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Monday, October 30, 2017

Average global IQ = 86

The blank slatists and civic nationalists are in for a nightmarish disappointment if these global IQ figures are even remotely correct.
The World's IQ = 86. Test results of 550,492 individuals in 123 countries.

Every test, either “school near” as those designed for PISA or “school far” as designed for intelligence testing, are subject to the same concerns about sampling, measurement invariance, individual item analysis, and the appropriateness of summary statistics. Why the difference in public response to these two different points on the assessment spectrum? Perhaps it is as simple as noting that in scholastic attainment there is always room to do better (or to blame the quality of schooling) whereas in intelligence testing there is an implication of an immutable restriction, unfairly revealed by tricky questions of doubtful validity.

Perhaps it is a matter of publicity. PISA has the money for brochures, briefing papers, press conferences, meetings with government officials. Richard Lynn put his list together in his study, and came up with results that many were happy to bury.

106.02 CHINA
100.46 GERMANY
 96.99 USA
 92.79 ISRAEL
 88.51 MEXICO
 83.04 JORDAN
I suspect the 8-point decline I calculated in the USA hasn't fully shown up in these tests yet, although the initial decline is clear in the way it is declining faster than the European norms. Anyhow, as incomplete as the data presently is, it suffices to put the lie to more than one dubious IQ-related narrative.

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177 Comments:

Anonymous Taco Town October 30, 2017 11:03 AM  

Why should it be any surprise that the United States scores significantly lower than it would if it were 100% white?

Anonymous Anonymous October 30, 2017 11:05 AM  

No information on the nation of Burkina Faso?

- Mobutu

Anonymous Clueless Assimilationist October 30, 2017 11:11 AM  

But...but...but...racist test! Cultural inappropriate test! Flynn effect! Muh blank slate!

Muh magic dirt! Whut about muh magic dirt?

Blogger CJ October 30, 2017 11:14 AM  

FWIW I have travelled and worked in several tropical countries in South America, Asia and Africa over several decades (yes, I'm a little older than most of your readers). A world average IQ of 86 seems perfectly plausible to me. I'm in fact a little skeptical that the overall Chinese IQ is quite that high, and there are still a lot of areas in places like Africa and New Guinea that have probably never been seriously surveyed and might pull the average down.

Anonymous Faceless October 30, 2017 11:14 AM  

This is like - why do the anti-gunners persist in comparing us to Norway and Denmark for crime statistics? Remember how Michael Moore had to try to embarrass Charleton Heston, and then the media ran with the "NRA is racisssss" storyline, when Pres. Heston questioned the racial diversity.

It's like those idiot GOPers who used to say in the Bush years - it's OK to suffer costs and setbacks to advance right-wing feminism, because "it's the right thing to do", so let some troops die from a military less prepared - they are afraid of certain facts and realities.

They cheer that we're becoming a polyglot imperial state, but then pretend that everyone's interchangeable and there is no difference except, thankfully, voting the right way. I would say it must hurt to keep all these thoughts in the leftist brain, but when they only have a couple glandular impulses to feed or fornicate or signal conform, thoughtlessness must be bliss.

Anonymous JN October 30, 2017 11:17 AM  

The USA score likely doesn't take illegals into account.

Anonymous Jeff October 30, 2017 11:19 AM  

Given the diversity in America, whites must be scoring well north of 100 to achieve a national 97 average.

Anonymous Musashi October 30, 2017 11:23 AM  

This simply means that people with higher intelligence are that much more rare and valuable in an expanding ocean of morons.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents October 30, 2017 11:31 AM  

88.51 MEXICO

Looks about right. They keep sending us their 80 IQ peasants, whose kids are filling up a lot of grade schools. The 100+ ones stay home where they have a job. Win-win for Mexico and for US libtard CivNats.

Blogger Revelation Means Hope October 30, 2017 11:33 AM  

I also question the Chinese IQ averages, I suspect they are excluding their less gifted comrades from even participating in these tests. But regardless, says a little something about America's average considering our huge numbers of Africans and South Americans now weighing down the average.

Blogger allyn71 October 30, 2017 11:34 AM  

"This simply means that people with higher intelligence are that much more rare and valuable in an expanding ocean of morons."

True and good luck maintaining a civilization with the that. The average is the key, no individual intellect is enough to offset the collective IQ being equivalent to that of an imbecile.

The Idiocracy is upon us.

Anonymous Roundtine October 30, 2017 11:36 AM  

Developed nation scores are a good estimate of average intelligence. Third World scores could be overstated. Critics claim the Chinese score is high because it's from major urban schools. I doubt countries far less civilized than China are thoroughly testing their rural populations.

Anonymous Brick Hardslab October 30, 2017 11:36 AM  

So most people really are idiots? Never would have imagined it.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents October 30, 2017 11:37 AM  

@8
I also question the Chinese IQ averages, I suspect they are excluding their less gifted comrades from even participating in these tests

Ditto for India.

Anonymous Difter October 30, 2017 11:38 AM  

This is a simple problem to solve. These people simply need to identify as high IQ individuals. You don't believe it? Bigot!

Anonymous Brick Hardslab October 30, 2017 11:39 AM  

It's not like Chinese are known for cheating at tests or anything.

Blogger Brad Matthews October 30, 2017 11:40 AM  

Africa is even lower

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 11:40 AM  

> I'm in fact a little skeptical that the overall Chinese IQ is quite that high

How many rural Chinese folks do you think were tested?

> Given the diversity in America, whites must be scoring well north of 100 to achieve a national 97 average.

You're not supposed to notice that.

Anonymous Kreator October 30, 2017 11:41 AM  

So...with Greece at 92 IQ, my country is screwed...right?

Anonymous Aeoli Pera October 30, 2017 11:44 AM  

That's weird, because unmixed homo sapiens has an average IQ of about 70. Hmm...

Blogger L' Aristokrato October 30, 2017 11:46 AM  

Geez...
I did my own version of this research a couple of years ago, using the mildly outdated data I could find to determine average World IQ. My horrifyong result was 88; Guess even then, It was slightly optimistic.

Blogger Josh (the sexiest thing here) October 30, 2017 11:46 AM  

So...with Greece at 92 IQ, my country is screwed...right?

Nah, that's probably just the IQ they're reporting to the tax office

Anonymous BBGKB October 30, 2017 11:47 AM  

here I thought I would have to post this as OT:

No stopping disease that can be stopped by hand washing after sh1tting.

#HBD
http://www.shtfplan.com/headline-news/hepatitis-a-outbreak-spreads-in-michigan-no-stopping-this-regional-epidemic_10302017

I also question the Chinese IQ averages,

Rampant cheating + corruption in schooling. But they do have a lot of people so that means they have more 4+ Standard Deviation people.

OT: https://downtrend.com/71superb/detroit-emt-thinks-all-white-people-should-be-raped-and-killed

Still has job "Willie Bragg, a black ambulance driver with the Detroit Fire Department, made this comment on a now-deleted Facebook post:

“White men, women and children should be raped and killed. White people should be used as alligator bait. Whites should be enslaved and beaten, like they had done to African-Americans,” wrote Bragg."

Anonymous Bobby Farr October 30, 2017 11:50 AM  

I recall reading that the Chinese scores came from a very unrepresentative sample - basically upper middle class people in Shanghai and Beijing.

Blogger S1AL October 30, 2017 11:51 AM  

United States hypothetical:

South Americans at ~90 (I'm rounding up slightly cause the math doesn't change much and Cubans) -20%

Black Americans at 85 (consistent with testing) - 12.5%

East Asians at 105 - 5%

Others negligible

90*.2 + 85*.125 + 105*.05 + X*.625 = 97

White American average (X) comes out to about 101.

So slightly above.

Blogger VFM #7634 October 30, 2017 11:52 AM  

Given the diversity in America, whites must be scoring well north of 100 to achieve a national 97 average.

@5 Jeff
It's most likely similar to the German value. Blacks are 85, and likely dropping since dysgenics is hitting them far harder than whites. The more educated, higher-IQ blacks adopt liberal Democrat breeding patterns. As for Hispanics, I actually think their IQ is actually HIGHER than the Mexican average. There was a column on VDare a while back talking about the Mexicans who head to El Norte tend to actually be more middle-class. Asians are likely higher than whites, considering how we appear to be sucking in geniuses from places like India.

Geez...
I did my own version of this research a couple of years ago, using the mildly outdated data I could find to determine average World IQ. My horrifyong result was 88; Guess even then, It was slightly optimistic.


@19 L'Aristokrato
You have to consider runaway African and Muslim population growth.

Blogger S1AL October 30, 2017 11:52 AM  

Factor in the couple other sub-100 groups and it might get close to 102.

