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Sunday, December 18, 2016

Interpreting neocon lunacy

The Saker has a go at trying to figure out what in the world the twice-defeated neocons are attempting to accomplish with their futile attempts to delegitimize the election and incipient ascendance of the God-Emperor:
My guess is that first and foremost what is taking place now is what always happens when the Neocons run into major trouble: they double down, again. And again. And again. That is one of the key characteristics of their psychological make-up: they cannot accept defeat or, even less so, that they were wrong, so each time reality catches up to their ideological delusions, they automatically double-down. Still, they might rationalize this behavior by a combination of hope that maybe one of these tricks will work, with the strong urge to do as much damage to President-Elect Trump before he actually assumes his office. I would never underestimate the vicious vindictiveness of these people.

What is rather encouraging is Trump’s reaction to all this: after apparently long deliberations he decided to nominate Rex Tillerson as his Secretary of Defense. From a Neocon point of view, if General Michael Flynn was bad, then Tillerson was truly an apocalyptic abomination: the man actually had received the order of “Friend of Russia” from the hands of Vladimir Putin himself!

Did Trump not realize how provocative this nomination was and how it would be received by the Neocons? Of course he did! That was, on his part, a totally deliberate decision. If so, then this is a very, very good sign.

I might be mistaken, but I get the feeling that Trump is willing to accept the Neocon challenge and that he will fight back. For example, his reaction to the CIA accusations about Russian hackers was very telling: he reminded everybody that “these are the same people that said Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction”.
I suspect any inclination toward pity or remorse on the part of the God-Emperor Ascendant has been eradicated by the neocon and SJW antics. I have no doubt that Donald Trump Jr. smells heresy, and he does not enjoy it.

Labels:

58 Comments:

Blogger Benjamin Kraft December 18, 2016 8:09 PM  

When reality points a sword at you and you double down on it, we call that Hara Kiri.

Blogger Sherwood family December 18, 2016 8:11 PM  

One of the most useful parts of Trump's campaign and election was seeing exactly who crawled out from under rocks on the right to declare their neoconnery and to scuttle "across the aisle" to join with Hillary so that their proclivities would be unimpeded. If W. Bush was the Neocon president, I suppose that Trump is the Anti-Neocon president. Trump, by his very presence, is in the process of purging the Right of these types.

Donald Trump Jr. as appointee to the newly created position of Presidential Inquisitor sounds about right.

Blogger Some Dude December 18, 2016 8:32 PM  

Neocons like Dan Senor, behind the Trump locker room tape, are gamma. Look them up, research them and their histories...its wall to wall gamma males.

Blogger Some Dude December 18, 2016 8:36 PM  

The neocons don't have a party. In a sense, the neocons are the cuck Dems and the cuck Repub elites they have bribed and blackmailed with hotel room sex tapes for a century since Woodrow Wilson (read Henry Goldman's, of Goldman Sachs, biography by his daughter talking about zionists blackmailing Wilson). But they have no natural party as the real Dems hate Wall Street and war, and the real republicans obviously don't want to cuck for Israel and their one world government open borders under Zion agenda. So they flit and slide in between the cracks of both parties. But you can't execute them for treason, even though they are foreign agents of Israel. And even pointing them out will lead to retribution. How Trump handles the neocons and their plants in the CIA/Wall Street/Hollywood will be his toughest task. Not the dems or even the cuckolds.

Blogger Benjamin Kraft December 18, 2016 8:38 PM  

@3. Alphas couldn't care less what he said, betas wouldn't care, deltas might care but would have the common decency to keep private talks private.

Only gammas are both pathetic enough to think that it was bad, and slimy/vindictive enough to out it instead of dealing with their misgivings on a one-on-one basis.

Blogger Some Dude December 18, 2016 8:43 PM  

On a final note, Zion only can win working in the shadows (hence the Mossad motto). Previously the mass media was their shadow. He has to beat them like he did in the campaign - sunlight. I bet many republicans were unaware of how much a disaster Zion's lebensraum wars or open borders have been until Trump

Blogger Dave December 18, 2016 8:45 PM  

Rex Tillerson is Trump's nominee for Secretary of State, not Secretary of Defense. The author of the article needs to correct that. Lt. Gen. (Ret.) Mathis is Trump's nominee for Secretary of Defense.

