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Tuesday, March 28, 2017

How to repeal Obamacare

After all, Republicans didn't vow to replace it, they vowed to repeal it:
In a simple two-page document, an Alabama congressman has filed a bill in the U.S. House of Representatives to repeal Obamacare.

Or, as it is stated in the bill, the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act.

U.S. Rep. Mo Brooks, R-Huntsville, introduced the bill Friday.

"This Act may be cited as the 'Obamacare Repeal Act,'" the bill states.

And the bill uses just one sentence to do it.

"Effective as of Dec. 31, 2017, the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act is repealed, and the provisions of law amended or repealed by such Act are restored or revived as if such Act had not been enacted," the bill states.

And that's it - one sentence.
Needless to say, the cuckservatives and moderates are probably far too stupid to get behind it. But it would certainly be a slick move by the God-Emperor if he did.

The core problem with Republicans is that they feel the need to posture and affect "responsibility". But they didn't pass Obamacare. They're not responsible for it. So, kill it as cleanly and completely as possible, without worrying about the inevitable repercussions. Deal with them as they come, don't try to anticipate and pre-manage them, and in doing so, fail to accomplish the primary objective.

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117 Comments:

Anonymous p-dawg March 28, 2017 8:08 AM  

So, kill it as cleanly and completely as impossible
Freudian slip?

Blogger Felix Bellator March 28, 2017 8:19 AM  

Congressman Mo Brooks, he Dah Man. I hope Trump backs this.

Anonymous RabidRatel March 28, 2017 8:20 AM  

It is a real pity that not more laws are written like this. At least there is very little to obfuscate, interpret or otherwise lawfare about.

Blogger James Dixon March 28, 2017 8:20 AM  

This is what a number of people, myself included, have been arguing for since the beginning (you can see my comment to dh a couple of months ago now). Repeal it, then you'll get some democratic support on fixing the problems.

Anonymous ODG March 28, 2017 8:23 AM  

Yes, total repeal. Stop piling stupid "fixes" to "fix" earlier stupid "fixes".

Blogger Mr.MantraMan March 28, 2017 8:24 AM  

Must keep the monopolies whole, must continue the loot and redistribute algo, must continue, mus contin.....

Blogger Dire Badger March 28, 2017 8:27 AM  

I have always opposed Obamacare, as I oppose all entitlement programs, but I am unsure of the morality of this stance, since I am ex-military and thus do not benefit from it.

Anonymous Churcher March 28, 2017 8:28 AM  

" So, kill it as cleanly and completely as impossible, without worrying about the inevitable repercussions. Deal with them as they come, don't try to anticipate and pre-manage them, and in doing so, fail to accomplish the primary objective."

First, you have to be able to spot a stunt when you see one.

Second, This couldn't pass -- which of course is what makes it a stunt.

Third, If by some magical turn of events it did pass, Trump and the Republicans would have to figure out what would happen to the Trump and the GOP agenda after having lost the house and the Senate in 2018.

24 million people without insurance would start to look pretty good under this bill. The GOP and the president would have to address the question: "Are you willing to accept the fact that hundreds of thousands of Americans will have no access to healthcare and will die?

The fact that any supporters of the President would give this bill any attention points to another problem. There is a certain incompetence inside the new administration right now. It's a combination of not understanding how the Republic operates and not knowing what is realistic and what is possible. This problem bleeds over into the President's supporters' minds.

Blogger JP March 28, 2017 8:29 AM  

RabidRatel wrote:It is a real pity that not more laws are written like this. At least there is very little to obfuscate, interpret or otherwise lawfare about.

LOL have you seen what they've done with interpretations of the 2nd Amendment?

Anonymous JAG March 28, 2017 8:34 AM  

We know what's in it before we have passed it. Imagine that.

Blogger Salt March 28, 2017 8:42 AM  

After all the repeal bills during Obama this should be a no brainer. Simplicity at its best.

Blogger StrawMan March 28, 2017 8:46 AM  

Repealing Obamacare entirely is more than a budget maneuver so will likely require 60 votes in the Senate. A slick political move for sure, but not much else.

Anonymous Man of the Atom March 28, 2017 8:46 AM  

Churcher wrote:

First, you have to be able to spot a stunt when you see one.

Second, This couldn't pass -- which of course is what makes it a stunt.


By that definition, all congressional legislation is a stunt.

Third, If by some magical turn of events it did pass, Trump and the Republicans would have to figure out what would happen to the Trump and the GOP agenda after having lost the house and the Senate in 2018.

24 million people without insurance would start to look pretty good under this bill. The GOP and the president would have to address the question: "Are you willing to accept the fact that hundreds of thousands of Americans will have no access to healthcare and will die?

The fact that any supporters of the President would give this bill any attention points to another problem. There is a certain incompetence inside the new administration right now. It's a combination of not understanding how the Republic operates and not knowing what is realistic and what is possible. This problem bleeds over into the President's supporters' minds.


Sounds like you are here to sow FUD, Churchian. Sometimes, you gotta risk breaking some eggs.

“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”

Blogger Michael Kingswood March 28, 2017 8:50 AM  

"Repealing Obamacare entirely is more than a budget maneuver so will likely require 60 votes in the Senate. A slick political move for sure, but not much else."

You didn't pay any attention to how Obamacare was passed in the first place, did you?

Blogger Aeoli Pera March 28, 2017 8:52 AM  

The core problem with Republicans is that their averaged facial morph looks like a flamboyant homosexual, and I don't mean a top. I'll ask the guy who made it if I can post it here.

Blogger exfarmkid March 28, 2017 8:55 AM  

12. Churcher.

I doubt that you have been on the receiving end of the ACA travesty, where you can't afford to see a doctor because you are going into a deep hole to pay the premiums.

Kindly spare us your opinions.

Blogger Achilles March 28, 2017 8:55 AM  

Why aren't GOP congressmen pumping out small bills like this every day?

If the Republicans in congress were smart (and not globalists) they would follow Trump's lead with the EOs and start pumping out small bills like this constantly and passing them. Repeal Obamacare, health insurance free market interstate competition, repeal NFA, taxes, etc. They could even sneak in the usual pork and naming buildings in-between the more popular bills. The fast pace keeps the Dems on defense and allows the GOP to say they're getting stuff done. And the small bills would allow regular citizens to understand the bills enough to realize the Lefty opposition is all fake news.

Blogger exfarmkid March 28, 2017 8:55 AM  

Sorry Man of the Atom. Careless of me.

Anonymous Churcher March 28, 2017 8:57 AM  

"Second, This couldn't pass -- which of course is what makes it a stunt.

By that definition, all congressional legislation is a stunt."

Alternatively, it could mean that many in Congress don't know a stunt when they see one.

"Sounds like you are here to sow FUD, Churchian. Sometimes, you gotta risk breaking some eggs."

