes explaining a bigger proportion of the differences between children (54-65%) than environmental factors, such as school and family combined (14-21%), which were shared by the twins.

Comparing the outcomes for identical twins with fraternal twins allows scientists to investigate the extent to which genetics influence a person’s life. Identical twins share 100% of their genes, whereas fraternal twins share on average only half of the genes that differ between people.

So if genetics were a significant factor governing GCSE results, the differences between fraternal twins’ performances would be expected to be consistently greater than those between identical twins – and this is what the scientists saw.

When the scientists factored in IQ scores, they found that intelligence appeared to account for slightly less than half of the genetic component, suggesting that other heritable traits – curiosity, determination and memory, perhaps – play a significant role.

Kaili Rimfeld, who led the study and is also at King’s College London, said: “There’s a general academic achievement factor. Children who do well in one subject tend to better in another subject and that is largely for genetic reasons.”

Plomin said that while talking about genetics and education was no longer the taboo that it was twenty years ago, education professionals were slow to adapt teaching methods in the face of new scientific findings. “It’s a problem with evidence,” he said. “Thirty years ago medicine wasn’t particularly evidence-based. I think education is fundamentally not based on evidence. What programme has been rolled out that has been based on evidence?
The "Blank Slate" theory is dead. It was never anything but political philosophy and science killed it. Every nominal justification for human equality is being gradually eliminated, one by one, as scientists revisit hypotheses that have long been passed off as pseudoscientific facts.

I suspect that what we are seeing here is not unrelated to yesterday's "cuckservative" kerfluffle, which is only going to get bigger now that Milo is working on a story. Remember, the Ciceronian political cycle predicts aristocracy will follow mob rule that has collapsed into dictatorship, and the anti-equalitarian backlash is going to have the benefit of a much stronger scientific foundation than historical justifications for the rule by the best.

I suspect that those equalitarians who claim to believe that a meritocracy is the best of all possible systems are going to rapidly change their tune once it becomes apparent that material merit is predominantly genetic in origin. Because in a post-Christian world of scientific rational materialism, there is no way that a meritocratic approach will not eventually lead to Eugenics 2.0.

The irony is that it is the equalitarians and anti-racists who will likely cling to the concept of race. Now that genetics gives us far more precise metrics, the new eugenicists won't have to pay any attention to race at all in order to achieve their desired results. And they can claim, quite truthfully, that their policies are race- and color-blind. For example, if variants of the MAO-A, DAT1, and DRD2 genes are deemed to be unsuitable for an occupation, those possessing the unwanted genetic markers can be banned with absolutely no reference to race at all.

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96 Comments:

Blogger rho July 27, 2015 4:57 AM  

You suspect quite a lot.

Anonymous Steve July 27, 2015 5:17 AM  

Children who do well in one subject tend to better in another subject and that is largely for genetic reasons

Amazing how science keeps proving what any semi-intelligent adult with eyes in their head knew all along.

What other startling insights will eggheaded boffins offer?

Men and women are different?

Ursine predators defecate in arboreal areas?

How magnets work?

Anonymous Giuseppe The Kurgan July 27, 2015 5:26 AM  

Can I just collect my crown and 50 serfs as the start of my benign dictatorship now?
Pretty multi-mulatto maidservants preferred for the household chores, with the bonus incentive of potentially increasing the genetic viability of your progeny thanks to any offspring I may bestow on you. Applicants in single file please.

Blogger Brad Andrews July 27, 2015 5:39 AM  

I would be interested in seeing clarity on what you think will happen instead of merit. Heredity? Share of the spoils? Something else?

It seems like some form of meritocracy is necessary for advancement of science and such. Even ancient Babylon had a form of that with taking the best of the conquered peoples and training them in the ways of the Babylonians. (See the Book of Daniel.)

I may not understand exactly what you are encompassing in the term meritocracy though, so I could use some clarification.

I don't think we have a meritocracy now though, since we have so many set asides, special groups, etc.

Blogger Josh July 27, 2015 5:41 AM  

I would be interested in seeing clarity on what you think will happen instead of merit. Heredity? Share of the spoils? Something else?

Designer babies

Blogger Josh July 27, 2015 5:44 AM  

I may not understand exactly what you are encompassing in the term meritocracy though, so I could use some clarification.


Essentially meritocracy rewards those who did the right things and worked hard (high test scores, grades, etc). If, however, those results are largely genetic, how different is a meritocracy than an aristocracy? If you're born with it, you didn't work for it.

Example: Shaq dunking a basketball versus Peter Dinklage dunking one.

Anonymous anonymous coward July 27, 2015 5:56 AM  

"Second World status"? What the hell does that mean?

Anonymous PhillipGeorge©2015 July 27, 2015 5:57 AM  

Building society 101. Doesn't matter how educated, clever, intelligent a man thinks himself or another man perceives any other. The epistemological brick wall remains Kurt Godel. Throw in Fitch's paradox and all science, philosophy hits a perfect wall.

