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Tuesday, September 22, 2015

Mailvox: the power of rhetoric

RM puts SJWs Always Lie into practice:
On Twitter I was able to apply your tactics in realtime against some atheist chick. I demolished pseudo-dialectic with dialectic, and met rhetoric with rhetoric. Additionally, I also worked in the Red Pill, maintained frame and got her hamster working over time by saying her profile pic was one of a 4, and hitting the Wall must drive her to seek male attention. I got six tweets in response for one of mine with her hamster spinning like mad to qualify herself to me.

In the end, she started following my account and asked if I'd follow her and if I wanted to have a conversation with just her since she was shy on Twitter.

I dropped it and walked away at that point, shuddering.

Granted, I have room for improvement. It took me far too long to get her to that point and I replied too often, but the end result was a confirmation of your tactics for logic and your observations concerning socio-sexual interactions.
There is a definite connection between rhetoric and Game that merits further exploration. And on a tangential note, I've had some requests for how to respond to common rhetorical attacks. For example, it's quite common to see atheists use the Old Testament to rhetorically attack Christianity, to which the ideal rhetorical response should be obvious: "You're attacking the Torah? You're an anti-semitic Jew-hating Nazi!"

It would be helpful, in this regard, if you would list some of the common rhetorical attacks you've observed at school, at work, or online.

Labels: ,

235 Comments:

1 – 200 of 235 Newer› Newest»
Blogger Thomas Davidsmeier September 22, 2015 9:12 AM  

"You're supposed to love your enemies not hate them."
"Don't judge!"
"You're fat." Well, maybe that's just what I hear a lot.

Blogger Student in Blue September 22, 2015 9:17 AM  

Imo, probably the most common rhetorical attack would have to do with "turning the other cheek", followed right up by "don't judge others".

It's common enough that I believe you've covered it before numerous times.

OpenID simplytimothy September 22, 2015 9:24 AM  

From a recent #IStandWithAnn twitter exchange...

Incl. by saying "How many f---ing Jews" are there? Sorry, don't engage with bigots or bigot sympathisers. Goodbye!

Yes, demographics matter. But denigrating, attacking a race, group of people? That's called #racism, dear!

i.e. charges of bigotry/racism. The truth is I don't give a damn, but the rhetorical response that puts the bastard on his back would be a joy to deploy.

Blogger JartStar September 22, 2015 9:25 AM  

Christians are uneducated idiots.
Christians are hypocrites.
You hate science.
Crusades! Inquisition!

Blogger Gaiseric ! September 22, 2015 9:28 AM  

False equivalencies of isolated anecdotes to cultural habits. As I've posted stuff about the ongoing Afghan bacha bazi pederasty scandal, I've had more than a few, "Hey, look, here's a story of child abuse in the West or among a church group, etc." replies.

Prior to this particular scandal, I've dealt with the same nonsense of false equivalencies frequently.

Blogger Phillip George September 22, 2015 9:30 AM  

Imbeciles, sociopaths, muslims and SJWs need to be managed rather than spoken to. I think that summarizes the situation.

Vox, when the titanic was obviously in it's death throws, Captain Smith, is remembered as having uttered, among his last words "Be British"

It was a call to die well, without panic, chaos or impropriety. To be brave stoic proud and honourable. It was a call to be gentlemanly to the very last.

Civilization once meant "not pagan, not heathen, not savage, not barbarian, not jumping queues, not a cad, not disloyal, not greedy, not spiteful....it also meant, I believe, to be positively condescending to lesser men, idiots, fools. Be patronizing. Stand your ground.

So even if England, the U.K. sink, over-run by fools, atheists, muhammadens, pagans, imbeciles, I plan to go on being British. Last man standing. For glories sake.
cheers.

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 9:32 AM  

I just left 5 replies to a twitter comment. How the hell do you have any meaningful conversation on that medium? It is terribly annoying.

Blogger VD September 22, 2015 9:34 AM  

How the hell do you have any meaningful conversation on that medium?

Category error. You don't. Twitter is pure rhetoric.

Blogger Student in Blue September 22, 2015 9:35 AM  

How the hell do you have any meaningful conversation on that medium?

You don't.

Blogger Zaklog the Great September 22, 2015 9:38 AM  

I would suggest that the answer to people promoting illegal immigration/amnesty would be, "Why do you hate poor black people?"

Blogger Trimegistus September 22, 2015 9:39 AM  

Truth and accuracy are very important to me. As a result I have a very hard time dealing with the casual lies liberals pad out their conversation with. "The Tea Party are all racists" or "one in five women gets raped" or whatever. I have an almost physical reflex to correct that bullshit. I shift into dialectic mode even though I know perfectly well they're not going to listen.

Any suggestions? What's a rhetorical counter to blatant falsehood?

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 9:42 AM  

"Any suggestions? What's a rhetorical counter to blatant falsehood?"

Yes. learn to control your inner aspie.

OpenID basementhomebrewer September 22, 2015 9:43 AM  

As others have said, anytime Christianity is featured in a conversation the "you're not a real follower of Christ" and "pay attention to the mote in your own eye" cards come out without fail. The accusations of modern Christians being the equivalent of pharisees in Jesus's times.

I haven't found the best rhetorical attack back at them for these accusations. In general the people making these arguments clearly have a hatred for Christians based on other things they tend to say. I have called them out for being hateful towards Christians and asked if they had a traumatic experience involving Christians in the past. They tend not to be triggered by that response though.

I have also called them out for being ignorant atheists. A few times I have had a couple people claim they were "deists" and then vehemently deny being atheists, so that tactic appears to work at least some of the time.

Blogger IsMishe September 22, 2015 9:43 AM  

@4 Those are some of the favorites of The Walking Dumb.
Christians created the education system.
Pots and kettles all the way down.
Issac Newton saw no difference between science and the works of God.
What was the primary cause of the battle of Tours?
The Inquisition was primarily Catholic(not Protestant nor Orthodox) and more than
slightly exaggerated for various reasons.

Blogger Ron September 22, 2015 9:46 AM  

The timing of the questions RE rhetoric and the Christian is interesting. I am just embarking on a study of rhetoric in Scripture and am considering writing up a book on the subject when I am done.

Jesus wielded rhetoric like a sword against his enemies and I'm sure there are many more examples in both the New and Old Testaments.

I say this because in my experience Jews have a pretty good handle on it compared to Western Christians.

Blogger Markku September 22, 2015 9:46 AM  

"don't judge others"

1Co 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

Ok, St. Paul, here we go: You are stupid, Biblically ignorant, or both.

Blogger daddynichol September 22, 2015 9:47 AM  

"One if five women are raped." Response: "That's a lie and you know it. Why would you lie about rape?" The response is for the benefit of those observing the exchange.

Blogger swiftfoxmark2 September 22, 2015 9:49 AM  

Matching rhetoric with better rhetoric is essentially beating crazy with crazier.

Not that it is a bad thing really. The rhetoric of the commies on social media is literally the bottom of the barrel and so you have to dig deeper to combat them.

Blogger Dystopic September 22, 2015 9:49 AM  

Here are a few rhetorical attacks that stumped me.

1. "I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old." I didn't even know what to say to that. It was so stupid and inane that it actually stumped me.

2. "If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents." Again, so stupid and pathetic I had a hard time sinking to the level required to make a comeback.

3. "I think you're lying." This was said about an easily-verifiable truth, to which I provided supporting evidence. Said individual then proceeded to ignore the evidence and continue saying "you're lying" repeatedly. This was probably my fault, because I responded with factual evidence (i.e. dialectic), but still... how do you respond that attack?

4. "Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!" This was said because I retweeted a Roosh V post.

5. "You look kind of rapey." Oddly enough, not the same individual as in #4. This was in reply to a Halloween contest post where I was dressed as Beetlejuice.

Those are the ones that come to mind. There are probably more that I just can't remember. Rhetoric is difficult for me, at times.

