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Tuesday, June 18, 2013

Ideological cleansing

In much the same way Sami Abu Al-Ala was recently calling for ethnically cleansing Egypt of Jews, a pinkshirt by the name of Amal El-Mohtar was calling for the ideological cleansing of SFWA the other day.  She appears to find me insufficiently enthusiastic about the equalitarian jihad and is obviously hoping to make use of Twittergate in order to expel me from the organization   I didn't bother responding to her call initially, since El-Mohtar's opinion is no more important to me than Al-Ala's.

What was amusing about the post with which she followed up that call, however, was the shock and dismay it reveals about her discovery that many sane and intelligent individuals actually tend to agree with me rather than with the fascist pinkshirts of the SFWA.  A number of my critics quite clearly do not recognize how the numbers line up; they're still babbling about the problem of giving me "a platform" and clearly failing to recognize that I already have a much bigger platform than most of my outspoken critics.  For all that the pinkshirts are desperately trying to pretend something else is at stake, this is a very clear test of where one stands on the freedom of speech and expression.

Anyhow, this brave pinkshirt is feeling drained and wearied and constrained in her speech and expression by the fact that people actually disagree with her about "the horrors" of my opinion, despite the fact that I paid her no attention at all.  So, clearly, that is a situation that requires rectifying:
There are roughly seven thousand things I would rather be talking about right now, but nevertheless. This is very important to me.

On Wednesday I called for the expulsion of Theodore Beale, aka Vox Day, from SFWA. The reasons and proposed methodology are detailed in the link. In brief, he very obviously, knowingly, and deliberately broke the rules over what kind of posts could be tagged for inclusion in SFWA's promotional Twitter feed by posting a racist attack on N. K. Jemisin. This is not a one-time occurence, but part of a pattern of behaviour that shows malicious contempt for the organization as a whole.

While the vast majority of responses -- through pingbacks on the post, in e-mail, over Twitter -- have been positive and supportive, over the last few days I have seen the following in various places on the internet:

- people refusing to acknowledge that there was anything racist or misogynistic about Beale's post
- people wringing their hands over how we shouldn't ban people from organizations for their opinions (when that is not the argument I am making)
- people saying we should just ignore him -- that banning him from the Twitter feed is enough of a reprimand
- people being more outraged at the idea that I would call Beale's post racist than at the fact that he called a black woman "an ignorant half-savage" who couldn't possibly be "fully civilized" on account of her ethnic heritage.

I have also seen people belligerently questioning or deriding my command of the English language, my religion, my ethnicity, and my nationality, as a consequence of having made that post.
I would be remiss if I failed to note that like NK Jemisin before her, El-Mohtar is lying about me.  I did not deliberately break the rules concerning the Twitter feed, I simply forgot them.  Nor do I have contempt for the entire organization, as my contempt is reserved for the current set of SFWA officers who are steering the organization into self-parody and complete irrelevance, as well as for the pinkshirts, who are mostly relatively new and unaccomplished members attempting to ideologically cleanse the organization of dissenting opinions.

UPDATE: Since I hadn't read the woman's entire first post, I didn't realize quite how cognititively handicapable she is.  Check out her bolding-for-emphasis:
Marking blog posts for inclusion that include threats or personal attacks or obvious trolling will also be grounds for removal. (Emphasis mine.)
The woman obviously doesn't realize that "removal" does not mean "expulsion from the organization", but rather, "removal of the offending blog from the Twitter feed".  Which, you will note, has already taken place.

El-Moron also lies again when she claims that I have "repeatedly and aggressively used SFWA platforms to broadcast and disseminate these views with obvious malicious intent."  I used the Twitter feed once.  Ever.  And I never used any "SFWA platform", because the Twitterfeed guidelines clearly state: "While SFWA does maintain the @sfwaauthors Twitter feed for the benefit of its members, ultimately the posts that appear in the feed are the responsibility of the authors of those posts, and are in no way endorsed by SFWA, nor do such posts reflect the opinions or policy of SFWA."   It's not as if I spoke as an officer of the organization, hijacked the SFWA Twitter account, posted anything on the SFWA web site or published an article in the SFWA Bulletin.

Finally, she doesn't so much lie as display outright neuroticism by claiming "This last reads to me very much like a threat, especially coming from a white man to a black woman in a country where public lynchings are a matter of living memory."

This last bit certainly helps explain why people have been deriding El-Moron's command of the English language. First, it's obviously not a threat.  I'm the only one who has actually, and repeatedly, been threatened here. Second, Jemisin made her speech in Australia.  Third, I live in Europe, not in the Americas.

Let rhetoric be silent when the readily observable facts gainsay its blather.

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141 Comments:

Anonymous DrTorch June 18, 2013 1:07 PM  

So 7001 things are "very important" to her. She does lack the command of the English language necessary to be an effective writer. Of course her grammar is just as much proof of that.

Anonymous MrGreenMan June 18, 2013 1:12 PM  

It does seem like a lack of a grasp of the English language.

The "half-savage" remark was clearly most directly linked in her screen shot to the idea that Jemisin had not respect for what was or was not factually true. Respect for truth and the realization that falsehoods are, well, false, is one of the foundation stones of civilization.

The other one it is clearly linked to is a respect for what built what one inherits. Similarly, since Jemisin has an a-historical view of things, and wants to purge anything that isn't from the neo-Marxist politically correct bubble world she strongly hopes for with all her furry heart's might, she has the anti-civilization bent of every communist who has dreamed of first destroying civilization to then recreate it, with him at the top of the heap calling the shots, of course.

I think they have no idea how to respond to somebody providing unvarnished opinions that doesn't immediately genuflect like they are taught all guilty white liberals will immediately do after the right code words are spoken by the race hustlers.

Anonymous MrGreenMan June 18, 2013 1:15 PM  

I did not know that Italy has a history of public lynchings of blacks in living memory??

Anonymous Jack Amok June 18, 2013 1:19 PM  

people wringing their hands over how we shouldn't ban people from organizations for their opinions (when that is not the argument I am making)

So, what was the argument she was making? Why did she think you should be chucked out of the club? Some possibilities come to mind.

