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Saturday, January 16, 2016

Already at trade war

Cuckservatives, and economically maleducated conservatives, don't realize that the fact one is not fighting a war does not mean one is not already engaged in one:
In retort to Trump pointing out a necessary shift in trade position (a shift to put American interests first – a shift to stop the dependency on cheap import goods – a shift to use China’s dependency on access to our market to OUR advantage) Jeb Bush came back with an example of Boeing manufacturing.

Donald Trump, responding to Jeb’s Boeing example, pointed out China is forcing Boeing to open a manufacturing plant in China.  As typical from a candidate who is unfamiliar and unbriefed on the issue Jeb looked back incredulously and said:

    “C’mon man”…

There you have it.  There’s the disconnect.  Almost everyone missed it.  There, in that exact moment, is the spotlight upon all that is wrong with a professional political class; globalists dependent on Wall Street for their talking points.

Trump was 100% correct.

But the issue is bigger.

Not only is China demanding Boeing open a plant in China, the intent of such a plant provides an opportunity to explain why Trump is vitally important – and time is wasting.

China is refusing to trade with Boeing if the company does not move.  Why? It’s not about putting Chinese people to work, it’s about China importing their research and development, Boeing’s production secrets, into their country so they can learn, steal and begin to manufacture their own airliners.

This is just how China works.  In time, Comac, a state-owned, Shanghai-based aerospace company will then use the production secrets they have stolen, produce their own airliners, kick out Boeing, undercut the market, and sell cheaper manufactured airplanes to the global economy.

Boeing, the great American company that Jeb Bush thinks they are, becomes yet another notch on the Asian market belt.

All of those Boeing workers, those high-wage industrial skill jobs that support the American middle class, yeah – those jobs lost.   And the cycle continues.
Theory, logic, and fifty years of free trade experience all demonstrate the same thing: free trade impoverishes a wealthy nation and lowers its per capita wages toward the global average. And those are just the negative economic consequences. No amount of magical thinking and repeated chants of "ricardosmith ricardosmith" are going to change that.

If you want to go into more detail on the subject, read the relevant chapter of Cuckservative: How "Conservatives" Betrayed America.

Labels: ,

85 Comments:

Blogger The Kurgan January 16, 2016 4:14 AM  

Why u no rike cheap plane?
Why u so lacist?

Anonymous ivvenalis January 16, 2016 4:37 AM  

What...what the hell is Boeing doing? They can't not know what China's up to. This has been going on for decades now. China's industrial espionage, arm-twisting tech transfer agreements, ambition to build a domestic aerospace industry are all solid public knowledge. They're going to take delivery of exactly as many of those 300 planes as they need for engineering examples, then claim the planes "no longer meet our needs" as stipulated in the contract and Boeing will be left holding the bag, along with whatever debt they took on trying to "leverage" their 300 unhatched chicken.

Then Boeing will come back to Uncle Sam hat in hand.

Blogger Phillip George January 16, 2016 4:41 AM  

as a self appointed language purist I like to point out free speech isn't free speech and free markets never existed. It's one set of highly regulated markets versus another model of highly regulated.

Does the BAR association or AMA have any competition in law or medicine?

If only you could outsource your government and pay less tax to another alt-IRS, or more competitive government. Would the mafia be more efficient than the NYPD; running law enforcement with lower operating costs?

all people are looking for is a leadership loyal to the people who put it there. Making a nation a single block purchasing consortium would be one smaller step in that. It's all so naked Emperor obvious.

Blogger Jon M January 16, 2016 5:14 AM  

@2 You are asking questions from the assumption that Boeing is an American company rather than a multi-nat with no particular allegiance to any one nation. Consider that Boeing is a publically traded company, right? How much Boeing stock is in the hands of non-USian investors who couldn't give two shakes for the American economy so long as Boeing's stock value goes up by four percent next year.

Blogger Kyle Searle January 16, 2016 5:37 AM  

Mercantilism has been economically successful as many years as we've hade trade. You look at the great merchant empires in the West like Venice, the Netherlands, and Britain, and they were all extremely loyal to their own people. The only reason free trade is promoted is for the super-rich who are effectively trans-national.

Anonymous 636 January 16, 2016 5:41 AM  

Just finished Trump's book, and positionally there is little I disagree with there. Of course he doesn't go far enough, but he's light years ahead of everyone else in the GOP on all the major issues.

Is he sincere? Who can tell?

Would he be able to actually do anything he promises? Who knows?

Yes, he's so plainspoken and occasionally simplistic that he gets called an idiot and especially "unpresidential", but how does any of that matter at this point?

