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Sunday, September 13, 2015

The Toad of Tor calls John Wright a liar

Another reminder that SJWs always lie:
This is all fine, but have you heard @pnh or @tnielsenhayden deny it? Any of it? Hmmm? @jenphalian
    — Steven Brust ‏@StevenBrust September 11, 2015

@tnielsenhayden @pnh @jenphalian As for JCW, um, if he tells me it's summer, I'm gonna play the odds and grab my snow shovel.
    — Steven Brust ‏@StevenBrust September 11, 2015

@StevenBrust @pnh @jenphalian Apparently JCW's unique version of Christianity doesn't include the bit about not bearing false witness.
    — tnielsenhayden (@tnielsenhayden) September 11, 2015

     @StevenBrust @pnh @jenphalian Here's a denial: Patrick didn't even raise his voice to Jagi Lamplighter. JCW fabricated the entire story.
    — tnielsenhayden (@tnielsenhayden) September 12, 2015

    @StevenBrust @pnh @jenphalian Lamplighter's the one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct.
    — tnielsenhayden (@tnielsenhayden) September 12, 2015 
Now, I wonder why PNH suddenly has the Toad of Tor out lying on his behalf and attempting to change the narrative concerning the abusive and unprofessional behavior of the Senior Editor of Tor Books at Sasquan last month?

It appears to me that Tor Books has given Mr. Wright yet another legitimate cause for complaint about the Nielsen Haydens, as they are publicly attacking both his reputation and his wife now. And in the unlikely event that PNH isn't hiding behind TNH, someone should really tell him to get his toad on a leash, assuming he can find a collar big enough to circumnavigate that swollen throat.

As for me, it's one more reason to continue to refrain from buying anything that is published by Tor Books.

Labels:

97 Comments:

Blogger Cataline Sergius September 13, 2015 7:11 AM  

MacMillan can't be happy with Patrick's Clown Show.

"You don't go to an awards dinner to scream at authors, Patrick. You used to know that, honey."

Blogger Cataline Sergius September 13, 2015 7:14 AM  

@StevenBrust @pnh @jenphalian Here's a denial: Patrick didn't even raise his voice to Jagi Lamplighter. JCW fabricated the entire story.

Queen Toadina managed to pack all three laws into less than a 144 characters. I have to say I'm impressed.

Blogger Durandel Almiras September 13, 2015 7:15 AM  

liars gonna lie

Blogger Durandel Almiras September 13, 2015 7:22 AM  

I wonder if what helps SJWs get away with their behavior is that normal people are unable to relate to them, so they apply a template of normal behavior to the SJWs and gloss over the signs. Kinda how psychopaths or pedophiles tend to go unnoticed under most people's radar because again, healthy people can't relate, so they project normal forms of behavior onto them rather than see snake before them.

Blogger The Original Hermit September 13, 2015 7:22 AM  

Even if knew the Nielsen's weren't obviously lying, I find it beyond credulity to even think that W̶e̶n̶d̶y̶ ̶V̶a̶r̶o̶v̶i̶c̶h̶ Jagi Lamplighter could behave like that.

Blogger Laramie Hirsch September 13, 2015 7:24 AM  

Hideous behavior from Tor's representatives. Hideous.

Anonymous Lulabelle (68) September 13, 2015 7:26 AM  

These people are utterly odious. I can't imagine what it must be like to work in the same office/company with them. It's probably like a bitchy sorority, times 10.

Blogger James Dixon September 13, 2015 7:34 AM  

> Lamplighter's the one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct.

As if that wouldn't have been trumpeted to the skies by the SJW's the moment it happened and ever since. Yes, she's lying.

Meredith used to converse with these people back in the rec.sf.written days. They weren't this bad then. What happened to them over the past 30 years?

Blogger VD September 13, 2015 7:35 AM  

What happened to them over the past 30 years?

They came to believe they had unassailable power.

Blogger James Dixon September 13, 2015 7:44 AM  

> They came to believe they had unassailable power.

Apparently so. And as the saying goes, power corrupts.

This rant by Scalzi was also found at that link: http://whatever.scalzi.com/2015/09/12/todays-twitter-rant-91215/

In which he says the following: "If you say that ANYONE ELSE needs to have their fan cred established by anyone else before they can be a fan, I will also laugh at you."

So we have Scalzi's word for it that we're all fans again now. I wonder how much that will be worth the next time someone claims we're not.

