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Sunday, April 22, 2018

The Fake Right is collapsing

And yet, the Alt-Right remains inevitable. Now that it is of no further use to them, the media is finally killing off its cartoon parody of the Right. But the Right is not, and never was, based on races or states, but rather, on nations. The material distinction between nationalism and imperialism is the easiest way to distinguish between true Right and Fake Right. Meanwhile, the genuine nationalists are growing steadily in popularity and influence, and taking over entire nations:
Eight months after a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia ended in the death of a counterprotester, the loose collection of disaffected young white men known as the alt-right is in disarray.

The problems have been mounting: lawsuits and arrests, fundraising difficulties, tepid recruitment, widespread infighting, fierce counterprotests and banishment on social media platforms. Taken together, they've exhausted even some of the staunchest members.

One of the movement's biggest groups, the Traditionalist Worker Party, dissolved in March. Andrew Anglin, founder of the Daily Stormer, the largest alt-right website, has gone into hiding, chased by a harassment lawsuit. And Richard Spencer, the alt-right's most public figure, cancelled a college speaking tour and was abandoned by his attorney last month.

"Things have become a lot harder, and we paid a price for what happened in Charlottesville. . . . The question is whether there is going to be a third act," said Spencer, who coined the name of the movement, which rose to prominence during the 2016 presidential campaign, advocates a whites-only ethno-state, and has posted racist, anti-Semitic and misogynistic memes across the internet.
This is why it is vital for nationalists to adhere religiously to the philosophical truth rather than to various dogmas and ideologies. Any departure from the truth and the media will adroitly exploit that gap and use it to discredit and disqualify you. Speak the clear and unvarnished truth and they will fear to even mention your name because there is little they can do to effectively spin what you are saying into something that it observably is not. They really, really, really do not want to permit any discussion of which narrative is closer to the observable truth, because that calls their own veracity and legitimacy into question.

Reject the Fake Right. Reject the neoconservatives. Reject the cuckservatives. Reject the conservatives. They are all fakes. They are all frauds. None of them are able to speak the truth reliably, and that is why the media is always able to successfully exploit the vulnerabilities exposed by their dishonesty.

UPDATE: Yes, in the unlikely event you still take any of them seriously, reject the libertarians, the communists, and while we're at it, the Whigs.

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191 Comments:

Blogger Ransom Smith April 22, 2018 9:59 AM  

Anglin is either a Fed or a moron who acts like a Fed .
Spencer is definitely a Fed.

Blogger Brick Hardslab April 22, 2018 10:05 AM  

You conclusively proved that Spencer is in no way right wing but the left will never admit that. They will use him as the epitome of alt right long after he is dead.

They're still using Hitler seventy years after he died.

OpenID zhukovg April 22, 2018 10:09 AM  

White may be a uniform color, but it takes more than pigment to make a nation.

The European nations will rise. The United States will break up(possibly to be reunited in a particularly bloody fashion).

Nationalism will crush Globalism.

Ad Victoriam, Deo Vindice, Ave Imperator Trump!

--ZhukovG

Blogger wreckage April 22, 2018 10:10 AM  

It's cute that they've declared victory. Doubtless given their "name it and claim it" mentality, they believe this has put to bed all those horrible things - like nationalism - that Spencer wasn't in favour of anyway.

There's really only three choices, at corresponding levels of organization: tribalism, nationalism, and imperialism. And in that respect, "alt right is inevitable" is so logically irrefutable it's almost trite.

Blogger CoolHand April 22, 2018 10:10 AM  

Well chaps, the MFM has declared us vanquished, guess we should all just go home.

I cannot wait to see the looks of their faces when it finally dawns on them that the news of our demise may have been greatly exaggerated.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 10:24 AM  

"Reject the conservatives. They are all fakes. They are all frauds. "

I understood a long long time ago that the Mainstream was the Lamestream. When I heard Bush I say that Dukakis as "out of the Mainstream," I knew Bush I was full of excrement, even though I had no use for Dukakis.

So what I want to know is, what does it mean "reject the conservatives?" Does it mean that anyone anywhere at any time who says, "I'm a conservative," I must reject? Or is it a matter of telling them that we aren't called conservative any more, we're called alt-right? Am I rejecting the person, or the label? I'm willing to reject whatever's necessary, but, why don't you also include the open borders libertarians in the list of phony baloney plastic banana poseurs we must reject?

I say this as someone who voted for a lot more Libertarians in my life than Republicans, and I regret it bitterly because I feel I should have known better, that I should have seen sooner how stupid it is to say I'm for liberty whilst allowing millions of statist foreigners to flood my country. I never liked open borders, but I tolerated libertarians who did because I was stupid.
What I'm saying is, to all my lobster friends, is that I hate my former libertarian allies a lot more than I hate my former conservative allies. I'm finding that conservatives are more open to the alt-right than libertarians. At least that seems to be the case here where I live in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA.

Blogger tuberman April 22, 2018 10:31 AM  

Ransom Smith wrote:Anglin is either a Fed or a moron who acts like a Fed .

Spencer is definitely a Fed.


I've usually figured Spencer as a Bush Family paid off guy, while AA is more likely paid by the SPLC or ADL.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 10:33 AM  

Zip it, Aeoli. I am not the subject.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 10:36 AM  

So what I want to know is, what does it mean "reject the conservatives?"

If someone calls himself conservative, be skeptical and examine the assumptions and identities that lay beneath his arguments. In most cases, you'll identify the lies and the reasons for them quickly enough.

I'm willing to reject whatever's necessary, but, why don't you also include the open borders libertarians in the list of phony baloney plastic banana poseurs we must reject?

Because they are about as relevant as the Mensheviks these days.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd April 22, 2018 10:39 AM  

Alphaeus wrote:So what I want to know is, what does it mean "reject the conservatives?" Does it mean that anyone anywhere at any time who says, "I'm a conservative," I must reject? Or is it a matter of telling them that we aren't called conservative any more, we're called alt-right? Am I rejecting the person, or the label?

Reject the surrender monkey approach, the Complain, Retreat, Cry tactic. The conservative label is tainted, so ``we're calling ourselves Right, now, not conservative,'' is probably good too.

We aren't rejecting people or labels, just rejecting losing as a path forward.

Blogger Anno Ruse April 22, 2018 10:42 AM  

I'm still waiting for the alt-right leaders to emerge. I'd follow the man, but if there is no man... I guess I'm following some blogs.

Blogger Wynn Lloyd April 22, 2018 10:43 AM  

The alt-right is inevitable, but progress is impeded by the alt-white types. Some of the most vicious, nutty, and disturbed people thrive on Alt-White sites.
I've been called all kinds of names due to the craziness of someone triggered by the mildest statements. Calling people agents because they like ham more than bacon, someone not being interested in the Paleo diet, etc. All sorts of irrelevant issues come to the fore on Alt-White blogs. Of course, that's how the Internet is, but the alt-white has no irl anchor aside from Spencer's goofy talks.
I once sympathized, but can't now. After arguing with a particularly retarded person who claimed that VD was an agent, all because he sold books, which made no sense to me.

"This guy writes books on Right-Wing/Nationalist topics, and SELLS them! Has to be Mossad!"

Blogger Mr.MantraMan April 22, 2018 10:47 AM  

Attention whores who steadfastly refuse to discredit and disqualify the Left and its handmaidens, instead focusing on stupid street theatre to bring attention to the usual ideological oddities that few people care about or care enough to learn about.

Not to dog pile on Spencer but years ago on one of his sites I came to basically conclude he was just another right wing tough talker who if anything wanted above all the usual "Smart Badge" from the Left. But then again what right winger can pass up the opportunity to show off for a journalist?

Blogger The Lab Manager April 22, 2018 10:48 AM  

Sometimes I think I'm more of an Anti-Federalist, but it's 200 or so years to late for that one.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 10:54 AM  

Fine, then on the subject of truth: "All warfare is based on deception."

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 10:58 AM  

Fine, then on the subject of truth: "All warfare is based on deception."

Philosophy is not warfare. The teacher is not the general. What you fight for is not how you fight.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 10:59 AM  

If we accept that Sun Tzu was correct, the logical choices are therefore either pacifism or engaging in at least some deception against the enemy.

I'd even argue that, in the final analysis, war and deception are the same thing.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 11:00 AM  

"If someone calls himself conservative, be skeptical and examine the assumptions and identities that lay beneath his arguments. In most cases, you'll identify the lies and the reasons for them quickly enough."
I try to do that already. And yes, I find that most conservatives are not as far up along the learning curve as they should be at this point. Around here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA it's pretty much a given that most conservatives are completely subdued by the anti-racism propaganda as much as the Marxist Progressives are, and it's annoying and disgusting to see. But I have to tell you that around here the libertarians are much worse in this regard, and libertarians are much more anti-nationalist than the conservatives.

:So what I want to know is, what does it mean "reject the conservatives?"

If someone calls himself conservative, be skeptical and examine the assumptions and identities that lay beneath his arguments. In most cases, you'll identify the lies and the reasons for them quickly enough.

I'm willing to reject whatever's necessary, but, why don't you also include the open borders libertarians in the list of phony baloney plastic banana poseurs we must reject?

"Because they are about as relevant as the Mensheviks these days.Because they are about as relevant as the Mensheviks these days."

That'd be true in most places most of the time but not around here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA. Around here there are a lot more libertarians than conservatives, and the libertine libertarians are an alternative ideological vanguard in support of the general Marxist Progressive project. Around here to be conservative and not Marxist Progressive or Libertine Libertarian is to be pretty much alt-right, whether one knows it or not.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 11:11 AM  

"Reject the surrender monkey approach, the Complain, Retreat, Cry tactic. The conservative label is tainted"

As I've commented previously when it came to voting I was more of a Libertarian that a Conservative because I really believed in limited Constitutional government. I moved away from the Libertarian Party because I figured out that open borders and statist foreigners constituted about as anti-libertarian policy as a policy could get. I almost got in to a fist fight at an Emil Villa's Hickory Pit with a fellow Libertarian over the issue 20 years ago. So I can understand how labels get tainted.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 11:11 AM  

If we accept that Sun Tzu was correct, the logical choices are therefore either pacifism or engaging in at least some deception against the enemy.

Again you are completely missing the point. You really need to stop trying to argue with me, because you are not intellectually up to the task and I am getting tired of explaining the obvious to you.

Sun Tzu is relevant to war. He is not relevant to things which precede or underlie or are unrelated to war.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 11:12 AM  

That'd be true in most places most of the time but not around here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA.

We don't care. It's not all about you.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 11:19 AM  

"Philosophy is not warfare. The teacher is not the general. What you fight for is not how you fight."

VD, this is why I love your blog. If anything sums up my problem with Libertarians it's this idea you so succinctly summarized. "What you fight for is not how you fight."

My way of expressing your idea there was to say, "Nobody ever had a speck of liberty who did not kill massive numbers of anti-liberty despots in order get it and keep it."

I would also say, "Libertarians will get liberty the same way despots get their despotism and totalitarians get their totalitarianism, by killing everyone who opposes them, or at least intimidating them in to submission."

Blogger IrishFarmer April 22, 2018 11:19 AM  

This is a mild cleansing i think. Like a fire many will disappear but the best will stick around and probably grow stronger thanks to the smarter and more efficient movement. You arent losing much with the twp and spencer gone. Spencer had some all right rhetoric but otherwise wasnt much use. The next test will be to see who of the survivors is best able to reorient themselves to take advantage of the glut of demand for something authentically right wing in the wake of all this.

OpenID paworldandtimes April 22, 2018 11:26 AM  

TWP and similar are "all bark, no bite" in the eyes of the public, so their belligerent optics had the effect of a joke. Golden Dawn adopts hitlerite iconography as well -- but they actually bring muscle to the street, so nobody thinks of them as LARPers.

I've wondered about the fallout from Spencer's first Charlottesville march, had VSP opened fire on the demonstrators. Martyrdom wasn't a game changer at Waco, but things are different now.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 11:27 AM  

"That'd be true in most places most of the time but not around here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA. " "We don't care. It's not all about you."

Gee, VD, why would you say that to me that way? Here I am in the belly of the Globalist Internationalist Marxist Progressive Beast, and you call me a gamma for trying to offer my report on the conditions here? I'm up to my eye balls in Satan's demon infested winged monkey servants, and you think I'm complaining because I think it's all about me?

Is the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA a candidate for Ground Zero status, or am I missing something? I'm trying to fight the good fight here, because I was born here and I don't want to run away like the more sensible people who hold their own comfort and sanity to be more important than resisting the evil. If it was all about me wouldn't I move to Oregon or Nevada or Arizona or Texas like so many of the other normal people who have been fleeing Gruberfornia?

