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Saturday, July 27, 2019

The clash of the two "Americas"

America can't be broken apart, but the USA can be, and will be.
The question comes down to this: Is the fragile American experiment in republicanism begun in Philadelphia in 1787, which required a commonly-shared understanding of basic principles, now over, or at the very least is it entering its agonizing death throes?

One can certainly trace a progressively destructive trajectory in American history since the overthrow of the American constitutional system in 1865. And the results of that history are now reaching almost an unimaginable breaking point.

Increasingly, we live in a country that has become de facto little more than a mere geographical entity. True, it is still formally a nation, but a nation where there are in fact at least two very distinct Americas, with radically differing visions of what is real and what is not real, radically differing conceptions of what is moral and what is not, radically differing views about truth and error, and radically differing ideas about using whatever means are available to reach a desired and posited end. For all the talk of equality and racism, the revolutionary side in actuality seeks to replace one oligarchy—which it calls “white supremacist”—with another oligarchy of its own making, in fact, a brutal, vicious and soulless “utopia’’ that would make Joseph Stalin’s Communist state seem like a Sandals Retreat in the Bahamas.

At the base of this revolutionary movement is the critical use of language. Ideologically-tinged words—“devil terms”—now occur with amazing regularity and frequency: racism, white privilege, sexism, toxic masculinity, equality, democracy, and so on. These terms have been weaponized and are now employed by those on the Left—but also adopted by many elitist movement conservatives (“conservatism inc.”)—to disauthorize, condemn, and damn anyone who would offer effective opposition to the rapid Leftward perversion of what remains of this nation.

It is not only the frenzied talking heads on CNN and MSNBC, but such “respectable” conservative voices as Bill Kristol, Hew Hewitt, Jonah Goldberg, Rich Lowry, Ben Shapiro, the National Review crowd and various Republican types , who have joined in to legitimize each new progressivist conquest (e.g., same sex marriage) and attack any real opposition to the Leftist “long march” through our institutions. Like the hard Left, the establishment conservatives betray a hardly-concealed contempt for Middle America, for those hard-working, gun-owning, church-going, underpaid folks who still try to raise a family morally on a shrinking salary. They see the rest of us as mere rubes, a servile class who are not supposed to have a voice—this, you see, is now “American democracy.”
The "two Americas" to which the author refers are not, in fact, two Americas. There is a white Christian America and there is a not-white not-Christian not-America which are now locked into an existential struggle. The USA is now divided into a New World remnant of Christendom and the stronghold of Satandom. The latter wishes to conquer and destroy the former because it is a separate nation that worships the god of this world rather than God the Father of Jesus Christ.

Belloc was not entirely correct. It isn't just the national element that matters, as both the national and the religious elements are significant with regards to how the end of the USA will play out.

A conceptual model is only as good as its predictive utility. And, as you will note, there is very little predictive value in the liberal-conservative divide, the black-white racial divide, or the Democrat-Republican divide. But the Christian Nationalist vs Judeo-Christian Globalist model is almost perfectly predictive, not only of future events, but even individual behaviors, everywhere across the West.

The USA is presently facing its own October Revolution right now, one that has been decades in the making. And many of those seeking to complete the destruction of Christian America and rule over a USSA are the literal descendants, intellectually, ideologically, and genetically, of the very Bolsheviks who subjected Christian Russia and Christian Ukraine to 70 years of persecution and suffering.

The author sees three possibilities:
(1) Either there must be some large mass conversion of one side or the other (a ‘Road to Damascus’ conversion?), probably occasioned by some immense and earth-shaking event, war, depression, disaster; or (2) there must be a separation into independent jurisdictions of large portions of what is presently geographically the United States, including possible massive population exchanges—this separation/secession could be peaceable, although increasingly I think it would not be; or lastly, and worst, (3) the devolution of this country would continue into open and vicious civil and guerrilla war, followed by a harsh dictatorship. 
Scenario (3) is a near-certainty simply because virtually no one who is even potentially on the side of the Christian Nationalists is currently capable of recognizing the situation, much less doing anything about it. And as Sun Tzu observes, those who know neither themselves nor their enemies almost always lose.

Labels: , ,

80 Comments:

Blogger A rebel without a General July 27, 2019 6:38 AM  

The only question remains is how violent the breakup of america will be.

Blogger Dark glasses Woody July 27, 2019 6:56 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger VD July 27, 2019 6:58 AM  

Why are you asking me? Ask the author.

Blogger Dark glasses Woody July 27, 2019 7:00 AM  

Fair enough

Blogger Mark Stoval July 27, 2019 7:04 AM  

I read this essay yesterday, so glad it interested VD also. This is a topic that is of utmost importance.

At this time, I am guessing that when the USA is unable to pay for all the money and free stuff given to the thugs and invaders there will be riots and the civil war will start. Living in a medium sized to large city at that time will be a death sentence to whites. Blacks will not be much better off as they can't keep a city running anyway --- and the electrify will be off from the start anyway.

VD has said that your skin will be your uniform, but at some point we will have to eliminate the white left wingers. They are insane and can not be part of whatever nation emerges from the conflict.

This breakup in inevitable.

Blogger Kraemer July 27, 2019 7:06 AM  

Is it advantageous to move to the more hostile climates of Wisconsin or Alaska? Seeing as the vast majority of non-prosperity "Americans" have neither the genetic predisposition nor the desire to live in such environments. There's a reason Hispanics stay in urban areas or the American Southwest,imho

Blogger Gettimothy July 27, 2019 7:12 AM  

4. Christ is building His army right now and America will be restored to Christendom from sea to shining sea.

Blogger Fargoth July 27, 2019 7:24 AM  

Gotten a real kick out of rereading Heinlein lately. If anyone is looking for helpful reading on "path of least resistance revolution", consider starting there.

