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Tuesday, February 16, 2016

Bailouts are for the banks

Not for the little people:
Believe it or not, the US Marshals Service in Houston is arresting people for not paying their outstanding federal student loans.

Paul Aker says he was arrested at his home last week for a $1500 federal student loan he received in 1987. He says seven deputy US Marshals showed up at his home with guns and took him to federal court where he had to sign a payment plan for the 29-year-old school loan.

Congressman Gene Green says the federal government is now using private debt collectors to go after those who owe student loans.
I suspect Donald Trump is the only reason the USA is not entering a revolutionary environment. But even with Trump, one more round of bank bailouts should do it.

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100 Comments:

Anonymous VFM #6306 February 16, 2016 12:40 PM  

Justice. Integrity. Loan Service.

OpenID sigbouncer February 16, 2016 12:42 PM  

Just read that on Drudge. Total insanity. You can't squeeze blood out of a turnip.

Blogger White Knight Leo #0368 February 16, 2016 12:43 PM  

I understand the logic of "too big to fail".

What I don't understand is how anyone can miss that having such institutions is all about creating sufficient opportunities for graft.

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 12:49 PM  

YES. THE FIRE RISES.

Blogger Mastermind February 16, 2016 12:49 PM  

Bank bailouts were loans with considerable interest, not free money. So how exactly would you bail out people with student debt in the same way the banks were bailed out? The people most likely to rebel (conservatives) aren't particularly inclined to do so over SJW#4834573's gender studies degree.

Anonymous Freestater February 16, 2016 12:52 PM  

29 year old loan- what ever happened to statute of limitations?

Anonymous VFM #6306 February 16, 2016 12:57 PM  

@5 You wouldn't, Mastermind. That's the point. Banks drafted their own bailout strategy, and then winched the implementation in tight.

In order for Student Loan Borrowers to do the same thing, they'd have to be a) far, far, far more connected to power than typical Student Loan Borrowers are and b) at least smart enough to have avoided student loan indenturedness in the first place!

The Student Loan Bailout plan is a three step process:

1) Scream "Mom!"
2) File for bankruptcy.
3) Pay off student loans and penalties at a 200%+ markup, out of pocket.

It is a bailout - not like you do for a leaky boat, but what you do off a toboggan right before it smashes into a tree. Survival not guaranteed.

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 1:13 PM  

Bank bailouts were loans with considerable interest, not free money.

And yet, somehow, the Fed balance sheet did this:

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/von%20havenstein/Fed%20Balance%20Sheet%201.28.jpg

It's a mystery, Mastermind! Gonna have to science that shit.

Anonymous Rigel February 16, 2016 1:19 PM  

What kind of morons cannot do math. The cost for 7 marshals, vehicles, & processing costs will exceed the $1,500 he owes.

Blogger VD February 16, 2016 1:21 PM  

So how exactly would you bail out people with student debt in the same way the banks were bailed out?

Forgive the debt.

What kind of morons cannot do math. The cost for 7 marshals, vehicles, & processing costs will exceed the $1,500 he owes.

Federal morons. Forget the cost of locking my Dad up, they have cost themselves tens of millions of dollars in taxes. It's not about the cost-benefit, it's about the optics. They are making examples in order to try to prevent others from doing the same.

Anonymous Donn #0114 February 16, 2016 1:22 PM  

You cannot discharge student loans through bankruptcy. What's next, making the debt inheritable?

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 1:23 PM  

What kind of morons cannot do math. The cost for 7 marshals, vehicles, & processing costs will exceed the $1,500 he owes.

7 Marshals for two hours - $2800
1 Bearcat + fuel - $1000
Court proceedings - $25,000

A boot stamping on a human face - forever? Priceless.

Anonymous Johnny February 16, 2016 1:23 PM  

That's what I'm going to do. I'm going to ask my creditors for a bailout. My family is too big to fail!

Blogger Conan the Cimmerian February 16, 2016 1:33 PM  

VD:

Mrs. Cimmerian left you a book review:

Truly excellent and a concise, fast read.

Fortunately and unfortunately it shows the true colours of the Republican Party and its conservatives.

They have conserved nothing and the book lays bare why that is so. These are people that do not hold true to principles and will sell out their allies for a pat on the back from the leftists/cultural marxists.

Have you ever wondered why the Hegelian dance always moves to the left? This book answers questions like that and highlight the greatest treason of the so called conservative movement.

Can't recommend this book enough. Give it to all of your conservative friends so that they can open their horizons.


HT

Blogger dienw February 16, 2016 1:48 PM  

I am under the impression that the IRS would withhold your income tax refund to cover defaulted student loans.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 16, 2016 1:49 PM  

Limbaugh examining the effects of Trumps rhetoric cucks still clueless

Anonymous Napoleon 12pdr February 16, 2016 1:52 PM  

What bugs me about the whole business is that I'm the one who always gets stuck with the bill.

Little Janie squandered $120K on a degree in Gender Studies, and can't pay? Don't worry, we'll tax the folks who went to college and studied engineering! Think of it as the New, Improved Frivorce...all the robbery, with none of the sex.

Blogger LES February 16, 2016 1:55 PM  

Trump took a page out of Limbaugh's playbook and now Limbaugh is stymied as to how to stop Trump.

Blogger Noah B February 16, 2016 1:56 PM  

It is a universal truth that taxes are collected from those with money, but not from those with so much money that they own the tax collectors.