Blogger RobertT October 30, 2017 11:54 AM  

How much of a role does culture play into this?

Blogger S1AL October 30, 2017 11:57 AM  

"How much of a role does culture play into this?"

Negligible in the short term. Within the human lifespan the only useful factor is nutrition.

Anonymous Bobby Farr October 30, 2017 12:00 PM  

Somewhat dated attempt to arrive at an accurate average IQ for China (concludes that it is 101-2).

http://akarlin.com/2012/08/analysis-of-chinas-pisa-2009-results/

Blogger VD October 30, 2017 12:02 PM  

Note that this tends to indicate that my previous calculation of the average Jewish IQ being 102.4 was a little on the high side, since I was working from an average Israeli IQ of 95, instead of 92.79.

Anonymous Idiocracy be real and shit October 30, 2017 12:02 PM  

"Up next, you can’t teach an old dog new tricks, but you can teach a new dog to trick or treat!”

- Megyn Kelly

Anonymous Taco Town October 30, 2017 12:03 PM  

Civilization isn’t necessarily threatened by stupid people in greater numbers. Representative democracy is what is threatened. If there are too many stupid people with the same voting rights, Civilization will need to address that to survive, by whatever means necessary.

Anonymous Killua October 30, 2017 12:04 PM  

It would be good to know if your IQ truly remains constant as you age. If a person scores 120 in an IQ test when they are twenty years old, will that person score around 120 if they take the same test in their sixties?

It has to do with the question of neuroplasticity. It seems like your intelligence actually "peaks" at some point, and from that age learning gets harder. Modern research suggests that fundamental changes in your brain take place until age 25:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/science-news/11413884/True-adulthood-doesnt-begin-until-age-25.html

Blogger S1AL October 30, 2017 12:12 PM  

'Note that this tends to indicate that my previous calculation of the average Jewish IQ being 102.4 was a little on the high side, since I was working from an average Israeli IQ of 95, instead of 92.79.'

Assuming that East Asian scores are inflated, this may indicate that we've reached more-or-less maximum IQ averages, assuming that there's a equilibrium-inducing set of trade-offs that comes with high IQ (and we already know that there are several associated negatives).

Blogger Shimshon October 30, 2017 12:13 PM  

Vox, you are free to use numbers skewed by the ~17% Arab composition of the national population or a higher amount for Haifa. You live with them around you and it makes sense that they are involved in similar lines of work to blacks and Mexicans. The Mexicans are actually more intelligent than Syrians, Jordanians, and Saudi Arabians, if I read the maps correctly. They drag the IQ way down.

But that is not what the IQ of Jews in Israel is. Your original calculation is likely closer to the mark.

Anonymous Mr. Rational October 30, 2017 12:14 PM  

@11 Obvious comment is obvious.

The real issue is, as M.G. Miles writes about all the time, what are the implications for policy?  Obviously, diversity and family-reunification visas must go.  Ideally we'd make them all go back.  But what kind of domestic policy do we need... and can we ever get it implemented?  What are the consequences if we can't?

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 12:20 PM  

> It would be good to know if your IQ truly remains constant as you age.

No, it doesn't. And yes, the peak seems to be somewhere around 25. After that it appears to decline slowly. The main difference I've noticed between now and my late twenties is speed. It appears that the slow decline in reflexes so obvious in athletics is also related to an overall drop in brain processing speed.

Blogger Abyssus Invocat October 30, 2017 12:22 PM  

The Chinese are indeed just that bright. The brightest ones go to the West for STEM education & promptly go home. They have civilisational confidence that no Western country can dream of, think political correctness is idiocy, and will relentlessly steal and adapt the required base technology to stomp us in AI, energy technology, and space exploration. They ruthlessly select the brightest among themselves for leadership in all fields abd are completely unsentimental about dealing with barbarians. An admirable people in many ways. Meanwhile the West import entire villages full of idiots and pays them to reproduce.

Jesus wept.

Blogger Brad Matthews October 30, 2017 12:24 PM  

Africa is even lower

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 12:24 PM  

Jeff wrote:Given the diversity in America, whites must be scoring well north of 100 to achieve a national 97 average.

IIRC, a few decades back (before cucking to the max), US Episcopalians as a group had a mean IQ that beat the snot out of the Ashkenazim in America.

Ah, the good 'ole days, when assortive mating and patriarchy meant that smart women married smart men and produced smart kids and when college coeds' most important degree attained was the "MRS."

Blogger John M October 30, 2017 12:24 PM  

Can't believe you guys here question the Chinese IQ scores. Looking at how they have taken the whole world for a ride for so long only fools would question that the Chinese are smart people.

Blogger James D. Miller October 30, 2017 12:25 PM  

From the experts I have talked to, we do not have good data on the average Chinese IQ. (One of these experts was a PhD working in China on a project where he hoped to collect such data.)

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 12:26 PM  

> ...only fools would question that the Chinese are smart people.

No one is questioning the IQ of the Chinese leadership class.

Blogger Abyssus Invocat October 30, 2017 12:26 PM  

I wonder that too. I scored 137 at age 12 when I didn't even know what kind of test I was taking. But I've never better than mediocre at any higher maths related work. I'm 60 now and no better at maths but my pattern recognition and verbal fluency are definitely better.

Blogger wired216 October 30, 2017 12:27 PM  

I live just outside Detroit. Good info. Thanks!

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 12:29 PM  

Abyssus Invocat wrote:The Chinese are indeed just that bright. The brightest ones go to the West for STEM education & promptly go home. They have civilisational confidence that no Western country can dream of, think political correctness is idiocy, and will relentlessly steal and adapt the required base technology to stomp us in AI, energy technology, and space exploration. They ruthlessly select the brightest among themselves for leadership in all fields abd are completely unsentimental about dealing with barbarians. An admirable people in many ways. Meanwhile the West import entire villages full of idiots and pays them to reproduce.

Jesus wept.


Really? All I hear from sons who work with Chinese STEM grads in industry is that they can't think their way out of a paper bag. Maybe that's why the Chinese Army runs a massive program for hacking into Western Firms' computer systems for the purpose of industrial espionage, so much that China's universities might as well offer specific degrees in Reverse Engineering.

Chinese law students in the USA pass the Bar the first time at rates well below Caucasians. I note again: If IQ was all that mattered, China would be the seat of where EVERYTHING peculiar to our modern cornucopia was invented. As BGKB notes, the last thing of true importance that came out of China was gun powder.

OpenID doktorjeep October 30, 2017 12:29 PM  

I would put that IQ average right next to the graphic showing how whites are a minority globally.

And say nothing else.

Blogger VD October 30, 2017 12:31 PM  

Vox, you are free to use numbers skewed by the ~17% Arab composition of the national population or a higher amount for Haifa.

I actually calculated it assuming Arabs were 22 percent of the Israeli population. It's pretty clear now that the "115 Jewish (really Ashkenazi) IQ" line is bullshit, as I suspected. Which, of course, is why the Asians are driving them out of the elite universities despite the best efforts of Jewish university administrators to prevent this.

Blogger tuberman October 30, 2017 12:33 PM  

Yeah, I suspect that the Chinese IQ stats, are the kind of stats mentioned by Mr. Twain. As if the Chinese government would let anyone get a fair sample. How many out of the rice fields were tested without a government over watch person around?

Blogger S1AL October 30, 2017 12:36 PM  

And the Ashkenazi are already functionally Italian, so...

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 12:37 PM  

> Really? All I hear from sons who work with Chinese STEM grads in industry is that they can't think their way out of a paper bag.

All of the east Asians appear to be relatively intelligent when it comes to "book learning". But all of their cultures also have strong societal pressures not to deviate from the norm (see the oft noted Japanese idiom, the nail that sticks up gets hammered down). Thus, their ability to "think outside the box" tends to be more limited.

Anonymous Sam the Man October 30, 2017 12:37 PM  

If you consider that China has 1.4 billion people and a reasonably successful schooling system, then the urban coastal chines should be a pretty smart group. What is not answered is how smart the 800 million rural Chinese and Tibetans are.

I seem to recall reading someplace if you had done a IQ test of the Hanseatic league cities around 1450 to 1500, you would have concluded the nations around the Baltic were intellectual giants. Of course that was not the case, instead it was a selected group. The same applies to China.

I do not think at this point folks know the answer, though given there are not enough women it is likely the Chinese stupid folks will not bred, which leads one to expect the Chinese national IQ scores will rise in the next two generations, rather than falling as is occurring in the west.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents October 30, 2017 12:37 PM  

@46 doktor jeep
I would put that IQ average right next to the graphic showing how whites are a minority globally.