But what his candidacy eloquently points out is the utter uselessness of the rest of the field of self-serving, know-nothing bozos trapped in the same futile magical thinking cycle.

It amazes me is how far I've moved in my own thinking in the last seven years of reading this blog on virtually every issue. Thanks, Vox, and many of the Ilk, for that. But even seven years ago I had a better idea what needed to happen than any of these hapless clods masquerading as the answer for America.

God help us all!

Blogger Gordon January 16, 2016 6:15 AM  

This was a plot point in Michael Crichton's 1996 book "Airframe." The protagonist has to juggle dealing with a TV expose show as she discovers that the CEO is selling off key parts of aircraft production to the Chinese. In the book, it's stated that the wing is the key. One can outsource the fuselage, the tail assembly, and other subassemblies, but the knowledge of how to build the wing was the critical part.

The thing is, whatever airline executive that allows a customer like China to have that knowledge and tooling will be long gone, bonuses in hand, before the Chinese open their own plant. This is one of the flaws of modern corporations; executives are paid based on immediate circumstances (the $300 billion sale) while the consequences happen later.

I think I read a commenter here who wrote that anyone who had spent time inside a Chinese manufacturing operation would know that we need not fear them. I would love for that person to write more. 25 years ago Crichton warned that the Japanese were going to overwhelm us. Crichton didn't realize the integration of government, union and corporate interests in Japan could also keep Japan mired in a decades-long recession.

Blogger Salt January 16, 2016 6:33 AM  

That exchange even got a reaction from Cavuto.

Blogger Rantor January 16, 2016 6:41 AM  

Had a brief free trade argument with a libertarian on Twitter. She did all the usual BS tactics. Stated that tariffs never help an economy. I let her know that foreign car companies build pick ups and SUVs in America to avoid a large tariff. That BMW is for example the largest exporter of American made vehicles because of that. That part suppliers have built manufacturing facilities to support the assembly plants. Etc. she had no argument for that and went off on a "socialist countries have tariffs so tariffs are bad." When I explained that NAFTA had led US car makers to move factories from the US to Mexico, she started going full-Ricardo and talking how cheap cars are a benefit to American consumers. I asked her to look at Detroit and tell me how many new cars the unemployed and impoverished were now buying. She decided to argue about the meaning of socialism... At which point I dumped her.

Yes, the Boeing development is concerning. It isn't even a free trade question. Boeing didn't want to move manufacturing to China, the government of China demanded the move as a condition of jet purchases. Just like their fighter plane industry started by making MiG knock offs, their passenger plane industry will eventually make Boeing knock offs, eventually taking a major share of Boeing's global market.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan January 16, 2016 6:59 AM  

I know a guy who was a top trouble shooter for Toshiba machine tool and his tale was walking into a Chinese factory circa the mid 90s to fix a machine and to look across the floor and see poorly made clones of his top of the line Toshiba.

Vote Trump, hang the cucks

Blogger Robert What? January 16, 2016 7:11 AM  

The political and bureaucratic classes are only interested in one thing: enriching themselves and their cronies. This Boeing deal with China will do that. Everyone else can pound sand.

Blogger Ahazuerus January 16, 2016 7:34 AM  

@2:

Not that you're wrong, but the idea that America is any different is perversely ignorant. The primary function of the NSA is industrial espionage. The price of US assistance to Britain before Pearl Harbour precipitated American entry into the war, was turning over the entire Imperial patent portfolio.

That's not only what empires do, it's what they're FOR.

Blogger Ahazuerus January 16, 2016 7:44 AM  

Oh, and lest we forget, America is doing with China exactly what America did with Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia; building a paper tiger into a credible enemy so as to perpetuate never ending war profiteering. And the preferred means of achieving this was State Dept organised industrial deals made even as the State Dept was proclaiming the other party as a mortal enemy or evil empire.

Plus ca change, eh?

Anonymous grey enlightenment January 16, 2016 7:52 AM  

. I asked her to look at Detroit and tell me how many new cars the unemployed and impoverished were now buying.

But cars are much more abundant than they were 100 years ago, when they were a luxury item. It's not capitalism's fault that some people are too lazy/stupid/unproductive or just simply 'too poor' to afford certain things.

OpenID simplytimothy January 16, 2016 8:11 AM  

Sundance at the link notes that imported value add good like iPhones are dropping in price while domestic bulk goods--like food--are increasing in price.


What is this? Why the disconnect?

Blogger JaimeInTexas January 16, 2016 8:13 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger JaimeInTexas January 16, 2016 8:15 AM  

Mercantilism only works for the Crown and only for so long. The colonies, to survive, have to resort to smuggling and dealing with enemy privateers.