OpenID basementhomebrewer February 16, 2016 1:58 PM  

@16 I would take the trade. Eliminate the student loan program in exchange student loan debts over 15 years old are forgiven.

Blogger LES February 16, 2016 1:59 PM  

Limbaugh is being exposed as GOPe and a phony populist.

Anonymous DT February 16, 2016 1:59 PM  

Today it's unpaid student loans, too many bank deposits under $10k, and any cash in your car during a "traffic stop."

Tomorrow it will be personally held gold and silver.

They won't need marshals for retirement accounts. Just a new law and a few lines of code. And a promise that "your money is secured by these special retirement bonds!"

USA Inc. is $19T in debt and sinking fast. The rats are scrambling for the seed corn.

As excited as I am to see the rise of Trump, I question if even he can do anything about the situation.

Side note: if I was a juror on a case where a citizen shot a U.S. marshal dead during an attempted arrest on a "student loan warrant" I would laugh while voting "not guilty."

Blogger Noah B February 16, 2016 2:00 PM  

"...it's about the optics."

Indeed. I wouldn't be surprised if Mr. Green had no idea he still owed anything, or if he already paid it and the feds' records are just wrong.

Blogger VD February 16, 2016 2:00 PM  

Mrs. Cimmerian left you a book review:

Cool. Please thank her for me.

Blogger pyrrhus February 16, 2016 2:05 PM  

What kind of morons cannot do math. The cost for 7 marshals, vehicles, & processing costs will exceed the $1,500 he owes.
Probably 12k with interest....

Blogger Conan the Cimmerian February 16, 2016 2:07 PM  

VD

Her nom de amazon is Texas Mom.

Anonymous DT February 16, 2016 2:10 PM  

@10 - So how exactly would you bail out people with student debt in the same way the banks were bailed out?

Forgive the debt.


I wouldn't do this. This fails to punish everyone involved in these bad loans and thereby fails to teach any lessons. It's effectively another bailout for the banks and FedGov as well as the students.

What I would do is the following:

* No student loan debt is immune to bankruptcy.

* To whatever degree a student loan is reduced or eliminated in bankruptcy court: the lender, including the Federal government, must absorb half of the loss. But the lender may pursue the school or school(s) attended for the remaining half.

Students who made poor decisions deserve to have their credit wrecked, for a time, like any bad borrower.

Likewise the lenders and schools need to pay for their role in all of this.

Anonymous DT February 16, 2016 2:11 PM  

@24 - Shhhh! If the idiots get wind of this they will have the courts declare that the borrowers must pay to have a boot on their face as well.

Anonymous Susan February 16, 2016 2:12 PM  

@21,

Argentina's feminazi president already let the game slip several years ago by nationalizing her country's 401K retirement plan. I suspect Obama was furious with her for jumping the gun.

I have seen stories on a couple of trustworthy sites that talked about how several leftist economists had already drawn up blueprints to do the very same thing here under Obama. That was why he was making noises about how $3 million in lifetime savings should be more than enough for anyone to live on.

The media ate that slop up.

Anonymous Ness1 February 16, 2016 2:16 PM  

More and more the reality is... why work?

The government just steals it all.

Your extra efforts to expand your resources just mean the government parasites steal more and give it to someone else.

You are a slave with the extra responsibility of delivering the loot to your robbers.

Fleecing the productive is a sure way to make the productive disappear or at least foster the parasitic mindset to steal, lie, coerce and destroy. Taxed on the money you earn, then taxed on savings, taxed on investments, taxed on ta

So yeah, to hell with it. Be a parasite.

Every day more and more, I just feel like this.

My only question: What can I do to actively STOP this involuntary subsidization of a parasitic system that is destroying my freedom and interests: economically, racially, personally?.

Blogger Timmy3 February 16, 2016 2:27 PM  

This is what should be done. Get some credit cards. Pay off the student loans with credit cards. Default on the credit cards. Let the government bail on the bank credit cards.

Blogger Cogitans Iuvenis February 16, 2016 2:30 PM  

I wouldn't do this. This fails to punish everyone involved in these bad loans and thereby fails to teach any lessons. It's effectively another bailout for the banks and FedGov as well as the students.

I get the argument why you would not want to forgive debt in lieu of making it bankrupt able from a moral stand point but saying debt forgiveness is a bailout for the banks or the gov? Logic doesn't follow. The loaners, banks and the gov, would have to recognize millions if not billions in dollars of loses.

A bailout would be if the federal government announced some sort of school debt relief program whereby the feds would buy the debt somewhere near face value then, as a "favor" to the people, only ask to collect a certain percentage of that debt at a much reduced interest rate. Banks don't realize any losses and the yoke of debt serfdom is lessened just enough that the people don't revolt.

Blogger Florian Ulrich February 16, 2016 2:44 PM  

I think we are not living in "reality", but in a new version of the Truman Show, this time run by the Onion.

Blogger The Rev February 16, 2016 2:48 PM  

@11 I just can't seem to get this smirk off of my face. Well played.

Anonymous DT February 16, 2016 2:48 PM  

@30 - I get the argument why you would not want to forgive debt in lieu of making it bankrupt able from a moral stand point but saying debt forgiveness is a bailout for the banks or the gov?

I guess Vox would have to define "forgive the debt." I'm under the assumption it would mean the following in the U.S.:

* Students get off with no consequences.

* Schools get off with no consequences.

* Banks get paid back by FedGov because "too big to fail."

* FedGov prints money, taxes citizens, and/or forfeits more citizen assets to cover the loss.