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 11:37 AM  

""We don't care. It's not all about you.""

Well, now I know how those guys on Omaha Beach felt when they reported meeting strong resistance and being under heavy fire and were told "stop whining, it's not all about you, SHAEF doesn't care."

And now I know how the 106th Infantry Division felt when they reported that there were massive Panzer divisions overrunning their position, ""Stop whining, it's not all about you, SHAEF doesn't care."

Which is what really happened, that they don't tell us about.

Blogger Aidan MacLear April 22, 2018 11:38 AM  

Vox, I agree with the vast majority of what you write, and I have a great deal of respect for you as one of the only people to put his money where his mouth is and actually build institutions that are alternative to the Left's mainstream ones. But I also think you lack historical perspective on nationalism.

Nationalism is not the 'real right' either. Nationalism is a leftist movement no more than 250 years old that proposed the fundamental equality of human beings in opposition to social class and class privileges. Abolish the nobility and all Frenchmen participate in French culture equally. Like Manchester Economics, the Overton Window has shifted and left it on the right of acceptable discourse. But in 1792 it was sitting on the Left and howling for the blood of the clergy and the head of the King.

Class is as real as race and sex. A "nation" is not a spontaneous outgrowth of culture from people who have similar genetics. A nation is the culture of its aristocracy, roughly following the Pareto principle.

Nationalism destroys what it touches. Garibaldi's unification of Italy turned it into a parody of a country that hasn't been relevant as a power for 150 years.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 11:44 AM  

"Garibaldi's unification of Italy turned it into a parody of a country that hasn't been relevant as a power for 150 years"

Black Pigeon Speaks says that Italy was invented by Napoleon to troll Austria.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd April 22, 2018 11:46 AM  

IrishFarmer wrote:You arent losing much with the twp and spencer gone.

Since Spencer seems to have been Left, I'd say we are gaining by his absense. The article Vox quoted was bemoaning the demise of the MSM's fake right. It's all good for the real, Alt-Right.

Blogger pyrrhus April 22, 2018 11:49 AM  

Nationalism destroys what it touches. Garibaldi's unification of Italy turned it into a parody of a country that hasn't been relevant as a power for 150 years.
That's because Northern Italy and Southern Italy are not the same peoples, primarily because of cousin marriage (still common in the south) and the Moorish influence in the South. The high IQ, industrious northern Italians are comparable to France and Germany, while the southerners are more like Brazil....
Nationalism is bad when it glues together unlike peoples...the answer is more homogeneous nations, which are highly stable.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 11:49 AM  

Gee, VD, why would you say that to me that way? Here I am in the belly of the Globalist Internationalist Marxist Progressive Beast, and you call me a gamma for trying to offer my report on the conditions here? I'm up to my eye balls in Satan's demon infested winged monkey servants, and you think I'm complaining because I think it's all about me?

I didn't call you a gamma. You asked me a question. I answered it. No one in the rest of the world gives a quantum of a damn about whatever the socio-political situation in San Francisco happens to be. The Bay Area is not the Axis Mundi. And libertarianism as a movement is not relevant to the ongoing battle between nationalist and globalist.

You may not like the truth, but that does not change what it is.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 11:50 AM  

Nationalism destroys what it touches. Garibaldi's unification of Italy turned it into a parody of a country that hasn't been relevant as a power for 150 years.

That's the precise opposite of nationalism. That is imperialist statism. You are confusing nation with state.

Blogger Avalanche April 22, 2018 11:52 AM  

@18 "That'd be true in most places most of the time but not around here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA."

Alpheus, do you not see that your questions are a version of "but, what about meeeee?" That you *choose* to live an a cesspool, and are trying to clean up or convert (or just live while touching ewww.) cesspool creatures has little or nothing to do with trying to salvage our nation.

You're NOT going raise them out of their filth. You're getting yourself filthy by trying. Maybe find a different front to fight on: maybe start sending out dispatches from behind enemy lines: let the normies (those not in the cesspool) know what living in shit-city is like. Keep showing them (us) the difference between OUR nation, and the not-us-creatures you are living amongst.

You're going to be mostly alone if you choose to live in a cesspool. Ask yourself: is it worth it to you? If it is -- then make it worthwhile to your people! Make YOUR contribution count where it can make some difference, of whatever magnitude.

Blogger Warunicorn April 22, 2018 11:53 AM  

Minus this allusion to Anglin and Spencer, yeah, SJWs, you go with that. Think we're in disarray. Let your guard down.

lol

Blogger Avalanche April 22, 2018 12:06 PM  

@24, "I'm trying to fight the good fight here, because I was born here and I don't want to run away like the more sensible people who hold their own comfort and sanity to be more important than resisting the evil."

That "fight" was lost long long ago! You're not "fighting" -- you're trying to APPEAR brave because you haven't paid attention to not-so-common sense! (Sensible people left: you're not resisting evil, you're tilting at windmills! Waste of time!)

@24 "trying to offer my report on the conditions here?"

Why would we have ANY interest in the temperature and percentage of solids IN A CESSPOOL!?! If you want to keep swimming... I guess, have at it? But WE don't care bout your conditions in the cesspool you're apparently too... un-sensible ... to get the hell out of! There is no making a cesspool habitable! Maybe stop trying!


@25 "Well, now I know how those guys on Omaha Beach felt ...
And now I know how the 106th Infantry Division felt..."

Please stop before someone REALLY tries to get through to you. You sound like a 6-yr-old asking daddy to applaud him! "How it FEELZ?!?! Really? ou're asking for someone (HERE?!?!) to pat you on the head because of your FEELZ?!?!

NO ONE with any sense is trying to "fight" in a cesspool, and certainly no one asked YOU to try to make any headway in a cesspool -- yet YOU are asking US for applause?!?! You expect people who are actually doing things that might actually have a USEFUL effect to applaud YOU because you don't want to move out of a cesspool?!

Uh, not gonna happen.

OpenID nhinsnow April 22, 2018 12:14 PM  

Daily Stormer, the largest alt-right website

I always wonder... Do other regular people see how this is the way you know "the circus et al" are lying?

I'm not alt-right, but I read widely on both sides of the aisle. Never once have I bothered to go to the Daily Stomer. I wouldn't know it existed if not for the media's harping about it.

Blogger Dire Badger April 22, 2018 12:14 PM  

There are a few places where Libertarians still have power... Bay area, Utah, Colorado, some of the other flyover states.

Fortunately, all you have to do is give them a little weed and they smoke themselves into oblivion.

What gets me are the "socially liberal, fiscally conservative" types that seem to be so incredibly popular here in flyover cities. Not only does the first preclude the second utterly, but the utter falsehood inherent in the phrase deserves nothing but a punch in the face.

Blogger Opiter April 22, 2018 12:20 PM  

Hey Vox, new here though I've been lurking for a while and reading your books (excellent by the way). As an interesting bit, did you happen to see the report about Democrats platform for 2020 and 2022? Breitbart had the post from Washington Free Beacon. Allegedly they are running on Medicare for all and free college (not shocking), but now want to include reparations. They expect to have Texas locked down Blue by 2024, along with Virginia and Florida. Thoughts on this?

Sorry if this is not the place to ask, I'm a bit new.

Blogger RusticFederalist April 22, 2018 12:35 PM  

Aeoli wrote:If we accept that Sun Tzu was correct, the logical choices are therefore either pacifism or engaging in at least some deception against the enemy.

I'd even argue that, in the final analysis, war and deception are the same thing.


I don't understand why are you bringing up Sun Tzu, deception, and war. Will you expand on your thought and how it relates to the Vox's post?

Blogger Laramie Hirsch April 22, 2018 12:35 PM  

Yes! The Whigs! Thank goodness you mentioned the Whigs.

Blogger MickDundee April 22, 2018 12:40 PM  

Not taking sides but let’s not retcon history:

A) The alt-right was pretty much invented as a meme by 4chan... the name “alternative right” was invented by Spencer...

B) It’s memes were then amplified by forums like MPC dot com, shitpoasters on Twitter like Ricky Vaughn, podcasters like TRS, sites like the Daily Stormer including Weeve and Agnlin, bloggers like Heartiste...

C) Then it spread to Bannon, Milo, Cernovich, Vox Day, etc. This was mid-2015 when Trump started taking off...

I know because I was there.

Blogger Dave April 22, 2018 12:48 PM  

Will Utahns reject Romney? Support Dr. Mike and help Utahns send Romney packing back to the northeast with his tail between his legs. Participate in the ultimate embarrassment of Romney by showing the world he can't even win a primary in Utah.

http://www.kennedyforutah.com/

(Yes, he's a Kennedy but not that kind of Kennedy!)

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 12:53 PM  

" That you *choose* to live an a cesspool, and are trying to clean up or convert (or just live while touching ewww.) cesspool creatures has little or nothing to do with trying to salvage our nation "

Well, if we lose the whole world will be like the San Fran Sicko Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA. I live here because I was born here. I stay here because I have an aversion to running away from a fight. I feel like I was born to contend with that which most other more normal people would eschew.
I have no illusions about saving my state; I believe it will eventually have to be destroyed in order to save it. What I spend most of my time doing is encouraging whosoever I run in to who sees the problem to save themselves and move away to a place where normal people have a chance to breathe. And I make sure to tell them not to take their Gruberfornia idiocy with them.

Is it not advantageous to have moles embedded in enemy territory? Is there not value in having allies behind the lines who enjoy making the heads of the enemy explode by telling them there are boys and there are girls as a matter of biological science?

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 12:59 PM  

Is it not advantageous to have moles embedded in enemy territory?

Yes, certainly.

Is there not value in having allies behind the lines who enjoy making the heads of the enemy explode by telling them there are boys and there are girls as a matter of biological science?

No. Making heads explode is ineffectual conservative talk.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 1:00 PM  

A) The alt-right was pretty much invented as a meme by 4chan... the name “alternative right” was invented by Spencer...

No, it was invented by Paul Gottfried. Spencer shortened it to Alt-Right. But the core concept was created by William F. Buckley, who read right-wingers out of the Conservative Movement.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 1:03 PM  

"NO ONE with any sense is trying to "fight" in a cesspool, and certainly no one asked YOU to try to make any headway in a cesspool -- yet YOU are asking US for applause?!?!"

Not exactly. I was trying to say that your generalized attack on "conservatives" was stupid, without putting too fine a point on it. And I think you're stupid for supposing that what I'm looking for is applause from retards who think conservatives in general are the enemy when the problem is Marxists Globalists in particular and Satan's demon infested winged monkey servants in general. I don't care that you insult me, but it bothers me that you insult me sofa king stupidly.

I don't hang around here to benefit from the admiration. If I wanted admiration wouldn't I parrot back whatever it was that seem to garner the admiration around here? I'm not so stupid that I think that questioning the hatred of "conservatives" is going to gain me any sympathy around here, much less admiration and applause. I'm being sincere and I thought there might be reason to suppose that there were some serious thinkers around here; people who disagree with deal with serious questions about serious issues with seriousness and not like the infantile Marxist Progressives that I live around and observe up close. I know mindless snark when I hear it and I'm rather disappointed that there is so much of it around here. You don't agree with me so you tell me I'm a pathetic loser looking for applause? Really? Who's the pathetic loser when it comes to dealing with abstract ideas here?

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 1:06 PM  

Who's the pathetic loser when it comes to dealing with abstract ideas here?

You are. You asked a dumb question, didn't like the answer, and proceeded to throw a hissy fit.

And we still don't care.

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 1:06 PM  

> And yet, the Alt-Right remains inevitable.

The reactions of single individuals you know nothing about may be extremely hard to predict. But large groups of people uniformly react in predictable ways.

Our people have been lied to and cheated for over 100 years now by their ruling class. Now they're attempting genocide them. What do people think the reaction is going to be?

> After arguing with a particularly retarded person who claimed that VD was an agent, all because he sold books, which made no sense to me.

Given the infiltration of the moneyed classed by our adversaries, it's not an unreasonable jump for the intellectually challenged to conclude that those who are successful capitalists must be part of that class. It's incorrect, but then mpai.

> Sometimes I think I'm more of an Anti-Federalist, but it's 200 or so years to late for that one.

Your time will come again. Be ready if it's in your lifetime. Teach your children if it's not.

> I'm trying to fight the good fight here, because I was born here and I don't want to run away like the more sensible people who hold their own comfort and sanity to be more important than resisting the evil.