I don't know what FUD is. However, you make a good point. The Democrats knew they were risking their seats by passing Obamacare without much bipartisan support. Yet they did it on principle. Thats the kind of attitude you need to have to effect change + plus a bill that CAN pass with one party support. At this point, the GOP and the President have neither that attitude or that kind of healthcare bill.

Anonymous Überdeplorable Psychedelic Cat Hair March 28, 2017 9:00 AM  

@4. I've argued the same thing too. Here's to hoping that monstrosity is obliterated and I can actually afford a decent plan.

Blogger Shimshon March 28, 2017 9:01 AM  

Regarding an alleged inability to pass the 60 vote threshold...so what? A filibuster is a real thing. A threat is meaningless. Republicucks should call the Democrats on it. Bring it on and see how long they can keep it going. It's not like they can have their Kindle read a prepared speech out loud while they sleep. They should do it for the entertainment value alone. And the potential victory is worth far more than a few hours of discomfort among a bunch of pampered and (otherwise) useless Senators.

Anonymous Churcher March 28, 2017 9:04 AM  

"I doubt that you have been on the receiving end of the ACA travesty, where you can't afford to see a doctor because you are going into a deep hole to pay the premiums."

That's right. I can afford the $700 per month I pay. But there is a simple reason I and others pay that much: There aren't enough healthy young people in the pool of payers. If you want to bring down premiums (and deductibles) and if you want to keep more insurers in the market,there is a simple solution. 1) increase the penalty for not buying insurance to encourage more people buying, 2) lower the max age a dependant can stay on their parents' insurance to 23 so, again, more young people pay for insurance, 3) expand the medicaid option to all states, 4) selectively offer a public option.

However, this plan, while fixing Obamacare so that it is more affordable, won't pass ideological muster with most in the GOP.

It leaves the GOP with a problem. Either live with the knowledge and problem of millions having no way to get healthcare by putting in a purely market approach to healthcare or find a way to defy the basic economics of insurance: having a large enough pool of healthy who will pay for the unhealthy with the promise that the healthy will get the same when they need it.

Blogger Chris Mallory March 28, 2017 9:05 AM  

Shimshon wrote:Regarding an alleged inability to pass the 60 vote threshold...so what? A filibuster is a real thing. A threat is meaningless. Republicucks should call the Democrats on it

They need to make a few changes to Senate rules first. Ban all food and water from the Senate floor. Ban using the bathroom while on the Senate floor. (No more pissing in trash cans while your buddies hold up blankets.) Ban the wearing of "sports" shoes on the Senate floor. No more gentleman's agreement on filibusters. If you want one, it lasts as long as you can talk under the above changes.

Blogger Chris Mallory March 28, 2017 9:08 AM  

Churcher wrote:3) expand the medicaid option to all states

This one won't fly. The states cannot be forced to spend money. The current Medicaid expansion started out with Federal matching grants to finance the expansion. But those grants were gradually phased out, leaving the states that expanded holding the bag to pay for Obama's vision.

Anonymous p-dawg March 28, 2017 9:08 AM  

@Churcian
When your business model is predicated upon forcing people who don't need your product to buy it in order to subsidize a small number of others, it's a bad business model. You're a lot better off basing your business model on something that people actively want to do rather than on something that they actively want to avoid.

Blogger Happy Housewife March 28, 2017 9:09 AM  

"The GOP and the president would have to address the question: "Are you willing to accept the fact that hundreds of thousands of Americans will have no access to healthcare and will die?"

I'm so sick of this stupid talking point. There will be hundreds of thousands of people without access to health INSURANCE, not health care. Look up EMTALA.

Anonymous Man of the Atom March 28, 2017 9:10 AM  

exfarmkid wrote:Sorry Man of the Atom. Careless of me.

Been there, done that. That's why it needs to go, and Denniger's view of tearing down the whole rotten mess of US Healthcare has to be done NOW, not later. Will be people be hurt? Yes. People will be hurt no matter what is done at this point. We wait and dither, and many more will be hurt. We do nothing, and many more will be hurt. We transition to something more market-based, maybe many will be hurt.

In my view, this is the decision we had with Trump vs the Establishment. Death and Destruction down one road vs a slim chance down the other to avoid Death and Destruction.

Blogger pyrrhus March 28, 2017 9:14 AM  

Exactly. Even better would be to add a sentence stating that henceforth there will be a free market in health insurance and medical services throughout the USA and across State lines, notwithstanding any State laws to the contrary. The Commerce Clause, you know....

Blogger B.J. March 28, 2017 9:15 AM  

What we really need is a constitutional amendment banning all entitlements, or this is just going to keep happening.

Churcher, you're an idiot. No one got extra coverage under the ACA, they were just shuffled between medicare and private insurers paid for via subsidies. The ACA forces everyone to get a comprehensive plan that covers everything (mammograms for 20 year old men). Forcing everyone to buy something will never drive down it's cost; we have 100 years of socialism as an example.

If we really wanted to lower healthcare costs, there are simple solutions. Disband the AMA. Break hospital monopolization. Throw the crackheads out on the street. There is simply no reason why someone who goes into the hospital for a broken leg should get a $10,000 bill, when the same medical care for a dog costs $100.

Anonymous Andrew E. March 28, 2017 9:19 AM  

Here's a very interesting article from Deroy Murdock who says Ryan and the House Republicans were taking a far too narrow understanding of what could be accomplished via reconciliation in the Senate, using welfare reform from the 90's as a model. Interesting that this very crucial point never seemed to come up in the debate over Ryancare. And why wasn't the White House aware of this or putting it more front and center?

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/445966/obamacare-repeal-filibuster-threat

Blogger JACIII March 28, 2017 9:19 AM  

The problem with healthcare isn't that it is too expensive, but that it is free for too many.
Fix the work force participation rate. Cancel commiecare.

Anonymous Grayman March 28, 2017 9:21 AM  

Churcher wrote:"I doubt that you have been on the receiving end of the ACA travesty, where you can't afford to see a doctor because you are going into a deep hole to pay the premiums."

That's right. I can afford the $700 per month I pay. But there is a simple reason I and others pay that much: There aren't enough healthy young people in the pool of payers. If you want to bring down premiums (and deductibles) and if you want to keep more insurers in the market,there is a simple solution. 1) increase the penalty for not buying insurance to encourage more people buying, 2) lower the max age a dependant can stay on their parents' insurance to 23 so, again, more young people pay for insurance, 3) expand the medicaid option to all states, 4) selectively offer a public option.

However, this plan, while fixing Obamacare so that it is more affordable, won't pass ideological muster with most in the GOP.

It leaves the GOP with a problem. Either live with the knowledge and problem of millions having no way to get healthcare by putting in a purely market approach to healthcare or find a way to defy the basic economics of insurance: having a large enough pool of healthy who will pay for the unhealthy with the promise that the healthy will get the same when they need it.