Blogger Fargoth July 27, 2019 7:26 AM  

And for god sake everyone get your hands on A History of Strategy

Blogger Rick July 27, 2019 7:30 AM  

“probably occasioned by some immense and earth-shaking event, war, depression, disaster”

Q would call this The Storm, in which case, a positive (physical) event which coincides with an emotional awakening. Similar to setting off an explosion to extinguish an oil well fire.

Blogger BastionHarm July 27, 2019 7:38 AM  

The USA is presently facing its own October Revolution right now, one that has been decades in the making. And many of those seeking to complete the destruction of Christian America and rule over a USSA are the literal descendants, intellectually, ideologically, and genetically, of the very Bolsheviks who subjected Christian Russia and Christian Ukraine to 70 years of persecution and suffering.

As my Orthodox brothers-in-Christ are wont to say: What started in Russia will end in America.

Blogger wahr01 July 27, 2019 7:47 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger wahr01 July 27, 2019 7:56 AM  

@5

The baizuo are living in major cities, which you point out will become a death zone for "privileged whites" when fiscal realities hit.

The issue is fiscal accountability can only come when the American Empire no longer has military hegemony to simply refuse to pay. I actually find the implications of falling to the next hegemon less disturbing than the implications of a civil war arising on its own based on the identitarian stoking the current left has been engaged in.

An important part of a hegemon's rise is a firm respect for reality in all its important functional sectors, which would mean whatever they impose in the regions they occupy will be infinitely superior to the "wokeness" seen in the current west.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan July 27, 2019 8:16 AM  

The Baizuo flee to the mountain states where their dollars go to build houses with approx 5 trillion BTUs worth of dead timber lying below these august houses of tolerance and enlightenment, and then these enlightened souls have one access road. See the off the grid house building shows

Blogger wahr01 July 27, 2019 8:34 AM  

It took roughly 40 years for white flight from cities to graduate to flight of the non-indoctrinated from states where the multi-cultist anti-americans consolidated their power.

It took another 20 years or so before it became clear metastasis from these colonized areas had infected other state, and will likely give rise to another 20 of flight yet again.

The question is: when do these fleeing people consider themselves "cornered" and try to fight back? And will there be enough when this happens for it to make a difference or will it just be presented as Waco 2.0?

Blogger ZhukovG July 27, 2019 8:40 AM  

It would be nice if the break up could be peaceful. But the children of Leon Trotsky will not allow it. Even if by some miracle the initial break up was peaceful, Trotsky's brood will still try to destroy us.

In truth, the break up has already started and is now accelerating.

2020 may be the last presidential election of the American Union as we currently know it. Though the Washington DC regime may last to the early 2030's.

My prediction: The USA's dissolution will become a wider global conflict. There's a lot of scores to settle out there and the USA will not be in the way of the settling.

The global death toll will surpass WWII.

The "new" American Nation will be Anglo/Germanic Christian.

The "new" American Nation-State(s) will be 85-95% White European.

The "new" American Nation-State(s) will dominate North America.

Between death and migration(forced and voluntary), the "new" American Nation-State(s) will have a total population of between 120 - 150 million.

Ad Victoriam, Deo Vindice, Ave Caesar Trump!




Blogger Ant_B July 27, 2019 8:47 AM  

Similar to the USA, fake-Nationalists in the UK are now being exposed such as Tommy Robinson. His movement was never about the British people/working class but was about getting the British to financially and politically, support a foreign power in the Middle East by demonising a common enemy i.e Islam. His Handlers are now starting to panic and are calling everyone who digresses a "Nazi".

Blogger Thad Tuiol July 27, 2019 8:48 AM  

As long as whites have new lands to escape to in America, there will be no major conflict. America is just too damn big and still has plenty of lebensraum for white people to flee to. They will prefer that option to actually drawing a line and fighting.

Blogger Avalanche July 27, 2019 8:48 AM  

OT, but a bit of applause for Vox Day, here:
http://www.unz.com/jderbyshire/amy-wax-national-conservatism-and-the-futility-of-nuance-why-not-an-immigration-moratorium/

(Who came up with the term "magic dirt"? Some people have credited me; I used the expression in a posting here at VDARE.com {https://vdare.com/articles/john-derbyshire-on-why-race-realism-makes-more-sense-than-magic-dirt-theory} but I had borrowed it from a post the previous month by blogger Vox Day. {http://voxday.blogspot.com/2015/10/immigrants-dont-share-american-values.html} ...)

Blogger Ransom Smith July 27, 2019 8:59 AM  

Is it advantageous to move to the more hostile climates of Wisconsin or Alaska?
See Minnesota, Maine and Sweden for why climate makes little difference.
As long as the Globalist Government supports the invasion, it'll come from and come to anywhere.

Blogger Hammerli 280 July 27, 2019 9:01 AM  

History says, "Several of the above."

Let's face it, the modern radical Left aren't liberal, they're Communists. Socialist, globalist, and revolutionary. Now, what happens to this sort?

They won in the Soviet Union...but lost in Germany. And their predecessors lost in France. Never forget that Robespierre ended on the guillotine.

And I'm seeing more and more people who are fed up with the neo-Communists. There's a lot of anger waiting to be tapped. Now, I don't think Trump has the nerve to tap it - he's full of boast and bombast, but won't pull the trigger. But he's moving the Overton Window.

And there's something else. I hesitate to discuss it, because it mentions Hitler, but it should be on the table.