Blogger Mint September 13, 2015 7:52 AM  

I should learn to not read File 770 comments section. Bad to my peace of mind.

Blogger Salt September 13, 2015 7:52 AM  

@10 Incredible. The TruFan meme is dead. Scalzi has issued its death certificate.

Blogger SciVo September 13, 2015 7:56 AM  

I'm very disappointed in Steven Brust. I like his books, but his judgment is lacking.

Blogger Dexter September 13, 2015 8:01 AM  

I like his books, but his judgment is lacking.

Feh. The hip anti-hero shtick got old fast.

Anonymous Ain September 13, 2015 8:08 AM  

Their professionalism when compared to that of John C. Wright's should make them feel ashamed.

Blogger James Dixon September 13, 2015 8:11 AM  

> Their professionalism when compared to that of John C. Wright's should make them feel ashamed.

You've got to have something before you can be ashamed of the quality of it.

OpenID crash September 13, 2015 8:15 AM  

Is this a reach too far?

There must be witnesses to the event that can contradict Nielsen Hayden's story.

Blogger Cataline Sergius September 13, 2015 8:15 AM  

@13

It surprises you that this is an SJW?

Sorry, for the repost. My link was malformed. It had contact with Stephen Brust.

Blogger Mom September 13, 2015 8:20 AM  

@19Cataline Sergius
E-w-w!

Anonymous LurkingPuppy September 13, 2015 8:32 AM  

@17: There must be witnesses to the event that can contradict Nielsen Hayden's story.

Now that the SJWs have lied about the event (it really was inevitable), I hope the video recording comes out soon.

Blogger Ron September 13, 2015 8:36 AM  

In the same conversation on twitter itself:

Sep 11
tnielsenhayden ‏@tnielsenhayden
@StevenBrust @pnh @jenphalian Apparently JCW's unique version of Christianity doesn't include the bit about not bearing false witness.

https://archive.is/T4eTu

Blogger Markku September 13, 2015 8:39 AM  

LGrin is banned already, though has been away for quite some time. We were moderately confident that it's a certain GG, but I don't remember if we were absolutely certain.

Blogger Cataline Sergius September 13, 2015 8:39 AM  

Just look at him. You can tell he got his start by snarking about "Stick Jocks" in the SCA.

Anonymous Stingray September 13, 2015 8:42 AM  

She did nothing of the sort.

It's amazing to me what they this they can get away with and simply cannot understand. The fact that they wallow in it disgusts me.

Blogger VD September 13, 2015 8:44 AM  

LGrin is banned already, though has been away for quite some time.

Ah, thanks. Spammed.

Blogger Steveo #238 September 13, 2015 8:52 AM  

@18 Holy Crap, what kind of caballero is that?

Anonymous Bz September 13, 2015 8:52 AM  

TNH was the editor of the last Brust book I read, just so the relationship is clear.

Anonymous Bz September 13, 2015 9:06 AM  

@StevenBrust @pnh @jenphalian Lamplighter's the one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct.
— tnielsenhayden (@tnielsenhayden) September 12, 2015


Hahahahahaha, is this pair for real? Theresa Toad and her gender non-specific partner Pompous Patrick had a screaming lecture about their precious code of conduct. Apart from what else they are, what utter buffoons.

It's good to have a little bit of levity while Europe is catching fire.

Blogger ScuzzaMan September 13, 2015 9:10 AM  

OT (but not really):
"The indoctrination effect, regarding the individual, is to make him think he no longer has an independent existence. Those who still have functioning minds are taught that 'the individual' was a concept that had a use at an earlier stage of evolution, when modern systems and structures were still developing---but 'individual' became an accurate synonym for 'criminal' when benign super-government took over..."
--John Rappoport

Anonymous Shut up rabbit September 13, 2015 9:12 AM  

Lamplighter's the one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct.

I think that speaks a lot more about the con's SJW code of conduct (vague, partisan, crock of shit) than it does about Mrs Lamplighter's behaviour.

Blogger automatthew September 13, 2015 9:27 AM  

Lamplighter's the one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct.

Note the sneakiness in language. Got warned ... by whom? Pushing the limits, but not actually violating.

Anyone attending SF cons should find the Toad and tell her she's pushing the limits on the code of conduct. Then we can honestly report the fact that she was warned.