Yeah, that work about as well as being outnumbered 1000 to 1 usually does. Remember that retreat from a battlefield is a valid military option. Especially if it harms the enemy more than it does you. Which, in this case, it would.


> Then it spread to Bannon, Milo, Cernovich, Vox Day, etc.

Nothing "spread" to Vox Day. Vox is what he's always been. He merely learns more as he gets older. The same is true for the Ilk.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 22, 2018 1:07 PM  

I know because I was there.
You were there when the Bull Mooses bolted the Republican Party?
Cool story, bro.

Blogger Wynn Lloyd April 22, 2018 1:08 PM  

Surprised the author didn't mention Baked Alaska. Another extreme implosion.

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 1:09 PM  

> They expect to have Texas locked down Blue by 2024, along with Virginia and Florida. Thoughts on this?

They expect immigration immigrant birth rates to continue at their current rates. That's not going to happen.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 1:11 PM  

Go away, Alphaeus. I am not the subject.

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 1:13 PM  

> Well, if we lose the whole world will be like the San Fran Sicko Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA.

a) No, it won't. The US isn't the world.
b) Only for a fairly short period of time, historically speaking.

> Is it not advantageous to have moles embedded in enemy territory?

You aren't acting like a mole. By definition, moles blend into the surrounding. You've said you aren't doing that.

Blogger Wynn Lloyd April 22, 2018 1:19 PM  

Good point. Reassuring.

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 1:21 PM  

> You cared enough to respond to me. If it was really that stupid you would not have bothered.

The SDL is kind, but his patience is limited.

> I think you know that the anti-conservative crusade is at least a bit problematic and that's why the juvenile snark. "We don't care" as a response,

You know nothing. Read the 16 points. The re-read point 12 again. Several times.

Blogger Anno Ruse April 22, 2018 1:21 PM  

Amazing how VD will waste 200 replies on someone who's obviously not going to learn. Not even the Great Blogger himself can resist "touching the poop".

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 1:22 PM  

> Besides, there are no stupid questions, there are only stupid people.

So, if you asked a stupid question...

> True, and I won't say, he who fights and runs away lives to run another day.

See above.

Blogger Aidan MacLear April 22, 2018 1:25 PM  

@31 Vox

Hindsight is 20/20. Garibaldi considered himself to be liberating Italy from a nobility that had imposed supposedly artificial divisions on the "Italian people". And especially Austria, which governed quite a bit of what is today Northern Italy.

Somehow, the Northern Italians were doing a lot better "as a people" under Austria than they did under a nationalist government (it both called itself nationalist and is considered by contemporaries and history to be nationalist). And that is because Austria wisely gave its territories (more or less) self-rule, while the republican-nationalist Italian state decided to meddle in order to conform different regions of Italy to a broad standard of Italian-ness.

I would go so far as to say that different regions of France or England constitute separate 'nations'. Under your definition, they are entitled to independent states. 'French Nationalism' is almost as abortive as 'white nationalism' considering that the genetics contributed to France are Gallic, Frankish, Norman, and Roman- each group with its own preferences and values. Or one could nebulously argue that they're similar instead; and there's no authority that can make a truthful claim on where the borders for these nations would rightfully stand.

'Civic nationalism' is true in the sense that the cultural values of the owner of a territory can exert a selection effect over generations on the genes of the people living there. The culture of the warrior aristocracy and the values of the Church gradually molded the genes of European peoples. Once you throw them away for self-rule, you don't have nations any more.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 1:26 PM  

I don't understand why are you bringing up Sun Tzu, deception, and war. Will you expand on your thought and how it relates to the Vox's post?

I would, except there are limits to Vox's patience with me and I had a dream the other night that warned me about the potential consquences of exceeding them.

This is not to say he's unreasonable, it's quite the contrary. There's no sense in arguing with unreasonable people.

OpenID bgkoranburner April 22, 2018 1:27 PM  

I'm still waiting for the alt-right leaders to emerge. I'd follow the man, but if there is no man

Why not follow your conscience & see if a parade forms behind you? If nothing else someone will always want to jump in front of you.

Well, now I know how those guys on Omaha Beach felt when they reported meeting strong resistance and being under heavy fire

If Omaha Beach was covered in shit & needles it wouldn't be worth taking. Maybe you should move?

Is the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA a candidate for Ground Zero status

Yes the bathhouses in San Fran are good candidates for Ground Zero status of many 3rd world diseases. http://www.newnownext.com/ive-contracted-my-third-gastrointestinal-parasite-from-rimming-and-i-cant-be-the-only-gay-man-suffering/01/2018/

Allegedly they are running on Medicare for all and free college (not shocking), but now want to include reparations

I am fine with reparations, Lewis Farrakhan looked up who owned the slave boats & ran the auctions that brought blacks to the US, low & behold they were all jewish. The largest slaveowning family now controls Montesano.

The inquisition was reparations for jews selling white Christians as slaves to moslems.

Blogger Jack Amok April 22, 2018 1:30 PM  

Libertarians used to be basically two groups - people who were Libertarians because they wanted to legalize dope, and people who wanted to legalize dope because they were libertarians and didn't think a free people should have a government intruding in their lives like that.

The second group didn't - back then - realize that while a limited government is a fine and preferable system for a high-trust, high-IQ, homogeneous people, it completely fails a multicultural society, especially one that has imported large numbers of low-trust, low-time-preference foreigners.

A third group came along to hijack the movement twenty or thirty years ago - Globalist parasites who made Libertarianism about open borders and free trade. The fruits of their labor has pretty much driven the second group out of the movement and into the Alt-Right.

The narrative arc of libertarianism is a great example of what politics is really about. The closest it ever comes to principle is when you have a homogeneous, high-trust society (and even then, there's lots of special pleading). But as soon as you have a multicultural society, it quickly degenerates into ethnic block voting. The coming explosion of the Democrat party into warring ethnic camps will be an even better example, but it's still some years (two? four? six?) years away.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 1:31 PM  

I would, except there are limits to Vox's patience with me and I had a dream the other night that warned me about the potential consquences of exceeding them.

No, feel free go ahead. I'm genuinely curious as to how you're going to try to connect the two.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 1:32 PM  

Hindsight is 20/20. Garibaldi considered himself to be liberating Italy from a nobility that had imposed supposedly artificial divisions on the "Italian people". And especially Austria, which governed quite a bit of what is today Northern Italy.

It's not absurd at all. People in the North could barely even understand the people in the South and they had no shared political history with them. Hell, I can barely understand the Calabresi today.

Blogger VD April 22, 2018 1:35 PM  

I would go so far as to say that different regions of France or England constitute separate 'nations'. Under your definition, they are entitled to independent states.

They ARE different nations. England, Wales, Scotland, and even Cornwall are different nations entitled to independent states.

OpenID genkong April 22, 2018 1:37 PM  

Ransom Smith wrote:

Anglin is either a Fed or a moron who acts like a Fed.

Spencer is definitely a Fed.


Anglin is certainly a moron - just watch the "debate" he had with VD if you're not sure. He literally had no idea of what Nazism was apart from Hugo Boss uniforms and the Pedowood narrative. Of course, being a moron actually increases his chances of being a fed.

Agreed Spencer is probably deep-state: William F. Cuckley version 2.0. Cuckley started out looking a lot more right-wing than Spencer did, too. The first clue with Cuckley was the attack on the Birchers.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 22, 2018 1:42 PM  

During the great mining boom of the 17th and 18th centuries, Cornwall was overrun with Midlanders and Scots. This after the war of extermination carried out by Henry VIII means that less than half the population is ethnically Cornish.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine April 22, 2018 1:48 PM  

"The first clue with Cuckley was the attack on the Birchers."

When you attack a pillar with your head, you just push yourself backward off the sandbar you're standing on.

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 1:58 PM  

> I would, except there are limits to Vox's patience with me...

That shows an unusual amount of discernment on your part. Not that I'm in any position to throw stones, mind you.

> ...and I had a dream the other night that warned me about the potential consquences of exceeding them.

Ah, perhaps that explains it.

> The largest slaveowning family now controls Montesano.

I assume you mean Monsanto? If so, not much longer. They're being bought out by Bayer.

OpenID genkong April 22, 2018 2:03 PM  

paworldandtimes wrote:

I've wondered about the fallout from Spencer's first Charlottesville march, had VSP opened fire on the demonstrators. Martyrdom wasn't a game changer at Waco, but things are different now.

The self-appointed leaders responsible for the events of Charlottesville were either deep-state plants (Jason Kessler was an Obama supporter) or idiots. Charlottesville was enemy-controlled territory. The folks who attended played right into the left's trap. As noted elsewhere, the Soros-funded Antifa is supported by deep-state, badge-gang and oafcuckers nationwide. Ministry of Truth was waiting and the whole event went according to script. Antifa not only worked with police at Charlottesville and at Spencer's speech in Lansing, but have successfully attacked gatherings of Cerno (NYC) and even Christian-named events. Holding marches and other public-events when those normally tasked with keeping order openly side with Antifa (well funded by $PLC, ADL, and various deep-state slush-money) is not a viable strategy.

Blogger FP April 22, 2018 2:04 PM  

@21
"VD, this is why I love your blog. If anything sums up my problem with Libertarians it's this idea you so succinctly summarized. "What you fight for is not how you fight."

My way of expressing your idea there was to say, "Nobody ever had a speck of liberty who did not kill massive numbers of anti-liberty despots in order get it and keep it." "

Thats a good way to put it. I got a great laugh when I read L. Neil Smith's Probability Broach. Pure Libertarian utopian fantasy where the good in it is rendered pointless because they won't do what is necessary to stop the "Hamiltonians" because "muh principles". Smith is great on the 2nd amendment and self-defense but ignores the rest of reality.

I had a similar reaction to watching the documentary Wild Wild Country on the Rajneeshi cult in the 80s. They had their American lawyer whinging decades later about their denied civil rights because a county government denied letting their homeless "street people" the right to register to vote after being in the county for 20 days. That delusional hippy cult boomer still can't see reality after what has happened to this country since 1965.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 2:08 PM  

"You know nothing. Read the 16 points. The re-read point 12 again. Several times."

I did not realize that point twelve meant we don't care what anybody thinks about anything. That would seem to preclude any and all discussion of strategy and/or tactics, or sharing of experiences, or just about any sort of intelligent thinking at all.

Seems to me that Point 12 means that the alt right does not care what its enemies and critics think of it, and has nothing to do with what we have to say to or about each other.

If you count me as an enemy because I don't just spout the party line, then it makes sense that you don't care what I say or what I think.


Blogger Jack Amok April 22, 2018 2:08 PM  

For the slow, maybe "we don't care" needs a little expansion. I've always thought there were three interrelated aspects to it.

1 - it doesn't matter whether the views of the Alt-Right are socially acceptable or not, we recognize a nationalist, anti-globalist, anti-equalitarian program as our only alternative to serfdom and oblivion, for us and our posterity. Most of us used to dislike several of the positions we now hold too, but they're necessary and inevitable, so we certainly don't care if other people don't like them yet. We don't care because our positions are both necessary and inevitable.

2 - we've seen the Globalist Left abuse their "-ism" cards far too often, and realize that the Right allowed itself to be defeated too many times by bogus, one-sided appeals to decency. Plus we know we were infiltrated by saboteurs and con-artists who were paid (one way or another) to counsel noble defeat. We don't care because caring was used as a weapon against us too many times in the past, and it separates us from the defeatist cucks.

3 - There are people who have, through bad choice or bad luck, gotten themselves into bad positions for the future. Mixed-race marriages, heavily invested in globalist endeavors, broken homes, too much debt, wrong communities... they're going to suffer a great deal in the revanchment to come. We're sorry about that, but you'll have to look after yourselves because the Globalists haven't left us enough margin to compromise what we need to do in order to bail you out. Plus, see #2 above, we're wise to that trick too.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 2:35 PM  

I'm reading "Cuckservative," and it's not as depressing as I thought it would be, it's actually uplifting to see that progress is being made against the surrender monkey tendency which besets what was called conservatism.

I don't cling to the conservative label any more that I cling to the libertarian label. What I've been trying to explain is that I'm not going to tell those I come across that they are my enemy and I hate them just because they happen to still embrace the label "conservative." I will hate them as an enemy if they are for open borders and for gun control and for Globalism instead of Nationalism; I will hate them in proportion to their actual cucky substance, and not because of a label which at this point might still be due to a misunderstanding and being behind the social and political awareness curve. Eventually it might be the case that conservatives that refuse to give up the label are refusing because they are in fact Globalist cucks, but I don't think we're at that point yet.