Anonymous Rigel Kent December 18, 2016 9:05 PM  

So, are all neocons gammas?

Blogger haus frau December 18, 2016 9:06 PM  

"I have no doubt that Donald Trump Jr. smells heresy, and he does not enjoy it."

This impression of Don Jr., where does it come from? I've followed the election as much as anyone and haven't seen enough of him to get much of a feel for him other than that he certainly does support his dad. Is it from twitter? I do so hope he is far to the right of his father. I would be happy to contribute funds toward proper inquisitorial robes.

Blogger Cynic In Chief December 18, 2016 9:06 PM  

It used to be us who didn't have a party. It was globalist right vs globalist left. They have a party, it's with the globalist left, they just don't want to openly side with them. It's much easier to undermine us with treachery instead of open warfare.

Blogger tz December 18, 2016 9:08 PM  

As long as he can control his son-in-law, everything should be fine.

Move the embassy to Jerusalem, then pursue benign neglect.

Blogger Lazarus December 18, 2016 9:10 PM  

The Saker gives an important insight from another perspective, but has blinders on for some things, i.e.:

As for Trump, I still can’t figure him out. On one hand he nominates Rex Tillerson in what appears to be a deliberate message of defiance against the Neocons, while on the other hand he continues to try to appease the Israel Lobby gang by choosing a rabid Zionist of the worst kind, David M. Friedman, as the next US ambassador to Israel.

Friedman has been close to Trump for 15 years. Obviously has had some influence. It is nothing to do with a deliberate anti-neocon policy, he simply trusts the guy to do the job.

And this:

Considering that several key Republican Congressmen have said they do support the notion of an investigation into the “Russian hackers” fairy tale, I submit that the Republicans are doing exactly the same thing, that this is not a Democrat vs Republican issue, but a “deep state vs The People of the USA” issue.

I submit it is an issue of factionalism in the Deep State. Once the Bifactional ruling party became more and more complacent and ossified, there had to be a reaction by those who were ambitious but shut out of opportunities for power.

Whether it is by design or simply the wave of history, who knows.

Blogger SteelPalm December 18, 2016 9:21 PM  

Sorry Vox, but the article is full of factual errors, even basic ones, like calling Rex Tillerson the Secretary of Defense, and its author is a complete fucking idiot.

How can anyone take it seriously with this line?

a real willingness to engage Iran and accept it as a partner and ally.

Yeah, let's be friends with a potential caliphate whose people chant "Death to America! Death to America!" at every opportunity, has openly talked about nuking the US, and who recently captured a US navy ship and humiliated its crew for billions in ransom money.

Brilliant strategy!

Anonymous Just another commenter December 18, 2016 9:28 PM  

has been eradicated by the neocon and SJW antics... Serious question: What's the diff between those two groups, behavior-wise? I mean, I know some of the ideological differences (thought to be honest now that I think about them there are fewer than I'd have suspected at first) but in terms of behavior? Lie? Check. Double-down? CHECK! Project? Help a brother out here?

Anonymous DJF December 18, 2016 9:37 PM  

"""and who recently captured a US navy ship and humiliated its crew"""

No, a US navy ship humiliated the United States by getting lost and going deep into another countries waters.

They had bad training, bad plan and bad navigation.

Blogger SteelPalm December 18, 2016 9:52 PM  

@15

Ah, so you believe the Iran state media, and consider it the US's fault for being attacked and kidnapped. Iran was just doing the honorable thing by getting billions in ransom, too.

And these Death Cultists will make great "partners" and "allies".

Sounds very similar to the 9/11 apologists.

Blogger praetorian December 18, 2016 10:05 PM  

This impression of Don Jr., where does it come from

/pol/ is convinced he is a lurker.

He retweeted a Kevin MacDonald tweet.

