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Saturday, July 09, 2016

The 4GW challenge in America

What many people who were either upset about my observations concerning Dallas or are completely mystified by my assertion of the need for the US police to demilitarize and deescalate fail to grasp is that the current approach of intimidation and overwhelming force is absolutely doomed to failure in the situation in which they find themselves.

While Bill Lind's perspective on the police is, understandably, outdated, it only underlines the vital importance of the police ceasing to act more like occupying military force and less like the traditional Officer Friendly.

Remember, this is the guy who literally wrote the book on USMC tactics, and if we apply his observations, it is eminently clear that the US police are doing nothing more than setting themselves up for defeat in the long term.

From "Understanding Fourth Generation War", 4th Generation War Handbook.
In Fourth Generation warfare, the weak often have more moral power than the strong. One of the first people to employ the power of weakness was Mahatma Gandhi. Gandhi’s insistence on non-violent tactics to defeat the British in India was and continues to be a classic strategy of Fourth Generation war. When the British responded to Indian independence rallies with violence, they immediately lost the moral war.

Operations David and Goliath show a strong military force, with almost no limits on the amount of violence it can apply to a situation, versus a very weak irregular force. The weaker force has the moral high ground because it is so weak. No one likes bullies using their physical superiority in order to win at anything, and unless we are extremely careful in how we apply our physical combat power, we soon come across as a bully, i.e. Goliath.

Most important, we see the central role of de-escalation. In most Fourth Generation situations, our best hope of winning lies not in escalation but in de-escalation (the “Hama model” discussed in the next chapter relies on escalation, but political factors will usually rule this approach out). De-escalation is how police are trained to handle confrontations. From a policeman’s perspective, escalation is almost always undesirable. If a police officer escalates a situation, he may even find himself charged with a crime. This reflects society’s desire for less, not more, violence. Most people in foreign societies share this desire. They will not welcome foreigners who increase the level of violence around them.

For state militaries in Fourth Generation situations, the policeman is a more appropriate model than the soldier. Soldiers are taught that, if they are not achieving the result they want, they should escalate: call in more troops, more firepower, tanks, artillery, and air support. In this respect, men in state-armed forces may find their own training for war against other state-armed forces works against them. They must realize that in Fourth Generation war, escalation almost always works to the advantage of their opponents. We cannot stress this point too strongly. State militaries must develop a “de-escalation mindset,” along with supporting tactics and techniques.

There may be situations where escalation on the tactical level is necessary to obtain de-escalation on the operational and strategic levels. In such situations, state-armed forces may want to have a special unit, analogous to a police SWAT team, that appears quickly, uses the necessary violence, then quickly disappears. This helps the state servicemen with whom local people normally interact to maintain their image as helpful friends.

Proportionality is another requirement if state militaries want to avoid being seen as bullies. Using tanks, airpower, and artillery against lightly armed guerrillas not only injures and kills innocent civilians and destroys civilian property, it also works powerfully at the moral level of war to increase sympathy for the state’s opponents. That, in turn, helps our Fourth Generation enemies gain local and international support, funding and recruits.

De-escalation and proportionality in turn require state-armed forces to be able to empathize with the local people. If they regard the local population with contempt, this contempt will carry over into their actions. Empathy cannot simply be commanded; developing it must be part of training.... Each of these points touches a central characteristic of Fourth Generation war. If we fail to understand even one of them, and act so as to contradict it, we will set ourselves up for defeat.

Remember, for any state military, Fourth Generation wars are easy to lose and very challenging to win. This is true despite the state military’s great superiority over its Fourth Generation opponents at the physical level of war. Indeed, to a significant degree, it is true because of that superiority. In most Fourth Generation wars, state-armed forces end up defeating themselves.
What is very difficult for most people, even those with considerable military experience, to understand is that 4GW is a different type of war and it utilizes very different metrics. As Lind and LtCol Thiele point out, the central dilemma of 4GW is that what works for you on the physical level often works against you at the moral level.

"It is therefore very easy to win all the tactical engagements in a Fourth Generation conflict yet still lose the war." 

The US police are in very much in the same position as a state military occupying a foreign nation. Therefore, 4GW principles and tactics very clearly apply to the situation.

One can summarize the core anti-4GW strategy in a single sentence: Either kill them all or don't kill anyone.

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205 Comments:

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Blogger SteelPalm July 09, 2016 8:47 AM  

This is a strong argument in favor of segregation/repatriation. That way, blacks won't have to deal with the cops they hate so, often murderously.

However, the political reality is that this can't presently be done.

So what would you recommend police do in the meantime, Vox?

Blogger Raggededge July 09, 2016 8:52 AM  

It isn't just blacks and immigrants whole hate cops. Our policing agencies have escalated against everyone. If they don't deescalate soon, it won't just be the blacks shooting at them.

Blogger Orville July 09, 2016 9:07 AM  

The personal approach is also segregation and de-escalation. I make it a personal practice to avoid groups of young black males and cops, and if I were in a confrontation, even though I'm carrying, I'd de-escalate and exit as quickly as possible.

So don't let the media get you all worked up and offended and looking for a fight.

Anonymous Big Bill July 09, 2016 9:14 AM  

Overt violence must be replaced with more covert, slow-acting methods. For example:

1. Biochemical warfare: e.g. genetic engineering that radically reduces fertility.

2. Memetic warfare: e.g. control of the cultural levers to preach self-extinction

Anonymous Anonymous July 09, 2016 9:14 AM  

Many people in the country continue to think and believe that the police are moral and are able to protect them from criminal and/or aggressive anti-social human behavior. Therefore at this time the police will armor up with the moral backing of most.

Blogger Old Ez July 09, 2016 9:15 AM  

What seems to be being argued in this post is that if cops encounter someone who is non-cooperative with their lawful orders that they should just let that person slide and flout the law because it is too risky to employ force. Am I reading this wrong?

Anonymous Elijah Rhodes July 09, 2016 9:15 AM  

Cops will never voluntarily de-escalate. They'll see their new mission as a sort of war on drugs, in the sense that no matter how utterly useless the efforts are, they'll continue to apply more and more resources, while legislators pass a never ending stream of new laws. An entirely new federal agency will soon be founded to deal with the problem (I propose it be called The Department of Integration, Culture, and Kindness, or DICK). That escalation won't quit until a seismic change happens in America, one along the lines of civil war.

Blogger Orville July 09, 2016 9:21 AM  

Ha! Don't DICK with me.

Old Ez, In some BRA hell holes the cops are already fleeing the force. Dallas and Baltimore were recently noted in the news for blue flight. On the flip side, if blue flight gets going strong, the hiring "standards" for cops will slide even further.

OpenID ar10308 July 09, 2016 9:23 AM  

Our police departments have escalated almost entirely due to Blacks and Mexicans, who are significantly more violent than Whites and Asians. Yes, there have been some White militia and Meth groups that have required escalation, but those are mostly dealt with by Federal Agencies rather than beat cops.

A beat cop in a Black or Mexican neighborhood needs the kind of outfitting that the 75th Ranger Regiment needed when it went in to Mogadishu.

This is a circle that cannot be easily squared. Segregation or Repatriation become the only long term options if Americans want to de-militerize their police departments.

Are the really any other options from where we are now?

Blogger Human Animal July 09, 2016 9:27 AM  

Cops will never voluntarily de-escalate.

I think this is true as long as the members of that tribe believe they are fighting on behalf of themselves, rather than on behalf of a doctrine.

Blogger Lovekraft July 09, 2016 9:27 AM  

Vox is correct in stating the policing has become politicized, especially during No-Borders Barack's reign. But this is part of an overall cultural marxist agenda of de-legitimizing that which is white and mle.

Positioning is the key. LGBT is allied with Jihad. BLM has Legacy Media pushing its lies. All point towards making the White Male conservative the devil.

Separation is becoming almost impossible - keeping our values, paying taxes etc used to be a given, but every day there are new attacks on these, and our core beliefs (think the mohammedans lining up hostages, and if they can't recite the koran ... boom) are under attack.

Anonymous Toddy Cat July 09, 2016 9:29 AM  

Of course, the whole business about being seen as "bullies" only works when the opponents of the state force are Left-wing. The Nazis gained no moral credibility when the Allies used overwhelming force against them, nor did the French OAS. The use of overwhelming force against Koresh and his Branch Davidians may have riled a lot of us over here on the right, but it gained them no moral cachet with the population as a whole. Lind is a sharp guy and makes a lot of good points, but I think that he's missing something here. And, of course, most insurgencies fail in the long run.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 9:34 AM  

Old Ez wrote:What seems to be being argued in this post is that if cops encounter someone who is non-cooperative with their lawful orders that they should just let that person slide and flout the law because it is too risky to employ force. Am I reading this wrong?

Lawful orders? I've only seen that phrase in the UCMJ; but I avoid all hints of the government wherever possible. Civilians didn't sign up for that.

Does the cop know who it is? Why not; isn't this his beat?

Is there a better way to settle everything down. Why do they not use nets and tasers? Then they can get rid of their firearms.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 9:35 AM  

Old Ez wrote:What seems to be being argued in this post is that if cops encounter someone who is non-cooperative with their lawful orders that they should just let that person slide and flout the law because it is too risky to employ force. Am I reading this wrong?

This also gets back to the "law enforcement officer" vs. "peace officer" terminology.

Blogger Human Animal July 09, 2016 9:37 AM  

5

It's not unreasonable. And it's clearly happened in places like Baltimore and Chicago after the race/police violence issue blew up there the other year.

Lines in the sand aren't actually drawn in sand. If you insist on establishing your authority every time, you have to bring a mop and a bucket along with your billyclub.

This is assuming that being discredited by national news stories about flippant murder of citizens is the biggest threat. I think it's fair to say it is so. Compromise in practice saves the principle in theory.

Blogger justaguy July 09, 2016 9:39 AM  

I'm sorry, but there is some misguided wishful thinking going on here regarding the police. As someone who went from lower middle class to upper middle class and who grew up as a white in a majority minority neighborhood, there is a need for security of home and persons in too many neighborhoods. While there will always be a strong police force someplace, it might not be where you are.

It is great to be able to be in a higher socio-economic neighborhood, especially in a state that allows broad gun rights. So I can move and stay in a relatively safe neighborhood and only shop at places that are up-scale and safe. The majority of people can't. When someone has their work truck broken into and all of their work tools stolen, their livelihood takes a hit. When there is open gang activity in your neighborhood, your options are limited. Moving costs $$. So the time in the recent past where the police went into all neighborhoods and tried to control time helped many people make something of themselves, if they wanted.

Yes the war on drugs and the problems with a strong police force has many downsides...but so does not having an active police presence. Someone will have a forceful presence--either thugs or the police. The police will not let a community watch have a forceful presence, so that avenue is out. The majority of people are in cities or the suburbs for work and with the newest empty public housing into the suburbs regulations from Obama, the problem of security for too many of us will be a big factor in our lives.

We haven't been given one of VD's four choices for the issues and the Dems are hellbent on bringing in other tribes to ensure a voting majority. Unfortunately, the majority of us left behind that actually make things work and function while we earn a living are left to deal with the aftermath of two or three various warring tribes that hate the white culture and our tribe. Not everyone can be a game designer off in a foreign locality where the problems aren't. The majority aren't several SDs up and have to work and live in the midst of what the "greatest generation" bequeathed us-- a shit sandwich (most bad things now happened in the 1960s and early 1970s under the greatest generation-- immigration, war n drugs, war on poverty and massive welfare, EPA, large regulatory state etc).

Anonymous CTHat July 09, 2016 9:39 AM  

@3 - Orville

"So don't let the media get you all worked up and offended and looking for a fight."

This is a lot of it. Psychopaths do certain actions, cop or BLM, and the sociopathic media and Left want a race war. Or at least get enough press for gun control, police power.

I agree with Vox's earlier assessments on the complexities of this situation - as bad as the Left and BLM are, the cops have a lot of blame in this too. It's far too individuated and based on the cop themselves or the district/precinct culture.

The Gandhi example is great too - the British culture itself was pretty law-abiding and respectful to Gandhi because Gandhi said he was a British subject AND that he protested peacefully. He argued for peaceful separation. One of his arguments was that Indians had faithfully served the Empire in WW1 and WW2.

The British forces, while violent and reactionary, had a lot of individuals that were good and disagreed with the violent tactics used at times. But like the unionized, militarized, police forces in the US, the government policy is hard to discern from individual actors who disagree with the system.

I didn't comment on the other posts re: the police and their responsibility as the binary thoughts were too heavy there. Great and engaging posts on the police, Vox. Thanks.

