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Monday, March 11, 2019

Jordan Peterson at the Trilateral Commission

I just wish I'd had this transcript in time to include it in Jordanetics. If you're still not convinced the man is a complete intellectual fraud, just watch his speech at the Trilateral Commission on the prospects for the survival of democracy:
What can we do in order for democracy to survive? So I would like that to be the main theme for our conversation and I can simply leave it with an advance, and ask you, so what does it take, and, and what can you do?

Well, I should tell you first what I've been talking to people about. So my wife and I have been on a hundred-city tour since January, and I've spoken to about 250,000 people over the course of that in Australia, New Zealand,  and throughout the U.S. and Canada. Some in Europe, mostly in the UK, in the Scandinavian countries, I'm coming back here in March, then to go through the South in them and the East. When I speak to audiences I always watched people one by one because I never speak to the crowd and always listened to the entire audience, because what I'm trying to manage when I'm speaking is to put everybody in the same place so that there's dead silence. Because if there's dead silence, that means that everybody's concentrating on the same thing and that everybody has come to a collective agreement that that thing is up substantive importance, and the most reliable means of silencing an audience of 2,500 people, regardless of where that is around the world, is to make a strong case for the relationship between suffering, meaning, and responsibility.

And the, the case for suffering, I think, is quite obvious, because one of the things that I point out to my listeners is that life has a tragic element and we all are perfectly aware of that, and then we're subject to that as fragile and finite creatures, and that, that tragic element is amplified by the human proclivity for malevolence, psychological level and at a social level and that's the reality that we find ourselves confronted with, eternally in some sense, and that the proper antidote to that is not the pursuit of happiness, and it's not even the existence of the individual rights that are part of the substructure of democratic society, but the willingness to accept voluntary responsibility for those preconditions and then working to rectify them. And the corollary of that is that it's almost inevitably the case that people find the meaning that sustains themselves through suffering, and that enables them to be motivated sufficiently to constrain their own malevolence is to be found in the adoption of responsibility, and it's surprising that a message that has that much weight, let's say, and that little frivolity, because there's no frivolity,  let's say, in that silence, is people, can democracy survive?

Well, first of all, if you ask the typical person in the democratic society whether they would like it to survive you're going, the resounding answer to that, it's going to be yes. The people who are working to undermine it are a tiny radical fringe on both ends of the political distribution, let's say, with a disproportionate amount exposure and power, and the people in the middle are lost in some sense without a uniting narrative. And a huge part of the narrative that is united democratic countries, since their foundation isn't the doctrine of rights, and it's not the doctrine of individual happiness,  it's the doctrine that the individual is the sovereign foundation of the, of the polity, and maybe of the cosmos itself, which is something that I happen to believe given the important rule that consciousness plays in existence itself,  and that it's useful and necessary to call to people to remind them of their responsibility as sovereign individuals.

And so I'm encouraging people to adopt,  to develop a vision for their life, to adopt full responsibility for themselves, in a manner, and not in a manner that's that pertains specifically to their narrow self-interest or happiness, but to something that's much broader in scope, to think that each person should take on the voluntary requirement to take care of themselves, but also their future self, because each of us is a collective that stretches across time. And whatever you do impulsively in the present merely means that you sacrifice yourself in the future, and that's not a sustainable or intelligent solution, and you want to take on a responsibility for yourself and your future selves in a way that's of maximal benefit to your family, if you can manage that, and then, perhaps, if there's something left over in terms of your capability, then you can do both of those things in a way that maximally supports and serves the community. And for many young people that's something they've never heard is that we'd be in a very bad case too, we've made a very bad case, all of us, I would say.