My attitude is, we should not burn that bridge until we come to it.

Blogger RusticFederalist April 22, 2018 2:39 PM  

MickDundee wrote:Not taking sides but let’s not retcon history: . . .

I don't remember where I first encountered the term, it may have been reddit or pol, or it could have been from Hillary and her bowtie-boy supporters.

I thought it was a gag at first, I thought all these frog and and warhammer cartoons were just people being silly. And in retrospect, that is probably where the Alt-Right got one of its main number boosts - in young men realizing the absurdity of the times and outright mocking it.

I had heard people talk about a really intuitive guy named Vox, but like a moron I went over to the OTHER vox (and what a letdown that place is), and didn’t find Vox Popoli until I watched a Molyneux-Day video after the election. I had heard the name Spencer, but I didn't see his face until he had his “Hail Trump” newsblip.

I originally thought the Alt-Right was a meme, but Vox Day has done a good job providing us links to the origin, growth, current status, and necessary future of the Alternative Right.

Blogger Lovekraft April 22, 2018 2:46 PM  

@72 Rustic:

If you haven't heard of takimag's Jim Goad, check him out.

@ Alphaeus: now's the time to reread the replies to you and reflect, not keeping on like you just got out of a Kanye concert and want to 'change the world'.

Blogger Ceerilan April 22, 2018 2:57 PM  

@Alphaeus

From what I can tell, you are welcome to share your personal experiences here providing they are relevant to the topic at hand. Vox isn't a combat general leading us against the left to reclaim our society. That isn't his temprament.

Your position behind enemy lines isn't unique. Every one of us who has gone to college since about 1950 has faced the same. Your contribution is small, but valued. Part of the Alt-Right is that no one is indespensible. Consider that a good thing because the movement won't fall apart without you. Feel free to contribute what you can, when you can.

If you want to see a certain type of action taken that will benefit the nation, and you don't see it being done by someone else... Start it yourself. Attract people who will help you.

Hope this helps.

Blogger John April 22, 2018 2:58 PM  

Vox is on a roll today.

Blogger John April 22, 2018 3:06 PM  

@71 I don't cling to the conservative label any more that I cling to the libertarian label. What I've been trying to explain is that I'm not going to tell those I come across that they are my enemy and I hate them just because they happen to still embrace the label "conservative."

Of course not. Just speak the truth. The neat thing is, the truth is actually pretty effective on conservatives, especially if they're not up to their necks in the Swamp. It's just doesn't take effect instantly.

Blogger MickDundee April 22, 2018 3:29 PM  

“No, it was invented by Paul Gottfried. Spencer shortened it to Alt-Right. But the core concept was created by William F. Buckley, who read right-wingers out of the Conservative Movement.”

Sure, and you can go back to Sam Francis, Pat Buchanan and Rothbard if you are talking about spiritual ancestors. Ann Coulter’s book on immigration was also a big influence. As the saying goes, success has many fathers...

But the fact is all the classic memes ... Pepe, cuckservative, ovenworthy, (((echos))), the goyim know... all originated with /pol/ and then were popularized by the sources I list above.

Maybe Anglin or Spencer are now feds or stupid or “fake.” I don’t know and I’m not going to take sides. But to deny their original contributions is a retcon.

Again, I know. I was on Twitter and MPC very early in 2015 when the Meme War first began. I was there when Ricky Vaughn began to hit the mainstream. I was literally the first account to call Jonah Goldberg a cuckservative, which Instapundit retweeted to a mass audience.

Blogger RusticFederalist April 22, 2018 3:39 PM  

The Lab Manager wrote:Sometimes I think I'm more of an Anti-Federalist, but it's 200 or so years to late for that one.

It was a bummer for me to realize that all the hopefulness of the ideas presented by the Federalists failed, the fears of the Anti-Federalists were realized, and some of the leading Federalists may have been outright deceitful.

When Vox talks about the different nations on Britain I become sentimental and think "oh maybe our American Federalism will work better for them." But now I wonder if centralized federalism wasn't always a vehicle used to covertly grow the power of statism.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 3:47 PM  

"Consider that a good thing because the movement won't fall apart without you. "

Hey, here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA, without me, there ain't no movement worth mentioning. Après moi, le deluge. There ain't nothing wrong here that a few well placed soothing neutron balms can't fix.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 4:10 PM  

I'm genuinely curious as to how you're going to try to connect the two.

You haven't even shown the instruments yet. Can I talk to a manager?

It's relatively simple in the big picture, but complex in derivation. I'll do my best to keep it impersonal and concise.

In the end, my position is that it's infinitely preferable NOT to claim that we're fighting a holy war with God and an army of angels at our backs. By infinitely I mean that I may be incorrect in a matter of life and death, but if I'm correct then it's actually a matter of heaven and hell. I'd rather we admit that there is a conspiracy between the deceived and the deceiver. We had a hand putting ourselves in a nasty, inextricable situation by believing the left's lies and deluding ourselves with ideals inherited from the extraordinary Luciferian deception called "The Enlightenment". So through our obstinate complacency we're faced with the choice to murder our neighbors, or be murdered by our neighbors, in potentially (probably?) the worst civil war in European history

If we redefine as holy the nasty business of murder we must perpetrate to survive the consequences of many generations' worth of sins, then we're working at cross purposes to Christ and the church. We abnegate the necessity to repent of the abject stupidities that brought us to the desperation of warring with our blood kin, and then there is no point in having a church at all. In fact, I've seen not even a hint to suggest the Alt-Right feels it ought to repent anything at all, much less the sins of our fathers. If Christ is reduced to mere air superiority for our little squabbles, he might as well be one of the pagan gods and we should go have homosexual sex in the woods with Richard Spencer. Which is to say I oppose the weaponization of Christianity, even as a desperate bid for national defense, which I believe is the logical endgame of the Alt-West. I'm sure you disagree, but you can at least take my word that I believe this is how that game plays out.

The Alt-White, which I identified as retarded long before I sympathized with the retards who comprise it, was born as a weapon. They believe in enforcing a vision of reality by speaking it into existence, and make no pretense to justify their use of lies. They believe it is simply the way of the world, and they're at least half-right. The LARPers aren't smart or sophisticated, and that's the root of my sympathy for them. Well, that and I've worked alongside of a lot of lower class people who don't know what the hell is going on, but know that Holocaust jokes grant some comfort and piss off the right people. They're weak, lonely, desperate, stupid, and surrounded by New Age mystics preaching that Yahweh is a desert djinn and Christ was an Egyptian magician who invented Christianity to shackle free European pagans with slave morality, so I give them some leeway to make mistakes. If I knew nothing about Christianity except by observing the Christians I've met in churches, I'd believe that story too.

tl;dr- Yes, the Alt-White is full of deceit, being derived from liberalism, but they are at least honest about it. The Alt-West would rather cast themselves as angels while doing the devil's work, and that is unacceptable to me. If I murder my neighbor for his food then I ought to know I'm a monster and carry the weight of his soul on my conscience.

Blogger RusticFederalist April 22, 2018 4:29 PM  

Aeoli, if I may ask, what generational cohort are you? I am in Gen-Y (1981 - 1996 according to the Pew Research Center).

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 4:33 PM  

Millenial. And please stop being so polite, it puts me on edge.

Blogger Lovekraft April 22, 2018 4:35 PM  

@80 aeoli: what's going on? I'm pretty sure I've read your comment here for a few years now, so what the what? Your post sounds like someone feeling the heat and trying to make an exit based on his own justification, rather than facts.

We aren't sheep, nor are we evil. We are playing among some entrenched and powerful forces and this little community of the internet actually comes across as the most peaceful and respectful.

If it's the stormclouds gathering that disturb you, who told you this was not going to happen (don't blame the alt-right for them). But if you have little 'uns to care for, then cover your tracks. But don't point the finger of judgment at us, otherwise we'll do some digging into your motives.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 4:37 PM  

By which I mean, when people suddenly affect to be politely curious I know exactly what game they're playing and the pretense of civility chafes.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 4:39 PM  

It's not the stormclouds. It's the white tower I see us constructing in order to stand above them.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 4:58 PM  

But don't point the finger of judgment at us, otherwise we'll do some digging into your motives.

Funny, that's what the dream I mentioned was about.

OpenID markstoval April 22, 2018 5:00 PM  

"Sure, and you can go back to Sam Francis, Pat Buchanan and Rothbard if you are talking about spiritual ancestors."

You just named three of the giants of the 20th century. Three of my favorite people. No, my three favorite people of the 20th century.

They all had some position that I did not agree with, but who is perfect.

Rothbard wrote extensively about the difference between the nation-state (or The State) and the nation. The nation is the natural way men are to interact with one another. I don't think it a coincidence that God will judge the nations at the end of time.

Rothbard believed that men built civilization and the State destroyed it. Would the alt-right disagree with that? Each nation should have the group govern itself as that nation sees fit, not as some monopoly State ordains.

The right wing needs to fight hard to beat back the left-wing super-state and break it into many pieces. Then nations of men can build civilization back up.

By the way, Rothbard told us decades ago that the Libertarian Party and belt-way libertarians at certain "think tanks" were worse than useless. It reminds one of the right where "conservatives" very bad for civilization and are not alt-right.

My 2 cents for today.

Blogger Lovekraft April 22, 2018 5:02 PM  

@ aeoli:

listen to this Molyneux video put up today about convergence, political correctness and the evil forces behind it. I think we are allies, but differ in perspective.

I don't see a white tower like you do, rather i see the remaining fractured structures being actively undermined, not to mention other towers counter to my interests being constructed, with state assistance.

After we've shored up our own structures, we then go about dismantling those that cut off our supply lines, THEN we discuss methods of succession.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 22, 2018 5:13 PM  

And Aeoli goes on the list of emotion-driven commenters I skip reading.

Blogger Lovekraft April 22, 2018 5:19 PM  

Molyneux vid:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXwIl8ijF7U

Blogger Jack Amok April 22, 2018 5:39 PM  

Hey, here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA...

A bit of advice. That phrase isn't clever enough to use it in nearly every damn comment. We get it. You live in the Bay Area. It's a mess. Use a funny name once in a while, or use shorter, funnier one all the time, but give this one a bit of a rest.

Blogger Aeoli April 22, 2018 5:47 PM  

I think we are allies, but differ in perspective.

I agree. The trouble is, as you said, that the inquisitors may go looking for an ulterior motive with the conviction of finding one. So I'd better take a break.

Thanks for the vid.

Blogger Bird on a Wing April 22, 2018 6:15 PM  

Aeoli, you might consider fasting and prayer over some of the individual things you are stringing together.

Sometimes dreams during a fast can be significant.

Pray and ask for guidance on which particular thing you should fast for, how long to fast (it can absolutely be an hour, a day or longer) as well as which specific thing you should give up for the fast. Fasting doesn’t have to be food. Sometimes the thing you give up to a fast is an incipient stronghold that God wants you to give up to Him before its grip on you becomes stronger.

Before you reengage with your fasted object, make sure you reiterate before God your prayer objective so your fasting doesn’t go to waste.

May God’s blessings be on you, Aeoli!

Blogger Al Du Clur April 22, 2018 6:27 PM  

"Alt-Right remains inevitable"

Agree. But will it be in time for the US and much of Western Europe? I have my doubts. There is a race against time and a huge gap remains between where whites need to be and where they are in terms of saving their societies.

While more whites continue to get a clue, the vast majority in the West try to stay in denial about the severity of the situation and what they are doing to the future of their descendants.

Can a minority share of population that is alt right drive the needed rebellion? Minorities have done it before but the right, including the alt right, so far mainly excel at infighting and have little interest in converting the masses. As the despised boomers die off and the millennials gain power, the left will gain even more power. That may finally motivate the white masses but it could just seal the fate of whites.

Doesn't really matter if most whites in Zimbabwe are alt right. South Africa is going down that path and from what I told most whites in cities don't care about the fate of the Boers. They probably won't care until the blacks come for white gated community homes like they are now with Boer farms

Blogger Zeroh Tollrants April 22, 2018 6:46 PM  

What a weird article. Traditional Worker's Party wasn't ever "Alt Right," they were always NS, and old school WN 1.0, and no one cared (cares?) that they split up. Why would they?
Anglin has been "in hiding," for about 3-4 yrs, that's no secret, they keep writing the same boring articles anout him that say absolutely nothing, & Spencer said last month or so he wasn't going to give speeches at colleges anymore because too many people get hurt or arrested and no one gets to actually come in and listen.
Seems odd they think all of those people are "connected," just because some of the members were at Charlottesville together, at that ill-advised, one time rally.
Most of those people hate each other and don't have any of the same beliefs.
Must be a slow news week or a wish prophecy thing because they managed to have doxxed and sued so many people that others are staying hidden?
Strange, whatever it is. Not that it means anything. Who thought there'd be a huge crowds ofpeople joining the yearly 2 dozen people march of KKK/Fed brigades, anyway? 🤣
Yeah, no. There won't be any people on the streets from those factions in the near future, that was decided by all of those groups, months & months ago.