"Men can't build towers to heaven" may not be true, being perceived as pig ignorant if they got there appears the bigger reality. Clever fools seem somehow more pathetic than village idiots enjoying the sunshine and rain. For all those who can read this, prepare to meet your maker.

Blogger Eric July 27, 2015 6:12 AM  

I suspect that those equalitarians who claim to believe that a meritocracy is the best of all possible systems are going to rapidly change their tune once it becomes apparent that material merit is predominantly genetic in origin.

Apparent to whom? It's been obvious for decades (or longer). Personally, I think we'll go the way of the UK - publicly noticing the truth will be illegal, and they'll keep using quotas to make the numbers come out right.

Anonymous zen0 July 27, 2015 6:22 AM  

@7

Ask The Google

Anonymous Stilicho July 27, 2015 6:28 AM  

Equalitarians hate meritocracy with a white hot passion. Oh, they may pay lip service to the idea, but they will only do so as part of a process to redefine the term "merit" to mean something that will help them achieve their political aims. E.g. Their current usage of "diverse" as the equivalent of "meritorious" in order to justify their socialist pursuit of equality of outcomes.

Blogger Mindstorm July 27, 2015 6:32 AM  

@2 Steve:

So, WHY magnets work? :)

I guess that study implies that 'good schools' merely have a substantial percentage of gifted pupils. Another argument for segregation? :)

Blogger Mindstorm July 27, 2015 6:40 AM  

@2 What Pauli formulated was entirely unnecessary, is that what you mean? :)

Blogger intuitivereason July 27, 2015 6:42 AM  

A person may still be judged on their merits, regardless of genetics. Unless and until their capacity to reproduce is part of the question. At that point, their heritage is of equal importance to their character.

Blogger Mindstorm July 27, 2015 6:44 AM  

@2
http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2015-07/22/tiniest-processor-moores-law - we would have this regardless, right?

Blogger Jason Roberts July 27, 2015 6:55 AM  

For example, if the MAO-A, DAT1, and DRD2 genes are deemed to be unsuitable for an occupation, those possessing the unwanted genetic markers can be banned with absolutely no reference to race at all.

That deserves a Heartstian "heh."

Blogger Mindstorm July 27, 2015 7:04 AM  

Coincidentally, we all have the MAO-A gene, and so on. Only specific alleles are problematic.

Anonymous Giuseppe The Kurgan July 27, 2015 7:18 AM  

It's not just me right?
Thordaddy has a severe issue with the English language. I have never before been able to read so many words withot them actually having any meaning whatsoever. It's like a magic trick. Makes David Copperfield's disappearing an elephant seem easy by comparison.

Blogger VD July 27, 2015 7:36 AM  

Stow it, Thordaddy.

Coincidentally, we all have the MAO-A gene, and so on.

Yes, it's certain variants that are linked to aggression.

Anonymous Steve July 27, 2015 7:44 AM  

Mindstorm - Racist nonsense.

Those schools only work because their pupils have an unfair advantage from all the White Privilege.

White Privilege is sort of like the bag of gold every Jew wears around his neck. But unlike Jewgold, White Privilege is invisible, because whites are sneaky fuckers, not unlike polar bears - which are also white.

Coincidence? I think not.

So basically, white children are like the kids from Village of the Damned, and we'd better do what they say. Mine have glowing eyes and shiny blond Beatles haircuts, and compel me with their unholy White Privilege powers.

You will buy us Lego, won't you, father?

Giuseppe - Thordaddy IRL

Blogger Joshua Dyal July 27, 2015 7:49 AM  

cuckservative is a yesterday kerfluffle? I thought it was more of an ongoing thing?

Blogger Cataline Sergius July 27, 2015 7:53 AM  

Because in a post-Christian world of scientific rational materialism, there is no way that a meritocratic approach will not eventually lead to Eugenics 2.0.

It's almost here now. All you need is $15,000 and a reliable set of genetic markers. At this point.

Reliable markers for intelligence haven't been identified yet. Not with any consistency. It looks to be a specialized cocktail of traits.

But here is the thing. Once identified with consistency, it's easy.

You are Tabitha Advocate-AllWhite and your life partner Jaime (who can be male or female doesn't matter and may not even know him/herself at this point) are in your late thirties, you now have an income that is reliably in the mid six figures. Time for your One Allowable Child.

You need medical assistance for that at this point. Your eggs are harvested and your life partner (or someone else suitable) provides the sperm. And in Brave New World fashion a batch of blastocysts are baked up in the lab

Now the genetic testing starts.

Your Grandmother died of breast cancer. So naturally you scan the batch for that. Any that are positive are immediately discarded, (that one is being done right now BTW) You also fish out any potential children, with obvious defects like Down Syndrome or Baldness (both being done right now as well).

Physical traits are quite a bit more tricky. Since these genes belong only to yourself and your male life partner (or someone more suitable, he's a male after all what he doesn't know won't hurt him). Blonde hair and blue eyes may not available for everyone sorry. You are only able to work with what your genes brought to the table in the first place.

BUT you can pick the best of those. OR what you consider the most preferable anyway.