Blogger Ahazuerus January 16, 2016 8:16 AM  

One reason for increasing food prices is subsidies for turning food into fuel. As fuel prices have fallen these subsidies become more significant.

OpenID bc64a9f8-765e-11e3-8683-000bcdcb2996 January 16, 2016 8:46 AM  

I'm old enough to remember folks making fun of all those Asian "tourists" because "They just walk around taking pictures of EVERYTHING!"
Get it yet?
CaptDMO

Blogger Jakeithus January 16, 2016 9:09 AM  

The problem really is more widespread thanot I think people realize. The fertilizer plant my Dad worked for had a Chinese engineer working for them; by all accounts a nice guy, ordered special "authentic" Chinese food for their New Years celebrationsince every year. One day my Dad comes home from work and says the guy is just gone. Turns out he was accused of industrial espionage, and whether it was the company or the government that ultimately got rid of him, that was it.

This was turning natural gas into fertilizer, no great secret or incredibly technical task. If it's happening there...

Blogger tz January 16, 2016 9:13 AM  

Boeing is the biggest crony with the Export-Import Bank (which I'm not sure the GOPe hasn't raised from the dead again).
That is not even Ricardian free trade.
Unclean hands.
But Trumps proposals are just the ExIm bank on steroids.

Blogger Cecil Henry January 16, 2016 9:16 AM  

'Cmon Man'??

What kind of an answer is that?? A dodge of the issue, or resent at Trump revealing the real issues.

As in 'Cmon Man... don't let the cat out of the bag'

Either way so damning a statement, why is it not followed up on vociferously.

The parasitic, exploitative and treasonous behavior of the 'elite' class is disgusting.

Blogger tz January 16, 2016 9:17 AM  

Jeb Bush is in a league of his own.

Blogger James Dixon January 16, 2016 9:50 AM  

> What is this? Why the disconnect?

It's my understanding that the dollar has gone up against most of the world's currencies. So our dollars buy more of their stuff. A quick look at the exchange rates over the past two years would confirm or deny that, but I don't have time right now.

Blogger James Dixon January 16, 2016 9:51 AM  

> 'Cmon Man'?? ... What kind of an answer is that??

He's just channeling his inner Chris Carter.

Anonymous DJF January 16, 2016 9:57 AM  

What the “free traders” leave out in their obsession with international trade is that the US did not get rich on international trade, it got rich on domestic trade, Americans selling and buying to other Americans.

Its only since the 1970s that US imports and exports as a percentage of GDP has gotten so large. It used to be around 4 percent imports/ 4 percent exports, the total is now above 30%. The reason why buying and selling to/from Americans made us rich is because Americans had the money to buy and sell. The richer Americans became the more money you made selling to them. The more money you had meant the more you could buy Trying to make money in the export business is very hard since most of the world is poor.

That is why countries with export based economies are so desperate to sell to the US. It was where the money is, though lately the US consumer is getting pretty ragged around the edges.

The “free trade” treaty system is all about the international traders and banksters selling off access to consumers in rich countries to poor export countries while the banksters collect their fees on each and every deal.

https://gailtheactuary.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/us-import-exports-divided-by-gdp.png

Anonymous WillBest January 16, 2016 9:59 AM  

I don't doubt that the Chinese attempt to do this, but have they ever successfully done it?

IS there anywhere, where the Chinese have managed to become the major market player and been competitive in leading rather than just picking off the value market?

I think that is what multinational corps don't really care about. So what if China learns how to make the 777, by the time they figure it out Boeing will be two iterations ahead.

None of that is good for the Americans working in any of the US factories, but then Boeing doesn't really care about them.

Anonymous The other robot January 16, 2016 10:21 AM  

A new term arises: Lethal homophobia

So, we also need Lethal Free Trade.

Anonymous WillBest January 16, 2016 10:24 AM  

One reason for increasing food prices is subsidies for turning food into fuel. As fuel prices have fallen these subsidies become more significant.

Corn is selling at a 5 year low, and adjusting for inflation is selling for less than at any time prior to the mid 80s excluding a brief period during the great depression.

Blogger Derrick Bonsell January 16, 2016 10:35 AM  

Ahazuerus, I don't care if the US steals trade secrets from foreign companies. I do have a problem with people extolling the benefits of free trade when it doesn't benefit us.

Anonymous The other robot January 16, 2016 10:37 AM  

OT, but this sub-head appeared in the Daily Mail:

The backlash: Neo-Nazis on the rampage. Gun sales soaring. SUE REID warns sex attacks by migrants have unleashed dark forces in Germany that have disturbing echoes of the past.