She thinks you should be booted because:

1 - you're skin is the wrong color.
2 - you have a penis and claim to know how to use it.
3 - you are over 40?
4 - you aren't gay
5 - you're married
6 - you are one of those horrid "breeders"
7 - you are the wrong religion
8 - you refuse to pose with Scalzi and that other idiot wearing women's clothing
9 - you don't write wereseal fiction (SFWA standing for Society of Feminist Wereseal Authors)


hmmmm, could be any of those I suppose. Perhaps she can clarify...

Anonymous anon123 June 18, 2013 1:20 PM  

Well, don't too hard on her. Poor dear has about seven thousand things on her mind, all important. This must be a record for female multitasking.

Anonymous Vidad June 18, 2013 1:24 PM  

"If you're havin' rabbit problems I feel bad for you, hon,
I got 7000 problems but Vox ain't one."

Blogger Bike Bubba June 18, 2013 1:26 PM  

Let me get this straight; someone with an Arabic name is going to SWFA to attack you because of sexism.

But does not change their name to separate herself (himself?) from that area's horrific crimes against women like honor killings, honor rapes (???how does that work?), polygamy, the harem system, and the like.

Sometimes reality is a parody, I think.

Anonymous RINO June 18, 2013 1:28 PM  

"Jihad"? "such an individual"? So raciss.

Blogger Nate June 18, 2013 1:34 PM  

MINDHURT! FEELBAD! ALSO CRUEL!!!

Anonymous Inane Rambler June 18, 2013 1:37 PM  

She wants to kick you out over a minor transgression, over a technicality.

If something that minor is grounds for dismissal, then she's a liar if she says it's not motivated by your opinions. If you broke the rules and were a willing equalitarian, there would be no calls for your dismissal.

Rabbits are really bad at hiding their true intentions.

Blogger Old Harry June 18, 2013 1:38 PM  

@Bike Bubba, I recently resigned from an engineering position with a major chemical company. While there, I would receive weekly pleas to sign the LGBT non discrimination pledge. I didn't want to because of the hate speech clause and it appeared that we could be reprimanded for speech away from work.
This same inclusive company has partnered with the Saudi government and is having a difficult time explaining to the LGBT staff why they're not allowed in the Saudi Kingdom and why the company would dare to partner with such a repressive regime. I think we've just about reached the bursting point for the inclusive bubble.

Anonymous Leatherwing June 18, 2013 1:40 PM  

From her original post:
While it is my personal feeling that the hateful, harmful, dehumanizing views expressed by Beale on his blog (about women, about religious and ethnic groups to which he does not belong, about queer people) would be “good and sufficient cause” enough to not share an organisation with him

Since she is voluntarily a member and feels this way, shouldn't she just quit. You know, to keep from sharing an organization with him?

Anonymous Dale Carnegie June 18, 2013 1:40 PM  

Vox obviously never read How to Win Friends and Influence People.

Anonymous Amanjaw Marc*ntte June 18, 2013 1:42 PM  

Why so Anal, Amal?

Anonymous Ahorselovertoo@charter.net June 18, 2013 1:49 PM  

She needs to get a life.

Anonymous George Costanza June 18, 2013 1:51 PM  

Tim Hall is "be-bopping and scatting" all over you on Twitter...

‏@Kalyr As far as I'm concerned, anyone who thinks Vox Day isn't a problem is actually part of the problem themselves.
https://twitter.com/Kalyr/status/346969629844983808

Anonymous hvitar flykrur June 18, 2013 1:52 PM  

> But does not change their name to separate herself (himself?) from that area's horrific crimes against women like honor killings, honor rapes (???how does that work?), polygamy, the harem system, and the like.

OT: honor killings, now there's a topic which will cause cognitive dissonance in a leftist. They all agree (quite rightly) that honor killings are bad, but they cannot admit that the vast, vast, vast majority of perpetrators are muslims (because, ah, muslims are good). In the recent(ish) debate over honor killings in Sweden, it was claimed many times that honor killings are a problem among ethnic Swedes. This is of course completely absurd.

Anonymous kh123 June 18, 2013 1:55 PM  

"about queer people"

Given what the term "queer" actually and historically means, she does realize that this is the equivalent of calling ghetto blacks "niggers".

Blogger IM2L844 June 18, 2013 1:58 PM  

Vox obviously never read How to Win Friends and Influence People.

It's likely he didn't get past the part that recommends you be really interested in the really uninteresting things really uninteresting people have to say.

Anonymous Flummoxed With Rage June 18, 2013 1:58 PM  

Curse you, Vox Day. My rage quota is being depleted.
It feels more like minor annoyance now.

Anonymous Joe Doakes June 18, 2013 1:59 PM  

So, did you actually get kicked out, or not yet?

Are you hoping to? Is this a Groucho Marx thing?

Anonymous bub June 18, 2013 1:59 PM  

This is a matter up with which you should not put.

Anonymous the bandit June 18, 2013 2:02 PM  

These characters missed their true calling in performance art. Or maybe it just takes a true [cruelty] artist to set the stage for them.

Anonymous Amanjaw Marc*ntte June 18, 2013 2:03 PM  

@George Costanza

"As far as I'm concerned, anyone who thinks Vox Day isn't a problem is actually part of the problem themselves."

As it was with your namesake, opposite George = success.

And seeing Mz Amal's pick inspires another Seinfeld reference: "You're as pretty as any of them. You just need a nosejob."

Anonymous kh123 June 18, 2013 2:04 PM  

Pretty sure he's quoting Tim Hall.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 2:04 PM  

Tim Hall is "be-bopping and scatting" all over you on Twitter...

Ah, the famously formidable Tim Hall. Clearly I shall be forced to immediately reconsider all of my opinions.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 2:05 PM  

So, did you actually get kicked out, or not yet?

Not to my knowledge.

Anonymous Hmm June 18, 2013 2:06 PM  

Why do you want to belong to an idiotic fascist group run by fools who are steering the organization into self-parody and complete irrelevance?

Blogger HMS Defiant June 18, 2013 2:06 PM  

I read what a few of those haters had to say over at the want to be expeller's blog post and they all sound a lot like Bradbury's firemen. Very keen to burn out heretics or anybody who speaks his mind.