Blogger Rick July 09, 2016 9:42 AM  

My guess is that currently, the general, likely-voter's mood views the BLM demonstrators and the Dallas shooter as the same body, and thus a violent unlawful force. And that most prefer the police as a force on their side to protect them from the BLM. Hillary's recent comments critical of white people who need to change, I think, shows she has mistakenly chosen the unpopular side of this, which is bad for her chances.
Though I could say VD and Hillary are on the same side on this one, they are for entirely different reasons.

Blogger Chris Mallory July 09, 2016 9:44 AM  

@5 I am a free white man over the age of 21. No one has the authority to give me an order of any kind. Make a polite request and I will probably respond how you want. Give an order and I will suggest you go preform an unnatural s exact upon yourself.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 9:49 AM  

"lawful orders" are escalation, and people don't know which are which (Sandra Bland - told to extinguish her cigarette, when she refused, told to get out of the car).

If you know and are part of the community, it won't come up. If you aren't, you may as well shoot first to make them comply as anything else will be seen as the same kind of bullying.

The police - especially through ticketing - have turned every encounter into a confrontation. That is the problem. Police are armed thugs - just another gang and if a gang banger asks for my wallet or police for my ID, I'd rather obey than die but not because I like or respect them. Both will kill me if I don't and I will hate both.

Anonymous Lawyer Guy July 09, 2016 9:51 AM  

Friday night Blacks held a protest march through the City of Detroit downtown. Maybe 1k marchers.

One of the organizers went on TV and said we were coming close to a race war.

News stations aired the threat without comment or followup

Anonymous CTHat July 09, 2016 9:53 AM  

@17 - Rick

I wonder if some of the "side with the police vs. BLM" thing has to do with localities and familiarity with individual cops. I've lived and worked in places where the cops were basically Stasi and itching to get you. In other places, they were de-escalating, pro-American, "Don't Tread On Me" libertarian types.

The complexity of the matter comes down to where do the loyalties of the police lie? To the FedGov (Obama, Clinton, et al.), to La Raza (in the case of the San Jose PD), to themselves, or to the people? It's all four really, and in 4GW fashion, the police act as multiple factions in all practical senses. Unfortunately for the police, they are a big and symbolic target for the State...

Blogger Cail Corishev July 09, 2016 9:54 AM  

Our police departments have escalated almost entirely due to Blacks and Mexicans,

Again, this is just not true, because they've militarized and escalated in places where there aren't enough blacks and Mexicans to matter, and they apply it to everyone. In the 95% white town near me, where the police blotter is usually filled with things like car stereo and bicycle thefts, if you're a middle-class white guy with a job who gets arrested for something non-violent like ignoring unpaid parking tickets, you get double-handcuffed and hauled to the pokey in an armored vehicle just as if you were a drug-dealing ex-con who got caught mugging someone. And the roided-up young cops, though they might be respectful and professional (as long as you don't scare them), think this is just how it's done. "Officer safety" and "following procedure," you know.

These guys aren't escalating because they need to; they're doing it because they want to. It's normal to them, what they signed up for. They have the attitude of an occupying military force, because many of them spent time in one, so the common us-versus-them attitude of cops is pushed over the top by that experience. They have the funding thanks to fears of terrorism and drugs, and the toys are cool. What's cool about wearing a simple cloth uniform with a hat and badge? Sheesh, next we'll be expecting them to get cats out of trees for old ladies! Screw that old stuff -- they want to be battering down doors of meth labs! When they can't find any meth labs....

Anonymous artaud July 09, 2016 10:00 AM  

"Memetic warfare: e.g. control of the cultural levers to preach self-extinction"

That's happening right now, even as we speak, innit? Just to the wrong side, as it were.

Anonymous Bellator Mortalis July 09, 2016 10:02 AM  

See these photos. Looks like cops on one side, blacks and SJWs on the other side: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3681287/Police-officers-alert-nationwide-wake-Dallas-shooting.html

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 10:11 AM  

This is why the cities will burn, worse than 1967-8.
We know deescalation works
With few exceptions the police have selected for aggressive bullies and trained them to be paranoid and always be in control.

Can you turn an alpha into a delta or vice versa? Can you both unlearn natural aggression and training?

They recruit for attitude.
The racial divide makes it worse, so it ends up with Darren Wilson as the foreign occupying soldier and Michael Brown as the local civilian. Even bad actions can't fix that staging.

4gw morality is mostly rhetorical, and without words. The Darth Vader look and swagger loses the argument before one word is said. The "show of force" - intimidation is worse.

But that is what will show up and things will just escalate. And they will be slaughtering white protesters assuming support for law and order instead of keeping the peace.

This is where most Trump supporters will err. They assume force is how you win. "Worse than waterboarding", "kill their families" were applause lines. When that happens here in our cities, our streets?

Blogger pyrrhus July 09, 2016 10:11 AM  

I don't see the police having such great superiority of force, either. In the Western US, outside big cities, private gun owners are generally better armed and better shots than the cops....Hence the eternal litany of gun confiscation .

Blogger BunE22 July 09, 2016 10:13 AM  

Why would my local police have any loyalty to the federal government? The feds aren't paying their salaries. The property tax payers in my county pay their salaries and pay for their buildings and equipment. To the tune of 340 million per year.

As for being taken away in handcuffs for unpaid tickets, I guess I'm old fashioned in thinking you have a responsibility to pay those tickets or fight them in court. Ignoring them shows the police and the court that you aren't a responsible or conscientious citizen. That might be why they prefer the cuffs.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 10:15 AM  

@22 - exactly, but it depends on the town. Here the police play dodge ball with the middle school near the end of the semester and are helpful instead of aggressive, at least mostly.

Anonymous Brock Hunt July 09, 2016 10:17 AM  

De-escalation to regain the moral high-ground?

As in the police completely removing their "provocative" presence from the Democratic National Convention?

I wonder how that would turn out...



@4 I think Clapper referred to Crispr/cas9 targeting, but didn't mention that it can target specific mitochondrial DNA and y-DNA markers ("haplogroups") and can be delivered within an adenovirus construct (all proof-of-concept found w/ medline search).

Blogger crazyivan498 July 09, 2016 10:18 AM  

Notice that the police apparently used a bomb to kill the guy in Dallas. Again, not good for the police in terms of 4gw. I suspected people will retaliate with similar escalations.

Blogger Robert Coble July 09, 2016 10:21 AM  

Most likely response by all parties:

1. Lie
2. Double down
3. Project

Why does that sound so familiar?!?

Blogger Orville July 09, 2016 10:22 AM  

Yeah, a robot bomb. That's old school and can be turned against them very quickly. Remember the old Dirty Harry movie where Eastwood was trying to outrun a remote control car with a bomb on it?

Anonymous fred July 09, 2016 10:23 AM  

People who fought the British Empire.....

George Washington
Benjamin Franklin
Napoleon Buonaparte
Mohandas Gandhi
Wolfe Tone
Daniel O'Connell
Michael Collins
various Africans

Some of these people knew precisely what they wanted, some didn't, they just wanted something different. Some succeeded, some did not. Some played 1GW, some 4GW, some invented things like 9GW.

Don't have a specific point here. It's Meditation Time. (or maybe Medication Time.)

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 10:24 AM  

The USMC is a tool of the elites to enforce globalism wherein a certain class of individual gets to tell everyone else in the world how to live. Smedley Butler understood this. Does Mr. Kind view his work as an extension of Smedley's assertion or a revision/rebuttal of it?


Black civil society doesn't exist in most of their culture. Appealing to their "better angels" is ignorant. This cake is already baked, and de-escalation isn't going to unbake it.

Wake up dude.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 10:27 AM  

@27 - what if the ticket just blew away and you were never notified? What if you paid it but it was an error in recording? I know a case of "non-payment" for child support where it was a simple weekly to monthly pay period change.

Yes, we need to shackle and strip search everyone who has a warrant due to a clerical error.

And you commit 3 federal felonies every day - you should turn yourself in!

Too many laws. It is possible to handle unpaid tickets peacefully. The officer can say "did you know, ... get this taken care of".

When it is a mistake, is the clerk or cop going to be handcuffed and similarly treated to be held accountable? Eye for an eye? Perjury or negligence?

Will it end "professional courtesy"?

You hate and don't want peace. That is the problem. 4GW morality is about peace. Anti-violence.

But there is no offense that requires holding police to account in the peaceful model. You - and the traveling cop both get warnings. Because the mistake is handled peacefully, it is corrected without resentment.

Blogger Stephen July 09, 2016 10:27 AM  

You have a militarized police force because the Dindus have been allowed to go feral. Of course they also give the militarized treatment to a white gut who got a parking ticket because to do otherwise would be racist. Sensible policing, peace, and civilization are impossible as long as Racism is seen as the ultimate evil.

Blogger Nate July 09, 2016 10:30 AM  

the answers are completely counter-intuitive... and cops have been taught that intuitive answers are almost always correct.

Does it sound right? Then it probably is. That's how cops roll.

Blogger Nate July 09, 2016 10:31 AM  

"You have a militarized police force because the Dindus have been allowed to go feral. "

No moron.

The militarization of the police started decades ago.

You have a militarized police force because of the war on drugs.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 10:33 AM  

"Follow commands or die," snarls police trainer Travis Yates at the public he and his colleagues supposedly serve. If police cannot use lethal force to punish those who don't submit, he complains, police will have to "stop being police" -- a pervasive attitude within the profession, one that helps explain our present predicament.

Blogger stevo July 09, 2016 10:33 AM  

Hasn't the Obama administration been supplying police forces with surplus military gear and stocking up on ammo for years?

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 10:35 AM  

Vox, does what Obama, Lynch (Holder before that), or Hillary are doing and saying strike you as de-escalating? Does 4GW account for traitors in the topmost ranks of command who want to see escalation? Who in fact respond to these events with visceral glee?

Of course the cops are going to fail, what a monumental epic of genius to figure that out.

Blogger Nate July 09, 2016 10:36 AM  

"Our police departments have escalated almost entirely due to Blacks and Mexicans,"

This is simply a blatant lie.

The police have escalated because they were trained to escalate. The escalation was accepted and possible because of the idiotic "war on drugs".

https://www.amazon.com/Rise-Warrior-Cop-Militarization-Americas/dp/1610394577

There.

That's a good starter for how we ended up with ground troops with badges.

Anonymous fred July 09, 2016 10:37 AM  

Well, when you've got BLM storming into a library at Dartmouth (Dartmouth! Rilly?) and screaming at young white female students "you white bitch!", then you sorta know what type of thing you're dealing with. As the guy with the clock around his neck from Public Enemy once said, "Show 'em whatcha got!"

Can you believe I actually once shook Chuck D.'s hand? I really did.

Blogger Cail Corishev July 09, 2016 10:39 AM  

Nate, I guess it's just impossible for many people to believe there are places that weren't afflicted with feral dindus when the cops started escalating. I guess that's for the best, or they'd all want to move here.

Blogger Markku July 09, 2016 10:41 AM  

In Finland, if a police officer verbally remarks about carrying his service weapon, or puts his hand on the holster, it is considered a firearms incident. The officer has to file paperwork justifying that this threat was necessary, and it is included in the annual police use of firearms -statistics.

Blogger Cail Corishev July 09, 2016 10:45 AM  

The idea that police will do what local citizens want because that's who pays their salary is as quaintly naive as the belief of many that public schools obey the local schoolboard. There's loads of funding and training with strings attached coming from the state and federal level. That's why you get institutional change across the whole country which doesn't reflect local needs.

Anonymous Godfrey July 09, 2016 10:52 AM  

Step 1: Kill Scalia

Step 2: Use useful idiots in BLM to foment violent racial unrest

Step 3: Establish draconian solutions to "stabilize" the situation

Step 4: Gun control (disarm the serfs)

Anonymous artaud July 09, 2016 10:57 AM  

"Feral dindus" is a redundancy. (Not a specifically racial category, NB; some blacks are dindus, and most others clearly are not. But alas, there's this unfortunate thing called statistics.) Dindus have always been feral, and always will be. Sort of why they're, um, dindus. It's the changing patterns of how humans respond to them which matters.

Blogger Emmett Fitz-Hume July 09, 2016 11:07 AM  

@5

Full Disclosure:

I am a Peace Officer by NYS statute. I am not a policeman. Without giving too much away, so as to maintain my anonymity from the SJW lurkers who read and stalk here, I'll say that I am basically a glorified security guard who carries a firearm, a baton and pepper spray. Our uniforms are still actually blue and professional as opposed to say the black and tactical uniforms taking over most police agencies.

I have the power to arrest but rarely use it. I am a veteran of my agency's uniformed personnel.

OK, so everything VD says is dead on, both here and in the previous posts. I work in a municipal building and regularly encounter police, sheriffs and NYS troopers (a state police force, in every sense of the term...)