Always two, there are.

Blogger Lazarus December 18, 2016 10:18 PM  

SteelPalm wrote:How can anyone take it seriously with this line?

a real willingness to engage Iran and accept it as a partner and ally.

Yeah, let's be friends with a potential caliphate whose people chant "Death to America! Death to America!" at every opportunity, has openly talked about nuking the US, and who recently captured a US navy ship and humiliated its crew for billions in ransom money.

Brilliant strategy!


Iran is Shiite. Sunnis are the ones who want a caliphate. If you are going to fight ISIS, and get closer to Russia, you negotiate a better deal with Iran also.

Its not a morality play, it is international relations.

You know, the art of the deal.

Blogger Scott Birch December 18, 2016 10:21 PM  

Let's not drag the media spotlight onto the young one. I'm sure he is busy.

Blogger SteelPalm December 18, 2016 10:38 PM  

@18

If you think Iran (and Shiites in general) aren't striving for their own caliphate, you're hopelessly naive.

This sounds very similar to the reasoning for the US backing the Taliban during the Soviet-Afghan War. "Hey, the Taliban is anti-Soviet! They're a natural partner and ally!"

How did that one work out?

No one said it was a "morality play". Yes, nations can and should make alliances with those they're lukewarm and uncertain about.

But not with those that have stated they want to exterminate you many times, and have backed up these sentiments with terrorism and military action.

Incidentally, Obama has worked very hard to make Iran an "ally" and "partner". I wonder if The Saker likes him?

Blogger Skyler the Weird December 18, 2016 10:40 PM  

Had Obama diplomatically supported the Iranian Green Revolution the Mullahs might have been overthrown and replaced by more moderate government but his Muslim Brotherhood advisors didn't want that.

Blogger Lazarus December 18, 2016 11:02 PM  

SteelPalm wrote:If you think Iran (and Shiites in general) aren't striving for their own caliphate, you're hopelessly naive.

Its obvious you will not be detered by actual information, but I will try anyway:

Are there any Shia Muslims who believe that the Caliphate could be restored?
I'm aware that Shia would not recognise a Sunni Caliphate as valid (quite apart from the self-styled Caliphate created by ISIS being anti-Shia). But the Fatimid Caliphate was Shia. So I'm wondering if it would be possible, at least in principle.........

Mehran Janghorbani, Have studied Islam as much as I could, am a practicing Muslim and know someth...
Written 29 Jul 2015
Definitely not. As others have pointed out twelver Shias believe that the Caliphate belongs to the 12th Imam which is their Messiah. Other Shia sects are much less numerous and some of them believe in a Messiah while others believe in a holy lineage decending from Fatima and Ali, however even if a person were to be of that lineage it would not suffice and certain criteria (some of them supernatural) should be met. Therefore, for the Shia the idea of a caliphate is an ideal, a kind of city of god which we strive for daily not through wars and weapons and conquest but through self purification, Shia belive that once they are ready the Caliphate will be brought about automatically.......

Usman Qazi, قاضی in name only.
Written 29 Jul 2015
My understanding is that Twelver Shias would like all temporal rulers to defer to the last Imam (who remains hidden). Iran does so and its supreme spiritual leader is a cleric. So there is no need for a Caliphate.

The Twelver Shia were a fringe sect at the time of the Fatimids. Currently, the Ismaili Shia trace their lineage back to the latter.


It reminds me of the difference between Christians who thought Christendom was the actual Kingdom of God, versus those who believe it can only come about through supernatural devices.



Anonymous BBGKB December 18, 2016 11:11 PM  

TRUMP has to deal with scum on the right as well. Latest batch of WikiLeaks
http://endingthefed.com/6-republicans-who-took-secret-payments-from-clinton-to-destroy-trump-all-new-wiki-leak.html

Every day the job of President-Elect seems to become more danger-filled for Donald Trump…

An email from John Podesta to Huma Abedin…

The email, sent in July of this year, describes how funds were being diverted from Clinton’s campaign to the Super PACS of Jeb Bush, Carly Fiorina, and John Kasich…

“He is on board, will retract the invitation to speak. Eyes only.”