Anonymous Profit June 18, 2013 2:07 PM  

The amount of stupidity which comes from the SWFA membership is at times so awe-inspiring that I wonder how Vox can stand to be associated with the organization. Ah well... I suppose they at least provide some entertainment.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 2:07 PM  

Why do you want to belong to an idiotic fascist group run by fools who are steering the organization into self-parody and complete irrelevance?

I want to continue to enjoy the many material benefits provided to me through my membership in a professional science fiction writers association.

Anonymous dh June 18, 2013 2:11 PM  

I want to continue to enjoy the many material benefits provided to me through my membership in a professional science fiction writers association.

LOL. This is great.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 2:12 PM  

You can start commenting again as soon as you demonstrate that you can produce something besides ignorant and reflexive anklebiting, Obvious. It didn't escape anyone's attention how you fell silent and didn't admit that you were wrong when I referenced the information about the introduction of 16-bit color and dynamic lighting models.

If you can't bring anything original to the table, no one is interested in what you have to say.

Anonymous Obvious June 18, 2013 2:12 PM  

Really?

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 2:14 PM  

Why is Geddy Lee her avatar?

Blogger James Dixon June 18, 2013 2:14 PM  

> I want to continue to enjoy the many material benefits provided to me through my membership in a professional science fiction writers association.

So when will you be joining one?

Anonymous Salt June 18, 2013 2:17 PM  

SFWA is a great club to beat them over the head with.

Anonymous Noah B. June 18, 2013 2:18 PM  

Makes sense to me. The opportunity to promote new literary works and games, the access that it provides to other established writers... I would imagine that the net present value of your SFWA membership must be on the order of several million euros.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 2:18 PM  

Yes, really. If you're just going to ignorantly snap at ankles, you're not going to be allowed to participate. Take a position, for crying out loud. Stand up for what you believe, don't just yap in reflexive response to things about which you know nothing.

Look at DH. He probably agrees with me about as much as you do. But he has a lot more to say than simply offering snarky negativity.

There is nothing wrong with disagreeing. Or being wrong. But for the love of all that is left and right, don't be so bloody tedious. And it wouldn't hurt if you'd drop the passive-aggressiveness either. It doesn't make your arguments convincing, it makes them sound like they're coming from a petulant teenage girl.

Anonymous Amanjaw Marc*ntte June 18, 2013 2:18 PM  

@kh123
"Pretty sure he's quoting Tim Hall."

Whoops, sorry forum-GC.

Anonymous demonl June 18, 2013 2:23 PM  

Time to have a debate on the equality gospel, the truth or a horrible lie?

Anonymous kh123 June 18, 2013 2:26 PM  

Ah, Livejournal. The transgendered hair salon of blogs.

Just as they likely advocate gun control, the combination of Italian and barbershop should be kept as far from them as possible. Not that the gun, Italian, or shop is the danger, rather the complete lack of control and higher functions that entail with SWPL coming in contact with. It's for their own safety; rabbits have hutches after all.

Anonymous Andy June 18, 2013 2:26 PM  

How come she never gets upset about all the blacks killed by blacks in the US every year which dwarf the numbers lynched by whitey within living memory......?

Oh silly me.

Anonymous dh June 18, 2013 2:27 PM  

Makes sense to me. The opportunity to promote new literary works and games, the access that it provides to other established writers... I would imagine that the net present value of your SFWA membership must be on the order of several million euros.

At least. In fact, with First Sword and other projects upcoming, it could be tens of million.

Anonymous Noah B. June 18, 2013 2:31 PM  

"At least. In fact, with First Sword and other projects upcoming, it could be tens of million."

I was trying to be conservative, but you could easily be right. You'd really need several international accounting and tax law experts to help figure it all out.

Anonymous RINO June 18, 2013 2:31 PM  

In much the same way Sami Abu Al-Ala was recently calling for ethnically cleansing Egypt of Jews ..."

My goodness, the zingers keep magically appearing in this post.

How come she never gets upset about all the blacks killed by blacks in the US every year which dwarf the numbers lynched by whitey within living memory......?

Or the massive amount of blacks and females that get aborted, etc. But look at the sheer amount of time and words that they've taken for this atrocity. Vox is worse than abortion.

Anonymous DrTorch June 18, 2013 2:32 PM  

I want to continue to enjoy the many material benefits provided to me through my membership in a professional science fiction writers association.

I'm guessing an MBNA Master Card and discounted auto insurance through Liberty Mutual.

Anonymous Anonagain June 18, 2013 2:36 PM  

The more they screech, the more I hate them.

Anonymous The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 2:36 PM  

Semi-related: many of the comments to her post said "Hugs.". This made me wonder: do any other women besides me hate promiscuous hugging? My feeling is, unless you're my doctor, a blood relative, or we wouldn't mind having kids with each other, keep your hands to yourself, thank you, and I'll do likewise.

Anonymous Salt June 18, 2013 2:37 PM  

I'm sure the wabbits of the warren would posit that in some SF/F world, being of actual truth, somewhere, Rome arrived in Germania and Britain to find flourishing cultures replete with running water, roads and equalitarian laws.

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 2:39 PM  

How come she never gets upset about all the blacks killed by blacks in the US every year which dwarf the numbers lynched by whitey within living memory......?

Because she's in Glasgow.

Anonymous OneFiver June 18, 2013 2:41 PM  

I bear witness. *hugs*

Anonymous Still Obvious June 18, 2013 2:42 PM  

Did you need me to admit that I was wrong about "dynamic lighting models"? Is that really what this is about? Or is it about the fact that you don't like the fact that someone has the temerity to call you out on things, that you don't have any answers for? If you have answers for them, why would you delete my comments and make passive-aggressive statements on how I can comment again when I can behave better? Didn't you just recently complain in a blog post about your posts in the SFWA forum being deleted? It's a travesty when it happens to you and just when you do it, huh?

Come on. You're a super genius and you're letting a rabbit get to you?

Anonymous jack June 18, 2013 2:42 PM  

Joe Doakes June 18, 2013 1:59 PM

So, did you actually get kicked out, or not yet?

Are you hoping to? Is this a Groucho Marx thing?