I would say that each of these people, each person has that sovereign responsibility, and that if they adopt it, that actually constitutes something of singular importance, and that's an old religious idea, in some sense, that each person has a soul, let's say, that is somehow a center of reality itself, and that that needs to be manifested in life itself,  and that if it isn't manifested, then something of tremendous value is not brought forward. And worse, and this is the end of the case, let's say, and worse, to the degree that that's not brought forward then something hellish moves in to take its place And people understand this sort of thing a lot more clearly than you might think, if you explain it to them as if they might understand, and then it gives them a seriousness of purposeness that straightens out their life. And so my sense is the way that you revivify democracy is by remembering its fundamental insistence that the individual is at the cornerstone of the state, and then everything you can possibly do to fortify the individual, simultaneously, the individual is the eyes of the state, the living individual is the eyes of the dead state, and the living individual revivifies the state.

And to the degree that we forget our concentration on the sovereignty of the individual, right, the divine sovereignty of the individual, for that matter, then we undermine the foundation on which democracy is based and then people look for alternatives. They search for meaning elsewhere, extremist movements of one form or another, or they collapse into a kind of nihilism that's completely counterproductive. And so, well, so that's been my experience.
This is the nonsense for which tens of thousands of marks pay hundreds of dollars to subject themselves. Notice despite all that useless, bafflegarbling word salad, he never even answered the questions he said he was going to address. And notice too the way in which he never stops selling his con.

How on Earth is the individual taking the sovereign responsibility for himself going to affect, in any way, the problem of foreign elites corrupting the political process to serve their own ends rather than the national interest? How is the mass acceptance of the voluntary requirement to take care of your future self going to hold dishonest representatives accountable for running on one set of policies and then governing on a wildly different one? How is what Peterson said even remotely relevant to the eminently justified widescale loss of faith in a political system that manifestly fails to deliver on its claims to represent the collective will of the nation?

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69 Comments:

Blogger 1st Earl Hardwicke March 11, 2019 8:18 AM  

Yeah, I've played Deus Ex. The Trilateral Commission "The Secret Government".

I wonder if people on the commission believe JBP BS, or even if he believes it. I suppose that doesn't really matter.

Blogger Matrim's Mutterings March 11, 2019 8:22 AM  

Well by offering nothing he gave everything of value he has to offer.

Blogger Rory March 11, 2019 8:26 AM  

what-the-fuck-am-i-reading.jpg

Blogger Jeff aka Orville March 11, 2019 8:29 AM  

He's put the crowd in a dead silence with his impenetrable bafflegarb. He's just a deep state crowd control tool.

Blogger Dominik K. March 11, 2019 8:30 AM  

he never really answered the questions he said he was going to address VD's last words saved me. As a non English speaker I fought through this text and thought that I must have missed the important stuff.

Good thing is, that he managed only to get a stance in Europe in Scandinavia and the UK. One of the times that the lack of English has saved some people.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan March 11, 2019 8:42 AM  

I might be mistaken but I never conflated socialism with divine sovereignty of the individual.

Blogger JACIII March 11, 2019 8:43 AM  

Mountains of evil can be laid at Marx' feet, but at least HIS 300 word sentences went in a single direction.

Blogger haus frau March 11, 2019 8:49 AM  

I deeply respect VD's perseverance in reading Petersen's works. This babbling is mind numbing. How can a person use so many words and yet say so little?

Blogger Zaklog the Great March 11, 2019 8:52 AM  

I'm sure some of this applies to many speakers, but I suspect Peterson is worse. Reading a fairly faithful transcript of his speeches is painful. There's so much repetition and it doesn't seem to be going anywhere. If you're listening and watching, it sounds interesting, but simply reading the printed words, it just doesn't seem coherent.

Blogger Diana Isabella March 11, 2019 8:53 AM  

Solipsistic ol' Peterson is back to give us another installment in the never ending saga of his shattered relationship with objective truth.

Blogger pyrrhus March 11, 2019 8:56 AM  

My brain refused to read any more after a few sentences of this arglebargle....

Blogger SciVo March 11, 2019 9:00 AM  

Mr.MantraMan wrote:I might be mistaken but I never conflated socialism with divine sovereignty of the individual.