Implant four and hope for the best. You are in your late thirties after all. If all four take. It's time for selective reduction. The first two least desirable fetuses are gone. A boy and a girl would be nice but Geia can't take that and your friends would disapprove. And boy's are so disadvantaged and unfashionable today, so the boy goes as well. Leaving you with one girl, whom you can helicopter around and provide every advantage to, Choate, then Yale Etc.


These are all the things that being done today. None of this is Science Fiction.

Once reliably identified you can select for intelligence as well. That is unquestionably going to happen.

All of this is predicated upon you having a shitload of money, so these things are automatically limited to the 01%.

Now consider the filtering mechanism of this model over three generations. You are going to have a world where the 01% are all as smart as Vox Day.

Welcome to the world of Participant Evolution.

Anonymous Steve July 27, 2015 7:53 AM  

Joshua - they prefer to be known as Caitlynservatives.

Blogger Joshua Dyal July 27, 2015 7:55 AM  

@14: Of course. Meritocracy means—among other things—that those to the right of the bell curve for their population can be successful. What it does not mean, in spite of the best efforts of the equalitarians, is that the bell curve itself is adjusted to the left either through flooding the population with individuals who are to the left of the mean or through just fudging the numbers, either one.

Anonymous Steve July 27, 2015 7:57 AM  

Cataline - You are going to have a world where the 01% are all as smart as Vox Day.

Called it.

Anonymous NorthernHamlet July 27, 2015 8:03 AM  

VD,

Interesting post with the end on race-blindness. However, to what extent could this really work, given that merely because someone has the desired genes, doesn't mean they haven't used them to their full ability?

Blogger VD July 27, 2015 8:16 AM  

However, to what extent could this really work, given that merely because someone has the desired genes, doesn't mean they haven't used them to their full ability?

Of course not. I haven't used mine to their full effect. Nurture matters. But it doesn't matter as much as Nature, especially on the positive side. Nature makes, Nuture breaks. One problem is that people recognize how Nuture can break an individual, and assume that it can have similarly positive effects. It can't.

Anonymous anonymous coward July 27, 2015 8:30 AM  

@10

The "Second World" were the countries aligned to the USSR during the Cold War. Two points: a) the "Second World" doesn't exist anymore, and b) it's highly doubtful that immigration will turn the USA into a Soviet Republic.

Blogger Joshua Dyal July 27, 2015 8:34 AM  

@28: That definition is somewhat outdated. From Wikipedia: "The concept of 'Second World' was a construct of the Cold War and the term has largely fallen out of use since the revolutions of 1989, although it is still used to describe countries that are in between poverty and prosperity, many of which are now capitalist states. Subsequently, the actual meaning of the terms 'First World', 'Second World' and 'Third World' changed from being based on political ideology to an economic definition.

Also, don't be so quick to write off the notion that we'll turn into a Soviet Republic. Oh, sure, we'll almost certainly not use that particular and specific label, but that doesn't mean that we haven't already absorbed way too much Marxism than is good for us.

Blogger W.LindsayWheeler July 27, 2015 8:56 AM  

I have never heard of the "ciceronian political cycle". Googling the term, only Vox uses the term. I go to Wikipedia and its article on Kyklos, there is NO mention of Cicero.

I have read the Political Science Professor, a Catholic, Erik von Kuenhelt-Leddihn that does use the Kyklos in his books. Yet, I never heard Cicero in conjunction with it. Maybe, someone can post an academic article on the "Ciceronian political cycle". For enquiring minds would like to know. Plato is the author of it and then Polybius talked of it. Cicero was not an original thinker; he copied other people. Even if there is a "Ciceronian political cycle" it was probably copied from someone else. He did go to school in Athens at the Aristotelian school.

Anonymous HardReturn¶ (30) July 27, 2015 9:09 AM  

@29 @28
For Second World, I'd think of Mexico or India in the 1970s--pockets of productivity and opulence, obvious squalor around the pockets, top-down byzantine bureaucracy yielding necessary tolerance of graft and corruption, sub-cultures of violence. It's a term I'm using more since it has more relevance with US today.

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 9:09 AM  

@8. PhillipGeorge©2015

Yes, Kurt Godel revealed a wall, but that wall is in the form of a singularity, a singularity which cannot be crossed, but can be approached from both sides.

Godel's Incompleteness Theorem does not, as some seem to believe, invalidate mathematical proof. What it does is show that any mathematical model of all truths must, at minimum, employ two theories of algebra.

Which may imply that the search for the TOE is in vain. That the minimum number of theories to describe physical reality is two.

Anonymous Difster VFM #109 July 27, 2015 9:11 AM  

And so, in the next 10 to 15 years, you'll see employers begin to require pre-employment genetic testing followed by shrill cries to makes such things illegal.

Blogger VD July 27, 2015 9:13 AM  

I have never heard of the "ciceronian political cycle". Googling the term, only Vox uses the term. I go to Wikipedia and its article on Kyklos, there is NO mention of Cicero.