The average joe needs to stop eating Twinkies and take responsibility for their own health. There is no need for the majority to be forced to subsidize the insane medical monopolies that are overpriced by 70% to 90%.
Everyone also needs to wake up and realize that medical services just like anything else are not a “right” and are not free. Too bad for all of us. But whether it’s done through a government system or through a “free market” mechanism rationing is a fact of life. Not everyone can drive a Ferrari, not everyone can afford a $250,000 cancer treatment that MAY extend your life expectancy by 6 months while you puke your brains out the entire time.
The majority of our society needs to accept mortality. Do the best you can with the time you have. Take care of yourself by taking simple steps such as exercising and not eating garbage and the fast majority of peoples “healthcare” needs significantly decrease.

Blogger Cail Corishev March 28, 2017 9:23 AM  

The core problem with Republicans is that they feel the need to posture and affect "responsibility". But they didn't pass Obamacare. They're not responsible for it.

That's a good point. It's too easy for good men to fall into the trap of, "Now that millions of people have been forced to participate in [government program], we can't just repeal it and leave them out in the cold (even if that's where they were before being dragged into it). We can't shut it down until we find a way to do it without harming a single person."

That's impossible, so it never happens. I honestly don't know what would happen to people who signed up for Obamacare if it were simply repealed like this; but a solution for them would be more likely to be found, and quickly, after repeal, when they're not trying to make it perfect.

Blogger Nate March 28, 2017 9:23 AM  

"That's right. I can afford the $700 per month I pay. But there is a simple reason I and others pay that much: There aren't enough healthy young people in the pool of payers"

You blithering moron. 700? Try 1800. 1800 and everyone covered is under 50. 1800 a month for garbage coverages with 10k out of pocket before even a hint of actual coverage happens.

Before Obamacare... actual insurace... that covered all kinds of stuff.. and had only 2k out of pocket was 600 a month for the same family.

And there were fewer payers in the pool back then.

So sincerely... Shut the hell up.

Blogger Nate March 28, 2017 9:25 AM  

also i will note that the bill was written by a Rep from Alabama.

yet again I say...

Roll Tide.

Anonymous Rodrigo Duterte March 28, 2017 9:26 AM  

Must keep the monopolies whole, must continue the loot and redistribute algo, must continue, mus contin.....

Sounds like an integral part of the Spic-Nig Cycle™.

Blogger Salt March 28, 2017 9:28 AM  

Email, tweet, FB... and ask POTUS to get behind this bill. It fulfills a campaign promise.

Blogger StrawMan March 28, 2017 9:29 AM  

It passed cloture 60-39 and passed with the same count.

Anonymous Man of the Atom March 28, 2017 9:31 AM  

Churcher wrote:"I doubt that you have been on the receiving end of the ACA travesty, where you can't afford to see a doctor because you are going into a deep hole to pay the premiums."

That's right. I can afford the $700 per month I pay. But there is a simple reason I and others pay that much: There aren't enough healthy young people in the pool of payers. If you want to bring down premiums (and deductibles) and if you want to keep more insurers in the market,there is a simple solution. 1) increase the penalty for not buying insurance to encourage more people buying, 2) lower the max age a dependant can stay on their parents' insurance to 23 so, again, more young people pay for insurance, 3) expand the medicaid option to all states, 4) selectively offer a public option.

However, this plan, while fixing Obamacare so that it is more affordable, won't pass ideological muster with most in the GOP.

It leaves the GOP with a problem. Either live with the knowledge and problem of millions having no way to get healthcare by putting in a purely market approach to healthcare or find a way to defy the basic economics of insurance: having a large enough pool of healthy who will pay for the unhealthy with the promise that the healthy will get the same when they need it.


Those "young people" aren't your damned slaves, Churcher. They aren't there to help you or anyone else bankroll Insurance Companies, Banking, or Healthcare into staying viable. You seem to think theft equals altruism. It doesn't.

You are part of the reason that these "young people" are mired in college debt and consumer debt. You want to add one more brick to that wall for them. That means no home ownership, delayed marriage and family formation, reduced lifetime income.

These "young people" have a lot of personal responsibility for situation they find themselves in, but you want to heap it on them, all for the "uninsured".

I'll trade one uninsured for one productive young person going forward.

Anonymous Man of the Atom March 28, 2017 9:36 AM  

Churcher, let's boil your philosophy down:

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs"

That close enough?

Blogger Chris Jackson March 28, 2017 9:37 AM  

Whatever they thought they did last time, actually proposing the repeal is a great place to start.

Blogger Cail Corishev March 28, 2017 9:44 AM  

Is it really that hard to spot the new name Samuree/Tad is posting under today?

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer March 28, 2017 9:45 AM  

The fix was in from the start. No Republican voted for Obamacare because none were needed. The corporate handouts and the takeover of the healthcare industry (none dare call it socialism) was not truly opposed by the PTB in the GOP, they just made noises so as to continue to lull their base into continuing to support them.

Then Donald Trump happened. The game plan now is to pretend to support repeal, but "replace" is just camouflage for doing as little as possible to disrupt the status quo and working with the Democrat party to minimize the God Emperor's creative destruction.

Anonymous Laz March 28, 2017 9:46 AM  

Whatever happened to just taking care of family? I'm one of those millions that can't afford the premiums without an employer paying for it and be damned if dad dies with strangers. Healthcare is not a right.

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer March 28, 2017 9:48 AM  

24 million people without insurance would start to look pretty good under this bill. The GOP and the president would have to address the question: "Are you willing to accept the fact that hundreds of thousands of Americans will have no access to healthcare and will die?

Yeah, that stuff you just said, that is pure, unadulterated bullshit.

Blogger James Dixon March 28, 2017 9:48 AM  

Of course there's already a repeal bill in process. Red State had an article on it on Sunday: http://www.redstate.com/prevaila/2017/03/26/replica-successful-2015-obamacare-repeal-languishing-committee/

It's been in committee the whole time. They're refusing to pass it on to the House for consideration.

And Churcher is a lying troll, pure and simple.

As for the sixty vote argument, the attempted filibuster of Gorsuch is probably going to make that matter moot. Though I agree with Shimshon that treating a filibuster the proper way would make for great entertainment.

Blogger Silly But True March 28, 2017 9:49 AM  

Churcher, you are lying about the 24m.

That's the number who will voluntarily choose to drop insurance when the government loses the unAmerican requirement which forced them to buy a product they didn't want.

The number of those who can't afford anything remains what it always was: about 6m+ at and below poverty line.

And there are better ways to address their needs than set up a system which requires every American to buy something forever.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother March 28, 2017 9:49 AM  

Let me translate Churcher into English:

Me Boomer me me me me me me

Blogger James Dixon March 28, 2017 9:54 AM  

> Needless to say, the cuckservatives and moderates are probably far too stupid to get behind it.

That's where proper leadership would help. But since the leadership is still the cucks, that's going to be a problem for the foreseeable future.

Blogger maniacprovost March 28, 2017 9:55 AM  

Needless to say, the cuckservatives and moderates are probably far too stupid to get behind it.

Uh, they're in favor of socialist health care. They don't have any reason to try to repeal ObamaCare- they just want to rebrand it and take the credit.