In the large city I work (but do not live in) the Law Enforcement agencies regularly escalate matters and alway articulate that Officer Safety is/was their concern.

For those of you who don't know, Articulation is the term used to describe institutionalized dishonesty. It's how cops are trained to lie. And they do it every day.

I watch articulate every day and the "articulation" is boilerplate at this point. I could go on about Articulation.

But I digress.

I was trained years ago by an Old School cop. That is to say, he was a Police Officer by statute but a Peace Officer in belief and practice. He left his force because of the culture change in his beloved profession that stemmed from two things: the War on Drugs and the way law abiding gun owners were being treated.
He was an absolute master of de-escalating situations and I can only hope that I have learned well from him. Part of his skill in de-escalating was his belief and behavior: he didn't believe himself to be any different or better than those he served. And he acted this way, everyday.

Now, this pertains directly to the concerns voiced in comment #5: I was taught by this salty old dog, and still believe, that not every "arrestable offense" should end in an arrest.

For the past twenty to thirty years (depending on geography) this is nearly unheard of in Policing. And it's a shame.

Being able to talk to people, talk people down is a dying art. Because most police forces and their associated academies are killing it. They don't use the word escalation. But escalation is what they teach. (And don't get me started on the effect of Tasers in these situations...)

"Lawful Orders" are a term of art in the Art of Articulation, right up there with "I saw a tail light out", "He made a sudden movement" and "Stop resisting!!!!!"

As someone else above said, mistakes get made: clerical, computer/data entry, etc. We all commit numerous crimes a day, every day. The law books are vast and convoluted. It wouldn't take much to convict any one of us on a variety of charges, some even felonies, all committed unavoidably and/or in ignorance.





Blogger Nate July 09, 2016 11:11 AM  

" Dindus have always been feral, and always will be. "

You have always been ignorant of American History, and always will be.

Blogger Nate July 09, 2016 11:14 AM  

"It wouldn't take much to convict any one of us on a variety of charges, some even felonies, all committed unavoidably and/or in ignorance."

amen sir.

Amen.

Blogger Nate July 09, 2016 11:15 AM  

"Nate, I guess it's just impossible for many people to believe there are places that weren't afflicted with feral dindus when the cops started escalating. I guess that's for the best, or they'd all want to move here."

I'm convinced the growth of VP has primarily come from the Urban world... which is why the comments have gotten dumber over time.

Sky's blue. Water's wet. Cities make people stupid.

Blogger Raggededge July 09, 2016 11:25 AM  

Sky's blue. Water's wet. Cities make people stupid.

Cities make people dependent on social services. When city folk see these services break down, they get scared. And, scared people make great boot lickers.

Anonymous artaud July 09, 2016 11:26 AM  

"You have always been ignorant of American History, and always will be."

A very silly thing to say. A guy as smart as you oughta know better. There are of course counter-arguments to be made, but that ain't one of 'em. Besides, there are things that are neither dialectic nor rhetoric. One of them is called polemic. C'mon, dood, you're better than this.



Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 11:27 AM  

@Nate.

"
No moron.

The militarization of the police started decades ago."

And when did LBJs "War on Poverty" (war on the poor family) begin?

Blogger Salt July 09, 2016 11:28 AM  

Nate wrote:The escalation was accepted and possible because of the idiotic "war on drugs".

And not be happenstance either. By design. De-escalation shall eventually happen, when escalation is no longer an extension of politics by other means.

Blogger Emmett Fitz-Hume July 09, 2016 11:29 AM  

Also, I'm wondering if we need a term, something similar to Cassandra Complex but differing in that the "prophet" is blamed for the prophecy coming true.

I have to say that one of the more fascinating aspects of VD's blog the past few days has been the inability of supposedly intelligent people to not see the distinction between predicting dire consequences and actually desiring dire consequences.

W.T.F.

Cassandra Shaming?
Prophiteering?


But seriously, Vox predicting this crap is world's away from him actually wanting it to happen. It's called a warning for an 'effing reason dipshits.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 11:31 AM  

The elites are trying to see if they can replicate the Ik withh their homegrown black population and use them as a weapon against the last bastion of the white middle class while our police get to play Operation Tethered Goat.

Another 1/2 generation and I think they can surpass the Ik level of incivility.

What we are witnessing is rodent utopia writ upon civilization.

Blogger Chris Mallory July 09, 2016 11:35 AM  

"And when did LBJs "War on Poverty" (war on the poor family) begin?"

Need to go back to the Volstead Act at least.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash July 09, 2016 11:40 AM  

Old Ez wrote:What seems to be being argued in this post is that if cops encounter someone who is non-cooperative with their lawful orders that they should just let that person slide and flout the law because it is too risky to employ force. Am I reading this wrong?

What on earth give an officer the right to give me any orders at all? The fact that he invented a "Probable cause", that he is going on official record with a lie?

Who here hasn't been stopped for a made-up offense? I've been stopped for such things as a bent license plate and a cracked wing window.

Just last month I was stopped by a useless small-town cop with an expensive license plate scanner. My offense? Having tags that would expire in 16 days. You see, "technically they had just expired, but the tags are monthly so it's not an offense until the end of the month". Meaning, I had to presume, that I had paid for them 366 days before. But that is evidently good enough for some 95IQ city revenue agent to pull me over and start issuing orders?

Fuck him, and fuck his "lawful orders".

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 11:42 AM  

Emmett Fitz-Hume wrote:(And don't get me started on the effect of Tasers in these situations...

I have seen an apparent over-use of tasers; I expect they are better than being hit with a sap.

Really, I'm pushing your taser button because I'm curious.

Blogger EasyCompany July 09, 2016 11:45 AM  

SNAFU is really losing it at his site.
Evil whitey are the only ones calling for a race war and how blacks are just doing what the Founders did.

He shows how even, supposedly, smart blacks are just out of it.

Blogger Emmett Fitz-Hume July 09, 2016 11:51 AM  

@61

Bear in mind that this is purely anecdotal Rusty but in my experience (as a witness. We are not issued or trained to use Tasers), when a cop has a Taser, he falls back on it like a crutch because of the "less-than-lethal" nature of the weapon. Something I'm not entirely convinced of myself...

Talking to a guy, guy's just not "compliant". Perhaps he's drunk or high. Perhaps his wife left him and took the kids. Perhaps he has psychiatric problems.

There could be any number of reasons an individual is not compliant. Some are even legitimate.

But when a Taser is present, why keep talking? It's such an easy, "less-than-lethal" option. Why bother to hear someone out? Why let them explain themselves?

*crackle*.....ZAP!

They are a crutch and they are slowly helping to erode the necessary skills to de-escalate.

Anonymous BigGayKoranBurner July 09, 2016 11:51 AM  

Positioning is the key. LGBT is allied with Jihad.

They are hoping for some "good moslem" rough trade. That's how Ali Mohamad Brown killed gays in 3 states.

Does the cop know who it is? Why not; isn't this his beat? The guy shot in Louisiana was a child sex predator, who committee multiple home invasions, gun crime, and was selling stolen goods when the cop shot him. His arrest record would take up the entire screen http://stuffblackpeopledontlike.blogspot.com/2016/07/alton-sterling-another-pillar-of-black.html

so it ends up with Darren Wilson as the foreign occupying soldier and Michael Brown as the local civilian.

Ferguson was a Whitopia until 2 section 8 housing complexes got dumped on them 2 years ago. Even worse is Dubuque Idaho that is getting shitted section 8 recipients from Chicongo. http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/429693/affh-preview-obamas-hud-takes-over-dubuque-iowa

"Our police departments have escalated almost entirely due to Blacks and Mexicans,"This is simply a blatant lie."

In the 90s gangs would go into hospitals to finish people off, I worked at one that it happened at, "I see nothing" was good enough. Blacks and browns were allowed to kill each other. When Abe Lincoln was in his teens, he and a friend escaped from a pack of didndus.

I have seen an apparent over-use of tasers; I expect they are better than being hit with a sap.

A 5' tall girl cop could never sap me.

Anonymous BGKB July 09, 2016 11:52 AM  

Sorry Ferguson was section 8 dumped on 10 years ago.

Blogger VD July 09, 2016 11:57 AM  

Wake up dude.

Shut up, Arthur. You're an idiot and you don't even understand what is being discussed. If you don't cut that posturing crap, I'll spam you.

OK, so everything VD says is dead on, both here and in the previous posts.

Interesting, is it not, that while the badge-lickers claim I am wrong, evil, and hate police, the actual men with badges back me up.

Has it ever occurred to the critics that I ACTUALLY TALK TO THE POLICE about these things? Just like I do with regards to almost every other subject on which I opine.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 12:02 PM  

Vox, given what Fox seems to have uncovered about the perp in Dallas that his actions were not a case of 4GW and were simply the actions of an unhinged black rapist trying to get back at the system and using the current BLM shit as an excuse?

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 12:05 PM  

Of course, Гаврило Принцип probably never thought that his actions would lead to the destruction of Austria-Hungary and WWI.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 12:06 PM  

@67: ... about the perp in Dallas isn't it possible that his actons ...

Anonymous Gen. Kong July 09, 2016 12:23 PM  

Human Animal.
I think this is true as long as the members of that tribe believe they are fighting on behalf of themselves, rather than on behalf of a doctrine.

This is pretty close. They're not actually fighting for themselves - regardless of what they've been indoctrinated to believe. Instead they are fighting to maintain the power of the genocidal criminal cartel who rules over them and makes promises of a golden pension if they faithfully follow orders. While some of the better members of the badge-gang might like to do the constitutional ghost-dance, they fail to comprehend that it is a very dead letter.

If there had been a "White Lives Matter" rally in Dallas, it would have been brutally repressed with police force and this would have been covered up by Lügenpresse. Those who issue their orders are the same folks who issue BLM's orders. Few members of the badge-gang have the insight to understand this. Mr. Kersey told us that Darren Wilson 'gets it' now. Speaking of the loyalty to the brethren among them, I note with interest that the Bell-Curve City P.D. promptly removed their "I Am Darren Wilson" bracelets when ordered to by the Chief Goonda. That should have given some of the rank and file a clue about the nature of things….

Blogger Achilles July 09, 2016 12:28 PM  

I would imagine cops in major cities are having their pensions eaten up by the city. I don't see anyone convincing hem to de-escalate and by friendly with local crack dealers. But the fiscal irresponsibility and corrupt governments might de-escalate for us.

We may get some version of 4GW policing in suburban and rural areas. But in the big cities I think cops are just going to stop doing anything - killing or arresting. Not striking perhaps but there will be a lot of talk of just sitting in the squad car sipping coffee. That's when OCP builds Robocop.

Blogger David Power July 09, 2016 12:29 PM  

"When the British responded to Indian independence rallies with violence, they immediately lost the moral war.

Operations David and Goliath show a strong military force, with almost no limits on the amount of violence it can apply to a situation, versus a very weak irregular force. The weaker force has the moral high ground because it is so weak. No one likes bullies using their physical superiority in order to win at anything, and unless we are extremely careful in how we apply our physical combat power, we soon come across as a bully"


In fact, Britain was by far the weaker force. A few hundred administrative pen-pushers and a small exhausted contingent of soldiers.

The British gave India its independence not because it had lost "the moral war" but because it had exhausted itself both militarily and financially winning a very real war - much of the time alone.

It's a little known fact that why America was pouring money and resources into rebuilding Germany and Japan, a bankrupt Britain continued to endure food rationing right up until 1954.

Britain didn't lose India because it was an oppressive brutal regime, it lost it because it had become weak and more importantly, was seen to be weak.

Once the leftist hamstring the police via false accusations of racism, and the police are seen to be weak, does anyone here really expect America to become less violent?

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 12:31 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 12:31 PM  

Emmett Fitz-Hume wrote:

*crackle*.....ZAP!

They are a crutch and they are slowly helping to erode the necessary skills to de-escalate.


Excellent thank you.

Blogger Derek Kite July 09, 2016 12:32 PM  

67. People who have nothing to lose start shooting first.

Repeat that. People who have nothing to lose start shooting first.

Repeat it again. People who have nothing to lose start shooting first.

Got it? It will escalate due to the reaction of police. An understandable reaction, purely human, accentuated by training and institution bias. Someone, many perhaps will get shot because of a twitchy cop. The pattern of unaccountability will make people very angry, and it will escalate.

Anonymous GM July 09, 2016 12:38 PM  

@Nate

Balko locked and loaded on reader. Thanks.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 12:38 PM  

@75: Derek Kite

Are you suggesting that we should have let him rape a few women?

He had no police interactions it seems but was drummed out of the Army for sexual assault in Afghanistan.

Who had robbed him of everything?

I fail to understand your reasoning.

Further, it seems to me that it is whites who have nothing left to lose.