This email was dated days before Speaker of the House Paul Ryan withdrew the invitation to Donald Trump to speak at an event in Wisconsin…

FEC reports shows that two large donations from PACS and private sources in early October went to John McCain right after he attacked Trump publicly criticized Trump…

Senator Lindsay Graham, another outspoken critic of Donald Trump and briefly candidate for President from July to December also it seems received help from the Clintons.

getting lost and going deep into another countries waters. They had bad training, bad plan and bad navigation

Affirmative action tokens can ruin things even with good training.

So, are all neocons gammas? Some are lambdas

Blogger Lazarus December 18, 2016 11:18 PM  

BBGKB wrote:getting lost and going deep into another countries waters. They had bad training, bad plan and bad navigation



And women on board, who we know ruin everything.

Anonymous SciVo de Plorable December 18, 2016 11:20 PM  

This impression of Don Jr., where does it come from? I've followed the election as much as anyone and haven't seen enough of him to get much of a feel for him other than that he certainly does support his dad. Is it from twitter? I do so hope he is far to the right of his father. I would be happy to contribute funds toward proper inquisitorial robes.

It appears to be from an anecdotal grimness in his campaign appearances, especially during the general election debates, which I haven't watched so I couldn't say.

Anonymous SciVo de Plorable December 18, 2016 11:29 PM  

So, are all neocons gammas?

There has to be a category for Gammas Gone Wild like Bill Kristol, who actually have national attention on TV.

Blogger StrongCoffee61 December 18, 2016 11:42 PM  

It's infuriating to see these CONservatives portray themselves as true conservatives left behind by the Alt-Right.

Two questions for George Will, Bill Krystal, Steve Hayes, and all the other NeverTrump "conservatives"

1) What have you done to Conserve White people's control of the country they created?
The overwhelming contribution of sweat, brainpower, and blood sacrifice that transformed a primitive land into the greatest nation was from European Americans. They don't want it stolen.

Answer;
The CONservatives got on all fours, pulled their silk underpants down and said " Take it Latin America, Africa, and Asia. We're scared of being called racists and our big business master wants cheap labor"

2) What have you done to Conserve America's industrial might?

Answer;
The CONservatives got on all fours again for big business and said "You guys pull our strings and us country club types can't even relate to those working class folk, so leave the country with our blessing. The rubes will have to get by."

Patrick Buchanan is an example of a true Conservative. Intensely nationalistic.

The neoCons have been weak hearted betrayers and sellouts who deserve nothing but contempt.




Anonymous Galactic Starfleets of Deplorable Spartacus December 18, 2016 11:48 PM  

Benjamin Kraft wrote:Only gammas are both pathetic enough to think that it was bad, and slimy/vindictive enough to out it instead of dealing with their misgivings on a one-on-one basis.

Ok, noice. Question for the aether- why does anyone listen to the siren song of the (not) fucking Gamma? This isn't a Gamma failing; it's the listener's failing. Why? Pedestalization tranference? Secret guilt of Secret Minion? For every Secret King...?

The author of Ponorology goes into this, in his way. The Gamma is approximately his "Skirtoid", iirc. The stolid Delta is in there too. I forget his term. Worth a read.

Anonymous JAG December 19, 2016 12:02 AM  

BBGKB wrote:TRUMP has to deal with scum on the right as well. Latest batch of WikiLeaks

And gee whiz, what a shock it is to read some of those names. Low Energy Bush, Kasich (D), Graham (D), Ryan (D), and McCain (T).

The usual suspects that we've known are Democrat moles all along by their behavior, voting patterns, and speech. The only time McCain even pretends to be Republican is when he needs to get re-elected. The rubes in AZ keep sending that prick back every damn time.

The only name that even mildly surprised me is Fiorina, but I shoulod have known better. That's on me.

Blogger pyrrhus December 19, 2016 12:14 AM  

Hey Iran fear mongers.... Iran is a 3d world country bordering two superpowers, Russia and China. Iran is not going to pull any major stunts...