Anonymous Grayman March 28, 2017 9:56 AM  

Cail Corishev wrote:The core problem with Republicans is that they feel the need to posture and affect "responsibility". But they didn't pass Obamacare. They're not responsible for it.

That's a good point. It's too easy for good men to fall into the trap of, "Now that millions of people have been forced to participate in [government program], we can't just repeal it and leave them out in the cold (even if that's where they were before being dragged into it). We can't shut it down until we find a way to do it without harming a single person."

That's impossible, so it never happens. I honestly don't know what would happen to people who signed up for Obamacare if it were simply repealed like this; but a solution for them would be more likely to be found, and quickly, after repeal, when they're not trying to make it perfect.


These debates sound like the conversation of a junkie. But I can’t stop using Muh Meth, it will be unpleasant and painful!!!! But I can’t stop stuffing my pie whole I’m 350lbs because I’m big boned, it’s genetic!.....

Blogger Jack Ward March 28, 2017 9:57 AM  

@23
This one won't fly. The states cannot be forced to spend money
With respect, Chris, the Dems with their O care forced us to spend money and buy insurance or else we will steal some of your money at gunpoint. In spite of what justice roberts says thats obviously unconstitutional.

Blogger maniacprovost March 28, 2017 10:00 AM  

It leaves the GOP with a problem. Either live with the knowledge and problem of millions having no way to get healthcare by putting in a purely market approach to healthcare or

I don't see the problem.

Blogger John Regan March 28, 2017 10:01 AM  

Why can't the federal government just build hospitals, clinics and so on, and do health care directly? I mean, if it's into health care anyway, and it has been in a big way since well before Obamacare?

https://strikelawyer.wordpress.com/2017/03/25/trumpcare/

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer March 28, 2017 10:02 AM  

Break hospital monopolization.

In Alabama (I don't know about other states) you have to go before a board and apply for permission to open a new hospital. The board makes its decision based on whether or not there is a need for a hospital in the area you are proposing to open one.

The PTBs can obfuscate it all they want, this is simply a way for the existing players to protect themselves from competition. The only reason I have ever heard for this is that hospitals get a lot of government funds. Well grocery and convenience stores do too. EBT. Yet for some reason you don't have to get permission from a government committee to open one of those.

Blogger Knight Of the Realm March 28, 2017 10:02 AM  

Churcher says
Are you willing to accept the fact that hundreds of thousands of Americans will have no access to healthcare and will die?
Yes , if you believe O care saved hundreds of thousands your a fool

Anonymous Andrew E. March 28, 2017 10:03 AM  

As for the sixty vote argument, the attempted filibuster of Gorsuch is probably going to make that matter moot. Though I agree with Shimshon that treating a filibuster the proper way would make for great entertainment.

My understanding is that using the nuclear option on Gorsuch does not meant the filibuster is also eliminated for legislation. That would have to be done separately. For example, the Dems have already eliminated the filibuster for federal and appellate judges but not for Supreme Court judges, which is what's under discussion now depending on what the Dems decide to do with Gorsuch.

Blogger praetorian March 28, 2017 10:06 AM  

Healthcare is the troll comment of government: the best option is not to touch the poop, but we just can't help ourselves.

I'd like to see Trump "temporarily" suspend enforcement of the penalty for people who make less than 80k and suspend all the other special deals bammers made to get it over the line, then watch the thing collapse.

Blogger frigger611 March 28, 2017 10:07 AM  

Obamacare is tens of thousands of pages of costly lies. Lies, lies, and more lies.

This simple bill is exactly what is needed. To save the body the gangrenous limb needs to be removed.

No democrat ever gave a fuck about all the millions of us productive people who work and maybe struggle to make ends meet. The dems just ripped away from us the plans and doctors we were happy with in order to give free health care to millions of illegals, losers, and layabouts - in exchange for votes and power. IT IS NOT MY JOB TO TAKE CARE OF MY NEIGHBOR AND HIS FAMILY.

To paraphrase Ayn Rand, "Why is it evil for me to enjoy my health plan, but good for it to be taken away and given to a stranger to enjoy?"

Blogger Phat Repat March 28, 2017 10:11 AM  

It's really rather simple, it will collapse upon itself; so what Trump did was to paint both the Democraps and Repubes into a corner. Brilliant! The best thing that could happen for Trump is an economic event, and sooner rather than later. Perhaps it will be the debt ceiling, perhaps the $ crisis; but it must happen soon so as to avoid marking him as the culprit (though of course #VeryFakeNews will try).

Blogger Peter Jackson March 28, 2017 10:15 AM  

People fail to distinguish between health insurance and a health care benefit program . My company provides a policy which includes both, at a cost to the company (pre-Obamacare) of about $30K/year. Obamacare is attempting to give everyone a $30K/year benefit program, even if that person is only working a $20K/year job. This is clearly impractical, unaffordable and absurd.

What the state governments should do is provide universal catastrophic-only health insurance which covers the healthy 25 year old who contracts a rare disease. Such coverage should cost no more than $50/month for everyone. As for health care benefits (regular checkups, etc.) you're on your own to buy a plan in the free market, or have your employer provide it, etc.

Anonymous craig March 28, 2017 10:22 AM  

53. John Regan: "Why can't the federal government just build hospitals, clinics and so on, and do health care directly?"

The good news is, the Federal government could do this now without building a single hospital or hiring a single doctor/nurse/orderly. All it would have to do is abolish the VA and provide veterans the same health insurance Federal civil service employees get.

The bad news is, the standard of care would be that of the VA.

Blogger Silly But True March 28, 2017 10:27 AM  

I changed my mind on legal process to overcome the filibuster.

The original 60-vote legislation was not passed through a legal process.

So repeal it now with simple majority reconciliation.

And if lawsuit comes up; counter to take that legal review back to the original 2009 legislative process, and specifically to the legislation which originated in the Senate not House.

And all the while tge lawsuit is running its course, Feds and States act like repeal is in effect.

Anonymous rienzi March 28, 2017 10:31 AM  

Churcher said: "Are you willing to accept the fact that hundreds of thousands of Americans will have no access to healthcare and will die?"

No access to health care? What planet do you live on? My local emergency room is packed full of Guatemalans with headaches, and Latrina's numerous brood with the sniffles. All "free" and no questions asked.

Blogger James Dixon March 28, 2017 10:31 AM  

> My understanding is that using the nuclear option on Gorsuch does not meant the filibuster is also eliminated for legislation.

They can do either, or both. It's up to them. But if you're going to shut it down, you might as well shut it down completely. It's not like the Dem's won't the moment they get back in power.

Blogger Tom March 28, 2017 10:34 AM  

Precisely.. But wha about muh healthcare!?

Anonymous BbigGayKoranBurner March 28, 2017 10:36 AM  

DieVerseCity is strength in medicine. Fake doctor Concrete booty

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/03/28/woman-who-enhanced-butts-with-glue-and-cement-gets-10-years-for-manslaughter/

There is simply no reason why someone who goes into the hospital for a broken leg should get a $10,000 bill, when the same medical care for a dog costs $100.

