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Monday, December 07, 2015

Evidence of a false flag

ISIS commended the "three lions" of San Bernardino. All the early news reports talked about three shooters. I personally heard the police on the scanner talking about three suspects, including one taken into custody. So, where is the third shooter? And more importantly, why did an eyewitness report seeing three tall male shooters?
We now know that ATF investigators recovered police issued firearms from the alleged shooters. This key detail was leaked by 2016 GOP Presidential Candidate Carly Fiorina during a press interview after she had overheard a newsroom report that doesn’t fit the official narrative.

We also know that active shooter drills actually took place near the crime scene just days before and possibly even on the same day of the mass shooting as reported by Mac Slavo.

Additionally details from an eyewitness, who came forth on the day of the shooting, may have been overlooked by investigators and suggest that there were actually ‘three white shooters’ instead of the radicalized husband and wife natural-born killer team portrayed in some mainline reports.

The witness, Sally Abdelmageed, worked at Inland Medical Center where the attack took place and saw it all unfold firsthand. It’s also important to note that Abdelmageed is likely not lying and that this quite possibly might be the most accurate eyewitness account publicized to date. After all how can two shooters, a man and a petite woman, be mistaken for three white military men with athletic builds?

In a phone interview with CBS Abdelmageed explained:

    "I heard shots fired and it was from you know an automatic weapon. [...] very unusual. Why would we hear shots? As we looked out the window a second set of shots goes off [...] and we saw a man fall to the floor. Then we just looked and we saw three men dressed in all black, military attire, with vests on they were holding assault rifles. As soon as they opened up the doors to building three [...] one of them [...] started to shoot into the room."

When asked what the gunman that shot into the room looked like the eyewitness replied:

    "I couldn’t see a face, he had a black hat on […] black cargo pants, the kind with the big puffy pockets on the side [...] long sleeve shirt [...] gloves [...] huge assault rifle [...] six magazines […] I just saw three dressed exactly the same”.

“You are certain you saw three men,” the newscaster asked Abdelmageed.

“Yes,” said Abdelmageed.

    “It looked like their skin color was white. They look like they were athletic build and they appeared to be tall.”
Now, who is more likely to be lying, this woman or the government? Which party has a longer track record of being less than entirely honest. And the strange behavior of the married couple makes a lot more sense if one considers the possibility that they were simply patsies who were flushed and then identified; the way in which the police found them struck me as just a bit odd at the time.

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174 Comments:

Anonymous Ummmmm December 07, 2015 11:33 AM  

Abdelmageed? So she's a Muslim? And she's blaming the white guys instead of the saintly Muslim couple?

Anonymous The other robot December 07, 2015 11:36 AM  

The truth is out there ...

However, if the three of them had six magazines and "assault rifles" how is it that the death toll is so low?

Hell, the Sandy Hook guy all by himself killed more.

Blogger Salt December 07, 2015 11:42 AM  

"I'm just a patsy." - Lee Harvey Oswald

Anonymous Soga December 07, 2015 11:42 AM  

@1 Ummmmm: Islam ain't a race, bub.

Blogger JAU December 07, 2015 11:44 AM  

But If you've got two Patsies ready to blame for the shooting, why send three shooters? Seems like that would forseeably and unavoidably to inconsistencies in the narrative.

Blogger Danby December 07, 2015 11:46 AM  

" It’s also important to note that Abdelmageed is likely not lying."
"Now, who is more likely to be lying, this woman or the government?"


What ethnicity is Abdelmageed again?
Egyptian you say?
Must be the truth. As an Egyptian and a Moslem, she would never even possibly lie to deflect scrutiny away from fellow Moslems.

Blogger WATYF #0222 December 07, 2015 11:46 AM  

Wait... what would be the purpose of the False Flag? This only serves to stir up anti-refugee and anti-immigration sentiment, which neither side of the ruling party wants.

WATYF

Blogger Danby December 07, 2015 11:47 AM  

Three white guys with 180 rounds each would have killed everybody in the building.

Anonymous That Would Be Telling December 07, 2015 11:48 AM  

It was reported by a pathologist as I recall that the Sandy Hook shooter dumped half and even full magazines into individual targets (that didn't get much coverage since turning kids into hamburger is very ugly and it goes against the narrative of "high capacity 'clips'"). The Official Story of this shooting is very different and .223/5.56 is notoriously inconsistent at wounding. I'm not sure we even know the exact type of ammo used, just that it wasn't green tip.

We also know that initial eyewitness reports are notoriously wrong, and it would be very easy for there to not be a John Doe 2 in this (we know who that guy was, a German as I recall informant for the ATF. That infamously inept unit really screwed up their sting of the bombers. This pretty much explains all the mysterious things about it).

Blogger The Other Robot December 07, 2015 11:48 AM  

Were they Israeli tourists?

Blogger bob k. mando December 07, 2015 11:49 AM  

vd
Now, who is more likely to be lying, this woman or the government?



Abdelmageed? seriously, Vox?

just because i think the .gov is lying, doesn't mean i'm going to lend any credence to the word of a muslim. that's like taking a dindu seriously when he says the 5lb brick of coke in his pants doesn't belong too him.

it's not an either or question. if the question is, "Which is lying to a kaffir, the US government or a muslim" the answer is most likely to be, "Both."

and muslims are gonna muslim.

frankly, with as many "red flags" on this couple as they've got, i'd be surprised if the feds weren't watching them 24 / 7 ... and let them make their assault.

because, you know, muslims are gonna muslim. they've been going all jihad on people's asses for 1500 years now.


Obama's wholesale importation of illegals is an act of war against the citizens of the US.

Obama's wholesale importation of muslims is an act of war against the citizens of the US.

why wouldn't Obama permit muslims and illegals to actually, you know, wage war against the citizens of the US?

Anonymous Gen. Kong December 07, 2015 11:50 AM  

Since Abdelmageed is a Musloid name, the chances of lying are high for both contenders. Yes, neither the regime or the Ministry of Truth have any credibility. The ISIS couple could have been sent in for decoration while the real shooters (government agents) carried out the killings. Even is the ISIS couple really did shoot up the place, they may have been supplied with weaponry by the regime - since the regime has supplied ISIS with weaponry from the very start, going all the way back to the Benghazi adventure. ISIS is a Banana Empire proxy after all, supported by Turkey, the House of Saud and the unmentionables.

In any event, whether an actual case of Sudden Jihad Syndrome or a full-fledged false-flag, the festivitives have been used by the Banana Empire and its minions in the Ministry of Truth, Cuckservatism, Inc., et al to 1) Promote more gun-control laws; and 2) Promote more Musloid colonization. Most of the idiocracy, even those who understand something is very wrong, are unable to distinguish between 'greater enemy' and 'lesser enemy'. Bloodthirstym crazy goat-humpers they may be, but Musloids are merely proxy soldiers for the greater enemy - the Banana Empire and its owners.

Blogger WATYF #0222 December 07, 2015 11:51 AM  

Isn't it just as likely that the third suspect was taken alive and simply "disappeared" into a black site for "enhanced interrogation"? :^D

WATYF

Blogger Rantor December 07, 2015 11:51 AM  

In the military, Commanders always accept that the first report is always wrong. Witnesses often don't see what is really going on, much to support that. Still it is odd... I won't ignore the possibility of a false flag but if it was, POTUS people probably not involved for the terror attack does not fit the narrative.

Blogger The Other Robot December 07, 2015 11:52 AM  

If the GoPro video surfaces we will know more.

Blogger Ian Boyd December 07, 2015 11:53 AM  

So many reasons to not think much of this.

One is that this is an Egyptian woman who is claiming to have been there and seen this and who would indeed have motivation to deflect away from it being fellow middle-easterners.

Secondly, eye-witness testimony at traumatic events is notoriously unreliable. She thinks she saw three big white men covered in black in the midst of the shooting...well, count me as skeptical.

I don't really like the tendencies towards creating conspiracies that rely on the first info to get out about an event like this when the first info out is usually the worst.

Finally, as noted above, there seems little motivation at all for the government to have done this. They could have created the police state just as easily if the perps were white males, them being seemingly well-adjusted Muslims throws a major monkey wrench in the plan to turn the US into an even more centralized, multi-cultural empire.

Blogger bob k. mando December 07, 2015 11:53 AM  

7. WATYF #0222 December 07, 2015 11:46 AM
Wait... what would be the purpose of the False Flag? This only serves to stir up anti-refugee and anti-immigration sentiment, which neither side of the ruling party wants.



i explained this back in the Russia video thread.

they are creating an "alien invader" threat so that you ( by which i mean the world, not necessarily the US ) will run into the protective arms of the KGB agent, begging to be saved.

Blogger swiftfoxmark2 December 07, 2015 11:55 AM  

The question now is what does the government have to gain by lying about this.

Yes, gun control is one but that is not going to happen anytime soon. And let's be honest, why would they make Muslims patsies. It doesn't seem to fit the Narrative.

Blogger jay c December 07, 2015 11:57 AM  

Brown is easy to mistake for white from a distance or in a stressful situation. Mistaking two for three or short for tall is a little more difficult.

One thing that struck me immediately: In an operation that appeared to be so well planned out, why did all three perpetrators flee in a single vehicle instead of in multiple vehicles to minimize capture? I was about to chalk it up to the usual Muslim level of stupidity (fire and let Allah do the aiming), but I'm beginning to think that the Mrs was just there for support and at least one other vehicle got away.

Blogger ScottD December 07, 2015 12:01 PM  

Didn't the actual victims who survived identify the husband/wife as the shooters? And I can think of a lot of reasons to suspect that Sally Abdelmageed, who speaks Arabic (per linkedin), would claim that three white men were the shooters rather than the ISIS supporting couple. Accepting this report borders on tinfoil hat territory.