WTF? The sex attacks are not the problem! No, the problem is that these immigrants exercising their Allah-given right to molest the infidel women might bring back the gas ovens?

Blogger Were-Puppy January 16, 2016 10:43 AM  

*sniff*
Now must get flied lice flom nippon

Anonymous RJ Moore II January 16, 2016 10:47 AM  

1) Intellectual property is bullshit; 2) Boeing is a government agency, not a company, and should held complicit for war crimes; 3) protectionism makes your own domestic industries gay and uncompetitive while driving up prices. Free trade (or any trade) can change the relative distribution of wages and returns on capital, but if you have a problem with that, suck a dick and stop being economically inferior losers. America is failing not due to free trade but to managed pseudo-capitalism.

Blogger Were-Puppy January 16, 2016 10:53 AM  

@20 Jakeithus
This was turning natural gas into fertilizer, no great secret or incredibly technical task. If it's happening there...
---

I'm going to WAG that it was during the Clinton years they were catching Chinese spies in our nuclear facilities?

Blogger Were-Puppy January 16, 2016 10:55 AM  

@22 Cecil Henry
'Cmon Man'??

What kind of an answer is that??
---

A while back that phrase was made popular on Sports Center or some such.

I wish Trump had use the phrase from before which was "You got JACKED UP"

Blogger Were-Puppy January 16, 2016 10:56 AM  

@25 James Dixon
> 'Cmon Man'?? ... What kind of an answer is that??

He's just channeling his inner Chris Carter.
---

He had those eyebrows that I thought were only achievable by those magnetic sketch toys

Anonymous DJF January 16, 2016 10:57 AM  

In reply to RJ Moore II

I would be very much more impressed with these “free traders” if they did not pretend that the situation outlined below had anything to do with actual free trade or free markets.

The Mongolian government owned Tavan Tolgoi coal mine ships its coal to China on the Mongolian/Chinese government owned railroads, to the Chinese government owed Chongqing Iron and Steel Company where its combined with Chinese government owned iron to produce steel. The steel is then shipped on government owned railroads to the Chinese/North Korean owned Rajin-Sonbong Free Economic and Trade Zone in North Korea where its turned into a bumper. It is then trucked on government trucks and government roads to the government owned port of Chongjin where its put on a ship built at the government owned Vietnam Shipbuilding Industry Group (Vinashin). The ship was chartered by the government owned Dubai Ports and transports the bumpers to the government owned Port of Los Angeles where its transported on government roads to the government bailed out GM assembly plant where its put on a van which is sold to the Department of Homeland Security.

All along the way this “free trade” was financed by the World Bank, IMF, various government owned banks and government bailed out Goldman Sachs and facilitated by the government organizations like the WTO and United States International Trade Commission and the laws of many countries which created government sanctioned limited liability corporations

And of course along the way the public has their money/freedom and sometimes their lives to pay for this ‘free trade”.


Blogger Christopher January 16, 2016 11:08 AM  

The moderators seemed locked into a cuckservative mentality too. Cavuto & Bartiromo practically interrupted each other to argue the free trade line:

CAVUTO: He [Rubio] is right. If you put a tariff on a good, it's Americans who pay.

BUSH: Absolutely.

TRUMP: You looking at me?

BUSH: Yeah.

BARTIROMO: Prices go higher for...

TRUMP: Can I tell you what? It will never happen because they'll let their currency go up. They're never going to let it happen....

--Washington Post transcript, my parenthese re Rubio





Anonymous paradox January 16, 2016 11:12 AM  

@33 Anonymous RJ Moore II

Muh... free trade! Look the free trade plane is fine!

Blogger pyrrhus January 16, 2016 11:15 AM  

Put 30% tariffs on all imports except raw materials and agricultural products--watch what happens.....But clowns like Cavuto would turn beet red at the thought.

Blogger Ahazuerus January 16, 2016 11:20 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Anonymous johnc January 16, 2016 11:26 AM  

It's fascinating seeing the libertarian and constitutionalists talk about how so-called "protectionism" is so against the values of America. It's like they've lost sight of the fact that before the income tax the federal government got much of its revenue from tariffs.

We talk about rolling the trade agreement with Mexico back to how it was before Clinton and they make it sound like we're advocating a clear break from American history. Do their minds seriously not go further back than 1993 NAFTA?

Anonymous M. Bibliophile January 16, 2016 11:30 AM  

I got into this exact argument on Twitter with some free trade true believers. I made almost these exact arguments (we're already in a trade war, but China is the only one fighting; China cheats; tariff's are only the first step etc).