That's completely unacceptable to me. The schools pushed the kids into worthless degrees paid for with mountains of debt. And banks happily jumped in because "Federally backed."

The only problem is that even in my scenario FedGov doesn't really pay. They print/tax/seize. I guess it would be better if I added:

* Any losses incurred by FedGov must be repaid via permanent budget cuts to the Department of Education.

Blogger frigger611 February 16, 2016 2:52 PM  

I thought I had read that student loans cannot be discharged through bankruptcy.

They used to say "to find out who's in charge, ask who you cannot ridicule."

Maybe a more current take would be "to find out who's in charge, find out whose debts cannot be forgiven."

The Academy (liberal professors) are the most important pillars of our society, ergo, they WILL get theirs, ahead of everyone else.

Anonymous Broken Arrow February 16, 2016 2:53 PM  

1. Schedule a workout program for everyone needing assistance with current debt.
2. Allow borrowers to default on all new student loans.

The issue would be fixed in about 20 years, the price of college would plummet, the banks wouldn't implode, and the market would dictate college prices.

Anonymous grey enlightenment February 16, 2016 2:58 PM  

But fed. student loans are still at taxpayer expense and students should bear some responsibility for majoring in low-ROI subjects, taking on too much debt, or not understanding the terms and conditions of the loans. There so so many forgiveness and deferral programs that student loans are seldom paid in full anyway. It's often dragged out forever. Harsher penalties are necessary for a system that is broken mainly against tax payers.

Credentialism is another problem, as well as too many low-IQ and immature student being encouraged to enroll in college despite the high drop-out rate. Another problem is the perpetually anemic labor market.

Anonymous grey enlightenment February 16, 2016 3:00 PM  

This is what should be done. Get some credit cards. Pay off the student loans with credit cards. Default on the credit cards. Let the government bail on the bank credit cards.

I suppose you could do that with the IRS, too

Blogger OGRE February 16, 2016 3:06 PM  

Bankruptcy protection should never have been removed from student loans. Thats the crux of the problem and why tuition costs and student loans have exploded over the past three decades.

These are the perfect loans for the banks. No chance of bankruptcy, and fully backed by the federal government. In fact in many circumstances they make money on forfeitures. So they have massive incentives to loan as much as possible.

The schools take advantage of this by upping tuition as much as possible. Why not? The banks will happy loan more to cover any increases.

And upon whom does the weight of these massive financial power plays fall? 18 year old kids, most of whom can't tell the difference between Canada and Mexico, and are being pressured by every authority figure in their lives to go to the 'best' school that accepts them. They have no concept whatsoever what accepting these loans will mean for their lives, and many get caught in this inescapable financial prison.

And now they are arresting debtors? That doesn't even make sense. Whats the basis for the arrest? Its not a crime to fail to pay a debt (barring issues of fraud), even to the federal government. Even a failure to answer a Complaint or to otherwise appear in a civil suit would not trigger an arrest. Theres no basis in law for an arrest warrant to be issued. I practiced federal criminal defense law for 10 years; I can't see what the legal basis would be. Frankly, this seems to be kidnapping, albeit under the guise of lawful authority.

And as anti-socialist as I consider myself to be, I can't help but think we would have been better off altogether just providing free college education. When weighing the costs against the system we have in place now, the massive debt plus stranglehold on the economic lives of millions of graduates (not to mention the psychological damage imposed) seems to significantly outweigh the financial cost of free education.

But its now crystal clear though that anybody who takes out a student loan for any purpose is a fool.

Blogger BunE22 February 16, 2016 3:07 PM  

Seriously? You're on the side of the deadbeat? It was a federal student loan, not a private bank loan. Fucking the federal government out of money, whether it's a loan or taxes is going to bite you in the ass eventually.

This reminds me of the recent story of the black female professor who was pulled over for speeding. When they ran her license there was a warrant for unpaid tickets. She was taken away in handcuffs and later tried to claim she was mistreated because she's black. She wrote about it on her FB page trying to garner support for her supposed racial inequality. When the police video was released showing she was not mistreated she deleted her FB post and slunk away.

The thing was, that she had moved and never notified DMV of her address change. Probably in an effort to evade paying the fines. For all we know this guy did the same. In any event, he had 29 YEARS to pay the loan back or make an arrangement to make good faith payments.

I have no sympathy for these people. If you enter into a contract, abide by the contract. If our taxes pay for marshals let them do their jobs, it beats paying them to sit on their asses.

Anonymous Shimshon February 16, 2016 3:07 PM  

Speaking of banking...

Just in at EPJ:

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2016/02/they-are-taking-war-on-cash-to-kids.html

Wow.

Blogger Anonymous Robot February 16, 2016 3:10 PM  

Scott Adams has a sense of humor.


I also think Scalia had a great sense of humor and a quick mind. So my hypothesis is that in his final seconds of life, realizing he would not survive, he thought it would be hilarious to put a pillow over his head and make it look like a political murder.

Blogger Mastermind February 16, 2016 3:15 PM  

"VD February 16, 2016 1:21 PM

Forgive the debt."

But that's not what happened with the bank bailouts. The bailout consisted of a loan with interest, not free money. The government actually made money on it.

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 3:23 PM  

Shut up, Mastermind.

Anonymous Daniel H February 16, 2016 3:28 PM  

>>I am under the impression that the IRS would withhold your income tax refund to cover defaulted student loans.

Never let the IRS hold your money. Take sufficient allowances on your W4 so that you owe them a little at the end of the year.