Blogger Michelle *VFM #311* September 22, 2015 9:49 AM  

The one that drives me nuts is "Christians only care about the unborn and won't help them after", I don't mind providing charity but it infuriates me to be forced to do it at the point of a gun. Oh, yeah, the blatant denial that taxes are paid at the point of a gun. That's the other one that pushes me over the edge.

Blogger swiftfoxmark2 September 22, 2015 9:50 AM  

"One if five women are raped." Response: "That's a lie and you know it. Why would you lie about rape?" The response is for the benefit of those observing the exchange.

A proper response is to say that this means that 20% of all men are rapists and that she should start a woman-only colony in a remote island for her safety.

Blogger Stingray September 22, 2015 9:50 AM  

There is a definite connection between rhetoric and Game that merits further exploration.

Rhetoric is used to influence through emotions. Which is highly appealing to women. A good practitioner of Game can make a women feel as he wants her to feel, just as a good rhetorician can make his listeners feel as he wishes and therefore influence his thoughts. When you base your world view on emotion (which all SJWs do) one his is skilled can lead them where he likes. Cult leaders come immediately to mind.

Unsurprising, those skilled in Game can not only lead women, but any one who is dependent on rhetoric. My husband is a natural as is Vox and Nate. All three are good with women, but it naturally extends to anyone who depends on rhetoric.

Blogger daddynichol September 22, 2015 9:55 AM  

To those who have trotted out the same old anti-faith and anti-Christian tropes, I simply refer them to Vox's "The Irrational Atheist". I do like to hook them with, "I usually don't recommend this book to those who are not intellectually up to the task, but you seem to be bright enough to understand its complexity." If they refuse to read it, I can point to their self admitted low intellectual curiosity. If they buy it and read it, they stand a chance of changing for the better.

Blogger buzzardist September 22, 2015 9:55 AM  

One of the common rhetorical ploys I am seeing recently is the "I know someone who" line. Whether it is someone who had an abortion, experienced rape, died from cancer, heard a racist taunt, is gay, or whatever, the fact that this person either knows someone who has this personal experience or has had such experience personally is treated as an automatic qualification for that person's perspective and an automatic disqualification of anyone who happens to disagree.

Blogger Stingray September 22, 2015 9:56 AM  

Truth and accuracy are very important to me.

Then lead them to the truth by understanding that they cannot get there the way you want them to. If its that important to you, you will lead them there in the way they can grasp it. This is also means leaving those behind who refuse to follow. Scrape them off.

Blogger Cail Corishev September 22, 2015 9:56 AM  

How the hell do you have any meaningful conversation on that medium?

Don't try. 99% of the people there aren't capable of meaningful conversation anyway. Use it for insults, rhetorical jabs, and occasional links to longer stuff elsewhere. If you can't fit a thought into a single tweet, or two at the most, don't bother. People who spread thoughts across multiple tweets just look incontinent.

As stupid as the place is, it is good practice for those of us who tend to be a bit, shall we say, wordy.

Blogger Tlu September 22, 2015 9:56 AM  

Dystopic said:
"3. "I think you're lying." This was said about an easily-verifiable truth, to which I provided supporting evidence. Said individual then proceeded to ignore the evidence and continue saying "you're lying" repeatedly. This was probably my fault, because I responded with factual evidence (i.e. dialectic), but still... how do you respond that attack?"

Dude, you need to watch some more Dwayne The Rock Johnson.
"I think you're-"
"IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT YOU THINK."

OpenID xsyq September 22, 2015 9:58 AM  

Re: Inquisition, how many people were killed as a direct result of Inquisitorial activity? Compare that with the 58? million abortions so far in the US alone and ask which is worse.

Blogger Skylark Thibedeau September 22, 2015 10:00 AM  

Looking at the ben Carson Kerfuffle should the correct response be "Don't you believe the Constitution calls for the Separation of Mosque and State"?

Blogger AmyJ September 22, 2015 10:05 AM  

@Michelle *VFM #311*

That one drives me nuts, too. As if we can't oppose the wholesale slaughter of the unborn without cleaning up the messes others make due to their irresponsibility or poor judgment. Because reasons.

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 10:08 AM  

People who spread thoughts across multiple tweets just look incontinent.

Yeay! Guilty of word diarheah! Just what I wanted to hear.

Great. So finish reading SJWAL, pick up Socrates, and try again.

Or just stick with baby pictures on Facebook.

Former wins. I've been too intellectually lazy since motherhood.

OpenID angrydrake September 22, 2015 10:08 AM  

>Crusades!

The only thing bad about them was that they were too little and too late.

>Inquisition!

The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith should get funded more than it gets.

Blogger sysadmn September 22, 2015 10:13 AM  

@Trimegistus - With dialectic, you are trying to change what they think. With rhetoric, you are trying to change what they feel. For an SJW, what they feel is more important to them than what they think. You cannot change those feelings with truth and accuracy.

Blogger Tank September 22, 2015 10:14 AM  

Finished the book last night. A very good read. I thought the chapter on rhetoric and what to use when was the best part.

Blogger Markku September 22, 2015 10:14 AM  

>Inquisition!

Christians are very inquisitive.

OpenID angrydrake September 22, 2015 10:15 AM  

>"I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old."

"It must suck to have suffered massive cranial trauma since then."

>"If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents."

"Does anyone here know where this basement dweller lives, so I can tell his parents to cut his internet privileges?"

>"I think you're lying."

"Nobody cares what you think." and variants are great, as noted earlier in this thread.

>"Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!"

"Stop being a pussy."

>"You look kind of rapey."

"So does your face."

Blogger Tommy Hass September 22, 2015 10:24 AM  

"Muh conspiracy theorist" has to be up there.

Blogger Gaiseric ! September 22, 2015 10:25 AM  

1. "I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old."

Could be. What in the world went wrong since then?

2. "If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents."

If I find out where you work, I'll get you arrested. And your parents too, if they can't take control of you.

3. "I think you're lying."

Nobody cares what you think, especially if you're going to be such an idiot.

4. "Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!"

You're an outright liar. Shut up.

5. "You look kind of rapey."

WTF? Are you for real?

Sometimes all that's required with really bizarre accusations is to heap scorn on them for being dishonest and stupid. Attempting to answer can go nowhere fast.

Blogger Tommy Hass September 22, 2015 10:25 AM  

"The only thing bad about them was that they were too little and too late."

Most people dont like mentally ill religious fanatics.

Blogger Tommy Hass September 22, 2015 10:28 AM  

Seriously, do you think people are gonna take you serious after attempting to justify a Christian version of jihad, in which frogs traveled over deserts to spill blood literally 2 continents away? That ain't self defence, boy.

Whats more, aren't you the geniuses that go "MUH RIGHT OF CONQUEST" to support the Jews? Checkmate, nasaran.

Blogger Markku September 22, 2015 10:29 AM  

Seriously, do you think people are gonna take you serious after attempting to justify a Christian version of jihad, in which frogs traveled over deserts to spill blood literally 2 continents away? That ain't self defence, boy.

No, it's reconquista, and hopefully we'll do better next season. The crusades were kinda meh.

Blogger LES September 22, 2015 10:31 AM  

When a SJW tells me they support government sanctioned same-sex marriage, affirmative action, etc. AND they claim to be libertarian, I direct them to this:
Freedom of Association

Blogger buzzardist September 22, 2015 10:34 AM  

@19

My try at some responses to those:

1. Well, then it's good that I am arguing with you and not 9-year-old you (because you are a moron now).

2. Find out who the troll is and report him to the police for making online threats. If he really does live at home, he will have some interesting explanations to make to the parents.

3. And I think you are a beached whale. (Insert relevant insult as needed, preferably something that hits at something the person is actually self-conscious about.) At least in my case I can point to some verifiable reality to back up what I think.