Blogger Chris Mallory December 07, 2015 12:03 PM  

Abdelmageed looks fairly Westernized in her photographs.

OpenID Jack Amok December 07, 2015 12:06 PM  

Three white guys with 180 rounds each would have killed everybody in the building.

Not if they had cop-level shooting skills. They'd be lucky to make it out of the building without shooting each other.

what would be the purpose of the False Flag? This only serves to stir up anti-refugee and anti-immigration sentiment, which neither side of the ruling party wants.

I don't know the answer, but it's probably worth noting there are more than two sides to the ruling party at this point. There may be two "official" sides, but there are lots of personal agendas and as the stakes get higher, the less control they have over their own people.

Anonymous Ummmmm December 07, 2015 12:07 PM  

@4 -- I didn't say it was a race, retard.

When she says "tall white guys" she is saying "not Muslims" for people like Soga too fucking stupid to figure it out.

Blogger Kentucky Packrat December 07, 2015 12:10 PM  

Every major killing event of the last 20 years or so has had multiple reports of more people acting than there actually were. Some of these reports (the Hispanic/Arab in the McVey crew) might even be accurate, but most are because people are notoriously bad at counting and keeping track of people who are or might be trying to kill them.

I generally have to agree with the comments section: Muslim patsies don't fit The Narrative. A white Militia family, I'll buy that. The white guy in Western Kentucky who says he didn't kill the little girl, OK, I'll give him some room to maneuver on the "I've been set up". This crew, no. I'm not going to buy the "My little baby couldn't be suffering from Sudden Jihad Syndrome, he's a good little Islamist."

Blogger Danby December 07, 2015 12:13 PM  

So little Sally Islam was able to count the magazines on the three large white guys who totally did this, even though she was some distance away? She really took the time to count the mags when people are shooting? Rather than getting to cover, leaving, calling police, she was studying the shooters so she could describe them to... the news media.

Right.

Blogger Danby December 07, 2015 12:14 PM  

Not if they had cop-level shooting skills. They'd be lucky to make it out of the building without shooting each other.
Literally. i shot tea out of my nose on that one.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis December 07, 2015 12:14 PM  

Vox...I like zero hedge for their reports on the financial industry but for everything else, well, if there was an outbreak of diarrhea someone there would report it as a false flag complete with an interviewed source.

Nothing about what happened at San Bernardino is outside the scope of what islamists have done in the past, nor is it beyond what they have publicly stated that they wanted to do. Not to mention, like everyone else has mentioned previously in the comments, I wouldn't trust the source.

As for strange behavior...they worship a "god" that advocates global genocide of all non-believers and maintains that blowing themselves up killing innocents is a virtue. I'm not going to expect them to act rationale by western standards given the aforementioned.

Anonymous Ryan December 07, 2015 12:15 PM  

huge assault rifle? six magazines?

She could see that each of them was carrying a spare magazine? 3 men, with two magazines each? Was each man carrying his spare magazine where it could be easily seen from a distance? By a woman?

Hmmm.

And three tall muscular white men with assault rifles would only off a handful of folks? And wound most of them?

Stinks.

Blogger Maple Curtain December 07, 2015 12:16 PM  

@4: uh, ya, Islam is a race, bub. It's an Arab-nationalist death cult.

That inbred Pakis who are descended from conquered peoples and assorted black fellers, like Somalis, Sudanese, and American inner-city apes (oh, and alienated rich white latch-key kids with absent fathers) who are also descended from conquered peoples call themselves followers of Islam doesn't change that fact.

Islam is an Arab-nationalist death cult with subordinate nations as nominal members - Arabs don't consider Pakis and blacks to be human or equal - that's why they sell them into slavery, and that's why they use them as cannon fodder in the MidEast (Rubber Dinghy Rapids, mate).

Just as Soviet "International" Communism was naked Russian Imperialism and a bunch of captive client states, so Islam is Arab nationalism writ large.

Anonymous Joe Blowe December 07, 2015 12:17 PM  

Why the False Flag?

There is only two reasons to conduct false flag terror attack against working class nobodies (as opposed to real terror attacks against the Ruling Elite) at that is to generate public fear/support for domestic repression and foreign wars. In this case it would be for gun control and direct intervention in Syria to overthrow Assad. Notice all these terror attacks have occurred since the CIA/Mossad proxy army known as ISIS started getting their asses handed to them by the Russian Air Force and Syrian Army.

Anonymous Crank December 07, 2015 12:18 PM  

There may well be 3rd shooter still at large (or who is secretly being waterboarded right now for more info). But the rest of it seems like one in a million.

Blogger Shimshon December 07, 2015 12:18 PM  

If the motivation is to push for more extensive war against ISIS as a pretext to escalate the war on the Assad regime, I can see this.

There are other reasons to add a bit of Islamic seasoning to a false flag event.

Anonymous JartStar December 07, 2015 12:20 PM  

Maybe the gun makers did it because they are sure a profiting.

Blogger jay c December 07, 2015 12:22 PM  

@25 She really took the time to count the mags when people are shooting?

Yes, that is pretty damning anti-testimony.

Blogger Duke of URL VFM#391 December 07, 2015 12:22 PM  

@22 Jack Amok
Not if they had cop-level shooting skills. They'd be lucky to make it out of the building without shooting each other.
==
Jack, you owe me a clean keyboard!

Blogger Maple Curtain December 07, 2015 12:25 PM  

As a natural skeptic, and a keen observer of human nature, I am highly skeptical of claims about false-flag attacks as terrorism.

The average dolt making up security services and the average extreme dolt leading bureaucracies makes it extremely unlikely that they could pull off and hide a "false-flag" corner store robbery.

Why should we believe that they could pull off a major terrorist attack on U.S. civilians when the fallout from being exposed would be catastrophic to the fedgov and the ruling class?

Anyway, even though all of these wannabe Machiavellis in diplomacy/statecraft/spyland have their theories about the best way to "tame" (i.e. fuck up) the MidEast, the Balkans, St. Louis, they don't seem to be all that able to consider two or three steps in the what-if scenarios that they concoct.

These people as masterminds?

Please explain.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis December 07, 2015 12:30 PM  

@30

Except the Fort Hood shooting happened in 2009... Not to mention the numerous attempts by islamists before and after 9/11. The Russian bombings may have something to do with the recent attacks, however, I would think it is more likely that ISIS is trying to bolster their dropping recruitment levels with a PR victory since their territorial advances have been stopped cold and the caliphate's entire legitimacy is dependent on their ability to expand itself and attack the unbeliever.

Blogger Hammerli280 December 07, 2015 12:31 PM  

@36 Maple Curtain:

Concur. As Napoleon once said, "Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by incompetence"

Anonymous Soga December 07, 2015 12:32 PM  

I like how the "Islam is a race" mongoloid crowd here is defending that by calling Islam a... wait for it... a cult.

You guys are a few inches short for this ride.

Blogger Student in Blue December 07, 2015 12:35 PM  

Were the police and news basing their initial count of three shooters based on Abdelmageed alone, however?

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 12:36 PM  

everything about this smells bad to me. All the signs of a pro hit... then total amateur hour in the take down.

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer December 07, 2015 12:37 PM  

Why would an eye witness lie?

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=+Abdelmageed&FORM=HDRSC2

Also, why would the government stage a false flag operation that fingered Muslims? The government protects Muslims. It put Muslim Brotherhood operatives into influential and important government offices while running people who speak honestly about Islam out of the government.

OpenID luciussomesuch December 07, 2015 12:37 PM  

Laura Wood, author of The Thinking Housewife and (as I understand) literary executor of Lawrence Auster, has been assiduously covering the evidence of mass shooting hoaxes and/or false flags, from 9-11 and Sandy Hook on through today. Readers of Auster and Wood will understand that this interest departed radically from the expected, and has apparently alienated much of the Auster readership who followed her.

These subjects held no interest for me (despite a penchant for "true crime" obsessions nursed since reading "Helter Skelter" when I was ten) until Wood started writing about them this summer. After some consternation I finally dove into the Sandy Hook materials.

Leaving aside the occasional hippy-dippyness of some "conspiracy theorists" or the occasional piece of false evidence (Gene Rosen in front of the EVERYONE MUST SIGN IN bulletin) seemingly entered into the counternarrative from whatever source, I am serenely confident that Sandy Hook was a bloodless, though remarkably evil, piece of theatre concocted for the obvious motives.

Whether or not Sandy Hook was intended as a one-off, I now believe that we are living through what I call "Too Fast, Too Furious". Leaving aside the likelihood of a conspiracy in 9-11 too, the Obama years have seen a massive expansion in the number of "mass shooting" events.

In an striking number of incidents, including some which I haven't seriously considered as false flag events myself (i.e. the Aurora Batman shooting), there are confirmed emergency drills taking place concurrently or directly prior in proximity whose scenarios involve terror strike or gun-related mass casualty events.

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2015/11/21/training-exercises-dovetail-with-mass-shootings/

I have no trouble believing Muslims are capable of mass murder against White Christian populations, or of telling lies to obscure that fact. However, the proximity of the SWAT team to this shooting is, for anyone already immersed in the possibility of this bloody genre of FedGov theatre, already an alarming tell.

It is also surpassing strange that the photo I've seen online, and which Wood today comments on, shows Madame Terror handcuffed from behind as she lies shot to death.

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 12:37 PM  

"Yes, that is pretty damning anti-testimony."

I mean if you see to groups of three your mind gets to the number six without you even thinking it. but given how specific she was... I am suspicious of her as a plant.

Blogger Bluntobj Winz December 07, 2015 12:39 PM  

@28

This. So much this. You have a fast moving shooting event and the lady watching has time to count magazines?