Deaf ears.

All I got back were the standard free trade uber alles talking points, and the OP (not otherwise a dumb guy, from what I can tell) quit responding to me as soon as I mentioned that my experience with the manufacturing sector was practical, not theoretical.

I realize that cuckservative primarily applies to immigration beliefs, but this perverse desire to screw over your countrymen for "conservative" virtue signalling and cheaper electronics is certainly a cognate.

Anonymous #1037 January 16, 2016 11:33 AM  

@33 what's the free trade response to China pegging their currency to our dollar for competitive advantage, cuckwad?

Blogger Big Griz Reno January 16, 2016 11:36 AM  

Three US submersible oil well pun manufacturers did great business in China in the 80s. That is until a Chinese manufacturer took everyone's business. I worked for one of them at the time.

Blogger Ahazuerus January 16, 2016 11:37 AM  

@30:

Derrick, I get it. I suppose it wasn't so much your comment I was reacting to, so much as the constant whining refrain from certain political quarters on that point, pretending that somehow we're the innocent victims of yellow perfidy ...

And at the same time, these very same political operators (i.e. traitors) are colluding with the enemy to give trade secrets away, under the rubric of free trade.

But at least I understand their motives. It's the people who believe their stupid contradictory lies that I want to sterilise. The ones who just "believe hard and never ask why".

Blogger Big Griz Reno January 16, 2016 11:38 AM  

I gotta turn off autocorrect. Oilwell is one word and where did pun come from?

Next time I preview

Anonymous DJF January 16, 2016 11:43 AM  

Reply to #1037

what's the free trade response to China arresting or even executing any worker who gets uppity and asks for a raise or a change in working condition.

The standard “free market’ response to other countries subsidizing their exports is that no corporation can keep on doing this since they will run out of money and go out of business, but China can do it since its not the corporation which is getting less money it’s the workers and the Chinese communists government has enough power to force workers to accept what they are giving. The owners of the corporations can go on forever selling at a low cost since they don’t lose out they transfer the loses to their workers.

Nobody is better at keeping workers under the foot then a communist government. And yes, the Chinese government is communist, flags, propaganda and executions

Anonymous WillBest January 16, 2016 11:50 AM  

What I don't understand is a large chunk of the conservative tax reform people keep telling me that a consumption tax is the way to go. What is a tax on imports if not a tax on consumption?

US imports 2.8 trillion worth of stuff. Using government math where taxes have no consequence a 40% tariff on imported goods would generate roughly 1.1 trillion and would allow the government to entirely replace the payroll taxes which is the single largest tax on the production of the vast majority of American workers.

Anonymous BigGayKoranBurner January 16, 2016 11:57 AM  

The ancient Greeks were smart enough to treat math & science as state secretes. White peoples greatest gift to the world is innovation/inventions. 'Cmon Man'?? just wait until Trump says all the cleaning ladies in his casinos are more beautiful than Jeb's wife.

Would the mafia be more efficient than the NYPD; running law enforcement with lower operating costs?

I have heard several accounts that the mafia does more to keep NYC safe from moslems than the cops do.

One reason for increasing food prices is subsidies for turning food into fuel. As fuel prices have fallen these subsidies become more significant.

It doesn't help that it takes around 20% more petrol energy to make ethanol from corn than ethanol has

This was turning natural gas into fertilizer, no great secret or incredibly technical task.

Asians with PHDs can memorize Gregor Mendel's work from centuries ago but not understand it enough to duplicate it. http://money.cnn.com/2014/07/03/news/china-corn-espionage/index.html

the problem is that these immigrants exercising their Allah-given right to molest the infidel women might bring back the gas ovens

The name of that right is Taharush, sexual harassment in groups. I hope you know Taqiyya, Jizya,& dhimmi

Anonymous #1037 January 16, 2016 12:33 PM  

@48 That's what I'm getting at. You can't have a multicultural society where the one culture wants to destroy the other. You can't have free trade with communists.