And say nothing else.


Most people wouldn't get the point.

Blogger Theophilus Chilton October 30, 2017 12:38 PM  

Really? All I hear from sons who work with Chinese STEM grads in industry is that they can't think their way out of a paper bag. Maybe that's why the Chinese Army runs a massive program for hacking into Western Firms' computer systems for the purpose of industrial espionage, so much that China's universities might as well offer specific degrees in Reverse Engineering.

This highlights an important point, which is that simply talking about IQ doesn't say anything about the particular strengths and weaknesses *within* IQ. Someone may be really smart at remembering facts, building logical arguments, etc., and yet be sub-par at spatial reasoning. Etc. Etc.

The Chinese are a high IQ population, but they are not particularly innovative or creative. They can steal someone else's tech and figure out how it works, but they're not that great at developing new tech, or developing new theory that would open up entirely new lines of advance.

Blogger S1AL October 30, 2017 12:39 PM  

'Thus, their ability to "think outside the box" tends to be more limited.'

Amusingly, competitive video games appear to be helping change this. They also highlight that the Asian IQ strength is real, given the factors that go into success in RTS and MOBA games.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents October 30, 2017 12:39 PM  

But all of their cultures also have strong societal pressures not to deviate from the norm (see the oft noted Japanese idiom, the nail that sticks up gets hammered down). Thus, their ability to "think outside the box" tends to be more limited.

Their ability to cheat on tests appears unlimited.
Ask any white STEM grad student who is a TA.

Blogger VFM #7634 October 30, 2017 12:40 PM  

The Chinese are indeed just that bright. The brightest ones go to the West for STEM education & promptly go home. They have civilisational confidence that no Western country can dream of, think political correctness is idiocy, and will relentlessly steal and adapt the required base technology to stomp us in AI, energy technology, and space exploration.

@37 Abyssus Invocat
Not sure that's an effect of superior intelligence, or simply imperviousness to the libtardery which is acting as an anchor around the necks of all white populations these days.

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 12:41 PM  

RobertT wrote:How much of a role does culture play into this?

Culture (which like "g" is mostly inherited) and personality (also inherited) are the transmission by which intelligence--the engine--reaches the road.

Independence of mind is a major cultural difference between East Asians and NW Europeans/Anglo-Saxons. Too little social conformity and you have the chaos of Africa & South Asia, too much and you have 5000 years of Chinese Civilization without once developing true science.

On a different note, the decline in US mean IQ is (IMO) less of a catastrophe than is the accumulation of genetic mutations showing up in human behavior. Some 84% of human genes are expressed in the brain; after a century of all but eliminating selective pressures that would have seen deleterious mutations culled from Americans, the rise of all these pathological behaviors celebrated by the Left is attributable to actual, mutation-driven behavioral aberration, AKA insanity.

Schizophrenia is heritable. So is leftism. The mutation-theory of homosexuality makes perfect sense, too. It's not heritable (in that there's no "gay gene,") but it is absolutely caused by genetic change that (by definition) is "unfit" in the Darwinian sense...i.e., it leads to its own line's elimination.

Blogger VFM #7634 October 30, 2017 12:42 PM  

The Chinese are a high IQ population, but they are not particularly innovative or creative. They can steal someone else's tech and figure out how it works, but they're not that great at developing new tech, or developing new theory that would open up entirely new lines of advance.

@53 Theophilus Chilton
It's entirely possible that potential Chinese inventors don't make the effort to invent things because they figure some other Chinaman will steal all their hard-earned work for themselves. Corruption has consequences, not least of which is stifling innovation.

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 12:42 PM  

> The Chinese are a high IQ population, but they are not particularly innovative or creative.

There is obviously some type of relationship between IQ and creativity/innovation, but afaik no one has ever been able to determine exactly what it is. It may actually be that there is no relationship, but that more intelligent people are better able to put their creative ideas into practice.

Blogger Abyssus Invocat October 30, 2017 12:44 PM  

Its true they haven't had an original idea in 3000 years, but they are absolute aces at adapting basic technology to their own ends and pursuing long term goals. Maybe inventiveness isn't all that strongly correlated with IQ. Interesting line of inquiry though.

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 12:45 PM  

> Their ability to cheat on tests appears unlimited.

For the Asians, cheating on tests is "inside the box". :)

Anonymous BBGKB October 30, 2017 12:54 PM  

As BGKB notes, the last thing of true importance that came out of China was gun powder.

Actually the most relevant would be that Asians can memorize a book but not understand what is in it.

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 12:56 PM  

VDare had a wonderful brief write-up of the mutation theory of human decline, relating it to the pivotal research on mice that showed how in an environment of unlimited resources, a population of mice grew, plateaued, stopped reproducing and then died out entirely.

It wasn't (just) because the mice got "dumber."

http://www.vdare.com/articles/of-mice-and-men-spiteful-mutations-look-bad-for-the-west

In the last six or eight years my 4th grade teacher wife noted something profound showing up with increasing frequency in her classes; kids who lack the most basic levels of self-control and self-motivation, who are disruptive or simply sit like toad stools with blank looks on their faces. Her colleagues report the same flood of profoundly incapable students. This isn't a decline in IQ, it's a decline in everything else, too.

We sail into the eruption of Mr. Vesuvi-debt, the robotics revolution and the collapse of the Equalist Cult right when the seeds of nurturing every defect and enabling their carriers to reproduce without limit begin to sprout in earnest.

A more perfect storm cannot be imagined.

Anonymous basementhomebrewer October 30, 2017 1:10 PM  

VFM #7634 wrote:The Chinese are a high IQ population, but they are not particularly innovative or creative. They can steal someone else's tech and figure out how it works, but they're not that great at developing new tech, or developing new theory that would open up entirely new lines of advance.

@53 Theophilus Chilton

It's entirely possible that potential Chinese inventors don't make the effort to invent things because they figure some other Chinaman will steal all their hard-earned work for themselves. Corruption has consequences, not least of which is stifling innovation.


The same thing tends to be true in Japan as well though. They were building really efficient 486 computers while we were using Pentium IIs back in the late 90s early 2000's.

Blogger Matamoros October 30, 2017 1:11 PM  

@18 unmixed homo sapiens has an average IQ of about 70.

Who are you calling "unmixed homo sapiens"?

Blogger kmbr October 30, 2017 1:21 PM  

**There is obviously some type of relationship between IQ and creativity/innovation**

My personal theory is there is a small sweet spot for IQ. Probably 105-125. Just a guess. These are the doers, the innovators, creators, etc.

Lower--and well, you get the 3rd world.

Higher and you get people who can build super computers but can't tie their shoes or have conversations with other actual human beings. Though these people are needed, they aren't the meet and bones of a robust society.

Blogger kmbr October 30, 2017 1:25 PM  

@63

Also, keep in mind A LOT of these kids are doped up.

Adderal, antidepressants, etc.

Anonymous Anonymous October 30, 2017 1:29 PM  

"Though these people are needed, they aren't the meet and bones of a robust society."

ROFL...

- Sal

Blogger dvdivx October 30, 2017 1:34 PM  

India is even worse than China in the cheating/stealing ideas department. Both have a severe lack of empathy (as opposed to to much in the west) and both have a caste type mentality. In China it's just a more economic white/blue worker type caste.

Anonymous CarpeOro October 30, 2017 1:39 PM  

basementhomebrewer wrote:VFM #7634 wrote:The Chinese are a high IQ population, but they are not particularly innovative or creative. They can steal someone else's tech and figure out how it works, but they're not that great at developing new tech, or developing new theory that would open up entirely new lines of advance.

@53 Theophilus Chilton

It's entirely possible that potential Chinese inventors don't make the effort to invent things because they figure some other Chinaman will steal all their hard-earned work for themselves. Corruption has consequences, not least of which is stifling innovation.


The same thing tends to be true in Japan as well though. They were building really efficient 486 computers while we were using Pentium IIs back in the late 90s early 2000's.


A pretty frequent theme with Japan. Government backed programs there into many areas have a tendency to produce more efficient versions of current tech, then they steal or buy the more advanced tech from the USA private sector and improve on it. Digital television being another example. Disciplined learning only gets you so far, the creative spark needs to be present for innovation. I think that the strictures of rote learning grind a bit of that spark out of them - after all, trying new things means being ready for failure while rote learning rewards sticking to what is known.

Anonymous Phaeton October 30, 2017 1:42 PM  

I shared this with a friend, who despite a growing right-wing streak, responded with

"You really think that "base intelligence" varies that dramatically by country?"


Well, I don't know what I think, just what the data says.

Truth can be a bitter pill.

