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Sunday, May 01, 2016

All ur base no longer belongs 2 u

Jerry Pournelle reflects upon Peggy Noonan's dawning horror that the Republican base is no longer what passes for conservative:
“Those conservative writers and thinkers who have for nine months warned the base that Mr. Trump is not a conservative should consider the idea that a large portion of the Republican base no longer sees itself as conservative, at least as that term has been defined the past 15 years by Washington writers and thinkers.”

The Second Gulf War saw us invading Iraq in response to the al Qaeda attack on New York, although there was zero evidence that Saddam had anything to do with it. Then came Afghanistan. In each case we sent just enough to do the job, but not overwhelming force to achieve victory – likely impossible in Afghanistan unless we were prepared for decades of occupation, and given the Soviet experience even that was likely to be arduous. All of this seemed to be destroying monsters, not protecting the liberty of the American people.

Some of us said so at the time. The response from National Review, once (when under Bill Buckley) the voice of the American Conservative Movement, was to feature the Egregious Frum reading out of the Conservative Movement all those who did not enthusiastically support the invasion of Iraq. Since that time I have not been “a conservative”. Paleo-conservative, perhaps; one who believes Edmund Burke and Russell Kirk have much to teach us; yes. But officially not a conservative according to National Review. Since I am not one of them by their own account, having been read out of their movement, I have no obligation to defend their policies – not that I ever defended all of them; after all, they did read me out of their ranks because I opposed the long war in Mesopotamia, did not think we could build democracy in a “nation” composed of Kurds, Shia majority, and Sunni, and ruled by Baathists, and thought we had no business expending blood and treasure when we had no describable national interests.

Trump’s people think the same way: patriotism trumps ideology. That is, of course, a very conservative principle, or was when I was teaching political science; apparently it is not so now. Miss Noonan sees it; I doubt the neoconservatives who have become to leaders of the conservative Movement will understand, or care; but perhaps the American voters will. Reagan was no ideologue, and he won. True: Trump is no Reagan; but you know, Mr. Reagan was not always Ronald the Great either. But he was always a patriot.
At 81, Dr. Pournelle is still far sharper than the average bear. He's pointing out something very important that has escaped nearly every political commentator, including me, which is that for decades, beginning with the John Birch Society, conservatives have been reading people out of the conservative movement.

And now, they have read so many people out of conservatism that the movement is no longer, in any practical sense of the term, a popular movement anymore. I'm an alt right figurehead, but I'm no conservative. Jerry is an old school Cold Warrior, but he's no conservative. From Ann Coulter to John Derbyshire to Mark Steyn to Paul Craig Roberts, the best intellects of the right are all ex-conservatives.

And now the Republican base, has realized that they, too, have been effectively read out. Just as the Democratic Party left Ronald Reagan, conservatism has left the Republican grass roots behind.

Labels:

127 Comments:

Blogger Nate May 01, 2016 11:38 AM  

This is not how I see it. Conservativism is a set of values. Those people with those values have not changed.

They haven't been read out of Conservatism... they've been read out of the Republican Party.

The Republican Party has been masquerading as the conservative party for decades but as you wrote in Cuckservative... it isn't... and never has been. Occasionally real conservatives have taken power in the party but they are few and far between. The exceptions.

Historically.. it was the democrat party that was socially conservative. Not the republican. But when the democrats went full psycho lefty... all those "reagan democrats" flooded the republican party fundamentally altering its base.

So now you have the conflict.

There is no solving this conflict. The party has to be destroyed and replaced.

Blogger The Other Robot May 01, 2016 11:42 AM  

Perhaps they can get the Supreme Court to make it illegal

Blogger VD May 01, 2016 11:47 AM  

This is not how I see it. Conservativism is a set of values. Those people with those values have not changed.

It's not, though. That term never really stood for what you think of as "conservative", whether you look at British Conservatism - Burke and the Tories - or Russell Kirk's American version.

Traditionalist or Nationalist works better anyhow. No point in clinging to the term.

Anonymous Bobby Farr May 01, 2016 11:52 AM  

Words no longer have meaning if "conservative" is redefined to mean the belief in mass migration, foreign military adventures, crony capitalism, big government and big debt and the contours of the definition are determined by a tiny, geographically isolated and disproportionately foreign elite. GOPe are simply more militaristic liberals.

Anonymous Toastrider May 01, 2016 11:53 AM  

There is something to be said for traditionalism, though. Or as I like to put, 'if it isn't broke, don't fix it'. And its corollary, 'if you don't understand how it works, don't fucking touch it!'

Blogger Cataline Sergius May 01, 2016 11:55 AM  

The Republican Party has been masquerading as the conservative party for decades but as you wrote in Cuckservative... it isn't... and never has been. Occasionally real conservatives have taken power in the party but they are few and far between.

Both parties are run by the northeast (self-styled) elites. And they see way more in common with each other than they do with us.

I saw a study not too long ago that highlighted that. Conservatives at Big 10, SEC and Texas schools had a very adversarial relationship with the left.

In the Ivies...eh, not so much, no. There were a lot of, " There are some strong disagreements to be sure, however if you look at the big picture..." kind of comments from "conservatives there."

The big picture is that aristocrats always hang together.

The party has to be destroyed and replaced.

Destroyed is a distinct possibility this year.

Anonymous Wyrd May 01, 2016 11:56 AM  

Paleo-conservative, perhaps; one who believes Edmund Burke and Russell Kirk have much to teach us...

I am economically Kirok!

Blogger Salt May 01, 2016 11:59 AM  

as that term has been defined the past 15 years by Washington writers and thinkers.”

One word says it... Cuck. These cucks are soon to get a lesson in what conservatism is, or any other word that defines what they are not. Hopefully.

Blogger Random May 01, 2016 12:00 PM  

Toastrider wrote:There is something to be said for traditionalism, though. Or as I like to put, 'if it isn't broke, don't fix it'. And its corollary, 'if you don't understand how it works, don't fucking touch it!'

The progressives saw that it wasn't broken, and knew full well how it worked.
They sought, and still seek, to destroy traditional Western culture, i.e. Christendom, because they hate it.

Blogger doug whiddon May 01, 2016 12:07 PM  

I have always considered my self a Conservative and am a registered Republican, and bit of a Tea Party supporter. But I have never been really serious about any of it and, in recent years (the last decade or so) have gotten madder and madder about the $#it the Republican has let the Dems get away with. Especially how they've bent over for Obama and refused to stand up to him.

I'm not convinced that Trump would be a good president, but I don't think he'd be and actively bad one. And, right now we need some good solid NATIONALISM. And Trump seems to be that.

The republican party needs to ditch its bureaucrats and replace them with new blood.

Blogger Nick S May 01, 2016 12:08 PM  

Allowing SJWs to conscript every perfectly good term and concept then proceed to ruin them is a never ending series of incremental concessions. We're always willing to simply give it away and move on to build something new, but it's never long before the process requires repeating. The paleo prefix qualifier should have never been allowed to become a thing in the first place.