Blogger Laguna Beach Fogey July 09, 2016 12:38 PM  

"As Lind and LtCol Thiele point out, the central dilemma of 4GW is that what works for you on the physical level often works against you at the moral level.

"It is therefore very easy to win all the tactical engagements in a Fourth Generation conflict yet still lose the war."
"

Too true. This is old hat. It's common wisdom among COIN practitioners and students of bush warfare. We saw it practiced in Rhodesia and South West Africa in the 1970s-1980s.

OTOH, the African threat can only be contained by oppression, force, and violence (explicit or implied). (Those who claim otherwise have no experience living near or among Africans, and/or are country bumpkins who have never lived or travelled in that continent).

The police need to be brutal in crushing black terrorists, but they also desperately need to work on their PR campaign. Fortunately, the behaviour and actions of the BLM movement are doing a lot of work 'selling' the police to the public.

The cops' best ally right now is BLM.

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar July 09, 2016 12:42 PM  

They will not de-escalate, except where it concerns valued victim groups. They will be kept lethal and become the tool of transformation they desire. Federalization through regulation will lead to assimilation by the anti-capitalists.

I hope Trump is preparing for this. We need grassroots buffer zones at all events and he needs to have contingency plans in place for the duration.

This is war. BLM, Anarchists, Islamists, Rainbow Coalitions, et al. are only cannon fodder for the invisible hand.

Trump needs a general. Maybe more than one with bright ideas for minimizing damage from the attacks which will be coming from every direction. He needs intelligence and proper application of modern technology to track and destroy his enemies.

I didn't used to sound this paranoid, but as the saying goes...

Anonymous Gen. Kong July 09, 2016 12:44 PM  

@BGKB.
Ferguson started going to the dark side more than 25 years ago. As you likely already know from Kersey's site, the Supreme Council of Blackrobes destroyed restrictive covenants in 1948 - with a case originating in St. Louis (aka Bell-Curve City). Section 8 is easily one of the most destructive components of the welfare apparatus, It has never been opposed by the Repuke Party - who theoretically could de-fund the whole damned thing next week if they actually wanted to.

Anonymous SaltyDonnie July 09, 2016 12:44 PM  

I am an attorney that represents law enforcement for labor-related matters. I also happen to be conservative (whatever that means these days) leaning alt-right. New to the site and Vox's works. Just finished "SWJs Always Lie", halfway through "Cuckservative" and will then start on "Missionaries". All well worth the purchase.

My two cents:

My attitude with police is "trust but verify". Not all cops are the same, even in the same state, so trying to brand Texas PD with the over the line actions of Officer Wedge Figgus in Light My Fart, Alabama doesn't dovetail. Christ, local PD don't get along with State Police. For every cop that agrees with Vox 100% I can cite one that doesn't. That's just life.

My personal issues with police (aside from obvious abuse of power) are:

1) Police are being used to "police" laws that shouldn't be laws. They are becoming behavior modification agents, directed by their municipal employers to do so. A big part of this is social engineering, but another part is that society is less socially "moral", so there is no courtesy and no "herd regulating itself" enforcement that makes police unnecessary. "I'm blasting my stereo at 3:00am on a Monday because F*CK YOU, that's why!" Yeah, the neighbors have to get up at 600am for work, so the cops are gettin' called, Patrick Henry.

2) They are directed to generate revenue. I resent being ticketed because I have a nice car and happen to drive through Ghettowood on my way to a hearing, so they know I have outside money to tap. Don't ticket the working man for going 10mph over the limit on a street that EVERYONE goes 10mph over the limit on. Sounds like a minor complaint, but it's common and that's the first thing to turn people off of police. Most police I know HATE being revenue generators. They are directed to take money from the working man and they know that causes public relations problems.

3) Civil asset forfeiture, which I know about as a lawyer, but the average man on the street has no idea what that is until it happens to them, so don't over-inflate the effect of that on the US populace. It's a legit problem that I wish more people were aware of, but they are not, and that's not BLM's concern here, so don't project your legitimate concerns on their illegitimate ones to bolster their cred. You have cred, they don't.

4) In all honesty, I have not encountered many brutal or arrogant police. I keep my hands on the wheel, respond to commands, have my info, etc. Everytime I've done that, I have no issues. Friends that arm flail get problems. My old criminal law professor, a lib with a lengthy career in criminal defense, always said "argue with the cops in court, don't argue on the street." I know a few cops that have that "Holier Than Thou" attitude, but most of the problem departments I run into are bad because the Chief/Mayor/Council are bad, incompetent or corrupt, which of course reinforces lower level corruption. The fish rots from the head.

Anonymous SaltyDonnie July 09, 2016 12:45 PM  

Our firm represents law enforcement state wide. Much to my surprise, outside of the larger cities in our state, the police are not "militarized". No tanks, no stormtroopers walking down street, etc. Most are small-town, live where they work, are understaffed and armed with standard police issued firearms. Some may have more powerful weaponry in the trunk for special occasions, but they aren't carrying it when they come to the window to write a ticket.

The local FOP Lodges do not have the money to defend every B.S. labor claim and discipline. They are not Teamsters. They do not fund criminal defense. If a police officer is "bad", the other others know it, and it isn't long until that cop is disciplined and fired for SOP violations or criminal code wrongdoing. And the neutral labor arbitrators uphold discipline where they know the cop is an issue. When they are disciplined, our firm has to evaluate if they have merit to their defense, and if so a grievance is filed to protect employment while criminal matters play out. But if not, the union denies the representation. If our firm/union is wrong, we can be sued for breach of the duty of fair representation to compel arbitration of the discipline, and if a union colludes with the Municipal employer, the remedy in court is an order for arbitration AND damages. Believe me, the union's I deal with can't afford defending dumbasses or colluding with the municipality. That doesn't mean it isn't a problem elsewhere.

On one our major cities was involved in a Trump protestor kerfluffle, and they were under-armored and under-protected for it, which caused serious issues locally behind the scenes. That City's force is dropping established cops due to early retirement, and they can't retain anyone because the cops know the City doesn't have their back, catering to the local BLMs, etc. This has been a long standing issue that is now bearing rotten fruit. So new hires are rushed in, who will be quick to baton and to ticket.

I get called out to police involved shootings, and I haven't been to one where the police were clearly in the wrong. Sometimes bad shite happens.

Another thing to note is that criminal defendants end up suing police for abuse because most cities settle out when they should fight the claim. Others see the settlement and dogpile on. Even if we advise them to litigate, the litigation is more costly that the settlement. Further, the defendants have all the reason in the world to say the police were abusive as part of a culture at the department, because in our state if the officer acts outside of their duty they are personally liable, and the municipality isn't, and they aren't getting much of a damages recovery from one officer.

Vox's comments aren't wrong (and in some jurisdictions may be 100% accurate), but they are not the whole picture. Thank you for your consideration, and I look forward to reading The Missionaries.

Blogger Derek Kite July 09, 2016 12:46 PM  

73. There are lots of false assumptions. First is that it is a black problem. It isn't. It is a police problem. The police problem comes from political administration problems.

The black guy who was choked and died in New York was selling cigarettes. Sell an illegal cigarette and we will kill you. No. Write a law or regulation where people who sell individual cigarettes get killed and we will wipe your brains off of the wainscoting.

If you have to kill people over silly inconsequential regulations, the whole structure of law and government is seriously broken and needs to be fixed. It is far easier to gin up outrage, kill a black guy, or white guy, or whoever. It is far easier to cover your stupid mistakes by blaming the civil unrest you created.

Clinton getting off by Comey is how the US works. Run a business, talk to business people, all of them with rare exception will simply pay a bureaucrat instead of fighting for what is right, because they know they cannot and will not survive the encounter.

I refuse to travel by air because I will be felt up by some twit in uniform. I refuse to submit to the indignity, and that is exactly why they do it, to force people to submit to indignity.

I doubt if the authorities, police officials and politicians will react well to this. They will double down as SJW's always do. The issue is power. That is the only issue.

By the way the New York revolution in policing was that police were held accountable for the crime rate in their jurisdiction. Bureaucrats are famous for nurturing the problems they are responsible for as a strategy for getting more and continued funding.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 12:48 PM  

@83: However, I never used those false assumptions.

How is the Dallas shooter different than Omar Thornton? If the BLM movement had not chosen to have a rally at that time he would likely have gone postal in some other way because of his nature.

Anonymous Fisk Ellington Rutledge III July 09, 2016 12:52 PM  

De-escalation is not an option. Whenever we've de-escalated it has been seen as weakness by nonWhites. Third-World savages only understand force. As I've mentioned before, the ONLY problem with police militarization is that it is also turned on Whites in the name of the Leftist pathology of "disparate impact" and "equality of outcome." Since de-escalation is NOT an option, then the only alternative is to deport ALL nonWhites with as much force as necessary. Doesn't matter where we deport them. Dump them on Mexico and let them deal with it.

Anonymous Gen. Kong July 09, 2016 12:52 PM  

Other Robot.
Further, it seems to me that it is whites who have nothing left to lose.

True but they cannot or will not see it. They still believe in the Amurikan Dream, which (as George Carlin noted) really is a dream because one has to be asleep to believe it.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan July 09, 2016 12:57 PM  

There is a white house petition up saying declare BLM a terrorist group supposedly has 37k signatures needs 100k before the administration has to BS us with an answer

Blogger Snidely Whiplash July 09, 2016 1:05 PM  

SaltyDonnie wrote:3) Civil asset forfeiture, which I know about as a lawyer, but the average man on the street has no idea what that is until it happens to them, so don't over-inflate the effect of that on the US populace. It's a legit problem that I wish more people were aware of, but they are not, and that's not BLM's concern here, so don't project your legitimate concerns on their illegitimate ones to bolster their cred. You have cred, they don't.

You misunderstand.
The problem is not that people are outraged about civil forfeiture. You're right, most people don't know about it, although the people it has touched can certainly explain in detail why it's evil. The problem is that it is no more than legalized theft by the police, often for their own benefit.
That has an effect on the police. Not everywhere, as I am dead certain you will immediately point out, no, NAPALT.
But CF has led and will lead to incidents where police will simply identify what they want to steal and gin up an excuse. Some Oklahoma police now carry a bank card scanner they can use to empty your bank account. No trial, no probable cause, no due process. They just take it and you can sue to get it back. Object and you will be beaten and imprisoned.
Don't like it citizen? Too bad, they out-rank you.

Blogger J Van Stry July 09, 2016 1:15 PM  

But this ignores the impact of the media.
It never matters what you really do, it matters what the people believe you are doing and the 'why' you are doing it.

So, if you control the media, you control the actual impressions on the war. The left has been controlling the media rather ruthlessly for some time now, and the always portray something completely fictional, in order to say who is moral and who is not.

The #1 weapon in 4gw wars is the media. If you don't control it, you don't win. So you should be ruthless in your capturing of the media. Putin understands this. He has taken over his media. Sure, he murdered a lot of people to do it, but notice that no one cares anymore, the majority now back him.

Blogger Chris Mallory July 09, 2016 1:16 PM  

OT:

The wife had Faux News on and they were reporting that
"the shooter's body was obliterated by the bomb. To the point it will make drug/substance test almost impossible" or words to that effect.

Putting on my tin foil hat, this sounds very much like a false flag. They don't have a body to ID because they blew it up?

Blogger YIH July 09, 2016 1:16 PM  

fred wrote:Well, when you've got BLM storming into a library at Dartmouth (Dartmouth! Rilly?) and screaming at young white female students "you white bitch!", then you sorta know what type of thing you're dealing with. As the guy with the clock around his neck from Public Enemy once said, "Show 'em whatcha got!"

Can you believe I actually once shook Chuck D.'s hand? I really did.


Funny you should mention Public Enemy. Guess who was hanging out with them? Though it wasn't the other ''clock boy''
When I saw those photos I thought: ''Go to Africa, go directly to Africa, do not pass GO, do not collect $200''.

Anonymous SaltyDonnie July 09, 2016 1:37 PM  

88.

No I don't misunderstand. Your concern is YOUR (and frankly, my) concern. Do you want cops dead because of it, or do you want the policy changed? Did the cops create the policy? No, they enforce it (or don't enforce it). So who created it? Did you vote those representatives in, or where they forced on you? That's a reason to have police based at local levels, less on the state level, and WAY less on the federal level, because the more uniform they are, the more consolidated, the more they are likely to become politicized and corrupted. The DOJ would LOVE to set use of force policy nationwide, so they can politicize it from on high, same reason they wanted to have any "one size fits all" law.

Our state police don't carry the bank card scanner (yet), which the very thought of pisses me off. So why should my state's police be targeted because Oklahoma police were ordered to violate constitutional rights? Should I burn down the 84 Lumber two states over because my local Home Depot screwed me on the price of paneling? Just because they all sell lumber?