Blogger automatthew January 16, 2016 12:43 PM  

McKinley on trade:

Under free trade the trader is the master and the producer the slave. Protection is but the law of nature, the law of self-preservation, of self-development, of securing the highest and best destiny of the race of man. [It is said] that protection is immoral.... Why, if protection builds up and elevates 63,000,000 [the U.S. population] of people, the influence of those 63,000,000 of people elevates the rest of the world. We cannot take a step in the pathway of progress without benefiting mankind everywhere. Well, they say, "Buy where you can buy the cheapest".... Of course, that applies to labor as to everything else. Let me give you a maxim that is a thousand times better than that, and it is the protection maxim: "Buy where you can pay the easiest." And that spot of earth is where labor wins its highest rewards.

https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/William_McKinley

Anonymous BGKBF January 16, 2016 12:57 PM  

Tangential to Boing and free trade what the sailors should have done with their high tech small boat was scuttle it,
http://www.captainsjournal.com/2016/01/12/what-those-sailors-captured-by-iran-should-have-done/

"Daniel (my former Marine) and I discussed it. We both agreed upon the necessary course of action had we been on board those vessels prior to being confiscated by Iran. Call on a satellite phone with your last known location, deploy life rafts, water, guns, ammunition and food, and then scuttle the vessels.

If they could not do that, they should not be sailors. I’m sorry if this offends former sailors, but this is what I think. And it’s what Daniel thinks. Sailors are supposed to be warriors too. We’ve become soft."

Anonymous 11B January 16, 2016 1:29 PM  

Airbus already has an assembly line in China, and Boeing is going to build one in order to compete. Boeing can't let Airbus have that market to itself. It is as simple as that. China is doing nothing wrong. They are just taking advantage of the fact they have an enormous market.

The USA is at fault for not doing the same. We did put pressure on foreigners back in the 1980s to build local plants. For example, when the Japanese were gutting the US auto market in the 1980s, President Reagan toyed with the idea of import quotas on Japanese vehicles. In response several Japanese manufacturers built assembly plants in the USA. The output from those factories, they were told, would be considered domestic and not be subjected to potential import quotas.

There is nothing stopping the USA from doing this today except for our devoting to free trade policies. In fact other than China, the EU and maybe India, the USA is one of the only nations large enough to be able to make such demands. A smaller nation like Venezuela making such demands on Airbus or Boeing would find no willing takers. But most manufactures cannot afford to miss out on the US or Chinese market. So they will do what they need to do to gain access.

Anonymous 11B January 16, 2016 1:47 PM  

This is just how China works. In time, Comac, a state-owned, Shanghai-based aerospace company will then use the production secrets they have stolen, produce their own airliners, kick out Boeing, undercut the market, and sell cheaper manufactured airplanes to the global economy.

In time is about to arrive sooner than you think. Comac just rolled out its first C919 airliner.

"The C919 forms part of China's long-term goal to break Airbus and Boeing's duopoly, and is intended to compete against Airbus A320 NEO, Boeing 737 Max, and other next-generation single-aisle airliners."

Anonymous Rolf January 16, 2016 2:03 PM  

How Boeing, or even Airbus, can be so stupid as to open a plant in China, a plant will have everything but a sign that reads "steal our technology here!" is beyond me. I just do not understand how people who are obvious bright can be so insanely dumb.

If anything, we should be ramping up tariffs on basic technologies like efficient transistor manufacturing so encourage domestic production for all the obvious reasons. We should never be dependent on our enemies for the basics: it never ends well.

Anonymous The other robot January 16, 2016 2:03 PM  

Are we going to be seeing BGKBVFF as the next iteration of BGKBF?

Anonymous Rolf January 16, 2016 2:05 PM  

@53 - yes, and look what's happened to Japan since they started building here. Lost decade after lost decade.

Anonymous WillBest January 16, 2016 2:21 PM  

China is still buying its jet engines and avionics from foreign suppliers. All they are making is a giant tin can. And then of course in order to convince people your tin can is safe you either need to force the sale internally, or give them away. You are talking 20 years before they will be able to effectively compete in the large passenger aircraft market.

Blogger Akulkis January 16, 2016 2:22 PM  

Department of Defense should be stepping in and blocking this on national security grounds.

Oh wait, Obama is president.

Blogger Akulkis January 16, 2016 2:22 PM  

Department of Defense should be stepping in and blocking this on national security grounds.

Oh wait, Obama is president.

Blogger Mr. Bee January 16, 2016 2:25 PM  

The "Plant" is only concerned with painting and final fittings. There will be little, if any tech transfer. This is in response to a 300 plane order from China - which will provide a hell of lot more jobs than lost - as well as Republicans getting rid of the Ex-import bank corporate welfare. Please don't let the facts get in the way of the general SJW like stompy footing.