Well, consider the Crowleyism, "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law." If JBP is saying anything, it's that democracy is for muggles, and anarcho-tyranny is magic.

Blogger Nate March 11, 2019 9:01 AM  

"Because if there's dead silence, that means that everybody's concentrating on the same thing"

this is the kind of bullshit that you can hear and just let it go... but when you read it... your bullshit warning lights go off like micheal Jordan with the flu

Blogger pdwalker March 11, 2019 9:03 AM  

@haus frau: practice.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd March 11, 2019 9:03 AM  

SciVo wrote:If JBP is saying anything ...

I think he's being rather careful to not say anything. It takes a lot of words to fill a vacuum.

Blogger David Baker March 11, 2019 9:11 AM  

Has Rogan got a copy of Jordanetics yet?
Be interesting to see if he is invited on yet again or whether both parties choose to disassociate due to contamination of brand.


Blogger Stilicho March 11, 2019 9:12 AM  

"How on Earth is the individual taking the sovereign responsibility for himself going to affect, in any way, the problem of foreign elites corrupting the political process to serve their own ends rather than the national interest? "

Peterson goes well beyond that. He is suggesting that individuals take personal responsibility for the existence of evil in the world when he states that individuals have to accept personal responsibility for those "preconditions" (evil). Then he goes on to effectively claim that man is the measure of all things and is likely the foundation of the universe.

It's beyond bafflegarb, it is literally satanic.

Blogger Jo K March 11, 2019 9:15 AM  

Hello. I've come here today to talk about poverty. Let me start by saying that life is suffering, and that only way we can begin to mitigate that suffering is by finding purpose.

Hello. I've come here today to talk about the noble goal of space exploration. Let me start by saying that life is suffering, and that only way we can begin to mitigate that suffering is by finding purpose.

Hello. I've come here today to talk about government. Let me start by saying that life is suffering, and that only way we can begin to mitigate that suffering is by finding purpose.

Hello. I've come here today to talk about meta-neo-migrant-separatism. Let me start by saying that life is suffering, and that only way we can begin to mitigate that suffering is by finding purpose.

Hello. I've come here today to talk about the crisis of obesity. Let me start by saying that life is suffering, and that only way we can begin to mitigate that suffering is by finding purpose.

Hello. I've come here today to talk about the bible. Let me start by saying that life is suffering, and that only way we can begin to mitigate that suffering is by finding purpose.

Hello. I've come here today to talk about the evolution of one trick ponies. Let me start by saying that life is suffering, and that only way we can begin to mitigate that suffering is by finding purpose.

Blogger Aaron March 11, 2019 9:17 AM  

The problem with Peterson is he's too much like a continental philosopher and not enough like an analytic philosopher.

Blogger dc.sunsets March 11, 2019 9:18 AM  

That 3rd paragraph has to be the most incoherent stream-of-consciousness I've witnessed.

The guy must have a minor in "illusionist" stuff, because no Las Vegas magician has better diverted audience attention from the magician's focus to Stage Left. Some already said it, but I do wonder if videos of Jim Jones show him demonstrating a similar style.

When people are lost, taking them further into the swamp is apparently easy.

Blogger Robin March 11, 2019 9:23 AM  

“...and it's surprising that a message that has that much weight, let's say, and that little frivolity, because there's no frivolity, let's say, in that silence, is people, can democracy survive?”

What? Just… what??? This isn’t even grammatical. Calling him wormtongue was an apt comparison.

Blogger 1st Earl Hardwicke March 11, 2019 9:30 AM  

Take up JBP Self authoring program, become your own God?

An engineered Nano technology augmented law enforcement officer, who happens to have the initials JC?

---------

@16 Pretty sure Joe Rogan is a lost cause. Psychedelic use, changes a person. It's not the same person.

Blogger The Contrarian March 11, 2019 9:57 AM  

The divine sovereignty of the individual comes from God, not the state, polity or cosmos. Bring the population back to God, or continue down the road of chaos.