The Populist Right and Center-Left are not diametrically opposed. Many of us on the Right are more concerned with cultural issues than with economics. Likewise, the Center-Left is concerned with economics (in particular, welfares), but doesn't care about the culture. Only the Rabid Left wants to control EVERYTHING.

Which makes it possible to form a coalition against the Rabids.

Napoleon did it. He made France great, the Napoleonic Code is thoroughly conservative...but he retained the Revolutionary property settlement and protected domestic French industries. And the Jacobins either got with the program or got guillotined.

Hitler did it. He gave the conservatives the repudiation of the Treaty of Versailles and reassertion of German power that they wanted, gave the Social Democrats the welfare state THEY wanted...and gave the Communists to the SS as bayoneting dummies.

The formula works.

Blogger wahr01 July 27, 2019 9:03 AM  

Thad Tuiol wrote:As long as whites have new lands to escape to in America, there will be no major conflict. America is just too damn big and still has plenty of lebensraum for white people to flee to. They will prefer that option to actually drawing a line and fighting.

No functionally-intelligent person will choose to abandon stability and prosperity for blood and destruction.

Only when the choice becomes one form of destruction or another will that become a possibility.

The problem for accelerationists is each generation huge segments of the populace grow up under the "new normal" and/or are indoctrinated from birth via propaganda.

Only when the subversives over-play their hand is a preference cascade triggered which takes back the minimum required ground for Joe Boomer to feel "normal" again.

What I see most likely to happen is a "reagan revolution 2.0" happening as generation Z, who grew up with SJW's as the hated moral scolds, comes into its own as a voting bloc.

When the people who trolled "he will not divide us" become a coherent political force is when you'll see real ground recovered, but only if you can prevent institutionalization of SJW policy as seen in the EU and Canada.

I don't see these nations remaining US allies should this happen, btw, but the result of this will still not be a full restoration of posterity America: It will be more like Bolsonaro's ideal vision for Brazil.

Blogger Monotonous Languor July 27, 2019 9:14 AM  

The US has had its run. My guess? A chain of events starting with Saudi Arabia and its government, which will implode due to something like the Yemen conflict getting out of control, and broadly escalating to well inside Saudi borders. The petrodollar will immediately melt down, along with the Swift exchange system, to be replaced by the currency basket already jointly started by Russia and China. At that point, the world financial markets will swamp Wall Street, and the entire US economy will come crashing down.

Then it's every man for himself. As predicted by others here on this blog, the barrios, ghettos, and inner cities are festering cancers that will destroy themselves and attempt to overwhelm others outside. Only those people who have already set up the foundations for a united local community based on traditional culture, Christianity, and guns will survive in some fashion or other.

Blogger wahr01 July 27, 2019 9:14 AM  

Hammerli 280 wrote:

The Populist Right and Center-Left are not diametrically opposed. Many of us on the Right are more concerned with cultural issues than with economics. Likewise, the Center-Left is concerned with economics (in particular, welfares), but doesn't care about the culture. Only the Rabid Left wants to control EVERYTHING.

Which makes it possible to form a coalition against the Rabids.



It's increasingly becoming clear this is a necessity rather than a possibility, because those who hold political power and office on the nominal right are lolbertarian ideologues who refuse utterly to reign in openly treasonous corporations.

Companies like Google and Twitter who openly aid the west's geopolitical enemies both militarily and through censorship will never be held to account by parties like the GOP without a complete gutting.

I'd like to further note how close America came to this alliance in 2010. Occupy and The Tea Party were very close to reaching an understanding that many fundamental grievances were one and the same before a massive, official divide & conquer intel op was launched against both movements.

Blogger rumpole5 July 27, 2019 9:29 AM  

VD said: "virtually no one who is even potentially on the side of the Christian Nationalists is currently capable of recognizing the situation, much less doing anything about it." If this is true, how can we account for Trump's success after success. There must be some very determined nationalist patriots in the background helping Trump in all sorts of ways. This suggests that a great number of people recognoze the situation. This gives me hope. Moreover, Trump is slowly exposing the true unAmerican nature of our 5th column enemies. He is undoing the race and ethnic levers that the left has used time and again to divide founder stock Christian Americans from each other. I think that the key is our founder stock protestant anglo culture. I have a lot in common with an Appalachian hill billy and an American slave stock Negro. We are protestants, hearing the same sermons and singing the same hymns. We have the same long cultural connection to the same soil and place. I have a lot less connection with some metropolitan Jewish guy or with some urban ethnic Catholic, although with European Catholics, like the Irish and south Itallians, at least, we worship the same Christ. Finally, the internet and the efforts of blogger Brilliants like VD and many of their insightful commentators, are red pilling the ignorant. This too gives me hope.

Blogger Calvin809 July 27, 2019 9:32 AM  

MN has a huge population of warmer climate populations. Somalis, and the largest Hindu temple in the Midwest. My guess it's not for the Germans or Scandinavians.

Blogger Halvar Andersen July 27, 2019 9:37 AM  

Ransom Smith wrote:Is it advantageous to move to the more hostile climates of Wisconsin or Alaska?

See Minnesota, Maine and Sweden for why climate makes little difference.

As long as the Globalist Government supports the invasion, it'll come from and come to anywhere.


When the welfare spigot runs dry and they can no longer run the heat at 80 degrees year round, do they stay?

Blogger xevious2030 July 27, 2019 9:42 AM  

"is almost perfectly predictive"

Bingo.
Humanity itself, sometimes fuzzy. The very real influence of actual Satan, has been persistant since at least Eve. Figure the tendency of truth, the tendency of lie, in plans, and things become less mysterious. Not some figurative consideration of evil, but formally adherent to the very best source of the quality of evil.