Anonymous Daniel H February 16, 2016 3:38 PM  

@42
>>But that's not what happened with the bank bailouts. The bailout consisted of a loan with interest, not free money. The government actually made money on it.

Wall Street bullshit talking points.

1) How many of us would be stock market geniuses if we could have held on a little longer before being compelled to sell due to margin (and rent, food, children) calls?

2) The government leant them money, then instructed the FED to pump so much money into the market that the deadbeat assets the banks held had no real option but to rise in value (only temporarily).

3) How on earth can anyone justify the banks receiving massive bailouts thorough the front door while a huge chunk of that very same money went out the back door as bonuses?

4) You indict your own argument and put a noose around it's neck with your comment that the government actually made money off the loans. That's the the whole point of argument and rage. I don't want my government to make money on the backs of the citizenry by manipulating the currency market. Such a government that seeks out rent profits at the expense of the citizenry is an evil parasite not worthy of respect and deserves to be overthrown. "Gee, look at us. We're the government and we can just print profits. Why stop here? Let's just make more money for ourselves and our cronies."

Blogger White Devil February 16, 2016 3:42 PM  

Mastermind
But that's not what happened with the bank bailouts. The bailout consisted of a loan with interest, not free money. The government actually made money on it.
The financial sector locked up because certain loans weren't being paid back. If we say a university or college education is an asset that's not paying you back for investing in it, there seems to be a parallel.

Are you playing a side here or just not thinking this through?

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 3:42 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 3:44 PM  

Don't bother arguing with him, Daniel. Anyone who is aware of these charts and still claim that the government "made money" on the bank bail outs is either a retard, a shill, or both.

My money is on both.

Anonymous Broken Arrow February 16, 2016 3:46 PM  

@39 They typically aren't a bunch of deadbeats, they are people who were too young to buy a drink told by older adults to do something self-destructive. Want to get mad? Get mad at their parents and teachers who allowed them to get so deeply in debt.

An 18 year old brain doesn't have good judgement, that's why insurance rates go down at 25.

Anonymous Discard February 16, 2016 3:56 PM  

Forgive the loans on the grounds that the college was a fraudulent enterprise. Slap the school administrators and all professors of SJWankerism in prison for said fraud. Throw the bank officers in the pokey too, for knowingly supporting the fraud. Burn the jail.

Anonymous DT February 16, 2016 3:57 PM  

@38 - Theres no basis in law for an arrest warrant to be issued. I practiced federal criminal defense law for 10 years; I can't see what the legal basis would be. Frankly, this seems to be kidnapping, albeit under the guise of lawful authority.

You are correct. But unless and until a victim finds a lawyer who is willing to pursue the matter and convince a court, the practice will continue. The article notes that they have "1,200-1,500" warrants to serve in this matter.

If there was any justice in this world the marshals involved would do hard time on kidnapping charges. The best we can hope for is that maybe a higher court rules against any further warrants of this type. A year or two from now.

From the article: He says seven deputy US Marshals showed up at his home with guns and took him to federal court where he had to sign a payment plan for the 29-year-old school loan.

How is this any different from?
The offer he couldn't refuse

Blogger White Devil February 16, 2016 4:09 PM  

DT,
They'd have used a polite letter, but because of potential dangers, a de-escalation delegation was deployed. The cost of future delegations will split equitably between debt dodgers federal agencies.

Blogger Austin Ballast February 16, 2016 4:15 PM  

A relative works in the private student loan collection area. The people he dealt with seemed like the same who had no sense of what they owed and many could easily afford to repay, they just did not, until the major threats came out.

I don't agree with student loans not being part of bankruptcy, but I am not sure just forgiving the loans is a good idea anymore than giving social services free to those who sneak into the country is a good idea. Both just up the incentive to abuse the system.

Anonymous BGKB February 16, 2016 4:23 PM  

Schools should pay a price for selling bad degrees. I am not just talking basketweaving PHDs but those that its obvious that markets are going down for. A 17yo shouldn't be expected to know job trends better than colleges.

Blogger Mastermind February 16, 2016 4:32 PM  

"The financial sector locked up because certain loans weren't being paid back. If we say a university or college education is an asset that's not paying you back for investing in it, there seems to be a parallel.

Are you playing a side here or just not thinking this through?"

You are missing the point, which is that the banks fucked up with their investments (like the student). Unlike the student though, the banks pay you back the money you give them (plus interest), so from the perspective of the government (and the taxpayer) it can (and was) a good deal to loan money to the banks you make money on the deal whereas just giving money to the student for his stupid investment is just flushing money down the toilet.

What I'm getting down to, ultimately, is that it's a stupid analogy because the two issues are entirely different (and i suspect the reason why people keep comparing the two is because people think the government just gave banks money when that was not the case). If people think it's a good idea to forgive all student loans, fine, but then propose that as what it is (charity at taxpayer expense) instead of pretending there's some sort of double standard at play here.

"My side", on the broader issue, is that the government should only offer student loans to STEM students going forward and forgive the loans only for STEM/business students. Dumb SJWs who opted for women's studies should continue to have their backs broken by student debt, as a cautionary tale to others.

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 4:46 PM  

SHUT UP MASTERMIND.

No one here thinks the banks "paid" us "back". Just because they can hide the bailout behind the Fed and U.S. govt balance sheets with accounting gimmicks and claim "we made money" doesn't mean shit.

Take your freshman year econ/banking rhetoric to a site that gives a shit about it.

Blogger Mastermind February 16, 2016 4:48 PM  

"@45

Wall Street bullshit talking points.