Anonymous Blastmaster October 30, 2017 1:49 PM  

@Wired216
RUN!

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 1:49 PM  

Phaeton, isn't it funny how a person can look at the world and still believe "we're all the same?"

I guess all those aboriginal people on the covers of National Geographic were simply short of neckties.

Blogger Duke Norfolk October 30, 2017 1:56 PM  

Phaeton wrote:Truth can be a bitter pill.

Blank slatism is a dogma that is very persistent. The blue-pilled right doggedly holds on to the notion that all it takes is hard work and "the right culture" and anybody can achieve just about anything. They just won't let it go.

Frequent commenters at gun forums/sites are a classic example of this syndrome. Drives me bananas these days.

Blogger Noah B The Savage Gardener October 30, 2017 1:56 PM  

My personal theory is there is a small sweet spot for IQ. Probably 105-125. Just a guess. These are the doers, the innovators, creators, etc.

They are the ones who piggyback on the innovations of others, but the innovators on the level of a Newton, Gauss, Maxwell, or Schockley - the ones who create real breakthroughs - tend to have much higher IQs.

Anonymous Roundtine October 30, 2017 1:58 PM  

Can't believe you guys here question the Chinese IQ scores.

There's evidence that those results come from urban schools such as Shanghai, aka offspring of cognitive elite.

China can have more geniuses than the West because it's population of 1.3 billion exceeds the West's total population, and it doesn't require a 106 average IQ.

Go to China and visit a rural area or interact with lower classes.

Anonymous Avalanche October 30, 2017 1:59 PM  

@20 "So...with Greece at 92 IQ, my country is screwed...right?"

Or maybe they're testing all your 'new arrivals' before they shunt the off to Germany? THAT would sure lower the IQ!

Anonymous Blastmaster October 30, 2017 2:02 PM  

In the early 90s I worked for a small but growing metal finishing company. Our first mexican immigrant was legal and very lightly complected. He was very polite, picked up on things quickly and his english learning curve was very steep. He was a great addition. Over the years he brought in more amigos that he knew and surprise surprise they were all not like that. Most worked hard and supported their families but many were just plain dumb. Employee number one had to translate to them for years because they were unwilling or unable to learn english. There was a wet tumbling area where water would splash onto the floor and pool up near a drain. I once watched one of the darker Jose's whip it out and let her rip right on the shop floor when the restroom was a few steps away. There was also a chemical based liquid rust inhibitor that we sprayed on processed steel parts. I asked one guy why he was spraying it directly on his leg and he said something about dry itchy skin. Unreal. Some very good people but it certainly explains Mexicos inability to thrive

Anonymous Mike Rock October 30, 2017 2:04 PM  

In the early seventies I was back in grad school at the Univ. of Wisconsin in metallurgical engineering. One prof, the department head at the time, who had a world wide reputation as the BEST foundryman, told me that Asians in general were intelligent but not inventive. His reputation had drawn many Asians, Chinese and Indians in particular, to the school. I saw his observation in action almost daily in the classroom and foundry labs. Rote repetition was their forte.... reading for understanding was very low on their list of 'features'. One day I was invited for dinner at two Indian (spot) grad students, husband and wife. They were an MD and a Doc. candidate. They brought up the subject on their own and repeated our major profs statement and added a lot to the background in their culture. They lack the creative spark, the ability to have the 'aha' moment. They can take a comment, idea, design, and develop from that concept, but CAN'T, culture wide, do the original conceptual thought.

Later, we hosted a wonderful Chinese man and his wife for a dinner. Charlie brought up the same thing, knowing that I was by now pursuing this subject with students. He said virtually the same thing my Indian friends had. The 'spark' is not there, genetically or culturally, he did not know which. He was brilliant, given a direction to go but need that pointer to get started. All these folks had well above average IQ's if I am any judge of it. Didn't ask, but they were darned smart folks.

God bless.

Anonymous Roundtine October 30, 2017 2:08 PM  

It's entirely possible that potential Chinese inventors don't make the effort to invent things because they figure some other Chinaman will steal all their hard-earned work for themselves. Corruption has consequences, not least of which is stifling innovation.

Chinese have invented a lot of things in the past. The culture, religion and government all conspired to "shut it down" as the industrial revolution took off. Chinese for instance had superior textiles and then would increase profits by reducing quality over time. They still do this today. It gave an opening to the British then, and to Americans now as automation brings manufacturing back.

One area where they might exceed us is genetic engineering. Westerners believe God made a universe like a machine, one that humans could understand (revelation). One can understand God by taking apart Nature and figuring out how His system works. Chinese thought everything had a spirit and taking things apart destroyed the sacred. Westerners believe humans have souls. Chinese believe it is just another piece of nature having abandoned religion and adopting Western science.

Anonymous Blastmaster October 30, 2017 2:11 PM  

I read somewhere that Asians imitate instead of innovate. Seems anecdotally true based in observations and patents granted. Smart people just not very creative.

Anonymous Avalanche October 30, 2017 2:13 PM  

@73 " holds on to the notion that all it takes is hard work and "the right culture" and anybody can achieve just about anything."

This is what drives me frustratingly, snarlingly, slam-off-the-video furious at stupid-d@mned Bill Whittle! He's got some REALLY good information and ideas, he presents them persuasively and well -- and then he idiotically says "if we switched a baby between the African Congo and a White middle class family in the U.S., the babies would grow up to fit into their adopted family! SO want to SLAP him!!

(And I'm sure WAY too many of his audience agree with him!)

Anonymous Bobby Farr October 30, 2017 2:14 PM  

@75 Or just go to San Francisco. I somehow managed not to be overwhelmed by their high IQs while choking on their BO, watching them spit and piss in the streets and paying the welfare for a surprisingly illiterate population.

Even at more realistic measures of Chinese IQ (~100), it remains to be explained how a relatively high IQ population manages to continue to have such a poor and backwards society. They haven't even equaled the Mexicans in per capita GDP.

Anonymous Gen. Kong October 30, 2017 2:18 PM  

The news will not change the minds of cloud people, blank slates, churchians or other assorted SJWs and cucks. Equality über alles is a religious tenet. It lies at the core of the actual belief system all the above share in common. The cloud people don't really believe in it, or at least see themselves as the priests and prophets of this shiny religion, but everyone else on the list are even more fanatical in their devotion than the average Salafist Musloid is to waging jihad. No amount of facts, figures, studies, etc. - no matter how meticulously prepared and proved - will dissuade the true believers from obeying the impulse to achieve ultimate righteousness by purging the planet of those who don't see the light.

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 2:19 PM  

So Roundtine, you anticipate that Chinese will be more open to experimenting with human bioengineering? Certainly the Japanese forays into biowarfare during WW2 seem quite worse than anything in Germany (e.g., Unit 731.)

Blogger VFM #7634 October 30, 2017 2:19 PM  

There's evidence that those results come from urban schools such as Shanghai, aka offspring of cognitive elite.

China can have more geniuses than the West because it's population of 1.3 billion exceeds the West's total population, and it doesn't require a 106 average IQ.

Go to China and visit a rural area or interact with lower classes.


@75 Roundtine
Or consider India. The immigrants it sends here definitely average over 100 in IQ, but India as a whole is only about 85 or so. Heck, even African immigrants are significantly smarter than black Americans, but the continent as a whole is dumber.

Blogger Luke October 30, 2017 2:31 PM  

Theory: Asians' have an extreme ability to hyperfocus, and a relative inability to juggle multiple thoughts.

This explains Asian superiority at ping pong, video games, academics and, yes, IQ tests.

It also explains the lack of creativity (which requires synergizing multiple and often unrelated thoughts) and the driving style that indicates an inability to think about anything other than the road space directly in front of them.

Blogger pyrrhus October 30, 2017 2:31 PM  

These IQ numbers are absolutely correct. Consider that subSaharan Africa, over a billion people, averages 70 IQ, and no nation in the 3d world is much over 90.....As I commented on Dr. Thompson's blog a while ago, British studies described by Thompson show that IQs under 88 are ineducable "to any standard." Imagine what that means....

Anonymous joey mortimer October 30, 2017 2:36 PM  

First an on-topic comment: I just had an argument about mean IQ differences by race with an otherwise intelligent and open-minded guy. Most people just can't accept it. It is religious heresy. Even though they must know in their hearts it is true. They just can't allow themselves to go there. They fear falling outside the matrix, floating in space, alone, shunned, etc. The scientifically unsupported idea of absolute IQ parity across races is the holiest of holies. Which reveals how small a role logic plays in people's most cherished beliefs.

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 2:43 PM  

> Most people just can't accept it.