Blogger ScuzzaMan September 13, 2015 9:31 AM  

Given even my sketchy exposure to the two people involved, and most of it thrid hand at least, I know who I'd believe.

(Not all my experience is third hand or more: I've had a personal email correspondence with J Lamplighter. She has never been anything other than thoroughly courteous.)

Blogger automatthew September 13, 2015 9:32 AM  

One of Bandler and Grinder's early works in the NLP field is worth perusing even if you're skeptical about the value of the rest. Unfortunately, it has the worst name. The Structure of Magic is primarily about systematizing the way you listen to what people say, detecting and reconstructing elided ideas, because what people leave out is often more important than the actual text for understanding actual goals.

Blogger Markku September 13, 2015 9:41 AM  

Mr. Bean explains NLP

Anonymous Stg58 / Animal Mother #225 September 13, 2015 9:45 AM  

What violation of the code of conduct would merit screamng and profanity? Sounds like they're trying to proactively cover themselves for when he video comes out. "She had it coming! She was pushing the limits in conduct!"

Blogger Markku September 13, 2015 9:46 AM  

Victim-blaming the Jews. Original.

Blogger Cail Corishev September 13, 2015 9:53 AM  

Lamplighter's the one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct.

Well, of course. That's what codes of conduct are for:

1. SJW attacks non-SJW.
2. Non-SJW responds (it doesn't matter how politely or fairly).
3. SJW claims non-SJW made SJW feel unsafe, appeals to code of conduct, has non-SJW sanctioned.

They wouldn't bother having a code of conduct if they weren't going to use it in such situations.

Blogger James Dixon September 13, 2015 9:53 AM  

> I think that speaks a lot more about the con's SJW code of conduct (vague, partisan, crock of shit) than it does about Mrs Lamplighter's behaviour.

Why are you granting THN the benefit of thinking she's even remotely being truthful?

She's lying. If Jagi had been in a confrontation with the convention staff it would have been all over twitter moments after it happened. She knows she'[s lying and we know she's lying. Don't give her the benefit of a doubt. She doesn't deserve it.

Blogger Russell (106) September 13, 2015 9:54 AM  

The VFM stand ready.

Blogger ScuzzaMan September 13, 2015 9:58 AM  

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/swedens-ugly-immigration-problem/article26338254/

"Yet Sweden’s acute immigration problems scarcely feature in the mainstream media. Journalists see their mission as stopping racism, so they don’t report the bad news. Despite – or perhaps because of – this self-censorship, the gap between the opinion elites and the voters on immigration issues is now a chasm. According to a recent opinion poll, 58 per cent of Swedes believe there is too much immigration, Mr. Sanandaji noted. The anti-immigration Sweden Democrats party is now polling at between 20 per cent and 25 per cent."

Blogger ScuzzaMan September 13, 2015 9:59 AM  

Crossover to GamerGate:

"Journalists see their mission as stopping racism, so they don’t report the bad news."

Blogger Rantor September 13, 2015 10:01 AM  

Of course Sasquan would have to keep any information on persons reported for abuse strictly confidential... Like their confidential Hugo nomination data.

Blogger Cataline Sergius September 13, 2015 10:12 AM  

@26

In answer to your question, an SCA fencer.

Decades ago, when I was involved with the SCA (*Cataline caveats; I was in college. I was young. Also I was completely insane, you can't prove anything!!!*)

The fencers were a bad gamma male joke back then. Constantly sniping and snarking about heavy fighters. And how much more skilled you have to be to fence. And that the Heavies shouldn't be the only ones who are titled as knights. And that fencing is an Olympic sport and WMA isn't. (they all look like athlete of the year Steven Brust BTW). Whining and whinging about how the SCA was just a complete jockocrasy. Basically the whole Gamma Male secret kings thing.


But it let women play with swords. As well as men who liked to wear lace but didn't like to get sweaty or bruised, pretend they were contributing to the war. It gave them something to do and we figured they were harmless.

Way wrong call.

Today they have taken over the organization.

Remember any organization that is not explicitly rightwing, will become leftwing. And boy have they ever.

(*Cataline's second caveat; in the SCA's case you talking about an organization that was started by (shudder) Marion Zimmer Bradley. So it was doomed from the start.*)

Anonymous Eric Ashley September 13, 2015 10:38 AM  

Recently, I've read...