Blogger wahr01 July 27, 2019 9:43 AM  

@25

Trump's entire life experience involves strategically navigating hostile bureaucratic rules in order to build big things.

The kind of structurally anti-American clown-world we currently have is based upon wrong-headed judicial rulings which will need challenge and overturn before anything beyond window dressing can be done.

This is why he ignored the house in 2018, focusing entirely on the Senate and ramming through as many judicial nominations as possible, and while he distracts everyone with his tweets he's very close to flipping the 9th circuit's ideological balance toward the right, among other districts and circuits.

Blogger Ransom Smith July 27, 2019 9:47 AM  

When the welfare spigot runs dry and they can no longer run the heat at 80 degrees year round, do they stay?
Of course they do.
Welfare was a limited factor when the waves of Mexicans and Central Americans started coming. A lot of Invaders will keep coming as long as they can and they can find work.
They don't live by our rules. They'll live five families in a single home and survive off low pay.

Blogger Carl B. July 27, 2019 9:49 AM  

It's to laugh. The cucked-ness of White males was thoroughly proved by their willingness to meekly march off to the slaughter in the World Wars, Korea, Viet Nam, and now the Middle East. Their utter apathy and weakness in the face of their "elected representatives" selling them down the river with illegal and "legal" immigration. Their retreating to drugs, alcohol, sportsball, and Disability/Welfare while the Ruling Class lived high on the hog all the while shipping the cuck's jobs overseas. The ever-increasing number of feminized White males meekly submitting to rule by women and homosexuals.

A "White Ethno-State you say? Yeah, right. The evidence suggests the White Race is doomed, a victim of suicide.

Blogger Margo July 27, 2019 9:57 AM  

So dictatorship pre-balkanization or dictatorships in post-american nation-states? The descendants of the Bolsheviks are practically running things now so I don't understand the point of them pushing for a revolution when they are in power.

Blogger Mystic On Main July 27, 2019 10:04 AM  

"Scenario (3) is a near-certainty simply because virtually no one who is even potentially on the side of the Christian Nationalists is currently capable of recognizing the situation, much less doing anything about it. And as Sun Tzu observes, those who know neither themselves nor their enemies almost always lose."

The other element here is that for #3 to occur there must also be what Unz describes as #1 ("Either there must be some large mass conversion of one side or the other (a ‘Road to Damascus’ conversion?), probably occasioned by some immense and earth-shaking event, war, depression, disaster")

What would that be? The election of a progressive (Sanders, Harris, Warren, etc)? Unlikely. No stomach. No economic incentive. Ideological certainty is unformed with the exception of a very small number.

Blogger Mystic On Main July 27, 2019 10:30 AM  

By the way, everyone wonders what kind of catalyst moves people to extremes in the current context of the United States. There is one catalyst that is on close to coming.

Trump is challenging a number of subpoenas. Those challenges are working their way through the courts. Trump is going to lose. The fact that he challenged them in the first plice is just a common legal delaying tactic. At some point an appeals court orders compliance with the subpoenas and/or the Supreme Court chooses not to grant cert to an appeal of a Circuit decision enforcing the subpoenas. Or the Supreme Court rules against Trump.

At that point, Trump is likely to defy the court(s). This does not happen in the U.S and it is quite simple to convince a majority of Americans and certainly members of congress that Trump's actions are extra-constitutional. It will lead to immediate impeachment hearings. The House will forward articles of impeachment to the Senate. It's not unlikely that he will be impeached on these grounds. Remember, Impeachment has nothing to do with the law other than the processes. It's a political process.

It's at this point when the Army of Trump will be most likely to "make a stand".

Blogger Sam July 27, 2019 10:50 AM  

@21
The formula doesn't work. Both of the new regimes were unstable both in military terms (they needed war to survive either for glory or for loot) and demographically (both were more blue pilled then the old regime).

You want to build something lasting you have to shoot the socialists- think Indonesia. Otherwise the rebuild when you have a moment of weakness and proceed to tear you down.

@34
Yeah, that is similar to Jim's take. Trump is going to have to take power- real power- in order to survive because otherwise the left is going to murder him. It is possible they will simply fold (Tony Abbott managed to pull off ignoring the courts in Australia) but there are no guarantees. Of course Trump has probably been insuring members of the military are loyal to him so if things do keep escalating he has the Trump card.

Blogger David Ray Milton July 27, 2019 10:53 AM  

Hope and pray for scenario 2.

Stock and prepare for scenario 3.

Blogger Nikolai Collushnikov July 27, 2019 10:57 AM  

The Democrats don't have the votes for impeachment, look at how the vote to start impeachment proceedings faired.

Blogger anorganicbear July 27, 2019 11:04 AM  

@31: The evidence suggests the White Race is doomed, a victim of suicide.

The Mexican government can't even root out the drug-running cartels. How will they successfully invade a unified Christian America?

Blogger jeffinjapan July 27, 2019 11:05 AM  

America has never been a part of Christiandom but only a rag tag of Christian sects.

Blogger Mystic On Main July 27, 2019 11:08 AM  

"The Democrats don't have the votes for impeachment, look at how the vote to start impeachment proceedings faired."

Correct. Right now. Things will change if the administration chose to ignore specific holdings of a Supreme Court decision.