Also, I watched the change in the narrative media from 3 white guys to 2 muslim shooters. I am willing to entertain that there was a 3rd guy, but I'd say he's been renditioned to a black site where he will be interrogated outside of US jurisprudence. Otherwise there would be a CAIR field day with media spin and a show trial that would be so useful for 4GW propaganda.

TL;DR: 3rd guy was black-bagged and will never see light of day again.

Blogger JCclimber December 07, 2015 12:42 PM  

a church member was in charge of this particular event and via her mother (also a church member) reported that she knew this Farook as a colleague (well, actually I'm guessing she was his supervisor).

He stood over her, could have aimed at her head, but instead swung the gun down and shot her in the leg and moved on to other people.

To me, sounds like a gamma male who wanted to prevent his wife shooting someone he knew was a good person, so inflicted a deliberate non-fatal wound. Or angelic intervention.

Another thing was that she had just sent everyone on a break during a party, that is why there weren't as many people in the room when the shooters burst in with their guns (people stepped outside, into bathrooms, offices, etc.)

Either way, given this testimony, Farook was there shooting people with a gun.

This doesn't prevent that other people weren't also there with guns, shooting people.

Blogger Daniel December 07, 2015 12:42 PM  

"Evidence of a false flag" could be rewritten "glaring lies in the official narrative."

In other words, "who benefits?" is not the appropriate question right now. "Who said what, when?" is.

Blogger haus frau December 07, 2015 12:45 PM  

If the fed gov did this false flag why on earth would they not use a white male patsy? Sure they need these kind of events for the gun ban push but it throws the narrative off. We aren't supposed to be afraid of muslims and mass muslim immigration because it's the religion of peace and all that. White Christian men are the violent ones. That being said, I can't imagine Bonny and Clyde weren't known to intelligence agencies. The piss poor handling of the apartment crime scene by the FBI indicates they don't really want to investigate too much.

Blogger JCclimber December 07, 2015 12:45 PM  

Yes, seeing active shooter drill signs posted around my workplace sends me into high alert too. There is a suspicious amount of correlation lately between active shooter drills and actual shootings.

Blogger J Van Stry December 07, 2015 12:49 PM  

I don't think she's lying, but I bet she's wrong about what she thinks she saw.
I've had to deal with this many times in my life when dealing with things that went wrong, and I had to go investigate them. People just do not see what they think they see, in 90 percent of all cases. They're not trained observers, and when they are stuck in an unfamiliar situation, they just make stuff up in their minds unconsciously.

She says she heard 'automatic fire' had she ever heard automatic fire in her life before? No, she hasn't, most people haven't.

She describes people she saw at a distance way too accurately to be true. Again, her mind filling in what she saw with what she thinks she saw. How can you describe someone as athletic while saying they were wearing baggy clothes? You can't. And having seen pictures of the woman terrorist, she looked like a man, and dressed pretty much like one too.

When I was flying in the military I think they spent a week just teaching us how to observe and showing us how our eyes could be fooled, and our senses easily tricked. And we would constantly get reminders on how what we thought we were seeing might not be what was actually there, and not to color our observations with things we really didn't have experience with.

Blogger Maple Curtain December 07, 2015 12:53 PM  

@39: you got an argument, or just trolling?

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer December 07, 2015 12:55 PM  

@48

My theory is that the FBI had them under surveillance, possibly even had turned Mom into an informant, so that's why "investigation" is so lackadaisical. They already know who was in the cell, etc. That would also explain the "tip" that caused the police to go to the IED factory/home almost immediately after the shooting. The FBI knew they were jihadists, but weren't expecting them to actually start shooting people yet.

Blogger bob k. mando December 07, 2015 12:58 PM  

49. JCclimber December 07, 2015 12:45 PM
There is a suspicious amount of correlation lately between active shooter drills and actual shootings.



yeah, i pointed that out when San Bernardino first went down.

it's getting to the point where if you find out there's an "active shooter" drill going on anywhere nearby then you need to either bug out for the hills or you need to be on high alert.

we're getting past the "coincidence" stage and well into "correlation".

Blogger Ostar December 07, 2015 12:58 PM  

Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true. The principle that Muslims are allowed to lie to unbelievers in order to defeat them.

So this Muslim woman is more likely to be lying than the government, but of course the government is probably lying by omission at least.

Anonymous WaterBoy December 07, 2015 12:59 PM  

If it was a 'false flag', my love...

RE: The staging of muslim assailants vs. white men

The failure of past events using white men to stir up sufficient fear within the populace to aid in gun control efforts leads to the use of 'scarier' boogeymen -- muslims -- to push the fear factor higher. Won't work, of course, but reality was never on the side of the gun-grabbers.

RE: Coincidence of drills and active shootings.

There are numerous drills going on at any time across the country. That some of them have subsequent actual events is not a surprise at all based solely on statistics, and are still offset by the vastly outnumbering cases of drills without subsequent events.

Blogger Gordon December 07, 2015 1:02 PM  

It's funny how this sort of thing goes. "We now know...police-issued firearms...Carly Fiorina...." No, we don't know any such thing. We have a fragment of a statement by someone who overheard something from a newsroom.

The JFK conspiracy folks repeated for years (still do) that practically all of the people in Dealey Plaza reported more than three shots. The problem is, that's simply false. Virtually everyone in the plaza that day reported three shots.

The liars who say that the Pentagon was hit by a cruise missile rather than a 757 grab a fragment of a quote from one person, who stated in the same paragraph that it was a passenger jet. Plus, there's hundreds of witnesses who saw the plane go in.

Blogger Scott6584 December 07, 2015 1:03 PM  

Having a hard time understanding who benefits from a false flag attack in this circumstance. I'll buy into the idea of a coordinated response that was pre-planned for whenever the next mass shooting happened. There is evidence that the Left had a pre-planned canned response in their attacks on "thoughts and prayers," and their immediate embrace of more gun control. But that pre-planned response blew up in their face when it came out that the attack was by Muslims who had pledged allegiance to ISIS.

So given that the identities of the shooters blew up the preferred narrative, just WHO would have been behind such a false flag attack?

Anonymous Donn #0114 December 07, 2015 1:04 PM  

There was the third guy for the McVeigh crew. He was seen by multiple witnesses at different times and places and there was even a witness sketch of him.

I think this woman is either mistaken or lying but if not I agree that the guy is probably in some deep dark hole. Obola may talk about closing Gitmo but there will always be a place to stick guys like that.

Blogger VD December 07, 2015 1:08 PM  

Abdelmageed? seriously, Vox?

I would not have taken her claims seriously were it not for the fact that I was listening to the police scanner. They were clearly talking about more than two people; they initially thought that only one was in the car. And the whole thing about the car being detected was odd, even as it was happening.

I am not saying I believe the Egyptian woman, but I do not believe the official account either.

Blogger Salt December 07, 2015 1:08 PM  

- She could see that each of them was carrying a spare magazine? 3 men, with two magazines each? Was each man carrying his spare magazine where it could be easily seen from a distance? By a woman?


- everything about this smells bad to me. All the signs of a pro hit... then total amateur hour in the take down.


Cause confusion, then set the narrative desired. MPAI and will follow the herd.


Anonymous DT December 07, 2015 1:09 PM  

@50 nails it.

Even if you ignore lying, human memory is notoriously unreliable and malleable. The mind will try to fill in the blanks according to its expectations, whatever may have primed those expectations. It then continually tries to maintain internal consistency. If certain beliefs and expectations are strong enough, or reinforced with enough outside pressure, the mind will literally change the memory at a subconscious level.

This ties into the whole SJW problem and the general disconnect from reality we see in liberals and cuckservatives. (Ha...just had to add cuckservative to my browser's dictionary.) There's no question that in many instances they knowingly, consciously lie. But it's a good bet that in other instances they really believe their own BS.

We're all subject to it, but a person trained to observe and to be critical is more resistant to it.

tl;dr - she didn't see what she thinks she saw.

That said, I am very curious about the third shooter because that was all over the police radio while the day was unfolding. Doesn't mean there was a third shooter. But police thought there was at the time.

Anonymous WaterBoy December 07, 2015 1:12 PM  

Vox: "ISIS commended the "three lions" of San Bernardino."

This is actually evidence against a false flag, if the implication is that ISIS knew in advance that there were three assailants, rather than merely reacting to media reports of same.

Blogger JaimeInTexas December 07, 2015 1:14 PM  

A lot of rumors, some facts and nothing for certain.

If a false flag, it is for the primary purpose of attempting to restore public opinion towards more aggressive military action abroad. Any expansion in FedGov activities within these uSA is icing on the cake.

Blogger Doom December 07, 2015 1:17 PM  

Hmm, maybe. Depends though. Her last name brings great doubts. If she is, or is married to, a "moderate" muslim, or one of the other aggro minorities, she may well see what she is "supposed" to see. Magic dirt, and mixing with those who attempt to apply it, is not functional or trustworthy. I definitely don't trust women who mudfish or minorities. Not on this type of thing. Not from urban areas, in academic circles, where politics is left and king.

Believe as you like. I'd have to have much more, see pictures, find out what people were where and saw what, and more. Though, truth be told, I don't think the news, unless you are there, is accurate. Further, a false flag stirring up aggro against islam? Yeah, not in a lib-zone. Maybe, just doubtful. And... more... if that is happening, that might not be a totally bad thing. Just saying. Psy-ops, black ops, nasty business, but sometimes crucial, necessary. On the darker side of things. At least in the secular side of the world.

Blogger Salt December 07, 2015 1:17 PM  

This is actually evidence against a false flag, if the implication is that ISIS knew in advance that there were three assailants

Why? Doesn't ISIS work for the US Government as has been reported?

Blogger JaimeInTexas December 07, 2015 1:18 PM  

@56. Gordon
IIRC, the security cameras from nearby businesses were confiscated and still not realeased or a said to be missing. Supposedly, those security videos were located where they had a view of anything that flew over, in the direction and altitude of whatever crashed into the Pentagon.