Shepherd's Cross and Shepherd's Crook
Exiles and Gods by Pam Uphoff
The Recruitment and most of Return to Earthy by Michael Chatfield
For I Could Lift My Finger and Blot Out the Sun
Yvvarros: The Digital Frontier

And some others....

None were Tor books.

------------------------------------

And what about combining Rhetoric and Dialetic in one article? This seems the most common technique.

Blogger VD September 13, 2015 10:54 AM  

And what about combining Rhetoric and Dialetic in one article? This seems the most common technique.

That's what I called the High-Low before I understood it from an Aristotelian perspective.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 11:01 AM  

13. SciVo September 13, 2015 7:56 AM
I'm very disappointed in Steven Brust. I like his books, but his judgment is lacking.



you're just now figuring this out? hell, the man is an openly avowed Marxist, refering to himself as a "Trotskyist sympathizer".

socialist / anarchist themes have featured fairly strongly in several of his books.

if you'd been paying attention, you'd have already known that his judgment is for shit.




10. James Dixon September 13, 2015 7:44 AM
So we have Scalzi's word for it that we're all fans again now. I wonder how much that will be worth the next time someone claims we're not.




what's really funny is that Scalzi is doing all of this ranting because of an essay to 'fix the Hugos' by ... Tron guy.

https://duckduckgo.com/?t=palemoon&q=Jay+Maynard+tron&iax=1&ia=images

i submit to you that there are very, VERY few people more truFen than Jay Maynard.


28. Bz September 13, 2015 9:06 AM
Hahahahahaha, is this pair for real? Theresa Toad and her gender non-specific partner Pompous Patrick had a screaming lecture about their precious code of conduct.



DARVO.

Deny
Attack
Reverse Victim / Oppressor

as i've pointed out so many times, what these cretins do requires NO practical intelligence, it requires only your presumption of goodwill.

you'll notice that she's following the script perfectly.

what's even better is, that she couldn't even be bothered to check what Brust was talking about ( heckling supposed control of the Hugos by PNH / TNH ) before she burst with the completely offtopic subject of accusing John and Mrs Wright of lying.

that's another tell:
when people can't restrain themselves from introducing subjects that are NOT relevant to the ongoing conversation ... that's happening because THEY are spending lots of time thinking about it.

and when the non-sequitur, like this one, is a diversionary tactic, you know that they're almost certainly trying to cover something up.

in this case, Patrick is probably feeling some heat from corporate ( what are these stories we're hearing from Sasquan about your treatment of one of our authors, Patrick? ) so Teresa is trying to establish a false narrative ( it was Mrs Wright who was the problem ) as a firewall against something happening to Patrick.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 11:04 AM  

11. Mint September 13, 2015 7:52 AM
I should learn to not read File 770 comments section. Bad to my peace of mind.



"It's bad for my peace of mind."

Anonymous Shut up rabbit September 13, 2015 11:04 AM  

38. James Dixon
You misunderstand me. I'm not suggesting she wasn't lying; I'm suggesting that they will have a code of conduct in place that will support a lying, deceitful toad against a normal person in all circumstances because... reasons? (framed as fat-shaming or internalised-hetero-normative-misogyny or whatever)

Anonymous Shut up rabbit September 13, 2015 11:11 AM  

e.g;
Art 1. Anyone talking to a person with a self-expressed but non-clinically proven hormonal imbalance which results in their inability to stop eating pies and cake in such a way as the clinically obese person might construe it as "fat-shaming" or in anyway judgemental of their choice to self-identify as a lardass land-whale will result in the immediate exclusion of the normal person with no refund"

Blogger Mint September 13, 2015 11:36 AM  

Thanks bob k. mando.

I am used to chat style English conversation. It is very informal and very loose in grammar structure. Sometimes, things occupy my mind that this habit slips and manifest in my speaking elsewhere. Things like the comment that compare smutty first novel to Mr. Wright's work.

By the bye, why don't you use proper capitalize words? Is it a fashion or personal style?

Anonymous Bz September 13, 2015 12:36 PM  

mando, you are entirely right. TNH wants to establish a fake cover story.

And that reminds me: Fire the Tor Four or we won't buy Tor no more.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 12:39 PM  

50. Mint September 13, 2015 11:36 AM
It is very informal and very loose in grammar structure.



true. however, that particular formulation rings very false to American ears.

it's things like that that used to indicate to us that Markku wasn't a native speaker.

using idiosyncratic speaking styles is perfectly fine if you're creating a character or persona. if you're trying to learn conversational language, not so much.

there will be variances between specific countries. for instance, if you watch Top Gear you'll notice them talking about "horsepowers" and "torques". Americans *never* append an 's' to either of those words.