4. Is it a man or a woman making this complaint? If a man, then why are blatantly trying to use this talk of rape culture to get into women's pants? If a woman, then maybe a comment about what a delicate flower she is for a simple tweet to set her off yelling, "Rape!"

5. First, I'd stop posting pictures of myself in costumes unless they are at least as badass as Vox holding a flaming sword. Such pictures are likely to be used as sources of ridicule against you if you tangle online much. That said, again, is the comment from a man or woman? If a woman, then perhaps ask, "Ah, are you looking to be ravished then?" If it is a man, on second thought, say more or less the same thing, but in a little crude fashion: "Why? Are you looking to be raped? Because I just saw a guy in a biker costume who'd be up your alley, if you know what I mean."

Rhetoric has to be adaptable. I am sure there are better responses, and there are bound to be many more option open depending who the person on the receiving end is. At least some of these require strong follow-ups, too. But any of the above has got to be better than standing there stupefied.

OpenID angrydrake September 22, 2015 10:34 AM  

>No, it's reconquista, and hopefully we'll do better next season. The crusades were kinda meh.

Yes, because the Middle East and North Africa were always Muslim, and were never conquered from Christians.

Blogger Jack Aubrey September 22, 2015 10:37 AM  

"The only thing bad about them was that they were too little and too late."

Most people dont like mentally ill religious fanatics.

-------------------
Seriously, do you think people are gonna take you serious after attempting to justify a Christian version of jihad, in which frogs traveled over deserts to spill blood literally 2 continents away? That ain't self defence, boy.

Whats more, aren't you the geniuses that go "MUH RIGHT OF CONQUEST" to support the Jews? Checkmate, nasaran.



See? It works!

Blogger Gaiseric ! September 22, 2015 10:38 AM  

Most people dont like mentally ill religious fanatics.

The Crusaders certainly didn't. That's why they went in to roll back the mentally ill religious fanatics who came out of Arabia. Too bad that they didn't do a more thorough job of it, but clearly it was thankless work.

OpenID angrydrake September 22, 2015 10:39 AM  

@45

I know, right?

Blogger SS September 22, 2015 10:39 AM  

will you people quit triggering the resident raghead

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 10:40 AM  

@18 swiftfoxmark2
Matching rhetoric with better rhetoric is essentially beating crazy with crazier.
---

That's kind of the way I see it too. Where the crazy and crazier is just another way of saying punch back twice as hard.

I'm trying to come up of with ways to practice rhetoric.

Look for examples of rhetoric and try and learn from it and make it your own.

Think to yourself, What would Trump or Coulter say? It doesn't matter if you like either, you can still appreciate their use of rhetoric.

One of the things, maybe silly, but I think is - what would a professional wrestler reply? Someone like the Rock, Ric Flair, Jericho, etc. Those guys always use funny rhetoric to manipulate the audience.

If you want to win, look for those who use rhetoric to win, and see what's working for them, what their technique is.

Blogger Carlos Eduardo Chies September 22, 2015 10:42 AM  

I find rhetoric works well on a therapy setting also, psychotherapy is a pseudo science, but the results can be seen... and retoric play a big part on that..

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 10:48 AM  

@19 Dystopic

1. "I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old."

"Ok, I admit you beat me in the booger eating contest when we were 9."



2. "If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents."

"I hope your fat ass hasn't become skin grafted to a couch down there"


3. "I think you're lying."
"What? You think? That's progress!"

4. "Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!"

"Is that why you want to take away our guns? So women can't protect themself from rapists? Why do you support the rape culture? "


5. "You look kind of rapey." Oddly enough, not the same individual as in #4. This was in reply to a Halloween contest post where I was dressed as Beetlejuice.

Those are the ones that come to mind. There are probably more that I just can't remember. Rhetoric is difficult for me, at times.

Blogger Skylark Thibedeau September 22, 2015 10:48 AM  

"I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old." What happened? Early onset Dementia?

"If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents." I'll find out where your parents work, get them fired and you'll all be Homeless.

"I think you're lying." As Pontius Pilate said, "What is Truth"? Like Pilate I'm washing my hands of you

"Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!" I never listen to Rap Music.

"You look kind of rapey." I look like Michael Keaton not John Scalzi.

OpenID xsyq September 22, 2015 10:49 AM  

Re: The Inquisition again, a quick search shows between 10,000-2,250 deaths due to the Inquisition in total, so 3-4 orders of magnitude less than just American abortions. I imagine bringing that up and then adding something like "Is inflation really that bad or do you just hate children?" would turn around the point quite nicely. Baiting out a reference to the Crusades by adding "If that's the worst thing you can come up with about Christianity you're going to have to try harder", then following it up by comparing their death tolls (1-3 million for the crusades and 40-72 million for WW2) could be a nice two-for-one. Imply they're wishing for more deaths because every time a Christian gets involved the body count goes down. If they try to move to refute your facts then you've got an easy dialectic win, if they stay on rhetoric then they'll probably try to justify abortion or attack the crusades. Either way provides plenty of ammunition and more importantly forces them to back off from the Inquisition (or the Crusades if you start with that).

Of course, I'm still rather new to rhetoric (the only mention I had of it in school was my teacher explaining that the phrase "that's just rhetoric" made no sense because rhetoric is just the way you phrase your arguments), so any advice would be appreciated.

Blogger Student in Blue September 22, 2015 10:51 AM  

Every human is so influenced by emotions that even the most Vulcanish needs to learn rhetoric. Needs to learn, not just "is a good idea to learn".

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 10:51 AM  

51. Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 10:48 AM
@19 Dystopic

5. "You look kind of rapey." Oddly enough, not the same individual as in #4. This was in reply to a Halloween contest post where I was dressed as Beetlejuice.


"You never saw Beetlejuice? How about Star Wars or the Matrix?"


Blogger Booch Paradise September 22, 2015 10:51 AM  

Remember it doesn't need to make sense and you're goal is not disproving their point. You're demonstrating that they are less comfortable with your point. If they show that they are annoyed or don't want to talk anymore, or post more frequently in response to you than you to them, then you win.


Christians are uneducated idiots.
Christians are hypocrites.
You hate science.
Crusades! Inquisition!

It really burns you that we built civilization doesn't it?

one in five women gets raped
Making women do science isn't rape.

"I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old." They are just hurling insults, then you've already won. Responses could be 'k', 'I believe you, really.' etc

"If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents." Again, you already won. You don't really need to respond.

3. "I think you're lying." Don't focus on the fact that you are not lying, but on the fact that they are dumb. "Then check, dumbass"

4. "Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!" Depends on what the roosh article was. But don't respond to her point, make what ever Roosh's point was. For example if it was women with short hair are damaged: "You have short hair, don't you?"

5. "You look kind of rapey." Don't respond to what they said, just make your point. "Stop hitting on me".

Probably the number one to keep in mind is that heartiste's golden ratio applies, in that if you are sending more that 2/3 back to them in response to what they send you, then you are probably losing (in this case going under is fine).

Blogger David The Good September 22, 2015 10:53 AM  

"Christians want to burn women!" I was told by a woman at the Farmer's Mkt.

I replied, "Wait a minute. First of all... I am a Christian. Second of all, I really don't see anything wrong with burning the occasional woman."

I could have gone dialectic and tried to convince her that Christianity ended widow burning, etc... but the rhetorical response made her completely lose her stuff. She stared at me, mouth open.

Later in the day as I was packing up, she smiled and waved at me from across the parking lot.

Heh.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 10:53 AM  

1. "I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old."

Were you a liar then, too?

2. "If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents."

If I find out where you live, I'll send Jehovah's Witnesses.

3. "I think you're lying."

I think you're a furry with daddy issues.

4. "Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!"

Why do you hate your father? Stop supporting patricide.

5. "You look kind of rapey."

Thank you.