Blogger Tino July 27, 2019 11:10 AM  

#34 Unlikely. I must take the opposite position. Most of the subpoenas are over personal matters that are not germane to any Executive function and would not be granted except under extreme circumstance. Some clearly violate Executive Privilege. He will actually win most. Also compared to the post-JFK criminals, the absolute scum of Clinton, Bush 41, Bush 43, Trump is as clean as the wind-driven snow. Unfortunately he is beholden to Israel via brokered debt for his enterprises and psychologically via Mossad-Jared. He is also fenced in by dual-passport holders all over the his Admin. Since the PTB will never again allow the President to be selected by the People, the Deep State is running out the clock on his Admin whether it be one or two terms. Post-Trump the march of the Deep State will resume, followed by the eventual denouement of the Nation as described by our Host. If Trump was a free actor, the Usual Suspects would have been in jail by now. Instead the whole cast of seditionists are still roaming free without an arrest in sight.

Blogger John Rockwell July 27, 2019 11:10 AM  

The real divide has always been the Kingdom of God vs the Kingdom of the God of this world Satan.

The far-left who are now telling others like them to arm themselves composed of all sorts of ethnic groups led by (((them))) and white leftists and the other the Kingdom of Christ also likewise composed various peoples working in parallel to each other directed by the holy spirit.

Blogger John Rockwell July 27, 2019 11:14 AM  

Ransom Smith wrote:When the welfare spigot runs dry and they can no longer run the heat at 80 degrees year round, do they stay?

Of course they do.

Welfare was a limited factor when the waves of Mexicans and Central Americans started coming. A lot of Invaders will keep coming as long as they can and they can find work.

They don't live by our rules. They'll live five families in a single home and survive off low pay.


But turning off the spigot will make them easier to deal with. Doing things that is equivalent to bombing german factories, infrastructure, cutting off supply lines, evaporating cash and arms as well as limiting recruitment all play a role.



Blogger Hammerli 280 July 27, 2019 11:20 AM  

@35 Sam: Not so. Both Bonaparte and Hitler were done in by getting overextended in wars. A more circumspect and less aggressive position would have served them better.

Blogger CS July 27, 2019 11:23 AM  

The "Christian" West will die due to its reproductive dysfunction. The fertility rate is far below the replacement rate, especially in the case of the more intelligent part of the population, whereas the progressive nation is continually expanded through immigration.

The only hope for the Euro-settler nation is to build a wall; outlaw abortion; encourage intelligent women to become mothers not doctors and engineers; provide large tax breaks for mothers, paid in cash for life, based on the income of both parents; discourage welfare breeding by making identification of fathers by DNA typing a condition of welfare payments to the mothers.

Blogger Joe Smith July 27, 2019 11:31 AM  

@Mark Stoval I bet a massive dose of actual reality will go a long way to curing whoever survives. By the time anyone left over is setting up new societies those white left wingers won't be so all-fired happy to welcome in the roving gangs that gang raped their wives.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd July 27, 2019 12:03 PM  

rumpole5 wrote:VD said: "virtually no one who is even potentially on the side of the Christian Nationalists is currently capable of recognizing the situation, much less doing anything about it." If this is true, how can we account for Trump's success after success.

Trump is nationalist, and may well be Christian. He's no Christian American Nationalist. Trump's whole focus is on maintaining the legitimacy of the current imperial system. The American nation is a much lower priority.

Mystic On Main wrote:At that point, Trump is likely to defy the court(s). This does not happen in the U.S and it is quite simple to convince a majority of Americans and certainly members of congress that Trump's actions are extra-constitutional.

It is quite easy to convince your fellow trotskyites - but they are not Americans.

Mystic On Main wrote:It's at this point when the Army of Trump will be most likely to "make a stand".

This is because your fellow trotskyites are not American.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd July 27, 2019 12:10 PM  

Tino wrote:#34 Unlikely. I must take the opposite position. Most of the subpoenas are over personal matters that are not germane to any Executive function and would not be granted except under extreme circumstance. Some clearly violate Executive Privilege. He will actually win most. Also compared to the post-JFK criminals, the absolute scum of Clinton, Bush 41, Bush 43, Trump is as clean as the wind-driven snow.

Because Trump is squeaky clean, losing the appeals and releasing his personal documents will help him more than hurt him. If he were ever to defy a court - and he almost surely won't - it will never be over that.

Trump's strategy is to spend most of his time in office taking over the judiciary branch. He's not going to curbstomp their legitimacy; he's trying to restore it.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd July 27, 2019 12:17 PM  

Kraemer wrote:Is it advantageous to move to the more hostile climates of Wisconsin or Alaska?

The poz has solid footholds in Alaska. The climate is a serious threat to Whites, and to Eskimos and Athabaskans. The Golden Hordes won't overrun you, but winter will. Agriculture here is different, too. If you didn't grow up here, you will need years to adapt.

Blogger Maniac July 27, 2019 12:38 PM  

"4. Christ is building His army right now and America will be restored to Christendom from sea to shining sea."

Nice thought, but no. VD is right - #3 will happen first.

Blogger Crush Limbraw July 27, 2019 12:53 PM  

Every summer, Ma and I travel the country in our old bus - from south to north and back, but stay west of the Mississippi. We purposely avoid any large cities, preferring to go around them, thus almost exclusively staying in small towns.
Traveling through those small towns in the north is almost like being back in Leave It To Beaver 50s or 60s - until we shop at Walmart. Seems like most White folks have adopted a ghetto culture and fat butts predominate the aisles.
Expecting them to become a force to fight the onslaught to come might be a stretch.