Why don't you, I don't know, try READING FUCKING CICERO. Just, you know, a suggestion.

Anonymous rienzi July 27, 2015 9:20 AM  

@7.: "Second World status"? What the hell does that mean?


Go to Jerez in southern Spain. Stay away from the tourist parts. Go back into the nowhere parts of the city where the folks live. That's second world.

Coming soon to a neighborhood near you.

Blogger Nate July 27, 2015 9:23 AM  

" Cicero was not an original thinker; he copied other people. Even if there is a "Ciceronian political cycle" it was probably copied from someone else. He did go to school in Athens at the Aristotelian school."

Wheeler... more primary sources... lets bullshit.

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 9:25 AM  

"For Second World, I'd think of Mexico or India in the 1970s . . ."

Coming from the Duck and Cover era it would make more sense to me to refer a country's socio-economic structure as Tier One, Tier Two, Tier Three, rather than employing a terminology that already has an established meaning of political alignment.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan July 27, 2015 9:27 AM  

"Gattaca" someone had to mention it.

Blogger VD July 27, 2015 9:27 AM  

The Ciceronian cycle is the Platonic cycle. But the question is, what does our blended form of government now best represent? Mob rule, aristocracy, or dictatorship? See my column The Fourth Government at WND.

Blogger James Dixon July 27, 2015 9:30 AM  

> I go to Wikipedia and its article on Kyklos, there is NO mention of Cicero.

Try De re publica and see http://tgenloe.com/sc/?p=428

Blogger James Dixon July 27, 2015 9:32 AM  

> Which may imply that the search for the TOE is in vain. That the minimum number of theories to describe physical reality is two.

Since our basic particles exhibit properties of both matter and energy depending on conditions, that makes perfect sense.

Blogger Cail Corishev July 27, 2015 9:38 AM  

those equalitarians who claim to believe that a meritocracy is the best of all possible systems are going to rapidly change their tune

Yes. We're seeing that in the battles over Codes of Conduct, where "meritocracy" is already a bad word that represents institutional racism, sexism, and all the usual suspects. Anyone who promotes it is accused of dog-whistling. The conversation goes like this:

SJW: We need to have a Code of Conduct that ensures that everyone who has something to contribute to our project feels welcome to do so.
Nerds: That sounds reasonable. We don't want to exclude anyone. Let's say it's a meritocracy: if your work is useful, we don't care about your skin color or what you do with your genitals.
SJW: No, no, no, that's exactly the opposite of what we need. You're still trying to keep out non-white-guys. Die in a fire.
Nerds: Blinking, blinking, does not compute, brain rebooting.....

Since the nerds think words mean things, they can't figure out why the SJW doesn't want what the SJW just said he wanted. And too often, the nerds assume the imperfection is theirs, that their white/male privilege or whatever is keeping them from seeing whatever it is has the SJW's panties in a wad. So they throw their hands up and say, "Okay, fine, you know what it is you're trying to say, so why don't you write the thing while we get back to work?" Then they end up with a Code that contains harmless-looking language that will be used to attack their meritocratic project and give the people with the least merit a club with which to beat the ones with the most.

Blogger Cataline Sergius July 27, 2015 9:50 AM  

it's highly doubtful that immigration will turn the USA into a Soviet Republic.

Way wrong call.

Anonymous Satan's Hamster July 27, 2015 9:59 AM  

@28: "it's highly doubtful that immigration will turn the USA into a Soviet Republic."

Well, no. It did that long ago, which is why Americans are now fighting the Sovietization of their institutions through standard KGB subversion tactics.

Back on topic, surely once 'white privilege' is proven to be genetic, the SJWs will demand that all white babies are genetically modified to remove the 'white privilege' genes?

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 10:03 AM  

" . . . SJWs will demand that all white babies are genetically modified to remove the 'white privilege' genes?"

They always destroy, seeking to bring everything down the lowest possible denominator, and BEYOND!

"Neighbor's goat too, must die."

Blogger Joshua Dyal July 27, 2015 10:07 AM  

@31, @37: Referring to the economic development using the labels First, Second and Third world is an already established tradition dating back decades. Saying that just because the terminology had another use decades before that is silly. The Second World has referred to countries like the BRICS since the end of the Cold War, if not even before.

Anonymous Giuseppe The Kurgan July 27, 2015 10:07 AM  

Steve. I lolled. I actually lolled.

Blogger Cail Corishev July 27, 2015 10:11 AM  

I may not understand exactly what you are encompassing in the term meritocracy though, so I could use some clarification.

Brad, I think you're a computer programmer, right? If you've ever been involved in an open-source project, or at least observed one like Linux, those are about as close to pure meritocracies as you can get. Someone can offer a new idea or a piece of code, and no one cares a whit where he lives or what he looks like or what he does on Friday nights. His contribution is judged on its merits, and accepted and incorporated into the project, or rejected and everyone moves on. The Internet runs on billions of lines of code created by that dispassionate method: keep the good, discard the bad.