With the wording of some Vox replies I suspect this whole thing is strategy. In Throne Corvus is the Stratisger; his primary legion commander is a master tactician who fully understands he is not the best at strategy.
The Strategy: Perform an ethnic cleansing upon the organization known as the SFWA. Standing upon the desolate field of battle with the carrion birds circling overhead, finalize the long range plans to reinvigorate an organization dedicated to the resurrection of real and meaningful [or, at least enjoyable] science fiction and fantasy. Be prepared to pull into the fold of the new organization the best of the old SFWA [however few they may be]. One of the anchors of this is Alpinwolf.
Gloat some. Have some expensive and artistically interesting mixed drinks at the local version of pub and eatery facing onto the Med. Contemplate the next battles and enjoy the accolades of the Ilk and others.
Did I miss anything here?

Anonymous Josh June 18, 2013 2:43 PM  

Wait...

People still use livejournal?

Anonymous CunningDove June 18, 2013 2:43 PM  

The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 2:36 PM
This made me wonder: do any other women besides me hate promiscuous hugging?


Yes, the promiscuous hugging does tend to grate on my nerves also.

Anonymous Josh June 18, 2013 2:44 PM  

I bear witness. *hugs*

Oh hell, next thing you know there's going to be hair braidings.

Bane wept

Blogger Lovekraft June 18, 2013 2:45 PM  

Until an effective deterrent is made against scurrilous accusations by the cockroaches, such as severe financial penalties, they will just continue. If and when these are implemented, they will either find the money from 'secret benefactors', or amp up their attacks.

What must happen is that the MHR movement enact a sufficient neutralizing force to push back so that progressives are left with eating their own (much like those cockroaches).

Anonymous jack June 18, 2013 2:45 PM  

@ The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 2:36 PM

Semi-related: many of the comments to her post said "Hugs.". This made me wonder: do any other women besides me hate promiscuous hugging? My feeling is, unless you're my doctor, a blood relative, or we wouldn't mind having kids with each other, keep your hands to yourself, thank you, and I'll do likewise.

Wonderful! This may be the blog post winner today.

Anonymous The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 2:52 PM  

AND a clothes and shoe swap! Followed by a potluck and a chick flick.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 2:53 PM  

Did you need me to admit that I was wrong about "dynamic lighting models"?

Need you to? Not at all. Indeed, I'm pleased we had that discussion as it helped me find something I'll post tomorrow. But it speaks to your weak character and lack of seriousness that you would leap in, comment repeatedly, and then fall silent the moment your errors were proven to you and everyone else. If you want to be a better, more substantive critic, that's great. If you're determined to remain a reflexive anklebiter, go somewhere else because it's too boring.


Is that really what this is about? Or is it about the fact that you don't like the fact that someone has the temerity to call you out on things, that you don't have any answers for?

Yes. Come on, surely you've been around enough to know how foolish it is to assume that because I'm not interested, I don't have an answer.

If you have answers for them, why would you delete my comments and make passive-aggressive statements on how I can comment again when I can behave better?

What part of "tedious" do you not understand? Your habitual approach isn't difficult to deal with, it's just repetitive and boring. I've seen it for ten years here. I'm not interested in it.

Didn't you just recently complain in a blog post about your posts in the SFWA forum being deleted? It's a travesty when it happens to you and just when you do it, huh?

It is when the moderator is permitting direct attacks on an individual but no defenses by him. Even you will admit, I think, that I've always permitted you to defend yourself here.

Anonymous AmyJ June 18, 2013 2:55 PM  

@next to last samurai: you are not the only one who hates promiscuous hugging. No touching!

Anonymous The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 2:55 PM  

I think what you two need is *hugs*

Anonymous Stickwick June 18, 2013 2:57 PM  

This made me wonder: do any other women besides me hate promiscuous hugging?

It bugs me, too. Even European-style air kisses are less annoying than the hugging epidemic.

Anonymous ___ June 18, 2013 2:57 PM  

Oppression of Irishmen is within living memory. Why is there no outcry for our irish brothers?

Blogger The Aardvark June 18, 2013 3:01 PM  

"Vox is worse than abortion."

This runs a close second.

Anonymous CunningDove June 18, 2013 3:01 PM  

The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 2:55 PM
I think what you two need is *hugs*

lol...

Be careful round these parts as promiscuous hugging could find you with a weapon between you & the object of your intended hug... Personal Space.... is in enforceable right.

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 3:02 PM  

Semi-related: many of the comments to her post said "Hugs.". This made me wonder: do any other women besides me hate promiscuous hugging? My feeling is, unless you're my doctor, a blood relative, or we wouldn't mind having kids with each other, keep your hands to yourself, thank you, and I'll do likewise.

You don't understand. The people offering hugs to her are her psychiatrists, her family and the ideas that they share are their children.

So, she accepts hugs on the same grounds you do. She just has a more open minded dictionary of terms.

OT: Rio nuking itself for soccer is not normally news, but this looks like something a little bigger than normal, only judging by the pictures. They keep saying tens of thousands. From what I can tell (again just from the photos - I'm not down there right now thank goodness), I'm looking at a quarter million people, or so.

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 3:08 PM  

Yes, hugs. We can read the comments at Geddy Lee's original site. The redundancy is redundant.

Anonymous hugs June 18, 2013 3:10 PM  

" We can read the comments at Geddy Lee's original site. The redundancy is redundant."

you should be thanking me for digging out the choice comments. the damage to my eyeballs from doing this was substantial.

hugs, daniel, hugs.

Anonymous CunningDove June 18, 2013 3:12 PM  

Josh June 18, 2013 2:44 PM
I bear witness. *hugs*

Oh hell, next thing you know there's going to be hair braidings.

Bane wept


Since Bane has already been invoked... I can't help but laugh. I know he would be having a ball with this. Something about stirring up the warren just for the pure humor it would afford him.

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 3:14 PM  

Well, considering the whitewashing these types do, I suppose it is a good thing that we have something as permanent and archivable as Vox's comment system to hold onto the memories of their heartfelt idiocy forever.

Which reminds me...

Bane R.I.P.

Anonymous Onefiver June 18, 2013 3:21 PM  

OT: Why do women make less?

http://youtu.be/TlgqWeuhJj4

Complete mystery...