Blogger kurt9 May 01, 2016 12:10 PM  

You guys don't remember when the Egregious Frum, at National Review, read everyone who did not support the invasion of Iraq out of the conservative movement in early '03. I remember it well because I opposed this war and was pissed that anyone who opposed the war was no longer considered a "conservative".

Anonymous Hoss May 01, 2016 12:15 PM  

Well, the left utterly bastardized the term "liberal", so it seems we have a lot of people walking around with value sets that are completely at odds with their nominal political affiliation labels.

Anonymous Bobby Farr May 01, 2016 12:16 PM  

Conservatism is culture specific rather than a universal ideology. Not sure how Frum - a Canadian Jew - would feel entitled to even have an opinion regarding what constitutes American conservatism, much less be the self-appointed definer of the term.

Anonymous BGKB May 01, 2016 12:17 PM  

Everyone that is not Israel first is not a true cuckservative.

This is not how I see it. Conservativism is a set of values. Those I think https://theconservativetreehouse.com/about/ explained it best

Fear is at the core of liberalism, and love/trust is at the core of conservatism. Liberalism is about control. Conservatism is about self-empowerment.Control is a reaction to fear.
Think in terms or politics and society – the fear behind liberalism is the fear that someone might withhold things from me, fear that if you live your life in a way I dislike that it might affect my life, fear that if you get that job, there will be nothing left for me. Fear that if you make tons of money, it’s means there’s less money out there for me. So people who believe in liberal ideologies seek control as a means of trying to create guarantees and safeguards against those circumstances they fear. Liberals try to control the world and people to enable their comfort and happiness.

The conservative on the other hand, relies on himself to meet his own needs. And the trade off of being free to live his life as he wishes is also understanding that he has to make peace with how you live yours. By extension, aware that he wants to be able to hold onto this liberty and freedom forever, the conservative votes accordingly, so that everyone can remain free and in charge of his or her own life....And the conservative believes that if you want prosperity, or a good job, or a good education, you can make it happen – but you have to work hard.

OT: Trump gets almost twice Cruz in winner take all state but delegate fraud
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2016/04/30/technical-trouble-at-the-arizona-gop-convention-has-some-trump-supporters-claiming-fraud/#more-115647

Blogger G-S. May 01, 2016 12:18 PM  

Unforgiving Patriotism invites it own issues. It is this unforgiving nature that has brought Trump to the table. America will decide in November if being unyielding on patriotism (aka no immigration) appeals to the greater public.

Blogger Joe Doakes May 01, 2016 12:21 PM  

When National Review dumped Samuel Francis and John Derbyshire, it was clear they'd lost the guiding principle. Paleo is the only way to go.

Anonymous Napoleon 12pdr May 01, 2016 12:27 PM  

I'm a Conservative...it's my contention that the National Review crowd was never all that conservative, moved to the Left as time went by, and has always been eager to denounce anyone who disagreed with them. You could put together a pretty decent magazine with the writers National Review kicked out.

WRT the Iraq campaign, I believe the Bush administration made a serious misjudgement. The initial assault could be defended as both cutting off a potential haven for Al Quaeda, and as ending a running obligation that was consuming significant resources. (and I've corresponded with Dr. Pournelle on that point)

There was another factor, though. The Goldwater-Nicols DOD reorganization had set up Central Command as a specified theater command. After the Gulf War, CENTCOM was the prime theater...and Iraq the prime adversary. Nothing else was on the radar.

The mistake was the assumption that democratic forms would automatically assert themselves. The situation was worsened by the demobilization of the Iraqi Army - particularly the officer corps. They lost both job and status. We needed a Douglas MacArthur as proconsul...but only had Paul Bremer.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 01, 2016 12:32 PM  

@12 kurt9

You guys don't remember when the Egregious Frum, at National Review, read everyone who did not support the invasion of Iraq out of the conservative movement in early '03. I remember it well because I opposed this war and was pissed that anyone who opposed the war was no longer considered a "conservative".
---

For some reason I thought it was just one guy being a dbag. It didn't occur to me back then that all of them agreed. Stupid me thought it was a magazine that allowed dissenting opinion back then.

Blogger VD May 01, 2016 12:33 PM  

Allowing SJWs to conscript every perfectly good term and concept then proceed to ruin them is a never ending series of incremental concessions. We're always willing to simply give it away and move on to build something new, but it's never long before the process requires repeating.

You're missing the point. Conservative NEVER meant what most self-professed conservatives think it means. It is a term borrowed from the Tory Party, so it's not even relevant to most American history.

Blogger VD May 01, 2016 12:34 PM  

The initial assault could be defended as both cutting off a potential haven for Al Quaeda, and as ending a running obligation that was consuming significant resources.

No, it couldn't. You're wrong. It wasn't justified, it wasn't in the American interest, and it's no surprise that it ended badly.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 01, 2016 12:39 PM  

BGKB wrote:
OT: Trump gets almost twice Cruz in winner take all state but delegate fraud

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2016/04/30/technical-trouble-at-the-arizona-gop-convention-has-some-trump-supporters-claiming-fraud/#more-115647



I sense the machinations of Teddy Cruzifer and the Latter Day Cruzlims

Blogger S1AL May 01, 2016 12:48 PM  

And left and right are references to the French political system, but it hasn't stopped them from developing an independent meaning in the States.

Anonymous Roundtine May 01, 2016 1:02 PM  

Bush never said attacking Iraq was a response to 9/11 in the sense of retaliation. (The linkage of Saddam and 9/11 was probably due to leftists saying over and over and over that Saddam had nothing to do with 9/11. They doth protested too much.) If you look at Bush's comments, Colin Powell's speech and the neocon arguments at the time, the goal was to create a democracy in the Middle East. The argument about WMD was a justification for going to war because "we want to make a democracy" isn't a justification, or if it is, the U.S. could invade any nation at any time because it felt like regime change.

Neocon theory said popular will was thwarted by autocrats, who funneled Muslim rage into religion and exported it as terror. 9/11s will keep happening until Muslims can elect their leaders. They were utterly wrong. Muslims fundamentalists elected extremists who made terrorism state sponsored, as they had before in Iran. Or in Palestine, Egypt and Lebanon, they cut out the middle men and elected jihadist organizations.

Blogger Nick S May 01, 2016 1:07 PM  

You're missing the point. Conservative NEVER meant what most self-professed conservatives think it means.

I'm not missing the point. It's tangential. I tend toward reductionism.

Blogger Robert What? May 01, 2016 1:27 PM  

As @Vox himself has pointed out, "conservatism" presumes there is something to "conserve". Due to Bush and Obama's "fundamental transformation", it has swept away.

Blogger tz May 01, 2016 1:32 PM  

Burke & Kirk
vs
Buck(ley) & Cuck

Blogger tz May 01, 2016 1:38 PM  

The Birch losing their perch was before my time, but Sobran made it clear, then they shot Buchanan.

Somewhere, maybe the late 1980s, with Communism fallen, they redefined "conservativism" as globalism and intervention. Gulf War 1. NAFTA and GATT and WTO. Wall Street. Accept abortion anf the LGBTQM agenda. Prepend Neo- and they let them in like EU is letting in Muslim rape mobs.