The problem is, SJWs realize that some people have far more good ideas than others, and some people may have no good ideas at all. That's just the harsh truth of reality. If you're five feet tall, you have zero "merit" as a pro basketball player. If you have an IQ of 80 and no interest in logic or math, you have zero merit as a computer language designer. So the people with the most merit in a particular field will contribute the most to it, and those with little merit in that field will struggle to come up with anything worth inclusion.

And since many people can't separate the particular from the general, they take "you have no merit as a programmer" to mean "you have no merit as a human being." That's non-Christian thinking, but it's exactly the thinking you'd expect from a utilitarian, which is where you end up when you replace Christ with Man and Christianity with a faith in Science and human actions to create Heaven on Earth.

Anonymous Clint 47/73 July 27, 2015 10:13 AM  

it's highly doubtful that immigration will turn the USA into a Soviet Republic.

You are correct. It won't be nearly that nice. It will probably be more of a cross between the Mexican barrio and the grasshut villages of Africa. You can already see the process taking place in South Africa. Nice, clean cities reduced to slums.

Hell, the trains won't even run on time.

Anonymous Giuseppe The Kurgan July 27, 2015 10:20 AM  

@VD re Cicero /wheeler,
(sorry the numbers don't show on my mobile)
That little outburst Vox, just confirmed you as "my people" as an expatriate dago, with ancient ties to the noble house of Filo, I give you rights to remain in my country as long as you like.

Even through the stunted medium of computers, the pathos of thatc"suggestion" reverberated within me. How well I know that type of sentence. How hauntingly well!

I also laughed for about two minutes straight btw.

Blogger Joshua Dyal July 27, 2015 10:23 AM  

Steve. I lolled. I actually lolled.

In the rush of posting, I missed the Caitlynservative line. I looked back and lolled too.

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 10:23 AM  

"First, Second and Third world is an already established tradition dating back decades."

I didn't say anything about expecting anybody to listen to me.

I would point out, however, that the term Second World does not have such an established meaning, as evidenced by the confusion it has caused here.

As it happens in the late 60's and early 70's I lived in the boonies of southern Mexico, but also spent some time in a state capital. Moving into the mid 70's I lived in the boonies outside of Huelva, which it shares with Jerez, but also spent some time in Malaga and Seville.

I have also lived extensively in the boonies of northern NY and southern Vermont and my experience is that once you've seen one backwater shithole where people shit in a hole in the ground you've pretty much seen 'em all. And they exist everywhere.

The tell, to me, is not what happens out in the sticks, but what happens in the big cities, like, oooooooh, I don't know - Detroit.

Anonymous Teenage Jail July 27, 2015 10:27 AM  

@38

"Of course, it's illegal to discriminate. Genoism. But no one pays attention to the law..."

@48

You've probably seen this many times, but http://readwrite.com/2014/01/24/github-meritocracy-rug

Blogger James Dixon July 27, 2015 10:29 AM  

> Hell, the trains won't even run on time.

Just ask the folks in Detroit how well their bus system works.

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 10:32 AM  

I used to actually be able to set my watch by the running of the NY Central and the equivalent in the Soviet Block. Try that with AMTRAK and you'll never even be sure what day it is.

OpenID genericviews July 27, 2015 10:34 AM  

...reduce the USA to Second World status

Not that you are wrong. I believe you are correct that the standard of living in the USA will be dramatically reduced. The term "second world", means "Soviet communist". The first World, under the cold war paradigm was The West, plus Japan and Korea. The Second World was the old Soviet Union and their satalites. The Third world was everyone else. So, it is possible to jump from the First world into the Third world without ever becomming a communist bloc client state.

Blogger Robert What? July 27, 2015 10:37 AM  

This is why it is important for intelligent men to mate with intelligent women. Note - I didn't say educated women: I mean a woman with common sense and a head on her shoulders. That's because boys inherit a large part of their intelligence from their mothers through the X chromosome. That means that an intelligent man and an idiot woman can still have intelligent daughters, but they'll almost certainly have idiot sons.

Blogger Joshua Dyal July 27, 2015 10:38 AM  

@52: Well, you're confused. Because you're unfamiliar with the established meanings that everyone else seems to have interpreted correctly. Because there are actually such established meanings.

But this is getting silly. Whenever you're reduced to arguing definitions on the internet, your discussion has gone way off the rails.

Although several other big metropolitan areas are on heading the same way as Detroit, but Detroit's catastrophic failure remains, at least so far, a somewhat unique element. In any case; what are you suggesting? That we're not headed towards Second World status? That we're already effectively there? That we need to literally be associated with the Soviet label to qualify for the Second World label?

In other words, what exactly are you arguing about? Because it seems that in every way that's actually significant, you're not in disagreement.

Anonymous 199060 July 27, 2015 10:57 AM  

[T]hose possessing the unwanted genetic markers can be banned with absolutely no reference to race at all.

So with IQ-based hiring decisions. Selection according to specific gene variants, when such variants are known to be prevalent in a given pet group, will just be called disguised racism.

Blogger Cail Corishev July 27, 2015 11:02 AM  

Nature makes, Nuture breaks.