Blogger Aeoli Pera April 22, 2018 6:47 PM  

Bird on a Wing wrote:Aeoli, you might consider fasting and prayer over some of the individual things you are stringing together.

Sometimes dreams during a fast can be significant.

Pray and ask for guidance on which particular thing you should fast for, how long to fast (it can absolutely be an hour, a day or longer) as well as which specific thing you should give up for the fast. Fasting doesn’t have to be food. Sometimes the thing you give up to a fast is an incipient stronghold that God wants you to give up to Him before its grip on you becomes stronger.

Before you reengage with your fasted object, make sure you reiterate before God your prayer objective so your fasting doesn’t go to waste.

May God’s blessings be on you, Aeoli!


Thank you, that's very kind.

I should say something else before taking that break. This is a subject where it would be a great relief for me to learn that I'm wrong.

Blogger jandolin April 22, 2018 7:03 PM  

No matter how often the establishment media pronounces the death of the alt-right, as long as the issues that were identified and analyzed in Clarmenont Institute's Flight 93 election fester, the alt-right will grow by leaps and bounds.

Blogger Thucydides April 22, 2018 7:27 PM  

No, not the Whigs! /sarc

Blogger El Cid April 22, 2018 7:59 PM  

markstoval wrote:
Rothbard believed that men built civilization and the State destroyed it. Would the alt-right disagree with that?


You are mostly right. Most alt-righters would agree with (((Rothbard))) on this, but some could retort that not all men built civilizations, and the State hasn't destroyed all remnants of civilization yet. While these point are valid, they didn't need to be made explicit by (((Rothbard))), as they don't disprove his larger point.

(((Rothbard))) is also my favorite person of the 20th century, followed closely by Buchanan, with his improvements over the former on immigration and trade.

UPDATE: Yes, in the unlikely event you still take any of them seriously, reject the libertarians, the communists, and while we're at it, the Whigs.

I consider myself to be both an alt-righter and a libertarian (anarcho-capitalist, to be precise). I see nothing incompatible with libertarianism in the 16 Points except perhaps the mention in point 2 of the alt-right being an alternative to it (which i don't take as excluding or substituting it, as the ideologies of point 1, but rather as complementing it), and a possible disagreement over the meaning of "free trade" in point 13 (i believe it can only exist in an ancap society, so it's pointless to discuss it in the current situation).

I believe Stefan Molyneux, Christopher Cantwell and Tom Woods are mostly, if not completely, alt-right. I think they still consider themselves ancaps and they still support trump. There are many minarchists and ancaps in /pol/, maybe as many as 50%. Even if they're all fake libertarians, just in it for the memes, it still plays testament to the influence of libertarianism in the alt-right.

Also, I would hate to put words in your mouth, so I'll end with a question. Is my perception that you believe the alt-right to not be a political movement, but rather a philosophy, true? And if so, would you accept libertarianism might also the latter, not defined by its "followers", but by its own postulates?

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 8:00 PM  

> Hey, here in the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA, without me, there ain't no movement worth mentioning. Après moi, le deluge.

You know, there's egotistical and then there's delusional.

> I did not realize that point twelve meant we don't care what anybody thinks about anything.

The twelfth point more fundamental than that. This is a historical turning point. The forces at play are larger than any individual. An individual may take charge due to fitting the circumstances and guide events somewhat, but they are largely outside of anyone's control. It doesn't matter what any of us think, events are going to proceed acourse. The alt-right is merely the political aspect of this change.

So no, the alt-right doesn't care what any individual thinks about it.

> If you count me as an enemy because I don't just spout the party line...

I don't count you an enemy. I do consider you either misinformed or misguided.

> In the end, my position is that it's infinitely preferable NOT to claim that we're fighting a holy war with God and an army of angels at our backs.

You choose being on the side of God. God does not choose to be on your side.

> If we redefine as holy the nasty business of murder we must perpetrate to survive the consequences of many generations' worth of sins, then we're working at cross purposes to Christ and the church.

Whether Holy or not, it will almost certainly be necessary for our survival, and self defense is an absolute right. Again, God will determine whether it suits his ends, not us.

> In fact, I've seen not even a hint to suggest the Alt-Right feels it ought to repent anything at all, much less the sins of our fathers.

What has the alt-right done for which it should repent?

Now, when war comes, there will be plenty for which to offer repentance. But that time has not yet come.

> If I murder my neighbor for his food then I ought to know I'm a monster and carry the weight of his soul on my conscience.

If. We're still a fair ways from that.

> It's the white tower I see us constructing in order to stand above them.

We're not the ones building a tower, Aeoli. The ones we're fighting are.

> Agree. But will it be in time for the US and much of Western Europe?

We don't know. The future is not ours to see. All we can do is try. To misquote Yoda, there is no do or do not, there is only try.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 8:04 PM  

"the San Fran Psycho Bayarrhea Gruberfornia USA"

Obviously I'm playing for sympathy. No, make that pity.

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 8:12 PM  

> No, make that pity.

Have you read The Fountainhead? If so, do you remember Roark's line about pity?

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 8:13 PM  

"You know, there's egotistical and then there's delusional"

Is this where I get to say I don't care what you think? I love the smell of hyperbole in the morning.

Blogger Alphaeus April 22, 2018 8:16 PM  

"In Rand's and Roark's worldview, pity undermines people by telling them they need to be helped, rather than help themselves."

I agree with Ayn Rand, and I'm wondering if my sarcasm is not sarcastic enough.

Blogger Sterling Pilgrim April 22, 2018 8:28 PM  

Oh wow, the SPLC said the "Alt-Right" is having issues? Must be gospel!
It's hilarious how furiously they will punch at shadows, never realizing they are the one's blocking the light.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 22, 2018 8:32 PM  

i believe it can only exist in an ancap society, so it's pointless to discuss it in the current situation
There clearly and literally can nevér be an ancap society, so why indulge the fantasy?

Blogger James Dixon April 22, 2018 8:54 PM  

> Is this where I get to say I don't care what you think?

Yes.

> "In Rand's and Roark's worldview, pity undermines people by telling them they need to be helped, rather than help themselves."

No, the specific quote. Here: https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/254000-this-is-pity-he-thought-and-then-he-lifted-his

I kind of figured you might agree with it, which is why I asked.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd April 22, 2018 9:07 PM  

tublecane wrote:@11- By "conservatives" Vox likely doesn't mean you or anyone you know. Who's In or Out of fashion for Conservatism Inc. is way out of the realm of ordinary people on the right.

I think Vox's answer in @9 was about how to read Conservative Inc. pundits. My answer in @10 was about how to approach Normie acquaintances.

Blogger El Cid April 22, 2018 9:13 PM  

Snidely Whiplash wrote:
There clearly and literally can nevér be an ancap society, so why indulge the fantasy?


Not an argument.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine April 22, 2018 9:17 PM  

"If we redefine as holy the nasty business of murder we must perpetrate to survive the consequences of many generations' worth of sins, then we're working at cross purposes to Christ and the church. We abnegate the necessity to repent of the abject stupidities that brought us to the desperation of warring with our blood kin, and then there is no point in having a church at all. In fact, I've seen not even a hint to suggest the Alt-Right feels it ought to repent anything at all, much less the sins of our fathers."

Huh? First of all, we need to define murder. I suspect you may be using an overly broad definition more akin to "killing people".

No one needs to define killing as holy in order to do it.

Some killing is certainly righteous.

Killing someone doesn't necessitate denial of some responsibility for the conflict.

There being a conflict caused in part by our forefathers does not mean that we bear the weight of those sins. We have to deal with them in some ways, but we didn't necessarily commit them.

If being aligned with The Truth and The Life necessitates that we war against our blood kin, then so be it, and it will be righteous which is in accord with that circumstance.

One cannot repent for a sin one has not committed, though certainly one ought to recognize sins committed by one's ancestors in order to avoid the same in themselves.

You seem to be going black-pill, Aeoli. Take a nap.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 22, 2018 9:49 PM  

"Not an argument" is also not an argument.
I know you think it's clever and all that, but it's moronic.
Libertarians want an an-cap society the same way the Soviets wanted True Communism, and the Oneida Colony wanted shame-free sex.
The fact that you want it doesn't make it real.

Blogger Samuel Nock April 22, 2018 9:59 PM  

We can also add the resignation of Evan McLaren from his position as Executive Director of Richard Spencer's National Policy Institute. His statement is opaque but basically says he was not the right man for the job.

https://twitter.com/evanmclaren/status/987890153682362368?s=21

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 22, 2018 10:15 PM  

Libertarians want an an-cap society the same way the Soviets wanted True Communism, and the Oneida Colony wanted shame-free sex.

Something Snidely and I agree on. Time to buy a lotto ticket.

Blogger El Cid April 22, 2018 10:48 PM  

@111 Muh why won't you cuck and refuse to play by your rival's own rules like a good cuckservative, and use the tools he hands to you instead.

Muh mind reading.

Muh libertarians=ancaps (ancaps are actually a subset).
Muh horseshoe theory.
Muh let me prove how knowledgeable I am about communism and religious communes that have nothing to do with the discussion.

Muh Trump will never win the republican primary, the fact that you want it doesn't make it real.

Arthur Isaac wrote:
Something Snidely and I agree on. Time to buy a lotto ticket.


Glad to be of help. Apparently I've done more to "Unite the Right" in a three-word-comment that Richard Spencer in his whole life. And Snidely saying it wasn't clever.

Please, illuminate me with your wisdom. As both of you have yet to address my main point, which was the supposed incompatibility between libertarianism and the alt-right. But I'm guessing, if you can predict the future of society, you can also predict the much simpler winning lotto ticket and you'll be too occupied cashing it and enjoying the good life, to engage in fruitful discussion.

Come on guys. I was expecting more from fellow VD readers. Don't disappoint me.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 22, 2018 11:24 PM  

@El Cid, libertarians are globalists. They've grown in the hothouse of civic nationalism, cheap energy, cheap shipping and cheap crap made in the third world in the small window of time when the dollar hasn't lost all of it's purchasing power when folks haven't yet realized TANSTAFL. Like Communism it's an ideology not extant in nature. The lack of factoring in human nature is the prime failing of libertarians (what Snidely said).

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 22, 2018 11:33 PM  

@El Cod, and knowing WHAT is going to happen on a given trendline is far different than knowing when that thing will happen.

If you're so smart go make your ideology work in Somalia. It's already got a lack of cohesive government "working" for it. The only thing that is lacking is the corpse of Western Civilization that libertarians are scavenging.

Blogger Jack Amok April 23, 2018 12:12 AM  

libertarians are globalists.

Q: What do you call a libertarian who doesn't believe in unrestrained free trade and open borders?

A: An Alt-Right Nationalist

Blogger El Cid April 23, 2018 12:12 AM  

@115 libertarians are globalists.

Plebbit tier. I'm a libertarian and not a globalist, Molyneux is a libertarian and not a globalist. You could even argue that Calvin Coolidge was a libertarian, and he was definitely not a globalist.

They've grown in the hothouse of civic nationalism, cheap energy, cheap shipping and cheap crap made in the third world in the small window of time when the dollar hasn't lost all of it's purchasing power when folks haven't yet realized TANSTAFL.

Everyone in the same age ranges and countries has been born in the same situation. Besides, the civnat generation (boomers) almost doesn't overlap with the Ron Paul generation (younger millenials). Also, not all libertarians come from countries that use the dollar, and people are starting to realize TISTAAFHR (There Is Such Thing As A Free Helicopter Ride). By the way, the current US Secretary of Education mentioned the No Free Lunch concept in a public speech, so I think we're seeing a lot of progress there.

Like Communism it's an ideology not extant in nature.

Again, muh horseshoe theory. Ancapism not only exists in nature, it was the starting point in nature. First came human beings, and then the State, not backwards. And it not only doesn't have anything to do with Marxism other than being political philosophies, it's actually the opposite in almost every regard. Yes, their end goals seem similar, but when has a marxist not lied about their end goals?

The lack of factoring in human nature is the prime failing of libertarians (what Snidely said).