Blogger Dangeresque March 11, 2019 9:58 AM  

Jordan B. Peterson, Structural Engineer for the Tower of Babel.

Blogger xevious2030 March 11, 2019 10:02 AM  

Can’t really put forward a dialectic on the quote, though I do a little. Can’t even bring myself to read the entire verbatim, but bits and pieces. It’s just, in rhetorical terms, diarrhea of the mouth. It’s not deep, mystical, substantive, or honest. It’s rhetoric, fuzzy foundation, written into the form of being a bad attempt to condense vast knowledge in a limited availability of speaking time. Of being a vast intellect trying to parse down the information through an imperfect and limited vessel/messenger, and with him, it just is not the case. It’s tripe, being presented as being from Wisdom. Beta wave stimulating and suggestive presentation of a trance inducing nature. I mean, it taps right into the emotional portion of the brain, and pretty well, so kudos to Peterson for that, but it is junk. Although, lulling, keeping, and directing an appropriate audience seems to be the aim, which, if that is the case, seems to be working as intended, to the point of providing an official first-hand presentation/demonstration to the Trilaterals.

Blogger KPKinSunnyPhiladelphia March 11, 2019 10:04 AM  

Diana Isabella wrote:Solipsistic ol' Peterson is back to give us another installment in the never ending saga of his shattered relationship with objective truth.

You know, I was reading this typical stream of consciousness of JP, and I thought, "Solipsism." That's the underlying "philosophy" of JP, even if you could deign to call it a philosophy.

As such, it doesn't need to be coherent. Coherence is an impediment.

Blogger Boorn Boorm March 11, 2019 10:08 AM  

VD's nationalism argument is surprisingly simple, which is why I am convinced of it's viability.

individual > immediate family > extended family > "tribe" > nation > state

Peterson's argument is somehow, you can have the individual and the state, and cut everything else in between. How the hell is that supposed to work?

Even conservatives add the immediate family, and Peterson has mentioned, but not emphasized it.

Blogger Garuna March 11, 2019 10:22 AM  

Wtf is up with the "protect democracy" meme? The whole reason the "radicals" are on the rise is because the elites are constantly subverting the will of the people.

Real measurable economic, social, and military problems can't be solved with verbal wizardry and misdirection about "muh individualism".

It's really a massive whitepill that the enemy thinks it'll work. It means that their whole worldview is some warped form of the Great Man Theory of History (Great Wizard Theory of History?). They have elevated Peterson as an ersatz "great man" who will do clever little tricks and wizardry and make the truth go away. It simply does not work like that, as they learned the hard way during the Supreme court confirmation process last year.

The Peterson Experiment is doomed to death by a thousand Kavanaugh tweets.

Blogger PCA March 11, 2019 10:24 AM  

Er, not quite.

The problem is that he's an Anglo *impersonating* an Anglo's idea of a continental philosopher. Anglos doing that end up being merchants of woo. They're incapable of thinking this way. (And project this inability onto the French and German, whom they accuse of being charlatans.)

Note also the irony: Peterson's big trick is to present himself as the champion of "British individualism," opposed to the "big continental ideas" of Nazism and Communism.

Blogger Boorn Boorm March 11, 2019 10:34 AM  

@28
"Protect democracy" is as pathetic as "Democracy dies in darkness." It doesn't mean a damn thing, except to people who associate it with "good."
It's the same way you can glaze over conservative uniparty members. Talk about "law and order, liberty" which are meaningless in context except,
"Yeah, yeah, those things are good."

Blogger Dave March 11, 2019 10:40 AM  

Yeah, got to the dead silence part, said eff this I'll just skip ahead to Vox's summation.

Blogger Trebor Nosemaj March 11, 2019 10:47 AM  

Notice how one of his themes is to stress how the tragic aspect of life and our sufferring in it's wake is prone to be "amplified" by malevolent forces ("OMG...The Nazis!!") but shies away from how it is really the amplification of a comfort zone provided BEFORE tragedy manifests that is the real trick of evil. I stress "before" because JBP would probably argue that the demagogue provides a psychological comfort to the suffering in the midst or after the tragedy. Isn't it funny how this demagogue doesn't address the "before" aspect? JBP is possibly the best archetype of a Freedom Philosopher in a Brave New World.