They dog might get better care.

we can't just repeal it and leave them out in the cold (even if that's where they were before being dragged into it).

Oy vey those illegals and junkies need a good home like a NY Times reporters apartment.

You blithering moron. 700? Try 1800. 1800 and everyone covered is under 50

Nate I thought your wife was a nurse, couldn't she get better than that?

Why can't the federal government just build hospitals, clinics and so on, and do health care directly?

We only do that in 3rdworld places in hopes of creating drug resistant diseases because the natives are too stupid to take pills as directed. Obamacare was designed to take healthcare $$$from old Asians/Whites and give to illegals/junkies.

Anonymous Grayman March 28, 2017 10:43 AM  

Peter @60

As for health care benefits (regular checkups, etc.) you're on your own to buy a plan in the free market, or have your employer provide it, etc.

No, there shouldn't be plans for "routine maintenance". You don't by a plan to change the oil on your car or provide new tires.
The more people and organizations you add into the mix the more corrupt and expensive it becomes.
There is no reason that "routine maintenance" such as checkups, sick calls, etc shouldn't be entirely out of pocket. There are multiple real world examples of the costs and they are less then any premium you would ever pay.

Anonymous kfg March 28, 2017 10:48 AM  

@63: "My local emergency room is packed full of Guatemalans with headaches, and Latrina's numerous brood with the sniffles. All "free" and no questions asked."

Once upon a time there used to something called a "free clinic." In a time somewhat before that time anybody who had any sort of job could afford to simply pay a doctor for anything short of catastrophic care.

And then the Federal government decided that we needed a national healthcare plan.

Anonymous kfg March 28, 2017 10:51 AM  

"No, there shouldn't be plans for "routine maintenance"."

It isn't even routine maintenance. It's routine inspection. 99 44/100 percent of the time no maintenance is actually required.

Blogger Mountain Man March 28, 2017 10:58 AM  

Get er done !

Anonymous BBGKB March 28, 2017 10:58 AM  

No, there shouldn't be plans for "routine maintenance". You don't by a plan to change the oil on your car or provide new tires

I have seen ads for such coverage but I doubt they are less than self paying.

Anonymous FP March 28, 2017 11:18 AM  

"That's right. I can afford the $700 per month I pay. But there is a simple reason I and others pay that much: There aren't enough healthy young people in the pool of payers"

No, you pay that much because the healthcare industry is allowed to screw you over by law.

Anonymous kfg March 28, 2017 11:34 AM  

@71: "I have seen ads for such coverage but I doubt they are less than self paying."

A bulk service package is not insurance. It's just a bulk purchase.

The very idea of "insurance" against known fixed costs is retarded.

Anonymous Rather, Not March 28, 2017 11:34 AM  

I like the idea of giving veterans the same insurance as other federal civil service, turn the VA into the second tier 'free' health care system, and remove the requirement to serve from all the other health care providers. The illegal immigrants and others who can't pay can wait on the former-VA waiting lists, the Vets can get care, and the rest of the healthcare networks can punt the deadbeats to the former VA system. And no complaints...it was supposed to be good enough for our vets, it is a damn site better than those who are not paying their own way deserve. It becomes an automatic catastrophic coverage plan, and we could even phase out medicare/medicaid over time. If you're really sick, and you really can't pay, you go to the gov't hospital and take your chances. Otherwise, pay for the quality care you receive. That combined with insurance across state lines, and health care cost/health insurance cost individual deductability is well on the way to a functional system.

Anonymous gxg March 28, 2017 11:35 AM  

Our rate went up to nearly $1,800 for coverage that would be useless unless we were hit by a bus. (Ironically, the dems are importing lots of terrorist types, so that's not nearly as unlikely as it once was.)

We dropped insurance and went to a Christian Health Sharing Ministry. This saves us $1,200 a month. Plus, it takes us out of the pool and speeds up the inevitable Obamacare death spiral.

The sooner this monstrosity dies, the better.

Anonymous instasetting March 28, 2017 11:46 AM  

Roll Tide!!

Anonymous The OASF March 28, 2017 12:00 PM  

The issue here is that the GOPe is trying to preemptively bail out the insurance companies because the Obamacare collapse will trigger great recession v2.0. Can Trump see that or is he in on it? Who knows.

Point being, he elites want us all sick, bankrupt, and dead. The literally last thing they want on Earth is for the 99 percent to have descent, affordable health care. Don't expect to get it anytime soon.

Anonymous Avalanche March 28, 2017 12:01 PM  

@7 "Are you willing to accept the fact that hundreds of thousands of Americans will have no access to healthcare and will die?"

But hundreds of thousands of people did not die BEFORE Obamycare -- so why do you think they will die NOW?! I have had my "health insurance by "Mastercard" for the past 20 years (I paid my own way for health CARE; i had no choice!) I could not POSSIBLY afford obamycare!

The year it came swaggering in slapping business owners around (except the connected ones and Congress), I paid myself (I run a very small American manufacturing co.) a whopping $13k. (That's THIRTEEN thousand, not 130k!) But the company profit -- which counts as "income" to me, but, of course, I could NOT pull it out of the company because, you know (do you know?), that's what the company RUNS ON NEXT YEAR!!) I looked at obamycare -- and AS A BUSINESS OWNER I could not qualify for a single penny of subsidy!! The cheapest plan I could find was literally multiple thousnads of dollars out of my reach!

But hey look: *I.* did. not. die.! I absolutely had access to health CARE. And yes, the kidney stone I suffered the year after my husband died damn near bankrupted me -- (well, the ER tried -- did you know they TRIPLE the cost of everything on the uninsured?! And, of course, no employed White person is going to escape the heavy hand of the hospitals and doctors!! Only immigrants and illegals get to skip out on paying!)

I have had to manage my own health CARE for most of my life. (And I use the term manage carefully: both in terms of AFFORDING help from the medical system, and in terms of learning and doing what is correct to promote health.)

And, until we can get the God Emperor to REPEAL EMTALA (look it up), the immigrants and illegals (and natives who aren't interested in paying / willing or able to pay for care) will continue to flood ERs for "free" care.

So, no. VERY few people will die from lack of access to health INSURANCE.

And oh hey look: it's another leftie lie: NONE of this is about health *CARE*; it's ALL about health INSURANCE! Join me in always correcting their lie with the true-and-accurate meme: it's health INSURANCE, not health care, no matter WHO is describing it.

Blogger Pteronarcyd March 28, 2017 12:03 PM  

Unfortunately, Trump campaigned on "repeal and replace," and has seemingly promised a replacement that is utopian.

The smart thing to do is to enact this simple repeal, then have Trump form a bipartisan commission to formulate a consensus replacement, if a non-dysfunctional one can be had.