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 10:54 AM  

@24 buzzardist
One of the common rhetorical ploys I am seeing recently is the "I know someone who" line. Whether it is someone who had an abortion, experienced rape, died from cancer, heard a racist taunt, is gay, or whatever, the fact that this person either knows someone who has this personal experience or has had such experience personally is treated as an automatic qualification for that person's perspective and an automatic disqualification of anyone who happens to disagree.
---

Make them tell you who it is. A lot of times this is just SJW projection and there is no real person behind it.

If they can't tell you, then make fun of them for having imaginary friends at their age.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 10:55 AM  

One if five women are raped.

The other four are very fat.

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 10:59 AM  

@29 Skylark Thibedeau
Looking at the ben Carson Kerfuffle should the correct response be "Don't you believe the Constitution calls for the Separation of Mosque and State"?
----

"I see your Saudi check cleared"

Blogger njartist September 22, 2015 11:01 AM  

@19
"I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old."

That was so last year...Have you stopped wetting the bed yet?

"If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents."

Must be a pain sharing that dank crawl-space with cockroaches...

"I think you're lying."
You don't think...

"You look kind of rapey."
Sorry, I am in a relationship...

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 11:03 AM  

@39 Tommy Hass
Most people dont like mentally ill religious fanatics.
---

"I thought you were supposed to be defending islam"

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 11:04 AM  

If they can't tell you, then make fun of them for having imaginary friends at their age.

Actually just lead off with that.

"I know someone who ..."

"Your imaginary friends don't count."

Forces her on the defensive. Keep it rolling with things like:

"Naw, I'm pretty sure you just read a story in Cosmo."

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 11:05 AM  

Most people dont like mentally ill religious fanatics.

We make an exception for you, Tommy.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 11:06 AM  

"One if five women are raped.

The other four are very fat."

Actually I find...

Honey... regretting a walk of shame is not the same as rape.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 11:08 AM  

Honey... regretting a walk of shame is not the same as rape

Different strokes. While I'm sure that's effective, I prefer to avoid responding with anything that smells of truth content. No sense letting them think I actually care about what they have to say.

Blogger Chiva September 22, 2015 11:08 AM  

From @58
"If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents."

If I find out where you live, I'll send Jehovah's Witnesses.

--I am going to remember that one.

Blogger Markku September 22, 2015 11:11 AM  

People, play Crusader Kings 2.

Then tell me losing Antioch over and over again doesn't bring you a healthy appetite for crusading.

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 11:11 AM  

I liked that one, too.

OpenID basementhomebrewer September 22, 2015 11:12 AM  

"One if five women are raped."

Men find jealousy unattractive.

Blogger Markku September 22, 2015 11:13 AM  

"One if five women are raped."

Then get out of South Africa.

Blogger haus frau September 22, 2015 11:13 AM  

When quoting Saint Paul on sexual morality, particularly homosexuality, many "Christian" gays say they only follow the words of Christ and that Paul is not a legitimate apostle.
I have responded that Paul was recruited by Christ himself and accepted by the other apostles who recorded the words of Christ and wrote the New Testament and that Paul's words do not conflict with the teachings of either the New or Old Testament. I think this is purely dialectic and it does get washed right over. What is a better response?
Also Paul's words accepting slavery as a fact of life. I don't believe the New Testament supports slavery as it's theft of labor but am not sure how to build a case on that argument.

Blogger Rabbi B September 22, 2015 11:14 AM  

"I thought you were supposed to be defending islam"

@ Tommy Hass: Are you "religious/observant?" Serious question.

Blogger Markku September 22, 2015 11:16 AM  

What I say is:

Mat 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
Mat 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
Mat 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

The scribes and pharisees told us to stone you people to death, so thank your lucky stars that I believe Paul the Apostle.

Blogger JartStar September 22, 2015 11:16 AM  

If a Christian woman states they'll never date a man who struggles with porn as the man has given themselves over to lust, agree and say that men should never date women who struggle with their weight because the woman given themselves over to gluttony.

Blogger Chiva September 22, 2015 11:17 AM  

"One if five women are raped."

One what?

Ok, I know. That was pedantic.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 11:17 AM  

If they are so foolish as to use a 1 out N women are raped statistic that mentions college:

"Women are happier as housewives anyway."

Blogger Markku September 22, 2015 11:18 AM  

One what?

One high-five, I presume.

Blogger Alexander September 22, 2015 11:18 AM  

People, play Crusader Kings 2.

Then tell me losing Antioch over and over again doesn't bring you a healthy appetite for crusading.


My left eye is twitching. This time will be different.

It will also give you a unique sympathy for Eastern Europeans. Okay... we've kept the HRE at bay. We've kept the Byzantines at bay. We've kept the Russians - ALL THE RUSSIAS - at bay...

We're building some infrastructure, getting a solid tax base, establishing cultural hegemony... nice and easy does it.

Oh... Mongols showed up. Fantastic

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 11:19 AM  

When quoting Saint Paul on sexual morality, particularly homosexuality, many "Christian" gays say they only follow the words of Christ and that Paul is not a legitimate apostle.
I have responded that Paul was recruited by Christ himself and accepted by the other apostles who recorded the words of Christ and wrote the New Testament and that Paul's words do not conflict with the teachings of either the New or Old Testament. I think this is purely dialectic and it does get washed right over. What is a better response?


"I wish my superpower was picking which parts of the Bible to follow."

Blogger Zach September 22, 2015 11:19 AM  

@19

For #1: "What happened?"

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 11:20 AM  

"One if five women are raped."

"If you want people to take you seriously, walk around with a mattress."

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 11:22 AM  

I like that, Were-Puppy. Doing it my way:

"The other four weren't carrying mattresses."

Blogger Peav September 22, 2015 11:23 AM  

1. And i've been smarter than you every year since.

2. You live with your parents, why would anyone take you seriously?

3. I think you're an idiot, and only one of us is right. Or. Your thoughts do not match reality, what's the definition of insanity again?

4. Why are you crying wolf? Stop crying wolf.

5. And you look like a (insert insult here: racist/pedophile/idiot etc) shall we agree that appearances can be deceiving?

Blogger Skylark Thibedeau September 22, 2015 11:25 AM  

I think one of the most powerful uses of Rhetoric is Marc Antony's Eulogy of Caesar in Shakespeare's 'Julius Caesar'. Antony uses Rhetoric and Sarcasm to while not directly attacking the conspirators, still inflame the crowd to riot against them.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 11:27 AM  

5. Don't judge a book by the windowless van on its cover.

Blogger MidKnight (#138) September 22, 2015 11:27 AM  


@Tlu

Dude, you need to watch some more Dwayne The Rock Johnson.
"I think you're-"
"IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT YOU THINK."


You can put scare quotes around "think"

Blogger Sensei September 22, 2015 11:31 AM  

When quoting Saint Paul on sexual morality, particularly homosexuality, many "Christian" gays say they only follow the words of Christ and that Paul is not a legitimate apostle... What is a better response?

"I didn't know the Jeffersonian Bible was still in print."

Blogger Stilicho #0066 September 22, 2015 11:32 AM  

"1. I was smarter than you when I was nine years old."

Yet you still haven't stopped wetting the bed.

Blogger Daniel September 22, 2015 11:32 AM  

"Why do you hate the poor?"

"I'm an atheist and I don't need God to keep from raping and murdering."

"Women should be encouraged into STEM."

Blogger darrenl September 22, 2015 11:34 AM  

I've posted this before, but I'll put it here again.

In response to an anti-Christian Facebook post on same-sex "marriage":

"Wow. You must really hate gay people"

Blogger Sensei September 22, 2015 11:34 AM  

"1. I was smarter than you when I was nine years old."

"How appropriate, you fight like a cow."

Blogger VFM #0202 September 22, 2015 11:35 AM  

@12 Nate: amongst ourselves, let's stick to dialectic.