Snidely hasn't said that in this thread. Also, you keep criticizing libertarians instead of libertarianism. I'm sure some libertarian has failed to factor in human nature at some time, but I'm unable to see how that has anything to do with the main point.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 23, 2018 12:19 AM  

@El Cuck,
Its not a matter of predicting the futue. It's a matter of understanding the proposal. Libertarians, and especially An-Caps believe everybody in the world is a middle-class White gut somewhere on the spectrum. As such the philosophy has no natural defense against Jews, Hindoos, Moslems, the Irish, the Chinese, low-IQ barbarians, any tribalist society, or even the Rotary Club. People operate in groups, and much more effectively in groups. The moment you really understand that, yoy will see that, were one to actually try to create a society run according to An-Cap rules, you'd have to kill an enormous number of people. Just like the Commies did, EXACTLY LIKE THE COMMIES DID.

To kill those people, you'd have to form a government. And that government would, of neccesity, be totalit@rian. Once you had your An-Cap government, you would never ever be rid of it, until the mass of people got tired of your hypocritical An-Cap bullshit and killed you all.

It's clear to anyone of above average intelligence who's considered the possibility for 5 minutes.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 23, 2018 12:35 AM  

It's clear to anyone of above average intelligence who's considered the possibility for 5 minutes.

Yeah, I even agree.

Ancapis not only exists in nature, it was the starting point in nature.

For the thirty seconds it takes for someone with a weapon decides to introduce a new socio/political/economic model revolving around rape, pillage and murder.


Blogger El Cid April 23, 2018 1:21 AM  

@116 knowing WHAT is going to happen on a given trendline is far different than knowing when that thing will happen.

Then you surely will keep buying the same lotto number every time. At the time you win, then libertarianism might have made one country worse off, somewhere.

If you're so smart go make your ideology work in Somalia. It's already got a lack of cohesive government "working" for it. The only thing that is lacking is the corpse of Western Civilization that libertarians are scavenging.

Regardless of how smart I was (which I never mentioned), I could never make any ideology "work" in Somalia in the sense I think you mean other countries have always "worked", Greece for example, and I'm certainly not an ideological cousin of the greek government. In fact, Somalia has never "worked" in this sense, doesn't now, and probably never will. Why don't YOU go make your ideology work in Somalia? Also, I don't think I'm "scavenging" anything, I'm as interested in defending Western Civilization as any of you.

As @110 said about someone else, you seem to be going black-pill, @Arthur Isaac. Don't get blackpilled.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 23, 2018 1:23 AM  

Oh, dear God, somebody who actually belueves in the Rousseauan "natural state". Its been a long time since 've seen this syndrome.

No, no human exists as an unconnected individual. Ever. Go out along the family tree, there is no primate that lives as an isolated individual.
Humans are born into families. Those families are members of tribes those tribes exist within the context of a nation.
The few cases we have of individuals who grew outside of human society, so-called feral children, result in people fit for little more than zoo exhibits.

Blogger Noah B The Savage Gardener April 23, 2018 2:21 AM  

Ancap is every bit as much horseshit as communism.

Blogger wreckage April 23, 2018 2:34 AM  

@123, no, while it might be as much of a philosophical anal ouroboros, it is markedly and observably less destructive than Communism. Ancap ignores important aspects of human nature; Communism attempts to smash them out of humanity as a whole.

In any case, Libertarianism or anarcho-capitalism can only exist as a limited subsystem within a strongly defined and defended nation. Any rational Libertarian MUST, therefore, be wholly and enthusiastically on-board with Nationalism as the only known structure in which their ideal has ever been able to exist in any sustained degree.

If they're willing to defend the Nation and its integrity, shut up and shoot left.

Blogger Noah B The Savage Gardener April 23, 2018 2:58 AM  

You have that backwards, wreckage. Communist countries at least defended their borders while the ancaps don't believe borders should even exist.

Ancaps might be allies on a few particular issues but they are not reliable allies for nationalists.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 23, 2018 3:03 AM  

Why don't YOU go make your ideology work in Somalia? Also, I don't think I'm "scavenging" anything, I'm as interested in defending Western Civilization as any of you.

Because I already have a country with roads, bridges, sanitation and electricity that were built in a Republic that paid for them with taxes and allowed for by the security of intellectual property with worker and environmental protections. I don't have to worry about pirates or bandits because we have a border and a military to protect it (paid for with taxes).

What precisely are you trying to defend? Your right to buy cheap shit imported from a third world sweatshop, delivered to you by an H1B visa truck driver while eating food harvested by an illegal immigrant, paying for it with a job currently being offshored to Bangladesh? Wake up.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 23, 2018 3:08 AM  

@wreckage, yeah I'm a libertarian. When I'm surrounded by a well armed populace of responsible adults who happen to have the same values and ethics as I do. Otherwise known as a nation.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 23, 2018 3:22 AM  

Damn, man, I'm cheering on Arthur Isaac. Weird.

Blogger El Cid April 23, 2018 4:41 AM  

@117 Q: What do you call a libertarian who doesn't believe in unrestrained free trade and open borders?

A: An Alt-Right Nationalist


This. Thank you. That's exactly what i was trying to say.

Blogger El Cid April 23, 2018 5:40 AM  

@119 @D&C Blackpiller
Its not a matter of predicting the futue. It's a matter of understanding the proposal. Libertarians, and especially An-Caps believe everybody in the world is a middle-class White gut somewhere on the spectrum.

I'm an ancap, and I don't believe that at all. I agree with point 7 of the alt-right, and I think most ancaps do, but I think you've met 1 or 2 people calling themselves ancaps at most, and believe we are all like them.

As such the philosophy has no natural defense against Jews, Hindoos, Moslems, the Irish, the Chinese, low-IQ barbarians, any tribalist society, or even the Rotary Club. People operate in groups, and much more effectively in groups.

Human beings, even whites, naturally defend their groups against outsiders. Ancapism doesn't stop them from operating in groups, which would be impossible and contrary to human nature anyway.

The moment you really understand that, yoy will see that, were one to actually try to create a society run according to An-Cap rules, you'd have to kill an enormous number of people. Just like the Commies did, EXACTLY LIKE THE COMMIES DID.

Muh Horseshoe 2: Electric Bogaloo. In ancapistan, commies can form their own communes and put in practice their own ideologies, but not in reverse. But yeah, I'm sure the american revolutionaries, Pinochet, killed just as many people as the commies, for no reason at all. And ancaps will too.

To kill those people, you'd have to form a government. And that government would, of neccesity, be totalit@rian. Once you had your An-Cap government, you would never ever be rid of it, until the mass of people got tired of your hypocritical An-Cap bullshit and killed you all.

You don't need a government in order to kill people. And again, was Pinochet totalitarian? Not even Hitler was totalitarian, at least until World War II. Totalitarianism means something closer to Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot. If we didn't get rid of government, we'd be in the same situation as now, so again, not an argument. And the hypothetical mass of people killing us all? They can try.

It's clear to anyone of above average intelligence who's considered the possibility for 5 minutes.

Thank God that someone took the time to take me out of my error, never thought there was anyone of above average intelligence among VD readers. /s

Blogger James Dixon April 23, 2018 5:57 AM  

> there is no primate that lives as an isolated individual.

There have been. There's a reason they're largely considered crackpots. It's called the exception that proves the rule.

Blogger wreckage April 23, 2018 5:58 AM  

127, 128, my point exactly!

@129, that's how I got here.

Blogger Dire Badger April 23, 2018 6:50 AM  

Arthur Isaac wrote:@wreckage, yeah I'm a libertarian. When I'm surrounded by a well armed populace of responsible adults who happen to have the same values and ethics as I do. Otherwise known as a nation.

I guess you 'identify' as a Libertarian while ignoring the basic libertarian ideology.
Kind of like someone who 'identifies' as female, even though she doesn't have a pussy or tits.

Blogger Dire Badger April 23, 2018 6:57 AM  

Arthur Isaac wrote:@wreckage, yeah I'm a libertarian. When I'm surrounded by a well armed populace of responsible adults who happen to have the same values and ethics as I do. Otherwise known as a nation.

When you show me a nation with a well armed populace of responsible adults who generally have the same values and ethics, that do NOT rely on a massive population of irresponsible, unarmed slaves with entirely different values and ethics, I will show you a real live Magical Unicorn.

Libertarianism depends upon the same lie that Communism depends upon- a perfectible populace. Only, unlike communism which contents itself with the population it controls as being perfectible, Libertarianism demands that those outside of it's control be perfect as well in order to function.

Blogger Wynn Lloyd April 23, 2018 7:27 AM  

"Kind of like someone who 'identifies' as female, even though she doesn't have a pussy or tits."
Flawless Victory.

Fatality.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 23, 2018 8:04 AM  

I guess you 'identify' as a Libertarian while ignoring the basic libertarian ideology.

And you identify as alt-right even though you still have your head packed up your neo-con ass.

Yes, I admire personal responsibility, high trust societies and filial respect. Aspects of libertarianism that need to be protected from open borders and unrestrained free trade. Traits that also need to be protected from the adventurism and a empire building of the jingo shithead that moves his lips about protecting the homeland while being suckered into destroying it for "honor".

Dire Badger is a cuck of a different stripe.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd April 23, 2018 8:11 AM  

Dire Badger wrote:I guess you 'identify' as a Libertarian while ignoring the basic libertarian ideology.

Kind of like someone who 'identifies' as female, even though she doesn't have a pussy or tits.


Identifying as female while lavking the essential bits makes you worth less.

Identifying as libertarded while lacking their philosophical underpinnings makes you worth more.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 23, 2018 8:21 AM  

When you show me a nation with a well armed populace of responsible adults who generally have the same values and ethics, that do NOT rely on a massive population of irresponsible, unarmed slaves with entirely different values and ethics, I will show you a real live Magical Unicorn.

Yes, strong nations consistently turn down the path towards empire. So? Are nations magic unicorns doomed to conquer or be conquered without a day in the sun?

In our instance the thing that is conquering us is an open border, not the lack of a navy. (That's actually putting foreign nationals at the helm of the Navy we have).

Maybe we can get another peak at DBs neocon civix nationalism here.

Blogger James Dixon April 23, 2018 9:07 AM  

> When you show me a nation with a well armed populace of responsible adults who generally have the same values and ethics, that do NOT rely on a massive population of irresponsible, unarmed slaves with entirely different values and ethics.

It's called West Virginia. A number of other states might also qualify, but I'll leave it to the natives of those to speak up.

Blogger wreckage April 23, 2018 9:12 AM  

The Rights of Englishmen are currently considered wildly Libertarian, so for as long as that holds, I identify as Libertarian. The USA and my own nation were, until the 20th century, what most moderns would consider definitively Libertarian.

The idea breaks down badly when low-IQ autists attempt to turn it into a complete system of philosophy instead of a culturally preferred ideal for governance within the Nation; as a high IQ autist I cannot be held responsible for their shortcomings - you'll have to talk to their parents, I suppose.

Blogger Alphaeus April 23, 2018 9:53 AM  

"Libertarianism depends upon the same lie that Communism depends upon- a perfectible populace. Only, unlike communism which contents itself with the population it controls as being perfectible, Libertarianism demands that those outside of it's control be perfect as well in order to function. "

I realize that official policy is that nobody cares what I think, but since I don't care what official policy is, I will tell my opinion anyway.

I think that Libertarianism requires Christianity.

And I also think that Jesus was a true Libertarian because His purpose was to set the captives free.

Matthew 20:
25 But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.
26 But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;
27 And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant:
28 Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

And I, Alphaeus, Father of James the Lesser, saith unto you, that servant government is even more radical and crazy than no government at all.

Blogger James Dixon April 23, 2018 10:16 AM  

> I think that Libertarianism requires Christianity.

All high trust functional societies seem to require Christianity or some equivalent religion. The reasons for same are left as an exercise for the reader.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 10:32 AM  

@13

"Sometimes I think I'm more of an Anti-Federalist, but it's 200 or so years to late for that one."

I believe that question is going to be revisited, considering how ALL of the Anti-Federalists' warnings have come true.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 23, 2018 10:33 AM  

@Alphaeus
It's not that no one cares what you think about anything. I've seen you make intelligent and pertinent comments many times, like just now. It's that no-one cares about your fixation on the word Conservative and your weird idea that Conservatives are eagerly waiting to go alt-right, if only we'll be nice to them.

And yes, Libertarianism would only be possible in a Christian context, were it possible at all.
But it's not possible, and the sooner Libertarians abandon their quest for a New Libertarian Man, the better.