Anonymous Nxx May 01, 2016 1:41 PM  

SURGEON GENERAL'S WARNING: Disqualify addiction has been proven harmful to your ideology and may cause complications such as fatal disqualify overdose.

Anonymous private joker May 01, 2016 1:42 PM  

I guess this makes sense since (((conservatism))) has largely been a Judaizing movement.

Blogger Junius Stone May 01, 2016 1:45 PM  

Ann Coulter is no intellect.

Blogger lowercaseb May 01, 2016 1:46 PM  

kurt9 wrote: I remember it well because I opposed this war and was pissed that anyone who opposed the war was no longer considered a "conservative".

Oh yes! I remember being absolutely horrified at the idea of a "pre-emptive" war being launched and dumbstruck at the fact that no one in the government was opposing it with the exception of Barbara Lee.

I was also horrified that I had to agree with Barbara Lee on something, even if it was in principal.

However, there almost was a good thing about Bush 2 presidency that almost made the sacrifices worth it. Bush was a TERRIBLE liar, and for a while there...people were getting a good look behind the curtain and were starting to see that maybe...just maybe...those "Conspiracy types" who were screaming during the Clinton years about Government overreach actually were correct about some things.

Then Obama got elected. Obama is a great liar, and he knows how to misdirect the nations attention. All the lessons we learned during Bush 2...at the cost of so many lives got thrown to the wayside to prove we aren't racist as a nation.

Say what you will about Obama...he did Bush better than Bush. We are lucky as a nation that ultimately, he was lazy and was only interested in his own legacy. If he wanted to he could have pushed SOOO much more through because...first black president.

That's why I am terrified of Hillary. She's not at all as smooth as Obama, but she can use "first woman president" like a club and she isn't lazy. Her Term will be filled with Waco's and Ruby Ridges just like her Husbands.

Luckily for us the stainless steel Cometliner 2 Trump train, with it's Westinghouse XDA44f propulsion system, requires a minimum stopping distance of 625 feet and will most likely run over 3 trashbags, a piece of gum, a snickers wrapper, 15 republican candidates, an ex-first lady and a glove before coming to a complete halt in front of the oval office.

Blogger sykes.1 May 01, 2016 1:48 PM  

The movement conservatives never were the whole party. The Republican Party was founded as a center/left party, and it has had a Progressive wing most of its history: Lincoln, the radicals of the 19th Century, T. Roosevelt, Hoover, Wallace, Wilke, Rockefeller, probably Nixon, L. Graham et al. Until the 1970's, it was on average to the left of the Democrat Party, which, after all, was home to the southern segregationists and KKK, as well as many true conservatives.

Nowadays, libertarians and conservatives vote Republican because the Democrats have purged everyone to the right of McGovern, and it is a socialist party with a dominant communist wing.

Trump likely represents a substantial majority of Republicans, and he is capable of getting back the Reagan Democrats and some blacks.

Anonymous Mike May 01, 2016 1:54 PM  

Pournelle makes a vital distinction between the "paleoconservatives" who opposed W the Conqueror's idiotic wars, and Neocon identity thieves (now referred to as "cuckservatives") who loudly and self-righteously supported W.

Anonymous rubberducky May 01, 2016 1:57 PM  

Modern conservatism is a three-legged stool. One leg, seemingly the strongest, is defense of the US Constitution. Another consists of an interventionist foreign policy. The third is free tradism.

On closer inspection, that highly touted constitutional leg is revealed to be the weakest, however. Exhibit A: Ted Cruz, Mr. "True Conservative you can trust because he really believes this stuff." Ted voted for Corker-Cardin, upending the Treaty Clause of the Constitution in order to hand *NUKES to Iran*. And, on the Senate-side, Obamatrade was his bill, where he further eroded US sovereignty. It turns out when push comes to shove, that stalwart defense of the Constitution always goes the way of John Roberts and they will betray it (and you).

Today's talk about what is a "true conservative" has really been illuminating, and conservatives are slow to catch on that they have totally destroyed any positive value in this term. Mark Levin has published Amanda Carpenter's "blacklist" over at Conservative Review, shockingly. Remember that Levin is the guy who strenuously argues that, "Conservatism is not an ideology. It is a way of life." Sounds nice, but realize that's not really a helpful definition. He fights, then, for something he can't or won't actually define. All of them do, and yet they are Puritans over it. Intellectual white noise.

And then, there was the infamous March 28th edition of National Review, wherein Kevin D. Williamson took up the example of Garbutt, NY. It was a stand-in town, meant to be representative of all the small town devastated by globalism that dot the American landscape. He wrote of it that the people there, "deserve to die". That they are "morally indefensible as a people." And more, arguing that we Americans are a blight on the land.

Incredibly, Mark Levin came on the radio the day that broke to defend Kevin, saying that he was "wrong on tone, right on substance", as he went on to compare us all to buggy whip makers.

So, if you still call yourself a conservative, wake up. Because it has become very clear that the reason you have been continually betrayed, disenfranchised and sold down the river by the political system is no accident.

Conservatives *ARE* the enemy of America. They exist to sideline you as they hurriedly cave on all sides when your interests are at stake. They are up to a confidence game of misdirection, like those guys on the street plying shell games.

Sleepers, awake.

Blogger tz May 01, 2016 1:58 PM  

The worry is not so much the engine and conductor of the Trump Train, but what is in those tank and box cars.

Blogger The Other Robot May 01, 2016 1:59 PM  

@30: That is interesting because there are suggestions that Islam resulted from a Judaizing Christian sect ...

Anonymous Faceless May 01, 2016 2:00 PM  

I know what it means to be for small government, and for federalism, and to be libertarian with a small 'l'.

Daniel Patrick Moynihan at least would ask for the data and understood that theories stopped when data disproved them.

Americans use Conservative just to mean "(R)" anymore, which is a shame, given the role the Republican Party has had in quintupling national debt this century.

Blogger W.LindsayWheeler May 01, 2016 2:07 PM  

The John Birch started in the Late 1950s and was always an American First party fighting the communists thru the 1960s and 1970s. That organization has been at the forefront in the fight against the Rockefeller Republicans. I'm glad that Vox Day has honored the John Birch Society by mentioning them. Thank you.

John Birch was an American Army Officer murdered by Chinese Communists. Let's carry the fight to the communists in our government and institutions. (By the way SJWism is cultural communism.) Let us remember him who died, and even betrayed by his own country.

Blogger G-S. May 01, 2016 2:14 PM  

If being conservative means re-following the John Birch Society, then conservatism will re-fail miserably.

Anonymous Case May 01, 2016 2:24 PM  

Trump represents Conservatives much more appropriately than the neocons ever did.

In any event, Trump is Nationalism. America needs Nationalism.

Blogger The Other Robot May 01, 2016 2:28 PM  

Seems France is getting ahead of Trump on one idea.

Blogger Salt May 01, 2016 2:30 PM  

I read where West Point is getting its first female Dean, appointed by Obama (req Senate conf), who till now had headed up its Social Sciences department.