50. Mint September 13, 2015 11:36 AM
By the bye, why don't you use proper capitalize words? Is it a fashion or personal style?



i actually do tend to capitalize proper nouns.

amongst the reasons i don't follow the normal Sentence Case rules:
- i'm a lazy bastard
- who doesn't care
- this is informal writing
- i use caps to indicate emPHASis on the correct sylLABle, as an alternative to bold or italics
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbjE8KI-j3M


were i to write a formal article i would use the standard capitalization forms.

but i'm not, and you ain't grading me, so the heck with it.

Anonymous The other robot September 13, 2015 12:46 PM  

I wonder when the next parody will drop?

Anonymous BGS September 13, 2015 12:51 PM  

What happened to them over the past 30 years?

The mask is slipping.

one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct.

If you where pushing the outer limits of the glass ceiling my love. The hugo award winning story of an old str8 YT man putting a woman in her place.

Top Gear you'll notice them talking about "horsepowers" and "torques". Americans *never* append an 's' to either of those words

I am pretty sure that the bronies talk about horse powers.

Blogger John Wright September 13, 2015 12:52 PM  

" @StevenBrust @pnh @jenphalian Lamplighter's the one who got warned that she was pushing the limits on the convention's code of conduct."

This is an utter lie. Nobody from the convention talked to my wife about this, nor was she "warned" about pushing the limits or anything else.

Blogger Mint September 13, 2015 1:04 PM  

bob k. mando,
It suits you. That's why I thought it is personal style. It makes your posts stand out whenever one scrolls fast the comments.

Now, does it sound like grading you? ;)


Blogger VD September 13, 2015 1:06 PM  

This is an utter lie. Nobody from the convention talked to my wife about this, nor was she "warned" about pushing the limits or anything else.

All together now: SJWs ALWAYS LIE!

Anonymous The other robot September 13, 2015 1:17 PM  

Dan Rather thinks that fiction is truth, but maybe he was just pleased about Redford.

SJWs Always Lie.

Blogger John Wright September 13, 2015 1:21 PM  

"Apparently JCW's unique version of Christianity doesn't include the bit about not bearing false witness."

While this is witty, I should be insulted that anyone would think that I would come up with so unbelievable a lie.

I would never, out of my own imagination, come up with the idea that the senior editor of my own publishing house where I have been working for over a decade would lose his temper in public and use saltly language to my wife, yet another Tor author.

If I were inventing a lie, I would invent something the audience was likely to believe.

This level of immaturity, incivility, and sheer, shocking unprofessionalism is not something I can readily imagine, and not something that strikes me as believable.

Even now, I am having a hard time understanding how someone entrusted with the interests of a large segment of the science fiction publishing world would endanger his financial wellbeing as well as my own merely for the sake of giving vent to a momentary emotional pressure.

If I had made up the story, I would have had him yell at me. No one who knows Jagi is likely to believe anyone would use bad language to her. It is like swearing at one of those Disney princesses who have woodland animals help her clean the kitchen.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 1:23 PM  

54. BGS September 13, 2015 12:51 PM
The mask is slipping.



no, you just hadn't previously identified what they were doing. the mask was 'slipped' the whole time, for those willing to look.

partly because they hadn't been attacking you at that time.

the Denial mechanism has been recognized since ~ 1900, and was bandied about by Sigmund. the first 'serious' ( i use this term advisedly with regard to any Freud ) research by his daughter Anna.



55. John Wright September 13, 2015 12:52 PM
This is an utter lie. Nobody from the convention talked to my wife about this, nor was she "warned" about pushing the limits or anything else.



i've no doubt that this is true.

BUT

this is why both Vox and i repeatedly warned people to video / audio record EVERY interaction between Puppies and others at Sasquan.

because for the vast majority of internet readers ( this includes me ), the dispute has now devolved down into literal 'he said, she said' competing accounts of what happened.


every interaction, no matter how straightforward or obvious, can be obfuscated by these DARVO / displacement type mechanisms ... to those who did not personally observe them.

sometimes, even to those who did see them.