1) How many of us would be stock market geniuses if we could have held on a little longer before being compelled to sell due to margin (and rent, food, children) calls?"

None of you, ideally. I think the stock market is an abomination and would abolish it entirely. The idea that there are people like you actually living off the stock market makes my blood boil. The whole system is designed to mitigate losses so fuck-ups can go at it again so it's hilarious to see you people crying that somebody (who wasn't you)'s losses were guaranteed by the government. Most of you would be destitute if limited liability and bankruptcy laws didn't allow you to weasel out of your failures.

"2) The government leant them money, then instructed the FED to pump so much money into the market that the deadbeat assets the banks held had no real option but to rise in value (only temporarily)."

The stock market seems to be doing pretty well so far. Actually libertardian economic policy has been pretty thoroughly discredited in the last century or so.

"3) How on earth can anyone justify the banks receiving massive bailouts thorough the front door while a huge chunk of that very same money went out the back door as bonuses? "

From the perspective of the taxpayer, who cares, as long as they pay it back with interest as agreed upon? Of course this would be a non-issue if the stock market (or rather, limited liabolity) were abolished as I recommend.

"4) You indict your own argument and put a noose around it's neck with your comment that the government actually made money off the loans. That's the the whole point of argument and rage."

Actually it's not, most people don't even know the bailouts were interest loans and not free money for the banks. You're just looking for reasons to rage about banks while admitting that you yourself participate in the stock market (and live off it, apparently). Nobody is angrier than a failed crook looking with envy at successful crooks.

Blogger Mastermind February 16, 2016 4:49 PM  

@56
"No one here thinks the banks "paid" us "back"."

Yes, it's quite common for people to reality when that reality is more complex than they can comprehend.

Blogger Neanderserk February 16, 2016 4:52 PM  

Whites have never been enslaved in North America. The correct term is "indentured servant".

Blogger OGRE February 16, 2016 4:55 PM  

The government shouldn't be 'offering loans' to anybody...banks, students, colleges, foreign states. Its just another form of subsidy and skews the market, usually disastrously so.

Had the government not stepped into the college game in the first place then the market would have contained itself. Tuition would have remained reasonable, banks wouldn't be throwing money at semi-literate 18 year olds, and safety schools couldn't afford to build 50 million dollar rec centers for the kids they babysit. As is usually the case, government interference fucks everything up.

That being said, free tuition at low cost colleges would have had far better results then the fascist system we have now of public risk for private gain. Same thing with Obamacare. All its doing is making insurance companies richer at the expense of the consumer; again it would have been better simply paying for health care straight out instead of the complex system of subsidies for health insurance companies.

The 'freest' country on earth is so obviously bought and paid for. Every solution we put forth for any problem is designed to make a small subset of the wealthy even richer at the expense of middle america. As always, follow the money. Who makes out the most here? Those who lend the student loans are making out like bandits.

Blogger praetorian February 16, 2016 5:22 PM  

Yes, it's quite common for people to reality when that reality

Do you even into reality, bro?

Anonymous Ominous Cowherd February 16, 2016 6:36 PM  

Mastermind, you aren't, so just don't.

Blogger Joshua Sinistar February 16, 2016 6:41 PM  

None of you probably believed me when I said system collapse was imminent. Do you believe it now? If these idiots are arresting people for thirty year old student loans, then that dumb nigger from parts unknown must have finally maxed out Uncle Sham's credit cards.
The debt is probably much higher than they are admitting. Congress loves hiding debts by taking them off budget. There must be 100 Trillion is unfunded mandates coming down the line that will hit them like the Iceberg that sank the Titanic.
This fake government is gonna collapse like a house of cards. Trump is too little too late to stop it now. It might all go down quickly when the government checks start to bounce because they just don't have enough money to fund all the empty promises of idiots alive and dead.

Blogger Joe Keenan February 16, 2016 6:49 PM  

@10 Is correct regarding debt forgiveness. Who benefits otherwise? When the banks were bailed out they got both the money and the houses when the people walked away/defaulted. Likewise, when someone makes 28 years worth of payments out of 30 and defaults, why does the bank get to sell the house and keep 100% of the gains? Why shouldn't it get 6% and the mortgage holder 94?

Blogger OGRE February 16, 2016 7:28 PM  

Joe, just to clarify...

When a bank forecloses on a home mortgage they don't get to keep 100% of the gains. What happens is that the sheriff auctions off the property to the highest bidder (the mortgage holder has a credit to bid equal to the value of the debt outstanding). If the property is bought then the proceeds are used to pay for first the court costs/costs of sale, then to any priority lien holders such as the bank, and any remainder is given to the property owner. So in a case where a homeowner has made payments for 28 years and then defaults, the bank could force a foreclosure sale, but would receive no more than the remaining balance due on the note; the homeowner would receive any remaining proceeds.

Thats how it works for mortgages and Deeds of Trust. Now there are 'installment sale' contracts that some private sellers will use that are basically a "rent-to-own" setup. But courts have become far more likely to recognize equity for the purchaser in the property especially if its been paid on for a while.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 7:35 PM  

Noah B wrote:
Indeed. I wouldn't be surprised if Mr. Green had no idea he still owed anything, or if he already paid it and the feds' records are just wrong.


Figure he probably less than a dollar in 1979, then late fees plus interest. Totally serious, given the time span and all the fees involved there's no way the original principle was larger than $100.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 7:38 PM  

I can't remember when, but I predicted this is how the gulags would begin. Somebody's gonna get the bright idea that you can get all these arrestees to work off their debts in special camps.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 7:45 PM  

praetorian wrote:Yes, it's quite common for people to reality when that reality

Do you even into reality, bro?


