ALL BLOG POSTS AND COMMENTS COPYRIGHT (C) 2003-2017 VOX DAY. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. REPRODUCTION WITHOUT WRITTEN PERMISSION IS EXPRESSLY PROHIBITED.

Sunday, January 22, 2017

"We are two nations, maybe more."

Definitely more, Peggy. Definitely more. And that is why war is on the horizon that no longer feels quite as distant as it once did. But at least one nation, the American nation, has a leader worth his salt.
We are two nations, maybe more.

Normally a new president has someone backing him up, someone publicly behind him. Mr. Obama had the mainstream media—the big broadcast networks, big newspapers, activists and intellectuals, pundits and columnists of the left—the whole shebang. He had a unified, passionate party. Mr. Trump in comparison has almost nothing. The mainstream legacy media oppose him, even hate him, and will not let up. The columnists, thinkers and magazines of the right were mostly NeverTrump; some came reluctantly to support him. His party is split or splitting. The new president has gradations of sympathy, respect or support from exactly one cable news channel, and some websites.

He really has no one but those who voted for him.

Do they understand what a lift daily governance is going to be, and how long the odds are, with so much arrayed against him, and them?
The USA now contains considerably more than two nations. That's why it is no longer any more viable than the European Union. It's been held together by force, easy credit money, and sleight of hand for a long time, but not for much longer.

For all his strength of will and civic nationalism, the God-Emperor cannot save the political entity, but he can put the American nation in a much better, much stronger position before the growing rifts become borders. He should take those who say he is not their president at their word, because they are neither the Posterity of the Founders nor We the People.

Labels:

263 Comments:

1 – 200 of 263 Newer› Newest»
Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 5:45 AM  

A nation of good and a nation of evil..

So lefties, my skin is white, clearly I am evil

Anonymous Jack Amok January 22, 2017 5:50 AM  

He really has no one but those who voted for him.

We all we got, we all we need.

Anonymous Takin' a Look January 22, 2017 5:52 AM  

Speaking of nations...

"Hello fellow white people"

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uTkRp4oD3Xg

Anonymous Icicle January 22, 2017 5:55 AM  

How many nations?

Anonymous Philipp January 22, 2017 5:56 AM  

Peggy Noonan spells out an important truth here: Trump has nobody else than the people who voted for him. The Democrats, most of the Republicans, basically all of academica and the mainstream media, the Deep State and most of the corporate leaders are against him, despise him, hate him.

His only allies are his voters. He is a very powerful incentive to keep his promises and build that wall.

Anonymous Jack Amok January 22, 2017 5:57 AM  

More importantly, we're all we want. The leftists, the scribbling classes, the cucks, the snowflakes, the immivaders... we don't want them. They can go, just leave us alone.

Of course they won't, so it'll get ugly, but Noonan understands so little. All the antics, the NeverTrumping and the temper tantrums, all that just confirms we made the right choice. There were a lot of reluctant Trump supporters who looked at him as the barely lesser of two evils, and now most of them realize just how big the gap was between Trump and everyone else.

4GW, when your opponents make imbeciles of themselves, you are winning. Peggy, do try to keep up, this ain't the 80's any more. Maybe read a couple of Castalia House books...

Blogger AdognamedOp January 22, 2017 5:59 AM  

Ridicule is the best weapon right now. These SJW's are throwing hangin curves. We can laugh them out of town before they completely destroy the nation state.

Blogger SteelPalm January 22, 2017 6:04 AM  

I thought "Trump only has the support of the people, no one less" was a basic fact any half-sane person following politics knew back in May 2016.

Peggy Noonan finally got there in January 2017, over two months after the God Emperor won the election.

Ditto for the number of nations within the "United" States. This was all obvious for a long time.

Perhaps by 2018 the WSJ will figure out that leftist protesters/pundits are NOT arguing in good faith and will not be convinced by any appeals to reason.

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 6:06 AM  

They only let in a few hundred thousand Muslims a year... we should definitely laugh that off ! Man I can take on 4 or so 5'9 Moslems on my own since I am still somewhat youthful, and it only left one gash on me last time .. what about you ? Maybe you're children are ready for it !!

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 6:08 AM  

Sjw's only want a few more hundred thousand moslems in per sjw.. not that many more

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 6:15 AM  

Steel palm, you have a steel heart, but trump cannot save our decline, he will protect us for a few years to give our future generations a chance. Respect

Anonymous Rocklea January 22, 2017 6:19 AM  

I think 2033 may be optimistic, but we will see. It will be interesting to see how long the protests go on for. I am currently reading The Evolutionary Psychology Behind Politics. The author points out that the counter culture of the sixties were likely born of the r selected men left behind while the K's were off fighting in WW2. Todays r selected lefty protesters are likely because of apparent abundance and the immigrants are also r selected fleeing harsh environments for a relatively plentiful one. I realize most here have probably read this book, but if you haven't you should. It really does highlight the fact that those on the left, really cannot be reached. These events are cyclical. I still find myself racking my brains for a way out though. The Golden Path sucks, but I do agree with it.

OT: Colin Robertson, aka MillennialWoes, has just posted a video after his doxxing. Looks like he's going anti-fragile.

Blogger Shimshon January 22, 2017 6:20 AM  

I like the gold curtains. They suit the room.

Blogger Lazarus January 22, 2017 6:21 AM  

I was more moved than I expected. Then more startled.

She got a tingle. A Chick Tingle.


Throughout the speech, and much of the day, Mr. Trump looked stern. At first I thought it was the face he puts on when he’s nervous. I don’t think so now.

What, she has never seen "resolute" before?

Blogger Thomas Henderson January 22, 2017 6:25 AM  

Ms. Noonan says Obama had the whole shebang backing him up and Mr. Trump has the people.

Look at the electoral map by US state counties: 600 or so counties went red, 50 or so went blue.

The elites are clueless about how isolated and confined they truly are.

Blogger Shimshon January 22, 2017 6:25 AM  

This is just getting started. We have yet to see how the media musical chairs are going to end. What are the MSM if they lose close access? Bloggers.

Imagine if he denies access to those who paywall content (like you, WSJ)? Can he do it? I don't see why not.

Anonymous Post Alley Crackpot January 22, 2017 6:35 AM  

Thomas: Actually, that understates the results by a substantial amount.

600 counties didn't "go red" -- 3084 counties went red.

57 counties went blue.

Seen the "Clinton Archipelago"?

https://bradjballard.com/2017/01/07/trumpland-and-clinton-islands/

Anonymous Steve January 22, 2017 6:37 AM  

Mr. Trump in comparison has almost nothing. The mainstream legacy media oppose him, even hate him, and will not let up. The columnists, thinkers and magazines of the right were mostly NeverTrump; some came reluctantly to support him. His party is split or splitting. The new president has gradations of sympathy, respect or support from exactly one cable news channel, and some websites.

Yes. However.

The deep state/political establishment has grown weak, pathetic, and useless. Best exemplified by the existence of Evan "Two Moms" McMuffin, CIA man, Humpty Dumpty impersonator and NeverTrump's own Don Quimote.

The best candidate the opposition could put up is Hillary Clinton, a vile old hag with all the effortless charm of a genital wart and the dynamism of a dead nematode.

The mass media is utterly fucked. They're in a similar position to Soviet state media in 1989. Nobody believes them any more, they've completely lost control of the narrative, and there's nothing they can do about it except squeal with impotent lib-rage as they become obsolete.

The cucks are cowards and losers. If they were going to stop Trump they'd have done it the first five or six thousand times they had a cunning plan.

Trump not only has the better part of the American people behind him, he has surrounded himself with some of the sharpest, toughest, most experienced admirals, generals, CEO's and political streetfighters in the West.

These men aren't babies. They know what they're up against. And let's not forget, they're led by Donald J. Trump, whose picture appears in the Oxford English dictionary against Badass Mother Fucker.

Anonymous simplytimothy January 22, 2017 6:41 AM  

"Two Midwestern women told me separately that they used to be but no longer are Republican. They’re something new, waiting for a name."

Christendom


"Have you ever noticed,” said Dimble, “that the universe, and every bit of the universe is always hardening and narrowing and coming to a point?”
His wife waited as those wait who know by long experience the mental processes of the person who is talking to them.
“I mean this,” said Dimble in answer to the question she had not asked. “If you dip into any college, or school, or parish, or family – anything you like – at a given point in its history, you always find that there was a time before that point when there was more elbow room and contrasts weren’t quite so sharp; and that there’s going to be a time after that point when there is even less room for indecision and choices are even more momentous. Good is always getting better and bad is always getting worse: the possibilities of even apparent neutrality are always diminishing. The whole thing is sorting itself out all the time, coming to a point, getting sharper and harder."


C.S.Lewis "That Hideous Strength"

Anonymous Rocklea January 22, 2017 6:48 AM  

@19 Freedom is truly a narrow path.

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 6:48 AM  

I will die, but my children will survive and spread their speed... as a white that is what your aim should be... especially when places like west and central china were first populated by whites, we deserve a chance despite our stupid women that want Asian and African men to outcompete us and will cheer them on

Blogger Lazarus January 22, 2017 6:56 AM  

simplytimothy wrote:The whole thing is sorting itself out all the time, coming to a point, getting sharper and harder."

The Chinese, weary with time, call it Going up the tip of the Buffalo horn

Blogger Gordon January 22, 2017 7:02 AM  

Post Alley Crackpot wrote:
Seen the "Clinton Archipelago"?

target="_blank" rel="nofollow" href="https://bradjballard.com/2017/01/07/trumpland-and-clinton-islands/">https://bradjballard.com/2017/01/07/trumpland-and-clinton-islands/



It is amazing. Lefties are down to a few miles on either coast, and a few inland islands. And since they have driven manufacturing away from their enclaves, they grow nothing, make nothing.

Silly ensemble political videos do not count as something. Oh, they still control the culture and education, and that ain't nothing. But their control of these is entirely dependent on our money.

We don't have to pay for this shit any more.

Anonymous karsten January 22, 2017 7:02 AM  

"no one but those who voted for him."

It is a measure of how rotten a state the U.S. -- a purportedly democratic Republic -- has become that she can, with a straight face, evaluate the significance of Trump's having precisely this body of support as nothing but a pittance, in the grand scheme of things...