"Aspie", "Munchausen" are pleasingly symmetric instances of cutting off one tail of a distribution and giving it a name. It has information content, it has its uses, but the tired old disqualify dance is tired, and old.

As always, the validity of a proposition is independent of the speaker.

Controlling one's inner anything is sound tactical advice. Whether to let a lie stand and thereby become background truth for the undecided spectators is more about strategy. I've adopted a principle of confronting untruth forthwith. Yes, of course that makes me an asshole. But what's the down side? I.don't.care.

Blogger Student in Blue September 22, 2015 11:37 AM  

@Daniel

"Women should be encouraged into STEM."

"Well it obviously hasn't worked. Why are you trying the same thing over and over again, hoping it will work? Literal insanity."

Blogger Stilicho #0066 September 22, 2015 11:40 AM  

"NA*ALT"

No.

"What do you mean?"

No.

"So you are saying..."

No.

"You're a horrible no good badthinking evil whitemale opressor!..."

No.

Drives them (even further) over the edge every time

Blogger Feather Blade September 22, 2015 11:41 AM  

I'm actually keeping the "one in five" meme, as well as its corollaries "rape is about power not lust" and "a woman's dress/age/appearance/behavior have no correlation with her chances of being raped" in my back pocket, just in case my armaments are insufficiently concealed and I get hauled in for questioning.

Blogger Feather Blade September 22, 2015 11:45 AM  

@73 Also Paul's words accepting slavery as a fact of life.

"What, you think they should have just killed their war prisoners?"

Blogger Daniel September 22, 2015 11:49 AM  

Christians are uneducated idiots.

We follow the teaching of a carpenter whom He calls sheep, Captain Obvious. What's that make you?

Christians are hypocrites.
Hypocrites hate hypocrites. You gave your game away.

You hate science.
You think a method of study can be hated. Did you volunteer for a lot of experiments in college?

Crusades! Inquisition!
Good ideas that didn't have enough follow-through.

Anyone who says they follow Jesus' words and not Paul's merely need to be reminded that Jesus said "Go, for Paul is a chosen instrument of mine to carry my name before the Gentiles and kings and the sons of Israel."

You don't follow Paul, you don't follow Jesus, liar.

Blogger Dystopic September 22, 2015 11:49 AM  

@automatthew:

Your responses were genius. I especially enjoyed these two:

If I find out where you live, I'll send Jehovah's Witnesses.

3. "I think you're lying."

I think you're a furry with daddy issues.

4. "Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!"

Why do you hate your father? Stop supporting patricide.

Blogger Emmanuel Mateo-Morales September 22, 2015 11:55 AM  

I don't know if its effective, but whenever I see an old fart cheer-leading for Islam, I like to insinuate they have a smack cock, especially if they're old and godless too.

Sort of like how I did to John J Xenakis in one of his most recent columns on Breitbart.

Does anyone here think my response was lacking a little something to really drive home the point than John's a stupid, old pollack or greasy greek bastard or whatever the fuck he is?

John, baby, honey, darling. Please, take your one-a-day and prosac, sweet heart, because what you just said about Ben Carson and JFK is a text-book false equivalency even a kindergartner could spot from the nearest galactic supercluster to ours. I know senility strikes like a Tsar bomba on a person the older they are, especially if they're a godless heel like yourself, but come on you cuckservative cad. Look at the early history of Islam, its interactions with the West, its current history, and what the Koran and the Hadiths command of true believers, and then try and keep a straight face and tell me that having a true muslim president wouldn't be a major stepping stone if not the final stepping stone into having roving Jihadi conversion squads with Sharia governmental blessing bringing atheist losers like you onto your knees and forcing you to recite the shahada or die, especially since we know that you're such an atheist coward you would recite the shahada.

Blogger Dystopic September 22, 2015 11:56 AM  

@darrenl: "Wow. You must really hate gay people"

A. Not all of them. Just you.

Blogger Cail Corishev September 22, 2015 11:57 AM  

1. "I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old." I didn't even know what to say to that.

"My left ass cheek is smarter than you now, so what happened?"

"I think you're lying."

"I've seen no sign yet that you 'think' at all."

"You look kind of rapey."

This one was flirting. Next time try: "Play your cards right, babe, and you never know." Or if you do not want: "Get over yourself."

"Christians only care about the unborn and won't help them after"

"I can introduce you to Christians who help struggling mothers and the babies they don't kill. Lie harder, liar." (I know this one includes a fact, so it's not pure rhetoric, but it's a fact more people should hear, so I think it's worth slipping in there.)

Blogger Russell (106) September 22, 2015 11:59 AM  

@19 Dystopic

1. "Ok." Or just ignore it.
2. "Ok." Or the JW threat.
3 and 4. "Too bad being crazy only works when you're attractive."
5. "No, I won't sleep with you. Stop asking."

If you are on Twitter, watch Vox toy with Charlie Martin.

Twitter, I've found, hones laconic responses and rhetoric because of the 140 character limit.

Blogger Gaiseric ! September 22, 2015 12:00 PM  

Crusades! Inquisition!
Good ideas that didn't have enough follow-through.


I really like agree and amplify when it's appropriate. Always a good rhetorical call.

Blogger Dystopic September 22, 2015 12:02 PM  

@buzzardist: "5. First, I'd stop posting pictures of myself in costumes unless they are at least as badass as Vox holding a flaming sword. Such pictures are likely to be used as sources of ridicule against you if you tangle online much. That said, again, is the comment from a man or woman? If a woman, then perhaps ask, "Ah, are you looking to be ravished then?" If it is a man, on second thought, say more or less the same thing, but in a little crude fashion: "Why? Are you looking to be raped? Because I just saw a guy in a biker costume who'd be up your alley, if you know what I mean."

A good point. I will delete such pictures, and not use them in the future. It's disturbing that an innocent Halloween picture drives people to say things like this, but it's probably best not to give them fuel for ridicule. Nothing is off limits to them. The personal is political.

As to your question, this was actually a man who said this. It was part of why I found it so disturbing. Your reply was good. I'll try to remember that in case I encounter him again.

Blogger Matamoros September 22, 2015 12:04 PM  

If I find out where you live, I'll send Jehovah's Witnesses.

And the Mormons, don't forget the Mormons.

I don't believe the New Testament supports slavery as it's theft of labor

It is not. It is the purchase of the life long right to the proceeds of their labor in return for life long welfare - housing, food, clothing, etc. You are looking at it wrong.

Blogger Weouro September 22, 2015 12:08 PM  

I've been handed, "Why are you so angry?" or "I hope you can find a way out of your anger" a couple times recently. They usually wrap it up in condescending sympathy. What I've tried in response is getting them visibly angry and then saying "U mad?" Or saying "thanks but" and then restating the point like, "thanks but the black community really is the most homicidal subculture in the world."

Blogger Greg September 22, 2015 12:10 PM  

"If a Christian woman states they'll never date a man who struggles with porn as the man has given themselves over to lust, agree and say that men should never date women who struggle with their weight because the woman given themselves over to gluttony."

Great retort but for St. Peter's sake learn pronouns. "They" refers to plural, what you mean to say is "If a Christian woman states she'll...man has given himself..."

Blogger Danby September 22, 2015 12:13 PM  

"I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old."
So, what the hell happened? Brain injury?

"If I find out where you work, I'll get you fired. And, haha, you can't do anything back because I live with my parents."
Whatever, sport. Make sure you wear pants when you leave the house this time.

"I think you're lying."
I think you're a child molester. What does that have to do with anything?

"Why are you supporting rape culture? Stop supporting rape!"
Why are you supporting slavery? Stop supporting slavery!

"You look kind of rapey."
You look kind of pederasty. or, alternatively
You look kind of unable-to-even-get-rapedy

Blogger Booch Paradise September 22, 2015 12:16 PM  

Man, everyone missed it.

You look kind of rapey.
Who bitch this is?