Anonymous Avalanche March 28, 2017 12:04 PM  

@8 " It's a combination of not understanding how the Republic operates and not knowing what is realistic"

The Republic is NOT OPERATING! It's crashing and burning! There is no "realistic" kind-and-gentle way to stop this catastrophe -- this is an all-hands-on-deck emergency!

If you look and see this Republic "operating", then you need to clean your glasses -- or un-brainwash your mind!

Anonymous BBGKB March 28, 2017 12:12 PM  

The west needs to stop importing medically needy 3rd worlders. They basically evolved to live just long enough to squat out zerg.

Soros pays for fleet to ship shitlings to Europe
http://disobedientmedia.com/italian-officials-call-for-investigation-of-george-soros-supported-ngo-migrant-fleet/

OT: but I know how we like our Roman-hun stories

Oy vey but DieVerseCity means more ethnic food:
"Ancient Romans may have been cozier with Huns than they let on ... Roman settlers swapped menus with them"
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/ancient-romans-may-have-been-cozier-huns-they-let

Blogger Matthew N March 28, 2017 12:14 PM  

Is there a reason you highlighted this bill by some politician nobody knows over, say, Senator Rand Paul's repeal bill?

Anonymous Avalanche March 28, 2017 12:16 PM  

@22 "1) increase the penalty for not buying insurance to encourage more people buying, 2) lower the max age a dependant can stay on their parents' insurance to 23 so, again, more young people pay for insurance, 3) expand the medicaid option to all states,"

Have you never heard of SLAVERY!?!? You actually wrote (out loud and in public!!):

1. MAKE SLAVES of young people by forcing them to buy something they don't want or need in order to pay for other people. (...to "encourage" more people?!? Do you lie often? Uh, yeah, apparently!)

2. Force MORE young people into slavery by requiring everyone to have this thing, but then allowing fewer people to get it (slightly) cheaper. (I'm against ANY children over 18 on their parents policies. Don't care if in college or not. Let's let (oooh, let's FORCE, you seem to like force!) the insurers make a mid-way policy class: "young and healthy but no longer children" -- oh hey: don't they call that using actuarial tables? You know, like, based on reality!?

3. Force DOCTORS into slavery providing health CARE for people who can't pay for -- at rates the doctors can't afford to work for! (My mom's doc gets $8 for her visit. HOW is supposed to stay in business? How is SHE supposed to get care after he has to quit?)


Oh, and you left this out:
5. FORCE people who want catastrophic insurance ONLY -- (insurance that covers only massive medical expenses) but not "oil changes and new windshield wiper blades" to spend more than they can on obamycare or they are not ALLOWED to buy catastrophic policies.

Are you even American?!!?

Anonymous Avalanche March 28, 2017 12:18 PM  

@24 " those grants were gradually phased out, leaving the states that expanded holding the bag to pay for Obama's vision."

Thus the wisdom of some few states refusing to play the obamycare game!! (They tried the same thing with paying to hire more cops... for a few years .. then leaving the states holding the bill again!

Anonymous Avalanche March 28, 2017 12:25 PM  

@40 "Churcher, let's boil your philosophy down:
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs"
That close enough?"

I'm sorry, Man of the Atom -- you've not done this correctly

It's
"From each according to MORE than his ability, to each according to his needs"

(Blood from stones (hey! Sell it for plasma!), money from the lower middle class working person (you don't need housing!)... you know -- all those things the commies pretend exist!)

Anonymous Man of the Atom March 28, 2017 12:41 PM  

@86 Avalance
"From each according to MORE than his ability, to each according to his DEMANDS"

Perhaps this as a compromise?

Anonymous Grayman March 28, 2017 12:49 PM  

While we are on a roll, the FDA needs to be nuked from orbit as well. despite what they claim, they arent doing jack for you and me, they are simply a means to keep the little fish out of the market. The big boys love the FDA as they can afford annual $250,000 registration fees while potential upstarts cant even come close. The FDA is all about protecting existing market plays, safety and efficacy is a joke!!!

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey March 28, 2017 12:55 PM  

@Man od the Atom

"Those "young people" aren't your damned slaves, Churcher. They aren't there to help you or anyone else bankroll Insurance Companies, Banking, or Healthcare into staying viable. You seem to think theft equals altruism. It doesn't."

Actually, the idea that forcing others to be "altruistic" against their own will is the highest possible good (far more "moral" than being altruistic oneself), seems to form the basis of a lot of the PC/ SJW moral system, to the extent that they have one. You're not going to argue him out of it; it's a core element of his weltanschauung, strange and distorted as it is.

Bruce Charlton's "Thought Prison" does an excellent job of dissecting this aspect of the twisted moral reasoning of leftist true believers.

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey March 28, 2017 1:02 PM  

@Laz

"Whatever happened to just taking care of family?"

Taking care of family = bad. Telescopic philanthropy, on the other hand, especially if you are forcing others to engage in it, rather than doing it yourself? Very good. Yes, that is how they think.

Blogger James Dixon March 28, 2017 1:02 PM  

> Is there a reason you highlighted this bill by some politician nobody knows over, say, Senator Rand Paul's repeal bill?

Spending bills have to start in the House. I still have no idea how Obamacare got around that detail.

Anonymous Man of the Atom March 28, 2017 1:06 PM  

@89. Francis Parker Yockey

I don't expect true believers to be turned by argument; too far down that path except for maybe God to help them. These things like Churcher are a walking moral and ethical disease. It's good to ID the ones that have it.

No different than knowing who the zombies are so you can ready your repellent.

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey March 28, 2017 1:20 PM  

@BBGKB

"Soros pays for fleet to ship shitlings to Europe"

Related-- background info on how the NGO invader-smuggling operation works:

https://gefira.org/en/2016/12/04/ngos-are-smuggling-immigrants-into-europe-on-an-industrial-scale/

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-09/ngo-fleet-bussing-migrants-eu-has-ties-george-soros-hillary-clinton-donors

https://gefira.org/en/2016/11/15/caught-in-the-act-ngos-deal-in-migrant-smuggling/

Good to see the Italians at least making noises about getting serious, though.

Blogger Unknown March 28, 2017 1:45 PM  


Here is all the Republicans should do, but they have to play long ball:

Step 1 - eliminate mandate, if you don't want to buy obmacare you don't have to no penalty
Step 2 - watch the costs go up and up and up, and maybe even make some laws and rules to make it go up faster such as eliminate all subsidies, add some stupid requirements that all plans must cover petcare or something
Step 3 - at the same time, eliminate rules and make it easier for the private market to be cheaper and more efficient
Step 4 - create a new block grant program to fund many new state and local charity hospitals and free clinics to provide healthcare to the poor who can't pay anyway so its stupid to put them in a private for-profit insurance system
Step 5 - make it illegal to use any commercial hospitals, facilities for healthcare in anything but a life threatening emergency if you do not have commercial paid insurance or are unable to self-pay
Step 6 - observe how fewer and fewer people bother to sign up for Obamacare because it is too expensive and useless
Step 7 - eliminate the whole program, once hardly anyone bothers to use it because its worthless

And all along for the next decade, keep talking about what a disaster Obamacare is and how we should never believe a single thing that the left says about healthcare again.