... and by contrast, weight the significance of the press, the academics, the culture-controllers and the columnists as being so great.

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 7:07 AM  

If you are white willing To discuss how America is still America with fewer whites you are a cuck (not vox's viewpoint) it is my viewpoint... if you think fewer whites is fine, then send your kids to Africa ☺☺☺☺

Blogger wreckage January 22, 2017 7:11 AM  

@24 good point, but one she intended to make, I expect.

Anonymous Be Deplorable, Not Afraid January 22, 2017 7:14 AM  

If the Dems manage to take the House and impeach Trump, as Noonan writes (hopes?), a lot of people are going to see what good half the country and 300 million firearms are. Ah, Peggy. Honestly, it won't even take guns. Don't you understand that all your friends will be roasting on spits after 4 weeks of no food deliveries to the urban centers?

Anonymous Galactic Starfleets of Deplorable Spartacus January 22, 2017 7:44 AM  

God-Emperor is following The Supreme Dark Lord's advice on how to win at the moral level-
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4144360/Anti-Trump-protesters-face-10-years-prison.html

Thousand of protesters launched a violent rampage just blocks away from the White House as anti-Trump demonstrators smashed store windows, set fire to cars and threw bricks at police.

Nice optics there too.

Blogger Cataline Sergius January 22, 2017 7:48 AM  

He really has no one but those who voted for him.

In Peggyland umpteen million people count for nothing if you don't have a token opinion scribbler at the WaPo in your corner. His Presidency is all but ashes already!

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! gasp...wheez...gasp Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!

Anonymous Faceless January 22, 2017 7:49 AM  

Walling off the independent nation "Rachelcoreyland" that encompasses Los Angeles up to San Francisco plus Oakland to Sacramento except for a naval beachhead on the San Francisco peninsula, blessing these brave snowflakes by cancelling their US citizenship, and aggressively thwarting anybody escaping back over the wall would go a long way to fixing things. We'll take the California farmers as real Americans.

Blogger Hen January 22, 2017 8:03 AM  

#28. Sierra Hotel! Maybe we could send them to Cuba where they might feel more at home. If leadership had the gonads to do this in the 60s and 70s, we wouldn't be dealing with it now. But better late than never!

Blogger Hen January 22, 2017 8:05 AM  

#18, #19. THANK YOU. So very well said!

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 8:07 AM  

@5:

"Trump has nobody else than the people who voted for him."

I'm not sure why people keep missing this; within "the people who voted for him" is one block that's a lot more important than the others. Trump - and he may not even fully realize this yet, himself - owns the armed forces in more than just a legal or constitutional sense. No, he doesn't own the admirals and generals, but they tend to be despised within the armed forces. O6 and below? Pretty much his, along with most of the veterans and, I am quite sure, an overwhelming percentage of the bleeding edge veterans.

The media, Hollywood, and the left wing professorial freak show can attempt to use 4GW, but they're missing an important point (as do some of us); memetic warfare is not a thing in itself and victory in the meme wars is not an end in itself. Both address creating and raising actual force, or diminishing same in one's opponents. But when you already have that force, and when the enemy's memes only solidify your control of that force, the problem is different and very superable.

Blogger Nate January 22, 2017 8:12 AM  

"Do they understand what a lift daily governance is going to be, and how long the odds are, with so much arrayed against him, and them? "

We don't care.

Blogger Timmy3 January 22, 2017 8:21 AM  

Trump entered into enemy territory in Washington DC. Seems like the coastal regions will be Leftist states. The Federal declared lands are the unstates. Indian lands are already their own states.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 8:28 AM  

@35

No. There will be no new borders. No inch of the sacred soil of the United States, soil for which our ancestors have bled, is negotiable nor, given the disparity in force, is there any reason to negotiate it. I don't care if Somalis want a New Somalia up in the frozen north; they can die. We can kill them. I don't about Mexicans who want a new Atzlan; they can die. We can kill them. I don't care about neo-confederates who want to give up defensible borders and access to all manner of resources to pursue a silly dream; they can die, too, and, likely enough, it will be other southerners who kill them.Z

It would be rather interesting if this all kicked off while Trump's in office. I could see him pulling a Lincoln and holding the United States together "by an means necessary." I could see our population dropping by about half in the process but, well, omelettes and eggs.

Blogger JaimeInTexas January 22, 2017 8:44 AM  

Sacred borders? In which bible or by pronouncement of which diety?
The borders existed before the union.
I guess some borders are more sacred than others.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 8:48 AM  

Yes, some are more sacred than others. Told you, Jaime, long ago; either secession was legal, in which case the United States was perfectly within its rights to invade, crush, and extinguish a foreign state, or it was not, in which case the United States was perfectly in the right to suppress rebellion. So no, their borders were not sacred to us. Ours are.

Blogger Josh (the gayest thing here) January 22, 2017 8:52 AM  

I don't care about neo-confederates who want to give up defensible borders and access to all manner of resources to pursue a silly dream; they can die, too, and, likely enough, it will be other southerners who kill them.

The Yankee is always either at your throat or your feet.

We have never been one people or one nation.

Blogger Nate January 22, 2017 8:54 AM  

"Told you, Jaime, long ago; either secession was legal, in which case the United States was perfectly within its rights to invade, crush, and extinguish a foreign state"

That worked out well for Saddam in Kuwait didn't it.

See the problem with your logic is that its old logic that no longer applies. its been well over 100 years since the Right of Conquest has been respected.

When it has been attempted... many times it has resulted in the rest of the world destroying the nation that attempted it.

So Saddam had the right to invade Kuwait.

I'm sure that made his army feel better on the Highway of Death.


Blogger Harsh January 22, 2017 8:57 AM  

Kant, what's with the alt-white talking points?

Blogger Cerdic Ricing January 22, 2017 8:57 AM  

The Yankee is always either at your throat or your feet.

That seems the case. Right now, through immigration, the Yankee and the Southron are now different peoples. The case for secession is stronger now than when my forefathers attempted in 1861, as now we are distinct nations in every sense.

Blogger Josh (the gayest thing here) January 22, 2017 8:58 AM  


That seems the case. Right now, through immigration, the Yankee and the Southron are now different peoples. The case for secession is stronger now than when my forefathers attempted in 1861, as now we are distinct nations in every sense.


Amen

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:03 AM  

No, Saddam ran up against a different problem, that the US was unwilling to let anyone dominate the oil fields and had the means to enforce our diktat. Note, however, that Goa was overrun by the Indian Army.

You shouldn't assume, Nate, that your grasp of history or international law equals mine. It doesn't.

As for any neo-confederates playing dress-up in gray and drinking mint Julep to excess, your opinions don't really count for anything more than the poor wretches putting on a different shade of play gray and addressing each other as "Herr Obergruppenfuehrer."

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:04 AM  

Oh, and Josh? This Yankee is never at anyone's feet.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:17 AM  

Oh, and let me append to that: You Fucking Idiot.

Blogger Harsh January 22, 2017 9:17 AM  

Not all yankees are yankees.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:21 AM  

There is some truth to that. But Josh is still a fucking idiot.

Blogger Cail Corishev January 22, 2017 9:23 AM  

"He really has no one but those who voted for him."

It's telling that she thinks Americans are nearly powerless against the establishment that she swims among. We just beat them at their own game, where they had the deck stacked. If they couldn't beat America in an election, with all the power of the media, why does she think they'll be able to beat America now that it has a leader holding the executive power? It makes no sense.

"Do they understand what a lift daily governance is going to be, and how long the odds are, with so much arrayed against him, and them?"

Strange use of the word "lift." Does she understand how much fun it's going to be for Trump, to have enemies to defeat every day? Does she understand what a "lift" he and his supporters get from a nothing-to-lose challenge like that? I'll bet he's jumping out of bed before the alarm goes off these days, ready to attack the day with more energy than he's had in decades. Has she been paying attention at all?

Blogger VD January 22, 2017 9:25 AM  

No. There will be no new borders. No inch of the sacred soil of the United States, soil for which our ancestors have bled, is negotiable nor, given the disparity in force, is there any reason to negotiate it.

I don't see how that works, Tom. Far too many Americans are tied to those whose ancestors didn't bleed for the soil they now inhabit.

Moving to, say, a Georgia or California that will become independent is viable. The only real prospect for avoiding an insane amount of violence as various identity groups struggle in an all-or-nothing scenario is to divide the USA among the various identity groups, in the same way that the Arab and African states need to be divided among the various tribal troups there. This process is already underway in Libya, Iraq, the Balkans, and Spain.

There is no reason to believe it won't apply to the USA sooner or later too.

Blogger Josh (the gayest thing here) January 22, 2017 9:27 AM  

There is no reason to believe it won't apply to the USA sooner or later too.

What do you think the map of the former usa looks like in 2050?

Anonymous Minack January 22, 2017 9:29 AM  

Heh, "neo-confederates". That's like, what, five people? When the balloon finally goes up Southrons will be busy killing and being killed by blacks and hispanic invaders to worry about trying to revive the CSA.

Blogger VD January 22, 2017 9:30 AM  

What do you think the map of the former usa looks like in 2050?

No idea. We have no idea how the globalist-nationalist struggle is going to play out or where the identity lines will be drawn, just for starters.

The one thing we know is that change is coming, and when it finally arrives, it transforms things faster than the linear thinkers imagine possible.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:35 AM  

It's easy Vox; Trump tells me to preserve the US at any cost and I do. Or he tells someone else as capable and ruthless. And the population drops by 50% but I'm cool with that.

Blogger Cataline Sergius January 22, 2017 9:36 AM  

Welcome to Southron Memory Play Theater with your host Tom Kratman.

LtCol. Kratman will be joined this morning by Nate and Josh. The lights are dimmed...lets enjoy.

Anonymous Napoleon 12pdr January 22, 2017 9:36 AM  

A separation would end in war. Let's game this out...

The US gets divided into Whiteland, Blackland, and Hispanicland. All people are moved into their racial homeland. What next?

Whiteland, freed of a vast number of welfare recipients, prospers. The urban Left is outnumbered by about a two-to-one margin, so it's a Utopia.

Hispanic land becomes Mexico del Norte. Lower standard of living, wholesale government corruption. An annoying but tolerable neighbor.