Blogger SirHamster December 07, 2015 1:21 PM  

it's getting to the point where if you find out there's an "active shooter" drill going on anywhere nearby then you need to either bug out for the hills or you need to be on high alert.

Was curious about the frequency of shooter drills ...

At San Bernardino Inland Regional Center: "They have active-shooter drills every month or so."

Crazy world.

Anonymous JI December 07, 2015 1:26 PM  

I see some comments suggesting that these three guys, with the description given, could have wiped out everyone in the building. I had the same thought about the shootings in Colorado Springs a week or two ago. How was it that only two civilians in that building were killed? I don't know if they worked there or not, but I would think a crazy would have shot every doctor and staff member in that place. Things just aren't making sense based on what I understand of a crazed mindset (so maybe my understanding is poor, but still...).

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 1:26 PM  

"Why? Doesn't ISIS work for the US Government as has been reported?"

created by, funded by, and aided by, doesn't mean works for.

But... yes.. there is no doubt the US government has some influence and control over ISIS.

Anonymous WaterBoy December 07, 2015 1:28 PM  

Alleged ≠ proven. And even then it would only apply if ISIS was controlling the attackers.

Again, though, if the Muslim couple were acting on their own rather than under ISIS control, it is most likely that the ISIS comment about "three lions" was only in reaction to media reports.

It would be quite informative if we could see the timing on the original ISIS comments.

Blogger Salt December 07, 2015 1:34 PM  

@69

Quibbler.

Anonymous Soga December 07, 2015 1:35 PM  

@51:

Move along. The train is fine. Stop worrying.

Anonymous WillBest December 07, 2015 1:39 PM  

Not trusting the official account goes without saying. But its a big step to false flag.

Keep in mind that the last thing this administration wants is a trial of a Muslim terrorist or terrorist co-conspirator keeping it in the media for weeks or months.

That is why if there was a 3rd guy he disappeared into a hole, as will any of the muslims that came and went as reported by the neighbor that had anything to do with this. They will play the faulty initial reporting line. Its also why the FBI is letting the press destroy the crime scenes after they make their initial pass for useful evidence.

The Administration needs this to be about 2 crazies that just happen to be Muslim and any facts that don't support that narrative are going to get covered up.

Blogger Robert What? December 07, 2015 1:42 PM  

I'm completely willing to believe it was a FF, if the dead shooters were white Christian males or "militia" members. But our government is trying to import Muslims as fast as they can do it. So why inspire the public against Muslims?

Blogger BunE22 December 07, 2015 1:43 PM  

I don't believe her.

AFAIK there were no reports of shots fired before they entered the building directly into the event room. She claims she heard shots fired from an automatic weapon, do shots fired sound different to an inexperienced person?

Unless you're trained LE or military you would not notice how many clips someone is wearing, and possibly not even what type of weapon they're holding. Eyewitness accounts are notoriously incorrect and her account is too precise.

The police were onto the vehicle so soon because people at the event told LE about Farook leaving and then the shooting taking place. LE ran his name, got his address, and went to check out his home when they saw the vehicle that had been described as leaving the scene by a man who worked across from the shooting. While under surveillance the couple took off in the vehicle so police gave chase.

The police did detain a third person who was seen running from the area of the vehicular shootout, but he was not involved and ran from the scene as any normal person would.

She's the false flag.

Blogger Danby December 07, 2015 1:43 PM  

I believe that in a threat situation, you see what you fear. She's afraid of tall, athletic white men, dressed in black clothing and carrying automatic weapons. That's the monster fuel in her brain, whether put there by her childhood, by movies, by her culture, whatever. That was the scariest thing her brain could come up with at the time, so that's what she saw.
Think Snow White, panicking in the woods at night. That's exactly how the human brain works.

Anonymous WillBest December 07, 2015 1:47 PM  

How was it that only two civilians in that building were killed? I don't know if they worked there or not, but I would think a crazy would have shot every doctor and staff member in that place.

Something definitely doesn't add up about that attack. The guy might legitimately be crazy. Schizophrenic or some such. Possibly its some sort of domestic dispute or quarrel with an individual doctor. If it were politically motivated it was ridiculously incompetent given the amount of time he had. Best explanation that fits the narrative would be cold feet after the adrenaline from the initial shooting spree.

Blogger J Van Stry December 07, 2015 1:47 PM  

@52
They knew where to go, because many of the survivors recognized their co-worker. The ski mask he wore didn't conceal enough of his face for them not to recognize someone they'd worked with for years.
And they told the police who had attacked them.

OpenID luciussomesuch December 07, 2015 1:52 PM  

@74: " But our government is trying to import Muslims as fast as they can do it. So why inspire the public against Muslims?"

--Assuming FedGov is running fake shooting events, they can create whatever sort of one-sided or dialectical narrative they want.

As far as official government responses are concerned, there simply cannot be such a thing as evil Islam as long as it is domestic. Leftoid zombies eat this up and only simmer with further rage against bitter-clinger "phobes". Right-leaning voters are demoralized by their governments' intractable dedication to foreign wars and domestic immivasion. Nationalistic persons might be finally stirred into acts of undissembled violence or revolt, thus giving countenance to martial law.

If the President uses Muslim violence as a pretext to impose gun control on the native White majority, just imagine what he can do with a counter-instance of "right-wing terror". Which can either be faked or waited for, depending.

But for my part, if it be not treason to say I'd countenance a right-wing coup in France, then yes, I would countenance a right-wing coup in France, seeing as the French government is determined to destroy its own people. Infer what you will of my attitude towards governments that work to destroy their own people.

Blogger Bluntobj Winz December 07, 2015 1:53 PM  

Looking further at the discussion, I have another point to add:

If the witness here is islamic, then the probability that this is a propaganda ploy for play on al jazeerah. The narrative will be that .gov killed these people, then framed Sayeed and his wife for the deed, like the FBI has been doing for the last dozen years.

In this case the witness is supporting the first narrative that was broadcast to the world, and is ensuring that any revision to the story would simply be US propaganda to be dismissed.

I was listening to the scanner too, and there was way to much about a 3rd shooter coming out.

This also ties in to the whole confiscation of cell phone video/audio. It's hard to challenge the narrative when faced with "pics or STFU"

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 1:53 PM  

@40 Student in Blue

Were the police and news basing their initial count of three shooters based on Abdelmageed alone, however?
---

I recall hearing about the 3rd shooter over and over on the police radio. There was also mention of taking one of them into custody.

That's all suspicious, but I also was hearing some other crazy stuff. I'm not sure if there were multiple events being talked about at the same time or what.

For instance, there was at one point a lot of talk about a black guy running through back yards. There was also talk about a hispanic guy holed up in a church or cathedral.

It's all very suspicious.

Blogger Jack Ward December 07, 2015 1:54 PM  

Three perfs? Maybe. If the third, assuming that there was a third, was captured, the PTB may be holding that person unreported while they wring him/her dry. Wrung dry by any means whatsoever.
They might not report this third person in order to lull ISIS into complacency after getting actionable information from same. Then, use this info to lower the boom on the jihads.
Yeah, I know. This assumes the government forces had enough neurons rubbing together to do this, and/or their handlers are letting them. Who knows anymore.

Blogger Gordon December 07, 2015 2:02 PM  

@66: JaimeInTexas:

I can't speak to the existence of any security cameras. But there really are hundreds, if not thousands, of people who were on the freeway the plane passed over, plus those on the streets nearby. Everyone saw an airliner. One of the authors of the official report said that they didn't bother documenting that strike further simply because there were so many witnesses. And the guy who the theorists quote as saying it was a cruise missile has stated many times that he saw the airliner. The conspiracy guys had to excise a tiny piece of his quote, and to do so is to deliberately falsify evidence.

As for the alleged third shooter, perhaps the police had interviewed this gal and took her "three guys dressed in black" as gospel, and out it went on the radio. Later, when the wounded were interviewed and named the loser and his mail-order jihadiette as the shooters, they were able to focus on their apartment and vehicle.

My thoughts are that the two had something bigger in mind. But he got all butthurt over something said at the office party, or perhaps that there was a party at all. He ran home to his new mommy and they threw on the gear, drove to the site and started shooting, because the county failed to create a safe space for him.

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 2:06 PM  

@41 Nate

everything about this smells bad to me. All the signs of a pro hit... then total amateur hour in the take down.
---

yeah, and there were reports of some kind of SWAT training nearby. How convenient.

And then there is the issue of the FBI or whoever letting the media invade the property of the 2 suspects. So let the media in to see a bomb factory.

It stinks all right. I'm not able to really come to a good reason of why it would be a setup or hoax.

They make the media look like idiots when they get a boner wishing it was whitey NRA Christian rednecks, and are again proven wrong. But so what? That's just what they do anyway.

They gin up even further anti-muslim fervor amongst the populace. But so what? This was unnecessary in this respect, because the rags help this along fine by themselves.

And Obomil, who still can't say ISIS, gets to give another widely ignored speech yammering about gun control. Again, he could do this anytime and didn't really need this shooting for that.

We all know his thing about the no-fly zone is a trap, since he can have the next Lois Lerner put everyone but terrorists and Mexicans on the no fly list. And no fly list has nothing to do with the two who were suppose to be behind all this.

Blogger Skylark Thibedeau December 07, 2015 2:08 PM  

Isis Sally was the first person the media interviewed and her description of 3 white militia in camo and body armor fit the Dylan Roof/Domestic terrorism narrative the Administration was looking for. After all if Dylan Roof caused Confederate Flags to be taken down an attack by Right Wing Supremacists with Machine Guns would be good fodder for taking down the Second Amendment.