Blogger Billy March 11, 2019 10:59 AM  

I gave up after paragraph 3. I can't believe I ever took this lunatic seriously enough, let alone buy his book. Hopefully his spell will be broken before any serious damage is done.

Blogger Nate73 March 11, 2019 11:13 AM  

Let's say, in some sense, because... democracy is the divine right of the individual?

Blogger The Deplorable Podunk Ken Ramsey March 11, 2019 11:25 AM  

Garuna wrote:Wtf is up with the "protect democracy" meme?

Short answer? SJWs always project. What is the surest way to undermine democracy? It's to reject the results of legitimate democratic elections. And to set the shadow warrior swamplings within the Deep State loose to sabotage and undermine legitimacy. Fellow travelers in black robes willing are a yuge asset, too, as are the members of nearly the entire chattering and media classes.

The left has been subverting democracy loudly and proudly and openly ever since November 2016. So of course they will concern troll its demise along the way, even as they twist their knife in body politic.

Blogger LES March 11, 2019 11:28 AM  

A constitutional republic with a capitalist economic system is the best model there is. It only works when a significant majority share the same worldview. The Church is made up of individuals who have chosen to be disciples of Christ. The US has been atomized and no longer shares the same values. A divided house cannot stand.

"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other". John Adams

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey March 11, 2019 11:38 AM  

Wasn't there a commenter a few weeks back who insisted that Peterson was using some kind of neurolinguistic programming/ Ericksonian hypnosis? I can see where he was coming from. Peterson's speech is incredibly incoherent -- if you look at it as an honest attempt to explain his ideas. But if you ignore the superficial layer of pseudointellectual gobbledygook and look at the underlying message on a purely emotional level, it's something like this:

"You feel bad now. Alone. 'Fragile' and "finite.' Threatened by 'malevolence.' You feel like something is wrong with your life, and with society in the current year. But if you believe what I'm telling you, you will feel better. You will feel a sense of belonging. A sense of 'purposeness.' Of 'meaning.' I will give you a 'uniting narrative' so that you won't be isolated out there on the 'radical fringe'. So you won't 'collapse into nihilism'."

That's the real message. The bafflegab is just there to disguise the underlying, purely emotional content.

@27
Peterson's argument is somehow, you can have the individual and the state, and cut everything else in between.

Oddly enough, that was exactly the objective of Cultural Marxism/ the Frankfurt School/ the "long march trough the institutions," going all the way back to Gramsci. Huh.

Blogger dc.sunsets March 11, 2019 11:41 AM  

Protect "democracy."
Now that's power...most people in the West today don't even question the relevance, much less the value of "protecting democracy," so brainwashed are we now.

Democracy is discussed as a good so universal that it needs no defense or qualification. Doesn't this sound awfully familiar? Perhaps like "diversity?" Or "equality?"

It should. The "value" of democracy is BASED on equality, especially applied under conditions of "diversity."

Defend democracy? Anyone who can think past the thinnest veil of subterfuge should see that DESTROYING democracy is an essential today, ESPECIALLY because there is no equality (never was, never will be, and its pursuit is a scam to keep the cattle from rejecting being farmed, milked and slaughtered) and as has been restated to DEATH on this and other forums, there can be nothing WORSE than democracy under diversity (AKA head-count totalitarianism.)

Blogger Daniele Grech Pereira March 11, 2019 11:48 AM  

What purpose can you find when you start with, "life is a piece of sh*t"? Life is a mission from God. That's why it's hard. But it's also a glorious struggle that sanctifies the world with your good deeds. Wake the frig up, Jordy.