The Cops are the line workers that are going to catch the public bitchfit first. But they are not doing anything "legally" that three layers of bureaucrats haven't already implemented and ordered. If it gets bad enough, at some point the police will have to decide "do I want to do this or work at Walmart?". Who do we hire then, since the problem (the elected officials) haven't gone away?

But all of this is not BLM's stated concern or the shooter's unless they, or he, say it is. The shooter targeted cops, particularly white cops, because he avers that police, EVERYWHERE, have it out for blacks. Do only white cops commit civil forfeiture? Do only white cops beat asses, or shoot dogs, or steal dime bags? They have their own reasons for hating police. So if a BLM shooter starts poppin' caps, saying the "cops deserved it" or "had it coming" is because "you" think they (all cops everywhere) deserved it for committing your particular list of wrongs, not the actual reason they were shot. That is just using the shooter as a proxy, which is considerably different than saying "hey, don't be surprised if effect B follows cause A".

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 1:37 PM  

But this ignores the impact of the media.
It never matters what you really do, it matters what the people believe you are doing and the 'why' you are doing it.


You are correct, and the media makes it look like blacks have started a race war (which they cannot win.)

We will see.

Blogger Billy July 09, 2016 1:45 PM  

Low IQ blacks are going to chimp out regardless if there is an aggressive American style police force or pussified Swedish type police force. It's just the way of the world.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 1:45 PM  

Escalation by police occurs in times of relative peace when their attempts at escalation go unopposed, or worse, are supported. A necessary element of this is that the public and their elected representatives lose the will to keep the police in line, leading to incidents like wannabe-commandos using an MRAP to stop grandma for an unpaid parking ticket, or SWAT teams raiding homes in the middle of the night when they could just arrest a guy at a gas station. Cowards can be very bold when unchallenged.

The group claiming police won't deescalate in response to Dallas and future similar incidents is obviously wrong, because deescalation is what police have done for the past 30 years and are observably still doing. Deescalation is what reliably occurs after significant attacks on the police when they have lost the backing of the public – it's what happened in the LA Riots, Cincinnati in 2001, Ferguson and Baltimore last year, ad nauseum. Unfortunately police rhetoric isn't likely to change, but don't confuse rhetoric with reality. While police spokesmen may promise to enforce the law with just as much diligence as they did before Dallas, it won't happen. A pullback and consequent emboldening of criminals is a given because any other option is untenable.

However, the available options for a government battling insurgents are not constrained to a linear scale of escalation and deescalation. We may see a continued trend of deescalation against blacks combined with escalation against whites (at least until they get fed up too and also respond with targeted violence). Or, as Big Bill mentioned @4, indirect and possibly clandestine options are also available. More typical than the options Big Bill mentioned is the employment or tolerance of paramilitary forces, a staple option in the counter-revolutionary toolkit. This allows the state to demoralize insurgents while maintaining deniability, typically involving publicly condemning paramilitary forces while training and supplying them. So it's both possible and likely that police will deescalate directly while eventually escalating indirectly. I don't see Colombian-style tacit support for paramilitaries on the immediate horizon – circumstances would have to grow much more desperate before allowing paramilitary action became acceptable to state and local politicians – but events are unfolding rapidly now, and paramilitary action could look like an attractive option quite suddenly.

Blogger Emmett Fitz-Hume July 09, 2016 1:50 PM  

@94

Noah, you say that the police are de-escalating. But the way you describe it, I think the word disengaging is more accurate.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 1:51 PM  

@82

If you have to kill people over silly inconsequential regulations, the whole structure of law and government is seriously broken and needs to be fixed. It is far easier to gin up outrage, kill a black guy, or white guy, or whoever. It is far easier to cover your stupid mistakes by blaming the civil unrest you created.

That cuts both ways. It is far easier for blacks to blame whites and police than assess the fact that the overwhelming majority of blacks vote to expand government to totalitarian levels. I'm unsympathetic to people who vote to empower a police state who are later upset that it didn't work out in their favor and that they, too, are accountable under the very laws they once supported.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 1:55 PM  

@95

I agree. In my mind deescalation is the broader term, and disengagement is one form of it.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents July 09, 2016 1:55 PM  

Clearly a new approach to policing is desperately needed, but great minds have already come up with a solution.

In the future, no weapons of any description will be carried. U.N. uniforms are to be worn, of course. Handcuffs are to be abolished. Arrests will take place only with the consent of the person being arrested. That should remove the problem of the police for the time being.

As for arrests, just declare a Zone of Custodial Care, within which those persons subject of a Care Order will be placed on parole not to go beyond the Zone boundary without permission, except at weekends, or for compassionate reasons, or when deemed under the domination of an irresistable influence.

I’m sure Vox will agree this would put paid to the problem of militarized police.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents July 09, 2016 1:57 PM  

Clearly a new approach to policing is desperately needed, but great minds have already come up with a solution.

In the future, no weapons of any description will be carried. U.N. uniforms are to be worn, of course. Handcuffs are to be abolished. Arrests will take place only with the consent of the person being arrested. That should remove the problem of the police for the time being.

As for arrests, just declare a Zone of Custodial Care, within which those persons subject of a Care Order will be placed on parole not to go beyond the Zone boundary without permission, except at weekends, or for compassionate reasons, or when deemed under the domination of an irresistable influence.

I’m sure Vox will agree this would put paid to the problem of militarized police.

Anonymous Soylent_Green July 09, 2016 1:58 PM  

79. Cluebat quote: "Trump needs a general. Maybe more than one with bright ideas for minimizing damage from the attacks which will be coming from every direction. He needs intelligence and proper application of modern technology to track and destroy his enemies.". Could not agree more. I nominate Lt.Col. (Ret) Tom Kratman.

Blogger Chris Mallory July 09, 2016 2:07 PM  

@94 The cops will deescalate in the ghetto. But they will double down on shooting Golden Retrievers,operating 3 AM military raids on pot dealers, and giving white guys with traffic violations felony stops all because "officer safety".

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 2:26 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 2:26 PM  

@5 - What seems to be being argued in this post is that if cops encounter someone who is non-cooperative with their lawful orders that they should just let that person slide and flout the law because it is too risky to employ force. Am I reading this wrong?

Many times, those "lawful orders" are just fishing expeditions. Like the Stop and Frisks. Cops will use some of the dumbest excuses to harass someone. Like, you are walking on the sidewalk, their is debris on the sidewalk so you sidestep off the curb temporarily and back on the sidewalk, which then becomes:

What are you stopping me for?

We saw you walking in the middle of the street.

I wasn't walking in the middle of the street. I stepped of the curb to walk around debris on the sidewalk.

Anyhow, the whole damn thing was on video. Don't tell me that cops don't get an ingrown hair up their a** and decide to harass people by "lawful order". Is that the kind of "lawful order" you are talking about?

As far as "breaking the law", sometimes the law is an a**. Not only do we have malum in se laws, which for the most part is good, we have malum prohibitum laws just because after 200 plus years of legislating, the legislatures run out of malum in se so they just have to do find something more to legislate. And we wonder why we have the largest prison population and parole/probation population in the world.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 2:27 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Unknown July 09, 2016 2:31 PM  

@92

The blacks have started the race war, it started years ago. It is not being reported. Look up Colin Flaherty on Youtube. His latest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fO41xnvVhHA
At this time, only one side is fighting, and it is not whites.

Blogger Robert Divinity July 09, 2016 2:35 PM  

"
As far as "breaking the law", sometimes the law is an a**. Not only do we have malum in se laws, which for the most part is good, we have malum prohibitum laws just because after 200 plus years of legislating, the legislatures run out of malum in se so they just have to do find something more to legislate. And we wonder why we have the largest prison population and parole/probation population in the world."

This, along with Comey's in-your-face announcement this week that the two-tier system of justice is official, makes me a huge advocate for jury nullification for most property along with some violent crimes. If you have to perjure yourself to get on the jury so be it. You can be damned well assured the law enforcement witnesses will commit perjury several times and go unpunished.

Anonymous Jack Amok July 09, 2016 2:49 PM  

Sky's blue. Water's wet. Cities make people stupid.

I need to flesh the theory out, but basically because cities are large concentrations of people, the following is true of living in a city vs small town / rural life:

-If you don't trust yourself to do something right, there's a better chance of finding someone to do it for you.

-If you want to do something shameful that involves other people, you have a better chance of blending into the crowd and doing it anonymously.

-the above goes double for shameful activities that involve leeching off of others, plus there are more potential hosts.

-It's hard to do anything entirely on your own in a city as the density requires more cooperation, so if you fail, there are plenty of other people to blame your failure on.

-If you suck at inter-personal relationships, it's easier to find new friends after you've screwed up your relationship with your old friends.

-if you don't have the ambition and semi-irrational confidence needed to start a business on your own, it's easier to find someone else to work for.


So, work up the personality profile of city dwellers. Then realize a city dweller is surrounded by and has daily interactions mostly with people who fit that same profile.




-

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 2:51 PM  

@40

There are now more bureaucrats with guns than U.S. Marines

https://www.bing.com/search?q=There+are+now+more+bureaucrats+with+guns+than+U.S.+Marines&qs=n&form=QBRE&pq=there+are+now+more+bureaucrats+with+guns+than+u.s.+marines&sc=0-58&sp=-1&sk=&cvid=E70D19B3F29344E88FE0B83B813FE598

Meanwhile:

Obama Administration and UN Announce Global Police Force to Fight ‘Extremism’ In U.S.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/10/02/obama-administration-and-un-announce-global-police-force-to-fight-extremism-in-u-s/

KrisAnne Hall – US Attorney General, US Cities, Join UN to Create Global Police Force Intiative

https://youtu.be/FhuhHK2LAYg

Attorney General Loretta E. Lynch Announces the Launch of the Strong Cities Network at the United Nations General Assembly - Remarks as prepared for delivery

https://www.justice.gov/opa/speech/attorney-general-loretta-e-lynch-announces-launch-strong-cities-network-united-nations

The fun has even begun yet. By the way, anyone believe all the above has anything to do with Blacks?

Blogger Snidely Whiplash July 09, 2016 2:51 PM  

@SaltyDonnie
Don't put words in my mouth.
I'm not justifying anything, particularly murder.
On the other hand, if you want tounderstand what is going on, you have to look at the situation objectively, and objectively, police are becoming more and more lawless, more and more violent, and more and more immune to any repercussions for their behavior. To the extent that you personally enable that immunity, you could be responsible for some of it.

The plain fact is that BLM is wrong, but so are many police departments. So are an awful lot of cops. So, in the particular event, is the Dallas PD. They straight-up murdered a suspect, with a bomb.

Anonymous Maximo Macaroni July 09, 2016 2:54 PM  

I remember no police shootings that had anything to do with the militarization of the police. Tasers have nothing to do with militarization. Trayvon Martin had nothing to do with the police at all. Don't remember any tanks surrounding Michael Brown or the others. False issue.

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 3:01 PM  

Strong Cities Network - https://youtu.be/Gy7FVXERKFE

You are either us, or with the ter-ists.

Everybody gets played.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 3:04 PM  

Another person who gets it - BLOWBACK, h/t copblock.org

And it was Will Grigg who noted the Drug War was Nixon's idea - Blacks use heroin. 14% of blacks use drugs, about the same as whites, 60% of drug prisoners are black. Black crack has a higher penalty than white surburban cocaine.

Keeping peace and order is one thing, the traffic ticket taxation and drug war (possession, sales, etc.) is something different. They don't do the just barely legal entrapment in the rich white high-school parking lots, though they would catch a lot.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 3:06 PM  

@110

Militarization isn't just about equipment. It's also about attitude. Look at the shootings of Miriam Carey and Oscar Grant. Watch the video of police instinctively confiscating smartphones from witnesses after one of them shot Oscar Grant while he was face down and handcuffed. There's your militarization.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 3:12 PM  

Perhaps the Big Gay Korean BBQ can chime in here:

And it was Will Grigg who noted the Drug War was Nixon's idea - Blacks use heroin. 14% of blacks use drugs, about the same as whites, 60% of drug prisoners are black. Black crack has a higher penalty than white surburban cocaine.

Metabolic pathways are important. The metabolism of many/most drugs is similar for the metabolism of alcohol.

Whites are just better at it and less affected by it because of thousands of years of selection against those who cannot handle their alcohol.

Life sucks if Basketball/sprinting is the most important skill needed to get through life and you are not black.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 3:13 PM  

Those two killings were some of the most blatantly egregious misuses of deadly force in modern US policing. I still don't believe it's an accident that the media didn't cover those.

Blogger Cinco July 09, 2016 3:18 PM  

Watch the video of police instinctively confiscating smartphones from witnesses after one of them shot Oscar Grant while he was face down and handcuffed. There's your militarization.