I'm betting the momen Isis Sally's account was aired and seemingly verified by the Gamergate Troll, the Left wing Propaganda machine went into full force to push the anti gun narrative. Using Twitter as the JornoList they coordinated their narrative and launched the attack prematurely.

When the fact it was just another case of Wahabi Workplace violence it was too late to stop the presses. The President tried valiantly to rescue the narrative last evening but failed completely.

Anonymous By Way of Deception Thou Shalt Do War December 07, 2015 2:10 PM  

This is actually evidence against a false flag, if the implication is that ISIS knew in advance that there were three assailants, rather than merely reacting to media reports of same.

Not really. There are two kinds of false flag events - LIHOP and MIHOP.

ISIS could well have known in advance, and the FedGov/CIA/DHS/NSA/BATF/FBI could have known and Let It Happen On Purpose.

I personally believe it was MIHOP, because ISIS is a CIA creation...but LIHOP is certainly plausible.

Anonymous Roundtine December 07, 2015 2:11 PM  

Occam's Razor: News said 3 shooters. ISIS learned of the attack from the news and thanked the 3.

Blogger LP999 December 07, 2015 2:12 PM  

Attune timing for Pearl Harbor.

FF or not, both the couple and the reported 3 had help.

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 2:20 PM  

Maybe 3rd perp din do nuffin'?

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 2:21 PM  

@48 haus frau

I can't imagine Bonny and Clyde weren't known to intelligence agencies. The piss poor handling of the apartment crime scene by the FBI indicates they don't really want to investigate too much.

----

I love you guys! In another speculation, what if the intelligence knew ahead of time that this attack was planned, but didn't try to prevent it. Instead of trying to prevent it, they had training set up nearby to try and deal with it in real life.

Regarding that FBI bit, they might have staged everything that was in there for the media. There was suppose to be a list they left behind indicating what they confiscated.

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 2:25 PM  

@50 J Van Stry

When I was flying in the military I think they spent a week just teaching us how to observe and showing us how our eyes could be fooled, and our senses easily tricked. And we would constantly get reminders on how what we thought we were seeing might not be what was actually there, and not to color our observations with things we really didn't have experience with.
---

I had this explained to me by a great artist once. He was saying that what we see is a kind of "iconic" vision. Our mind fills in iconic things. Another interesting thing he pointed out regarded photographs. If you look at any family photos, and you turn that icon-vision off in your mind, you'll begin to notice that arms and legs are longer and shorter than the other, and all sorts of optical illusion type stuff. All depending on the angle of the photo.

Anonymous Discard December 07, 2015 2:29 PM  

Why does a government building in a high-crime city like Berdoo not have security cameras?

Anonymous YIH December 07, 2015 2:30 PM  

Guess who wants more moslims here?
Glenn ''soccer balls and teddy bears'' Cuck.

Blogger LP999 December 07, 2015 2:30 PM  

90 the country or pencil pusher let another idiot woman in the country with a death wish.

Christmas tree and workplace dispute are failed narratives. Also failed is more gun control.

Blogger Cataline Sergius December 07, 2015 2:33 PM  

everything about this smells bad to me. All the signs of a pro hit... then total amateur hour in the take down.

If this was a professional job there are some leading indictors that are absent. Hard core caliphate Jihadis want mass casualties and lots of attention. If it was trained three man team I would have expected them to round up as many hostages as possible, make some kind of announcement and then start killing as many of them as they could until the cops breeched them.

The presence and type of IED indicates two things. They did have something like that in mind and they got a lot of their training from the Anarchist's Cookbook.

Fatalities would have been three times around thirty+ in that scenario. Instead the shooters just walked in and started shooting.

It's quite possible they weren't expecting to survive the operation and then when they did, they were at a complete loss as to what to do next.

Hence the driving past their own home, possible attempt to reconnect with their own lives or were they wondering if they had gotten away clean.



Blogger Hammerli280 December 07, 2015 2:36 PM  

@59 VD:
It would not surprise me if there were a third terrorist involved. Certainly the initial reports were of "two or three" people. There was plenty of time to drop Terrorist #3 off somewhere...and the neighbors reported a significant number of Middle Eastern visitors at that house.

I'm betting that the terror cell is larger than the FBI is publicly discussing.

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 2:37 PM  

"If this was a professional job there are some leading indictors that are absent. Hard core caliphate Jihadis want mass casualties and lots of attention. If it was trained three man team I would have expected them to round up as many hostages as possible, make some kind of announcement and then start killing as many of them as they could until the cops breeched them. "

No.

That's not how pros do it.

Pros go in... hit... and leave. with about as much emotion and fuss as you taking a crap.

I think you're thinking of professional terrorists. I am not. I'm talking about professional killers.

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 2:38 PM  

what makes the most sense right now... is a professional hit... IEDs were cover... with mis information designed to sick the authorities on the couple.

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 2:47 PM  

Who's smart enough to pull off something like that? Cartels maybe?

Blogger Phat Repat December 07, 2015 2:48 PM  

'Supreme' court has decided NOT to hear case regarding town banning assault weapons.

"If a ban on semi‐automatic guns and large‐capacity magazines reduces the perceived risk from a mass shooting and makes the public feel safer as a result, that’s a substantial benefit," Judge Frank Easterbrook, who was appointed to the appeals court by President Ronald Reagan, wrote.

Now let's feel safer everyone. We wouldn't you to perceive risk. Feelings and perception. Just where are we headed; sad.

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 2:48 PM  

"Who's smart enough to pull off something like that? Cartels maybe?"

Inteligence agencies... cartels was my first thought but normally they are more brutal.

The attempt at misdirection makes me think it was some foreign intel agency

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 2:49 PM  

which also makes me wonder what exactly is going on at this strange large facility with active shooter drills every month.

Blogger bob k. mando December 07, 2015 2:51 PM  

98. Nate December 07, 2015 2:38 PM
what makes the most sense right now... is a professional hit... IEDs were cover... with mis information designed to sick the authorities on the couple.



major problem:
we have a VP regular saying that his mother in law was shot in the leg by Farook ... as in, she was AT the office party that got hit.

you going to say that testimony is a plant? or that the MIL is in on the false flag?

Blogger iain_boyd December 07, 2015 2:54 PM  

"Occam's Razor: News said 3 shooters. ISIS learned of the attack from the news and thanked the 3."

ISIS would also have every reason to promote the idea that there's a 3rd shooter out there and at large within the US to cause more fear.

Blogger Cail Corishev December 07, 2015 2:59 PM  

Wait... what would be the purpose of the False Flag?

"In my study of communist societies, I came to the conclusion that the purpose of communist propaganda was not to persuade or convince, not to inform, but to humiliate; and therefore, the less it corresponded to reality the better. When people are forced to remain silent when they are being told the most obvious lies, or even worse when they are forced to repeat the lies themselves, they lose once and for all their sense of probity. To assent to obvious lies is...in some small way to become evil oneself. One's standing to resist anything is thus eroded, and even destroyed. A society of emasculated liars is easy to control. I think if you examine political correctness, it has the same effect and is intended to." -- Theodore Dalrymple

Yeah, they could have a bunch of right-wing white guys shoot up a mosque, and sell that as a straightforward, "Look, whites do it too, so stop blaming Muslims." But it's much more confusing and demoralizing if you have Muslims do it, let everyone know they did it for Allah, and then harangue everyone into repeating the "religion of peace" mantra together again. It says, "Are you really gonna believe your lying eyes?"

Which doesn't mean it is a false flag. It just means that they can work on more than the most obvious level.

Blogger dc.sunsets December 07, 2015 3:03 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Salt December 07, 2015 3:05 PM  

cartels was my first thought but normally they are more brutal.

Brutal when it's to make a point. Swift and to get away if it's a targeted hit. I can image someone having seen something, or knowing something, and the hit made as to not draw attention to that; to misdirect.

Blogger Tom K. December 07, 2015 3:06 PM  

I always have problems with claims of so-called "false flag" operations.

Seriously. I'm supposed to believe that the U.S. government, one of the most incompetent actors on the world stage, which couldn't organize a circle jerk in a bath house for Obama is somehow recruiting American military or former military personnel to slaughter innocengs, involving the the admittedly duplicitous civilian media in the conspiracy AND that no one EVER turns on the conspirators and goes public. Sorry, I'm not that credulous.

I'm always reminded of what Chuck Colson said about the Watergate "conspiracy". He said just two weeks passed from the time Nixon have the order to cover-up Watergate and the time Dean turned on Nixon. Two weeks, he said. And we were defending the most powerful office in the world.

He used this example to silence those who said the disciples conspired to hide the body of Jesus and then died for their lie. " We weren't even willing to face the media with the lie, let alone die."

So where does the government get tbese loyal agents willing to kill innocents?

Blogger Ostar December 07, 2015 3:06 PM  

C'mon - it's an attack that could have killed a lot more people than it did. Muslim terrorists have done stupider things plenty of times before. Sometimes an incompetent jihadist is just an incompetent jihadist, to paraphrase Freud. Not everything is a conspiracy.

The government lying is probably mostly to hide their own incompetence re either not having them under watch or having them under watch and them attacking anyways.

Blogger Rabbi B December 07, 2015 3:14 PM  

False flag or not, what's always important is how the gov will make certain not to let this (or any)crisis go to waste.

Blogger Ostar December 07, 2015 3:16 PM  

@108 This - yes.

Blogger praetorian December 07, 2015 3:21 PM  

I'm supposed to believe that the U.S. government, one of the most incompetent actors on the world stage...

Who said anything about the U.S. government?

Anonymous Athor Pel December 07, 2015 3:24 PM  

"48. Blogger haus frau December 07, 2015 12:45 PM
If the fed gov did this false flag why on earth would they not use a white male patsy?
..."