Anonymous hugs June 18, 2013 3:21 PM  

Vox:

What do you think about their attempts to deport and/or gag you?

https://twitter.com/KariSperring/status/347053440779816960

PS: hugs!

Anonymous The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 3:27 PM  

The Huggathon is on!

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 3:27 PM  

Hugs, don't post their comments here. People can go read them there if they want.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 3:28 PM  

What do you think about their attempts to deport and/or gag you?

I think they are unsurprising. And irrelevant.

Anonymous Robert in Arabia June 18, 2013 3:29 PM  

Fascist should never be used as a term of opprobrium.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 3:32 PM  

There's nothing quite so breezy as anti-racist, anti-sexists who obsessively write about what typical racists and sexists white men are.

We're talking about people who can read "1984," but not quite figure it out.

And here's Auntie N.K.:

Oh, Australia, I am taking my life into my hands by coming to a place that is "not a safe country for people of color," unlike noble Chicago.

Although you Aussies are today less savage and uncivilized white supremacist racists, this extremely dangerous country has "still got a long way to go," cuz you were worse than America "even in the depths of the Jim Crow era."

Australia is "trying to become safer," and less savage, which "will never happen in my country. Not in my lifetime, at least," because America is working to "solidify a permanent underclass." To sum it up, you Aussies are only half the savage white supremacist racists you used to be, though worse than America ever was. I don't know math or even what magic alchemy created the bicycle I like to ride, so figure that out yourself.

I am black and so of course a fountain of morality cuz of my skin. I am immune to lust, hatred, jealously, war, conquest, crime and I literally cannot be racist, not ever. If you ever see that, trust me, it's a white man's fault. I am Solomon and you are savages. Deal with it and listen to me, and admit you were wrong. Confess you sins and apologize, and then maybe pay me some money.

As for science fiction, "people of color have been in SFF from the very beginning, hiding behind the racial anonymity of names and pseudonyms" so effectively, I can't give you any actual examples.

Translation of N.K. Jemisin's racist speech by a not-racist sane person. Quotes by Auntie White Jemisin.

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 3:32 PM  

What a bunch of dorks. Those gals wouldn't last 2 screens in Beyond Castle Wolfenstein.

"Oh! That little nationalist bastard shot me for walking down a hall without a pass! What a nazi! For a game whose object is to deport the guards by looking pretty and win a date with Hitler, it sure is harder than it looks!"

Anonymous Stingray June 18, 2013 3:32 PM  

Nate,

I see your translator came in. Though, it only ever puts out the same thing over and over.

Anonymous Jill June 18, 2013 3:37 PM  

I've had numerous comments deleted at various blogs (not recently, been on good behavior for a while), and the ensuing e-mail debates always came down to one thing: it doesn't matter what arguments you give; you knew you were being rude (which is a BIG assumption). I've since concluded that using verbiage that causes others' offense will inevitably shut down the logic centers in those others' brains, and, consequently, they won't hear anything more you have to say--unless they are very unusual human beings.

Anonymous Anonagain June 18, 2013 3:37 PM  

The term warren is too benign to describe the grouping of these creatures. I'm thinking coven would be more apt.

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 3:40 PM  

Covens are too effective. At least they try to cast a spell.

Anonymous GreyS June 18, 2013 3:41 PM  

"Makes sense to me. The opportunity to promote new literary works and games, the access that it provides to other established writers... I would imagine that the net present value of your SFWA membership must be on the order of several million euros."
----
"At least. In fact, with First Sword and other projects upcoming, it could be tens of million."


Indeed. Despite the histrionics, that they want him out pretty much boils down to "We don't like him". They are playing with legal fire with huge financial consequences. And one can easily imagine one or two board members and, say, former board members and/or president(s) of the organization conspiring by email to get this author out of the organization. One can further imagine that there are only a handful of conspiring members who have sold a high number of books and who will take the brunt of the damages if any legal action goes beyond the organization itself.

Anonymous dh June 18, 2013 3:47 PM  

GreyS--

The reality is that a few years of slogging through litigation would really harm most people, SF/F authors just the same.

Anonymous Josh June 18, 2013 3:52 PM  

And one can easily imagine one or two board members and, say, former board members and/or president(s) of the organization conspiring by email to get this author out of the organization.

Funny thing about depositions...

Anonymous Alexander June 18, 2013 3:52 PM  

Granted I don't know how this would work legally, but...

If Vox took them to court, could he have the entire archive turned over to the public record? In which case the real fear for SFWA might not be anything relating to Vox per se, but what has been said over the years behind closed doors about various publishers, books stores, online vendors, their own readership, etc. etc.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 4:07 PM  

The reality is that a few years of slogging through litigation would really harm most people, SF/F authors just the same.

Oh, it can be a bit of a nightmare. The problem is that once the lawyers get their hooks in, they're very, very good at keeping the billable hours going. It took two years before GT Interactive finally settled; including what they finally paid us, it probably cost them somewhere between $750k and 1M.

Anonymous bob k. mando June 18, 2013 4:07 PM  

Daniel
I suppose it is a good thing that we have something as permanent and archivable as Vox's comment system to hold onto the memories of their heartfelt idiocy forever.




i hereby nominate Danial for funniest post in the entire thread.

Anonymous Rex Little June 18, 2013 4:08 PM  

Third, I live in Europe, not in the Americas.

That's being a bit nitpicky. Is it unreasonable for someone who hasn't read your blog, and saw you running for president of Science Fiction Writers of America, to assume you live in America?

Anonymous Anonymous June 18, 2013 4:15 PM  

I want to continue to enjoy the many material benefits provided to me through my membership in a professional science fiction writers association.--VD

Group insurance discounts?

--Hale

Anonymous The Next to Last Samurai June 18, 2013 4:20 PM  

For self-employed Americans, getting into a group--any group--that offers group insurance plans is indeed very important.

Anonymous Daniel June 18, 2013 4:21 PM  

Is it unreasonable for someone who hasn't read your blog, and saw you running for president of Science Fiction Writers of America, to assume you live in America?

Yes, especially if that someone is complaining to the overseas director of the SFWA in her region.

Is it unreasonable for someone who hasn't read your blog to criticize what she believes to be the contents of it, and not its actual contents?