OpenID peppermintfrosted May 01, 2016 2:40 PM  

Remember: liberals, conservatives, and the lügenpresse were all for having Gaddafi sodomized to death by terrorists.

Trump asks, was it in the interests of the American people to have Gaddafi sodomized to death by terrorists?

And the liberals, conservatives, and lügenpresse are terrified of that question.

Blogger Nate May 01, 2016 2:42 PM  

"It's not, though. That term never really stood for what you think of as "conservative","

the education system in the South taught that liberal and conservative in american politics referred to the Constitution. Liberals viewed the Constitution liberally... as an open document meant to be reinterpreted with the times... and the conservatives were conservative in their interpretations of the document... means strict constructionalists.

In american politics those are the only definitions that make sense. That's certainly what Reagan meant when he said he was a conservative.

Now... I agree... its not what the GOP means. But then again... it should be confusing shouldn't it? Considering the Republican party was founded on the principles of screwing up the Constitution.

Blogger frigger611 May 01, 2016 2:42 PM  

When I was a kid the schools' administrations at least had the sense and honesty to call them "Social Studies" rather than "Social Sciences." They are anything but sciences.

But if you're a fraud, you'll call something a "science" to gain cred and grant dollars.

And the dullards and dopes among us automatically assume an extra super duper level of legitimacy, thus the careers of Bill Nye and Neil DeGrasse Tyson.

Blogger tz May 01, 2016 3:00 PM  

Paleocons are Dino-sore-heads.

Blogger tz May 01, 2016 3:04 PM  

@46, well, I tend to study anti-social science. Very interesting and even productive, at least to dark triad types.

Anonymous LastRedoubt May 01, 2016 3:06 PM  

Was exposed to Birchers early, and well aware they were considered a bit... out there. That said, they were hard-core Americans and anti-communists, and as a result had the pleasure of being introduced to both Dr Petr Beckmann and also to a LIthuanian who had, among other things, lived through the Russian revolution.

Blogger Nate May 01, 2016 3:13 PM  

""Social Studies" rather than "Social Sciences." "

we called it civics.

Blogger Lovekraft May 01, 2016 3:31 PM  

From a psychoanalytical angle in terms of how humans in groups prefer unity, yet also choice, there is a perpetual struggle between our desire to have order and also freedom (terms which are exhibited in the very real world of government).

Leftists deep down accept that their desire for choice may cause them to put substantial mental blocks up. Same goes for the right. They come at society more from the latter persuasion - that of wanting to preserve freedom, but fall back to doing this while seeking more and more power.

It isn't that one or the other group will be defeated, but rather how either side can and should approach the other. The right wants to neutralize those ideologies that are, to them, over-reaching into private lives. The left wants the right to bend to the will of the state.

The left has been shaping public policy for so long in North America that they are able to send out hordes of followers to breach the civil rules of public protest, even using tax money to do it in some cases. But the well is drying up and socialists, unable to fix an economy in ruins, will tell those hordes that the right is what is preventing them from having 'diversity' and 'working'. Evolution of mental illness.

Anonymous Smith Ohlrig May 01, 2016 3:40 PM  

Fight the commies, but don't name the Jew

dumbass Birchers

Anonymous A.B. Prosper May 01, 2016 3:40 PM  

I have only one quibble with Dr. Pournelle , when it comes to deportation,

I'd argue Sí se puede.

Its not something that has to be done all at once though.

Functionally you make it nigh impossible for illegals to get work, zero out the green cards. Many, maybe most will self deport.

As noted since rail capacity is limited, you than take 5 years to do it instead of all at once,

Its going to take a decade to quell the violence anyway . Moving 5 million people a year for a decade is trivial if you have the will. Amazon moves millions of packages more perishable than humans,

We simply have become astoundingly better at logistics than even the amazing capabilities of the past.

As for the once who cannot be returned as the host nation won't take them, drop them on Mexico.

With a fairly sealed southern borders, having a few million angry African Muslims and others serves as nice punishment for the Mexican state.



The press core is a non problem, there is a pretty heavy control apparatus in place anyway and few people listen to the MSM


Also I don't blame him for being squeamish about papers please, camps out in the Mojave or wherever of the human toll. Its not terribly pleasant for anyone including many of the people here illegally just trying to get by.

This course requires willpower and small amount of resources the former which the US is lacking.

Blogger Rusty Fife May 01, 2016 3:48 PM  

A.B. Prosper wrote:I have only one quibble with Dr. Pournelle , when it comes to deportation,

I'd argue Sí se puede.



Indeed. Yes we can. The Israeli's have shown the way.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/toughening-its-stance-toward-migrants-israel-pushes-africans-to-leave/2015/05/14/e1637bce-f350-11e4-bca5-21b51bbdf93e_story.html

Blogger Mr.MantraMan May 01, 2016 3:54 PM  

Conservatism Inc. Is ran by Trotskyites and that says it all. We need an ice pick, hopefully metaphorically but physical if needed

Blogger Chris Mallory May 01, 2016 3:57 PM  

@18 "You could put together a pretty decent magazine with the writers National Review kicked out."

We had one back in 2002 with The American Conservative. But sadly, the cucks have taken over that publication. Closest we have now is over at Unz.

Blogger Chris Mallory May 01, 2016 4:00 PM  

@52 "As noted since rail capacity is limited"

I have lived much of my life within spitting distance of a track line. You would be surprised at the number of empty box cars and bulk carriers moving upon the nation's rails.

Blogger Chris Mallory May 01, 2016 4:03 PM  

@18 "You could put together a pretty decent magazine with the writers National Review kicked out."

We had one back in 2002 with The American Conservative. But sadly, the cucks have taken over that publication. Closest we have now is over at Unz.

Blogger RobertT May 01, 2016 4:10 PM  

" ... for decades, beginning with the John Birch Society, conservatives have been reading people out of the conservative movement."

Been there, done that. Years after running for Congress newspapers across the state would still take me to task for my insensitive comments. If the editors hadn't retired, they'd still be doing it. They hated my guts.

When I look at the platform Trump is running on, all is see is the stuff you cover in Being-An-American 101. Nothing about it is controversial. Yet to a large portion of the American public, it's over-the-top controversial, and many people hate his guts. Including Fred Barnes. We can take comfort in knowing the whole NR & Weekly Standard crowd are taking their breaths as influence peddlers, and they all know it.

Trump told them all in no uncertain term on Fox today. Trump impresses the hell out of me.


Blogger Josh May 01, 2016 4:11 PM  

But sadly, the cucks have taken over that publication

Not true

Blogger RobertT May 01, 2016 4:17 PM  

1. Nate.

Philosophically perhaps. But CO, AZ, OH, LA, WY, UT have made it absolutely clear the Republican party is still in the control of traditional, Capital "C" conservatives. If they don't like the results at the polls, they change them.And many of the 'grass roots' are right there with them, cheering them on and participating ... Because 'they know best'. If anything, the Republican Party is being reborn anew.