Wrong.

Confiscating cell phones of civilians by the military is neither taught nor would it be condoned, regardless of the circumstance. The reason is simple, military operations do not require us to collect evidence in order prosecute an offender. If we are conducting an operation, we operating under the ultimate approval authority of POTUS. We submit the justification for our actions before we leave the wire, we don't need to justify our actions afterwords with evidence. That is the difference between policing and militarization.

Blogger Chris Mallory July 09, 2016 3:18 PM  

@110 When the cops are using SWAT teams to serve low level warrants, that is militarization.

@112 Dale Carson in his book "Arrest Proof Yourself" https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FO80SOQ/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1 explains the big disparity in drug arrests between the races as blacks being stupid and cops being lazy. It is a lot easier to bust Tyrone bebopping on the street corner than it is to arrest Bubba in his own home. The cop can stop and frisk Tyrone for just about anything. To get Bubba, he needs a warrant.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 3:24 PM  

Kratman writes about the military:

Social Justice Armed Forces

It probably also applies to those armed bureaucrats, but even more.

Blogger Emmett Fitz-Hume July 09, 2016 3:25 PM  

@110

I'm the guy who brought up Tasers Maximo. And I mentioned them in regard to escalating, de-escalating and good old fashioned "Let's just talk this out." I was pretty clear.

Not militarization. I'm pretty sure you're disingenuous.

@113

Or there's the baby burned by flash-bang in its crib during a SWAT/Tacticool raid on the wrong 'effing address.

Or, how about the numerous family pets shot by those like minded Tacticool SWAT operators as a "precaution".

One could go on and on...


Blogger tz July 09, 2016 3:27 PM  

@63 A Taser is only "non-lethal" until someone tries to grab it - the north Charleston incident? - at which point the Officer can be in fear of his life if the suspect tries to grab his "non-lethal" weapon so it justified in shooting.

@52 - Cities make people evil too, I'm not sure it makes them stupid as they act too smart in doing the evil.

Blogger Cinco July 09, 2016 3:28 PM  

The cop can stop and frisk Tyrone for just about anything. To get Bubba, he needs a warrant.

Exactly. I find the assumption of equality or false equivalence, to be the number one logical fallacy in use today. This is especially true when dealing with the issue of race.

Blogger Mike Wallens July 09, 2016 3:29 PM  

People are delusional if they think this is some kind of war against the police. It is racial only. Those cops represented bad whites to the murderer. White America gets along with the cops for the most part,mostly because they don't act like insane idiots when asked for their ID.

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 3:31 PM  

@116 There is militarization abroad, and then there is militarization at home. While the rules of engagement may differ, it is still militarization in the broader context of police militarization.

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 3:34 PM  

@122 - ...they don't act like insane idiots when asked for their ID.

Not true. There are plenty of whites who refuse to show their I.D. Need YouTube? And there are plenty of whites who have suffered the consequences for not providing their I.D. on demand.

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 3:36 PM  

@122 - But then again, you may claim "lawful order"?

Anonymous Jack Amok July 09, 2016 3:38 PM  

Regarding all the binary thinking going on, it's just another aspect - and a negative one at that - of Declare.

Globalist forces have busted our society into a million pieces, thinking they were pulling off the old divide and conquer shtick. But the pieces are forming themselves back up into blocks and we're all being asked to declare - which side are you on? That's a hard question to answer these days though, because we haven't quite finished sorting out all the sides.

BLM isn't on our side. The cops aren't either. Today anyway. In the future? Hell, either one - even both - could end up on our side, but they would look different than they do now. If you're smart, you'll notice that what Vox is really doing here. He's not just saying "the cops aren't on our side." He's also saying what they need to do to be on our side.

If you're a cop and you want to be on our side, pay attention. Those are the changes you need to make. And if the current folks who issue your badges and paychecks won't let you make them, you might want to change who you work for. Our side needs peace officers. Their side needs an occupation force. So, Declare.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 3:38 PM  

@114, how does buying, selling, or possession have anything to do with a metabolic pathway?

Yes, different physiology, but have certain metabolic pathways now been outlawed?

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 3:40 PM  

Try not to sperge, Cinco. Nothing about the term "militarization" requires or implies a precise emulation of any policy of any US military branch. It simply means the prevalence of a militant/hostile attitude and policies.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 3:42 PM  

@127: Sigh. So, the effects of those substances on blacks, Mexicans, Indians etc, last longer and cause more violence etc than they do among the white population.

If whites get high and don't go and smash up malls and other people is that a problem?

Blogger Cinco July 09, 2016 3:44 PM  

@126

Not in this case, in fact it is the opposite. Police must collect evidence in order to justify arresting people and enable prosecutions. Cell phone video is evidence. When you record the police arresting someone whether they are resisting or not, you are creating evidence. Even if you didn't record an arrest with your phone, the police can collect your personal information in order to call you as a witness for the prosecution. I don't like that they can confiscate our phones, but I do understand why they do.

I also agree that by and large the police are being militarized. I don't like that either. I agree with our host that the police need to go back to the days of being polite and more of a presence than an actor.

While I think that 4GW theory as put forth by Lind does make the assumption of equality with regards to the moral war, he does have a point. What may work with the black community with regards to the moral war will definitely not work with the Muslim community.

Anonymous A.B. Prosper July 09, 2016 3:48 PM  

Raggededge wrote:Sky's blue. Water's wet. Cities make people stupid.

Cities make people dependent on social services. When city folk see these services break down, they get scared. And, scared people make great boot lickers.


True but without cities you can't have a large population. In the past you really couldn't have technological innovation either though modern technology does allow better communications.

Its nearly to the point that the majority of humanity lives in cities, its a disaster waiting to happen but its unavoidable.

Also re: everyone turning in the cops. There is some truth to that. A lot of the US "rebel" class mostly White, militia sympathetic, very conservative are saying stuff like N.W.A. was right or far more militant thing. The loss of that demographic is an extreme list for loss of police legitimacy because this leaves only the "safe" class which is tiny and the shrinking middle. Its too few to support the system for a lot longer.

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 3:54 PM  

Because this was really necessary - prevalence of a militant/hostile attitude and policies -

https://youtu.be/Fa1lGOHEgN4

And this just but one of many examples across the USSA.

It's not just the Blacks. It is just that the Blacks have the cajones to speak up. Also, it is big mistake to just focus on the cop on Black shootings. It is also all the "minor" things, like harassment, that build up a crescendo.

Blogger Chris Mallory July 09, 2016 3:56 PM  

@121 It isn't about equality or race at all. It is because Tyrone is in public where the cop driving by in his car can see him. Bubba in his single wide or in his own back yard or in the cow pasture isn't going to attract the same attention from law enforcement.

Say Tyrone and Bubba both have a couple ounces of pot. Building the case against Tyrone takes one or two man hours because like a dumbass he is walking down the street with it in his pocket. To make the case against Bubba takes 40 man hours because he took it home in his lunch box and smoked it behind closed doors and only sells it to family and close friends.

Blogger Cinco July 09, 2016 4:03 PM  

@132

I agree completely. About 4 months ago I got stopped at a random license inspection point and gave the cop a piece of my mind. Random license inspection... I live in a rural area that is 98% white too, we have a negative crime rate. People give stuff away more than they steal.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 4:04 PM  

@132

The logical outcome of upper IQ limits in a profession.

Anonymous Jack Amok July 09, 2016 4:04 PM  

Cell phone video is evidence

It is also propaganda. This is one area where police have shown some comprehension of the whole 4GW thing. They don't want their opponents to have video footage of their behavior to use in 4GW war against them. But they only partially get it because they resort to 1-3GW tactics to prevent it.

But even if they are just thinking of it as "evidence", confiscating cell phones from innocent bystanders is abso-fucking-lootly militarization of the police - in thought and attitude. Militarization as in thinking like an occupying military force rather than as fellow citizens dealing with the occasional criminal. Confiscating personal property of innocent bystanders? Yeah, sure, you can justify it as "evidence" but the attitude that says the cop is entitled to take someone's cell phone? The think I use to stay in touch with my friends, family, coworkers and business contacts? The thing with not just the video footage of Officer Friendly arresting Suspect #1, but also the video footage of my kid's birthday party?

Joe Cop's going to just take that? Because he needs it more than I do? And he's got a badge so it's okay? And if I say "no" he's justified in detaining me? That's not the attitude a fellow citizen takes with me. That's the attitude an occupying soldier does.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 4:11 PM  

@129 - Then arrest them for smashing malls or other violence or property crimes.

The utter stupidity and idiocracy is that possessing a small amount of a substance has a minimum sentence, but there is no minimum sentence for destroying property, theft or robbery, rape or murder.

Real, actual, destructive crimes of property and violence can be bargained down and suspended, but a tiny amount of drugs in a voluntary transaction is treated as some kind of monstrous crime.

I'd rather have no laws except for fraud, property, and violence, but have them enforced vigorously than have millions of trivial laws regulating every stupid or silly aspect of my life enforced randomly.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash July 09, 2016 4:13 PM  

tz wrote:They don't do the just barely legal entrapment in the rich white high-school parking lots, though they would catch a lot.
Way back in the 1970s, I got to watch a drug deal go down. In the school library. In a nice White, upper-middle-class town.
One of the participants slipped up enough to let me and a couple of other people see inside the briefcase full of cash. My estimate at the time was about $30k.
Neither of the parcitipants to this day has ever been arrested, although I did hear that one of them overdosed on angel dust, personally met and talked to God, and is now a Mormon Bishop.

Anonymous LastRedoubt July 09, 2016 4:14 PM  

"De-escalation"

I first came across that concept at Marc MacYoung's "no nonsense self defense" site.

While he does provide pointers for good martial arts, gun training, and where to get info on relevant laws, most of the site is dedicated to the psychology of crime, recognizing crime, and factors that escalate violence. Mostly, how importantly guides on when and how to escalate, and more often, de-escalate.

It seems that most departments aren't getting training on that these days.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents July 09, 2016 4:15 PM  

Cell phones are old technology compared to some form of Google glasses, bodycams, recording systems concealed in objects, etc. Confiscating phones is not just obnoxious, not just stupid, it’s already pointless and will become moreso.
A bodycam vid with audio of Joe Cop getting all up in someone’s grill about their cellphone, that’ll look good in 4 GW terms, yeah?

Cripes, the Minnesota shooting was livestreamed, taking her phone away would accomplish nothing at that point except give the impression of cops tampering with evidence.

We live under someone’s video at all times in public. That’s reality.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 4:17 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 4:24 PM  

Lind suggests himself that engagement 4GW is a reversion to pre-state conditions. The states monopoly on power is itself the target. That loss of monopoly is going to render the state in a hopelessly out of reach place as an organizational force. Both Tainter and Orlov give good reasons as to why this means we'll be facing a world that lacks the ability to organize human behavior.

I don't how I can be a proponent for civilization without being chained to the dead man that is the State. I don't see how the devolution to 4GW in the way that we are seeing is anything less than an extinction level event for civilization. I don't see how to convert a 2GW monopoly of power system of governance into a 4GW model, or what government looks like thereafter.

Again, I think Tainter would suggest that 4G "pre-state” war and civilization are antithetical.

Put in a nutshell I don't think civilizations are capable of 4GW. They either protect their citizens via a monopoly of power or they cease to exist.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 4:28 PM  

Then arrest them for smashing malls or other violence or property crimes.

Ahhh, now we are getting somewhere.

So, then what happens? Well, someone starts noticing (which is evil) that it is mostly blacks who are arrested for smashing up malls etc and starts using a bit of virtue signalling, as whites do, and claiming that the politicians are racist and should be kicked out of office.

Then, nice little old ladies, who have no experience with blacks start agreeing and holding campaign lunches and the like.

Segregation is probably the best.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 4:31 PM  

@141

Civilizations can exert power to protect themselves, but it is essential that they go about it in the right way. Rather than the state itself maintaining a centralized monopoly of force, force can be distributed among the citizens themselves. When mustering the militia or deputizing citizens, one key effect is that the decision to use force is a joint one. (The less free that citizens are to serve, the less the effect.) This gives a decision to use force far greater legitimacy than if the decision making power is solely vested in one supreme executive.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 4:35 PM  

The particulars of why our state is going to cease to exist are that we no longer govern in light to people's God-given rights nor are we allowed to discriminate between the civilized and the uncivilized. We have allowed as a people the abuse of that monopoly of force to delgitimize it, by using it outside of its righteous limitations, rendering it incapable of protecting us and keeping our peace.