Blogger Stryker4570 July 27, 2019 12:54 PM  

A lot of speculation in this thread. I found this podcast helpful. Done by real military intelligence analysts with experience in 'failed states.' This link is an overview.
https://forwardobserver.com/fotv-civil-war-heres-the-truth-about-americas-future/

They also have a 5 part series called 'Breaking Down Civil War 2' that is excellent.

https://forwardobserver.com/breaking-down-civil-war-2-part-one/

Blogger Birdman July 27, 2019 2:18 PM  

Doubt

Blogger Birdman July 27, 2019 2:26 PM  

For now they're cursed

Blogger Birdman July 27, 2019 2:29 PM  

Well in indonesia for thirty years the gov under soeharto still purging the commie, even the people would kind of help them in a way, without the propaganda. Many bloodshed in 1960s no kidding but it's for the nation

Blogger Birdman July 27, 2019 2:30 PM  

Well just look at the state of america

Blogger Birdman July 27, 2019 2:30 PM  

Christendom*

Blogger DonReynolds July 27, 2019 2:41 PM  

Americans have never been One People, not even in the colonial period. Each colony, and later state, was different...had a different mix of people, history, geography, government, values and morality. Yes, there were times when the colonies/states went to "war" over territory and trade, long before the civil war. The civil war was a surprise to no one and had been threatened almost from the beginning, put off and delayed by several grand compromises over the decades that failed in the end.

The Founders of this Nation were keenly aware of the differences and they realized that only a weak Confederation or weak Federal system could work. They were not of one mind, so we had the Federalists promising a restrained government and the Anti-Federalists warning of the temptation of power and corruption. The states themselves had the same challenge and in the end created a legacy of weak executives and strong legislatures, which was consistent with Whig politics.

Short version....What is pulling the country apart today is the same thing that pulled apart the Mexican Republic, after their independence from Spain. Specifically....Central Government.

The differences from one colony/state to the next was only annoying in a weak federal system, because the states basically governed themselves and there was very little that rose to the Federal jurisdiction AND because the Federal government was relatively poor and underfunded. So it was not necessary for representatives of the states to agree to take Federal action on tranny toilet assignment in public schools, or gay marriage, or welfare programs, or education, or any one of a thousand different matters that have recently become a "Federal responsibility" or a "Federal matter".

Not only do the states still differ, but there are factions in the USA that insist that their own solutions be adopted by ALL the other states, whether they agree or not. The American Pluralism that was guaranteed by a weak federal system and an underfunded government has been destroyed by a Leftist tyranny that demands compliance by the other states. Not only do Leftists believe they are best or correct, but anyone who fails to agree (and comply) are cruel, evil, wrong, and immoral....all at the same time.

I simply do not see any good choices in the future, when the only political choices allowed is conversion to the faith, utter destruction or submission/ slavery. (The same choices left us by Islam.) There is no compromise solution. There is peaceful solution. There is no co-existence. Either we must partition and separate or we will both be partially or completely destroyed. There will be no winners and not many survivors.

Blogger DonReynolds July 27, 2019 2:47 PM  

Sorry......NO peaceful solutions.

Blogger Doktor Jeep July 27, 2019 3:59 PM  

I have long give up on trying to figure out when and how. With the preppers who come my way for firearms training there has been a long train of fat boomers operating on some notion that with enough "prep" they could live after some incident very close to the way they live now, complete with living close enough to a town so their equally obese wifey can still get her prescription meds. I get asked about how to do this or that as if this this or that that is the key to prevailing and once having found this out somehow they can switch their brains back into sheeple mode. This is a boomer trait, BTW, putting very high value into "being sublime". I don't see this as much in GenX. X'ers have a tendency to expect a shoe to drop. You tell a boomer how to do something with enough authority they accept it as truth and move on happily and ignorantly. An X'er never allows that much trust.

We have no way of knowing. And with that, no way of being prepared enough. There is only so much you can do.
Faith is in order here.

Besides, even if we could think-tank our way out of this by accurately predicting what, who, when, and how, the enemy will see this, and change their tactics and programs. I still meet people working on the "1990s model" of tyranny or perception thereof. Thankfully at least now people are starting to think of that which was not thought of in the 1990s: demography. And yes that's a big one.

It does not help that Conservative Inc distracted from it on purpose. Always look for the elephant in the room when the Judeo-Boomerviks are trying to say what is and what is not.

Now given that, the only thing I can accept is a Brawlers Attitude on the matter. Ever know a real brawler? These are people who can fight but never took a course in any fighting "art" or method. These are the people who never got a certification in face punching who will knock a black belt out in one punch simply because they have punched people before and know how. More importantly, they know how to take a punch without getting rattled. The lot of them can do it while drunk too, because they have.

In a macro conflict it's the same thing only what matters right now is regional. Some regions prevail for a long list of reasons, some will fail. Everything becomes a factor. Yes, even the climate. Some parts of America will not see one shot fired, others will be a total bloodbath. Some will be under the control of Christians, some will be under control of people who would make 1920s era communists fresh out of Leningrad nervous. Some will be under control of a Mao. Others will have a Pinochet.

So be a brawler about this. Expect to get punched in the face. Expect to punch back. Hope for the best. There's nothing else you can do.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash July 27, 2019 4:02 PM  

(((Bill Kristol))), Hugh Hewitt, (((Jonah Goldberg))), (((Rich Lowry))), (((Ben Shapiro))), (((the National Review crowd))) and various Republican (((types)))

If only there were some common thread we could use to find a predictive pattern here. Oh well.

Blogger justaguy July 27, 2019 4:41 PM  

Best guess: scenario #3 without the civil war-- just a harsh dictatorship backed by modern surveillance technology. No civil war, just violence on a level of the 1970s, but a more effective security state taking the dissenters down.