Blackland degenerates into Haiti du Nord, quickly. Deprived of welfares, and with a government that is both corrupt and stupid, they have no chance.

Shortly after that, Blackland declares war on Whiteland. Politically, war has always been one of the most common distractions from internal problems. And Blackland loses, badly. Quite possibly to extinction level.

Separation would merely be the opening move in a massive fight.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:36 AM  

Minack:

Maybe as many as 12, and every one of them puts his ass on display here, regularly.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:38 AM  

@56:

If a de facto split is a necessary pre-condition to a full restoration, Nap, I'm happy with that, too. At least I am, provided we don't lose sight of the goal of a defensible country for the people.

Blogger HanSolo January 22, 2017 9:46 AM  

Trump doesn't have the institutions of persuasion (most media, universities, so on) but he does have most of the members of the institutions of hard power (military, police, FBI).

Blogger Cataline Sergius January 22, 2017 9:48 AM  



This is the 2016 electoral breakdown by counties

The Left has already segregated itself into Mega-concentration camps. Would they even notice if we closed the gates?

Blogger Stilicho January 22, 2017 9:50 AM  

@33 Tom, that is exactly right. The left can exist in this country until they actually move their war against the USA from lukwarm to hot. The left can survive until they are violently opposed by those with the means and will to do so. SJW bleed out quickly.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:51 AM  

Once the food, water, and power stop flowing they will.

Blogger ZhukovG January 22, 2017 9:51 AM  

It occurs to me, that in the event that there is a 'War to Preserve the Union' that it may well be largely Southerners that form the bulk of the Federal Army. Though I am a Southern Nationalist, I confess a certain perverse pleasure at this thought.

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 9:54 AM  

I don't know, I speak a few languages. European languages are turning into a secondary language to me.. all leftists hate Christians, including your and my family members

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 9:55 AM  

Southern and midwestern, Zh, with a sprinking of others, refugees from the left and such.

Had Massachusetts been the first to secede over slavery (or states rights), and then been followed by the rest of the north, I have no doubt but that the bulk of the Union Army would have been southern.

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 9:56 AM  

I have stopped talking to white women... I have met American men +40 years of age and respect them for intelligence, but as every year passes I speak to fewer whites... I had a Spaniard unleash on me a few months ago for the EU and then after he gave time to think about it he realised the men and women in my country are ready to fight nail and tooth against the EU... especially the men...

Blogger Dave January 22, 2017 9:58 AM  

She doesn't get it; may never get it. He is there to take the power back from the establishment.


We, the citizens of America, are now joined in a great national effort to rebuild our country and restore its promise for all of our people. Together we will determine the course of America and the world for many, many years to come.

We will face challenges. We will confront hardships. But we will get the job done.

Today's ceremony, however, has very special meaning. Because today, we are not merely transferring power from one administration to another or from one party to another.

But we are transferring power from Washington D.C. and giving it back to you, the people.

For too long, a small group in our nation's capital has reaped the rewards of government while the people have borne the cost. Washington flourished, but the people did not share in its wealth. Politicians prospered, but the jobs left. And the factories closed.

The establishment protected itself but not the citizens of our country. Their victories have not been your victories. Their triumphs have not been your triumphs. And while they celebrated in our nation’s capital, there was little to celebrate for struggling families all across our land. That all changes starting right here and right now. Because this moment is your moment. It belongs to you.

Blogger VD January 22, 2017 9:59 AM  

Separation would merely be the opening move in a massive fight.

But a vastly cleaner and easier one. And therefore preferable.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother January 22, 2017 10:03 AM  

Tom,

The old borders of the South aren't relevant any more. How has Southern culture spread throughout the country? The mindset of The South is now basically the rural mindset that you can find in the middle of upstate NY. The Yankees are now merely the city dwellers, and we have shitload of them here in Texas.

Blogger Cataline Sergius January 22, 2017 10:06 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger ZhukovG January 22, 2017 10:09 AM  

@Tom Kratman, If the Hartford Convention had resulted in New England secession, I suspect that they would have been allowed to depart in peace with the hope for future re-union. Unless of course, New England became a base for British troops at which point the United States would have had no choice but to conquer them.

But yes, you are correct, Mid-westerners, probably the 'Mormon Division', and Rocky Mountain West-Slope folks as well.

Blogger Kant Leerus January 22, 2017 10:11 AM  

I am so stupid to give so much information. My European country as of last year has nothing to do with the EU... and I will fight nail and to protect my brothers and sisters

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 10:30 AM  

They're relevant in the minds of some idjits, Stg. Josh, I'm looking at _you_, boy.

But, yes, the actual attitude can be found in upstate New York, Vermont away from the Massholes who contaminated it, ditto New Hampshire, ditto even the left coast away from the coast. It would, however, be hard to find it in Atlanta. Not impossible, just hard.

It isn't all white, either. If you look at an ethnic map of, say, the Mississippi, you'll note that the heavily populated, heavily black center, where the river itself is, went solidly Dem. But there are two splotches, large but not that densely populated, which are also heavily majority black and went Trump. Something similar can be seen east of the I-95 corridor in the Carolinas.

You know the thing that _really_ pisses me off about secession? We really weren't that different in 1861, except on the subject of slavery. (No, neo-cons of a grayer color, the tariffs were not that important.) That's why we fought so hard and would not give up; we were not that different. But by seceding and bringing on the war, a bunch of idiot southern slavocrats set the stage for what would grow into the bloated fucking government we've endured ever since. THEY fucked up the United States; arrogant, stupid, incompetent asses to a man.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 10:31 AM  

Zh:

Nah. Foreign policy goal number one has always been no peers or near peers in this hemisphere. The Southern-based United States could not have tolerated a seceded north anymore than the Northern-based United States could tolerate a seceded south.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 10:33 AM  

"But a vastly cleaner and easier one. And therefore preferable."

No, it won't be cleaner or easier. It will be massacre and rape-fest galore, possibly with a touch of cannibalism, as the populations exchange. That, if nothing else, ensures war to the knife and the knife to the hilt.

Blogger Cecil Henry January 22, 2017 10:34 AM  

Notice how when we were two nations, when millions were disgusted, coerced and disenfranchised of their OWN accomplishments and earnings under Obama and other leftist policies, NONE of that counted.

But now that those interests are even slightly represented, we are 'divided'.

YOu see Peggy, the only humans are those on the left, all others go in the deplorable box right??

Your blindness and false consciousness discredits you.

Blogger Bard January 22, 2017 10:41 AM  

Not many black kids in the Infantry. Virtually none in aviation. Filled to the brim with them in soft support skills. High number of Hispanic boys and they are pretty good soldiers and get along well enough.

Blogger Joshua_D January 22, 2017 10:42 AM  

Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Tom,

The old borders of the South aren't relevant any more. How has Southern culture spread throughout the country? The mindset of The South is now basically the rural mindset that you can find in the middle of upstate NY. The Yankees are now merely the city dwellers, and we have shitload of them here in Texas.


Yes. This is the true cultural divide; rural vs. urban. The rural mind wants space, to be left alone, to live and let live. The urban mind wants ... well, I'm not sure really, but it wants control, to control people.

I'm not sure how this struggle will actually play out because there are plenty of urban/leftist centers spread through the South and the nation.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 10:47 AM  

@77 No, not many. The reason for that is that those solid black parents, especially mothers, who are tough minded enough to ensure their kids don't fall into the abyss, and keep to their studies, also don't want to see their kids butchered. I've recruited these kids and helped my recruiters to. They're often willing or eager, as young males will be, but defer to Mama who does not want them in combat arms.

Hispanics, conversely...well..."be a MAN, Juan!" The problem for both, though, is that the educational system we've let the left inflict on minorities leaves many or most of them incapable of a half decent performance on the ASVAB.

Blogger Bard January 22, 2017 10:49 AM  

The labels are inaccurate: Left vs right, liberal vs conservative, blue vs red, dem vs Republic. They can still attemt to shape the narrative because they don't call it good vs evil or moral vs immoral if you prefer. That is the angle that needs to be pushed. Once they self identify as evil on the internal level, the people on the sidelines will be forced to act. Tolerance sounds good, but evil? No one wants to accept a little of that for their families; but some do it now because it is still called progress.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 10:51 AM  

Joshua, it's not quite that simple. For people to live in cities _does_ require a greater degree of control and subordination than living in the country. Always has. Then, too, either our academic institutions sprang up in cities or towns and cities grew around them. Academia has long been the milieu of the idiot intellectual. It got worse with the migration of rural blacks (and now Hispanics) into the cities looking for work. The sheer lack of space in the cities means that it's harder to me your own man or woman; the neighbors are always at your elbow.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 10:52 AM  

Evil, however true, is too great a leap for people to accept, Bard.

Blogger crs January 22, 2017 10:54 AM  

Is it likely concepts like the 11 cultures of North America would play into the breakup versus just a city-countryside break? I know from personal experience that moving from one cultural area to another in the US can be extremely jarring and persistently uncomfortable.

Blogger Joshua_D January 22, 2017 10:54 AM  

Tom Kratman wrote:Joshua, it's not quite that simple. For people to live in cities _does_ require a greater degree of control and subordination than living in the country. Always has. Then, too, either our academic institutions sprang up in cities or towns and cities grew around them. Academia has long been the milieu of the idiot intellectual. It got worse with the migration of rural blacks (and now Hispanics) into the cities looking for work. The sheer lack of space in the cities means that it's harder to me your own man or woman; the neighbors are always at your elbow.

Sure, but how does accepting more restrictions transform into wanting to restrict and control others? See that's the problem. Those who seek control, or maybe those who want to be controlled, tend to gather in the cities. Of course, there are plenty of freedom loving people ithe cities, but they aren't near the majority, maybe like 30% max.

OpenID elijahrhodes January 22, 2017 10:55 AM  

The large population centers are all liberal and multi-cult, and they are the least prepared to deal with a blip in their supply chains. When the shit hits the fan, the only thing patriotic Americans need to do is block the arteries into/out of those cities, turning them into flesh eating zombie war zones. After a few weeks the problem will have taken care of itself.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 10:59 AM  

Several reason, Joshua. One is to not permit a contrary example that calls your own philosophy into question. Another is to keep the money flowing into the cities in whatever form. Another is simple cultural revulsion; cities, you see, open one's mind in come ways but close it very tightly in others.