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 12:17 PM  

@91 Daniel
"I'm an atheist and I don't need God to keep from raping and murdering."

"The rest of us need God to keep athiests from raping and murdering."

Blogger AmyJ September 22, 2015 12:21 PM  

@automatthew

"I wish my superpower was picking which parts of the Bible to follow."

I'm stealing this and never giving it back. Perfect.

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 12:22 PM  

On women in stem:

"You're in favor of brainwashing?"

Blogger John Wright September 22, 2015 12:24 PM  

@39 Tommy Hass

Has this to say about the Crusades: "Most people don't like mentally ill religious fanatics."

An interesting way to depict Richard the Lionheart and Godffrey of Bouillon.

I suppose you Muslim-kissers will do anything and say anything to get in good with your homies, the Imams.

No doubt you are hoping for a well situated job as a well oiled bend-over catamite in the harem of a Sultan when they take over? He might interpret your dismissal of his religion in the wrong way, however. I should show more circumspection were I you.

Blogger Emmanuel Mateo-Morales September 22, 2015 12:32 PM  

@115

Ha! I wish I had said that to John J. Xenakis instead of what I actually said. The jerk seriously tried to equate the controversy of JFK becoming president because he was catholic to what Ben Carson said against a Muslims becoming president.

It's like he's never heard a false equivalency before.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 12:33 PM  

"While I'm sure that's effective, I prefer to avoid responding with anything that smells of truth content. "

The beauty in it is you've just called them a slut... and most of them won't realize you called them a slut until a few minutes later. probably after the conversation is over.

Blogger Feather Blade September 22, 2015 12:40 PM  

Speaking of rhetoric, particularly re : Planned Parenthood, how have we missed telling supporters that "fetal stem cells cause cancer"?

Blogger guest September 22, 2015 12:46 PM  

Progressives don't mind being called a Jew hater. Every one of these I have talked to, express hatred for the Jews on some level. What always amazes me is the Progressive Jew. The Hollywood types.

Blogger guest September 22, 2015 12:46 PM  

Progressives don't mind being called a Jew hater. Every one of these I have talked to, express hatred for the Jews on some level. What always amazes me is the Progressive Jew. The Hollywood types.

Blogger Daniel September 22, 2015 12:46 PM  

Women in STEM:

"You're in favor of brainwashing?"

That's a multi-stepper, but ok. They'll say "If it gets the job done, yes."

"Cheaper to convince men already in STEM to identify as women."

"That's sexist."

"Stop hating Caitlyn Jenner. That isn't funny."

Blogger Durandel Almiras September 22, 2015 12:50 PM  

1 in 5 women sexually molested in college
We need feminism because women were/are/still oppressed
Christianity is for stupid people/losers
Christianity isn't true
There is no God
Men and women are equal in everything
Fat women are beautiful
It's wrong to judge
We have to allow immigrants in
Immigration/diversity strengthens our nation/people
But he starving children (immigrant crisis but it gets applied to others)
Single mothers are heroes

I'm sure I'll come up with more later.

Blogger JartStar September 22, 2015 12:51 PM  

@109 Do you do this in person or only online? Serious question.

Blogger Patrick Kelly September 22, 2015 12:52 PM  

"You look kind of rapey."

Wait, are you hitting on me?

No thanks, your not my type.

Blogger Geoff September 22, 2015 12:53 PM  

I know that there is more to rhetoric than hilarious comeback lines, but based on many of the responses above, it does seems to be play a rather large part!

Blogger Daniel September 22, 2015 12:56 PM  

Speaking of rhetoric, particularly re : Planned Parenthood, how have we missed telling supporters that "fetal stem cells cause cancer"?

Too many jumps and it relies on a demonstration (dialectic).

Tell her instead that some rogue nurse at Planned Parenthood could very easily have sold video footage of its past patients for stock porn images. Could you imagine if a woman's most intimate choice has been resold for sexual purposes?

Blogger Rabbi B September 22, 2015 12:57 PM  

". . . .hilarious comeback lines"

Nothing bites harder than humor. People don't like to be laughed at much. And most of the SJW-types are pretty humorless for the most part.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 12:58 PM  

@108 Weouro: I've been handed, "Why are you so angry?" or "I hope you can find a way out of your anger" a couple times recently.

Simple and infuriating response:

"You're projecting."

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:02 PM  

@117 Nate,

Yeah, but with my tactic, I'm implying she's fat and unrapeable. And doing a reductio with the idea that all men are rapists. And making a callback to the jokes about "3 out of 4 dentists". And just generally refusing to take her seriously.

Blogger natschuster September 22, 2015 1:03 PM  

I've had some fun with, "I know you are, but what am I." Or

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 1:05 PM  

It's wrong to judge
Stop judging me.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:06 PM  

I know that there is more to rhetoric than hilarious comeback lines, but based on many of the responses above, it does seems to be play a rather large part!

Mostly this is because the examples we have so far are very unsophisticated, sub-midwit level. These interlocutors are not shrewd.

Blogger Cail Corishev September 22, 2015 1:07 PM  

"Women should be encouraged into STEM."

"Why do you want to force women into jobs they hate?"

Or: "Why do you hate women?"

Or: "Why?"

Or: "No."

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:09 PM  

Women should be encouraged into STEM.

"Let women make their own choices."

Blogger Cail Corishev September 22, 2015 1:09 PM  

"One in five women are raped."

"Then I haven't been getting my share."

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:09 PM  

""Aspie", "Munchausen" are pleasingly symmetric instances of cutting off one tail of a distribution and giving it a name. It has information content, it has its uses, but the tired old disqualify dance is tired, and old.

As always, the validity of a proposition is independent of the speaker."

Bro... Do you even Reading?

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:11 PM  

One in five women are raped in college.

"I don't think that can be right. Under Title IX, it should really be a lot more."

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:12 PM  

Honestly... do I have to explain this? Do I really have to explain why telling someone to control the aspie tendency that they already admitted to having is not disqualification?

OR...

Maybe we need to have a basic reading comprehension class here at VP.

Today's threads certainly make it seem so.

Blogger Josh September 22, 2015 1:13 PM  

These threads have gone full retard

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:15 PM  

@122 Durandel:


Christianity is for stupid people/losers
Christianity isn't true
There is no God
Fat women are beautiful


These aren't so much rhetoric as baldly stupid counterfactuals. Generic response:

"If you stand up on your tippy-toes and say that louder, it's possible someone will believe you."

Blogger Thomas Davidsmeier September 22, 2015 1:16 PM  

@57

What is this? Why does it work? I've observed it repeatedly with my high school students. Say something outrageous, don't back down but do move on, and you come out way further ahead than when you started your interaction with them.

Makes my head hurt, but works amazingly.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:17 PM  

amongst ourselves, let's stick to dialectic.

You probably never played "Flinch" with your friends as a boy.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:20 PM  

What is this? Why does it work? I've observed it repeatedly with my high school students. Say something outrageous, don't back down but do move on, and you come out way further ahead than when you started your interaction with them.

It's about frame control, to descend into jargon. By responding to a super-cereal piece of mindless clap-trap with something outrageous and funny, you have just changed the terrain on which you're fighting to terrain you control.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:26 PM  

Single mothers are heroes

* No woman is a hero to her latest boyfriend.
* They heroically look away while their daughters are molested.
* You misspelled "whores"
* Naw, most of them would look pretty bad in spandex.

Blogger Josh September 22, 2015 1:34 PM  

"Single mothers are heroes"

Hero like the sammich?

Blogger Unknown September 22, 2015 1:35 PM  

@107 And the Mormons, don't forget the Mormons.

I suppose you could do that if you were actually capable of finding them.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:37 PM  

Hero like the sammich?

Similar in shape, at least.

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 1:38 PM  

Makes my head hurt, but works amazingly.

Makes my head hurt, too.

I can't read rhetoric without thinking everyone sounds stupid unless there's something particularly witty.