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar March 11, 2019 11:52 AM  

Not really on topic here, but it is about time a boomer apologizes:

https://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/ny-oped-im-so-so-so-sorry-20190301-story.html

Apology not accepted until you organize a front in the culture war to fight against your former friends, who are at this moment poisoning our children's minds and disseminating agit-prop.

Blogger Ann March 11, 2019 11:56 AM  

I saw Peterson in Minneapolis last year. I bought 2 tickets in order to bring my son but he bowed out; summer basketball was more alluring. In hindsight I'm glad he did because it was a mind-numbing snooze-fest. I took my 74 year old aunt and she tried to take notes in short-hand but gave up.

Initially, I applauded the way Peterson stood up against compelled speech and all the pc nonsense out there, but Vox is right about the rest of Peterson's message. It's suicidal.

I've learned to skip most lengthy quotes and jump to Vox's ka-pow! at the end. Life is short.

Blogger Latigo3 March 11, 2019 11:59 AM  

For people like Jordan Peterson, my description is always this; "Diarrhea of the mouth".

Blogger R Webfoot March 11, 2019 11:59 AM  

"How on Earth is the individual taking the sovereign responsibility for himself going to affect, in any way, the problem of foreign elites corrupting the political process to serve their own ends rather than the national interest?"

Simple; it will naturally entail submission to the elites.
We know that Jordanetics is aimed at the bottom and middle, and teaches them to avoid looking too high up. We should neither aspire to greatness, nor criticize those above us until our rooms are perfect.

We should also cut off those below us who steadfastly refuse to rise in the hierarchy - which will naturally include those political dissidents, who insist on criticizing those above them without first making their own room spotless. Those people are dangerous - that's how we get Columbines, you know - and if they refuse to reform and stop attracting the ire of tyrants, sometimes you just have to cut them loose.

Above all else, your pursuit of meaning and your very concept of truth should be defined by your evolutionarily tuned instincts - and we know from Jordan Peterson himself that this includes the instinct to please and not attract the ire of the rich and powerful. Defending Faith Goldy or Milo would have gotten him attacked, so defending them just didn't spark joy.

Blogger R Webfoot March 11, 2019 12:05 PM  

That reminds me - who HAS Jordan Peterson defended? He defended himself, and made it clear that it was not about free speech, only compelled speech. He defended James Damore and Lindsey Graham; Damore referred to Peterson's work directly, and Graham was attacked for playing a clip from a Peterson speech. He defended Milo when Milo had a huge following, not so much afterwards.

Blogger PolitiCrump March 11, 2019 12:10 PM  

So, essentially Peterson's response to the role of Satanic globalists, corrupt cosmopolitan corporations, anti-national anti-traditional elites and politicians in undermining civilization is...

to tell people to clean their room (i.e. take personal responsibility Blah blah blah).

Blogger Tatooine Sharpshooters' Club March 11, 2019 12:19 PM  

Reading that was like having your teeth pulled out through your arsehole, then put back in the same way.

Blogger DJT March 11, 2019 12:27 PM  

I ran into a friend the other day and he asked me if I heard of Jordan Peterson. I said I wasn't a fan, but I couldn't offer a lot of details as I haven't followed the articles closely.

Can anyone offer an elevator pitch for Jordanetics that could get this guy interested in seeking help?

Blogger OneWingedShark March 11, 2019 12:34 PM  

haus frau wrote:I deeply respect VD's perseverance in reading Petersen's works. This babbling is mind numbing. How can a person use so many words and yet say so little?
Look up Markov Chains, they're used in text generators (that's a live-site, the demo used to generate 200 times more than the few bullet-points there).

Blogger Quiet Poetic March 11, 2019 12:39 PM  

@41
I saw Peterson in Minneapolis last year. I bought 2 tickets in order to bring my son but he bowed out
I took a date to a JBP lecture and that was the last time I saw that SOB. He probably thinks I'm nuts. I blame Jordan Peterson. Haha

Blogger John Williams March 11, 2019 12:47 PM  

“Because if there's dead silence, that means that everybody's concentrating on the same thing and that everybody has come to a collective agreement that that thing is up substantive importance,...”
Isn’t that a female/gamma/SJW trait where they think silence means agreement?