Underlying all that, though, is the penultimate articulable question. No, this is not the desire to rule or be ruled; that's a libertarian/objectivist/anarchist fantasy designed to stroke their own egos. The penultimate articulable question is the nature of Man, malleable by breeding (nature), by training and education (nurture/environment) or by nothing much with any degree of reliability.

Blogger VFM #7634 January 22, 2017 11:07 AM  

"Told you, Jaime, long ago; either secession was legal, in which case the United States was perfectly within its rights to invade, crush, and extinguish a foreign state"

That worked out well for Saddam in Kuwait didn't it.

See the problem with your logic is that its old logic that no longer applies. its been well over 100 years since the Right of Conquest has been respected.


@40 Nate
I'd say it's subordinate to the Might Makes Right rule.

The world community bitched about Putin grabbing Crimea but hasn't started a war with him over it.

And if the South had been strong enough to beat back the North it would have "demonstrated" that there is a right to secession, just like how the South's loss "demonstrated" there isn't.

Academia has long been the milieu of the idiot intellectual.

@81 Tom Kratman
Some men may like science and the arts for their own sake, but the fact that they're overwhelmingly progtard atheists right now suggests that academia is a ghetto for savants who can't hack it in the real world.

Blogger Bard January 22, 2017 11:10 AM  

I agree Mr Kratman. But, there will be more people amendable to the idea when they see it personally and even more when they are a victim now that these idiots have decided violence is a valid form of protest which cannot be used against them due to the power and authority of the safe space.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:13 AM  

@7634

I think there's something else going on there. In that penultimate articulable question of nature v nurture, the people who are inclined to academia, ditto Hollyweird and the Media, are almost invariably on the side of nurture. That means they will tend to gravitate to places where they can mold man via nurture, in the classroom, on the silver screen, or in print. I don't know that it a conscious decision very often, but I suspect that's where the motive derives from.

Blogger Cail Corishev January 22, 2017 11:13 AM  

Yes. This is the true cultural divide; rural vs. urban.

Yep. That's why it's impossible to predict how things will break up. There may be a North-South split, but I'd be very surprised if it's the only one. As far as civil war is concerned, people here in rural Illinois would far prefer war against Chicago to war against Nate's people. Chicago's been screwing us for years; Nate never did anything to us.

The cities can't survive on their own, though, so while we'd all be happier if they turned themselves into walled city-states and seceded, that's not possible. If they leave, they'll have to try to take the states or regions that they currently control with them. So that brings us back to secession, but as individual states, groups of states, what? And if secession requires a fight, who's going to do their fighting for them? How much do they really control their states, if push comes to shove? Considering all the Republican gains in statehouses in recent years, maybe not as much as they think.

Blogger Josh (the gayest thing here) January 22, 2017 11:13 AM  

You know the thing that _really_ pisses me off about secession? We really weren't that different in 1861, except on the subject of slavery. (No, neo-cons of a grayer color, the tariffs were not that important.) That's why we fought so hard and would not give up; we were not that different. But by seceding and bringing on the war, a bunch of idiot southern slavocrats set the stage for what would grow into the bloated fucking government we've endured ever since. THEY fucked up the United States; arrogant, stupid, incompetent asses to a man.

That's a lot of ahistorical bullshit packed into one paragraph.

And yes, we were that different, and we have always been different. Whether it's the federalists vs the anti federalists, Hamilton vs Jefferson, Webster vs Calhoun, or any number of examples, the two sides have been fighting almost since Yorktown.

Blogger Bard January 22, 2017 11:13 AM  

To clarify, I don't think the snowflakes will ever admit they are evil. Just that more normies will see it for what it is. Alt lite wake up call.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:15 AM  

Bard:

sure, but a little more subtlety and a little more time before we spring right to "evil" would probably be better. Now "stupid"? We can call them idiots from day one and that will not only resonate, but will get the fucknuckles to act in ways that will allow us to convincingly call them "evil" to the fencesitters.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:17 AM  

And you remain an idiot, Josh. Indeed, you are the very platonic essence of idiot. You are the concept of idiot, incarnate, as it exists in the mind of God. When God was thinking, "The world is going to need some real idiots so that normal people can see how well off they are"? Josh, He had you in mind. You're a fool, a fucknuckle, a dunce, a posturing ape unworthy of the title "Man." You stink; you suck (and probably swallow). You're an historical illiterate.

Twat.

Blogger Josh (the gayest thing here) January 22, 2017 11:23 AM  

Yes. This is the true cultural divide; rural vs. urban. The rural mind wants space, to be left alone, to live and let live. The urban mind wants ... well, I'm not sure really, but it wants control, to control people.

If the that was the true cultural divide, the exchange between Tom and myself would not have happened.

I want to be left alone, Tom does not want to leave me alone. That was the essence of the late unpleasantness. The south wanted to be left alone. The yankee did not want to leave the south alone.

Anonymous crushlimbraw January 22, 2017 11:28 AM  

Excellent! Why do I say that? I was about to post the same Lewis quote - stumbled upon it just last week in one of Gary North's books - "Moses and Pharaoh"! I said - 'That's us!"
Great minds.....eh?:)

Anonymous Eduardo January 22, 2017 11:29 AM  

Josh you gotta step up the insult game, this could be the Beginning of the WWE of Vox Popoli

Right now you are the worthless baby-face and Kratman is charismatic Heel. What we need is a heel-turn from you.

OpenID elijahrhodes January 22, 2017 11:30 AM  

Note to self: Don't annoy Kratman.

Anonymous Ominous Cowherd January 22, 2017 11:31 AM  

Tom Kratman wrote:It would be rather interesting if this all kicked off while Trump's in office. I could see him pulling a Lincoln and holding the United States together "by an means necessary."

As it stands, the US is an empire: several nations held together under one government by force. If Trump ``pulls a Lincoln,'' he can't change that.

On the other hand, if Trump forcibly removes some of the invader nations from our traditional borders, removes the mohammedans and La Raza and depopulates the loony left enclaves we are calling the blue archipelago, the few White nations that are left might be able to overlook their differences for a few generations more.

Blogger crs January 22, 2017 11:31 AM  

Is it likely concepts like the 11 cultures of North America would play into the breakup versus just a city-countryside break? I know from personal experience that moving from one cultural area to another in the US can be extremely jarring and persistently uncomfortable.

Anonymous crushlimbraw January 22, 2017 11:32 AM  

Oops - I thought I was replying to @19 with my @96 post.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother January 22, 2017 11:34 AM  

Josh, it's mindset, not location; furthermore the lines are blurry. Kratman can live in the South but still long for Yankee dominion. People who should be dyed in the wool Southerners can still spit on Dixie.

Blogger pyrrhus January 22, 2017 11:36 AM  

@33 Yes, a friend and neighbor of mine here in Tucson is ex-special forces. When I suggested to him that the military vote probably ran at least 3-1 for Trump, he said, Oh it's way more than that...

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 11:36 AM  

Good grief, Kratman. If that's the best you got, that's pitiful. I'm trying hard to be nice here.

Blogger michaeloh59 January 22, 2017 11:39 AM  

"His supporters, who flooded Washington this week, were friendly, courteous—but watchful. Two Midwestern women told me separately that they used to be but no longer are Republican. They’re something new, waiting for a name."

White. Gringo. Cracker. Eventually these nice ladies need to understand that their political identity is rooted in their hue, and hue they pray to. Those who are ready to understand they have far more in common with white Italians than black Americans, to say nothing of white Yankees vs Indian immigrants already have a name; alt-right. However for nice Midwestern ladies who ain't ready for Vox Day a glide slope is necessary. Trump's economic nationalism and populism is just such a glide slope. To understand that the fundamental problem with America is that the Establishment's attitude towards us ranges between hate and neglect (Trump's populist message) is not so far from realizing a new definition of "us" ( the alt-right's message). Some will never be ready for Vox Day but that doesn't mean nice Midwestern ladies and even Bernie bros won't be coalition partners with the alt-right. But first, before that can happen the Peggy Noonans and the Bernie Bros have to be given a shield from the Left's kill shots, "racist", "bigot", fill-in-the-phobe. How to do that? By going on offense. Waiting around for the prophecied apocalypse ain't gonna make mid western ladies and Peggy Noonan comfortable in the same room with Vox Day. Reframing same as a champion of human and civil rights for the despised crackers will. If the Left can do it for Malcolm X.......

Anonymous The Gods of Copybook Headings January 22, 2017 11:39 AM  

To deprive an organism of the consequences of its actions is the height of cruelty. Without feedback, self-regulation becomes impossible.

For 50 plus years, the virulent Left has suffered such deprivation.

Time to be kind.

Blogger pyrrhus January 22, 2017 11:46 AM  

Tom Kratman:
Underlying all that, though, is the penultimate articulable question. No, this is not the desire to rule or be ruled; that's a libertarian/objectivist/anarchist fantasy designed to stroke their own egos. The penultimate articulable question is the nature of Man, malleable by breeding (nature), by training and education (nurture/environment) or by nothing much with any degree of reliability.

Yes it is, and the question has been conclusively resolved by research against Nurture having very much influence....This infuriates the Prog-tards in Academia, who have made genetic science a hate thought, because it conflicts with their political ambitions, which is to displace Europeans with minorities in jobs where the minorities will inevitably fail. This tumor will inevitably destroy America if it is not excised, and it will lead to Civil War II if accommodated.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:47 AM  

Nah, Stg; I'm a conservative, minarchical, timocrat and could give a fuck about either Yankees or Rebs, qua yankees and rebs. Except to spit on both, of course, to the extent that they're out of date and brainless morons like Josh, of course. You might think of me as being of one mind with Washington and Jefferson, as well as Daniel Webster. We hang together or we hang separately, and if it's necessary to hang some people who would split us up the better and easier to see us hang separately, so be it; I'll tie the nooses myself.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother January 22, 2017 11:48 AM  

Tom, you may think that, but your desire for a perpetual union and idea that the North and South were relatively similar betray you as a Yankee.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:49 AM  

I, personally, think that the reasonable position is that both have an effect, but that neither is predictable, or reliable, or useful in order to improve anything. So don't bother. Conversely, either can be used, with considerably more precision, to make things worse, so string up the motherfuckers who want to try again.