Blogger RobertT May 01, 2016 4:17 PM  

1. Nate.

Philosophically perhaps. But CO, AZ, OH, LA, WY, UT have made it absolutely clear the Republican party is still in the control of traditional, Capital "C" conservatives. If they don't like the results at the polls, they change them.And many of the 'grass roots' are right there with them, cheering them on and participating ... Because 'they know best'. If anything, the Republican Party is being reborn anew.

Blogger RobertT May 01, 2016 4:17 PM  

" ... for decades, beginning with the John Birch Society, conservatives have been reading people out of the conservative movement."

Been there, done that. Years after running for Congress newspapers across the state would still take me to task for my insensitive comments. If the editors hadn't retired, they'd still be doing it. They hated my guts.

When I look at the platform Trump is running on, all is see is the stuff you cover in Being-An-American 101. Nothing about it is controversial. Yet to a large portion of the American public, it's over-the-top controversial, and many people hate his guts. Including Fred Barnes. We can take comfort in knowing the whole NR & Weekly Standard crowd are taking their breaths as influence peddlers, and they all know it.

Trump told them all in no uncertain term on Fox today. Trump impresses the hell out of me.


Anonymous BGKB May 01, 2016 4:42 PM  

As noted since rail capacity is limited, you than take 5 years to do it instead of all at once

I am informed that a nation the size of Montana was able to get rid of 6 million people that didn't belong in short order. If Trump announces he will pardon anyone who killed an illegal alien child rapist, drug dealer, guy with MS-13 facial tattoos or that has killed Americans, 1/4 of illegals will be self deported before he is inaugurated. I would be out there on inauguration day with a mauser, rainbow feather boa, and USA flag shirt looking for my 3x DUI former patient.

Yes we can. The Israeli's have shown the way.

They also sterilized the same groups.

Blogger Anchorman May 01, 2016 4:50 PM  

It seems a great deal of the GOP base/conservative movement was read out of the GOPe/DC "conservative" club at elast as far back as 2008. They were told to "hold your nose and vote." Had Trump not run, they would've been told that message again.

The "base" was read out in 2008 (or earlier). They just didn't know it yet.

Anonymous Frazier May 01, 2016 5:08 PM  

The lower and lower middle white men of the economy, whether right or left, have always been prone to anti intellectualism, a good dose of simple mindedness, demagogues, and looking to others to blame but themselves. Add the Great Recession into the mix along with lawmakers decision to fight rather than work and you have the perfect explanation for Trump.

Intellectually and inuitively many of these people are Conservstive. Pournelle is misreading the political climate.

Blogger Rantor May 01, 2016 5:24 PM  

Mark Levin actually used to speak as a Constitutionalist, now he has become an idiotic Cruzbot. He of all people should know that Cruz was born in Canada of Canadian parents, his mother having renounced her US citizenship to become Canadian.

Red State, similarly, used to have some decent articles. Now it is a wall to wall Cruzbot apologist festival. Cuckservatism defined.

Glenn Beck is rolling his face in Cheetos. Pathetic cuck loser.

All because what? They want to lose their country to candidates who are running as anti-patriots. If I hadn't witnessed the last two years, I would find it hard to believe what is happening.

The US has two options for survival, President Trump and a transformed Republican Party. Or a defeated R party getting destroyed and a nationalist winning in 4 years. All other options seem to have LOSER written in neon green on them.

Blogger SciVo May 01, 2016 5:25 PM  

A.B. Prosper @52: This course requires willpower and small amount of resources the former which the US is lacking.

I mostly agree with you, but it would not take five years. It wouldn't even take one.

Two documentary crews, one filming the Mexicans flown to Somalia, another filming the Somalians trucked to Mexico. A month of filming, two weeks of editing, a day or two of people watching the vids on YouTube, and two weeks later there wouldn't be an illegal alien left in America.

It could be done in two months. It is not a matter of resources. It is not a matter of time. It is purely a matter of will.

Blogger The Other Robot May 01, 2016 5:33 PM  

@65: The lower and lower middle white men of the economy, whether right or left, have always been prone to anti intellectualism,

For good reason, I would suggest. Look up clever sillies.

Blogger Harsh May 01, 2016 6:02 PM  

Intellectually and inuitively many of these people are Conservstive. Pournelle is misreading the political climate.

No, wrong. Read what he wrote again.

Blogger David of One May 01, 2016 6:11 PM  

tz wrote:Paleocons are Dino-sore-heads.

Hmmm ... kinda sounds similar to butt raptors ...

Just saying.

Blogger David of One May 01, 2016 6:18 PM  

Nope ... that ain't right. Gotta quote the former speaker of the house, bonehead ... "Butt Buddies". Kinda leaves little doubt to actual butt hurt after one of his alcoholic "benders".

Anonymous Napoleon 12pdr May 01, 2016 6:43 PM  

The logistics of expelling 11-20 million illegals is straightforward. The legal issues present more of a challenge. There would have to be a hearing, and the courts are backlogged. Then there would be the appellate games....

At a minimum, we would have to establish temporary Expulsion Courts to clear the backlog. The alternative would be to declare war on Mexico - in that case, Mexican nationals can be ejected, whether they are here illegally or not. With the side benefit of being able to sling the defenders of the enemy nationals into prison.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 01, 2016 6:47 PM  

@46 frigger611

When I was a kid the schools' administrations at least had the sense and honesty to call them "Social Studies" rather than "Social Sciences."
---

Me too. Social Studies was one class and it was pretty pointless. All I can remember of it now is the teacher yelling at the class "Quit actin' a foo! This ain't no carwash!"

Blogger Rusty Fife May 01, 2016 6:48 PM  

Frazier wrote:The lower and lower middle white men of the economy, whether right or left, have always been prone to anti intellectualism,

There is a lot to be said for simple common sense. The most retarded stuff imaginable isn't found among the lower middle classes; only among intellectuals. They are too close to failure to avoid negative feedback.

The Ivory Tower, on the other hand, is uniquely designed to prevent negative feedback. If you know anything about control loops, this is not an optimizing model.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 01, 2016 6:56 PM  

@63 BGKB

If Trump announces he will pardon anyone who killed an illegal alien child rapist, drug dealer, guy with MS-13 facial tattoos or that has killed Americans, 1/4 of illegals will be self deported before he is inaugurated. I would be out there on inauguration day with a mauser, rainbow feather boa, and USA flag shirt looking for my 3x DUI former patient.
---

All he'd have to do is say that on a certain date, he would start paying a bounty of $500 a head, dead or alive, for the illegal aliens. 80% or more would self deport super fast. Way before that date.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 01, 2016 6:57 PM  

@64 Anchorman

The "base" was read out in 2008 (or earlier). They just didn't know it yet.
---

I'm no expert, but from what I can figure it started at least with the administration of Bush 1.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 01, 2016 7:03 PM  

@66 Rantor

If I hadn't witnessed the last two years, I would find it hard to believe what is happening.
---

Yep. It's like Trump has somehow exposed a lot of crazy I didn't know was there before. Take just the talk show hosts melt downs alone. How many out there are still not Trump deranged?