John, you'd have saved yourself a great of time and trouble if in response to the lying Toad of Tor ... you could simply post Jagi's pov video. or even third party video of the exchange.

now, in order to 'properly' defend your reputation, you have to make multiple posts and solicit the testimony of others.

*shrugs*

i feel bad for the situation you're in. but there's no use crying about spilled milk, we've got to make the best of what we've got and go forward.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 1:26 PM  

56. Mint September 13, 2015 1:04 PM
Now, does it sound like grading you? ;)



don't care. :3

Anonymous Alsos September 13, 2015 1:51 PM  

Funny, when I read "Toad of Tor" it somehow morphs into "Mother of Toads". Must be a dyslexia thing.

Anonymous The HB September 13, 2015 2:11 PM  

Didn't John C. Wright's own wife admit John's description of the events was fabricated?

Blogger VD September 13, 2015 2:14 PM  

Didn't John C. Wright's own wife admit John's description of the events was fabricated?

No, quite the opposite. She confirmed it in its entirety. SJWs always lie.

Blogger VFM bot #188 September 13, 2015 2:26 PM  

Was anyone else present when the exchange occurred?

Blogger Keith Glass September 13, 2015 2:29 PM  

I know both John and Jagi personally. I don't think they're CAPABLE of lying. The Nielsen-Haydens, on the gripping hand, seem to be incapable of telling the truth. . . .

Blogger James Dixon September 13, 2015 2:31 PM  

> You misunderstand me.

Apparently. I apologize.

> I'm suggesting that they will have a code of conduct in place that will support a lying, deceitful toad against a normal person in all circumstances...

Of course they will. Why else would they have one?

> ...partly because they hadn't been attacking you at that time.

At the time I was talking about they didn't seem to be attacking anyone, save perhaps for the occasional Usenet flame war. And they didn't seem to make a habit of lying at the drop of a hat. Now they do. Of course, as Vox notes, they didn't have perceived power then.

> ...now, in order to 'properly' defend your reputation, you have to make multiple posts and solicit the testimony of others.

Something which, given her previous position with Tor and Patrick's current one, might best be done in a court of law. Yes, it's reached that point, especially if John and Jagi need to break any existing contracts with Tor..

Given the new Sad Puppies 4 logo (http://madgeniusclub.com/2015/09/03/introducing-sad-puppies-four-the-bitches-are-back/), I can't help but wish I had to artistic talent to make a Mecha-Puppy versus the Toad of Tor kaijū eiga. Anyone else up to taking on the task?

Anonymous That Would Be Telling September 13, 2015 3:22 PM  

Recording would have been illegal because Washington is an all party consent state, and we can be very sure PNH wouldn't have consented. So any such recording couldn't now be used as evidence for the general public.

But Missouri is a one party consent state, so you're a party that's presumably consenting :-), so I recommend everyone attending the next Worldcon carry and have running at all times a little voice recorder, as well as the usual taking a video of anything that might prove to be useful.

Blogger Cataline Sergius September 13, 2015 3:54 PM  

Common sense tells you Toadina was lying.

She would have shot her mouth off the night of the awards if that had happened and crowed loudly about it too. She would have incorporated that into their Victory Parade as instinctively as a beaver builds a dam.

The fact that it took her three weeks to remember this version of events tells you its a rancid load of horse shit.

Expect her to double down on it.

Anonymous TroperA September 13, 2015 4:26 PM  

(*Cataline's second caveat; in the SCA's case you talking about an organization that was started by (shudder) Marion Zimmer Bradley. So it was doomed from the start.*)

There was a pedophile scandal in the SCA awhile back:

http://www.post-gazette.com/frontpage/2007/05/08/Six-file-federal-complaint-over-sex-abuse-conviction/stories/200705080198

Parents in the organization will frequently let their kids pal around unsupervised at its events. Can we be all that surprised when one of these Lord Crotchingtons takes a passel of pageboys pavilion-camping in the deep woods to show them his magic wizard staff?

Blogger chris September 13, 2015 4:42 PM  

What violation of the code of conduct would merit screamng and profanity? Sounds like they're trying to proactively cover themselves for when he video comes out. "She had it coming! She was pushing the limits in conduct!"
Profanity ("No Fracking way are you that shite to do") is the the correct response to profanity.
Screaming and intimidation is the correct response to a threat on your wife and children: ("Get away NOW!")