Blogger bruce December 19, 2016 12:34 AM  

OT, Hillary has always been good at breaking inconvenient media people and she has cause to fear some decrease in the bribe intake. She's not a quitter. If she makes some examples now she can maintain media clout and try for some other office worth bribing.

I think that's why we see mainstream press putting out a bunch of conspiracy theories and the harassment of the electoral college. These are loyalty oaths. Don't break me, Hillary- go after the other guy. I am loyal.

Anonymous Post Alley Crackpot December 19, 2016 12:35 AM  

FUCK THE CUCKS

Anonymous Sevatar December 19, 2016 12:45 AM  

OT: How converged is Vice media? I get the impression some of their news can be impartial but a lot is pretty skewered to the narrative and some topics they tend to just ignore.

Blogger Ezekiel December 19, 2016 12:54 AM  

Rigel Kent wrote:So, are all neocons gammas?
Almost all of the ones who go out of their way to make sure you know their name are gammas, or those not lambdas tend to be gammas. A few deltas and betas from the ex-military side, then maybe a couple of alphas and even sigmas working on behalf of spy agencies or organized crime... though you're probably just as likely to find an Omega with potty-training in that category. I have trouble seeing Ralph Peters as a gamma.

Blogger Aeoli Pera December 19, 2016 1:08 AM  

Excommunicate the neocons, inquisition NOW!

Blogger Aeoli Pera December 19, 2016 1:11 AM  

praetorian wrote:Always two, there are.

Lol. Even genre-crossing hack writers perceive deep truths every now and then.

Blogger Doom December 19, 2016 1:21 AM  

The problem with the analogy is there really were wmd's in Iraq. Some went to Syria, but many remained, were found, but weren't cataloged for a number of politically embarrassing reasons. There are quite a number of vets who came into accidental contact with the stuff and are or have been treated. So... not a good analogy. Popular, but wrong.

If that is how he is going to work? If he is truly just ignorant, cool. But if he is playing populism over truth, then he is just as the others. As general rule I am watching from the sidelines, for the most part. But I will call a penalty if I see it. And this is one, one way or another.

Blogger Bob Loblaw December 19, 2016 1:30 AM  

Sorry Vox, but the article is full of factual errors, even basic ones, like calling Rex Tillerson the Secretary of Defense, and its author is a complete fucking idiot.

I couldn't say how much Asian politics politics he gets right, but Saker is unremittingly wrong on nearly everything military. He just doesn't know what he's talking about.

And yeah, getting the SecDef nominee wrong is really embarrassing.

Blogger Ron December 19, 2016 1:32 AM  

So what it all comes down to, is that the best way to reality check SJW types, is by giving them wedgies and flushing their faces in the toilet.

Ah well, we all tried to be nice..

Blogger SteelPalm December 19, 2016 1:32 AM  

@30

Hey Iran fear mongers.... Iran is a 3d world country bordering two superpowers, Russia and China. Iran is not going to pull any major stunts...

Yeah, two superpowers that have despised the United States for over 100 years. One of which, China, has called the God Emperor a sworn enemy and recently engaged in hostile military actions against the US.

And no one is "fear-mongering" or suggesting any action; this topic began because I pointed out that anyone claiming the US should become "partners" and "allies" with Iran is a raving imbecile.

Again, have folks learned nothing from the US's long-time support of Taliban in the 70s and 80s?

Blogger Shimshon December 19, 2016 1:40 AM  

Didn't Trump Jr. retweet a Pepe meme?

Blogger John Williams December 19, 2016 1:54 AM  

@23, Their appears to be no wikileaks email that supports the link you provided. Not sure if the error is mine or theirs.

Blogger John Williams December 19, 2016 1:56 AM  

Iran is not going to pull any major stunts...
Iran is the master of brinksmanship, what better location to create global stress, then back off for a while?

Anonymous JAG December 19, 2016 2:18 AM  

Ron wrote:So what it all comes down to, is that the best way to reality check SJW types, is by giving them wedgies and flushing their faces in the toilet.