I remember when Supreme Cuckster Eric Erickson got bent out of shape over Trump and disinvited him to some event. Which was his right. But his excuse is what exposed him as a Cuckster. His wife and daughter might get offended by Trump.

How F'n stupid, hiding behind his wife and daughter.

And don't get me started on Boortz, who thank God for his own sake he retired before this election cycle. He would have lost 90% of his previous audience. He went full out bonkers very early on Twitter :P

It's not whether they are pro-Trump or not. It's whether all they do is rant and rave like frothing mouthed rabid 'possums day and night about Trump.

Yeah, it's their right to do that. It's also the right of their former listeners to change the channel or turn the radio off.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 01, 2016 7:13 PM  

@73 Napoleon


The alternative would be to declare war on Mexico - in that case, Mexican nationals can be ejected, whether they are here illegally or not. With the side benefit of being able to sling the defenders of the enemy nationals into prison.
---

After watching those protests in California, full of illegals and Mexican flag waving rioters, I wonder why they didn't send in the national guard or the army to repel the invaders.

Anonymous Gen. Kong May 01, 2016 7:16 PM  

Mr. MantraMan:
Conservatism Inc. Is ran by Trotskyites and that says it all. We need an ice pick, hopefully metaphorically but physical if needed.

It was actually an ice-axe, and incompetently wielded. The Banksta's boy Bornstein lived for several hours after the attack and might have survived - even in 1940 Mexico City - had he not chosen to lecture the assassin on the finer points of Marxist theory before passing out from the brain-swelling resulting from the injuries inflicted. Typical SJW. Your sentiment is nevertheless appreciated. The neo-con men deserve worse than their spiritual father.

Blogger Nate May 01, 2016 7:31 PM  

So what is needed is a Nationalist Constructionist Party

Blogger bob k. mando May 01, 2016 7:43 PM  

11. Nick S May 01, 2016 12:08 PM
Allowing SJWs to conscript every perfectly good term and concept then proceed to ruin them



listen, you all need to spend a GREAT deal more time thinking about this.

"Conservative" ( as an ideological descriptor ) ALWAYS WAS godawful stupid and ignorant.

just as Liberal and Progressive are.

ALL THREE TERMS are utterly relativistic and DO NOT MEAN ANYTHING unless you know what the "existing order" already is.

What are you conserving? a Hindu mother who's son dies of getting stomped on by an elephant, who then demands that her daughter-in-law commit suttee on the husband's funeral pyre is "conservative".

the EXISTING social order IN THE WEST pretends that we are all Equalitarians now, with all differences 'created' by socialization and education. this then means that pro-aristocracy people like Wheeler and Moldbug are "Progressives" ... because they would like to "Progress" away from the existing Social Order to a new one more in line with reality.

Liberal might still have somewhat of a basic valence too it, but even so, the Liberalism of the American Revolutionaries has almost nothing to do with the Liberalism of the French Revolutionaries or the Marxists.


being proud of calling yourself a 'Conservative' ( in 1776, a conservative would have been a British Loyalist ) is just about as dumb and pig ignorant as calling yourself a "Red Stater".

Red is, and always has been, the universal and international color of Communism.

Anonymous Quartermaster May 01, 2016 8:13 PM  

When the Moronic Frum read Cold Warriors out of the party there was discussion at Jerry's site on the issue. Jerry served in the Army when a part of the cold war turned hot as did I (his was Korea and mine was Vietnam). I noted that Frum never served having come south from Soviet Canuckistan so as to show us how conservatives were supposed to operate. Pete Dupont joined in Frum's festivities, and both immediately became irrelevant, with Dupont fading into oblivion, and Frum going full leftist, showing his true colors.

I would posit that Frum and Dupont were never conservatives, and demonstrated that movement conservatism had been fully co-opted for the left. They did, indeed, leave us. I certainly never went anywhere.

Anonymous patrick kelly May 01, 2016 8:20 PM  

All the Borchers I run into tend to be anal spergers

Blogger Rusty Fife May 01, 2016 8:33 PM  

patrick kelly wrote:All the Borchers I run into tend to be anal spergers



Not that there is anything wrong with that. So you're complaint is that Birchers are high-functioning pattern recognizers? Dumping on INJT isn't going to make you any friends on the internet.

Blogger Student in Blue May 01, 2016 8:35 PM  

If it nominated a fiscal conservative with moderate social views it would also control the Presidency.

We tried that. Government still grew, progressives still passed their bills.

Blogger Teri May 01, 2016 8:52 PM  

So you don't think there are laws already on the books to cover this? I also think it will be hard to defend revoking a previous executive action.

Blogger Blackburn #0040 May 01, 2016 8:52 PM  

Napoleon 12pdr wrote:The logistics of expelling 11-20 million illegals is straightforward. The legal issues present more of a challenge. There would have to be a hearing, and the courts are backlogged. Then there would be the appellate games....

At a minimum, we would have to establish temporary Expulsion Courts to clear the backlog. The alternative would be to declare war on Mexico - in that case, Mexican nationals can be ejected, whether they are here illegally or not. With the side benefit of being able to sling the defenders of the enemy nationals into prison.


Badges? We don't need no stinkin' badges...

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY May 01, 2016 9:12 PM  

" No, it couldn't. You're wrong. It wasn't justified, it wasn't in the American interest, and it's no surprise that it ended badly."
You are most corect, good sir.
To the proud ignoramus you were replying to, I say :
" When ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise."

Anonymous Napoleon 12pdr May 01, 2016 9:29 PM  

Quartermaster wrote:When the Moronic Frum read Cold Warriors out of the party there was discussion at Jerry's site on the issue.
I was part of the discussion. One problem of our time is a tendency for people to think in purely binary terms. The idea of a Loyal Opposition loyally executing a policy they disagree with goes over their heads.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY May 01, 2016 9:31 PM  

"dumbass Birchers "
FELLATOR of Buckley the dead, you are.

Blogger tz May 01, 2016 9:57 PM  

Glenn Beck does Cheetos facial mask
I wish I was kidding. "Can't unsee" warning.
Trump must be praying the old "make my enemies ridiculous".
(there is an ani-gif toward the bottom).
Not merely crazy, but silly.

Blogger SteelPalm May 01, 2016 10:18 PM  

@94 Easily the funniest thing I have seen all month. However, I took several sips from my water bottle while the Youtube video was playing, though.

Big mistake.

Anonymous FP May 01, 2016 10:37 PM  

We need #NeverTrump more than evar!!!11!

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/434765/nevertrump-badly-needed-now

Sayeth David French:
"Trump is not the “best of bad options”; he is a cataclysm. If he defeats Hillary Clinton, his presidency will fail, and Republicans will suffer for a generation. If he loses, there’s a good chance he’ll turn the GOP into a shadow of its former self..."

A cataclysm! Queue Morbo:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bbIBs0P2t0

Blogger JaimeInTexas May 01, 2016 10:43 PM  

Revoke an exec. action with another ... they are not law.

Anonymous BGKB May 01, 2016 10:45 PM  

How much of that $100K are you getting from the Hitlery campaign?