Anonymous Emperor of Icecream June 18, 2013 4:25 PM  

I want to continue to enjoy the many material benefits provided to me through my membership in a professional science fiction writers association.--VD

Group insurance discounts?

--Hale


Spurs to creativity.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 4:51 PM  

El-Mohtar hilariously enjoys the hypocrisy of being able to whine about diversity because she knows there is no real danger for her at present that the culture she claims to love will actually dominate where she lives so she can be shot in the head for going to school or sent back inside a burning school for fleeing without a headscarf.

It's all fun, fun to say Conservatives are like the Taliban while living around Conservatives and studiously avoiding the Middle East, where El-Mohtar would be treated like she lies about being treated in the West.

People like El-Mohtar want all-Arabic literary anthologies cuz a book won't burn her as a witch, say she can never be President, or say she can't drive. People like El-Mohtar are endemic liars and hypocrites. It is a thing you can measure by whether their mouth is open or not. Trust me, the last thing these people want is diversity going beyond a mere book, cuz these people never live with the people they claim to defend and cherish. They live with whites cuz they love the safety, organization, and innovation that make their lives better, not worse.

Anonymous VD June 18, 2013 4:53 PM  

That's being a bit nitpicky.

Like pointing out that I haven't misused any SFWA platforms when the SFWA specifically disavows any responsibility for the platform that was misused?

Blogger Old Harry June 18, 2013 5:20 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Anonymous Pinakeli June 18, 2013 5:34 PM  

I would think another reason that they do not want litigation is that the threats to Vox and the Ilk would be made public. That could expand the legal issues considerably.

If every one of us who felt threatened were to file, or group together as a class it would end them financially.

Anonymous MendoScot June 18, 2013 5:37 PM  

And the feelbad just amplifies as you click through the comment links.

It makes me physically ill. It's like being hit by someone you'd like to trust... sort of sitting there, stunned, unable to fathom that there's real people who think like this. I... kind of wish I didn't really know that. And that there's really nothing you can say to someone like this, because it's the base assumptions-- the very foundations of thought-- that are wrong here. He thinks arguments matter that don't. He has definitions of savagery and civilization that would make Karl Popper grit his teeth over the need to even have a conversation over what those words mean, because they clearly aren't what I think they mean.

The wabbit is werry strong in this one.

Blogger Old Rebel June 18, 2013 5:38 PM  

The problem is bigger than SFWA. Cultural Marxism has infected all of our institutions - even the churches.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 6:36 PM  

Here's a funny one: Nebula Award winner Aliette de Bodard, who has a blog with anti-white maunderings, Tweets a link to "94 Asian SF writers."

This is the link: http://carriecuinn.com/2013/06/18/list-94-asian-speculative-fiction-authors-with-links/

The woman writes she wanted to read "more non-white American authors."

Then she give us the one-drop rule she went by to choose them, which resembles how Jews used to be spoken about by certain someones.

And she writes: "I plan on doing lists for African and Hispanic/Latin American authors as well, soon."

And whites? hahaha.

If anyone said they wanted to read more white authors, and made lists, these people would set off air raid sirens.

Didn't we used to drop bombs on Europeans who were fascinated by racial literature? Eventually people like de Bodard will need the air raid sirens.

Now, I know what they're trying to say here. But the Chinese don't purposefully arrange their literature by race, and neither did old SF. There's a difference between a hobby's accidental demographic, and purposefully keeping SF white. The SFWA, which supports the goofy one-drop Carl Brandon Society, can't tell the difference. In other words, these people are doing what they say others did, but didn't.

It's the "Enough Wrongs Make A Right" policy of the SFWA's de facto race committee.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 18, 2013 9:02 PM  

Hmmmmm?

It turns out that when Vox Day exposes folks outside his own bunny hole to his opinions he discovers that in all likelihood it is he who is the true savage.

My take? They ought to keep you in the club just to use you as a living, mouth breathing cautionary tale.

It's all quite amusing.

Anonymous kh123 June 18, 2013 9:29 PM  

It's getting to the point where not only what is said is predictable, but the arrival as well. Rabbit train schedules.*

*Though lemming could work as well; both tend to veer head first, en masse, over long drops.

Anonymous kh123 June 18, 2013 9:30 PM  

...Which probably means, it's the same individual.

Anonymous bbtp June 18, 2013 9:47 PM  

Writers Gawking At VD June 18, 2013 9:02 PM

... It's all quite amusing.


"ELL OH ELL", she tearfully explained. "ARE OH TEE EFF -- *sob* -- ELL!"

--bbtp

Anonymous WinstonWebb June 18, 2013 9:55 PM  

Writers Gawking At VD June 18, 2013 9:02 PM

Hmmmmm?

It turns out that when Vox Day exposes folks outside his own bunny hole...


Vox Popoli is the farthest thing possible from a bunny hole, echo chamber, circle jerk, [insert pejorative here]. Not a single opinion post gets published that does not have at least a handful of vehement objectors, and typically dozens. The difference between VP and rabbit warrens? Vox doesn't act like a pussy and hide behind his widdle censor hammer.

...to his opinions he discovers that in all likelihood it is he who is the true savage.

Possibly, depending on your definition of same:

1a : not domesticated or under human control
b : lacking the restraints normal to civilized human beings
2 : wild, uncultivated
3a : boorish, rude
b : malicious
4 : lacking complex or advanced culture


I count 4 of 6 where the definition could apply. But I don't see those 4 as all that bad.

My take? They ought to keep you in the club just to use you as a living, mouth breathing cautionary tale.

My take? This is a lie.

It's all quite amusing.

On that we agree.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 10:00 PM  

SFWA writers, do not gawk. Instead, make me a list of white science fiction writers, cuz I hunger for people who look like me. And then make me a sandwich, because you are all women.

And then, figure out this mystery of the ages. What is a non-gay who writes obsessively about gays and always in the negative?

That's right, your homophobic.

Then, what is a black person who writes obsessively about whites and always in the negative?

A brilliant hero.

Wrong.

That is arch-racist, N.K. Jemisin, enemy to Australia, like a Brown Recluse Spider.

I have a Rubik's Cube buried underneath the Sphinx which is also a death-maze. The riddle is, what is stupider than a KKK member? Answer, an SFWA member, because the KKK member doesn't sit around thinking they're an anti-racist.