The bad muslim narrative, terrorist narrative, is important from a fedgov defense spending perspective. Having an active shooter event is also important for government spending justification but for police and intel rather than pure national defense. But that's the dialectic in you motivating you to look at the money, the material advantage. There's more to it than that.

If something happens that seems staged or weird then it might not be aimed at you. The people running the op and their motivations don't have to be your personal boogeyman. It's not always the phone cops of Johnnie Fever's nightmares nor is Johnnie always the target.

It may be a false flag, it may not. It doesn't matter. Look at this event as rhetoric and not dialectic. It's meant to push emotional buttons and short circuit rational thought. This witness could very well be an integral part of the operation, put out there to cause confusion. Or not.

Remember, the people running things aren't on your side. They may have merely needed to justify a couple line items in their budget and saw a mass murder as a cost effective means for that. They may actually be in the business of providing events like this and got paid to do it. But like I said, there's more to it than that.

The world runs on fear. High levels of discernment don't exist in most people. They go with first impressions, accepting what they're told. The San Bernadino shooting is above all a fear inducing event. That is it's main purpose. And in that it was very successful.

People ask, "Why a government office that deals with retards?"

How many here are a little more observant when in public now? Maybe a little apprehensive? Do you notice the muslims now?

How about the two muslim women and their kids at the grocery store, did you immediately notice that the kid's stuffed animal was big enough to hold a bomb or a couple pistols? Did you watch to see them move the stuffed animal around to get an idea how much it weighed? Did you think about that before? How about the number of obvious muslims waiting at bus stops on your drive home from work? Did you notice them before? Were they there before? Why weren't they driving? Probably because they're new in country and haven't bought a car yet.

Now ask, "Why a government office that deals with retards?" Because if they would go after a non-entity place like that they will go after any place, including wherever you are right now. It's about the fear.

Blogger Thomas Davidsmeier December 07, 2015 3:25 PM  

They even reported that it was the brother or brother-in-law didn't they? They named him, I thought...

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis December 07, 2015 3:26 PM  

That's the other thing...everyone talks about the police mentioning of a 3rd shooter over the radios and the lack of one as evidence for something stinks in Denmark' but...how can you say that the Police were at a complete fucking loss on what was going on and that they were simply going off of a rumor of rumor. Agency's chasing their tails on erroneous information during a crisis situation isn't a new thing and frankly I would consider the norm rather than the exception. So, you know, Occrams razor and some such.

Blogger Curtis December 07, 2015 3:28 PM  

Another twist:

FBI raid home of 'ISIS terrorist's' childhood friend - as it's revealed 'HE bought Syed Farook assault rifles, then fell out with him as he became more devout' and checked into mental unit after the attack

Meh. Probably just de-programming the stress and guilt.

http://tinyurl.com/jarszvw

Blogger luagha December 07, 2015 3:32 PM  

I also recall hearing about the brother/brother-in-law.

Blogger Cataline Sergius December 07, 2015 3:37 PM  

@97 Nate

I think you're thinking of professional terrorists. I am not. I'm talking about professional killers.

I'm sticking with my nagging wife theory.

Blogger DadOfTen December 07, 2015 3:38 PM  

False flags work great. Like when Hitler wanted to invade Poland, but that took only a few hours to execute, and then it was done. No one cared that the whole army knew about it.

In this case someone would have to make the decision. Then at least 20 intensely patriotic people, at least half of them religious, with background checks back to where they were conceived would have to keep their mouths shut for the rest of their lives. It wouldn't work. Several would fairly quickly rat out the operation and protect themselves by posting it on 20 internet sites and getting an interview on TV.

I think it is much more likely that the MCB is fixing an active undead incident.

(I originally heard about your association with Larry Correia while reading Monster Hunters Inc. I had to go there.)

Blogger Curtis December 07, 2015 3:38 PM  

@108

The same way you can get drone pilots to throw missiles knowing that they are killing MOSTLY innocent people including children.

Oh. Wait! They're all Muslims! My bad.

The fact is, USgov does have human drones at its disposal who WILL do what they are told to "protect American lives". Wink. USA! USA! USA!

But, but, everybody would know. You don't even know the half of it.

Blogger David of One December 07, 2015 3:47 PM  

Unless substantiated by the survivors and others in attendance of the attack and photographic evidence ... this woman is lying. Especially as it very much fits the narrative that sick bastards are desperate for to push their Marxist NWO agenda.

For me it was extremely strange that the authorities were very slow, even nonchalant, about rushing over to the church to capture or kill the 3rd terrorist.

Supposedly, this afternoon, the FBI announced that detailed interviews would begin this week and/or next week. Until the survivors and witnesses are interviewed and provide some sort of substantiation, the 3rd terrorist appears to be a rumor.

Blogger paradox December 07, 2015 3:55 PM  

I see CA shooting as a false flag in that the US created ISIS. Knowing Muslims would radicalize and leaving the borders open for political gain via terrorism.

As for police issued weapons, I think that's an Alex Jones comprehension issue. Of course the firearms are police issued, you can buy the same issued M&P firearms the cops use.

Anonymous More Things in Heaven and Earth December 07, 2015 3:58 PM  

practically all of the people in Dealey Plaza reported more than three shots.

Arlen Spector (Jew), apparently is still alive and well, and his magic bullet minion true believers are making the rounds. Great.
And yet, no mention of the House findings nor of mention of the super duper secrets involved that need to be hidden from the public in national security to-this-day sealed documents. Only those who are true believers and have only looked at it superficially would ever believe the Government - most Americans do not as the polls show, but of course, that's what true believers do. That identity with Government and their heretofore world view might be rent asunder otherwise.

As for the Pentagram, Hanjour couldn't even fly and could never have done that, nor could the plane, as countless pilots have noted. And that's hardly the only evidence at the Pentagram.

It's ok. Let the shock and pain work its magic and find not only freedom, but Truth. Then you can participate in exposing the evil works of darkness to the light. You know the root of their psych game right? Fear and Pride.

Blogger Dalrock December 07, 2015 4:03 PM  

Even knowing how incompetent the Obama administration and their allies are, the idea that they would gin up a false flag attack in order to generate fear of radical islam doesn't pass the laugh test.

Obama and the left wants Americans terrified of white militia members with guns, not of Sudden Jihad Syndrome. One is helpful to the agenda of disarming the population and importing 10,000 Syrian refugees. The other is not.

Blogger Azimus December 07, 2015 4:23 PM  

VD:
Now, who is more likely to be lying, this woman or the government? Which party has a longer track record of being less than entirely honest


Weren't there more than 50 survivors of this attack? If she is the only one saying "3 tall white men" and everyone else is saying "yeah, the guy I worked with for 5yrs and his new wife", I do tend to doubt this witness's credibility.

Blogger Azimus December 07, 2015 4:25 PM  

WATYF #0222 December 07, 2015 11:46 AM
Wait... what would be the purpose of the False Flag? This only serves to stir up anti-refugee and anti-immigration sentiment, which neither side of the ruling party wants.


Not to play both sides of the coin (I am doubting the credibility of a single uncorroborated witness), but "false flag" doesn't necessarily mean instigated by a government.

Blogger Rabbi B December 07, 2015 4:25 PM  

@123 Dalrock

Obama and the left wants Americans terrified of white militia members with guns, not of Sudden Jihad Syndrome.

Which also explains why they are pushing so hard to spin this as workplace violence, post partum depression, or whatever other lie they think they can foist upon the ignorant masses with impunity.

Anonymous YIH December 07, 2015 4:30 PM  

@62 Waterboy:
This is actually evidence against a false flag, if the implication is that ISIS knew in advance that there were three assailants, rather than merely reacting to media reports of same.
Remember moslim groups 'claim responsibility' as a boast not as a confession. It's quite possible 'ISIS' knew nothing of it until the news broke - when it became public that it was possibly moslim, they were happy to take the credit.
Of course, it could also be the 'wife' was indeed an operative, the breaking news confirmed the successful operation.

Blogger Azimus December 07, 2015 4:52 PM  

57. Scott6584 December 07, 2015 1:03 PM
So given that the identities of the shooters blew up the preferred narrative, just WHO would have been behind such a false flag attack?


1. Neo-cons. More war in ME.
2. Nationalists. Shut down immigration. This also happened in France.
3. Other groups that specifically do not want Muslims living in the US, like Jewish people for example.
4. Anti-gun factions. More momentum to take guns away.
5. Rudy C Hernandez Community Center, San Bernardino, CA. Will benefit from cancelled reservations due to attack/crime scene shut down.

Anonymous WaterBoy December 07, 2015 5:01 PM  

YIH @127: "It's quite possible 'ISIS' knew nothing of it until the news broke - when it became public that it was possibly moslim, they were happy to take the credit."

Yes, that's why I added the bit about the timing of the ISIS comment -- if they made the "three lions" statement prior to any public announcement via media or reports on police traffic being publicized, it would indicate they were somehow familiar with it (even if only aware of the operation but not actively involved). And of course, it doesn't necessarily mean that they weren't involved, even if their comments came afterward.

But I'm not aware of ISIS 'officially' claiming credit, like they did with the Garland attack.

Blogger Bill December 07, 2015 5:05 PM  

Nate:
Why do you think it was total amateur hour in the take down? They got away from the house, but the cops got them boxed in with two bearcats. Not much you can do against bearcats except become a bullet magnet.

Blogger Danby December 07, 2015 5:10 PM  

@129 Azimus
5. Rudy C Hernandez Community Center,

World-class, man, world-class.

Anonymous Anonymous December 07, 2015 5:26 PM  

I don't think so.

I think they were part of a larger cell and as it got closer to the date of whatever they planned to attack the couple got more and more hyped up and so were set off early by an incident at work.

No way that amount of kit was assembled to attack a disabled centre.