He is doing it for the free 1/2 hour with Hookers for HilLIARy

Anonymous Chucque May 01, 2016 11:05 PM  

@23 What's your big babbin about?

Port and starboard are still used, shipping, banks, passports... this ain't no boat sir.

Anonymous Billy Parker May 01, 2016 11:21 PM  

"The Second Gulf War saw us invading Iraq in response to the al Qaeda attack on New York, although there was zero evidence that Saddam had anything to do with it. Then came Afghanistan."

Has it been that long that even the order of events is in question?

Blogger The Other Robot May 01, 2016 11:42 PM  

On another note, I doubt that Hillery has the balls that Madame Secretary has ... but also its depiction of all the acts of war that the us commits is disturbing.

Blogger Timmy3 May 01, 2016 11:46 PM  

"Traditionalist or Nationalist works better anyhow."

No mention of Populist? Trump is referred to as one. I don't get the feeling Trump is a Traditionalist.

As for Conservative, Christians do refer to themselves as Conservative or Liberal Christians. So their religious preferences direct them to who they are likely to support in politics. Certainly, many Conservative Christians went for Trump instead of Cruz. Unlike the previous election when many held their noses to vote for Romney, many are enthusiastic for Trump.

I'm more frustrated with foreign policy for this is where I don't know where to draw the line on what's considered a Liberal or Conservative foreign policy. It seems foreign wars are justified using both ideologies thus causing the contradiction. Trump and Sanders could be against foreign wars and we won't know the difference based on their political beliefs.

Blogger SciVo May 01, 2016 11:57 PM  

Billy Parker wrote:"The Second Gulf War saw us invading Iraq in response to the al Qaeda attack on New York, although there was zero evidence that Saddam had anything to do with it. Then came Afghanistan."

Has it been that long that even the order of events is in question?


It's no wonder the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor, after we nuked Hiroshima. And it was lucky that we were able to establish a DMZ between North and South Korea after our failure in Vietnam, which surely must have encouraged the commies.

And not to change the subject too much, but isn't it weird how much Tolkien borrowed from Rowling? He basically just split the wizard and the chosen one into separate characters. It was a good choice, but still. Terribly derivative.

Blogger bob k. mando May 02, 2016 12:00 AM  

102. Timmy3 May 01, 2016 11:46 PM
don't know where to draw the line on what's considered a Liberal or Conservative foreign policy.



that's the point.

that's why they suckered you into using the the terms 'conservative' and 'liberal' in the first place.

first they substitute terms of no real meaning for what you actually believe.

then they change the definitions of those amorphous substitute terms at will.

then you have no idea what you're supposed to be in favor of or against.

because they've already snuck other, non-x philosophical points into that fake descriptor that you never noticed.

the whole universal equalitarianism thing is particularly amusing, given how much the Jews push it.

because THERE IS NO RACE MORE CONVINCED OF THEIR OWN SUPERIORITY ( they are 'blessed of God', after all ) and special nature than are the Jews.

Blogger SciVo May 02, 2016 12:12 AM  

Timmy3 wrote:I'm more frustrated with foreign policy for this is where I don't know where to draw the line on what's considered a Liberal or Conservative foreign policy. It seems foreign wars are justified using both ideologies thus causing the contradiction. Trump and Sanders could be against foreign wars and we won't know the difference based on their political beliefs.

Reality is complicated. It's absurd to expect a single axis to cover everything. Our physical reality is three-dimensional, plus time, and we have all kinds of genetic, cultural and religious differences on top of that.

Moreover, even if they're both motivated by nationalism, a socialist and a capitalist are going to have very different flavors of skepticism of military adventurism.

So there is no such thing as a "conservative foreign policy," because foreign policy is influenced by far more axes than just left-right.

Blogger SteelPalm May 02, 2016 2:19 AM  

@104 I'm afraid your personal stupidity and inability to differentiate between distinct ideologies can't solely be blamed on the Jews.

Blogger ray May 02, 2016 2:37 AM  

Ah, here we are. That didn't take long! A special comment for the Warpath Contingent --


"'I have a lot of experience dealing with men who sometimes get off the reservation in the way they behave and how they speak,' Clinton responded, hesitating slightly before pronouncing the word 'reservation.'

She then went on to say she 'could really care less' about Trump's rhetoric and said he's welcome to continue with his 'insult fest.'

The CNN reporter let the 'reservation' remark pass - but Native American commentators swiftly denounced the candidate's wording."





The Wicked Witch of the West must be as afraid of Injuns as she is of Them Evil Menz. How will she stop the Men Injuns?

Only the Tingler knows.....


source: http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/05/social_justice_warriors_elicit_a_grovelbyproxy_from_hillary.html

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 4:57 AM  

@40 Gs

"If being conservative means re-following the John Birch Society, then conservatism will re-fail miserably."

Every single one of the John Birch Society's predictions has come true.

Every

Single

One.

How about this instead -- if you're a real traditionalist, then you'll support the John Birch Society more than you ever have before. They are the ONLY people organization throughout the last half century which has been true to the vision of the nation's founders. The ONLY ones.

If you're not supporting them, then just STFU.

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 5:05 AM  

"As noted since rail capacity is limited, you than take 5 years to do it instead of all at once"

Cattle cars ALL head to Texas.

There's nothing in the Constitution that says that invaders need to be treated humanely. They're INVADERS, for cryin' out loud. It should be as brutal, nasty, and insufferable as possible, so that when they get unceremoniously dumped off on the south side of the Rio Grande, the stories of horror will spread far and wide,...and as fast as the wind, so much so that old women in Patagonia will fear for the well-being of their sons who snuck into our country.

Anything less is a less-than-serious effort to solve the problem once and for all.

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 5:16 AM  

@73

Is that a new strain of BC Bud that you're smokin?

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 5:36 AM  

298 BGKB

"He is doing it for the free 1/2 hour with Hookers for HilLIARy"

Must be an awful life when a guy's motivation is receiving the payoff of 30 minutes with a 70-year old hooker.

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 5:37 AM  

er...@98

Blogger JaimeInTexas May 02, 2016 11:48 AM  

THIS DAY 83 YEARS AGO: FDR's Evil Executive Order Required Citizens to Turn in All Gold to the Government by This Day

and

President Gerald Ford signed Executive Order 11825 on December 31, 1974 revoking FDR's order.


http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2016/05/this-day-80-years-ago-fdrs-evil.html

Anonymous DE-173/Code 19/Vox Nox May 02, 2016 12:00 PM  

Has Peggy Noonan ever explained (apologized for) her description of Obama as "elegant"?

I quit reading her when some dying spring of defective estrogen caused her to write that, even if it does demonstrate that Obama, with his pipe cleaner arms and kindergarten girl baseball throws is our first hermaphrodite president.

Blogger JaimeInTexas May 02, 2016 12:50 PM  

@105. ray

This one's for you:


Hillary Clinton's staff have apologized for their boss after the presidential hopeful was lambasted by Native American groups for saying Donald Trump had gone 'off the reservation' Friday.