Blogger SciVo March 11, 2019 12:49 PM  

Garuna wrote:Wtf is up with the "protect democracy" meme? The whole reason the "radicals" are on the rise is because the elites are constantly subverting the will of the people.

It's the Big Lie, the word wizardry of inverting the truth.

"democracy"
"democratic institutions"
"institutions of our democratic system of government"
"government institutions"
technocracy & kritarchy
anti-democracy

Blogger 1st Earl Hardwicke March 11, 2019 12:52 PM  

Trebor Nosemaj wrote:Notice how one of his themes is to stress how the tragic aspect of life and our sufferring in it's wake is prone to be "amplified" by malevolent forces ("OMG...The Nazis!!") but shies away from how it is really the amplification of a comfort zone provided BEFORE tragedy manifests that is the real trick of evil. I stress "before" because JBP would probably argue that the demagogue provides a psychological comfort to the suffering in the midst or after the tragedy. Isn't it funny how this demagogue doesn't address the "before" aspect? JBP is possibly the best archetype of a Freedom Philosopher in a Brave New World.

In the book Brave New World; John the Savage, one of the main protagonists ends up killing himself, shortly after talking to one of the "World controllers" from what I can remember from listening to the audiobook. Would be interesting to contrast JBP before he took psychedelics and after. According to wikipedia "The Tempest" was the last play Shakespeare wrote, and there's a pretty strong reference to magic mushrooms. I wonder if psychedelics can make someone more gamma (or permanently), kind of like forcing epigenetic changes. Could an Alpha be created with testosterone therapy?

Funny coincidence that C.S Lewis, John F Kennedy, Aldous Huxley all died on the same day.

Blogger Robin March 11, 2019 12:57 PM  

@1st Earl

“I wonder if psychedelics can make someone more gamma”

I can certainly see that. Blow their perspective out, and convince them that the world is too large to take responsibility for, that it will somehow take care of itself, and that “we are all one” which translates as “abandon your family”.

Blogger Ann March 11, 2019 1:49 PM  

@49 The funny thing is the audience at the Peterson lecture was very restless. One could sense they wanted something to happen. A heckler got up and yelled something about the John Birch society, but he was quickly escorted out. You could tell the crowd was just waiting for someone to call them a "bunch of Nazis" for being Peterson fans, but no such luck.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine March 11, 2019 2:05 PM  

"Stay moderate, stay atomized, everything is your fault. Keep democracy, even though if if you actually believe in it, it minimizes your effect while maximizing the effect of those manipulators who do not."

AKA follow the program, fishies, stay alienated thralls. Don't challenge your betters. Everything is still your fault. Resistance is evil.

"Peterson's argument is somehow, you can have the individual and the state, and cut everything else in between. How the hell is that supposed to work?"

I'm not sure he really knows himself, but logically all the individuals opiatize and weaken themselves by only focusing on themselves and the state, and a cabal of slavemasters steps in to handle everything in between.

As someone else said, yes, it's a variety of socialism similar to Fabian.

Blogger sammibandit March 11, 2019 2:12 PM  

Lorem ipsum all the way down.

Blogger James Pyrich March 11, 2019 3:36 PM  

So many "wtf" moments in the reading of this transcript.

That whole section about the individual and the state, where the individual is alive, the state is dead, but the individual is the "eyes" of the state--or did he mean "I"s? I think your guess is as good as mine.

There's no there there, but the structure of it stood out to me, like it was some kind of magical spell he was trying to cast. Entomb the living individual in the dead state? Aspire to being the foundation of the cosmos, and through this, your will is made manifest in the dead material world?

I'm going to stop before I drown in bafflegarble.