That right there is an easy playbook for anyone that is strategic thinking.

Anonymous Han Solo March 28, 2017 1:47 PM  


Here is all the Republicans should do, but they have to play long ball:

Step 1 - eliminate mandate, if you don't want to buy obmacare you don't have to no penalty
Step 2 - watch the costs go up and up and up, and maybe even make some laws and rules to make it go up faster such as eliminate all subsidies, add some stupid requirements that all plans must cover petcare or something
Step 3 - at the same time, eliminate rules and make it easier for the private market to be cheaper and more efficient
Step 4 - create a new block grant program to fund many new state and local charity hospitals and free clinics to provide healthcare to the poor who can't pay anyway so its stupid to put them in a private for-profit insurance system
Step 5 - make it illegal to use any commercial hospitals, facilities for healthcare in anything but a life threatening emergency if you do not have commercial paid insurance or are unable to self-pay
Step 6 - observe how fewer and fewer people bother to sign up for Obamacare because it is too expensive and useless
Step 7 - eliminate the whole program, once hardly anyone bothers to use it because its worthless

And all along for the next decade, keep talking about what a disaster Obamacare is and how we should never believe a single thing that the left says about healthcare again.

That right there is an easy playbook for anyone that is strategic thinking.

Blogger Silly But True March 28, 2017 1:49 PM  

@James Dixon: "I still have no idea how Obamacare got around that detail."

It did in only the most cynical way possible.

H.R.3962 was revealed by the House in July 2009. It was voted on Nov. 7, 2009 and passes.

The Senate passed a different version on Dec. 24, 2009.

Scott Brown is seated January 2010 killing filibuster-proof majority in Senate; Dems realize that the original Senate vote must stand.

This is when reconciliation was used. But there are limits to how that can happen, so the _existing_ House bill H.R. 3780 - the Service Membets' Homebuyer Tax Credit Extension Act 2009 was used. Original H.R.3962 was just abandoned. The language of tge recilliation bill then stated "This is superseded in its entirety by..." and the Senate bill language was grafted verbatim on the Servicr Members crefit bill.

Problem solved: the House reconciled its (wholly unrelated) bill _to_ the Senate version.

Pelosi had no idea WTF was in Senate version, because she wasn't involved and there were differences.

Then a second normal bill was crafted to tweak the now passed legislation more to House Demo liking.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents March 28, 2017 1:59 PM  

@58 praetorian
Healthcare is the troll comment of government: the best option is not to touch the poop, but we just can't help ourselves.

Thread winner.

Anonymous gxg March 28, 2017 2:18 PM  

Just got another call from the RNC asking for money. I said, and quite cheerfully, I might add, "Can you please quote me on my response?"

The caller: "Sure. We've got a space for comments."

Me: "Okay, please quote this directly, word for word. (Deep breath.) 'Ha ha ha ha. We're not giving one more stinking dime to the RNC until they rein in, or preferable get rid of, the sellouts like McCain and Ryan, who are sabotaging Trump at every turn.'"

I made the caller laugh. And she mentioned something that I thought was interesting. She said, "Well, at least you were cheerful about it, rather than yelling."

It makes me wonder how many people are telling the RNC to fuck off.

Blogger Feather Blade March 28, 2017 2:35 PM  

Churcher wrote:I can afford the $700 per month I pay.

Churcher, if you put that $700 a month into a savings account you wouldn't need insurance, because after a few months (years if you're healthy) you'd be able to pay cash for all your medical care.

And quite frankly, other people's medical needs are none of your damn business.
It's exceedingly presumptuous and patronizing of you to claim that nobody else can afford medical care just because selfish young things refuse to fork over cash that they earned, to strangers to whom they have no obligations.


.. what's the general, non-sexual term for "Captain Save-a-ho"? Whatever it is, that's what you are.

Anonymous Churcher March 28, 2017 3:06 PM  

"When your business model is predicated upon forcing people who don't need your product to buy it in order to subsidize a small number of others, it's a bad business model. You're a lot better off basing your business model on something that people actively want to do rather than on something that they actively want to avoid."

You are right. However, we aren't talking about a business. We are talking about how to cover all Americans so that all can have and afford healthcare. We do this thing all the time. I don't think I need the full level of defense capabilities that I'm asked to pay for. Yet, I'm forced to pay for it. I don't think we need a wall on the southern border. But I'm forced to pay for it. I don't think we need the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, but I'm forced to pay for it.

Blogger James Dixon March 28, 2017 3:13 PM  

> I don't think ... I don't think ... I don't think...

I'll be darned. Churcher doesn't tell complete lies all the time.

Anonymous Churcher March 28, 2017 3:14 PM  

"Those "young people" aren't your damned slaves, Churcher. They aren't there to help you or anyone else bankroll Insurance Companies, Banking, or Healthcare into staying viable. You seem to think theft equals altruism. It doesn't."

No, they are not, as you say. However, they are part of a collective responsibility that as a people we've all decided to take on. In the same way we all take on the responsibility of funding a national defense, of funding emergency services, of funding a diplomatic corp, we have decided to fund a healthcare system.

The same can be said for social security. During the Great Depression the people decided they did not believe the high level of elderly Americans in poverty was acceptable. After social security was instituted, the decline in elders living in poverty declined significantly from around 40% to under 10% now. That was a collective effort too.

Anonymous kfg March 28, 2017 3:23 PM  

"We are talking about how to cover all Americans so that all can have and afford healthcare."

Lower the cost.

Lewis Thomas once did an informal survey of doctors to find out what sort of routine "healthcare" their families received. It turns out that they take more Aspirin than average.

My own medical expenses since 1990 total 4 Tylenol to moderate a runaway fever and two Sudafed to moderate yellow jacket stings. Most people only need about 2% of the "healthcare" they receive.

To wit, in a more formal survey, rich people who received regular "healthcare" lived longer than those who did not.

But poor people who received regular "healthcare" lived shorter than those who did not.

"The Healthcare System" kills the very people it is meant to protect, because the system itself is a clusterfuck from conception.

"Wellness" is not medicine and statistical herd management is not medical treatment.

Anonymous gxg March 28, 2017 3:38 PM  

they are part of a collective responsibility that as a people we've all decided to take on.

Sorry dude. I didn't "decide" to take on illegal aliens, their anchor babies, or feral welfare rats, even as they squat out endless streams of new Dem voters while we producers get stuck with the bill.

Decided, my ass.

Anonymous kfg March 28, 2017 3:50 PM  

"After social security was instituted, the decline in elders living in poverty declined significantly from around 40% to under 10% now."

And yet, speaking as a "Senior Citizen," I want neither SS nor Medicare. What's with that?

Anonymous Feelings, Nothing More Than Feelings March 28, 2017 4:44 PM  

they are part of a collective responsibility that as a people we've all decided to take on.