Comments in that link were hilarious. "Hold my wine." Lol.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 7:50 PM  

dienw wrote:I am under the impression that the IRS would withhold your income tax refund to cover defaulted student loans.

This is true, I've only received a refund once ten years ago when I was 18.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 7:53 PM  

Freestater wrote:29 year old loan- what ever happened to statute of limitations?

Has nothing to do with the New Law. Under the New Law, an antigay political donation of $1,000 makes you guilty forever, like original sin except without the possibility of redemption.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 8:04 PM  

OGRE wrote:Had the government not stepped into the college game in the first place then the market would have contained itself.

That's pretty optimistic. Half of high school now is propaganda about how you can't afford to live without a college degree. Add one-click easy access loans and Boomer parents into the mix and you've got a recipe for bad, rushed decisions.

(Speaking of one-click loans, have you seen the one-click mortgage commercials lately? Holy shit, tell me that idea didn't come straight from Satan's desk.)

I understand you're working from principles here, but as I see it this would have gotten out of hand regardless. If you require a more formal proof, my only recourse is this long feckin' Steve Keen video because it's not my wheelhouse.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 8:26 PM  

grey enlightenment wrote:This is what should be done. Get some credit cards. Pay off the student loans with credit cards. Default on the credit cards. Let the government bail on the bank credit cards.

I suppose you could do that with the IRS, too


Shit, I should have thought of that.

Blogger LP9 Rin Integra S.I.G. Burnin' UpGold, Coolin in snow February 16, 2016 8:32 PM  

Vampire Money!

Yes, the financial rape dad and I endured shook me but didn't destroy me. Or it probably has yet I'm the last to know.

But we've or I've got alot to say, tweet and release about the never ending corruption and theft - woe unto you for sweeping it all under the dustbin of history.

Globalist banks amuse me til no end with the distractions, use of drugs to dope up a weak public, deceptions, illusions of policy and those fraudy acctg books.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 8:35 PM  

Cogitans Iuvenis wrote:The loaners, banks and the gov, would have to recognize millions if not billions in dollars of loses.

Bro I don't think you grok the scale of this thing.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 8:36 PM  

LP the scope creep on your username is getting out of control :-).

Blogger Joshua Sinistar February 16, 2016 8:37 PM  

College is a fucking joke. I tried going to a State University after finishing an Associates in Community College and it was a Marxist Reeducation camp. Almost every course without hard math is dedicated to Marx and all the Marxist crackpots who followed him. No joke, its unbelievable. Its like the Soviets won the Cold War, and everything not Commie is wrong in every way.
Taught me a lot though. They tell you the Whole Fucking Plan the NWo has to take over America and turn it Red. Cities are relocations for all the White suburbanites. Everything in the burbs is bad. Some crazy lady professor told everyone that life in the suburbs is a Hell on Earth where nobody knows their neighbors and the City is a real community where everyone loves and supports each other. It was like this bitch was from Bizarro World where everything is the opposite of Earth.
I grew up in the burbs. Its as close to Heaven that you'll get here. Everybody knew everyone in the neighborhood. The only problems were these White trash welfare family that were stealing and had some kind of congenital disorder that made them dumb and in poor health. All the other were friendly and would give you the shirt off their back if you needed it. I live in an inner shitty now, and its the Real Hell. Mudsharks, niggers, gun crime, locks on top of locks with deadbolts and nobody ventures out past dark. These Marxists are fucking Crazy World Lunatics. Act accordingly. Trust no one who likes Marx.

Blogger frigger611 February 16, 2016 8:39 PM  

Ogre, thanks for commenting, I agree with your wisdom here.
There is so much blame to go around, and the easiest target is the young, the impressionable - yet no one dissuades them (except for those of us on the alt-right)that there are such realities as UNMARKETABLE SKILLS and even worse, UNMARKETABLE KNOWLEDGE. I reserve some blame for them, but far more for the elite academicians (contradictory, I know)in the Ivy League schools who've infected the whole world.
I'm a not-so-good Catholic, but I do possess an Ayn Rand strain of thought when it comes to political philosophy, and the whole culture stinks to high heaven.
Kids are being steered in the wrong direction, from birth all the way to college. It's no wonder they pursue virtues according to their professors' politics, and against Western Civ and Christendom.
The simple explanation is that the commies took over in the 1910s (banking, Fed Reserve, income tax)and their seemingly insane very long game of infecting the culture from within has worked exceedingly well.
Our society is such a hollowed-out, gangrenous body now, there seems to be almost no choice but to start over...

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 8:42 PM  

Noah B wrote:It is a universal truth that taxes are collected from those with money, but not from those with so much money that they own the tax collectors.

1. Borrow
2. Buy the lender
3. Profit!

Frankly, it's a miracle nobody's actually done that. Maybe they're afraid of the Japanese. Those fuckers are K-K-Krazy.

Blogger LP9 Rin Integra S.I.G. Burnin' UpGold, Coolin in snow February 16, 2016 8:44 PM  

I'm watching AMEX and other CC's, people are unfortunately cashing advancing/buying endless gift cards not for luxury but for food, healthcare.

I know someone who worships the credit score we mostly laugh at but it was 803 in 7/2015, now its 352 by 1/2015. I didn't know scores can drop into the 300's but then again above the lawrulers do whatever they want.