Also: "And people understand this sort of thing a lot more clearly than you might think, if you explain it to them as if they might understand"

Of course. Understanding is not required. You only need to make them believe that they have understanding, which is apparently not that hard to do.

Blogger tublecane March 11, 2019 3:52 PM  

"How is what Peterson said even remotely relevant to the eminently justified widescale loss of faith in a political system..."

It isn't, but who even knows what system Peterson has in his head? Democracy does not have a historical foundation in the sovereignty of individual souls. I don't even know where he gets that from.

Except perhaps the phrase popular sovereignty. Which wasn't a bunch of individuals getting together in Kansas territory, for instance, and comparing the tragic sufferings of the collective temporal daisy chain of chronological selves and coming to an agreement on the adoption of a new state constitution. That would be unworkable, to put it mildly.

There's your Rousseauan radical individualism, but that's at the same time collectivist. Not collectivist in the Petersonian sense of the billion Petersons all responsible for themselves.

Blogger tublecane March 11, 2019 4:01 PM  

@17- Can't wait to read:

The Willingness to Accept Voluntary Responsibility for Evil, and What Better Purposes Toward Which Your Evil May Be Directed for the Sake of Democracy

by Dr. Jelly Butter Peanut

Blogger tublecane March 11, 2019 4:15 PM  

@28- What does democracy mean to them? Never forget to put quotation marks around "democracy" when it passes their lips. Because that's just a PR buzzword for a ruling order that deliberately seeks to circumvent direct popular government. That was much the point of progressivism and the Managerial State it spawned.

Now, Peterson is fond of denigrating extremes and pretending there's an Excluded Middle in politics. And perhaps the extreme sides of the Overton Window get more publicity. But anyone who has any bit of experience with the universe of thought outside what's safe to talk about in the MSM this week knows those extremes are pretty close together.

There's this thing we call the Narrative, and it's exists to instruct the general public. So it'll be a little ahead of them (to the left), but it more or less represents what they want us to think. When Peterson speaks of people losing faith in democracy, he probably means not trusting the Narrative.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash March 11, 2019 4:38 PM  

Our democracy is derived from the tradition of the Anglo-Saxon warbands to elect their chiefs, and to a lesser extent the tradition of the Irish to have the ranking members of a clan vote for a king of the clan, and the clans to vote for a high king from among themselves.

In other words, democracy is not a universal, and is grounded in the ethnic traditions of our tribes from 3000 years ago.

Blogger RealTalk103 March 11, 2019 5:05 PM  

“Most of these joker's don't even want to use language you and I know or can learn… they would rather sneer at us and be smug, because we “fail” to see what they are driving at. If indeed they are driving at anything-obscurity is usually the refuge of incompetence” - Robert Heinlein, ‘Stranger In A Strange Land’

Blogger Silent Draco March 11, 2019 8:20 PM  

Get the quiet audience unified on his theme. Begin the chant:

"Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You ate my cousin. Prepare to die."

Blogger Edgar Abbey March 11, 2019 8:34 PM  

The Peterson speech is pure gibberish.

Blogger matveidaniilovich March 11, 2019 11:00 PM  

"The Search for the Cooler Side of the Pillow." Should do comic version to troll all of the nags who complained about Quantum Mortis #1 being too slow.

Blogger The Pitchfork Rebel March 11, 2019 11:03 PM  

"What can we do in order for democracy to survive?"

At the TLC? Isn't that like talking about the survival of the beef industry at a PETA convention?

Blogger birdman March 11, 2019 11:52 PM  

Dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt lmao

Blogger Travis Moss March 12, 2019 12:40 PM  

I find it laughable that someone would pay $200 to shake his soft hand. Him and his Pseudo-Intellectual Dork Web friends have replaced the intellectual charlatans of the New Atheist crowd.

Blogger Paul M March 13, 2019 11:46 AM  

But, but, I'm not a sovereign individual! I'm an Australian, and a faithful subject of Her Majesty, the Queen. She's my sovereign! Isn't this guy supposed to be a Canadian?

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