I remember my reaction when I first encountered the facts concerning average IQ around the world and realized that there was simply no way for most of the world to support or even fit into the kind of society we have built.

Anonymous joey mortimer October 30, 2017 2:43 PM  

Now an off-topic question. I remember a genius comment on here within the last week, but I can't find it. Do any of you remember this comment? It's somewhere in the comments of VD's past week of posts. It was effectively this:

"The pattern keeps repeating. The God Emperor says something that coastal elites find shocking. They get the vapors and denounce it, assuming that real Americans are shocked too. Real Americans disagree with the coastal elite logic, and end up hating them even more. Rinse, repeat." Can anyone remember that post and direct me to the exact wording. It is genius. And I want to start sending it to all my sanctimonious anti-Trumper friends.

Blogger The Overgrown Hobbit October 30, 2017 2:48 PM  

@78 He was brilliant, given a direction to go but need that pointer to get started. All these folks had well above average IQ's if I am any judge of it. Didn't ask, but they were darned smart folks

I've observed the same phenomenon. The "spark" is almost certainly that quality of heritable IQ. It is not, however, measured by IQ tests*

What you are perceiving is "pretty smart" combined with superb work habits drilled into their heads from pre-school, that allows them to amass skills, learn languages (like math) etc. and use that as a base to stand on.


One difficulty I perceive is that tests done at age 15 don't allow for the raised by wolves" phenomenon, in which an adult on a welfare plantation, farmed by liberals for politically useful dysfunction, has the measured vocabulary of a free-state kindergartener. The actual genetic information is pretty much lost in the noise.

Anonymous Ominous Cowherd October 30, 2017 2:52 PM  

dc.sunsets wrote:Really? All I hear from sons who work with Chinese STEM grads in industry is that they can't think their way out of a paper bag.

They specialize in taking tests. They tend to cheat, they tend to be risk averse, and tend to want to stick to formulas. It's tough to cheat your way to innovation through formulas, especially without taking risks.

A few are bright enough to overcome their natural disabilities and innovate. That's one reason I tend to believe the high average IQ story for the Han.

dc.sunsets wrote:Chinese law students in the USA pass the Bar the first time at rates well below Caucasians.

Chinese law students probably are all ESL, and I'm going to guess that language skills are not a strong point in the first place. I wouldn't expect even legitimately bright Chinese to shine in US law.

dc.sunsets wrote:If IQ was all that mattered, China would be the seat of where EVERYTHING peculiar to our modern cornucopia was invented.

China has a long and rich history of not innovating, and not developing ideas into technology. I don't know exactly how they do it so consistently, but they do.

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 3:00 PM  

Regarding population differences in IQ across the world, it's probably useless to even discuss it with anyone who won't accept the voluminously supported difference in mean IQ between people who self-identify as "white" and those who self-identify at "black" in the USA.

https://www1.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/reprints/2004socialconsequences.pdf
Social Consequences of Group Differences in Cognitive Ability

http://www.lagriffedulion.f2s.com/testing.htm
STANDARDIZED TESTS: THE INTERPRETATION OF RACIAL AND ETHNIC GAPS

Blogger Luke October 30, 2017 3:03 PM  

Search "rinse AND repeat site:[thissite'smainURL]"

Anonymous patrick kelly October 30, 2017 3:05 PM  

"Civilization isn’t necessarily threatened by stupid people in greater numbers. Representative democracy is what is threatened. If there are too many stupid people with the same voting rights, Civilization will need to address that to survive, by whatever means necessary."

Yep, "ocracy" is 1/2 of idiocracy. If the smarter people find the motivation and have the stomach to limit the franchise and keep the "idio" in line, the lower IQ crowd doesn't mess things up as much.

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 3:05 PM  

@92 The poor-relative-to-IQ performance of Chinese law grads is, IIRC, true of US-born Chinese; ESL is not the explanation. What you find as I understand it is that East Asians do particularly well in spacial & math tests, not so well with vocabulary based tests. This is getting into the limits of IQ tests when it comes to testing for "g" (the elusive, broad representation of talent.) Test companies would prefer their tests yield ZERO difference between races, and we probably don't know how much they do what the Scholastic Board does, which is try to tweak their tests to reduce race-based differences (at the expense of revealing what they're promising to test.)

Anonymous Grayman October 30, 2017 3:08 PM  

Vox
Take a look at the PISA test results. It looks like white IQ may not be declining so much as the group numbers being reported are being "watered down" by the invaders.

Look at the 2015 PISA results:

2015 PISA results:

http://imgur.com/a/idADj

Anonymous Gen. Kong October 30, 2017 3:10 PM  

British studies described by Thompson show that IQs under 88 are ineducable "to any standard." Imagine what that means....

Let me take a wild guess... Edumacayshun is a racket, perhaps?? I'm shocked, absolutely shocked I tell you.

Anonymous Grayman October 30, 2017 3:13 PM  

DC

As someone in a technical field who has had to hire and work with a fair crose-section of engineers analytical chemists etc, I have to agree with you that IQ is not everything BUT a big part.
In my field its obvious that asians have little to no creative problem solving relative to westerners. The asians are great at plug and chug operations that dont require the synthesis of new concepts on the fly. If forced to problem solve on the fly the crash and burn.

The key tot he west has been our hi IQ'ers ability to synthesis concepts outside of their base knowledge set on a purely conceptual basis and then actualizing it. Its obviously genetic. Just like you will never teach a rottweiler to retrieve like a Labrador will be able to purely by its nature.

Anonymous Grayman October 30, 2017 3:17 PM  

@98 Kong, you might find this interesting:

its a piece that was purged for being to "honest" by one of their own.

http://www.nosacredcows.co.uk/opinion_pieces/3050/article.html

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 3:20 PM  

> British studies described by Thompson show that IQs under 88 are ineducable "to any standard." Imagine what that means....

http://foxbaltimore.com/news/project-baltimore/6-baltimore-schools-no-students-proficient-in-state-tests

Blogger VFM #7634 October 30, 2017 3:21 PM  

Take a look at the PISA test results. It looks like white IQ may not be declining so much as the group numbers being reported are being "watered down" by the invaders.

Among whites, the higher-IQ and lower-IQ portions of the population don't really have much of a difference in birth rates any more. This is not true for NAMs.

Blogger Ben Cohen October 30, 2017 3:21 PM  

Vox, what percentage of Ashkenazi dna is italian?

Best news in a long time.

Blogger VD October 30, 2017 3:22 PM  

The blue-pilled right doggedly holds on to the notion that all it takes is hard work and "the right culture" and anybody can achieve just about anything. They just won't let it go.

And they would just LOVE to vote for a black conservative. They never hesitate to tell you all about how willing they would be to vote for one.

Blogger VD October 30, 2017 3:23 PM  

Vox, what percentage of Ashkenazi dna is italian?

30 to 40 percent.

Blogger James Dixon October 30, 2017 3:35 PM  

> And they would just LOVE to vote for a black conservative.

Yeah. Colin Powell disabused me of that notion. Now, Clarence Thomas or Walter Williams might convince me otherwise, but that's about it.

Anonymous Ominous Cowherd October 30, 2017 3:37 PM  

dc.sunsets wrote:What you find as I understand it is that East Asians do particularly well in spacial & math tests, not so well with vocabulary based tests.

Yes. Law, which is all about creatively spinning stories, is always going to be tough for that crowd.

Also, anything which requires knowledge of the real world is going to forever be a closed book to anyone who has spent his entire life in academia. That's not exclusively a Han problem, but it's a problem that bites most of the brighter Han. Chinese students don't get summer jobs on the construction site or the farm.

Then there's that whole risk averse thing. Innovation fails, a lot. A culture that cannot stand failure cannot innovate.

Anonymous Grayman October 30, 2017 3:42 PM  

The bursting of the blank slate bubble is the greatest fear of the SJW & globalists. If the dark hordes can never build OR maintain a first world industrialized culture, then ALL of their beliefs are essentially invalidated.
Even globalism is sold on the great belief (myth) that everyone one can live like a western european, just with their local cultural flavor, if we all just work together. As soon as you acknowledge the IQ issue we more or less end up back at 18th century sensibilities. That is you only allow for very limited rights of certain races, miscegenation laws, etc. from a logical perspective.
Hell, we all know Africa would crash back to tribal level tech within a decade if cut-off from outside commerce and aid.

Blogger Ben Cohen October 30, 2017 3:57 PM  

That's it vox? I thought it was 50-80 percent.

Thank God though. Italians are the funnest Europeans.

Blogger SteelPalm October 30, 2017 4:02 PM  

VD-

I actually calculated it assuming Arabs were 22 percent of the Israeli population.