Anyone who hides behind a code of conduct is a fascist. It is immaterial if they are of the left or right. Shun them, until you can make their playpen glow. In the dark.

Blogger chris September 13, 2015 4:45 PM  

Additional: John C Wright is a better man than I am. He'd pray for them. God bless the Papist..
I am too much a Cromwellian Puritan. I want a New Model Army, and the fight. I need to pray more, that the Toad will rediscover that she is flawed, human, damned, and needs the cross, and Christ.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 4:57 PM  

63. The HB September 13, 2015 2:11 PM
Didn't John C. Wright's own wife admit John's description of the events was fabricated?



go on then, get us the quote where she said this. she has her own blog and hijacks John's occasionally.

remember, the internet is forever.



67. James Dixon September 13, 2015 2:31 PM
At the time I was talking about they didn't seem to be attacking anyone, save perhaps for the occasional Usenet flame war.



you need to re-read TNH's own account of her *forcing* the Mormons to excommunicate her. by her own telling, she could have left the church without issue. instead, she willfully chose to behave in a flagrantly and publicly abusive manner toward her church until she forced their hand.

that happened back in the 70s.

certain of her behaviors may have gotten more aggressive ... but they've ALWAYS been there.

and Patrick chose to marry her.

Anonymous Amok Time September 13, 2015 5:10 PM  

I haven't purchased a Torean novel in at least a year and will continue my path. Why would i want to put any of my cash into the hands of the Toad? Heck, i might get warts!!
I would rather send the money directly to John Wright and his adorable wife!

Anonymous GG4life September 13, 2015 5:24 PM  

Weren't all the puppies instructed explicitly to always record everything at the hugos? And yet this one controversy where puppies were present went unrecord.

go figure.

Blogger Carl Philipp September 13, 2015 6:12 PM  

@63 The HB
"Didn't John C. Wright's own wife admit John's description of the events was fabricated?"

No.
http://www.scifiwright.com/2015/08/in-memoriam-of-the-hugo-awards/comment-page-1/#comment-118685
"First, I think John has made it sound a bit worse than it was…" and then she proceeds to explain what happened, which was, in substance, basically the same but with less outrage.

SJWs Always Lie.

Anonymous Ain September 13, 2015 6:25 PM  

James Dixon: "You've got to have something before you can be ashamed of the quality of it."

They lack shame in any area. A total absence of self awareness is one of the personality flaws necessary to be an SJW.

Blogger Blume September 13, 2015 6:58 PM  

He is a tor boy, he has to defend his feudal lord.

Anonymous Mudsack8 September 13, 2015 7:16 PM  

No Tor, No More!

I have nothing but glee in my heart at the thought of depriving the Tor Four of any of my money. But there is a fly in the ointment.

I just finished J.C. Wright's 'Count to a Trillion'. I see that there is a sequel. I want to read it. But it is published by Tor. (Sobs bitterly and gnashes teeth). I couldn't find it at Half Price Books. Anybody have any advice on how to score Mr. Wright's books WITHOUT paying tribute to the Toads?

OpenID malcolmthecynic September 13, 2015 7:36 PM  

If any of you have ever spoken to Mrs. Wright, through e-mail, comments section dialogue, phone, meeting, or otherwise, you know how absolutely insane it is to accuse Mrs. Wright of lying about this situation - which is actually what they're doing.

This is perhaps the most blatant lie I've seen yet in the Puppies affair, and that's saying something.

Blogger John Wright September 13, 2015 8:08 PM  

Mudsack8, send an email to me using the address found on my journal site at the bottom. I can show you the manuscripts as a courtesy, but obviously I cannot sell them. Tor has that privilege.

Blogger James Dixon September 13, 2015 8:20 PM  

> ...you need to re-read TNH's own account of her *forcing* the Mormons to excommunicate her. ... that happened back in the 70s.

I may take your word for it rather than doing my own research, Bob, but thanks for the correction. Maybe they just did a better job of hiding it in public back then.

> Anybody have any advice on how to score Mr. Wright's books WITHOUT paying tribute to the Toads?

Contact Mr. Wright directly. Or donate to him via the tip jar on his page when you've obtained one of his books used or via more questionable methods.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 8:29 PM  

82. James Dixon September 13, 2015 8:20 PM
when you've obtained one of his books used or via more questionable methods.



whodathunkit? JCW is a blasted commie hippie.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steal_This_Book

Blogger Ragin' Dave September 13, 2015 8:37 PM  

Question to the publishing inclined here - what are the chances of having John C Wright published by someone else other than Tor? Can he pull his writing from Tor, or do they have an exclusive contract?