FedGov don't want to admit there was a bigger cell.

Anonymous YIH December 07, 2015 5:27 PM  

Another reason to like Trump; His grasp of the bleedin' obvious

Blogger bob k. mando December 07, 2015 5:29 PM  

118. Cataline Sergius December 07, 2015 3:37 PM
I'm sticking with my nagging wife theory.



that fits with the story from JCClimber's (?) MiL that Farook shot her in the leg and walked away.

if Farook was also primarily wounding and most of the fatalities were generated by Tashfeen ... this would also explain the low body count.

Blogger jacopo.saracini December 07, 2015 6:06 PM  

A couple odd items:

Media allowed to walk through the perps' apartment where supposed personal ID info was still on the scene, before the Administration dropped the workplace violence cannard.

Unused IEDs -- did something accelerate the couples' plans? Did they catch wind of some heat and decide to jihad the office party?

Maybe they should have contracted out the remote detonator design to Clockmed.

I'm leaning toward a botched FBI operation that triggered the couple to implement a plan B because the Administration is behaving the same as it did during the Benghazi affair by covering its rear initially with implausible theories: workplace violence and inadequate gun control.

Blogger Azimus December 07, 2015 6:08 PM  

132. Blogger Danby December 07, 2015 5:10 PM
@129 Azimus
5. Rudy C Hernandez Community Center,

World-class, man, world-class.


Nobody ever expects the little guy!!!

Blogger bob k. mando December 07, 2015 6:08 PM  

for everybody claiming false flag who missed it:
@46 JCclimber December 07, 2015 12:42 PM

a church member was in charge of this particular event and via her mother (also a church member) reported that she knew this Farook as a colleague (well, actually I'm guessing she was his supervisor).

He stood over her, could have aimed at her head, but instead swung the gun down and shot her in the leg and moved on to other people.



it's still possible that this was a 'false flag' in that the FBI / Homeland Security / Deep State was keeping tabs on these clowns and permitted this to go forward.

but we've got eyewitness testimony being reported by Ilk here.

either you admit that Farook and Tashfeen were the primary shooters
OR
JCclimber and / or his church member's mother is in on the disinfo campaign.

Blogger Nate December 07, 2015 6:20 PM  

"Why do you think it was total amateur hour in the take down? They got away from the house, but the cops got them boxed in with two bearcats. Not much you can do against bearcats except become a bullet magnet."

Because they never should have been anywhere near their house. A pro hit would've been in and out... and 2.5 hours later would be likely out of the country already.

These two acted like complete pros during the hit... then... went home?

K.

Again... my skepicism comes from the testimony of how cool and calm they were during the events and how they were able to simply shut it down and walk away without a trace.

Need more background on these folks. makes me wonder if their whole backstory isn't in fact BS.

Blogger Zaklog the Great December 07, 2015 6:32 PM  

Why would our current government create a false flag attack perpetrated by white men and pinned on Muslims? That seems directly opposite their usual behavior.

Anonymous Poli_Mis December 07, 2015 6:55 PM  

Yup

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 6:59 PM  

@114 Thomas Davidsmeier

They even reported that it was the brother or brother-in-law didn't they? They named him, I thought...
---

There was a brother or brother in law that they interviewed, I think he was the guy who popped up out of nowhere with CAIR in the middle of it.

He said something we roundly mocked for hours on brietbart during all that. Paraphrasing "Farooq had just recently memorized the koran. I don't know why he would do something like this."

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 7:06 PM  

@119 DadOfTen

I think it is much more likely that the MCB is fixing an active undead incident.
---

This is better than my sneaking suspicion that this was a gay multicultural Dr. Who adventure.

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 7:11 PM  

@121 David of One

For me it was extremely strange that the authorities were very slow, even nonchalant, about rushing over to the church to capture or kill the 3rd terrorist.

--

That guy in particular I believe was the mysterious hispanic. I even remember thinking he was dressed like Ronald McDonald as they were saying he had yellow pants and an orange shirt. Or something like that :P

And lo and behold the link from @116 has a hispanic child hood friend of the rag that bought them their rifles.

And now from that link above in post

Blogger Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 7:20 PM  

Another false flag idea:

What if this was staged to turn back the idea that police forces don't need to be so heavily militarized?

Anonymous BigGaySteve December 07, 2015 7:24 PM  

Hard core caliphate Jihadis want mass casualties and lots of attention.

Hard Core JIHADISTS WANT VIDEOS, NOTE THE 2 GOPRO CAMERAS NOT RECOVERED. The video of the attack on Christmas in the US is worth far more than extra bodies, and leaving early to make sure the video makes it to Al Gorzeera

Abdelmageed? So she's a Muslim? And she's blaming the white guys instead of the saintly Muslim couple

How do you count magazines unless they are taped together? Possible false report to help them escape. If the GOPRO cameras ran we will find out the truth. Initial reports at 1:20 CA time said 3 middle eastern people, with Farooks name shortly after. Its nice she was able to count the mags on moving/shooting people.

Not if they had cop-level shooting skills. They'd be lucky to make it out of the building without shooting each other.

Chris Dorner was a CA cop. Leftists still thought he was unfairly fired for bad behavior even after he shot up a cops family.

The average dolt making up security services and the average extreme dolt leading bureaucracies

I say 2 things about conspiracies. "What if there is no conspiracy and the govt really is this stupid" & "a conspiracy is 2 women plotting to give a 3rd a bad peer review"

Another thing was that she had just sent everyone on a break during a party

Holly micromanaging batman, a party that has scheduled breaks?

There was the third guy for the McVeigh crew.

McVeigh never would have been caught if he was not speeding. The cop arrested him because he was acting funny so he was already behind bars when his pic went out.

I can't imagine Bonny and Clyde weren't known to intelligence agencies.

There are thousands of bad moslems being tracked

I agree that the guy is probably in some deep dark hole..closing Gitmo but there will always be a place

BigGaySteve's moslem waterboarding services is available.

Anonymous BGS December 07, 2015 7:39 PM  

I think they were part of a larger cell and as it got closer to the date of whatever they planned to attack the couple got more and more hyped up and so were set off early by an incident at work.

No way that amount of kit was assembled to attack a disabled centre.


That is my belief they got triggered by people eating free ham. Breitbart says there is a chance of a 12-8-2015 attack.

Blogger Azimus December 07, 2015 7:41 PM  

Were-Puppy December 07, 2015 7:20 PM
What if this was staged to turn back the idea that police forces don't need to be so heavily militarized?


Then the bearcats/SWAT teams and all that would be being hailed right now as preventing/containing a massive killing spree rather than simply avenging it. To my knowledge no one is saying this.

Blogger Bill December 07, 2015 7:54 PM  

I've been wondering about the going home angle. Thoughts; They wanted to upload the GoPro video themselves and also resupply for another target. They had a serious stash, so obviously they were planning another attack.

My guess is that they had coaching, not actual training. The coach may have said that they'd have a few hours before the cops showed up, or they might have thought they got away clean.

Anonymous redsash December 07, 2015 8:47 PM  

San Bernardino shootings and days later the House of Commons votes to bomb ISIS in Syria. The Saudis let the lady through, and the Saudis want Assad out. Game - Set - Maybe Match.

Blogger Benjamin Willard December 07, 2015 8:52 PM  

A "false flag"? This would entail dozens - if not hundreds of local and federal .gov employees to be in on the conspiracy. Too many moving parts.

"Three men can keep a secret, if two of them are dead." - A very smart man.

C'mon Vox...

-Ichi

Blogger Joshua Sinistar December 07, 2015 9:19 PM  

You'll have to excuse Vox. He may be superintelligent like me, but apparently he must have imbibed too much coffee recently and saw an episode of the X-Files featuring that loveable ex-Governor Jesse The Body Ventura in which a Ray Harryhausen character magically returns as a space alien to say hello to Jose Chung and everyone's favorite Ghost Hunter Charles Nelson Reilly.
Being an unofficial expert on strategy and gaming, he's apparently not familiar with disinfo black ops like false flags. You see false flag operations are done to support the propaganda line of corrupt states to increase their power and influence. I'm glad some of you Alex Jones boys have pointed out that Muslims are a protected class of The Soviet Suicide Pact of Climate Change Racism.
Obviously with the simplistic and outdated taqiyya method developed over a thousand years ago, this alien from Egypt has obvious and upfront needs to obfuscate Muslim perfidies simply for the purposes of preventing the String the up Theory for offensive minority control which most of us remember as both effective and satisfying at pest control for her and her Flammable Rag Brigade of Useless Bipedal Pollutant.
We need to definitely change the climate and atmosphere by reducing these populations of bipedal pollutants using easy to make and employ firebombs like napalm to show them what our definition of Black Flag is in relation to them.
Remember: Join the Mobile Infantry. Get Citizenship. Visit a Hive of Scum and Villainy, then Kill it. Mobile Infantry: We Kill Bugs Dead.

Blogger Von Zeitgeist December 07, 2015 9:44 PM  

A few observations from someone who was in the business. I was a cop in Northern CA for 14 yrs, >9 on SWAT.
1. That there was a tactical team drill nearby recently is unremarkable. There are so many teams in the LA area, and San Bernardino is on the emptier east side of the valley where all the good ranges and open areas are, that there is likely SWAT training of some sort going on there on any given day. My team traveled there a few times a year, and we were 400 miles away.
2. The dead woman being cuffed is not anomalous. The only time I approached a dead suspect without first cuffing and then searching anywhere his cuffed hands could reach was the time he had finished the job with his shotgun. That one was pretty obvious. She could have been 99% dead and twitched a finger to a bomb vest button hidden in her hand or on her person. Dead people get cuffed.
3. Occam's Razor is a sharp tool. No US group could have done this without 100+ people in logistical and support trail, and someone would talk. This isn't developing the SR71 or some other unambiguous good to keep quiet. The people to do this would not be tech geeks who live for being on the cutting edge so cutting them off from it if they talked would be a penalty. Someone would get big money for talking, and so they would.
4. Witness statements in a dynamic situation are suspect. Muslim named witness statements even more so as we have a reason to believe their world view does not necessarily comport with reality.
5. The pipe bombs shown on TV are EXACTLY like those that the AQ magazine Inspire taught readers to make. Not anarchist cookbook recipes which are more likely to go off when you make them, but actual instructions.