Blogger James Dixon January 22, 2017 11:49 AM  

> And the population drops by 50% but I'm cool with that.

Are you equally OK with the major population centers of both sides being radioactive wastelands? Because that's what will happen in that scenario.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:50 AM  

Then what were Jefferson, Washington, and Madison, Stg?

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:51 AM  

Whatever it takes, though I suspect a very large portion of the drop will be self exile.

Blogger Michael Maier January 22, 2017 11:52 AM  

I'm with Mosby. This is not the first time Kratman's come off as a hysterical insulting ninny.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother January 22, 2017 11:55 AM  

They were Virginians.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:57 AM  

Oh, c'mon, Stg, don't cop out. They were Americans, firmly fixed on the idea of perpetual union. But by your logic they would be Yankees, too. Now, I realize that the North, during the Civil War, did use at least the first two for propaganda, but I never really expected you to join in in making them Yankees....

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 11:58 AM  

I will be sure to let you know, Michael, when i think your opinion is worth more than what the dog left in the yard this morning. Until then, though, don't hold your breath against my actually giving a shit what you think.

Blogger CynicalMan January 22, 2017 12:02 PM  

Look at the county vote map, take out a few cities on the east and west coasts and what you have remaining is a nation that supports President Trump. It is not hard to imagine that is war comes the east and west coast cities will be the first to suffer.

Anonymous VFM 3061 “Chief Who Notice Things Make Chief Go 'Hmm'” January 22, 2017 12:02 PM  

@Kratman,
You say "Trump - and he may not even fully realize this yet, himself - owns the armed forces in more than just a legal or constitutional sense. No, he doesn't own the admirals and generals, but they tend to be despised within the armed forces. O6 and below? Pretty much his, along with most of the veterans and, I am quite sure, an overwhelming percentage of the bleeding edge veterans. "

I agree with what you said wholeheartedly...but don't see it as very relevant. The most impactful force on the coming dissolution of the country we're talking about will be the po-po. And for decades TPTB have encouraged the low to mid-IQ to join as long as they'll follow orders. And I'm not a BLM nutjob--it's the cop from The Grapes of Wrath ramped up to 11...as long as he and his family are fed, he'll do what he's told.

Trump is such an outlier it's hard to describe, and he almost lost. Soros et al are a long way from dead or on the run. And the cops work for them, ultimately.

Anonymous Sam the Man January 22, 2017 12:03 PM  

I do not think we are going to go to a hot war internally, at least I hope not.

What does need to happen is:

1) Build the wall, deport all illegals you can catch, 12 million or so. That will likely take care of 3 million surplus democratic votes that came out of California and a million votes elsewhere.

2)Which will lead to a reaction. A mild rebellion/riots in Hispanic centers by criminal elements. Patriots/whites will support Trump while the urban leftists do all sorts of crap, most of it insipid and useless, but which will make their anti-Americanism clear.

4) Which will bring the full force of the security state down on the democratic side. They will fold short of war, as they basically are not willing to fight unless they think they are "safe" and even then they only scream. Starting with prosecuting the rioters in DC that side will see that sort of activity is unsafe and the urban metrosexuals/ homos/ leftist-chicks will stop.

5) Except the urban blacks. Major chimp out coming at some point, Trump may have to trigger it by eliminating affirmative action, or they will provide him the excuse by their criminality. They are going to be an issue but their activities will make folks chose between barbarism and Trumps authoritarian stability. Folks will chose stability. You will see a great reaction against urban hoods and their behavior by the vast majority of the population. Once the Blacks realize they have no support, they will fold. Black gangs have shown they cannot even hold their own against organized Hispanic gangs.

In the end I think that getting rid of affirmative action will suddenly result in a lot of legal Hispanics deciding they are white. It will also result in around 12~18% of the Black population identifying with mainstream America, 35~50% of the Hebrews doing the same.

Hopefully that will keep us from going to a full civil war. isolate each of the disparate elements that make up the democratic block and deal with them one by one.

A lot of us fear civil war and though we may be identified as not being American by some here, we have no place to go. Because of that a lot of us have a real reason to fight for the US, and every ex-service man recalls his oath to "fight all enemies, foreign and domestic" in defense of the constitution and lawfully constituted authority.

Blogger James Dixon January 22, 2017 12:10 PM  

> This is the true cultural divide; rural vs. urban.

We're probably well past due for a pandemic that will wipe out a significant percentage of the human population. It will almost certainly disproportionally hit the cities. The problem may solve itself.

Blogger tz January 22, 2017 12:12 PM  

9 nations
11 nations and there are more articles including suggested flags.

There are makers and takers, generally red and blue respectively.

Cut off food, energy, water from the left coast (let them go green ;) and see what happens.

A terrorist attack or natural disaster can do this. Sanctuary death-traps.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:12 PM  

@119

I don't know if you have any time in the military or, if so, when it was, but the Army and Marines are largely white, middle/prosperous working class, with blacks and hispanics being from similar backgrounds with similar outlooks. You can find outliers, of course, but in the main, they're a fairly solidly, reliably right wing force, that would need just a bit of direction to do some major head smashing. Peggy is talking about only the meme generators having power. That's because she's ignorant of where power really lies, and what the memes are useful for.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother January 22, 2017 12:14 PM  

Tom,

Do you want me to say they were Federalists? Their ultimate loyalty was to their state.

Lee was a "Yankee" too, until he was asked to invade Virginia.

Blogger Escoffier January 22, 2017 12:14 PM  

Napoleon 12pdr wrote:A separation would end in war. Let's game this out...

The US gets divided into Whiteland, Blackland, and Hispanicland. All people are moved into their racial homeland. What next?

Whiteland, freed of a vast number of welfare recipients, prospers. The urban Left is outnumbered by about a two-to-one margin, so it's a Utopia.

Hispanic land becomes Mexico del Norte. Lower standard of living, wholesale government corruption. An annoying but tolerable neighbor.

Blackland degenerates into Haiti du Nord, quickly. Deprived of welfares, and with a government that is both corrupt and stupid, they have no chance.

Shortly after that, Blackland declares war on Whiteland. Politically, war has always been one of the most common distractions from internal problems. And Blackland loses, badly. Quite possibly to extinction level.

Separation would merely be the opening move in a massive fight.


Agree with this scenario 100%! Can't imagine it playing out any other way. No matter what a Black homeland on American soil will become a huge problem and would most likely need to be eradicated.

Blogger tz January 22, 2017 12:17 PM  

11 nations, link

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:17 PM  

Not talking Lee, Stg, talking Washington, Jefferson, and Madison. Lee does not refute those three. If I am a Yankee, because perpetual union is and was only and ever yankee, then so were those three. If they were not, either I am not or Yankee means something other than the meaning you seem to have attached to it.

Blogger James Dixon January 22, 2017 12:19 PM  

> Lee was a "Yankee" too, until he was asked to invade Virginia.

Yes. I suspect both Washington and Jefferson would have made the same choice. Tom obviously disagrees.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:20 PM  

(OH, and lest I forget, Maier, you stupid cunt, when someone can switch from vituperation to reasoned discourse, that's an indicator he's having fun with a ninny, or since there seem to be three of you, several ninnies.)

Blogger michaeloh59 January 22, 2017 12:20 PM  

#89
"I think there's something else going on there. In that penultimate articulable question of nature v nurture, the people who are inclined to academia, ditto Hollyweird and the Media, are almost invariably on the side of nurture. That means they will tend to gravitate to places where they can mold man via nurture, in the classroom, on the silver screen, or in print. I don't know that it a conscious decision very often, but I suspect that's where the motive derives from."

In some cases at least, this confuses means for ends. For example, the most viscous practitioners of Affirmative Action are also the most the most zealous practicioners of IQ-like tests (SAT, ACT). These very devoted yet very secret heretics worship at the alter of nature (IQ) and so become the most publically devoted faithful to the religion of nurture(Quotas, AA). Of course I'm talking about Academia. They created a religion (nurture) they do not subscribe to, except rhetorically, in order to smokescreen their practice of the religion they clearly do subscribe to (nature).

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother January 22, 2017 12:20 PM  

I used Lee as an example of what Washington, Madison and Jefferson would have likely done if asked to invade Virginia. They were Federalists, sure. But they would not have invaded Virginia, just like Lee didn't.

Blogger Michael Maier January 22, 2017 12:21 PM  

Tom Kratman wrote:I will be sure to let you know, Michael, when i think your opinion is worth more than what the dog left in the yard this morning. Until then, though, don't hold your breath against my actually giving a shit what you think.

Feeling's mutual, pal. Not sure why I expect better from you. Everyone has their blind spots and feet of clay.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:22 PM  

One suspects that neither Washington nor Jefferson would have let the lunatics of the south take over the discourse, James. And, given Washington's rather forthright approach to the Whiskey Rebellion, it seems to me unlikely he would have hesitated to invade Virginia for half a minute.

Blogger Michael Maier January 22, 2017 12:22 PM  

But I'm just a moronic Copperhead...

OpenID elijahrhodes January 22, 2017 12:23 PM  

@Sam the Man

What you fail to account for is that even if the 1965 immigration act is repealed and a full moratorium on immigration enacted, the white race will soon become a minority. The browns are significantly out-breeding whites. Sooner or later the demographic math will bring a reckoning that can't be solved in a linear manner. Your progressing might take place in the short term, but that's just a stop-gap. This is why I disagree with Kratman that the U.S. can be held together. The ethnic pandora box has been opened. That said, I'll bet on an outnumbered white race to win the war every time over a brown foe.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:25 PM  

@130

Oh, hypocrisy won't be going out of style any time soon. However, it's more of a sliding scale thing than absolute. Not everyone is a Lysenko, convinced that genes don't even exist. But, on the whole, the left will tend to ascribe to nurture potentials which just are not there

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 12:29 PM  

Kratman,you yankee dolt who really gives a hootin' damn what you think ? I sure as hell dont. You wouldn't last 5 minutes runnin' your yap down here, hoss.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:29 PM  

@135:

The solutions to that is actually not that hard, although it is not all that attractive. Stop educating caucasian women past the 12th grade. Or educate only hispanic women. Or that, plus higher education for caucasian women who have three children. Their birth rate would plummet even as whites' rose. Not very libertarian, to be sure, and probably not do-able, but, if done, it would likely fix things.