The SFWA is a racist cult. Make me more sandwiches and lists. You can never have too many lists of art made good by race. Screw art. Give me the race. I want money to go to all-white SF convention. My great-great-grandfather was 1/10 black on his cousin's mother's side. Do I qualify for Carl Brandon money? I will write you a SF story using my one-drop talents. Arrrrggggh!! Accept me!! I am not white, I am interesting!!

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 18, 2013 10:01 PM  

Hey Winston Webb...

Don't forget to clean out the bunny hole.

Look around...once the bizarre and juvenile ideas so softly caressed here in this little bunny hole are exposed to the light of outside evaluation, you see them torn apart with the simplest of efforts. That's what happens to silly ideas. The funniest part is how all the little bunnies hop around and lick the long saggy ears of the wounded.

Anonymous Writers Gawking At VD June 18, 2013 10:07 PM  

Hey Auntiewhyte Jemisin:

I applaud you for keeping your your coat so soft and furry and admire your pretty, long ears.

Hop now. Hop tall little bunny. Your hip hoppy leader VD will lead you to the promised hole.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 10:29 PM  

SFWA was exposed to simple comparison - blew minds all over the place, like LSD bummer. Make me a science fiction anthology written entirely by Sumatrans.

I want Carl Brandon no-whites science fiction money. How do I apply; with Ansel Adams zone system?

http://www.varis.com/DigitalZoneSystem/images/Digital_Zone_System_-_Part_1/media_1258322059829_lg.png

Where is cutoff; 90? I am 90. I have short story. More compelling than if I was 100, fer sure. Blood test? No problem. Art is in my blood.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 10:51 PM  

Look! Art is in blood and race. They call them "Bloodchildren."

http://sofiasamatar.blogspot.com/2013/06/get-your-bloodchildren-anthology-before.html?spref=tw

Each author went through blood test and had cranium measured.

I love art! Hahahahaha.

Anonymous Alexander June 18, 2013 10:53 PM  

We do not need to make lists of dead white men books. A thorough grounding in the great books will provide a more than satisfactory approximation.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 11:01 PM  

Introduction to Octavia Butler Scholarship Bloodchildren is by Speaker-To-Racists, Nalo Hopkinson.

They say, "This is a really, really worthy cause, and look what you get!"

You get the racism and DNA testing to determine proper ancestry and art potential. Anti-Defamation League gives it minus 1,000,000 stars B.C., but no Raquel Welch.

Stormfront gives two thumbs up for being step in right direction; racial segregation.

David Duke says "These are my kind of people. Well, sort of, but you know what I mean."

KKK says they are making Carl Brandon Society honorary Grand Dragon and giving them "KKK Same Page Award."

Anti-racists march backwards again!!! Good grief!

Anonymous WinstonWebb June 18, 2013 11:25 PM  

Writers Gawking At VD June 18, 2013 10:01 PM

Hey Winston Webb...

Don't forget to clean out the bunny hole.

Look around...once the bizarre and juvenile ideas so softly caressed here in this little bunny hole are exposed to the light of outside evaluation, you see them torn apart with the simplest of efforts.


Example?

That's what happens to silly ideas. The funniest part is how all the little bunnies hop around and lick the long saggy ears of the wounded.

Are you Dane Cook? Your attempt to hijack this metaphor is like his ripped-off comedy material: pathetic, unoriginal, and not even humorous.

Blogger James Dixon June 18, 2013 11:52 PM  

> ...you see them torn apart with the simplest of efforts.

Yeah, that's worked so well over the years.

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 18, 2013 11:56 PM  

The SFWA can't make that simple effort here; they can only mention it. And of course they censor their own blogs like a blanket. That's why only they make comments on them. No one else even bothers. Any of them would have their heads handed to them in open debate, since they make racist and sexist comments multiple times a day.

But that's life when you base literature on gender and blood tests. Something's gonna give. Prediction: it won't be Australia.

Anonymous Mudz June 19, 2013 12:03 AM  

Oh dear. 'Writers Gawking at VD' used the 'I know you are, you said you are' riposte. That's almost interesting enough to - no, actually I think I'll watch a movie instead. Just got 'Arthur's Christmas' in the mail.

Anonymous Matthew June 19, 2013 12:05 AM  

Damnit, is that Tad back again?

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 19, 2013 12:18 AM  

Let's see, the Carl Brandon Society has racial segregation, a number of projects either by or supported by SFWA members are racially segregated SF&F stuff. WisCon has a racially segregated room and dinner.

"Neil Gaiman ‏@neilhimself 4 Apr
Some days you think it's 2013. Then you read something like this, and your jaw drops, and you wonder:"

That's Gaiman commenting about the first segregated prom in a town in GA, not the SFWA.

Anonymous Matthew June 19, 2013 12:31 AM  

Writers Gawking At VD, have you ever commented here using a different name?

Anonymous Mudz June 19, 2013 12:36 AM  

That's nothing compared to the spectacle of watching VD flame out as he fails to resist the temptation to publicly make a fool out of himself in front of his peers.

Sounds like a long wait for a train don't come. I don't have that kind of time.


Hmmmmmm...Soft fur, deep hole.


You're kind of weird.

Anonymous Matthew June 19, 2013 12:42 AM  

Writers Gawking At VD, have you ever commented here using a different name?

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 19, 2013 12:51 AM  

Dear SFWA Gawker, I would like to see more science fiction stories by transvestites and the disabled. Plus, I think the SFWA should offer discounted membership rates to women and blacks and other of history's ill-treated and marginalized. And, I would like to see fewer stories about TRIGGER WARNING colonization of outer space. I would like to see more stories about zombies and ghouls on Ganymede. Plus, two of the slots for the Nebula best novel should automatically go to non-whites. More Kate Elliot-type novels about outer space Dr. Zhivago threesome love affairs with all-gay tribes would be nice too. Needless to say, fewer old white men. Ish.

Yours truly, A. Racist and Gender Bigot.

Anonymous Matthew June 19, 2013 12:54 AM  

"And, I would like to see fewer stories about TRIGGER WARNING colonization of outer space."

I laughed, I did.