This is inaccurate, though. 21% of Israel's population is non-Jewish Arab (Muslims, Christians, and Druze), but over half of Israel's Jewish population has Arab (Mizrahi) heritage.

Thus, we get a number closer to about 60% Arab. The number of pure-blooded Ashkenazi in Israel is relatively low, about 35%. I don't know the actual average IQ of Ashkenazis (and frankly, I doubt anyone does, because of certain logistical problems in any possible study, which I can enumerate if anyone cares), but your demographic assumption above is incorrect.

Blogger Shimshon October 30, 2017 4:05 PM  

Vox, yes Israel went down from 95 to 92.7 but Palestinian Arabs went down even more from 84.5 to 79.9. I was wrong about the Arab population. Current estimates put it at 20.8% of the population. What was your Jewish number before and now?

Blogger Shimshon October 30, 2017 4:16 PM  

Something like 10K Arabs leave Israel annually, or so I've read. Undoubtedly the smartest of the bunch. It's easy to see Arab IQ drop like a stone in that case.

Anonymous Mr. Rational October 30, 2017 4:24 PM  

@68  India built a society around lack of empathy.  What's Hinduism about?  It's about people being in whatever situation they're in because of good or bad karma; the people on the bottom DESERVE it.  They actively punish empathy and have certainly bred it out.

Blogger S1AL October 30, 2017 4:25 PM  

"That's it vox? I thought it was 50-80 percent.

Thank God though. Italians are the funnest Europeans."

It depends on the type of DNA you analyze.

https://infogalactic.com/info/Ashkenazi_Jews#Genetic_origins

Blogger VD October 30, 2017 4:31 PM  

your demographic assumption above is incorrect.

I have no doubt. It was just what was on Wikipedia at the time.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine October 30, 2017 4:32 PM  

"Hell, we all know Africa would crash back to tribal level tech within a decade if cut-off from outside commerce and aid."

They'd probably fall a heck of a lot further than that. There's still a lot to be consumed in falling back to that level, and that consumption while falling builds momentum that in my opinion will probably destroy even the "tribal floor". You eventually realize that even what we might think of as the typical tribal is probably not the bottom floor for that elevator...

Blogger Cataline Sergius October 30, 2017 4:36 PM  

China has a long and rich history of not innovating, and not developing ideas into technology. I don't know exactly how they do it so consistently, but they do.

I have an idea.

Genetic selective pressure.

For most of human history if you were born a pig farmer, you died a pig farmer, covered in pig shit all your life.

There was never anything that resembled a hope of something better.

But in China if you could pass a few exams, you could be wafted so high above and so far away from the sty you'd forget what pig shit even smelled like.

If you became a Mandarin you could afford a great many wives and have a great many children.

The problem with the Mandarin examination system is that it was based on the literary style and a knowledge of the classics.

I love John C. Wright's books but I would be terrified of setting foot on any bridge he designed.

But that is the kind of intelligence that China's selective pressure favored.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine October 30, 2017 4:36 PM  

"India built a society around lack of empathy."

Truer words have seldom been spoken. Religion really can conform society to itself. Better pick the right one, because atheism has even less logical basis for empathy than Hinduism.

Anonymous B.C. Dooper October 30, 2017 4:39 PM  

@88

Even those who can be reached may take a long time and lot more hammering before their programming is broken.

Regarding myself, I remember the programming was incredibly severe. On one occasion I found myself confronted with the relatively minor heresy that a majority of Asians couldn't metabolize lactose. Totally unwilling to accept that there were any differences that went beyond skin deep, my brain rejected the information out of hand and without any further inquiry decided it was not true and went about my business. This was probably in excess of ten years prior to when I finally accepted the truth.

To be fair, not only were hatefacts far more hidden back then, but the programming ensured I wouldn't even try searching them out on my own.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine October 30, 2017 4:39 PM  

"The problem with the Mandarin examination system is that it was based on the literary style and a knowledge of the classics."

I take it your raaaacism against the Chinese is because you've refused to appropriate their cultural icons such as "Journey to the West", "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" and "Dream of Red Mansions"?

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 4:54 PM  

While perhaps India built a system around a lack of empathy, what do we make of Christians' willingness to turn Christian dogma into pathological altruism?

150 years ago (as I understand it) most Christian people believed poverty was either "God's Plan" or something people had a hand in creating for themselves. Personal responsibility was believed highly relevant.

Much of the Virtue-Signaling Folly of today's leftist cult is based on the notion that all hardship in life is not the fault of any who suffer it, that "there for the Grace Of God Go I," and that this demands that all such hardships be ameliorated no matter the cost.

It gets more murky, not less, if one truly embraces the truth of HBD. The newest frontier in Leftism isn't "You didn't build that," it is "You didn't pick your parents," which is basically some weird form of "social ownership" of the very DNA in your cells' nuclei.

The urge to ameliorate hardship is extremely dangerous unless individual agency is the primary focus of attribution. It remains dangerous even when applied to people who have no agency (e.g., children) for there is no ameliorating the social hardships of children (ex: poverty) without enabling their parent(s). Don't get me started about bleeding-heart hand-wringing about "hungry kids" when you find out their parents drive SUV's, smoke cigarettes and hang out at the bar.

Humans are best set up for lifeboat ethics. We get all kinds of bad ideas when we march in the Saving-the-World band.

Anonymous Grayman October 30, 2017 4:57 PM  

Slightly OT, but someone needs to have a nice long chat with the diversity, the browns and blacks. They and their liberal facilitators are openly pushing the "replace evil genocidal whitey" message and hard now.

They haven't thought thought the logical conclusion of this. If whitey accepts he is a gencoidal monster, what does a genocidal monster do????? The hordes are actively creating the force that will purge them and show them versions of hell they have never imagined.
How many times can you call someone a Nazi before they decide to say "ok, get in the oven"

Man, s this socioeconomic wave gains downward momentum its going to turn into one hell of a shit show.

Blogger Kristophr October 30, 2017 5:03 PM  

kmbr: Higher and you get people who can build super computers but can't tie their shoes or have conversations with other actual human beings.

I am one of those. I can tie my shoes, am married, and have been very successful. I can have conversations with other human beings, but I find most of them to be painfully stupid.

I just nod politely, and try to talk them out of walking off cliffs, when I can.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents October 30, 2017 5:04 PM  

@122 Grayman

Have you ever tried having that chat? It's frustrating.

MPAI.

Blogger Kettle October 30, 2017 5:08 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Anonymous Grayman October 30, 2017 5:09 PM  

@124 twenty cents

Yes I have, with a liberal PhD professor of biology. He didn't seem to grasp the logical consequences. I tried with some diversity as well. it was a short fruitless chat.
The degree to which it is being openly pushed is what catches my attention.

Blogger dc.sunsets October 30, 2017 5:10 PM  

@124 "Never try to teach a pig to sing; all it does is frustrate you and annoy the pig."

@123 Have you had any success talking the lemmings from running down the beach, diving into the water to drown themselves? Hmmmm. I didn't think so.

Anonymous Ominous Cowherd October 30, 2017 5:12 PM  

Cataline Sergius wrote:Genetic selective pressure.

Even if there were no effect on the gene pool, that sort of pressure would produce an anti-innovation society, in which anything which threatened the examination system and its rewards would be anathema to all. Add in some affect on the gene pool and you get East Asian society.

We could call the result the CPA gene, I suppose. Its possessors are able to follow the rules, but unable to think outside them. Some Whites have this gene, but only enough of us to keep the books straight. It appears that the East Asians have a far higher occurrence of this hypothetical gene; high enough to keep their cultures stagnant for 5,000 years.

My children are half Chinese. Their mother has the CPA gene, and I very much don't. The children's minds are not rigid like their mother's, and they independently come up with innovative solutions to real life problems. I suspect that the CPA gene is not dominant.

Blogger Stilicho October 30, 2017 5:21 PM  

Is the Flynn effect verfiable across all demographics or just some? Is there a selection bias possible (e.g. Those most likely to be tested vs broader populations, etc.)?

Blogger Kristophr October 30, 2017 5:41 PM  

127.  dc.sunsets
October 30, 2017 5:10 PM
@123 Have you had any success talking the lemmings from running down the beach, diving into the water to drown themselves? Hmmmm. I didn't think so.

I actually have, once in a while. But only with the very smart, and those dumb enough to know they are dumb.

Blogger Duke Norfolk October 30, 2017 6:10 PM  

VD wrote:And they would just LOVE to vote for a black conservative.

Yes, the fawning over "based blacks" is getting rather nauseating. It's akin to woman worship these days. And if that black is female? All bow and scrape.