After my cop time, I went to the ME as a contractor for 4 years. I learned Arabic and spent much time talking to people from Palestinians to Iraqis before going to the 'Stans and trying to make do there. I learned some lessons, including that the savages have little patience and so the fact that most of their plans do not work well should not be a surprise. The poster's story about his mother in law IIRC rings true. I also suspect they were surprised by how efficient US law enforcement is when a situation like this occurs. The resources it can bring to bear on this sort of thing in a place like the LA basin are amazing and they all communicate, which a Pakistani/Saudi would have a hard time believing.

Blogger praetorian December 07, 2015 10:03 PM  

our current government

I was joking above, but seriously: why assume it was *our* government? There are lots of countries I can think of that would want us pissed off at arabs. Two obvious ones. One of them even tried shit like this before.

Blogger Aeoli Pera December 07, 2015 10:11 PM  

I'm as crazy and paranoid as anybody but I think this one was real.

Anonymous map December 07, 2015 10:38 PM  

If the FBI can set someone up by having them push the trigger on a fake bomb, then why can't the FBI set someone up by pushing the trigger on a real one?

The former is a "foiled bomb plot" and the latter is a false flag.

In all cases, the solution to real or false-flag terrorism is the same: don;t allow Moslems in the West. You get rid of real Jihad and you get rid of fake Jihad.

Remember, that a false flag is merely fake, but accurate. It is a catalyzed attack instead of one that occurs organically.

Blogger deadman December 07, 2015 10:49 PM  

Didn't read every comment, so if already covered...
Reasons for #SanBerdinoShooting being a false flag?

- Too much coverage of Saudi / Turkish / U.S. links to Islamic state, thus requiring a distraction.
- Perpetuates the divide & conquer motif between people in the West.
- Potential for policy promoting boots on the ground in Syria.
- The obvious gun control desires.

So seeing as the main thrust in geopolitics after climate change policy, is kicking Assad off of the x-mas card list.
Can't have the public thinking the Saudi's & the White House are in bed with Islamic State / Daesh, now can we.
Best to get them arguing amongst themselves about guns & moozlimz.

Blogger Miss Carnivorous December 07, 2015 11:45 PM  

She wanted it to be "white men". In fact, the media set her up to expect that " white men" would come gunning for her any minute. That, and the fact that eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable, makes me believe that the Pakistani love birds are entirely responsible for the attack. I almost feel sorry for the poor male half of the couple. He married a terrorist and she pussy whipped him into trying to commit genocide against infidels.

Anonymous Ain December 07, 2015 11:53 PM  

According to contacts in the SB Sheriff department, the third shooter is still at large, and they have uncovered evidence of a terrorist cell of four (possibly five) still exists in San Bernardino. Purportedly, they found evidence that the cell was or is planning to attack movie theaters and shopping complexes. If the government's behind it, it's unlikely they would have local law enforcement in the loop (IMO). Evidence can be fabricated, though this information was received before the atrocity of what can only be described as the deliberate destruction of the crime scene (proof beyond all else that something is amiss).

I continue to see people arguing over two possibilities when both can be true. Why is it either the government or islamic terrorism? I don't have enough information to favor one over the other, but don't rule out the possibility of both factions being involved. Useful idiots are useful idiots.

Blogger David of One December 07, 2015 11:53 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger David of One December 08, 2015 12:10 AM  

@144 Were-Puppy

I didn't know about this "childhood" friend buying guns ... it would seem that evil and stupid are almost limitless.

The depths of which should maybe make "entertaining" reading and nothing more ... never to exist in reality and yet here we are ... there is way too much evil and stupid in the world.

Blogger bob k. mando December 08, 2015 1:34 AM  

153. Von Zeitgeist December 07, 2015 9:44 PM
A few observations from someone who was in the business. I was a cop in Northern CA for 14 yrs, >9 on SWAT.


the only relevant question for you to answer is this:
why would the PD allow reporters to over run the crime scene and hopelessly contaminate and destroy evidence after only a couple of hours investigation?

Blogger Akulkis December 08, 2015 4:48 AM  

@ 50 J. Van Stry

"

When I was flying in the military I think they spent a week just teaching us how to observe and showing us how our eyes could be fooled, and our senses easily tricked. And we would constantly get reminders on how what we thought we were seeing might not be what was actually there, and not to color our observations with things we really didn't have experience with."

Would be interested in hearing more about this.

Anonymous Takin' a Look December 08, 2015 5:17 AM  

At this point, does it matter if it was musloids or .gov or a combo of the two? It's all a pile of disinfo and misinfo. It's dividing and conquering us when we should be saying "enough, get out!"

Blogger Von Zeitgeist December 08, 2015 6:50 AM  

@162 I have seen crime scenes entered inappropriately by the press, usually accidentally and nothing like this. I have no theory beyond someone somewhere screwed up and left it unguarded.

Blogger Were-Puppy December 08, 2015 10:38 AM  

@148 Azimus

Then the bearcats/SWAT teams and all that would be being hailed right now as preventing/containing a massive killing spree rather than simply avenging it. To my knowledge no one is saying this.
---


Not so fast Kemosabe

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis December 08, 2015 10:59 AM  

For those who have a predilection for calling false flags... The Pentagon is denying that they bombed a Syrian army airbase and that there were no US aircraft operating in the Der-al Zour region, where the army base was, and that it was the Russians. So what's the vote here? US gov't lying? Russian false flag? Or an honest blue on blue by the Russians?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/pentagon-says-russian-%E2%80%94-not-american-%E2%80%94-warplanes-hit-a-syrian-army-base/ar-AAg7bYZ?li=BBnb7Kz

Anonymous Takin' a Look December 08, 2015 2:40 PM  

What.The.FUCK!?!?!

That's it, if you are an American and STILL think it is okay to have our boys over there YOU are a cuckservative. This is bullshit!

Blogger Joshua Sinistar December 08, 2015 4:01 PM  

Look boys. Our frenemies in .gov land want more terrorism, but identifiable recent immigrant terrorists shit all over their "brilliant" Blackadder plans to overrun us with hostile alien bugs. They are not stupid enough to make false flags that arm their opponents and shit on their own plans. They're really stupid, but not that stupid. They want gun control and these ain't White American gunowners who support Trump. A false flag would fit the profile of the TEA Party and not ragheadistani immigrates.

Blogger bob k. mando December 08, 2015 9:33 PM  

168. Takin' a Look December 08, 2015 2:40 PM
What.The.FUCK!?!?!



whether Obama's DoD is lying about Russian "incursion" into Turkish airspace, Obama's State Dept playing pattycake with the Turks for shooting the fucking thing down AT ALL is inexcusable and indicates that Obama is playing at least a double, if not triple, game.

given that, the idea that US planes would have bombed a Syrian army post, when the President has stated on numerous occasions that he wishes to drive Assad from power, makes this hit almost certainly US.



note that the US admits to bombing targets "at least 34 miles from Ayyash". oooooh, that's impressive, a whole 34 miles.

let's think this through.

all fighters in the theater ( except dedicated ground attack, like the Warthog ) are supersonic capable. Mach 1 @ 0' ASL is +750mph.

lets call the operational speed 700mph.

that means US attacks are acknowledged to have taken place LESS THAN 4 MINUTES transit time from this 'blue on blue' bombing.

even if bombed by A-10s, their cruising speed is still 340mph, which is a whole <6 minutes air time from the "official" target coords.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairchild_Republic_A-10_Thunderbolt_II


you remember how we bombed / near missed the French embassy when Reagan hit Libya, because the Frogs would let us overfly French airspace en route from the UK to the targets?

yeah, i don't think we ever admitted that was intentional either.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis December 09, 2015 12:24 AM  

@170

I am more than willing to consider the possibility of the US striking at a Syrian Army base, however, indicating that a desire of wanting to do something makes something certain doesn't make sense to me. I mean could just as easily say that Russia wants to further alienate the US from Iran given their recent détente and what better way to do it than orchestrate a false flag?

I mean frankly it could be anyone of the three especially but I have to say I am leaning towards blue on blue. 1) The city is currently being fought over with ISIS.

http://isis.liveuamap.com/en/2015/8-december-at-least-32-isis-terrorists-reported-killed-40

In fact the Russians bombed an oil refinery in in the region not two weeks ago and the Russian air force is active in the region as well.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=0aa_1448285183

https://twitter.com/WarUpdates/status/673767902374322176
Secondly is the silence by the Russians on the matter.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/12/deadly-air-strike-hits-syrian-forces-151207064554316.html

Why be silent on the matter if it was most certainly US fighters? Why would the Russians be silent if it was a false flag, let's not forget that Russians did say to the world they were bombing ISIS targets when they most definitely were not bombing ISIS targets.

I have to say given all that my vote is for blue on blue.

Anonymous VFM 261 December 10, 2015 1:50 AM  

Occam says you win today's edition of "Find the Jihadi".

Blogger Akulkis December 10, 2015 5:17 PM  

@172

I'm pretty sure that most nights, he sleeps at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, Federal District of Columbia, usually with some ?creature? identified as either a wookie, or a really bad post-op transsexual.

Blogger Theranter December 13, 2015 4:30 PM  

What if she was the third person?

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