Oh, you are so right! I feel that you are a real citizen of the world, Churcher! We've all decided to take on caring for all other Americans! Including the ones that haven't moved here yet! I'm sure you feel that we shouldn't be repealing Affordable Care, we should be expanding it! First to cover all the South Americans! Then to cover all the Africans and every single future American in India!

Only the heartlessly mean would feel otherwise! Don't you feel in your heart it's true?

Anonymous roadrage March 28, 2017 5:01 PM  

Will somebody put that fucking churcher out of his misery? Stupid sonofabitch.

Anonymous A.B. Prosper March 28, 2017 6:08 PM  

JACIII wrote:The problem with healthcare isn't that it is too expensive, but that it is free for too many.

Fix the work force participation rate. Cancel commiecare.


How would you do this?

There are fewer and fewer jobs that require labor of any kind, skilled or otherwise.

And yes the is my sperg topic but wage decline correlates far closer to automation and computers than full time female workforce participation or broadly, trade.

entire industries have been eliminated, travel planning , sales, retail. Its going to get to the point in which too little labor is required to support a healthy economy

We really haven't needed anything more than a thirty hour work week since the 1930's give or take.

Basically its going to come to all kinds of regulation or if we are unwilling and unable to hire people, a welfare state

We can't have either though with multiculturalism or immigration , they have to go first

Anonymous A.B. Prosper March 28, 2017 6:23 PM  

Feather Blade wrote:Churcher wrote:I can afford the $700 per month I pay.

Churcher, if you put that $700 a month into a savings account you wouldn't need insurance, because after a few months (years if you're healthy) you'd be able to pay cash for all your medical care.

And quite frankly, other people's medical needs are none of your damn business.

It's exceedingly presumptuous and patronizing of you to claim that nobody else can afford medical care just because selfish young things refuse to fork over cash that they earned, to strangers to whom they have no obligations.

.. what's the general, non-sexual term for "Captain Save-a-ho"? Whatever it is, that's what you are.


Feather,, almost no one in the US is paid well enough to do this . 90% of jobs created are low wage/often part time.

In order for someone to save 700 US a month without crippling the economy through too much delayed consumption or people not having children or the like is for them to make after taxes 7000 US a month

Assuming 25% taxes that's around 50-60 US an hour. Most working couples don't pull $30 an hour each. The median US wage is half this

Worse 10% of the US population owns 70% of the wealth . This is not the kind of society that allows for much savings

We can't tax cut our way out, we can't save our way out and we can't really deport our way out. The later is still essential for social comity and public safety reasons and it will help some economically but its not a solution.

Assuming no collapse and no way to make the economy hire all kinds of people at a good wage, the need to avoid collapse indicates some kind of socialism

Better it be democratic or nationalist rather than international

And last, yes other people medical needs are a collective problem, contagious disease, lower national security and less loss productivity are national problems not individual ones

We aren't ready to work for a healthier population though , we can't stop the selling of crap like high fructose corn syrup and there are needed limits we won't be able to keep

But all in all, a society of rugged individuals makes sense on a frontier, not in a crowded developed nation

Blogger Silly But True March 28, 2017 6:24 PM  

Churcher: "We are talking about how to cover all Americans so that all can have and afford healthcare."

No we are not. We are talking about the quickest way to restore freedom and liberty and make people responsible for their own healthy or unhealthy decisions.

"We do this thing all the time. I don't think I need the full level of defense capabilities that I'm asked to pay for."

Common defense is a necessary duty of the federal government.

Subsidizing illegals' and meth addicts' doctor visits and surgeries are not.

Blogger DonReynolds March 28, 2017 8:12 PM  

Absolutely, Vox.
I have advocated many times to simply REPEAL Obamacare and set the sunset date for later in the year. My suggestion was the end of the Federal fiscal year.....September 30, 2017, but if they want to make it the end of the calendar year, that is fine by me.
This gives CONGRESS plenty of time to get their heads together, if that is possible and it is something that the president can SIGN. If that is not possible, then we return to a free market for health care insurance. Hooray!
This is the way, now if only the NationalReview crowd and the Chamber of Commerce will see it as a way forward. If they do not, Obamacare will crash and burn.....as it should and many billions of dollars later, it will be repealed anyway.

Anonymous Churcher March 28, 2017 11:36 PM  

"No we are not. We are talking about the quickest way to restore freedom and liberty and make people responsible for their own healthy or unhealthy decisions."

Well, sure. That's what you are talking about. But it appears that not only did millions of people not vote for Donald Trump and his Repeal message, but the repeal bill was very unpopular and the ACA is more popular than ever.

""We do this thing all the time. I don't think I need the full level of defense capabilities that I'm asked to pay for."

Common defense is a necessary duty of the federal government."

I agree. However, I don't think that all that we pay for is necessary....and yet, I pay for it.

Anonymous Man of the Atom March 28, 2017 11:41 PM  

Churcher wrote:"Those "young people" aren't your damned slaves, Churcher. They aren't there to help you or anyone else bankroll Insurance Companies, Banking, or Healthcare into staying viable. You seem to think theft equals altruism. It doesn't."

No, they are not, as you say. However, they are part of a collective responsibility that as a people we've all decided to take on. In the same way we all take on the responsibility of funding a national defense, of funding emergency services, of funding a diplomatic corp, we have decided to fund a healthcare system.

The same can be said for social security. During the Great Depression the people decided they did not believe the high level of elderly Americans in poverty was acceptable. After social security was instituted, the decline in elders living in poverty declined significantly from around 40% to under 10% now. That was a collective effort too.


No, you human shitstain! They are not part of the collective "WE" decided to support. That's your circle-jerking Leftist community. You want to drive the whole of society into the ground with your utopian ideas ... THAT NEVER FUCKING WORK! They are their own people, and will rightly turn on your and your filthy inhuman kind like wolves if given the chance. May they tear our your throat with your words on your lips.

FDR and all the Socialist enablers right through the Great Society should have been shoved into mass graves from 1933 through 1966 on. I would have saved a few tens of million lives in the next decade or so.

Social Security was never meant to be what if morphed into today, and to be the unsupportable, under-financed timebomb that it is now because Leftist asshats like you robbed the fund for other utopian projects that went tits up. Your ideas now have elders living in poverty today in greater numbers due to depression of the bond market due to Bush and Obama's financial rigging.

Slavers like you need to keep talking. Don't go underground when economics go south. Make your views known to those around you.

Anonymous Churcher March 29, 2017 12:01 AM  

@112 You're gonna hurt yourself.

Anonymous Feelings, Nothing More Than Feelings March 29, 2017 1:28 AM  

@113 Churcher

I feel your concern, really I do!

Anonymous MrNiceguy March 29, 2017 2:03 AM  

...In the Senate.
Then the Dems lost Massachusetts, so the House abandoned the version they had been working on and passed the Senate version so it wouldn't have to go to committee. The final Obamacare bill was passed... Through budget reconciliation.

Blogger Olivia Smith March 29, 2017 10:34 AM  

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