After being asked about Trump's offensive comments, Clinton said: 'I have a lot of experience dealing with men who sometimes get off the reservation in the way they behave and how they speak.'

That remark, made to CNN's Jake Tapper, kicked off a firestorm that led to an apology by Amanda Renteria, Clinton's national political director.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3568350/Hillary-Clinton-staff-apologize-offended-Native-Americans-reservation-comment-Donald-Trump.html



OpenID aew51183 May 02, 2016 2:28 PM  

"The party has to be destroyed and replaced."

The 1983 agreement where the RNC promised never to pursue voter fraud necessitates the destruction and reformation of the republican party under a new brand. If this doesn't happen, we will continue to see urban districts reporting more democratic votes than living residents.

Blogger ray May 02, 2016 2:49 PM  

Much obliged Jaime.

Apparently when Ms. Clinton curls up at night with Huma, some bad little bird whispers nightmares about Injuns and Males into her delicate ladylike ears. Next day she seemed rather obsessed with the notion!

First Jemisin slurs Aztecs, then Clinton slurs Injuns and, oh yeah, tells Americans that she plans to keep the males she owns on her Reservation.

Once upon a time there was a bush that burned and burned but never was consumed. It'll be kinda like that for Hillary and Company too. Except for the holy part.

Blogger Nick S May 02, 2016 3:13 PM  

being proud of calling yourself a 'Conservative' ( in 1776, a conservative would have been a British Loyalist ) is just about as dumb and pig ignorant as calling yourself a "Red Stater".

Which ideological category best fits your personally held set of beliefs? What do you call yourself, bob?

Blogger James Dixon May 02, 2016 4:09 PM  

> The legal issues present more of a challenge.

Deport them anyway. If the win the legal challenges they can come back.

> I'm no expert, but from what I can figure it started at least with the administration of Bush 1.

Even before that. You can trace the split back to at least Barry Goldwater and Nelson Rockefeller in 64.

Blogger bob k. mando May 02, 2016 4:11 PM  

116. Nick S May 02, 2016 3:13 PM
Which ideological category best fits your personally held set of beliefs? What do you call yourself, bob?


i think that the Constitution IF ACTUALLY APPLIED would work pretty well.

unfortunately, actually applying Constitutional principles would include the US Congress impeaching and disbarring Supreme Court Justices who go rogue, like the pro- votes for the Kelo decision and Justice Roberts re-defining ObamaCare on the fly as a tax.

so, clearly, Congress is not upholding it's powers and authority, which is why we get this asinine bullshit from the Court.

something else, which every American is taught in their classes on 'Government':
the US Constitution was written to constrain and limit ( federal ) GOVERNMENT. aside from those few enumerated powers delegated specifically to the Fedgov, the 10th Amendment *specifically excludes* the Feds from having ANY power or authority over the States or individual citizens.

therefore, EVERY exercise of federal power to force the citizenry OR the States to do ANYTHING which it does not have specific authority delegated to it by the Constitution + Amendments ...
is Lawless Tyranny.

applied, this means that all three of the Reconstruction Amendments are Lawless Tyranny. being as the Southern States were forced to 'adopt' all three amendments before the North would allow them their representation in Congress ... where IN THE CONSTITUTION is the authority for the North to have done this?

answer: that authority does not exist in the Constitution+Amendments, not even today.

AND

Amendments which *do* afford the fedgov the power to constrain the freedom and liberty of the citizenry ( such as the 14th being used to cram forced association, ie - homo wedding cakes, down everyone's throats or Prohibition ) is directly contrary to the entire purpose of the Constitution and the Declaration.


however, i'm not advocating that anyone agree with me here.

my larger philosophical point is that you need to stop accepting these relativistic terms to define yourselves. you need to identify the actual principles that you wish to achieve, call yourselves by those and then work towards them. do you want to be a Monarchist like Moldbug? good on ya. let's hash that out.

it's not that this will be a magic panacea preventing deceivers from substituting false beliefs under your banners ... but it will become far more difficult.

i accept the need to use them ( conservative/liberal/progressive ) in colloquial conversation ( because i'm not interested in having a debate about Reconstruction, et al, all the time ), but you do need to be aware of the weaknesses of the terms.



107. Akulkis May 02, 2016 5:05 AM
They're INVADERS, for cryin' out loud.



*shrugs*

there's actually nothing keeping us from re-defining illegal immigration as a Class 1 felony, permanently excluding said person from eligibility for residency withing the US, punishable by death if the exclusion is subsequently violated.

note that the Class 1 felony conviction would also exclude the possibility of voting in most States ...

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 6:16 PM  

"
That remark, made to CNN's Jake Tapper, kicked off a firestorm that led to an apology by Amanda Renteria, Clinton's national political director. "

Of course, she did. You can't expect Her Royal Highness Hillary to apologize for anything, ever, can you?

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 6:19 PM  

@115

"Once upon a time there was a bush that burned and burned but never was consumed."

Hillary's got something like that. I think that's why both she AND Huma always wear a facial expression indicating a complete hatred of their own lives.

Blogger Akulkis May 02, 2016 6:23 PM  

@118

Nothing that can't be solved by a few public hanging after a nice, Ceacescau-style kangaroo court. Ok... maybe many. A couple thousand.

Or crucifixions on the lawns of the White House and the Capitol Building, and the SCOTUS building (Congresscritters get X'ed up in front of the Capitol, members of the Executive Branch get X'ed up in front of the White House, and rogue judges at all levels get X'ed up in front of SCOTUS.)

Blogger ray May 02, 2016 10:10 PM  

#120-- "Hillary's got something like that. I think that's why both she AND Huma always wear a facial expression indicating a complete hatred of their own lives."

It is jolly to witness. Uplifting.

We have a good and just God.

I wonder if Hil and Hum represent some subaqueous creature secreted during the Flood, glued to some cavern wall deep in the Atlantic rift? and only now hatching-out binary? Back antedeluv all kinds of monsters and hybrids infested erf.

I don't have data on this. I'm just going by impressions.

Anonymous mature-Craig May 02, 2016 11:12 PM  

May 02, 2016 2:28 PM
"The party has to be destroyed and replaced."


one thing that I learned from this election is that there is a dark side to the republican party,

Anonymous Bukulu May 03, 2016 2:03 AM  

lowercaseb,

As much as I despise Bill Clinton, I cannot bring myself to blame him for Ruby Ridge (which happened on Bush the Elder's watch.)

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY May 03, 2016 2:25 AM  

There has been a dark side to the Elephant Party for a long time, craig.
I am glad that you recognized it, good sir. The donks have the same prob, but it ain't a prob to them, they embrace it.

Blogger JaimeInTexas May 03, 2016 8:30 AM  

@118. bob k. mando

The Constitution of 1787 was the death of the real Republic. Too many ambiguous passages -- the Committee of Style is Hamilton's long term victory.

Blogger bob k. mando May 03, 2016 11:43 AM  

that's as may be.

but even the ersatz ( according to you ) Constitution de jure that we do have would be a damn sight better than the actual government de facto that we have in practice.

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