Anonymous Matthew June 19, 2013 12:55 AM  

Writers Gawking At VD, have you ever been a syphilis-addled homo?

Anonymous Matthew June 19, 2013 12:56 AM  

Wait, I got that last bit all wrong. So solly.

Writers Gawking At VD, have you ever TRIGGER WARNING colonized inner space?

Blogger  Trust Ted get misled. Gamma secret kings reddit June 19, 2013 1:37 AM  

Nein to expelling Beale from SFWA. Nein on crazy lady, she is the perfect sort of critic to have.

Anonymous Toby Temple June 19, 2013 2:05 AM  

what the hell is wrong with this thread!? it has all the things a trainwreck has but I am not enjoying it...

hmmm....

Anonymous Auntiewhyte Jemisin June 19, 2013 2:36 AM  

Dear SFWA, please provide more safe spaces for gays and peoples of colors and whatever. Peoples of colors and gays needs safe areas where they can spread their wings and not have to suffer from peoples of colors gaze by ciswhites with their privilege and stuff. I would like to see more science fiction by illegal aliens and people who float to Australia on tuna cages. Asians are very lively and damn clever peoples of colors and should write more kung-fu ghost stories and all Asian space stations stories about Ramen noodle smugglers who fight empire men who wear goggles and say, "hip, hip, cheerio" and stuff. There are never enough stories about black pirate women who lead armies and fly around in hot air balloons with blow guns that shoot hand grenades at their enemies, hapless white Dagwood Bumsteads who run into each other as soon as they see the noble and mighty black womens.

Yours, I. Will Chokeyu.

Anonymous Matthew June 19, 2013 2:53 AM  

Dear SFWA, I would like to see more stories about butthext in Analog, Asimov's. and The Magazine of Fantassy and Science Fiction.

Dear Toby, it became necessary to destroy the village so that we could save it.

Anonymous VD June 19, 2013 4:00 AM  

Look around...once the bizarre and juvenile ideas so softly caressed here in this little bunny hole are exposed to the light of outside evaluation, you see them torn apart with the simplest of efforts.

Except, of course, you don't. You see a lot of women fainting, you see a lot of expressions of horror, and you see excuses for why those ideas don't even have to be debated... but you never see them torn apart or even directly addressed.

PZ Myers was the only one to try and he got his chunky posterior kicked again... in his own field of supposed expertise.

Also, answer the questions directed to you before you post again. Provide an example of this outside evaluation and tell us if you have ever posted here under a different name. And if you have, tell us what that name was.

Anonymous Anonymous June 19, 2013 6:02 AM  

Let the illiterat pigs-dogs wallow in the mire of their own cross-bred muck.
I'm a racist (I'm not ashamed, I want people to know). I believe in every word VD had written.

I love you VD.

Purity is Truth!

Anonymous a. dude June 19, 2013 7:39 AM  

Getting ugly ... now they are after Vox's wife...

http://jamesworrad.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/vox-day-schrodingers-spacebunny.html

Anonymous Wanderer June 19, 2013 8:26 AM  

fully-rounded adult N K Jemisin

Fully-rounded in what sense?

Blogger Bane June 19, 2013 10:54 AM  

Awwww, c'mon, Bane liked the occasional hug.

"I see I have pissed off yet another stalwart reader. She claims I have banned her. I haven't, but oh how I will. I slaver at the potential. Her hypocrisy is breathtaking.

And she dares to call me rude.

Oh well, I'll get to all of you sooner or later. Bane is nothing, if not an equal opportunity offender.

I woke this morning to a world that was all flocked up. Beautiful. White. Fuzzy. Glazed. Probably not frost, just very heavy condensation, but combined with still fog, was eldrich, fey, and at the cusp of the day, breathtaking.

Sigh. I have been confronted by bastards, bitches, assholes, and other forms of douche-drippings lately. After coming to the realization that I cannot actually give them the proper choking they so richly deserve, I go grab one kid or the other, or the wife, and give them a good rubbing like a set of worry beads.

Been a lot of hugging going on around here lately. They urk! in surprise, but I gets me my hugs back, and all is right with the world for a bit. Until the next blog-fly begins to buzz around my head."

Blogger hadley June 19, 2013 11:10 AM  

Nora Jemison (aka "NK Jemisin") a black woman paid by the white folks at NYU-Polytechnic to give (in effect) GED training to Brooklyn NAMs so the percent of Poly NAMs equal the percent of Brooklyn NAMs.

Of COURSE she is against even the slightest suggestion that there is any inequality between NAMs and non-NAMs. Her paycheck depends upon the doctrine of absolute racial/ethnic parity.

And please be honest here. You would be coming down hard on Vox if your paycheck hung in the balance, too. What is that Famous Orwell quote about paychecks?

What else can she do with her education? Teach in some ghetto high school in Brooklyn? I wouldn't wish that hell on my worst enemy!

So just consider the source and move on.

Anonymous Steve June 19, 2013 11:46 AM  

"This last bit certainly helps explain why people have been deriding El-Moron's command of the English language.First, it's obviously not a threat. >EXCELLENT I'm the only one who has actually, and repeatedly, been threatened here.>OUTSTANDING!Second, Jemisin made her speech in Australia. Third, I live in Europe, not in the Americas.>FINISH HER!"

"Let rhetoric be silent when the readily observable facts gainsay its blather."

VOX DAY WINS....HUMILIATION....

Anonymous Belgium dude June 19, 2013 5:56 PM  

Is it perhaps too insensitive to ask those Progressive ladies Twittering about our gracious host where do they exactly fall on the fertility age chart?

Blogger Justthisguy June 20, 2013 12:40 AM  

Oh, "The Next to Last Samurai"? I feel just the same way about the hugs. When it comes time to exchange The Peace in the service I attend, I shy away from the wimminz attempting to hug me. I famously (in the congregation, at least) said "No, there are machines for that." I then explained the Grandin Squeezebox. Why, yes, I do believe I have a touch of the "A". Just don't touch me, and we'll get along fine.

Blogger Justthisguy June 20, 2013 3:41 AM  

Whee! My LJ account still works! I left a comment at caudetac's place taking up for Vox. I think I referred to Jemisin as "that bimbo."

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