Just think, teachers talking to your kids and the FBI (the KGB for the Dems "z-man") show up. You kid said that you espoused bad think when yelling at the TV yesterday-- and off you go.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan July 27, 2019 4:47 PM  

Trump is twitter brawling with that idiot from Baltimore, of course the conservatives are stooging after being called "racist", ya know because reality is racist or some stupid crap or whatever Cultural Marxism means today.

The scum have villified white Americans with the political rhetoric "racist" for decades but Baltimore still sucks. It might just be me folks but I think the people who use such rhetoric are evil, crazy huh?

All the black pillers who are out there hating on Trump have done nothing to discredit the Left/Establishment's rhetoric, those black pillers truly are useless morons.

Blogger Robert What? July 27, 2019 4:51 PM  

Progressive America hate Heritage America with a flaming passion. But they will never peacefully allow Heritage America to break away, even though you'd think that Progressive America would celebrate it ("hooray, no more White people"). Why? Because Heritage America is the Host that the parasitical Progressive America feed off of. Parasites die without a Host. Progressive America know that and it makes their fury burn that much hotter.

Blogger Ariadne Umbrella July 27, 2019 4:58 PM  

The Reconquista started in one poor region next to one bloody independent minded region. Why does everyone think it will be a unified, expensive, all generational glide?

GenZyklon is more fascist, and more Christian, among white boys than GenX, because GenX is doing the seedwork, online,in what looks like frivolous outlets to Boomers. Who among the Boomers respects Milo? GenZyklon boys study his videos. They read Evola. I'm not sure why, but they do. I thought it was a joke, but I've seen boys who aren't old enough to drink read Marcus Aurelius and Evola, and debate with each other.

I do thought experiments, but I don't know enough to make good predictions. But, say, get rid of liberal white women Boomers- literally the most expensive women in history to the public fisc. They are dying off. After that, what excuse do you have to keep black men around? They pay into Social Security, but they don't collect- they die at 63, on average.

Then add, say, bankrupt newspapers and failing news stations: does the peculiar Jewish affection for criminal blacks continue to keep black crime out of peoples' thoughts? When half the black women have an incurable sexually transmitted disease by age 20, do we actually continue to fund mitigants, or do they just die off in pain and misery? We already don't extend enough care to keep them from being raped by diseased pedophiles.

The thought-crime stats that will get you bounced off the internet are the black crime stats from the FBI, the black disease rates, again courtesy of a government agency, and any public engagement highlighting their ignorance and illiteracy. Which suggests that TPTB know that these are things that end the blacks in America experiment.

If you look at the work Mr Unz does, does anyone think that Jews will be allowed to remain at large in the general united states area?

Any competent white man I've met will eventually tell me how his job can wreak destruction on society. Then he will explain why he doesn't do this- why he builds. That's a lot of Ragnarok agency that other races don't seem to harbor within themselves. Grocery store clerks, even. Plastic bags, cheese slicers, box cutters- that's just a grocery store. Now add everyone else, everywhere else.

Blogger Damelon Brinn July 27, 2019 4:59 PM  

When the welfare spigot runs dry and they can no longer run the heat at 80 degrees year round, do they stay?

Yes. They came here because someone put them on a plane and others met them at the plane and set them up with apartments and gibs. No one's going to do that in reverse, and it's not possible anyway, Africa being Africa. Shivering in Minnesota is still better than living in most of Africa, and Minnesotans being Minnesotans, they'll keep the heat on for the poor as long as possible. Plus, why would the welfare spigot run dry? They can always print more money. Isn't that what countries usually do?

Our side has too many "...and they'll just go back" fantasies, as if there's some easy trick we can do to make them all choose to go home peacefully. Self-deportation is a real thing and should be encouraged as much as possible, but it won't solve the problem. It will also be least effective on the least desirable ones: the diseased, the drug/human traffickers, the conquerors. Many of them now, from multiple continents, think they're close to a tipping point: if they swarm and hold out a little longer, they can break America open like a pinata and divvy up the goodies amongst themeselves. They won't be put off by a bit of cold now.

Blogger Mark Stoval July 27, 2019 5:09 PM  

"A dying culture invariably exhibits personal rudeness. Bad manners. Lack of consideration for others in minor matters. A loss of politeness, of gentle manners, is more significant than is a riot." - Robert A. Heinlein

The USA passed that threshold decades ago. The USA is done -- stick a fork in her.

Blogger Ransom Smith July 27, 2019 5:31 PM  

But turning off the spigot will make them easier to deal with.
No it won't. Not if welfare is the only thing eliminated.
Welfare isn't why the Second wave came, and it isn't why the waves after have come either.
It's for work, security, and to leave awful countries behind.
They'll keep coming and keep coming until someone sends them back or the burden becomes too heavy that the camel breaks.
You seriously can't fix the mess at this point unless you're willing to do painful labor, or set it all ablaze.

Blogger Quintus Maximus July 27, 2019 6:00 PM  

Exactly. David Hackett Fischer’s “Albion’s Seed is the reference tome on this matter and I highly recommended ppl who really want to have a better understanding of the 4 or so rather distinct groups that made up the various “parts” of the US (some states had much more in common with each other than others and that’s still tie even now. The regional traditions have held true until somewhat recently.)

Blogger xevious2030 July 27, 2019 7:14 PM  

"the enemy will see this, and change their tactics and programs"

The influence they abide by has had a copy of the playback ever since Revelation was penned. He will follow it relentlessly, as shall his. It is the reprobate mind, it is not entirely sensical.