That's spooky; I was just running through that same idea yesterday. If you have a high IQ, enough heavy drinking can make you stupid through brain damage. But if you have a low IQ, there's nothing you can drink or otherwise add to your environment that will make you smarter. But as you say, people assume that if it works one direction, it must work the other direction, and we just need to figure out how.

There are all sorts of examples that people can understand, when you get away from the brain. If you have the height to be an NBA player (nature), you can cut off that possibility by fattening yourself on junk food (nurture) until you can't run or jump. But if you're below a certain height, no amount of nurturing your skill and desire will get you to the pros.

So our Nature sets an upper bound on what we're able to accomplish. By Nurture, we can lower that limit, but we can't raise it. I didn't come up with anything as pithy as "Nature makes, Nurture breaks," though. That's excellent.

This also touches on why homeschooling is so important: there isn't really much parents can do to "improve" their kids after contributing their genes. They are as you made them. So the most important thing is to keep them away from bad Nurtures, to limit any breakage and keep their potential as close as possible to what they were born with.

Blogger Alexander July 27, 2015 11:02 AM  

Well, if we whites actually go and commit the demographic suicide our betters cheer for, the vibrant will get to enjoy the best of both philosophies.

In addition to the stringent requirements regarding the following required and prohibited genetic markers, the candidate must also be Han Chinese.

No chance of the Mexicans and the Africans benefiting from a gene-based society, because neither group will be the ones with the know-how to read the genes in the first place.

From their point of view it might as well be a King with a magic 8 ball that he never lets anyone else read, except the King will be backed by a massive amount of firepower, an overt and unashamed ethnic and cultural bias, and a decidedly unChristian approach towards the meek and powerless.

So all told, it's probably best for most of the anti-white coalition if that doesn't come to pass. Africa is starting to appreciate that independence was never a practical option for them while they had stuff in the ground other people wanted, and replacing European Imperialism with either the Chinese or local middle-men is not conducive to little luxuries like eating meat a few times a year or keeping the slave markets closed.

Blogger Brad Andrews July 27, 2015 11:25 AM  

So we can only understand the vast pronouncements of VD if we do all the reading he does? Not a chance of that happening.

Basic definitions are not always VD's thing.

Where is "Cicero for Dummies" when you need it?

Blogger Cail Corishev July 27, 2015 11:26 AM  

Once reliably identified you can select for intelligence as well. That is unquestionably going to happen.

Which makes me wonder: what IQ will be considered the sweet spot? At first blush, you'd think most people would want to jack it up as high as possible. But I don't think it'd really work that way. After thinking about it a bit, most would want "smart but not too smart." There will be a lot of interest in studies correlating IQ with income, and people trying to find the best spot on that curve.

And it'll depend on whether they can select for/against other traits that tend to go with high IQ. If people can push the IQ up to 160-180 while being assured they won't get a social retard, they'll be more likely to do it. They'll want a kid who's smart -- and handsome, sociable, healthy, etc. So it'll depend on whether there are trade-offs: what if turning on enough "IQ genes" to reach your goal means you can't have Dad's hair and nose or you raise the odds of obesity? Do you trade back a few points?

Competition will factor into it too. Right now, maybe 140 would be the sweet spot, ensuring the mental horsepower to be a doctor or lawyer without being an annoying nerd. But if all the other rich parents with an eye on Harvard are writing 140 in the IQ line of their baby order forms, maybe you go for 145 to get an edge -- and then you get IQ inflation in the market, just as you can see now in the preschool/kindergarten/test-prep market.

Should be interesting, that's for sure.

Anonymous Stilicho July 27, 2015 11:29 AM  

@33 Difster, such genetic screening in connection with employment is already illegal in some jurisdictions. I expect most will do so.

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 11:32 AM  

"Well, you're confused."

I expressed no such confusion. I am not an aspie and was able to interpolate something of the idea being expressed. What I did was empirically observe confusion, i.e., everyone did not get it, even though I am sure that they would have understood "First World" to mean "Developed," and "Thrid World" to mean "Shithole."

I understand the meanings of words can change over time, but I do not accept the post-modernist idea that words have no meaning. Maintaining reasonable definitions is one of the chief weapons against the beige goo of the rabbit warrens.

The reason that Internet arguments about definitions are generally such a clusterfuck is that they typically involve rabbits trying to break definitions, as that is there winning case.

When I have political discussions these days it is often necessary to first determine what the other party means by "left" and "right," as their definition likely has no correspondence to what these words meant just a decade or two ago and may vary from person to person.

It's not that I, as some do, get off on doing this, it's a royal pain in the ass, but it is necessary so that I have any idea what the hell we're even talking about. If I can't do that, then the whole conversation is a pointless exercise in gum flapping.

Which for them is the point of it.

Blogger automatthew July 27, 2015 11:46 AM  

@30 W.LindsayWheeler,

You're not Googling for the right terms. Try this.