I probably have misunderstood Vox and his analysis. If we can get back to a legitimate use of State power via segregation and good laws through de-escalation, I'm all for it. And I apologize for being a dumbass.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 4:38 PM  

Agree wholeheartedly Noah B.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 4:41 PM  

Looks like Obama is moving toward Vox's recommendation for having local cops trained by the FBI. Interesting times.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 4:51 PM  

I think 0bama is a 4GW actor. He's delegitimizing the State's authority with both hands, a phone and a pen.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 4:54 PM  

I think you're right, Arthur. Obama hates everything about the United States and is destroying it in any way that he can. I'm just surprised that there are still so many whites who don't see it.

Blogger Robert Divinity July 09, 2016 5:08 PM  

@145:

This corresponds with the Platonic notion that all democracy ends in tyranny, which itself only can be maintained with the projection of military force abroad and domestically. The cucks and their masters use war to distract from their more important fight against the individual. The intensity is anything but low now so your doubts about the applicability of Lind have substantial basis. The state as such already has ceased to exist because even the pretense of legitimacy has been dropped. The technology others have mentioned doesn't permit the illusion. I have grave doubts the degenerate form of government we now have can be changed electorally. There is this mass assumption that if Trump were to be elected the tyrants would permit him to hold office. Outside of some possible fear this strikes me as magical thinking. The hand would be forced and the tyrants very well may deploy their internal shock troops. Leftist rebellion is a given. Obviously I hope all that is wrong but suspect it isn't. I anticipate November with absolute dread.


This quote from Madison was prescient:

"Throughout all Europe, the armies kept up under the pretext of defending, have enslaved the people."

Exactly. Obviously post-World War II society has been militarized to enslave the American people, and you can make a sound argument the tyranny started with Lincoln or perhaps even further back to the Mexican War.

Great comment, AI.

Anonymous Gen. Kong July 09, 2016 5:21 PM  

Elder Son:
The fun has even begun yet. By the way, anyone believe all the above has anything to do with Blacks?

Tangentially. 95% or more of blacks support all of the programs linked, along with Obama, Lynch and BLM. No point in appealing to Golden dindu for it will not save YT. It wants YT dead and to take his sheit. More useless than constitutional ghost-dancing. As someone else noted, there's been a one-sided war going on for decades now. A statistically meaningless number of negroes (5% or less) have some concept of right and wrong and actually oppose the above. But, statistically meaningless percentiles are just that - not representative of the group as a whole.

Blogger Were-Puppy July 09, 2016 5:51 PM  

@35 tz
@27 - what if the ticket just blew away and you were never notified? What if you paid it but it was an error in recording?
---

There was a reality show a few years back, Parking Wars. It doesn't sound interesting, but it was. Cameras would follow around meter cops, the tow and boot trucks, and then at the impound facility.

Much like this current situation, there weren't really any good guys in it

Blogger Avalanche July 09, 2016 5:53 PM  

@25 "The racial divide makes it worse, so it ends up with Darren Wilson as the foreign occupying soldier and Michael Brown as the local civilian. Even bad actions can't fix that staging."

So? What do you suggest Wilson SHOULD have done? What could he have done differently to prevent nearly getting killed with is own gun? How could he have de-escalated things to prevent the thug from trying to grab his gun or charging at him? Should he just have paid no attention and tough luck for the shopkeeper? If Wilson and his brothers-in-blue ARE an occupying force in a war-torn area -- then what? How do they de-escalate and somehow stop the war THEY would rather not be a part of?

Blogger Were-Puppy July 09, 2016 6:00 PM  

@60 Snidely Whiplash

Fuck him, and fuck his "lawful orders".
---

Yep. We are a bunch of cows they milk for dollars with stupid made up nonsense about tail lights.

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 6:12 PM  

@Avalanche

"Tough luck for the shopkeeper" is a much more likely future outcome because of the feds' and media reaction to Ferguson. So the shopkeepers either go broke, defend themselves, or pay protection to some local goon.

Blogger Were-Puppy July 09, 2016 6:21 PM  

@109 Snidely Whiplash

So, in the particular event, is the Dallas PD. They straight-up murdered a suspect, with a bomb.
--

Pics or it didn't happen

Blogger Noah B July 09, 2016 6:24 PM  

"They straight-up murdered a suspect, with a bomb."

Well he did ask for a pizza, they just added some extra bang to the toppings.

Anonymous Gen. Kong July 09, 2016 6:32 PM  

153. Avalanche.
So? What do you suggest Wilson SHOULD have done? What could he have done differently to prevent nearly getting killed with is own gun? How could he have de-escalated things to prevent the thug from trying to grab his gun or charging at him? Should he just have paid no attention and tough luck for the shopkeeper? If Wilson and his brothers-in-blue ARE an occupying force in a war-torn area -- then what? How do they de-escalate and somehow stop the war THEY would rather not be a part of?

Wilson's problem is not that he was a thug-in-uniform but that he continued to believe in myths about the USSA, equality, rule of law, etc. Hopefully you saw the video of St. Swisher the Sweet manhandling the clerk at the convenience store. In the wake of the martyrdom of St. Trayvon of Skittles by everyone's favorite white/skinhead/hispanic/octaroon and the series of murders of whites (like 100+) in 'revenge' by dindus across the fruited plains in the months following (especially after the acquittal) - whipped by Lügenpresse, Wilson (who was alone as I recall) should have realized after hearing the dispatch that a) nobody was killed and b) the Lügenpresse and its numerous SJW allies would raise hell if yet another dindu were arrested; and c) proceeded to the nearest donut shop for refreshment. Now his police career is finished and he and/or family will very possibly be killed by some dindu or SJW hell-bent on vengeance, perhaps by agents of the regime itself. St. Swisher might be alive today, piloting a spaceship into a black hole - or (even better) a government agency into a similar place.

Yes, worse is better. It's better to allow your enemies to destroy and kill one another whenever possible. Wilson didn't understand the concept of enemies, much less greater and lesser enemies. Swisher the Sweet would have likely ended up in the big house or on a slab eventually anyway. Better he winds up there as a result of pissing off the local Gangsta Disciples than at the hands of YT. Wilson's main problem is that he was insufficiently cynical. The "law" such as it is, was not worth enforcing in that particular circumstance on that particular day. He should have avoided getting into the situation where the holy gentle giant of Fergudishu was about to grab his service weapon and turn him into a statistic. You think there would have been months worth of Lügenpresse screaming if he had? Wrong color.

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar July 09, 2016 6:37 PM  

Arthur Isaac wrote:Lind suggests himself that engagement 4GW is a reversion to pre-state conditions. The states monopoly on power is itself the target. That loss of monopoly is going to render the state in a hopelessly out of reach place as an organizational force. Both Tainter and Orlov give good reasons as to why this means we'll be facing a world that lacks the ability to organize human behavior.

I don't how I can be a proponent for civilization without being chained to the dead man that is the State. I don't see how the devolution to 4GW in the way that we are seeing is anything less than an extinction level event for civilization. I don't see how to convert a 2GW monopoly of power system of governance into a 4GW model, or what government looks like thereafter.

Again, I think Tainter would suggest that 4G "pre-state” war and civilization are antithetical.

Put in a nutshell I don't think civilizations are capable of 4GW. They either protect their citizens via a monopoly of power or they cease to exist.


This is exactly right and why the framers tried to guarantee that the monopoly of power was benefited to the citizen. First they tried to proscribe the aggrandizement of any form of power by proscribing federal limits. Many thought that this would be enough to guaranty against creeping hegemony by the state, but others rightly guessed that eventually the clarity of the founding document would degrade, and so they insisted on the Bill of Rights.

By forcing the courts to focus on the verbiage contained within 2A we have recently been successful in restoring some of our original power. The Bill of Rights is the force which ensures that the 2GW Mexican standoff will quickly transform into a 4GW hegemony of citizens.

We need more of this restoration of individual rights to qualified citizens. It is the source of our power, and what the state rightfully fears.

Blogger The Other Robot July 09, 2016 6:43 PM  

First they tried to proscribe the aggrandizement of any form of power by proscribing federal limits.

Did you just throw a few big words in there for fun?

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 6:49 PM  

We're tracking Client, but I contend that there is no such thing as a 4GW citizen. Tribesman, gang member, terrorist, revolutionary, or rebel.

The best we can hope for is that the 4GW has a glimmer of a proto-state motivating his actions. Obviously a constitutionally limited proto-state.

Blogger Arthur Isaac July 09, 2016 6:50 PM  

Client = cluebat.

Blogger Rebelfire July 09, 2016 6:53 PM  

"Most people in foreign societies share this desire. They will not welcome foreigners who increase the level of violence around them."

Except for Europe apparently. They can;t welcome violent, thieving foreigners fast enough. So, minus points for him.

The premise behind his 4GW construct, is absolutely drenched in slave morality. About the 'weaker' party being 'bullied' by the stronger. Once one realizes that you don't have to play by their rules, and adopt a more master morality point of view, then his points about 4GW become irrelevant. "Oh, some dindu's got shot because they were rioting and demolishing the neighborhood? Good. Why wasn't it done sooner?

Once one severs the paradigm of the liberal concept of good and evil, then the only paradigm that serves is group interest. And once you arrive there, threats of being called a bully, and the cries of "muh oppression" no longer hold any sway over you.

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar July 09, 2016 6:58 PM  

The Other Robot wrote:First they tried to proscribe the aggrandizement of any form of power by proscribing federal limits.

Did you just throw a few big words in there for fun?


Sorry. I don't like repeating words and try to be creative.

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar July 09, 2016 7:00 PM  

Arthur Isaac wrote:We're tracking Client, but I contend that there is no such thing as a 4GW citizen. Tribesman, gang member, terrorist, revolutionary, or rebel.

The best we can hope for is that the 4GW has a glimmer of a proto-state motivating his actions. Obviously a constitutionally limited proto-state.


Also sorry. I should have said "former citizens".

Blogger Rebelfire July 09, 2016 7:05 PM  

Gen. Kong

That's why the prudent thing to do, is take those SJW's and their vile consortium of allies, put them on theire knees in front of a trench, and fire a bullet into their skull.

No muss, no fuss.

#PhysicallyRemoveDemocrats

Anonymous BGKB July 09, 2016 7:09 PM  

The black guy who was choked and died in New York was selling cigarettes. Sell an illegal cigarette and we will kill you.

He would have lived if he was not black. Sickle Cell + obesity means they can suffocate if placed prone, they can also die in a small unpressurised plane that no one else is affected. He was arrested 30+ times, was a sex offender, and a black girl sergeant lead the team who arrested him.

agree more. I nominate Lt.Col. (Ret) Tom Kratman.

He said he wouldn't take over from the fagot Army Secratary because it would take more than 8 years to fix things.

Sky's blue. Water's wet. Cities make people stupid.

Cities have services to support stupid people. If you move into an area that a lot of people use coal to heat, you know blacks can't move in because coal heat requires a small amount of regular effort/maintenance. Rural areas are a K environment while cities an R especially when people can trade $100 of food stamps for $40 cash.

Metabolic pathways are important. The metabolism of many/most drugs is similar for the metabolism of alcohol

Cocaine and Crack are not the same drug. You can go into any gay club in Miami or DC & see someone snorting cocaine off a counter then just dancing all night. Crack can have someone strapped down to a backboard with leather restraints while making the bed bounce.

The biggest difference with blacks below the neck is their kidneys. The genes that let them resist sleeping sickness come with a 3.5x normal likelihood of renal failure. Their kidneys like to retain salt, and are more likely to get rhabdomyolysis. Groids actually sued Crossfit because they put up posters warning blacks that they were more likely to get it. If you look at your labwork you can see GFR and AA-GFR, glomerular filtration rate has to be calculated differently for blacks.

Asthma meds also don't work as well for blacks. http://medicalxpress.com/news/2016-05-asthma-african-american-children.html
"Results from the largest single study of the genetic and environmental causes of asthma in African-American children suggest that only a tiny fraction of known genetic risk factors for the disease apply to this population, raising concerns for clinicians and scientists working to stem the asthma epidemic among African-Americans. "

Oh looky here I wasn't expecting this rural and city blacks have same asthma rates, eat that ((())) http://medicalxpress.com/news/2015-04-asthma-black-youth-similarly-high.html

Blogger JohnG July 09, 2016 7:21 PM  

I'll stipulate in advance a lot of the police problems have to do 2nd and 3rd order of effects with the War on Drugs™. Tho I'd quibble a bit on the militarization of the police - I think that really started with the North Hollywood shootout with the two guys with converted AK47 variants.

I don't think Lind is the right guy to consult here. He's talking about COIN phase IV (phase III is the actually shooting part of the war) occupation strategy and extrapolating onto a police situation. But what's going on doesn't have very much to do with black people being pissed off by cops at all. It might have with BLM after Ferguson, but that lasted 30 seconds before it got coopted by Soros, Marxists and the Democrats. They're using this as a "Crisis not going to waste" to do something they don't think they'd be able to get away with otherwise and I expect that the histrionics out of the media are only going to get more shrill as time goes by. Somebody is hoping someone is going to f*ck up and hit the casus belli.