I honestly can't tell Vox is winning in these exchanges.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:40 PM  

"
Yeah, but with my tactic, I'm implying she's fat and unrapeable."

see I don't like to directly do that. I like to let their own bizarre solipsism do that part for me. It plays up the puppet on a string aspect for the audience and also really makes them feel dirty later. My goal is always to make them experience the maximum possible pain... later.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:42 PM  

"I honestly can't tell Vox is winning in these exchanges."

social interaction is hard. You should avoid it.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:44 PM  

"Make me a sandwich" and "MOOOOOOOOOO" are excellent rhetorical options when dealing with women.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:45 PM  

CM is a chick.

Blogger Josh September 22, 2015 1:45 PM  

"Make me a sandwich" and "MOOOOOOOOOO" are excellent rhetorical options when dealing with women.

Don't forget "you look tired"

Blogger Josh September 22, 2015 1:46 PM  

CM is a chick.

Why hasn't she offered to make us sammiches?

Blogger Geoff September 22, 2015 1:47 PM  

CM, check out VD's last exchange on Twitter:

"We didn't make any fat jokes, your mother did."

I'm crying.

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 1:47 PM  

social interaction is hard. You should avoid it.

Explains so much about my life.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:47 PM  

another favorite of mine for guys... I used this recently on twitter to shut a troll down..

"No... you can't suck my dick. Sorry dude... I'm not into guys."

2 hours later he's still jabbering...

"Dude.. seriously.. I'm sorry... but you can't blow me. Find someone else."

after the third or fourth time they realize that all their going to get is the same thing every time they say something... they shut up.

and... for the aspies reading... for them... shutting up is an act of submission.

Blogger Stingray September 22, 2015 1:49 PM  

Don't forget "you look tired"

This is brutal.

A common rhetorical attack on par with the single mom nonsense is, "Moms have the most difficult job in the world."

. . . Uh huh.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:50 PM  

When someone is not capable of or willing to engage in honest discourse, it is appropriate to treat them as ill mannered juveniles. As we are not so placed as to be able to beat them into submission with a big fucking stick, we must resort to blunt rhetoric.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:51 PM  

"CM is a chick."

Tits or GTFO

Blogger D. Lane (#0067) September 22, 2015 1:51 PM  

I honestly can't tell Vox is winning in these exchanges.

Look at the impact (RTs, favs, etc.). Rhetoric is about impact. The winner in online exchanges on Twitter is whoever generates the most clicks. Which, in this exchange, is Vox. You'll note that VD has ~2x the followers of CM but his impact is more than 42:1.

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 1:51 PM  

Geoff, that did make me laugh.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 1:53 PM  

Let your rhetoric be as the bears the LORD sent Elisha.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:53 PM  

Honestly... CM... its like someone watching the wimbledon finals... and then saying.. "It doesn't make any sense to me. All I see are two people swing stupid rackets at a stupid ball and running around like fools. Look at how hot and sweaty they are. and in front of all those people? They're both losers to me."

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 1:56 PM  

"Let your rhetoric be as the bears the LORD sent Elisha."

Possible response to rhetoric:

Least effective: dialect.

more effective: harsher rhetoric.

most effective: Bears.

Blogger Josh September 22, 2015 1:56 PM  

They're both losers to me.

They're also not classy

Blogger CM September 22, 2015 1:58 PM  

Honestly... CM... its like someone watching the wimbledon finals... and then saying.. "It doesn't make any sense to me. All I see are two people swing stupid rackets at a stupid ball and running around like fools. Look at how hot and sweaty they are. and in front of all those people? They're both losers to me."

Yup. It is. If you can't see the ball, they do look like idiots. This ball is more abstract than the tennis ball. Its just taking some thought adjustment to see the ball.

I'll get there... eventually. Until then, I'll read and ask lots of questions and accept sounding stupid and vapid.

Blogger Unknown September 22, 2015 2:02 PM  

Your just a tool of Wall Street.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 2:03 PM  

"Until then, I'll read and ask lots of questions and accept sounding stupid and vapid."

no its ok... with an attitude like that we can help you. The ones we can't help are the ones who embrace their own retardery like Asher.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 2:06 PM  

The ones we can't help are the ones who embrace their own retardery like Asher.

"I don't perceive what you perceive, therefore it doesn't exist."

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 2:10 PM  

Here's an old Asher-laden thread.

http://voxday.blogspot.com/2013/03/mailvox-relevance-of-kuhns-revolutions.html

Blogger Anonymous September 22, 2015 2:10 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger mistaben September 22, 2015 2:14 PM  

@146 I can help with that.

Blogger Dystopic September 22, 2015 2:16 PM  

@CM: "I can't read rhetoric without thinking everyone sounds stupid unless there's something particularly witty. I honestly can't tell Vox is winning in these exchanges."

I go by laugh factor. For instance, watching Charlie self destruct in Vox's Twitter feed is funny. And I'm at work, so I'm trying to stifle the laughs. To me, that means Vox is winning. Charlie's replies are increasingly desperate and not amusing.

Since it's all based on feelings, emotions and other such stuff, that's what you have to go by. The comment earlier about retweets and favorites is instructive. Those are the only real metrics you have. But even those can lead you astray sometimes. If you go into a forum run by Progressives, your posts won't be particularly popular even if you are winning the rhetorical battle. The best way to tell who is winning is to see who *seems* more desperate, who is pleading and reacting instead of dominating.

Basically, who is completing the OODA loop faster.

But that's rhetoric for you. Sometimes you don't know who the loser is until they self destruct in spectacular fashion.

Blogger Anonymous September 22, 2015 2:19 PM  

I think the important thing is to strike a conciliatory tone so that mutually respectful dialogue can continue.

"Don't judge!"

Judging judgment is judgment, Judy.

"Turn the other cheek"

Jesus didn't mean butts, fag.

"Christians are uneducated idiots."

Education majors are idiots.

"Christians are hypocrites."

Christians give more to charity than atheists.

"You hate science."

Christian white men did all the important science.

Peer review ended science, because narrow-minded consensus idiots like you.

"Crusades!"

Learn 2 map.

"Inquisition!"

Unexpected inquisitive - which kills more, Inquisition or children's bicycles? Who invented burnt human sacrifices?

"people promoting illegal immigration/amnesty"

I agree. White people should take over Africa.

"you're not a real follower of Christ"

Jesus hated anyone holier than him. Do you support women's lib, anti-slavery, or anti-racism? Jesus hates you.

"One if five women are raped."

Black men rape or sexually assault 100 American white women per day. White men on black women: zero. Are you racist? Stop talking about rape.

"I was smarter than you when I was 9 years old."

Sounds like you still are. Nine.

"I think you're lying."

You're projecting.

"Why are you supporting rape culture?"

By raping our culture, do you mean importing millions of 3rd world immigrants? Or the actual physical rape they do once they arrive?

[reply whatever]

Ok mudshark. Fatties need love too.

"You look kind of rapey."

You look kind of divorce rapey.

"I know someone who"

I know someone who lacks the brain cells for dialectic so she status whores with anecdotes like a bonobo slut.

"Muh conspiracy theorist"

Name any significant historical event that didn't involve a conspiracy.

"Wow. You must really hate gay people"

Do you molest children?

"We need feminism because women were/are/still oppressed"

If the oppression stops, how will you cum?

[some reply]

Hyenas are matriarchal. They are ugly and have giant floppy clit-dicks. Lions are patriarchs. They are beautiful and have sex for days.

"Christianity is for stupid people/losers"

Prisoners are disproportionately low-church atheist.

"Christianity isn't true"

Josh McDowell, A Ready Defense.

"There is no God"

Prove it.

"Men and women are equal in everything"

Equality doesn't exist in nature.

"Fat women are beautiful"

Even blind men prefer .7 WHR.

"Immigration/diversity strengthens our nation/people"

Environmentalists protect fragile ecosystems from diversity. Idiot.