Blogger Vlad Z. April 23, 2018 10:40 AM  

A few thoughts:

1. The Alt-Right label probably isn't salvageable.

2. The simple "Nationalist" label is a problem in the USA, the nation is already too deconstructed. Which is why you see "Southern Nationalists" "White Nationalists" "Black Nationalists", etc.

3. It's wrong and silly to say someone who has screwed up their "15 minutes of fame" is a plant or CIA agent. Spencer lost his way, and wasn't up to the task fate handed him.

4. Denigrating Spencer as a Leftist for his statement that he voted for Kerry in 2004 to express his opposition to the War in Iraq seems ahistorical. Many on the right, particularly the circles he was traveling in (the Buchanan /Taki paleo-conservatives) hated Bush with a passion perhaps hard to understand from the distance in time we now enjoy.

5. Spencer has never quite been able to articulate his views as clearly as you have, Vox. The "16 points of the Alt-Right" is not something he ever managed to write.

His "race matters, race is real, race is the foundation of identity" formulation is the closest he has come to stating his credo. That doesn't sound very leftist to me.

6. Spencer is a failed intellectual who dropped out of his Ph.D. program, and it shows. His webcasts become tedious when they three of them start veering off into esoteric history of the Austro-Hungarians and such. As a political strategist he was no good, in part because he has no background in it.

He was doing good work with Arktos and the old NPI, the exposure and fame was too much for him.

The shift from culture warrior to political leader is a hard one, the field is covered with the bones of those who tried and failed.

7. It's mis-characterizing his views to say that he's "pro-Globalist because he supports the EU". His point is that European Man is at his best when united, and his frame of reference for thinking that is Yokley's "Imperium" -- regaining the lost glory of Rome, going to Mars and the Stars, etc.

These might still be bad ideas, but they are not of a piece with Merkelism.

8. One of his biggest mistakes, in my opinion, was making common cause with Andrew Anglin, who is a complete liability and an idiot, and maybe the TRS crew as well. Oven jokes and Swastikas are never a good look.

9. He's 40 now, a decade older than the center of the Alt-Right movement, I think he's properly seen as a bridge between the Paleo-Conservatives (who are 60+ now) and the new generation of rightists. He was at his most effective bringing Peter Brimlow and Jared Taylor level people to a new audience.

10. Is life is an open book. He's spent his whole life publicly advancing the cause of the far-right, as it existed at that moment. As mentioned: he worked for The American Conservative (the mag. Buchanen founded in opposition to the War in Iraq), then Taki Mag, then started Alt-Right.com (version 1.0) and then Radix.

If he's an undercover stooge he sure is deeeply undercover. But I don't see it. Can anyone imagine him taking the Jennifer Rubin option and renouncing White Nationalism? I can not.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 10:44 AM  

@23

"I've wondered about the fallout from Spencer's first Charlottesville march, had VSP opened fire on the demonstrators. Martyrdom wasn't a game changer at Waco, but things are different now."

Timothy McVeigh blew up the Murrah Building on the anniversary of the Waco Massacre.

I specifically remember that morning, the news people commenting that it was the 2nd anniversary (Waco Massacre was April 19, 1993; Murrah Building, Oklahoma City, was April 19, 1995). I suspected something would happen, because the disgust over Waco was still so thick, you could cut it with a knife.

By the way... the Michigan Militia... which was presented as a bunch of crazies... is actually under the jurisdiction and control of the Adjutant General of Michigan.

Membership is open to anyone between the ages of 18 and 60, with no felonies, who is not CURRENTLY a member of the U.S. military (regular service, federal reserve, or national guard -- which is just another federal reserve). Training is unpaid; service is paid ONLY when called up by the state on Title 32 (state military service) orders [Title 32 is the same as when NG are called up for state duty, as opposed to federalization which is Title 10].

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 10:55 AM  

@25


Dude, You're NOT storming the Beach on D-Day. You're reporting from deep inside Occupied France after the surrender.

While Partisan forces are useful (taking out critical infrastructure at the critical moment), most of their intel reports, even when true, are completely useless.

On that note, Your report, while probably true ("Jacques calling London! Jacques calling London! Wherever I go, there's Germans EVERYWHERE!!!"), is barely interesting, and entirely not useful for the task at hand (Planning D-Day).


Read some history. Train. Learn how to operate as part of a fire team. Learn how to operate as one fire team in a squad, which is part of a platoon. Learn how to take out important things (like the base supports of 250kV transmission line towers, water department resources, etc) by as an efficient use of explosives as possible, OR BY OTHER MEANS OF SABOTAGE.

Stop whining, and make yourself useful, in the future, if not now.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 10:57 AM  

@26

"
Nationalism is not the 'real right' either. Nationalism is a leftist movement no more than 250 years old that proposed the fundamental equality of human beings in opposition to social class and class privileges. Abolish the nobility and all Frenchmen participate in French culture equally. Like Manchester Economics, the Overton Window has shifted and left it on the right of acceptable discourse. But in 1792 it was sitting on the Left and howling for the blood of the clergy and the head of the King."

Nationalism came late to France.

Learn some English/Welsh/Cornish/Scottish/Erish history.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:04 AM  

@39

"Yes! The Whigs! Thank goodness you mentioned the Whigs."

Nixon, Bush family, The lousy excuses for House and Senate leaders for the last couple of decades...ALL are best described as Whigs. Gingrich *MIGHT* be an exception...but I don't think so.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:08 AM  

@42

"
Is it not advantageous to have moles embedded in enemy territory? Is there not value in having allies behind the lines who enjoy making the heads of the enemy explode by telling them there are boys and there are girls as a matter of biological science? "

See... that right there is an admission that you're NOT on Omaha Beach on D-Day, nor a member of the Pennsylvania National Guard getting pounded by panzers in the opening hours of operation Wacht Am Rhein.

You're a Frenchman living in 1942 Paris.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:17 AM  

@59

"Libertarians used to be basically two groups - people who were Libertarians because they wanted to legalize dope, and people who wanted to legalize dope because they were libertarians and didn't think a free people should have a government intruding in their lives like that."

I was in the 2nd group. Still am, in fact, because the Drug War and drug gants are even worse than 18th Amendment prohibition. Having said that....

"The second group didn't - back then - realize that while a limited government is a fine and preferable system for a high-trust, high-IQ, homogeneous people, it completely fails a multicultural society, especially one that has imported large numbers of low-trust, low-time-preference foreigners."


Which is why I changed from Libertarian to Independent.
I might even accept open borders, but you CANNOT have open borders without first shutting down ALL tax-funded welfare.

Blogger Alphaeus April 23, 2018 11:23 AM  

"your weird idea that Conservatives are eagerly waiting to go alt-right, if only we'll be nice to them"

Not nice, just coherent about what it is we believe and want to say. The problem is if we run around saying that conservatives suck, period, most will assume we're communists. It really helps if we get specific; instead we should say, Paul Ryan sucks, John McLame sucks, the Bush's suck, George Will sucks, David Brooks sucks, and the reason they suck is because they are tools of the Globalist NWO and they love open borders and they hate America and it's absurd to say one is an American Conservative if one hates America. That approach I believe would be impossible to argue with if the conservative in question is not one of the Globalist tools.
I got the same problem dealing with "Libertarians." I love Murray Rothbard, but I hate Jeffrey Tucker and the ironically titled Reason Magazine.

Blogger Alphaeus April 23, 2018 11:31 AM  

"On that note, Your report, while probably true ("Jacques calling London! Jacques calling London! Wherever I go, there's Germans EVERYWHERE!!!"), is barely interesting, and entirely not useful for the task at hand (Planning D-Day)"

I also have a long mustache, don't forget that.

Blogger Jack Amok April 23, 2018 11:42 AM  

This. Thank you. That's exactly what i was trying to say.

Well then quit saying you're a libertarian. Say you used to be a libertarian and now that you - like a bunch of us already here - realized your mistake, you gave up bad ideas and are not Alt-Right.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:44 AM  

@111


""Not an argument" is also not an argument."

Actually it is:


A: Disconnected mumble jumble intermixed with cliches

B: That's not an argument

B's statement IS an argument. B's argument is that what A presented is not an argument, and therefore, worthy of no more consideration other than to point out that it's an incoherent mess (e.g. "not an argument").

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:52 AM  

@115

"@El Cid, libertarians are globalists. They've grown in the hothouse of civic nationalism, cheap energy, cheap shipping and cheap crap made in the third world in the small window of time when the dollar hasn't lost all of it's purchasing power when folks haven't yet realized TANSTAFL. Like Communism it's an ideology not extant in nature. The lack of factoring in human nature is the prime failing of libertarians (what Snidely said)."

A couple years ago, I came to this realization:

1: (((Communism))) is no-borders, Globalist Socialism
2: (((Libertarianism))) is no-borders Globalist Anti-Socialism.

Conclusion: the ((( )))'s primary goal is no-borders Globalism, and they're willing to go either the Socialist route or the anti-Socialist route to get it.

Now, in light of
1: the Tower or Babel was the original attempt at Globalism
2: the rampant child-trafficking
3: the indications of Satanism in it
4: and Jesus referring to (((Judaism))) as the Synagogue of Satan

Conclusion:

It must be destroyed, because Globalism IS Satanism, and anything done which hinders it will be rewarded by God.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:54 AM  

@118

"Plebbit tier. I'm a libertarian and not a globalist, Molyneux is a libertarian and not a globalist. You could even argue that Calvin Coolidge was a libertarian, and he was definitely not a globalist."

Then ALL of you are confused, or just being used.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 23, 2018 11:56 AM  

Dirk Manly wrote:""Not an argument" is also not an argument."

Actually it is:


Actually, it's not.
Go read up on logic and what an argument formally entails. "Not an argument" is simply a (usually dishonest) assertion used as an excuse to not address the opponent's argument.
As I said before, it's not clever. It's deeply moronic. Yes, that includes when Stephan uses it too.

Blogger Jack Amok April 23, 2018 12:03 PM  

I might even accept open borders, but ...

That's a problem. There's no "but." Open borders don't work at all, welfare or no welfare. The fault in liberarianism that can't be fixed is the inability to deal with the "tragedy of the commons." As a philosophy, it recognizes this problem, ironically, better than most other philosophies, but erroneously believes it solves it with private property.

Private property can't solve the immigration problem, because importation of a foreigner into the community comes at the expense of everyone else already in it, and the community is an irreconcilable commons. Unless of course you've got a feudal system where the community - and every one in it - belongs to the local lord of the manor, but that's hardly a libertarian system now, is it?

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:14 PM  

@118

"Ancapis not only exists in nature, it was the starting point in nature."

B.S.

Take a family (Adam, Eve, and their offspring; Noah and his family, post-fllod), and thrown them into nature, with no contact with anyone else. At that level, the economy is Communist Dictatorship (the Patriarch decides who does what, and who gets what, for the good of the family as a whole, and overall survival).

Communist Dictatorship only works with extremely small groups of people who will, for whatever reason, put up with each other's more egregious faults (families up to the size of small clan, infantry companies DURING WARTIME, SPECOPS teams during an op, ships' crews) to make "the system" work.

Anything larger than that, and Communist Dictatorship requires a lot of in-group violence to perpetuate it.

This will perpetuate itself...as a clan becomes "too large" (i.e. the surrounding fields for growing crops and raising livestock within reasonable walking distance can only support a population so large), the clan splits off one or more families: the men take their wives and kids and go off to some new location...at least a couple day's walk away...and the cycle repeats... UNTIL population density gets to be too high for the (inter-related) clans to remain isolated.

What comes next is Anarchic Barter. Because there is no money yet.

---

The Pilgrims, and the First colonists at the Jamestown colony THOUGHT they could get non-Totalitarian Communism to work -- but they weren't closely related enough, and outside threats weren't scary enough to make it work like in my prior examples (enemy soldiers / just plain being discovered / the sea itself). In both cases, non-Totalitarian Communism almost killed them. And in both cases, they went to Free-Market Barter.

An Cap still isn't in the picture.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:26 PM  

@125

"You have that backwards, wreckage. Communist countries at least defended their borders while the ancaps don't believe borders should even exist."

Commies don't believe in borders, either.

They USE the concept of borders against Anti-Commies, to secure their base(s) of operation while fervently working to dissolve everyone else's borders, with the end goal that they will be running the Global Government.

Of course, none of them ever thinks it through all the way... Will the Chinese Communists actually go along with a Global Government which is not all Chinese at the top?

How about the Indians?

None of those 3 societies, no matter how much they believe in one-world government Communism, would ever willingly abide under a government not controlled exclusively by their tribe (yes, any of them might allow TOKEN personnel from the other 2 nations, only so long as power remains with THEIR nation).