Blogger Duke Norfolk October 30, 2017 6:19 PM  

Grayman wrote:someone needs to have a nice long chat with the diversity, the browns and blacks.

Nah, f 'em. Let them learn the hard way. It's the only way the lesson has a chance of really sticking.

Besides, as you know this is to our advantage. Waking whitey up from his delusional beliefs needs some strong medicine. And listening to these hateful maniacs is just the prescription we're looking for. More please.

Blogger Joe A. October 30, 2017 6:20 PM  

Damn. That US IQ score is even worse than expected...

Blogger Noah B The Savage Gardener October 30, 2017 6:21 PM  

@106 Yeah. Colin Powell disabused me of that notion. Now, Clarence Thomas or Walter Williams might convince me otherwise, but that's about it.

I would argue that Clarence Thomas is one of the better SC Justices we've ever had not because of his intelligence but because of his honesty. He is generally willing to apply the plain meaning of the Constitution to the interpretation of law. Every Justice we currently have is capable of doing the same thing, but instead, some/most of them refuse to uphold their oaths of office and place the pursuit of utopian visions above preserving the rule of law.

Blogger Duke Norfolk October 30, 2017 6:22 PM  

Grayman wrote:The degree to which it is being openly pushed is what catches my attention.

It really is rather shocking just how brazen and aggressive they're getting now, isn't it? Amazing. And yet many people still have no clue how bad it's getting, safely ensconced in their bubbles. Or they shrug it off as just a wacko loony fringe that's inconsequential. Over and over again. Denial's not just a river in Egypt.

Anonymous DanVincent October 30, 2017 6:27 PM  

How is Germany allowing this travesty of immigration policy to continue if that is really their IQ?

Anonymous Ominous Cowherd October 30, 2017 7:36 PM  

DanVincent wrote:How is Germany allowing this travesty of immigration policy to continue if that is really their IQ?

Perhaps their IQ is that high because they have an embarrassment of midwits keeping the average too high for good sense - but not high enough to straighten out and fly right.

Anonymous Mr. Rational October 30, 2017 7:56 PM  

pyrrhus wrote:Imagine what that means....
Given regression to the mean, it means we should have an IQ cutoff for having children.  Whites, no less than 76; Hispanics, no less than 82; Blacks, no less than 91.

Assuming mean IQ of 85 and stddev of 15, that would leave off about 65% of Af-Ams.

@90 Here ya go.

@118  If there's a label for what I am, it's evolutionary humanist.  We got where we are by evolving from less-capable forms, some of them still extant.  We can behave humanely toward one another, but if we don't have substantial Darwinian selection pressures we'll lose everything we've acquired through them.  To see where that goes, all we have to do is look at Africa.

@121  One of several reasons I will not go back to Christianity any time soon.

The urge to ameliorate hardship is a feminine thing.  Western Civ is way too yin, not enough yang.

@122  Oh, no, let them keep talking.  They have NO IDEA how many red-pill subscriptions they're printing; they're turning them out in tear-offs like rolls of TP.  Let them reap the full measure of their reward.

Some of us have already sketched out the specifications for the ovens, or equivalents.  The tree chippers are available to rent, we can use some directly as pig slop and other feed, and we can keep the rendering plants running full-bore to handle the rest.  Simple logistics.

@126  I could have tried to have that conversation with P.Z. Myers himself, but he knows that his retirement depends on not transgressing the boundaries of egalitarian dogma.  All academics do.

@128  Or maybe she's heterozygous.

Anonymous B.C. Dooper October 30, 2017 7:59 PM  

DanVincent wrote:How is Germany allowing this travesty of immigration policy to continue if that is really their IQ?

If I could lie to myself about differences in food digestion I'm sure they can spin that one real easy.

"These poor refugees just need a warm glass of milk, a regular healthy meal, and lots and lots of other people's money! Then the IQ scores will shoot right up! After all, that famous scientist, (((Franz Boas))) (((proved))) that we're all equal because nutrition affects skull size and shape!"

Blogger Assyrian Nationalist October 30, 2017 8:00 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Assyrian Nationalist October 30, 2017 8:02 PM  

30% - 50% of Iraqi Arabs are inbred. I suspect that Iraq could propel its average IQ from 87 to at least the low 90s to be on par with southern Europe if it fixed its inbreeding problem. Not to mention the associated drop in neurosis that would come from no longer being inbred.

Thank God my church forbids cousin marriage.

Anonymous Yankee Imperialist October 30, 2017 8:08 PM  

"Given regression to the mean, it means we should have an IQ cutoff for having children."

Clearly you oppose the message of Jesus.

“Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” When he had placed his hands on them, he went on from there.

— Matthew 19:13-14

"We can behave humanely toward one another, but if we don't have substantial Darwinian selection pressures we'll lose everything we've acquired through them.Given regression to the mean, it means we should have an IQ cutoff for having children."

You are putting man-made restrictions on an holy, natural act as intended by God. Have you no dignity?

Anonymous DirkH October 30, 2017 8:12 PM  

Skull shape of sinoids is rounder than that of Caucs; and that one is rounder than that of negroids. Resulting in highest volume for sinoids followed by caucs followed by negroids.
IQ 107 for sinoids is well established. See Taiwan and Japan if you doubt it. Taiwan was given by the Tenno to the escaping Chiness of Chiang Kai Tchek .
Taiwan is the world's No.1 computer maker; the Taiwanese became advisers to the Chinese from 1995 on.
Germans are at 105, our average is diluted by the imported Muslims which should be 10% of population now, or 8 million after Merkel's mass import. The Muslims should be at IQ85; caused at least partially by incest. Negroids of course at IQ70. American Negroes have white genetic admixture and score at 85.

Anonymous DirkH October 30, 2017 8:17 PM  

136. DanVincent October 30, 2017 6:27 PM
"How is Germany allowing this travesty of immigration policy to continue if that is really their IQ?"
We're working on it. It's only two years since the communist cunt rammed the knife in our back. These things take time.

Anonymous RedJack October 30, 2017 8:24 PM  

A great team is a Chinese programmer, a German engineer, and an American redneck. If they work well together, I have seen awesome things.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents October 30, 2017 8:53 PM  

Speaking of cranial shapes, the pinhead is back.

Blogger Luke October 30, 2017 9:40 PM  

The bar exam requires takers to think of dozens of things at once. It's nonlinear, more like a flowchart with multiple starting points. You're usually given one starting point, but you'll fail if you forget the other relevant starting points.

As described above, Asians have difficulty thinking about more than one thing at a time, hence the bar difficulties.

Blogger Koanic October 30, 2017 9:56 PM  

Smug waiguoren will discover that
1. Scale + Internet mitigates the stagnative effects of low individual innovation, and
2. China's economic problems are a speed bump; the USA's are a cliff.

Anonymous Magna Carta October 30, 2017 10:08 PM  

Tie all government welfare to sterilization or deportation to those who don't have American ancestry before 1965.

Blogger wreckage October 30, 2017 10:26 PM  

@26, short term, maybe 5-10 points from nutrition and disease. Long term at least another 10 from sexual preferences and social systems.

Where wealth can be accrued inter-generationally by legitimate means, pairs mate for the long term, and rogue parents are eliminated economically or physically, there's a trajectory upwards, that takes "long generations", say, 20-30-year increments or longer for small gains. Where pairs mate shortest term, aggression is king, and rogues either remain or dominate, IQ goes down the toilet fast, generations are about 60% shorter, rogues spread their DNA fast and wide... we're probably looking at downward movement easily twice as fast as upward, just for starters.

So culture is needed for an upward trend, and a strongly dysfunctional culture can wipe out centuries of gain in maybe 2 generations.

Blogger wreckage October 30, 2017 10:29 PM  

(Off the top of my head; neither a geneticist nor a genius; just running numbers by eyeball.)

Blogger Unknown October 30, 2017 10:39 PM  

Lynn has been caught massaging IQ data before. He vastly underestimated Italian and general European scores. He wrote that Finland's IQ was 97, when in fact it was 107. He said Greek IQ was somewhere near the 90's, when in fact it was 105 - the same as China's.

Dienekes, Italian Anthro, and Jason Malloy have all criticized him.

Blogger Thucydides October 30, 2017 11:40 PM  

The destruction of the natural family may have a lot to do with the weakening of the cultural roots and foundations that people need to build upon to live stable lives (and certainly frightened, confused people are not going maifest intelligence in any coherent, usable fashion: http://www.weeklystandard.com/the-primal-scream-of-identity-politics/article/2010234#.WfZVqrlgQnd.facebook

Blogger Azure Amaranthine October 31, 2017 12:26 AM  

"Clearly you oppose the message of Jesus."