Blogger rumpole5 July 27, 2015 11:58 AM  

Your point is valid, but, given the rising rate of genetic engineering, who knows if inherited genetic compsition will ultimately make an outcome difference. We will soon be able to alter it. It probably makes more sense to explore and understand the "nurture" component in the outcome equation because better genetics tech can't control the character component.

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 12:04 PM  

"We will soon be able to alter it."

More human than human, and BEYOND to transhuman!

Oh! The Brave New World that awaits us.

Blogger MendoScot July 27, 2015 12:12 PM  

The problem with Eugenics 2.0 is that we simply don't know enough about the heritability of complex traits to reliably engineer them. It's estimated that alleles in around 600 genes (the last time I checked) influence IQ. The problem is negative epistasis - genetics' Law of Diminishing Returns. Finding out how these alleles interact really is a case of suck it and see - with a generational timeline.

Blogger haus frau July 27, 2015 12:28 PM  

@19
Thordaddy has a severe issue with the English language.

His writings remind me of my possibly schizophrenic, con artist, lawyer cousin. Word salad with an overwhelming theme of specific obsessions.

Anonymous BGS July 27, 2015 12:41 PM  

The Minnesota study on twins separated at birth showed even higher genetic basis for intelligence.

I may not understand exactly what you are encompassing in the term meritocracy though,

No affirmative action tokens or women that just drink coffee and want to have meetings dead weight.

"Second World status"? What the hell does that mean?

Mexican President Calderon said "where there is Mexicans there is mexico". Some thought he was extruding authority over the US but most understand he was apologizing for the littering, people acting like the age of consent was 12, DUIs & drug crimes. North Carolina tracks Hispanics separately from whites and Ann Coulter recently reported 90% of NC's sex crimes are Hispanic.

Giuseppe - Thordaddy IRL they did it those bastards actually did it, have a black lesbian hit ler.

Hell, the trains won't even run on time. Just ask the folks in Detroit how well their bus system works.

What did Zimbabwe use for light before candles? Electricity.

try READING FUCKING CICERO. I am pretty sure that Vox doesn't mean the Hugo award winning time travel story.

Anonymous Suindara July 27, 2015 1:00 PM  

I suspect this sort of thing will not convince the true religious.
For some people equality must be achieved by any means, that includes cutting down the tall trees.

Blogger James Dixon July 27, 2015 1:03 PM  

> Where is "Cicero for Dummies" when you need it?

Would you settle for Cicero for English readers? http://oll.libertyfund.org/titles/546#toc_list

The Online Library of Liberty is a great site in general, BTW.

Anonymous Discard July 27, 2015 1:28 PM  

Nate: Is that you quoting "The White Woman and the Negro" over on Yahoo?

Anonymous Cyrie July 27, 2015 1:51 PM  

Does "equalitarian" refer to one who believes all people are equally capable or one who believes all people should be treated equal under the law?

Anonymous Mike M. July 27, 2015 1:52 PM  

Selecting for intelligence is good, but weeding SJW and other leftist tendencies would do more long-term good.

Anonymous BGS July 27, 2015 2:02 PM  

"Does "equalitarian" refer to one who believes all people are equally capable or "

I think it means the fact that Asians girls everywhere in the world are less violent/stupid than black boys is the STR8 YT X-TIAN MAN's fault.

Anonymous Discard July 27, 2015 2:04 PM  

Robert What?@57: If a woman is smart enough to become a lawyer, the best thing she could ever do for her society would be to have six kids.

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 2:44 PM  

And keep the four good ones. That's the old school way of maintaining the breed.

Blogger Groot July 27, 2015 6:22 PM  

@8. PhillipGeorge©2015:
"Doesn't matter how educated, clever, intelligent a man thinks himself or another man perceives any other. The epistemological brick wall remains Kurt Godel."

Any system of proofs will always be incomplete. There will always be things that are true that you can't prove with existing axioms. You will always need new axioms, for there is always more to learn. How people always have a pessimistic take on this wonderful theorem amazes me.

@20. Steve:
"White Privilege is invisible"

I just substitute "high IQ" for "White Privilege" both in my head and in the conversation, and watch them stutter. You can easily include Orientals and Jews and keep talking without logical inconsistency, but they can't. You can then turn it around and refer to standard deviations of "White Privilege" and confuse them further.

@68. kfg:
"More human than human, and BEYOND to transhuman!"

It's easy (and fun) to mock, but if you worked in the middle of it every day, you would understand why people are both excited and unsettled. Imagine an interface from a brain to the electronic world, including not only computation but other brains also so connected. Not Science Fiction:

Mindmelded Computer

Nature, Nurture, and Network! (See, fully OT.)

@69. MendoScot:
"we simply don't know enough about the heritability of complex traits to reliably engineer them"

Yet! If you want to know where the forefront of AI research is, from ontology tools, machine intelligence to big data, genetics is where it's at.

Anonymous Donn #0114 July 27, 2015 6:41 PM  

anarchotyranny

Anonymous kfg July 27, 2015 6:46 PM  

"Imagine an interface from a brain to the electronic world, including not only computation but other brains also so connected."

Been there. Done that. 50 years ago.