Anonymous The Fifth Horseman January 22, 2017 12:30 PM  

An interesting aside- medically dependent populations.

In your grid down/ whiteland/blackland scenario,
casualties from loss of medical care would be vast. And not just trauma- SSRI shortages alone would be causing mass psychotic breaks. Beta blockers, coumadin, insulin, inhalers, antibioltics, antivirals- the 1st year die off would be spectacularly rapid.

But afterwards? Whatever state reconstituted in the aftermath would not have "health care" as a major line item.

Because the people who needed it would all be dead.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:32 PM  

I am down here, fuckface. I've lived most of my life down here. And, although some poor subhuman shits are too afraid to use their real names, cowards who would rather blacken the name of a man in every way better than them, I am not remotely like that. You can look me up any time you like; I will certainly make every effort to accomodate you.

Blogger cheddarman January 22, 2017 12:36 PM  

Tom Kratman, when you loose your temper it detracts from your arguments. I say that as someone who has a great deal of respect for you and your accomplishments.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 12:40 PM  

You are a pussy, Kratman. You know it, and I damn sure know it, you unhinged yankee fuck .

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:44 PM  

But, Ched, I _haven't_ lost my temper. See comment to that cunt, Maier, above. It's really not that hard, a spout of vituperation framed by reasoned discourse is not an indicator of losing one's temper, but of having fun with ninnies.

Blogger Sheila4g January 22, 2017 12:44 PM  

@120 Sam the Man: "In the end I think that getting rid of affirmative action will suddenly result in a lot of legal Hispanics deciding they are white. It will also result in around 12~18% of the Black population identifying with mainstream America, 35~50% of the Hebrews doing the same."

You are a delusional cuck. It doesn't matter if Mestizos decide they are "White"; genetics don't change and mere economic interest will not overcome blood and culture. Same goes for Negroes and Jews. The only "deciding" that will matter will be that of the White plurality and who it is willing to accept, and on what terms (member, tolerated long-term guest, temporary 2nd class guest, etc.).

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 12:45 PM  

And yet, Remus, you're the one hiding behind someone else's name. So, arguendu, if I am a pussy, what are you? A tiny and virginal pussy? A diseased and rancid pussy? Or just a crawling shit?

Anonymous Fabius Maximus January 22, 2017 12:45 PM  

Yawn. Call me when someone actually fights.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 12:50 PM  

Mewl some more ,you mouthy yank. Unlike cheddar, I don't like you one damn bit.

Anonymous Sam the Man January 22, 2017 12:57 PM  

elijahrhodes

No I have thought about that a fair amount. The fact is trend lines look unbeatable until they are. Look at Germany, on October 1 of 1942 they were still wining and the allies were shmucks, 60 days later Germany was reeling back on all fronts and never regained the initiative.


In 1987 the official CIA assessment of the Soviet Union had them gaining strength, they had subdued Afghanistan, their economy was doing well, they were updating their self propelled artillery, they had a very good anti-space denial program etc. 3 years later they had collapsed.

Same thing with economics. In the late 1980s we were all about to be taken down the Japan, they would own high tech and be the world tech/production leader. All the trend lines said so. By 1993 they had failed and have never come back.

If we look at the US demographics: A lot of Hispanics can become "white" if they wanted to be. The fact is affirmative action makes it good not to be, so they identify as Hispanic. I do not know the percentage, but the percentage of Hispanics (17.4% or 55.3 million) is boosted because of the advantage. Get rid of 12 million~15 illegals. another 8 to 12 million go back to white when they realize there is nothing to be gained. Suddenly Amerindian Hispanic is 35~37 million out of 308 million. Back to 13%, on par with the Blacks.

All the populations that depend on government largess are going to see their standard of living decline. That will happen, as there is no money to keep the current rich benefits going. make single motherhood absolute poverty and those birth rates will decline.

If you look pre WWII, lots of Italians were for all practical purposes not white, they were "wogs". Irish were suspect and there was on intermarriage or very little between these populations and the white protestants. It was WWII that changed that with the draft and mixing of populations. Bad for combat cohesion but good for national cohesion. It is no accident that after WWII we reached a maximum degree of homogeneity (not to ignore the 1924 immigration act). The same thing applies now to small isolated immigrants who see no reason to emphasis their difference if it does not offer an advantage as it does now with affirmative action.

If Trump manages to improve the economy, you will see a lot of pent up baby demand satisfied by whites, they do not bred at the over 2 children rate because of late of breeding territories. That can change in 2 years of good economic growth and housing opportunities. Throwing out 12 million illegals will open up a lot.

I am not saying it is sure, or that it will be easy, but it is possible.

Blogger michaeloh59 January 22, 2017 12:57 PM  

@#146
"Yawn. Call me when someone actually fights."

Please! Pretty sure this catfight is even less lame than the actual MMA throw down between any 2 Internet Warriors would be.

Anonymous Not my real name January 22, 2017 12:59 PM  

Tom, Tom, Tom, over here Tom, Tom look Tom, Tom, look at me Tom, I'm talking to you Tom, Tom, Tom, Tom, Tom, Tom, listen to me Tom, Tom, Tom, Tom, Tom

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 1:00 PM  

I'd be mortally offended if you did, Remus, as that would call into question everything I value in my character and reputation. Why...acceptance by you is unthinkable, horrifying beyond measure. Why do yo suppose I have ignored your occasional quasi-friendly comments? I just wouldn't want anyone to think I was anything like you. It would bother me to think that we're both bipeds, really, but I am fortified by the deep suspicion that you're trapped in a wheelchair, a freakish result of brother-sister incest.

Anonymous gamma gamma hey! January 22, 2017 1:01 PM  

Thus spake TK: "If a de facto split is a necessary pre-condition to a full restoration, Nap, I'm happy with that, too."

Correct, sir. The most likely outcome. Consolidation, then Reconquista. I can even tell you a solid guess what the map would look like. But I just generally like your nerve on this one.

TK's been on fire, lately. Onya, mate. Good-o.

signed,
that asshole Scooby doo.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 1:07 PM  

Not only are you a mouthy yankee bitch Tommy boy, but you are My bitch.
Carry on with my permission.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 1:08 PM  

It probably includes Canada, since they will harbor the enemy and will lack the will to control him. That could be a plus, provided we're willing to do whatever it takes to subdue the place and turn it onto the path of righteousness.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 1:09 PM  

Until you take my very generous invite, Remus, I'm afraid you will always be just another pussy. Sorry, boy, but them's the rules.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 1:12 PM  

Well, Fabius, I made the offer. What more can I do?

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 1:14 PM  

God we need to nuke Boston so no more morons like the K-cupcake infest the rest of the country.

Blogger DemonicProfessorEl January 22, 2017 1:19 PM  

Thomas Henderson wrote:Ms. Noonan says Obama had the whole shebang backing him up and Mr. Trump has the people.

Look at the electoral map by US state counties: 600 or so counties went red, 50 or so went blue.

The elites are clueless about how isolated and confined they truly are.


Very true. We control nearly all the natural resources and most of the major bases of manufacturing. A few lines cut, a couple sinkholes on a major interstate...and those blue islands become truly isolated.

Anonymous Sam the Man January 22, 2017 1:21 PM  

John Mosby,

Tom Kratman was a US combat vet. I very much doubt he is a pussy. He has a CIB and the Ranger Tab. The CIB goes over every other decoration on your uniform, it is a big deal. The Ranger Tab you get by going to Ranger school, a punishing course that only 50 % graduate at most, and to get in you have to be a stud. it is a big deal.

You mark yourself as a putz by insulting such a man, even if he was an officer. He has earned respect, even if you disagree with him on a position. An appropriate response would be to apologize, if you feel you are the model of a southern gentleman.

If not, well your posting name would then fit you.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 1:25 PM  

"and those blue islands become truly isolated."

We _really_ don't want to start our own MFecane. If we're going to isolate a city, it needs to be surrounded first and the troops reasonably well fortified, at least to the point of wire and mines, plus fields of fire cleared. That means we could probably only do one heavily blue area at a time, since the Army and Marines are not that large. We also have to assume that a state national guard will, as is right and proper, fight for its own people when they're threatened.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 1:27 PM  

I was actually a buck sergeant before that, Sam. But never mind; as mentioned, I would be disgusted at a civil word from Remus.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 1:29 PM  

Respect is earned, not given . He has earned none from me, he's just another mouthy yank. Apologies , my ass.
Stay outta my biz, Sam.

Anonymous Stickwick January 22, 2017 1:29 PM  

What has become of the West when a man insulting another man in strong terms is evidence he's "losing his temper"? The quality and intricacy of such insults used to be a measure of a man's wit and honor. Now it apparently offends sensibilities. For God's sake, does no one read Shakespeare anymore...

Anonymous BBGKB January 22, 2017 1:31 PM  

I am pretty sure if TRUMP gets his supporters to visit representatives on a regular basis even shitlibs like Franken will fear them.

Man I can take on 4 or so 5'9 Moslems on my own since I am still somewhat youthful, and it only left one gash on me last time .. what about you

While I agree with you they are shit fighters, like blacks you will never be attacked by only 4 unless they run you over with a truck first.

Oh, and Josh? This Yankee is never at anyone's feet.

Oddly there are a significant number of (literal bootlicking) gay jews.

Anonymous Sam the Man January 22, 2017 1:31 PM  

Sheila4g

Here is an example: A certain former US colonel who posts on this site is married to a Hispanic lady from Panama. His daughters are technically Hispanic by affirmative action definition. They look white, what they are for statistical purposes depends totally on self-identification. There are a lot of folks like this.

Make an Americanism the favored thing to be and in 20 years you will see a lot more folks that identify with the dominate middle class US culture. It will not be 1965, but it will be ordered and perhaps quite livable.

Blogger DemonicProfessorEl January 22, 2017 1:36 PM  

Tom Kratman is in excellent argumentative form today!

And I agree with him regarding the US Civil War - had the Southern plantation owners not seceded...Lincoln's plan was emancipation and deportation.

That was Lincoln's plan for after the Civil War too. Deport the former slaves, break up the plantation lands and distribute it to the serfs in the South. But Lincoln was assassinated and the Radical Republicans treated the South like a colony.