This is why global government will never work. EVER. I think the Globalists see this, and this is why they are pushing the "nation of immigrants" narrative, even on Sweden!

Because until Recently, it would have been FIVE factions, each of which would refuse to live under a global government which allowed real power in the hands of any personnel from the other four (the U.S. and Europe are currently cucked.... hopefully not for long).

(((They))) think they can bamboozle everyone into living under Central Asian Steppe Turk rule.... The Chinese consider their sorry excuse for a civilization which abandoned their home territory with NO colony already set up to be a bunch of impetuous idiots who fail at long-term planning.

Blogger peppermint88 April 23, 2018 12:29 PM  

Alphaesus, if you wanted to be a spie, you would emit the proper virtue signals and get into the enemy's confidance. It's a dangerous and difficult job. I live in a city and I'm not a spie, just an idiot.

Aeoli, "pretence of civility chafes", perfect. Thats why the chans are so aggressively hoss style up front.

The chans turned Boomer politics into chan memes so that when Boomers ponitifcate GenZ only sees our memes. VD is right that philosophically there has been an alternative right ever since Buckley.

Cville was the third chantard protest, after Chanology and Occupy.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:30 PM  

@130

"I'm an ancap, and I don't believe that at all. I agree with point 7 of the alt-right, and I think most ancaps do, but I think you've met 1 or 2 people calling themselves ancaps at most, and believe we are all like them."

How can you believe that we are all like them, when you obviously don't know those two well enough to even know FOR SURE if both of them consider themselves AnCaps, let alone to have had deep enough discussions to know what the hell they actually believe.

Good grief, talk about solipsism.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:37 PM  

@130

>> The moment you really understand that, yoy will see that, were one to actually try to create a society run according to An-Cap rules, you'd have to kill an enormous number of people. Just like the Commies did, EXACTLY LIKE THE COMMIES DID.

> Muh Horseshoe 2: Electric Bogaloo. In ancapistan, commies can form their own communes and put in practice their own ideologies, but not in reverse. But yeah, I'm sure the american revolutionaries, Pinochet, killed just as many people as the commies, for no reason at all. And ancaps will too

---

Wrong, idiot.

In your AnCap fantasy land, if you want to take your property from point A to point B, on the road going through MY property, than I can demand that you pay a toll. And so will my neighbor whose property contains the next bit of road.
And so on and so on and so on, until you get to point B.

Do you SERIOUSLY believe that you can have an effective economy when you have to negotiate dozens, hundreds, thousands, or even millions of tolls before letting a vehicle leave point A to make a delivery at point B?

See, that's where you need a GOVERNMENT to enforce freedom to use the roads. (Government is ALSO necessary to chase down highway men, aka landlubber pirates who prey on wheeled transport instead of ships).

AnCap is a pipedream, even more moronic than Communism, because Communism at least works at the family level. AnCap never exists at ANY scale.... it's POINTLESS at the family and clan scale, and it's already unworkable by the time you get to the scale of a single tribe.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:42 PM  

@140

"The Rights of Englishmen are currently considered wildly Libertarian, so for as long as that holds, I identify as Libertarian. "

"Considered to be" and "is" are not the same thing.

Frank is 112 years old, and is considered to be the oldest human alive.

But Pajeet the Urine Drinker is 115... so whatever Frank is considered to be...he is NOT the oldest man in the world.

Do you understand now?

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:43 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:44 PM  

""I realize that official policy is that nobody cares what I think, but since I don't care what official policy is, I will tell my opinion anyway.

I think that Libertarianism requires Christianity.

And I also think that Jesus was a true Libertarian because His purpose was to set the captives free."


---
You believe that Libertarianism requires Christianity, despite the fact that Libertarian philosophy is fundamentally atheist.....

Have you even READ Libertarian philosophy?

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 12:50 PM  

@158

"Dirk Manly wrote:
""Not an argument" is also not an argument."

Actually it is:


Actually, it's not.
Go read up on logic and what an argument formally entails. "Not an argument" is simply a (usually dishonest) assertion used as an excuse to not address the opponent's argument.
As I said before, it's not clever. It's deeply moronic. Yes, that includes when Stephan uses it too."


I got an 397 out of 400 points in my Formal Logic class.

When you can beat that, then you can come back and explain to us why you argument that '"not an argument" is not an argument' is wrong.... considering that I already beat you over the head once with the most simple explanation possible.

Blogger Alexandros April 23, 2018 1:11 PM  

I would say they're growing instead of collapsing. The major difference is that, richard spencer not withstanding, the guys like Enoch and Striker have fibally realized what VD has known for a long time: don't talk to the media.

They've also realized that the police and other state organs are actively out to imprison them for so much the appearance of misconduct, so they have abandoned public activim. In the meantime, I expect the alt light types like Mike C and Milo to take more of the heat now that the convenient "actual Nazis" have gone underground, so to speak.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 23, 2018 1:17 PM  

Dirk Manly wrote:I got an 397 out of 400 points in my Formal Logic class.

When you can beat that, then you can come back and explain to us why you argument that '"not an argument" is not an argument' is wrong.... considering that I already beat you over the head once with the most simple explanation possible.

What is the Major Premise of "Not an Argument"
What is the Minor Premise?
What is the Conclusion?
Is the Conclusion Induced, Deduced or Adduced?



Or if you prefer legal wrangling;
What is the Claim?
What are the Grounds?
What are the warrants?


What do we call a pretend argument that hides or obfuscates it's Premises?

And you can take your grade in a Formal Logic Class and blow it out your puckered ass. I was studying Formal Logic at an age when you were still struggling with long division.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 23, 2018 1:37 PM  

@ElCid, Also when we compare libertarianism with communism we aren't talking about political spectrum in any way making your regurgitation of "horseshoe theory" silly. Instead, the argument is that both rely on altering and/or ignoring basic human nature. They both do that independent of their position on the political spectrum and that is why they both universally fail.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 23, 2018 1:50 PM  

@Arthur Isaac
Forget it Jake, it's LibertariTown.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 23, 2018 3:35 PM  

More cowbell.

Blogger Noah B The Savage Gardener April 23, 2018 5:58 PM  

Property rights
Freedom of movement

PICK ONE

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:02 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:03 PM  

@170

`What is the major premise of "not an argument?"'

Arguments has a definable form,

"What is the minor premise?"

What was presented does not conform to the definition of an argument.

Are you done making a fool of yourself yet?

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:05 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 23, 2018 11:05 PM  

"And you can take your grade in a Formal Logic Class and blow it out your puckered ass. I was studying Formal Logic at an age when you were still struggling with long division."

In 1987, I was designing digital computer hardware and writing operating systems.

And in case you aren't aware, those things are 100% propositional logic.

Blogger Dire Badger April 24, 2018 12:54 AM  

Arthur Isaac wrote:I guess you 'identify' as a Libertarian while ignoring the basic libertarian ideology.

And you identify as alt-right even though you still have your head packed up your neo-con ass.


Dire Badger is a cuck of a different stripe.



I love it when dipshits try to use terms like 'neocon' and 'cuck' without actually understanding their meaning.

Keep on trucking, dumbass.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 24, 2018 2:08 AM  

Db, wasn't it just last week you were trying to score points for your military service? And pull the "I protected your rights you dirty hippy!" schtick? Yeah, we noticed. Wrapping your dick in the flag doesn't mean shit to me.

Blogger Dire Badger April 24, 2018 3:40 AM  

Arthur Isaac wrote:Db, wasn't it just last week you were trying to score points for your military service? And pull the "I protected your rights you dirty hippy!" schtick? Yeah, we noticed. Wrapping your dick in the flag doesn't mean shit to me.

You really got THAT from the whole discussion? Boy, you really ARE a dumbass. I don't think I have ever met someone as stupid as you are before.

The worst part is, even Snidely spelled it out for you. And you still cannot get it.

Here, very slowly, yet again.

Americans young men do not deserve to die in order to 'make a point'.

The fact that warhawks make them do bad things, does not make them deserve to die.

the fact that you insist that they 'deserve' to die shows that you do not 'deserve' to live in this country.

We all understand. You were bullied growing up. You have a permanent chip on your shoulder about the kind of strong, dominant, courageous boy who often enters military service, because you remember them pulling your underwear over your head.

People like John McCain want to send them to their deaths to prove a point. People like Mitt Romney. People like the conservative establishment. Ironically, people like you.

That doesn't mean that they should die to make you feel better about what a pussy you are.

This conversation is over. I am tired of explaining reality to someone who isn't an American. Go back to your safe space, pussy.

Blogger wreckage April 24, 2018 3:44 AM  

@174, property rights, every time. Freedom of movement isn't a right.

Point of fact, collective property rights is where you get from "Libertarian" to "Nationalist". In fact if you believe in open borders, you CANNOT claim to believe in property rights, wherefrom you can't claim to be either Capitalist-of-any-sort, or Libertarian.

Almost every single thing people claim Libertarianism can't do, it already has, repeatedly; that some die-hard nutballs insist that any and all social constraints are contrary to "muhh rights" does not change the fact that laissez-faire plus immutable rights works passably well and is frequently, defacto, the reality.

That said, you might not consider me Libertarian but some sort of alt-lite or liberal alt-right or just a Nationalist; that's fine by me.

But remember, a lot of men disaffected with a rules-heavy, cuck-infested Conservatism have moved to Libertarianism and a lot of what I have said makes for the perfect leading question if you want them to move towards the alt-right or Nationalist.

Uncontrolled borders erase property rights, and without property rights ANY form of Popular Capitalism (as opposed to a capitalistic elite served by serfs)or Libertarianism simply cannot function. It's both a direct violation of their logical premise and a direct violation of their most important mechanic.

Like I said, this is just one obvious meme to drop on Libertarians, to get them moving away from Globalism. Don't fight it. Spread it.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 24, 2018 6:06 AM  

@180

"Db, wasn't it just last week you were trying to score points for your military service? And pull the "I protected your rights you dirty hippy!" schtick?"

NO, that was me, dipshit.

27 years service. 3 of those in war zones.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 24, 2018 6:10 AM  

@181

"We all understand. You were bullied growing up. You have a permanent chip on your shoulder about the kind of strong, dominant, courageous boy who often enters military service,"

I entered as a coward. I wanted money to complete my education, and military service was an honorable way of obtaining it (and being a big history buff, I knew the sacrifices that had been made on MY behalf, by men who had never known me, or even my family, so that I could obtain such an education in the first place).

My courageousness has grown since then.

Courage: Doing what has to be done right now, even though you're scared shitless.

Blogger Alphaeus April 24, 2018 10:02 AM  

"Uncontrolled borders erase property rights, and without property rights ANY form of Popular Capitalism (as opposed to a capitalistic elite served by serfs)or Libertarianism simply cannot function."

My pithy way of saying it is, "Libertarianism is not jungle law." Somalia is not libertarian because nobody in Somalia has any moral rights that anyone else is morally or legally bound to respect. In the jungle might makes right. In libertarianism right makes moral and legal might. Libertarianism requires an ethic like what Jesus Christ taught, which was that whoever would be greatest amongst the libertarians would be the servant of all. In libertarianism private servants serve their customers in the free market, and the civil servants serve the general public according to the Res Publica, the public thing called the law. In the jungle the law is whatever you think is right in your own eyes, and if you don't like it you have to retain a jungle lawyer, otherwise known as a spear.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 24, 2018 11:36 AM  

DB you got cranky because you misread what I said? I never suggested I wanted to see ANY servicemen die.

That you want to get recognition for your sevices to Babylon is your problem not mine.

If you weren't so busy polishing that turd you might realize you're covered in it.

The internet tough guy routine is pretty funny too. Could you take yourself a bit more seriously?

Blogger Dirk Manly April 25, 2018 6:24 AM  

@186

IF your intent was to communicate that the result would NOT include dead US Navy crewmen, then you utterly failed.

Blogger Arthur Isaac April 25, 2018 11:33 AM  

@Dirk. My intent was to point out that crying about the broken eggs of neoconnery is a stupid exercise, especially here. On the other post you have people gleefully fantasizing about tsumamis wiping out both coasts and your panties aren't twisted. Because no sailors will die when Norfolk and San Diego are 300 feet under water, right? You are posturing and I'm laughing at you.

Blogger Dirk Manly April 25, 2018 4:11 PM  

Are US Navy sailors enemies of the Constitution and the American people?
A) yes
B) NO

Are coastal libtards enemies of the Constitution and the American people?

a) no
B) YES.


See how easy that was?

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