Ah well, we all tried to be nice..


This is why I now cheer for the Alpha Betas instead of the Tri-Lambs when I re-watch RotN. We are far better off with the jocks and face men in charge than the nerds who give us an SJW dominated culture.

Blogger Resident Moron™ December 19, 2016 2:36 AM  

Hey @SteelPalm

Vox quoted the article, he didn't endorse it for historical accuracy, but it's attempt to explain reality to people assiduously avoiding it.

Which makes your own [ahem] contributions to this thread quintuply ironic, given that you seem completely unacquainted with reality yourself.

But I give you due credit; you've memorised the neocon talking points and can regurgitate them on demand.

Blogger Happy LP9 December 19, 2016 2:51 AM  

An observation, I'm atheistic if not disinterested neocons' men, their narratives and their absurd aged antics. So I really don't know...

The neocon men are pathetic parasitic omega ragers they are utterly bereft of testosterone and vastly repulsive to women (me). I am thrilled they are alone without a party, its how many found themselves without a party and its fine - no one needs a party or a instanta party, why need masters at all -

Then again I revert back to how I resist and resent women voting, I have documented proof my vote was not counted and I circulated this letter - my point here is that the neocons to the women backing all this war talk and Russia fear mongering is replacing the reality of an alliance with America, Japan, Russia, portions of the EU states against China's junk products.

It is all a lie against Russia as a boogie man, 5 to 8 years ago it was Iran. Well, Iran, Assad and Putin want a peaceful future minus the neocons, do they not?

Syria and Iran with Russia are measured or managed and shut up by Putin, any attempt against Putin or demonizing Russia is poor pathetic irrelevant outdated strategy. It is outdated and the neocons are sadly passing away into the after life due to their old age.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-funsv5mhg

Blogger SteelPalm December 19, 2016 3:00 AM  

@45

Your username is fitting. Wanting to get into an alliance and partnership with a budding Muslim caliphate that wants to exterminate the US is exactly how the neocons got America into so many messes to begin with. Not to mention it's exactly Obama's own position with Iran. (Again, is Saker a fan of Bathouse Barry?)

You're now advocating this dangerous interventionist game while claiming to be against neoconnery. Resident Moron, indeed.

Blogger Resident Moron™ December 19, 2016 3:05 AM  

I didn't actually advocate anything. You can't even read what is in front of you correctly, and you want people to trust you on international relations?

Sure, that's gonna happen.

But I will advocate for something definite now: we should definitely not listen to people who have been wrong about everything, always.

Anonymous Eric the Red December 19, 2016 3:59 AM  

Even if Trump wanted to try, Iran wouldn't allow the US become its ally in any kind of endeavor. Iran has been successfully making the US its premier enemy since 1979, so there's no reason it should stop now. Any treaty or alliance with Iran would be subject to taqqiya from the outset; as proof, look at Obama's so-called deal with them. It amounted to no viable quid-pro-quo other than billions to them and hate to us.

Realpolitik with Iran means they are never going to even look at the bed, let alone get in it with us. Trump will have better options than that, the first one being arrange for Russia to get rid of ISIS, then the US gets the hell out of the Mideast. That also provides a good excuse to let the Saudis twist in the wind, and also to start fully developing internal US fossil fuels, and (as per K. Denninger) new thorium reactors. Be beholden to nobody in the Mideast, not Saudi Arabia, not Israel, not Iran, not anyone.

Anonymous Takin' a Look December 19, 2016 4:33 AM  

@Eric the Red

"Trump will have better options than that, the first one being arrange for Russia to get rid of ISIS, then the US gets the hell out of the Mideast. That also provides a good excuse to let the Saudis twist in the wind, and also to start fully developing internal US fossil fuels, and (as per K. Denninger) new thorium reactors. Be beholden to nobody in the Mideast, not Saudi Arabia, not Israel, not Iran, not anyone."

No homo, but I could kiss you for that common-sense post.