No fan of Lincoln, but his touch of Bismarckian realpolitik would have been useful and saved a lot of trouble that we find we're in now.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother January 22, 2017 1:39 PM  

John Mosby,

As much as I despise Yankees, Kratman is a known quantity. We know he has the goods to back it up, and the accomplishments to bolster his statements.

We don't know your real name jOHN MOSBY. All we know is what we see you say. We don't know if you're a Green Beret, Kyle Carpenter, the ghost of Chris Kyle, or J.E.B. Stuart. Or a kid in someone's basement.

Until we actually know who you are and what you've accomplished in life, your insults ring hollow. And Stickwick is right. Insult away, without it being personal.

Blogger DemonicProfessorEl January 22, 2017 1:40 PM  

Tom Kratman wrote:"and those blue islands become truly isolated."

We _really_ don't want to start our own MFecane. If we're going to isolate a city, it needs to be surrounded first and the troops reasonably well fortified, at least to the point of wire and mines, plus fields of fire cleared. That means we could probably only do one heavily blue area at a time, since the Army and Marines are not that large. We also have to assume that a state national guard will, as is right and proper, fight for its own people when they're threatened.


All true. Writing for brevity and all that. But yes, it would need to be heavily fortified against, blockhouse/blockade fashion a la Alexia and Caesar, by professional forces. All out 4GW, militias, paramilitary would be very very bloody and the good people still left in cities would be abandoned or killed.

There's still a good 1/3 of Californians that are good people. Same in places like Chicago, NYC, Detroit, etc. We cannot abandon huge numbers of our friends and allies to death and destruction at the hands of the Caliphate and the Reds.

Blogger James Dixon January 22, 2017 1:57 PM  

> One suspects that neither Washington nor Jefferson would have let the lunatics of the south take over the discourse, James

Neither Washington nor Jefferson would have given them reason to, Tom.

> And, given Washington's rather forthright approach to the Whiskey Rebellion, it seems to me unlikely he would have hesitated to invade Virginia for half a minute.

Apples to oranges comparison, Tom. But it's a point on which reasonable people can disagree. Perhaps fortunately, I'm old enough that I'm unlikely to see battle in any of the proposed scenarios.

Blogger Joshua_D January 22, 2017 2:01 PM  

James Dixon wrote:> This is the true cultural divide; rural vs. urban.

We're probably well past due for a pandemic that will wipe out a significant percentage of the human population. It will almost certainly disproportionally hit the cities. The problem may solve itself.


It wouldn't even take a pandemic, just a breakdown in the food/medical supply chain for a few months would kill hundreds of thousands, maybe millions.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 2:03 PM  

I didn't besmirch the man's service to this country , just that he's a mouthy yankee, which he is. And if you think I'm the only one that insulted someone, I got a beach house in Phoenix I'll sell you cheap. Read K-cupcakes posts to others in this here thread before telling me how i should respond.

Anonymous BBGKB January 22, 2017 2:03 PM  

Or he tells someone else as capable and ruthless. And the population drops by 50% but I'm cool with that

A couple bubbas with thermite take out power lines to DieVerse Cities in winter and that Clinton Archipelago loses everywhere it gets cold.

educational system we've let the left inflict on minorities leaves many or most of them incapable of a half decent performance on the ASVAB

Even leftists realized the only way to get equality in education is to drag Asians/Whites down with common core.

Those who seek control, or maybe those who want to be controlled, tend to gather in the cities.

One of the realizations I had as a healthcare traveler with housing provided by the agency was in cities not only can you hear your neighbors music, & smell when they cook something bad, but I was in an apartment that if it was quiet I could hear when my 5 closest neighbor's apartments flushed their toilets. When you have an acre of land between you and your nearest neighbor its not easy for them to bother you.

Note to self: Don't annoy Kratman. Note to self: Don't reincarnate as a table in the Kratman house. Lawyers pound facts, the law or the table.

this is not the desire to rule or be ruled; that's a libertarian/objectivist/anarchist fantasy designed to stroke

So all that stuff about jews on homeowners association councils is all fanfic?

For the conservative, when life presents great struggles, he knows he has the power to surmount them. Happiness stems from internal strength and perseverance. For the liberal, when life presents great struggles, the system failed, therefore they were at the mercy of a faulty system, and they believe that only when the system is fixed can their life improve. Happiness is built on systemic contingencies, which they will then seek to control or expect someone else to.

One blames himself. The other blames anyone and everyone but himself.

Anonymous VFM 3061 “Chief Who Notice Things Make Chief Go 'Hmm'” January 22, 2017 2:04 PM  

@Kratman,
I'm former enlisted infantry/retired officer, and like I said, I agree with you about the lower ranks being anti-Hillary/pro-Trump. I might disagree about your line of departure being O-6 and below, since I saw smart LTs who want to be generals spouting diversity like it meant more to them than Judeo Christ.

My POINT was that all ranks of the military will be irrelevant. It's the cops to be concerned about after the breakup begins. And the current makeup of cops is concerning.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 2:05 PM  

"We cannot abandon huge numbers of our friends and allies to death and destruction at the hands of the Caliphate and the Reds."

And that's why split means war. We cannot - certainly _I_ cannot - abandon to the left family, friends, and comrades in arms anywhere in the country. No man of any character - which expressly excludes Remus, of course - should even contemplate such a thing.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 2:09 PM  

Now that I cannot address; I have police, more than a few, in the family (extended), but I am not one and never have been...and never should have been, either. I will say that we've been taking people onto the police forces for a long time that have no business being cops, any more than I would have any business being a cop. Too prone to violence, too prone to make a bad situation worse, thereby.

I don't know that I fairly implied unanimity, in officers, but just a broad and reasonably solid trend.

Blogger DemonicProfessorEl January 22, 2017 2:11 PM  

Tom Kratman wrote:"We cannot abandon huge numbers of our friends and allies to death and destruction at the hands of the Caliphate and the Reds."

And that's why split means war. We cannot - certainly _I_ cannot - abandon to the left family, friends, and comrades in arms anywhere in the country. No man of any character - which expressly excludes Remus, of course - should even contemplate such a thing.


Exactly, and here too. Some of my family live in blue islands. We're all rural, and the central family location is pretty rural too, so there are extraction plans I've made. But yes, no matter what one must stick by family.

My suspicion is even families with only a couple redpillers will come around.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 2:13 PM  

It will not be 1965, but it will be ordered and perhaps quite livable.

And, as Vox has mentioned, in relatively smallish numbers they'll be absorbed quite nicely.

Anonymous Anonymous January 22, 2017 2:16 PM  

These aren't the only protest but https://www.womensmarch.com/100/ They're being urged to identify with movement to prevent attrition, almost like LUGs in the gay community, with some some congressman harassment thrown in.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 2:18 PM  

I'm pretty sure Old Will is beyond the poor, inbred, white trash likes of Remus, Stick.

Anonymous Andrew E. January 22, 2017 2:21 PM  

One suspects that neither Washington nor Jefferson would have let the lunatics of the south take over the discourse, James. And, given Washington's rather forthright approach to the Whiskey Rebellion, it seems to me unlikely he would have hesitated to invade Virginia for half a minute.

This reminds me of something I've always wondered. Why wasn't there a forward-looking leader from the South who could have said to the North: "You know, we think you may be right about this slavery thing. We have re-examined our position and you guys may very well be right on the moral question of it. Here's our 10-point, 10-year plan to wind down the institution starting with removing our demands to have new territories become slave states."

War would have been averted, Reconstruction would never have happened, the North would have reigned in the fire breathers, etc.

Blogger Chris Mallory January 22, 2017 2:23 PM  

JaimeInTexas wrote:Sacred borders? In which bible or by pronouncement of which diety?

The borders existed before the union.

I guess some borders are more sacred than others.



You got to remember, Krautman is from the asshole of the world, Boston. He was marinated in the mindset of the Puritan trash that founded Massachusetts.

Blogger Chris Mallory January 22, 2017 2:25 PM  

jOHN MOSBY wrote:God we need to nuke Boston so no more morons like the K-cupcake infest the rest of the country.

Amen.

Sad that a lunatic, who needs Thorazine and electric shock, get such a following.

Anonymous Sam the Man January 22, 2017 2:26 PM  

I was a state guardsman 30~ miles outside of a major metropolis. We had a fair number of policeman in the RTI I was in. Here is what I noted:

1) The police in the counties surrounding the major metropolis were pretty conservative and in no way aligned with democratic politicians or the inner city problematic populations.

2) The last election, BLM, Ferguson and the Dallas assault on police made the police very pissed at the politicians that did not back them up. The middle class American though, did and I think the relations between middle America and the rank and file police have not been better in my observation.

3) Once you get outside of the big cities and inner suburbs, the population is very middle class America values. Even in New York New Jersey and Maryland the cities would be isolated. Further the cities populations are not united, they are powder kegs kept in check by a heavy police force.

4) The Guardsmen in my experience may not be right wing if they came from the city, but they are patriotic. There simply is not enough rewards for them to be in if not.

5) The Hispanic and black guardsmen, if ordered to restore order in the city, will follow orders if they come from lawfully constituted authority. Trump has that for at least 4 years, maybe 8.

6) As enlisted I was not privy the thoughts of officers, but based on what I saw they were at the lower levels very dedicated the United States of America as a unified nation. Of course I have no idea how it is now, I wonder how the ones I knew would react to the July transgendered order. I strongly suspect that the 8 years of Obama did not really change the culture.

Anonymous Jack Amok January 22, 2017 2:36 PM  

The map of the us in 2050, or 2100 at least, will be roughly the map as it is today, but the demographics and the political forms will be different.

If, for example, CA goes independent, it won't fix anything - Mexico will just move a little north, but continue to create the sort of problems they've been creating. Liberals won't govern the place with any better as the real People's Republic of California than they have as the joke version. They place is about bankrupt, and some of the most productive agricultural land on the planet is fallow. Or paved over with crappy track homes. The rest of us will have to take it back.

Aside from Mexicans and Blacks, the divide isn't really racial anyway. It's - as others have said - Left/Right and Urban/Rural. But the Leftists are on the cusp of collapse. Their cities are all facing bankruptcy. I doubt there's a Leftist-run political entity in the US that would survive two more generations of leftist rule. The problem with dividing up the country to settle our political differences is that one side would be incapable of running it's share.