Blogger Praxis Archon January 16, 2016 2:57 PM  

The real problem is that the owners of capital have benefited enormously from the increased profitability of multi-nationals and the massive increase in the valuations resulting from the use of cheap third world labour. The "Davos men" who form the political elite in the western world have been totally cushioned from the ill-effects of free trade. Free trade has created a massive amount of wealth which has ended up in the hands of third world industrial producers, third world workers (global poverty is way down even though these workers are still poor by Western standards) and the owners of the exported capital. Even the multi-decade fiscal imbalances that have resulted in the run-up of certain key western asset prices have worked to the advantage of the Western elite (NYC, Miami, London, Sydney, SF, Vancouver real estate, precious art, the Swiss Franc etc...). The real problem is that neoliberalism has been financially very rewarding for a small segment (but politically powerful) portion of the population and the government sector workers have been mostly immune to the decline of private sector wages (and consequently not sympathetic to the concerns of ordinary citizens). The gated-in enclaves of the western elite are completely oblivious to the social havoc they have wreaked even though it stands bare before them (either because it is in their interest to deny what is going on or they have been convinced by the state ideology that the ill-effects are not real or they are simply afraid to speak out). There is no political counterbalance to neoliberalism as all parties subscribe to its core-tenets they simply vary on what portion of the table scraps will be doled out to the surplus domestic supply of labour whose reservation price is above the state transfer payments. The media doesn't even have the political vocabulary to describe the distinction between Trump and even the most right-wing of the traditional conservative candidates. The dislocations of mass migration and downward pressure on wages will cause a rift to open between those whose loyalties are to the nation and the traditional cultures of those nations and to those whose loyalties are to economism. Economism has valid lessons (the UK of the 1970s demonstrated that). However, neoliberalism has been taken too far. Trump wants reasonable limits set on the trade balance. I agree.

Blogger Were-Puppy January 16, 2016 3:05 PM  

@58 WillBest
And then of course in order to convince people your tin can is safe you either need to force the sale internally, or give them away.
---

I wouldn't want to be involved in beta testing those things

Blogger The Other Robot January 16, 2016 3:17 PM  

Sex attacks at migrant welcoming event

FURY is growing in Germany over mounting evidence of ANOTHER cover-up of migrant sex crimes after it emerged a welcome party for refugees held two months before the Cologne rapes descended into a mass groping session.

Anonymous Artraccoon gone Rabid January 16, 2016 3:26 PM  

This same trick that China is pulling with Boeing, is the same trick done with GM cars in China.
GM wanted to sell cars in China, but the only way that GM can do that is to make them in China alongside a Chinese auto maker. So the corporate weasels and free traders can proudly announce that "GM sells cars in China". The Chinese car buyers love Buicks and Holdens, and GM sells a whole lot of them, but that doesn't help the automotive worker in Detroit, Michigan or Elizabeth, South Australia. This arrangement also scores the tech needed not only to help the Chinese leap frog their industrial development, but their military tech as well.

Blogger The Other Robot January 16, 2016 3:32 PM  

This is not OT, I believe.

If Bush 43 and the Squid Bankers were involved in the events of 9/11, then the schadenfreude of Trump using it to shaft Jeb and the bankers all the way from their asses to their tiny brains is amusing.

Trump's winning surprise in the last debate.

Blogger RobertT January 16, 2016 3:43 PM  

Trump. The first politically motivated positive mention of tariffs in five generations.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash January 16, 2016 3:48 PM  

@61 Mr. Bee
Mr. Bee, and others here, have forgotten that in the 1990s, Boeing, Hughes Electronics and Loral Space managed to reveal to the Chinese government designs for virtually every missile in the US inventory, as well as the encryption techniques and even the encryption keys used by our military satellites.
There was no way that allowing US companies to launch satellites using Chinese rockets could result in a huge giveaway of military technology, and military secrets. Can't happen. The US companies would obviously be too careful, and wouldn't depend on systems and security built by the locals.

So, of course a manufacturing agreement with the People's Liberation Army won't result in any technology transfer. They're just building a really big aluminum can!

Blogger James Dixon January 16, 2016 3:54 PM  

> ...though lately the US consumer is getting pretty ragged around the edges.

Yep. When even Walmart is retrenching, you know the consumer is almost tapped out: http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2016/01/15/list-of-walmart-stores-closing/78852898/

Blogger The Other Robot January 16, 2016 3:59 PM  

The Chinese car buyers love Buicks

The Chinese call them Bie-ke (別克) which sounds like someone chundering and is similar to the derogatory name Americans use for Buick.

Still, I guess it is better than Pontiac.

Anonymous WillBest January 16, 2016 3:59 PM  

This arrangement also scores the tech needed not only to help the Chinese leap frog their industrial development, but their military tech as well.

The Chinese don't seem to be even capable of making the iterative improvements that the Koreans do, let alone the more modest jumps that the Japanese have been demonstrating of late. If they are competing with the West on innovation, its because the West is dying and is no longer interested in doing it.