Blogger Stephen July 27, 2019 7:21 PM  

@65
Who among the Boomers respects Milo?...
Boomer raises his hand.
...but I've seen boys who aren't old enough to drink read Marcus Aurelius and Evola, and debate with each other.
I've seen similar. Love 'em.
I must say reading on here has alerted me that if/when SHTF I'll be keeping a weather eye on GenXers along with the usual suspects. BTW I don't need a cynical Xer to inform me from which end of the tube the projectile exits.
...liberal white women Boomers- literally the most expensive women in history to the public fisc.
Amen.
Any competent white man I've met will eventually tell me how his job can wreak destruction on society. Then he will explain why he doesn't do this- why he builds.
Amen. And my type of Boomer has fortified personal spaces.
I've no clue which of the above discussed scenarios will unfold. All any of us can do is to live righteously until that day. If it comes to it, go down swinging.
Zoomers do seem the best generational hope.

Blogger CM July 28, 2019 12:07 AM  

Does Daniel's statue need to apply to one specific nation or can it stand for any that mixes iron with clay?

Blogger jeffinjapan July 28, 2019 1:51 AM  

Thanks Birdman! Can’t blame that on a typo :)

Blogger weka July 28, 2019 2:14 AM  

It is not the welfare spigot being turned off. It is the riots that will happen when (not if) the welfare state goes bankrupt.

And the SWPL liberal enclaves go full Mogadishu. If you can, get out of these towns yesterday.

Blogger Toris July 28, 2019 3:34 AM  

"...the Democrat-Republican divide. But the Christian Nationalist vs Judeo-Christian Globalist model..."

Re: fake divides 'Judeo-Christian Globalist' has a nice ring to it. How many elections have followed the 100-yr-prior-to-Trump Wilson vs Hughes fixed bout. In the blue corner, weighing in on issues with deception, and the undisputed champion of the World-Order, Woooodrow Wiilsooon. In the blue corner, weighing in on not much at all and undisputed champion of the World Brotherhood (NCCJ), Chaarles Evaans, Huuughes.

Blogger Valley Forge Patriot July 28, 2019 10:10 AM  

Sokath - his eyes uncovered!!!!

Blogger Avalanche July 28, 2019 1:18 PM  

@30 "do they stay?
Of course they do.
Welfare was a limited factor when the waves of Mexicans and Central Americans started coming."

Typical wrong-think: "if we quit giving them welfare; they'll leave." No, they won't, because even living 'rough' under a bridge in AMERICA is better than anything in their 3rd world shitholes. If you're going to beg for money -- go to the RICH neighborhood, not the ghetto. If you want to get good quality, barely worn clothing for cheap, go to Goodwill in the RICH area; not the clothing bin in the poorhouse.

Almost no one will leave if welfare ends... They may have to move into the streets: how many thousands are already living in the streets?! Or they may just be able to eke out a living by begging the local White folks to "help a fellah out, wou'jah?" Or just thievery and grift. We've got a ton of THAT too!

Blogger Avalanche July 28, 2019 1:24 PM  

@32 "I don't understand the point of them pushing for a revolution when they are in power."

Because it's "who they are." They ALWAYS go too far -- whether in the skin suit of left or right, globalist or nationalist, rural or cosmopolitan, commie or nationalist, Christian or other. It's not real, it's a method, not a choice.

A person with a pathology HAS to act out that pathology. Doesn't matter how clearly he sees -- or doesn't see -- how his pathology destroys his life and the lives of folks around him, he MUST act out that pathology.

110th country comin' up: nice round number, innit?

Blogger OneWingedShark July 29, 2019 11:29 AM  

BastionHarm wrote:The USA is presently facing its own October Revolution right now, one that has been decades in the making. And many of those seeking to complete the destruction of Christian America and rule over a USSA are the literal descendants, intellectually, ideologically, and genetically, of the very Bolsheviks who subjected Christian Russia and Christian Ukraine to 70 years of persecution and suffering.
As my Orthodox brothers-in-Christ are wont to say: What started in Russia will end in America.

I think many Russians realize that the US is being taken over by "Americans" in just the same way that Russia was taken over by "Russians".

wahr01 wrote:Hammerli 280 wrote:The Populist Right and Center-Left are not diametrically opposed. Many of us on the Right are more concerned with cultural issues than with economics. Likewise, the Center-Left is concerned with economics (in particular, welfares), but doesn't care about the culture. Only the Rabid Left wants to control EVERYTHING.

Which makes it possible to form a coalition against the Rabids.

It's increasingly becoming clear this is a necessity rather than a possibility, because those who hold political power and office on the nominal right are lolbertarian ideologues who refuse utterly to reign in openly treasonous corporations.

Companies like Google and Twitter who openly aid the west's geopolitical enemies both militarily and through censorship will never be held to account by parties like the GOP without a complete gutting.

I'd like to further note how close America came to this alliance in 2010. Occupy and The Tea Party were very close to reaching an understanding that many fundamental grievances were one and the same before a massive, official divide & conquer intel op was launched against both movements.

This is a great insight. There's a lot of things that are uniting factors among Americans more than dividing factors: for example, the notion of Justice. Virtually all the real US Democrats and real US Republicans would be in favor of investigating and punishing [fairly harshly, even] the voter-fraud that's been rampant for decades. Trump used this to good effect with "Drain the Swamp". And even the school system does its utmost to taint and twist this deep desire to destructive ends: that of the Social Justice Warrior.

Avalanche wrote:110th country comin' up: nice round number, innit?
Yes, but I prefer Tolkien's Eleventy-One.

Anonymous Anonymous July 29, 2019 2:30 PM  

Thank you, Vox, for recognizing that there is a separate Ukrainian identity, gene pool, culture and language. Lviv and perhaps Kyiv are Ukrainian (the war is still being fought for Kyiv). Kharkov, Odessa, Dnepr and Donetsk are Russian.

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