Blogger SciVo July 27, 2015 8:00 PM  

@ Robert What?: "That means that an intelligent man and an idiot woman can still have intelligent daughters, but they'll almost certainly have idiot sons."

No. Men have a higher variance of IQ, with both more geniuses and more idiots. (Nature experimenting more with the more expendable sex.) Therefore, the Y chromosome is highly relevant.

Furthermore, all but one X chromosome is deprecated in its expression. So, the daughters would have a 50/50 chance of not getting much any benefit from their dad's X.

It's a bad idea for a brilliant man to mate with a stupid woman for many reasons, and it would drag your descendants' IQ down, but if anything I think you would be more likely to get stupid daughters than stupid sons.

Blogger SciVo July 27, 2015 8:05 PM  

That's the theory, anyway. I haven't seen studies on it.

Blogger SciVo July 27, 2015 8:18 PM  

On further reflection, if one of her parents is smart, then maybe she just got unlucky on which X was deprecated. She can still pass on the other one, so the odds of non-stupid daughters rises in that case.

Blogger MendoScot July 27, 2015 8:28 PM  

@80. Groot

FUCK yeah!

Except AIs, machine intelligence and big data don't.

Or trees.

I've been watching genetic algorithms for - it seems - ever. Shtupping is still far more more effective.

Blogger W.LindsayWheeler July 27, 2015 8:35 PM  

Nate, the American classicist Michael Grant, opined that most likely, Cicero plagerized Diachercus of Messina's Tripoliticus for his De republica. The book I referenced in a paper is 1995 but I lost the title.

I have several books by Cicero. One Loeb with De republica and On the Laws and two paperbacks by Michael Grant.

Blogger Luke (alias "Lines With Chrome") July 27, 2015 8:41 PM  

1. Sexual orientation is determined by genetics.

2. Genetics has absolutely, positively NO relation to IQ, SAT scores, graduation rates or crime.

Dear "progressives", you get to pick ONE. :-)

Anonymous Ain July 27, 2015 9:09 PM  

Giuseppe The Kurgan: "with the bonus incentive of potentially increasing the genetic viability of your progeny thanks to any offspring I may bestow on you. Applicants in single file please."

Do they say, "Rapunzel, Rapunzel, let down your hair?"

Blogger Groot July 27, 2015 10:09 PM  

@86. MendoScot July 27, 2015 8:28 PM
"FUCK yeah!
"Except AIs, machine intelligence and big data don't.
"Or trees.
"I've been watching genetic algorithms for - it seems - ever. Shtupping is still far more more effective."

Don't what?
I didn't mention genetic algorithms, but Turing proposed them in 1950, Holland programmed them machine language in the '70s. That is a long time. I am again short your point.
Shtupping? At last, I can join you in a hearty "FUCK yeah"!

Blogger rumpole5 July 27, 2015 11:25 PM  

I predict that we will be immersed inside and out by self replicating, AI guided nano machines. If Rachel Blonde wants to be a negress the nanos will pump up, darken, and alter the requisite features. Just like your glasses change into shades. However, I expect far more bio traffic to Nordic destinations. No more "bad" hair. If the Negro horde gets caught Polar Bear knock outing, the judge will order nano readjustment of the requisite brain receptors and hormones to Caucasian levels, and Jessie Jackson will no longer have to worry about the race of the foot falls he hears behind him in the dark alley.

Just as fracking quietly transformed our energy potential, all of the bio applicable tech is going to transform our race and other "being" issues. "Be all that you can be" will be more than just a recruitment slogan.

"There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy".

Blogger rumpole5 July 27, 2015 11:27 PM  

Yeah, I know. Shakespeare stole the quote/idea.

Anonymous The other robot July 28, 2015 12:29 AM  

By the same token, we who have been blessed with greater intelligence have a responsibility to not fuck things up for the less-blessed fellow members of our race.

Sometimes we need them and there but for the grace of god go I.

Anonymous The other robot July 28, 2015 12:35 AM  

On further reflection, if one of her parents is smart, then maybe she just got unlucky on which X was deprecated. She can still pass on the other one, so the odds of non-stupid daughters rises in that case.

I think the problem is that because of random X inactivation on the non-pseudo-autosomal portion of the X, in females, they average, so daughters will get the average of the intelligence linked genes on the X from each parent, while males will be either stupid or brainy.

Of course, while the X chromosome is enriched for intelligence related genes, it does not contain them all.

Blogger Groot July 28, 2015 3:48 AM  

@91. rumpole5:
I detect a problem. While we enjoy SF speculation, it is tolerable and enjoyable only within a context of story and character that engages us. Bullshit sets off bullshit-alarms. My recommendation: Less grandiose hosannas, and more point. Can you contribute clarity rather than feelz?

Blogger VFM bot #188 July 28, 2015 10:58 AM  

Why don't you, I don't know, try READING FUCKING CICERO. Just, you know, a suggestion.

My, my. Is the Evil Dark Overlord of Evilness out of sorts today?

RUNNN! Everyone!

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