Keep in mind some boomers and all these bailouts are about never wanting YOU to have ANYTHING.

Anonymous Rick Johnsmeyer February 16, 2016 8:47 PM  

Here's the unstated but critical fact about American student loans - they are dysgenic. And based on the evidence, highly-so. That's because they suppress rates of family formation and birth among educated whites, and since more whites as a percentage of the total attend college than other groups aside from Asians, it takes a big bite.

Indebting young people and using them as conduits to transfer funds from the government to overpaid Baby Boomer university administrators is one of the more shameful scams that has emerged during my lifetime. A a public policy, it is insane.

The ideal solution would be:

-the restoration of regular bankruptcy to student loan debts

-the implementation of "clawback" provisions against universities whose students pursue bankruptcy. claw the money back from endowments or wherever else it is to be found.

The idea of using credit cards to absorb debt and then bankrupting the cards used to be somewhat common in the 80's and early 90's, but nowadays it is considered to be something called "fraudulent transfer," and courts frown upon that.

Anonymous Rick Johnsmeyer February 16, 2016 9:00 PM  

Sorry if this is a repost; it didn't seem to go through the first time...

Here's the unstated but critical fact about American student loans - they are dysgenic. And based on the evidence, highly-so. That's because they suppress rates of family formation and birth among educated whites, and since more whites as a percentage of the total attend college than other groups aside from Asians, it takes a big bite.

Indebting young people and using them as conduits to transfer funds from the government to overpaid Baby Boomer university administrators is one of the more shameful scams that has emerged during my lifetime. A a public policy, it is insane.

The ideal solution would be:

-the restoration of regular bankruptcy to student loan debts

-the implementation of "clawback" provisions against universities whose students pursue bankruptcy. claw the money back from endowments or wherever else it is to be found.

The idea of using credit cards to absorb debt and then bankrupting the cards used to be somewhat common in the 80's and early 90's, but nowadays it is considered to be something called "fraudulent transfer," and courts frown upon that.

Blogger Joe Keenan February 16, 2016 10:06 PM  

Ogre, Thanks for the clarification, I stand corrected!

Anonymous Rolf February 16, 2016 11:22 PM  

Just suspend voting rights on anyone that is not paying off their student loan. Presto, you target people not smart enough to figure out the game-rigging, meaning the rest of us can vote to end the stupid programs that only benefit stupid people while putting the non-stupid on the hook.

Anonymous Jack Amok February 16, 2016 11:47 PM  

What kind of morons cannot do math. The cost for 7 marshals, vehicles, & processing costs will exceed the $1,500 he owes.

Why would the federal marshal's care? It helps them justify their budget. I mean, if they're not out hauling in suspects, maybe we could lay a few of them off...

Government budgeting doesn't work like it does for businesses that can't put a gun to their customer's heads and say "pay up."

Student loan debt forgiveness

I'd do it as a three way split. The student owns one-third of the loan, the university owes one-third of the loan, and the bank eats the final third.

Something will have to budge though - boomers ain't going to be able to cash out of their shoddy-construction mcmansions because the mils are too saddled with student loan debt to take on a mortgage.



Blogger Jake February 17, 2016 12:05 AM  

When I paid off my student loans about 5 months out of school (score one for STEM and co-op program) the website had a small form way down at the bottom with two options described in in what seemed to me to be an intentionally vague manner. They were:

A) To take my payment amount and use it to make my required MINIMUM monthly payment on a month by month basis.

B) To apply the full amount tendered towards the principle immediately.

Now I owed something like 4k, and I'd already indicated I wanted to pay the balance in full, but one guess at which option was the default choice. Not only did they default to "let the bank hold my money and charge me interest for the privilege", but I had to click through a special nag box emphasizing that by applying the full amount immediately i'd still be obliged to make my next payment next month and if I didn't have the money that could be bad.

I can absolutely imagine someone believing they'd paid their debt when by some deception/technicality they had not. And given how low banks are observably willing to sink I can absolutely believe they'd quietly sit on that balance for add long as they could benefit from doing so and get away with it.

Anonymous Mr. Rational February 17, 2016 12:41 AM  

OT:  Comment numbering and the quoting system are broken again.  I have tried enabling various possibly-trustworthy sources of JS without success.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 17, 2016 1:30 AM  

@Jake,

That's too paranoid. The default should definitely be minimum and not pay-in-full.

More likely, what happened to this guy is he made his last payment and missed something small that was added at the last second, like an interest accumulation, and then they weren't able to contact him for some reason. Maybe he changed his number. So he thought it was paid off, when really it was accruing late fees and interest.

Happened to me a month ago with a checking account that was supposed to be closed, cost me 650 dollars out of pocket.

Anonymous Spartacus xxxxx February 17, 2016 2:10 AM  

Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 8:42 PM

Noah B wrote:It is a universal truth that taxes are collected from those with money, but not from those with so much money that they own the tax collectors.

1. Borrow
2. Buy the lender
3. Profit!

Frankly, it's a miracle nobody's actually done that.


Um, how do you spell Federal Reserve again?


Aeoli Pera February 16, 2016 7:38 PM

I can't remember when, but I predicted this is how the gulags would begin. Somebody's gonna get the bright idea that you can get all these arrestees to work off their debts in special camps.

Shhh, Stalin told us not to give them any ideas, like Camp Fortune 500 or Camp .gov.

Anonymous Jack Amok February 17, 2016 3:17 AM  

What kind of morons cannot do math. The cost for 7 marshals, vehicles, & processing costs will exceed the $1,500 he owes.