Clearly, you haven't even read the message you're repeating. Obviously, the little children coming to Jesus are ones that already exist. Otherwise, the logical end of your argument cannot possibly be anything other than to ensure that every single human female capable of bearing children is perpetually pregnant so that as many children as humanly possible can "come to Jesus". You're a f***ing embarrassment to literate human beings.

"You are putting man-made restrictions on an holy, natural act as intended by God. Have you no dignity?"

On the contrary, feeding those who cannot otherwise feed themselves is a wholly unnatural act, and thereby permitting them to produce more pitiful disadvantaged children is a cruelty. Obviously barring people from having children is not the way to prevent it. Ensuring that they do not have the free time to do so (by not giving them a single handout) is a rather better way of going about it. Executing them if they start to pick up the habit of theft is also an entirely necessary component of that.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine October 31, 2017 12:33 AM  

You have two reasonable options:

A: Let those who are habitually or congenitally incapable of feeding themselves and/or their children starve to death.

B: Feed them, but sterilize them.

Your choice of which is more humane, but if you refuse both you cannot have any civilization whatsoever.

Anonymous Jack Amok October 31, 2017 12:41 AM  

I also question the Chinese IQ averages,

Rampant cheating + corruption in schooling. But they do have a lot of people so that means they have more 4+ Standard Deviation people.


I question not just their supposed 106 IQ, but I also question whether the Chinese STDEV is the same as the US/Europe. I've come across relatively few true Chinese geniuses. What if their STDEV is, say 10 instead of 15? If genetics change the average, no reason to think it can't impact the distribution too.

Note that this tends to indicate that my previous calculation of the average Jewish IQ being 102.4 was a little on the high side, since I was working from an average Israeli IQ of 95, instead of 92.79.

Even at 92, they'd still be 10 points higher than most of their Semite Arab cousins.

Anonymous Charlottesvillain October 31, 2017 12:55 AM  

"83.04 JORDAN"

Oof. Stop inbreeding, Muslims.

Blogger Doc Rampage October 31, 2017 1:51 AM  

Since the position of civic nationalists has nothing to say about how IQ is distributed over populations, how would this be a problem for us?

Blogger Akulkis October 31, 2017 2:00 AM  

China...civilized?

They have rules and order, but I wouldn't call China civilized.

Anonymous A western European October 31, 2017 2:41 AM  

DirkH wrote:Skull shape of sinoids is rounder than that of Caucs; and that one is rounder than that of negroids. Resulting in highest volume for sinoids followed by caucs followed by negroids.

IQ 107 for sinoids is well established. See Taiwan and Japan if you doubt it. Taiwan was given by the Tenno to the escaping Chiness of Chiang Kai Tchek .

Taiwan is the world's No.1 computer maker; the Taiwanese became advisers to the Chinese from 1995 on.

Germans are at 105, our average is diluted by the imported Muslims which should be 10% of population now, or 8 million after Merkel's mass import. The Muslims should be at IQ85; caused at least partially by incest. Negroids of course at IQ70. American Negroes have white genetic admixture and score at 85.


The muslim (Turkish) mean IQ in Germany is lower than that. The first generation is 18 points below the German mean IQ; the second generation is even 3 points below the first. Source:

Der mittlere IQ der Bildungsstufen:
http://www.v-weiss.de/bildungsstufenIQ.pdf

The mean IQ for students from North Africa/Southwest Asia is 92, which means that the average European is smarter (source: Lynn: Race Differences in Intelligence, 2nd edition, 2015). The mean IQ of those regions is 83/84.

There is also a correlation of 0.928 regarding the occupation of southern Spain and intelligence: the longer North Africans/Arabs occupied a region, the greater the interbreeding with the indigenous population and the lower the mean IQ of that region. (Lynn: Race Differences in Intelligence, 2nd edition).

It doesn't look good for us western Europeans.

Anonymous Jack Amok October 31, 2017 2:43 AM  

They have rules and order, but I wouldn't call China civilized.

I agree. I think I've told this story before, but once when I was stuck in a traffic jam in Bejing, I looked out the car window and saw a toddler standing with his mother on the sidewalk get run over by a bicycle. The crowd on the corner started laughing.

Blogger Koanic October 31, 2017 3:55 AM  

> The crowd on the corner started laughing.

And whitey thought the Jap prison camps were bad.

The question is not "if" whites will experience the Chinese death camp, but "how many".

Blogger Akulkis October 31, 2017 5:15 AM  

@Grayman

"The key tot he west has been our hi IQ'ers ability to synthesis concepts outside of their base knowledge set on a purely conceptual basis and then actualizing it. Its obviously genetic. Just like you will never teach a rottweiler to retrieve like a Labrador will be able to purely by its nature."

Now you've done it. You've made yourself Literally Hitler, and everyone in the blog is gonna be begging to be allowed to be Literally Hitler, for at least an hour or so, also.

Blogger James Dixon October 31, 2017 5:52 AM  

> 2. China's economic problems are a speed bump; the USA's are a cliff.

The USA will simply repudiate it's debt. Like most of the other countries in the world have done at one time or another.

Blogger Akulkis October 31, 2017 5:59 AM  

@Azure Amaranthine

True African poem written by an African man some years ago:

Me and my country against the world.
Me and my tribe against my country.
Me and my clan against my tribe.
Me and my family against my clan.
Me and my brother against my family.
Me against my brother.

Blogger Robert What? October 31, 2017 7:58 AM  

Exactly. There are plenty of Whites in Mexico. But they come here as tourists, not 80 IQ day laborers.

Blogger heyjames4 October 31, 2017 8:06 AM  

Jordan Peterson's lecture on IQ and professions from a few months ago.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjs2gPa5sD0

Blogger Wishing Star October 31, 2017 8:50 AM  

If this data is correct, it explains many political leanings. If a large percentage of your people suffer from intellectual disabilities,you need a centrally planned society. It would need to run like a household, the parents guide the young.

If a large percentage of your population functions at a high intellectual capacity then less oversight is responsible. This societies population are more like roommates than parents and young people.

Anonymous Mr. Rational October 31, 2017 10:45 AM  

Yankee Imperialist wrote:Clearly you oppose the message of Jesus.
"Let the little children get smallpox, measles, tuberculosis, whooping cough and poliomyelitis.  Let half of them die before their first birthday."  That was the natural, "God"-given order of the world two millennia ago.

You are putting man-made restrictions on an holy, natural act as intended by God. Have you no dignity?
Having children you can't house and feed (because you're too stupid to hold a family-supporting job) is a holy, natural act?  Making society ever more stupid a holy, natural act?

It's a problem we created and need to fix, period.

@154 What you said.

wreckage wrote:a strongly dysfunctional culture can wipe out centuries of gain in maybe 2 generations.
It has observably done so in the American ghetto.

@163  In the future, everyone will be Literally Hitler for fifteen minutes.

Nope, not touching the poop.

Blogger Jim in Alaska October 31, 2017 11:54 AM  

Average global IQ 86?
Curious strange in so far as by definition the average, median, peak of the bell curve, is 100 when measuring intelligence quotient.

Blogger Daniel October 31, 2017 12:41 PM  

A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents wrote: 88.51 MEXICO

Looks about right. They keep sending us their 80 IQ peasants, whose kids are filling up a lot of grade schools. The 100+ ones stay home where they have a job. Win-win for Mexico and for US libtard CivNats.


Bolivia Paraguay Ecuador are doing the same thing with Argentina.

Blogger Daniel October 31, 2017 12:42 PM  

and perú

Blogger dfordoom October 31, 2017 10:51 PM  

@10. allyn71

The average is the key, no individual intellect is enough to offset the collective IQ being equivalent to that of an imbecile.

Is that really true? It might be true of a democracy, but democracy is such a spectacular failure anyway that it hardly matters. In a society run on sane lines it might be an advantage to have most of the masses being fairly stupid. It's certainly an advantage to have way fewer highly educated people (and especially way fewer educated women).

Blogger dfordoom October 31, 2017 11:42 PM  

@137. DanVincent

How is Germany allowing this travesty of immigration policy to continue if that is really their IQ?

The higher your IQ, and the more education you're exposed to, the more likely you are to believe really stupid things. Think of every dumb idea that has contributed to the ruin of our civilisation and you'll find that every single one of those ideas has been passionately believed in by high-IQ highly educated people.

We need to stop making a fetish of IQ. Our problems in the West are mostly moral problems. IQ doesn't help in tackling such problems.

Mexico may well have a brighter long-term future than Germany.

You don't need a high IQ population. You need a small number of high IQ people. Most western countries probably have too many high IQ people. We certainly have too many people being ruined by unnecessary higher education. We need to start closing down universities.

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