The only place I see the Chinese really competing is biomedical, and that is mostly due to their utter disregard for human life allowing them to do things that churn the stomachs of western scientists.

Blogger Feather Blade January 16, 2016 4:34 PM  

@14 It's not capitalism's fault that some people are too lazy/stupid/unproductive or just simply 'too poor' to afford certain things.

Har. No, it's the US government's fault for paying a bounty on old cars, thereby reducing the supply of used vehicles, which raised the price of the remaining used cars.

I'll freely admit that I haven't tracked it very closely, but when I look I still don't see people asking less than $1000 for a used car.

Blogger John Williams January 16, 2016 5:11 PM  

If you want to understand the full significance of Boeing opening a plant in China, read Michael Crichton's book Airframe. It's a fictional book, but it's so full of facts, principles, and explanations, one can't help but learn from reading it. Just hope the China plant isn't building wings.

Anonymous Mr. Rational January 16, 2016 6:55 PM  

@58 "China got the bomb but have no fears, they can't wipe us out for at least 5 years."

Think of posterity.  200 years, not 20.

Anonymous johnc January 16, 2016 7:07 PM  

@66 Trump's winning surprise in the last debate.

Going to go out on a limb here. The Cruz / Trump debate discussion about "New York values" was a pre-planned, scripted exchange. Cruz threw one right over the plate for Trump. Trump's going all the way and will re-pay the favor.

Cruz is not an alpha male. He doesn't want to be president. He'll gladly have somebody else do the job, as long as he can play his part.

Blogger Tom K. January 16, 2016 7:21 PM  

But averaging the wages of the world's working class is the GOAL of the globalist elite. It always has been. It is the only way to make the world "fair".

Blogger Tom K. January 16, 2016 7:21 PM  

But averaging the wages of the world's working class is the GOAL of the globalist elite. It always has been. It is the only way to make the world "fair".

Blogger Were-Puppy January 16, 2016 9:40 PM  

@69 James Dixon
> ...though lately the US consumer is getting pretty ragged around the edges.

Yep. When even Walmart is retrenching, you know the consumer is almost tapped out: http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2016/01/15/list-of-walmart-stores-closing/78852898/
---

I wouldn't make too much out of this. They had almost 10,000 stores world wide back around 2006-2007. I have two of them within a 3 mile distance near me. They are going to close one, and leave the other open. I think the number of 269 is not big against 10,000 and they are probably consolidation space. Just my opinion.

Blogger Halifax Donair January 16, 2016 10:37 PM  

@65 Malcolm Bricklin was working to import Chinese cars a few years ago, but theyes didn't have the smarts to pull a VW to pass emissions tests.

Blogger David Gudeman January 17, 2016 12:05 AM  

Free trade typically means that you allow imports without restriction. It does not mean that you allow the export of technology to your global adversaries. This is not an article about problems with free trade, it's an article about problems with technology export laws and how they are enforced.

Blogger Thucydides January 17, 2016 12:49 AM  

Cuckservatives, and economically maleducated conservatives, don't realize that the fact one is not fighting a war does not mean one is not already engaged in one:

Tolkien had perhaps the best response:

“It needs but one foe to breed a war, and those who have not swords can still die upon them.”

Anonymous BGS January 17, 2016 1:02 AM  

Chinese don't seem to be even capable of making the iterative improvements that the Koreans do

North Korea buys tech from other bad boy nations. South Korea gets propped up by US



Yep. When even Walmart is retrenching... I have two of them within a 3 mile distance near me

Everyone knew the plan for walmart was to have the entire store be a lose leader until it destroyed local competition. Shut down competitors then raise prices.

Anonymous Discard January 17, 2016 2:15 AM  

The idea that the Chinese are too stupid to properly use the advanced technology that we give is pretty shortsighted. What if you're wrong? Does anybody really know what goes on over there? Even if you think that they are a bunch of uncreative robots, they do scour their whole country looking for good minds and put them to work at STEM, rather than sending them to law school. And they do their best to fill our tech schools with their own people, and displace ours. I know a former student in an engineering Master's program at the U.of California who tells me that he's the only American in his classes.

Blogger Were-Puppy January 17, 2016 9:33 AM  

@83 BGS

Everyone knew the plan for walmart was to have the entire store be a lose leader until it destroyed local competition. Shut down competitors then raise prices.
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Does not compute. The reason people go there is because of the lower prices.

That being said, I have lived in an area before that pretty much had Walmart. And one mom and pop grocery. I've since returned to semi-civilization :P

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