Now, granting greater regional autonomy - sort of like what the Constitution was originally supposed to do - that has promise. Re-Federation, couple with political changes that protect people who work for a living from people who vote for a living. That would get us through the K cycle.

Blogger Thucydides January 22, 2017 2:42 PM  

@ 154

Canada is even more heavily urbanized than the United States, and our equivalent of the Red/Blue divide is equally stark. The political and economic elites live in and control the cities, but cutting the power lines to Toronto or Vancouver would probably cause an even larger political and economic catastrophe than cutting an equivalent "Blue" city in the United States.

I'm actually more interested in the idea of the Blue islands self destructing rather than external action. Their finances are a house of cards, their infrastructure is decayed (due to payments being diverted from essential work to featherbedding political and union nests) and the Blue islands are concentrated masses of the various "diverse" factions the Democrats have been developing through "Identity politics" for decades.

Will the Diverse start openly fighting amongst themselves? Will their infrastructure collapse at an inopportune time, fuelling discontent as citizens freeze in winter, bake in summer or go for prolonged times without running water? Will a financial crisis put their public services out of action as they can no longer pay their bureaucrats, police forces, teacher, firefighters etc.?

To finish them off, all that it would really take is to refuse to come in and fix their problems, and ensure "they" cannot food the countryside seeking to strip Americans of vital resources (including tax dollars). Far less bloody and violent than an open Civil War II scenario as some people discuss.

Anonymous BBGKB January 22, 2017 2:45 PM  

The browns are significantly out-breeding whites Only because of foodstamps/welfare fraud.

casualties from loss of medical care would be vast... Whatever state reconstituted in the aftermath would not have "health care" as a major line item.Because the people who needed it would all be dead.

The cost differences for non-East-Asian minorities is staggering. That's why before Obamacare Asians and whites were better off with a catastrophic plan, except for years they had kids, all the way up till they are eligible for Medicare. The 2 illegal aliens who took 1300+ ambulance rides as taxis in Fresno in one year(thinking they are smarter than gringos by getting free rides) had an incalculable cost to society.

Please! Pretty sure this catfight is even less lame than the actual MMA throw

This is why I wont go to drag shows.

The Ranger Tab you get by going to Ranger school, a punishing course that only 50 % graduate at most, and to get in you have to be a stud. it is a big deal

Not anymore the Rangerettes proved you can complete it just by saying your pussy hurts.

If we're going to isolate a city, it needs to be surrounded first and the troops reasonably well fortified

Cut off the power in wintertime, throw a couple of caltrops/tacks at the outer loop exits & cities surround themselves. A single accident in a metro area can stop traffic in a huge swath for hours. My view is the golden horde wont leave until after they consume bad food/water but here is a cops view. https://greyenigma.wordpress.com/2014/11/01/a-veteran-policemans-observations-on-the-golden-horde-sb/

We cannot - certainly _I_ cannot - abandon to the left family, friends, and comrades in arms anywhere in the country

You can burn down Folsom St San Fran, Bourbon St NO,& all of (NYC,DC,) as long as you leave the nice whitopias alone.

Anonymous Satan's Hamster January 22, 2017 2:54 PM  

"It probably includes Canada, since they will harbor the enemy and will lack the will to control him."

Canada is at least as divided as America. As the Liberals take down the economies of the provinces they control, the conservative provinces will, sooner or later, refuse to subsidize them. Then they'll secede.

Besides which, if Trump does restrict imports and Canada can no longer be a source of cheap labour for US companies, the Liberals will have no idea how to cope with the economic chaos that results. Canadians will vote for adult government in the next election, because they'll have no choice.

Blogger Thucydides January 22, 2017 2:57 PM  

@51

An interesting starting point for a map of the Future USA might be "The Nine Nations of North America", by Joel Garneau. He divides the continent along geographic lines (although perhaps he didn't realize this), suggesting that various different cultures thrive in different environments and access to different sorts of resources.

Robert Kaplan has a similar view of "History as Geography", and his book "An Empire Wilderness" updates Joel Garneau's observations at a more granular level of river valleys and watersheds.

YMMV

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 3:03 PM  

He'd have been run out on a rail, that or lynched, if he'd tried, Andrew. Anti-slavery wasn't just a northern phenom, you know, and the initial stops of the Underground Railway were all down south. As for the details of the thing, slavery and the crops for which it was suited wore out land and, at the time, they didn't really know what to do about it. They had to expand to new lands, but what was left in the US wasn't really suitable. They were looking at Cuba, which was suitable, but the rest of the US was not at all interested in a war with Spain to spread an institution they detested. And then, they couldn't tolerate a large number of free blacks, largely because of concerns with miscegenation. while there really weren't enough ships to carry them to Africa, and then Panama Province, Colombia, was less than enthused about our plan to dump 4 and a half million free slaves on them. And, I assure you, northern states weren't especially enthused about having that many freedmen dumped on them, either.

It was, unfortunately, a problem for which there was not, at the time, an obvious solution.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY January 22, 2017 3:03 PM  

178. Tom Kratman
You don't think what Stick said pertains to you also ?
Damn, you are one stupid-assed yankee.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 3:05 PM  

Ah but I didn't go "anymore," Steve; I went "back when it was hard."

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 3:06 PM  

Oh, Remus, are you even _that_ dumb?

Anonymous Jack Amok January 22, 2017 3:07 PM  

My POINT was that all ranks of the military will be irrelevant. It's the cops to be concerned about after the breakup begins. And the current makeup of cops is concerning.

In any situation just slightly more chaotic than what we have now, police who side against the local population will be slaughtered unless they have military backup. Police can not, never have been able to, pacify a population even slightly in rebellion. For that, you need a occupying military force.

Police exist to deal with a small fraction of the population - called criminals - that prey upon the rest of the population. And they're hard-pressed even to deal with that. If even a sizable minority of the population turns against the Police (or think the Police turned against them) the situation becomes unmanageable for the Po-Po.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 3:10 PM  

And even Chris Mallory's been released from the homosexual black whorehouse in which he is routinely employed to comment here! My joy is complete.

Anonymous Lawyer Guy January 22, 2017 3:12 PM  

Due to my Marine MOS I had a great deal of exposure to Marine Field Grade officers. A majority of them will pledge any position, pay any price other than their career, just for a chance to reach the next rank clean. Many of them have no morals or standards left.

A Marine MEU can defeat almost any irregular or law enforcement based enemy. A MEB can for sure. From what I can see from the outside the same is true for the new Army Brigades.

If the Os can keep the units working, they can defeat any force the President does not agree with. I believe they will follow any President and any orders.

VFM 3061 “Chief Who Notice Things Make Chief Go 'Hmm'” wrote:@Kratman,

I'm former enlisted infantry/retired officer, and like I said, I agree with you about the lower ranks being anti-Hillary/pro-Trump. I might disagree about your line of departure being O-6 and below, since I saw smart LTs who want to be generals spouting diversity like it meant more to them than Judeo Christ.

My POINT was that all ranks of the military will be irrelevant. It's the cops to be concerned about after the breakup begins. And the current makeup of cops is concerning.

Anonymous Jack Amok January 22, 2017 3:29 PM  

I'm actually more interested in the idea of the Blue islands self destructing rather than external action. Their finances are a house of cards...

All of what you said is true, but... the problem is the Blue Islands don't just fumble about until their house of cards comes down around their ears. They aggressively capture - through a broken democratic system - progressively larger and larger circles of existing value around them*.

Detroit should have gone bankrupt decades ago. Same with NYC for that matter. California would be bankrupt now if not for federal money. The liberal response to every failed effort is to do it exactly the same again, but on a bigger scale. The problem is always that not enough resources were poured into the plan, never that the plan itself was doomed. c.f. Obamacare, your local Unified School District, or any region transportation agency in the country.

The liberal failed city-states are not going to quietly go bankrupt - they're going to grasp with increasing desperation for every ounce of value they can commandeer to keep themselves afloat.

* And then ignorantly claim that cities are the engine of wealth creation. You'll see lots of charts and tables showing that cities are net positives in tax revenue while the hicks in the sticks rural areas are net drains on government budgets. But of course that's true, when you count the rents extracted from rural areas by all the regulators, bureaucrats, banksters, and their hangers-on centered in the city as city production. Take half of a Red districts income in various taxes, pay it to government bureaucrats in the city, take another twenty percent in finance fees, pay it to banksters in the city, add in the handful of actually productive city activities - like maybe a heavy equipment dealer - that serve the rural areas, count all that as city productivity, and voila! You've convinced your pack of jackals that the rubes in the countryside are the real ones on the dole.

Blogger JaimeInTexas January 22, 2017 3:36 PM  

I think that Geo. Washington may, may, have opposed secession.
T. Jefferson, of Kentucky (and Virginia) Resolution, opposed secession. Not a chance.

Maybe you were a man of the sword for too long that your are blind to the difference in a people and occupation.

Is there a Nathan in your life, David?

Anonymous Satan's Hamster January 22, 2017 3:52 PM  

"they're going to grasp with increasing desperation for every ounce of value they can commandeer to keep themselves afloat."

Near the end, the Romans made abandoning your farm to avoid high taxes a capital offence. It didn't stop the collapse.

When something can't continue, it doesn't. The only question is how violent and disruptive the collapse will be.

Blogger Tom Kratman January 22, 2017 3:54 PM  

Washington's Farewell Address: "Indissoluble union."

Jefferson is a closer case; against the Kentucky Resolution we have his first inaugural, where he considered the notion "error," and against that his invitation to some northern federalists to leave if they wanted. But then, even the Kentucky resolution didn't mention secession. Then, too, there's this: "if on a temporary superiority of the one party, the other is to resort to a scission of the union, no federal government can ever exist. if to rid ourselves of the present rule of Massachusetts & Connecticut, we break the union, will the evil stop there?" Note, he calls scission of the union "evil."

Blogger cheddarman January 22, 2017 3:55 PM  

Tom Kratman, I retract my statement about you getting angry. I mistook you insults for anger. Please accept my apologies. I don't want to be the house mother of the comments section.

1 – 200 of 263 Newer› Newest»

Post a Comment

Rules of the blog
Please do not comment as "Anonymous". Comments by "Anonymous" will be spammed.

<< Home

Newer Posts Older Posts