Blogger VD December 19, 2016 4:53 AM  

Yeah, let's be friends with a potential caliphate whose people chant "Death to America! Death to America!" at every opportunity, has openly talked about nuking the US, and who recently captured a US navy ship and humiliated its crew for billions in ransom money.

You clearly don't know your US-Iran history. First, the USA has historically been the aggressor and was responsible for destabilizing the country in the first place. Second, Iran is not the aggressor in the Middle East now, the USA was, and ISIS now is. Moreover, the USA has been talking openly about bombing Iran since 1980, so you should at least mention that if you're going to point fingers at Iran.

Third, Iran is not a "budding caliphate". That is Islamic State, which is Sunni and adamantly opposed to Iran, which is why Iran is prominently involved in the Syrian operations against ISIS. Iran doesn't want to rule the world. ISIS does.

It is not "neoconnery" to make peace with a country that is neither at war with the USA nor has any reason to be. Iran is going to be a nuclear power soon, if it is not already, and the world is going to have to come to terms with that sooner or later.

Russia + Iran + China are already capable of challenging the USA's practical military preeminence anywhere but North America. The days of the USA attempting to dictate terms are over.

Blogger Sherwood family December 19, 2016 4:58 AM  

Iran could get in to bed with us. They've gotten in before. Anyone remember Iran-Contra? It all depends on the deal. Look, the real problem here is that the Saudis are deep in everything in D.C. and the Israelis. And those guys do not like Iran. How do you break the backs of the Saudis, Iranians, and the Russians if you have to? You further reduce U.S. consumption of oil. That puts all of them in a bad place and gives you room to negotiate. Blockading the Persian Gulf with Russian help and then letting the Russians sell oil and selling our own fracked oil would have us sitting on a gold mine. Do that for the next four years and see if they are ready to deal. We could defund the Saudis/Iranians, strengthen the Russians vis-a-vis the Muzzies and make a great deal of money in the process. The Russians don't want to make nice with Iran or Saudi if they are reaping the harvest of oil sales to Europe/China and will help keep the lid on the Gulf to prevent Saudi/Iranian tankers from getting out. They'd want to build pipelines but we can prevent that happening through any territory that easily connects to major markets. Just a thought.

Blogger The Kurgan December 19, 2016 6:07 AM  

Crushing heretics is SO addictive! One cannot just stop after a dozen... One must crush them all.

Blogger Hunsdon December 19, 2016 7:41 AM  

SteelPalm? The Taliban was founded in the 1990s. We did not fund them during the Soviet-Afghan war (your comment #20), nor did we work with them in the 1970s-1980s (your comment #40).

Careful! Doom is watching from the sidelines, and might call a penalty on you.

OpenID countenance December 19, 2016 8:16 AM  

VD quoted:

My guess is that first and foremost what is taking place now is what always happens when the Neocons run into major trouble: they double down, again. And again. And again. That is one of the key characteristics of their psychological make-up: they cannot accept defeat or, even less so, that they were wrong, so each time reality catches up to their ideological delusions, they automatically double-down.

My response:

'Tis the typical ideological cultist, of any sort.

I've written elsewhere that I would rather have Donald Trump propose a Paul Ryan style idea than Paul Ryan propose a Paul Ryan style idea. That's because Trump isn't ideologically wedded to Paul Ryan style ideas, while Paul Ryan is. If ("when") the idea fails or is disappointing in results, Trump will have no problem sending the idea to the circular file cabinet. Paul Ryan, in contrast, would double down, blame impurities in the product, sabotage in the process, or any number of other excuses. But he could never say the idea didn't work, because that would then be admitting his ideology is flawed.

Anonymous buybuydandavis December 19, 2016 8:26 AM  

"what in the world the twice-defeated neocons are attempting to accomplish"

Impeachment

google
russian hacking nixon trump impeachment

Blogger Benjamin Kraft December 19, 2016 12:58 PM  

@56. That's just amusing.

Blogger Ben Sanderson December 19, 2016 4:31 PM  

Don't underestimate Bannon's role. I suspect he also loathes neocons.

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