I'd love to buy more of his books. I refuse to support Tor until the Hadens are fired.

Blogger James Dixon September 13, 2015 8:46 PM  

> Question to the publishing inclined here - what are the chances of having John C Wright published by someone else other than Tor?

http://www.castaliahouse.com/

Not much there by Wright yet, but expect it to grow.

Blogger Ragin' Dave September 13, 2015 8:53 PM  

Already have Somewhither. Waiting for book #2 to come out so I can shove my money into Mr. Wright's hand.

Blogger Carl Philipp September 13, 2015 8:53 PM  

@84 Mr Wright has published at Castalia House.

Unfortunately, the best of the works he has published at Castalia isn't on either of his author pages there; they really should update that.
http://www.castaliahouse.com/downloads/somewhither/
It's really good, and only $5.

Blogger bob k. mando September 13, 2015 8:54 PM  

yeah, Tor certainly has the rights for publishing the rest of the Eschaton sequence ... even if they prefer NOT to publish it, just so they can screw with John.

beyond that, i have no idea what contractual obligations John has with them.

Anonymous Hound's Tooth Check September 13, 2015 10:30 PM  

"you need to re-read TNH's own account of her *forcing* the Mormons to excommunicate her."

Yes. A normal person who finds himself in a church whose doctrines he can no longer accept simply leaves and finds another church (or starts another church, if none match the dictates of his conscience). Not her.

By her telling, she's right up there in Joan of Arc territory, rather than being a histrionic adolescent who wasted the time of a bunch of nice old men who would much rather have been fishing, or golfing, or playing with their grandkids, instead of dealing with her.

Anonymous REG September 13, 2015 10:30 PM  

When used books are preferred (over Tor) you can check with Amazon used books or even better, Better World Books, nine million books in stock, they claim. Most from BWB are in the neighborhood of four or five dollars and free shipping worldwide. There is another used book seller like BWB; unfortunately, I've forgotten its name. Hitting the tip jar generously after that low a price for one (or more) of Mr. Wright's books is easy.

Blogger automatthew September 13, 2015 10:55 PM  

Yes. A normal person who finds himself in a church whose doctrines he can no longer accept simply leaves and finds another church (or starts another church, if none match the dictates of his conscience).

I've done this. I miss that congregation, and that will never change. There are men I love and admire I will probably never speak to again (in this body). I left partly so I wouldn't be the cause of trouble.

Because: the greatest of these is love.

The actions of the Toad betray her utter unfamiliarity with love. She's a tare and a serpent.

Blogger The Overgrown Hobbit September 13, 2015 11:26 PM  

Yes, there are. I couldn't hear what PNH was saying, all I could hear was volume and Jagi coming away chagrined. She had gone over to offer an olive branch and got yelled at for her troubles.

Blogger The Overgrown Hobbit September 13, 2015 11:31 PM  

Addendum: I was with the Wrights, running interference for the con (My goal: See to it that they got the WorldCon experience two celebrated authors deserved). I always volunteer at cons, this time my volunteering was a tad more superversive than usual.

There was only one (very short) time when the Wrights were at at the 'con when I or my husband wasn't nearby. Get the fabricators to 'splain when Jagi was "cautioned." Unless they get very lucky, I suspect I can prove they're lying.

Blogger automatthew September 13, 2015 11:56 PM  

The Overgrown Hobbit,

Do you need any assistance making that recording public? Numerous Technical Directors of the Evil Legion of Evil are standing by.

Blogger VD September 14, 2015 8:17 AM  

Overgrown Hobbit, will you please email me a short statement about what you witnessed and what Jagi told you after PNH yelled at her?

Blogger Mark September 14, 2015 11:29 AM  

PNH was too busy this weekend memorializing 9/11 in his own classy way:

@PNH
As your observance of 9/11, don't forget to find someone who didn't attack you, and beat the living crap out of them.

8:31 AM - 11 Sep 2015

Blogger Zeke OF Confettii September 14, 2015 1:10 PM  

John, now you have me imagining Rachel Griffin with a squad of overly helpful raccoons messing up the cleaning up, and that HAS to be racist in some withering manner.
;-)

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