"But he starving children"

Low IQ must starve.

"Single mothers are heroes"

For spreading her legs without thinking it through? Or for not aborting? Or for doing a great job? Because they don't.

"Moms have the most difficult job in the world."

Some of these women are bending over at the waist and pushing a tape into the VCR.

In Mala Fide,
Koanic

Blogger Danby September 22, 2015 2:19 PM  

@168 Unknown
Your just a tool of Wall Street
"You're just a lazy thief."

Blogger Rabbi B September 22, 2015 2:21 PM  

"I can't read rhetoric without thinking everyone sounds stupid unless there's something particularly witty. I honestly can't tell Vox is winning in these exchanges."

It's really quite simple. If Vox is tweeting, he is winning. If Vox is not tweeting, he is winning.

When is Vox not winning?

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 2:22 PM  

"Here's an old Asher-laden thread."

oh God... I had forgotten about that...

The train is fine y'all. The train is fine.

Blogger Josh September 22, 2015 2:23 PM  

When is Vox not winning?

When he's watching the Vikings.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 2:24 PM  

Koanic, please change your display name to something other than "Anonymous".

Blogger Anonymous September 22, 2015 2:29 PM  

Good answers/attitudes for rabbits in non-antagonistic situations:

Your fear is not my emergency.

Speak reason or be silent.

- Koanic

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 2:36 PM  

He's not anonymous. He's Koanic. Stand down matthew.

Blogger automatthew September 22, 2015 2:37 PM  

Setting one's Google display name to "Anonymous" is a calculated stance. I am not amused.

Blogger mistaben September 22, 2015 2:39 PM  

OT: Now NRO has joined Salon and US Army in promoting the polite overlooking of the rape of little boys.

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 2:44 PM  

"Setting one's Google display name to "Anonymous" is a calculated stance. I am not amused."

bahahahahah

I am.

Blogger Rabbi B September 22, 2015 2:44 PM  

I am not amused.

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 2:50 PM  

"One in five women are raped."

"Oh, are you talking about Game of Thrones?"

Blogger Nate September 22, 2015 2:50 PM  

""Oh, are you talking about Game of Thrones?""

that's like 37 out of 39

Blogger Danby September 22, 2015 3:02 PM  

...that's like 37 out of 39...

More like 45 out of 39

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 3:23 PM  

@122 Durandel Almiras

Ok, I gotta try on these :P


1 in 5 women sexually molested in college

"Then you must keep them out of college, or you are War on Women!"


We need feminism because women were/are/still oppressed

"1 out of 5 women find your breath oppressive"
"How dare you speak up for women!"



Christianity is for stupid people/losers

"Why do you hate stupid people? Why do you hate losers?"


Christianity isn't true

"4 out of 5 pedobear hope you are right"



There is no God

"The imperfection is yours"
"Prove it"


Men and women are equal in everything

"Carefully recount the number of entrances, n00b"



Fat women are beautiful

"When they are no longer fat"
"You've obviously been in the flour again"

It's wrong to judge

"I want to apologize to any I might have offended, except for you"
"Then why do we have a Supreme Court?"

We have to allow immigrants in
"Cool, I'll tell them all a party at your house"
"So you're the reason I have to dial 1 for English? Asshole."


Immigration/diversity strengthens our nation/people

"Wake up, it's not 1984 anymore"
"WTF, are you some kind of HR fag?"
"Wait, are you the famous Lucy from that old 'My Name is Pancho' thing?"


But he starving children
"If you aren't gonna feed my kids RIGHT NOW, STFU"
"They got plenty of food in their home country"

Single mothers are heroes
"Since when does getting boned make you a hero?"


Blogger James Dixon September 22, 2015 3:27 PM  

> ...aren't you the geniuses that go "MUH RIGHT OF CONQUEST" to support the Jews?

Right of conquest has to be maintained, Tommy. You have to keep it.

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 3:27 PM  

"You look kind of rapey."

"Kindly remove your beer goggles, i'm not available."

Blogger Daniel September 22, 2015 3:27 PM  

Men and women are equal.

Except in raping.

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 3:28 PM  

And the Mormons, don't forget the Mormons.

"My Morons are Jehovah Witnesses"

Blogger Were-Puppy September 22, 2015 3:31 PM  

@168 Unknown
Your just a tool of Wall Street.

"Aren't you supposed to occupying a Dumpster somewhere?"

Blogger Koanic September 22, 2015 3:38 PM  

"Setting one's Google display name to "Anonymous" is a calculated stance. I am not amused."

Shall we plumb the devious depths? AYE AYE CAPTAIN, FULL SPERG AHEAD!

IfiguredthatVoxwouldprobablyreenablemypreferredname/urlformat,andalsodidn'treallyknowwhetherIneededtostartabloggerblogtohaveaprofile,andalsowasmildlyconcernedaboutanidentityleakfromrealname->koanic.

gaaaaaaaassp...

Moreover,yourimaginaryfrienddefenserisksbackfiringandsmacksvaguelyoflyingbyassertingthingsyoudon'tactuallyknow.

ASPIE PWNED

Blogger M.S. September 22, 2015 5:06 PM  

I remember seeing Vox do this one. Anytime they mention "Stop [African country's] anti-gay law!", respond with "A privileged white person telling black people how they should run their country? Sounds like colonialism."

Blogger haus frau September 22, 2015 5:13 PM  

"One I. Five women are getting raped"

Where is this quintet and do they do private parties?

OpenID ymarsakar September 22, 2015 5:22 PM  

Back when some county elected clerk was trying to get her name off the homo marriage certificates her office has to issue out, she got put in jail by this one judge. The Left likes to use that whole illegal thing to shut people up, it's convenient for them. They did it to various anti Muslim film makers as well, assuming Islam didn't behead them first.

During the Leftist onslaught defense of Planned Profit and the human farming of the livestock babies and organ selling from live births, they brought various topics up in order to divert from the horror of the Left.

That and plus some other people started talking about how the Planned Profit undercover sting videos were "illegal".

So as a counter, I kept poking those people with "the Rule of Law instituted by white men, that you use to declare this illegal huh". Their zombie reflexes fried a little bit at that, since I don't think they were used to this. They wanted to declare that the film producers were "illegal" and thus should be "imprisoned".

It's a fault with their side's strategic and tactical operations. They fund black thugs in cities like Baltimore or Ferguson to make them riot using the "reverends" for cash trick, then they go and use the power of the gov gun to imprison people to shut them up. Those two things cannot be reconciled, no matter how smart a Leftist thinks they are at doublethink.

Later on they'll start talking about gun control to control all the crime, riots, and stuff they created, but they won't allow criminals to be imprisoned or executed. It's complete mental submission on the part of these zombies towards Leftist religious and social authority.

Blogger David-093 September 22, 2015 5:32 PM  

"1 in 5 women sexually molested in college"

And the other 4 were ugly.

"We need feminism because women were/are/still oppressed"

Have you ever read 50 Shades of Grey?

"Christianity is for stupid people/losers"

Atheism is for ugly basement dwelling neckbeards who like to jerk off into an old tube sock.

"Christianity isn't true"

That proves it! 2000 years of the smartest men in history saying otherwise is no match for random internet guy!

"There is no God"

Well there's only way to find out. Let us know how it goes.

"Men and women are equal in everything"

You know better than to try doing math, sweetheart.

"Fat women are beautiful"

Compared to what? Elephants?

"It's wrong to judge"

Its wrong to be a pussy.

"We have to allow immigrants in"

Awesome, let's start with your place.

"Immigration/diversity strengthens our nation/people"

But not your all-white neighborhood, apparently. Funny that.

"But he starving children (immigrant crisis but it gets applied to others)"

This wouldn't be happening if we still had colonialism.

"Single mothers are heroes"

Then why do their kids always turn out to be drug addicts?

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