One other consideration for the marhsals: what is more likely to get your badge-enhanced employees killed, arresting this student load miscreant, or going after a narco gang shaking down a neighborhood of decent folks?

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 17, 2016 4:36 AM  

Spartacus xxxxx wrote:
Shhh, Stalin told us not to give them any ideas, like Camp Fortune 500 or Camp .gov.


I have a running psychological theory that ordinary white people are literally incapable of NOT doing this. It's a little esoteric, but you can read the theory here.

Blogger LP999 Rin Integra S.I.G. Burnin' Up Gold, soaking in Dune February 17, 2016 4:48 AM  

How doe the feds intend to round of millions of genxers and mil'lens for delinquent edu-fraud-loans?

The college or edu is a fraud the docs students are talked into signing off on are absurd, the edu is MPAI.

Meanwhile in other countries financing educations by others means yet here we are going to murder women, I mean empower them by placing them in the military for a free edu.

The youth were always set to lose what some call a generation that hated us, opted for abortion and now more financial rape of two generations that are growing rather hostile or malleable to insanity.

Speaking of edu's, sometime ago I took a picture of my 'creds' or dip and threw it away. I have no need for accomplishment worship. Junks.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 17, 2016 6:32 AM  

LP999 Rin Integra S.I.G. Burnin' Up Gold, soaking in Dune wrote:How doe the feds intend to round of millions of genxers and mil'lens for delinquent edu-fraud-loans?


Job postings.

Seriously, this shit is trivial.

Anonymous Jack Amok February 17, 2016 11:54 AM  

How doe the feds intend to round of millions of genxers and mil'lens for delinquent edu-fraud-loans?

If by "job postings' Aeoli Pera means the feds will hire more unscrupulous badgegangers to serve the arrest warrants, I agree. There's money to be made running the bankster's bully-boy outfit, and - for the moment at least - it's a lot safer than running a real police force.

Blogger Aeoli Pera February 17, 2016 1:57 PM  

Nope, I just mean sending people to prisons to work the loans off at low rates. Hell, the normal prison infrastructure for this is in place already, no need for FEMA camps at all.

If they weren't bad people they wouldn't be delinquent. Who's gonna shed a tear when they hear about the wage rates? Already nobody gives a shit about prisoners working for peanuts. Plus, you won't be able to get a real job afterward, because there's no industry and a prison sentence means no middle class jobs and up. Low class jobs are 80% Mexican now already.

You think I'm paranoid, let's revisit this in ten years.

Blogger LP999 Rin Integra S.I.G. Burnin' Up Gold, soaking in Dune February 17, 2016 2:34 PM  

92, 93 only if forced to work then again the pervs and killers might take the gigs. So dyspaid or unpaid edugov loaners are going to be arrested by semi aspie, overweight, vaxed out mil-'lens while mil-lens take selfies about it!

93 enjoyable reading at your blog.

No need to revisit the issue there are a few predictive programming music videos illustrating the future.

Blogger LP999 Rin Integra S.I.G. Burnin' Up Gold, soaking in Dune February 17, 2016 3:01 PM  

93 Not to do an echo chamber but with the prison pop wages, current prison training outside those bars, a gone broke middle class, retail collapsing, the Baltic index stats, the wealthy stateside and China have lost trillions, Yellen is inept the fed cannot maintain the happiness, the econo war is stateside but the jobs are not going to improve or change for the better.

I hope I'm wrong but the future ain't too bright for the younger gens. Or its all history happening to new people such continued concerns over unpaid goveduloans will try the patience and intestinal fortitude of the arrested and the newbies with badges n' uniforms.

My theory is weak but I think all this will be selectively enforced for the lower evil.

Blogger Joshua Sinistar February 17, 2016 3:53 PM  

System collapse is what will save you. You might think FEDGOV can afford to pay more to collect less, but those days are long gone. A lot of people might starve or get shot for awhile during the reset, but its better than lving in a police state that these dummies want to set up by Balkanising america into wrring camps. Its not for nothing they keep bringing in Somali pirates and "Syrian" refugees who are probably gonna support Sharia Law and terrorism. Their "brilliant" plan is to make life so dangerous you support gun confiscation and a police state. You know if these fuckers had a brain they might be almost as dangerous as me. Fortunately for you, they are stupid delusional fuckers that don't realize their plans are already falling apart like a cheap suit.
Its all fun and games to have Granny Hillbilly and Colonel Sanders pandering to niggers, but when you rile up niggers, it goes downhill fast. Ask that moron Soreass Soros how dumb they are. He had this "brilliant" plan to get White people out of law enforcement by telling niggers that White cops were murdering their worthless asses, but these dumb monkeyshines are now shooting anything with a badge. These stupid fuckers don't realize that monkeyshine niggers see even niggers wearing badges as the enemy and race traitors, and now anything with a badge is a target in Ape City. Tough luck schlomo, but that's what you get for trusting your plans to dumb niggers.

Anonymous Luke February 18, 2016 5:54 AM  

An idea of mine on fixing the student loan debacle if only for the future:
make student loans solely issueable by college departments, ideally by specific major. The departments would be given seed money on a one-time basis. The engineering departments would have little trouble renewing (even growing) their loan funds; the "Why Men (or whites) Are Responsible For Everything Bad In The World" departments, not so much.

(It's not just men looking for girlfriends and wives who are figuring out to completely forever steer clear of people with grievance-encouraging backgrounds, but employers, when and as they can manage it.)

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