Instead of Lind here, I'd look into Eastern, African and South American Maoist/Marxist insurgencies, and how they get started - because that's whats going on here. It's always the demonisation of one group or another, pandering to another group, abuse of the demonized groups by the government or government sponsored proxies (like BLM) - we don't have the key fiscal ingredient yet (usually it's a ruined currency) but we may not need one of somebody thinks they're going to make a gun grab by force.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 7:37 PM  

Has anyone read any of Soros' books?

I've found two titles that might be interesting:
The Bubble of American Supremacy: Correcting the Misuse of American Power (PublicAffairs, 2003) ISBN 978-1-58648-217-6 (paperback; PublicAffairs, 2004; ISBN 978-1-58648-292-3)

Soros on Soros: Staying Ahead of the Curve (John Wiley, 1995) ISBN 978-0-471-12014-8 (paperback; Wiley, 1995; ISBN 978-0-471-11977-7)

Nassim Taleb had a lot of good thing to say about his...completely psychotic...ability to write off sunk costs as sunk.

Anonymous LastRedoubt July 09, 2016 7:39 PM  

Insofar as de-escalation, and how to handle things, if you're going to deal with "broken windows" and maintain civilized standards, there comes a point at which you still need to subdue, arrest, etc. someone who needs to be removed so he doesn't beat up shopkeepers and attack people. It won't always be the case where these thugs prey on their own - so we can't just leave it be to them. In the long run, if we have officer friendly, he can't just be officer "nice".

So how DO you do what must be done to preserve order and civilization while keeping the moral high ground?

I know, I know, case y case.....

But there will have to be guidance, a strategy, or set of guidelines. What works for that?

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 7:41 PM  

Noah B wrote:@Avalanche

"Tough luck for the shopkeeper" is a much more likely future outcome because of the feds' and media reaction to Ferguson. So the shopkeepers either go broke, defend themselves, or pay protection to some local goon.


If the shopkeeper had been black...this is among the problems with immigration. Though, I've read stories of weave shops being burglarized as well.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 7:43 PM  

Were-Puppy wrote:@109 Snidely Whiplash

So, in the particular event, is the Dallas PD. They straight-up murdered a suspect, with a bomb.

--

Pics or it didn't happen


Hell yeah! Conspiracy theory time: closed casket, dude is living it up back with his Tier I buds in Syria as we speak.

Anonymous BGKB July 09, 2016 7:50 PM  

It is a lot easier to bust Tyrone bebopping on the street corner than it is to arrest Bubba in his own home

Mike Vic played the race card thinking his neighbors complained to cops about the noise and admitted to having a dog fighting ring that he thought was legal to have.

Exactly. I find the assumption of equality or false equivalence

I looked up an ex boyfriend of mine that I had never meet anyone else with the same last name. Turns out page after page of people with his name doing charity work, historical societies, & awards with nothing negative about them. The name Shitavious Cook on the other hand.

a tiny amount of drugs in a voluntary transaction is treated as some kind of monstrous crime.

We need laws against drugs. In fact black leaders originally asked for crack to have higher sentences. I have passed on lorry loads of free cocaine over the years because I knew workplace drug testing was possible. Three travelers in a row got the boot in about 1 weeks time, for the same position, because the hospital actually did drug tests on its travelers.

They don't do the just barely legal entrapment in the rich white high-school parking lots, though they would catch a lot.

Any gay club in DC or Miami would catch people of all races.

So? What do you suggest Wilson SHOULD have done? What could he have done differently

Wilson actually didn't know about the robbery 10 min before, it was that fresh. They walked down the middle of the street(which helps avoid security camera evidence) & he pulled up closer to them than he would have if he knew they just robed a liquor store.

Nassim Taleb had a lot of good thing to say about his...completely psychotic...ability to write off sunk costs as sunk.

33million spent funding BLM will pay him far more in the form of jewish (((lightning))). He is an expert at making money from stabbing currencies & institutions in the back.

Anonymous fred July 09, 2016 7:50 PM  

"It is a lot easier to bust Tyrone bebopping on the street corner than it is to arrest Bubba in his own home."

Bubba doing drugs in his own home isn't really bothering anybody, unless I guess he falls asleep while smoking and burns the place down. Tyrone bopping in the street is bothering lots of people. Maybe you could ask Aisha Ring about the difference. If, of course, she were still alive.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 7:52 PM  

LastRedoubt wrote:Insofar as de-escalation, and how to handle things, if you're going to deal with "broken windows" and maintain civilized standards, there comes a point at which you still need to subdue, arrest, etc. someone who needs to be removed so he doesn't beat up shopkeepers and attack people. It won't always be the case where these thugs prey on their own - so we can't just leave it be to them. In the long run, if we have officer friendly, he can't just be officer "nice".

So how DO you do what must be done to preserve order and civilization while keeping the moral high ground?

I know, I know, case y case.....

But there will have to be guidance, a strategy, or set of guidelines. What works for that?


Look at the Moral level of the operation. Ask yourself, this guy has to come in, we have the goods on him, how do we take him down in such a way as to not irritate the neighbors and make us look bad? A beat officer knows who the dude is and his habits.

Blogger Laguna Beach Fogey July 09, 2016 7:54 PM  

Africans are Africans.

We should learn from our White brethren in Rhodesia , South West Africa, and South Africa.

Race War is upon us.

Blogger Laguna Beach Fogey July 09, 2016 7:59 PM  

How long before the police form and/or sponsor volunteer defense units and civilian paramilitary companies?

That would save a bunch of issues.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 7:59 PM  

Laguna Beach Fogey wrote:Africans are Africans.

We should learn from our White brethren in Rhodesia , South West Africa, and South Africa.

Race War is upon us.


Our Africans have 15IQ points on theirs. I've worked with Congolese, Cameroons, and Nigerians. There can be quite a behavioral difference.

Blogger BunE22 July 09, 2016 8:05 PM  

Maybe you guys are right about cops.

Here's a solution.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 8:16 PM  

BunE22 wrote:Maybe you guys are right about cops.

http://womensenews.org/2015/01/more-female-officers-defuse-violent-policing-style/

Here's a solution.


Awesome, if it were only true.

Blogger Were-Puppy July 09, 2016 8:42 PM  

@169 Rusty Fife
Has anyone read any of Soros' books?
---

You know those stories about going back in time to stop Hitler? They need one now about going back to stop Soros.

Blogger Were-Puppy July 09, 2016 8:44 PM  

Or somehow round the guy up, and deliver him to Putin.

Blogger JohnG July 09, 2016 9:04 PM  

They're not going to deescalate. They blew the guy up with a bomb on a robot (who knew they had bombs?). From here they're going to try to go Dredd.

Blogger Rusty Fife July 09, 2016 9:12 PM  

Were-Puppy wrote:@169 Rusty Fife

Has anyone read any of Soros' books?

---

You know those stories about going back in time to stop Hitler? They need one now about going back to stop Soros.


Know your enemy.

Blogger Were-Puppy July 09, 2016 9:13 PM  

@180 BunE22

There are problems with that

http://crime.about.com/od/current/a/brian_nichols.htm

"On March 11, 2005, Nichols was on trial for rape at the Fulton County Courthouse in Atlanta when he overpowered a female deputy, took her gun, and went into the courtroom where he trial was being held and shot the judge and a court reporter. Nichols is also charged with killing a sheriff's deputy who tried to stop his escape from the courthouse and shooting a federal agent at his home a few miles from the courthouse."

Blogger dfordoom July 09, 2016 9:14 PM  

@ Snidely Whiplash

What on earth gives an officer the right to give me any orders at all?

When you believe that the job of the police is to give orders to free citizens then you've adopted a slave mentality.

And there's one thing you can count on - once the police believe they have the right to give free citizens orders then those orders will become more and more petty.

Blogger Stephen July 09, 2016 9:15 PM  

The Dindus where much less of a crime problem when America was more racist. The first half of the century may of been before the invention of kevlar etc so they those "professional uniforms" but let that give you the impression they were soft, any BLM type protest would be broken up by fire hose and baton immediately. In the 19th century protests were broken up by cavalry charges armed with sharp weapons. 4GW is a thing because governments have gotten softer not harder. Resisting arrest has always led to escalation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBp2w8r17AE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeNIdbaV29I

Anonymous Eric the Red July 09, 2016 9:27 PM  

How much money is going to be stolen today due to someone's Ideal Fantasy about equality?

How many will be jailed today because of someone's Wonderful Vision about eradicating hate speech?

How many will lose their jobs today due to someone's Beautiful Ideal of PC?

How many are going to die today because of someone's Perfect Dream of a non-racial society?

When will the dreaming stop, and reality set it?

Segregation is the only moral solution.

Blogger John rockwell July 09, 2016 9:49 PM  

One shouldn't side with the underdog because he is an underdog only if he is a rightist dog regardless of power.

Satan and his minions are the underdog which in no way means that one should have sympathy for them.

Blogger Elder Son July 09, 2016 9:54 PM  

@184 Said the same on my blog. Not only is it going to happen, the process in that direction has been baby-stepping for years.

*******

Anyhow, let’s stop fantasizing here and face frikkin REALITY. You can play the “individual cop” angle until your face turns blue while ignoring the institutionalizing of the growing military industrial complex into the government “Law Enforcement” SYSTEM. And that gets you exactly where?

You can deny it all you want, but the direction of “Law Enforcement” is very clear. When this is fully implemented, the Strong Cities Initiative, I will not be holding my breath to hear that giant sucking sound of empty “Law Enforcement” barracks.

And wait until all those old fart police officers are retired, and your “Law Enforcement” is captured by a majority of Millennials, who only know, what they know, in the environment, that they have grown up in. Baby-stepping and birthing into totalitarianism, and you “old farts” are not exactly innocent. You are but a step in the process. A part of the birthing process. Who do you THINK are the foot soldiers? Or, is it that the cognitive dissonance is to great? Spit in their faces, and they call it dew.

It just amazes how even the so-called "conservatives" are played.

Blogger LP9 Solidified in Gold! Rin Integra July 09, 2016 11:04 PM  

Mystified, upset and emotional? What?!

ZFG on feelings or peelings, we dont have time for feelings or emoting, none. We have time for history, an understanding of the current times and to be aware of the times to follow while remaining unafraid and unfazed.

It must be a memory reading comp fail for some, Vox, Lind and others online have had concerns, predictions, but have hoped., prayed such events would not happen but its inevitable.

BLM has to BLM to ruin or try to wreck summer. I miss 2011 or 2010's summertime debt theater.

Thank you to everyone at CH, Lind, Crevald and all the man wargaming the untenable that just became the norm stateside.

Blogger Avalanche July 09, 2016 11:40 PM  

@112 " 14% of blacks use drugs, about the same as whites"

Except that is "self-reported" drug use -- and it's not accurate! There was a study of (I think it was) a new heart med, and as part of the protocol, they ASKED the patients if they were using recreational drugs. (Because drug interactions / drug use could interfere with the actual drug testing results.)

Also, they regularly drew blood to track the serum levels of the new drug. And DESPITE the patients KNOWING for sure that they were going to be subject to blood testing during the trial -- the blacks still lied through their as... uh, cardiac systems!

BOTH races insisted they used drugs at some lower rate (it may been have been only 14%) -- but the black patients' blood testing showed between 60% and 80% of them WERE using drugs!

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 11:50 PM  

@171 - Lind's 4GW handbook has the answer. There is a "SWAT" team that surgically and correctly (with stakeouts so they get the right house and right person) takes out the bad actor, then disappears into the background. In such places, it is likely everyone knows and hates a vandal or robber and will celebrate his removal, even if not openly.

Note that Minnesota was a "robbery suspect" and it is extremely unlikely that the assassinated man was the robber. Even here, if it wasn't a "busted tail light" it should have been a felony stop from the beginning.

@154 - If I tell you to empty a pool with a sieve, and train, and even laud and praise you, do you remain in a futile job? And that isn't even a dangerous one. Others have pointed out Wilson didn't know. He was there to give out another ticket. I have ZERO respect for any cop who participates in the traffic ticket taxation. Wilson was therefore a bad cop. He should have found an honest job. If the powers that be insist on escalation, then he should quit and move where they don't, or he agrees with the situation and is a guilty participant.

TL;DR - Wilson should have quit or moved to an honest (police) job years before the encounter.

It is like asking what the Sunni in Iraq should do about the abusive Shia in Baghdad. If you find yourself in a war zone, and have the option not to be a soldier on either side, you should avoid being one at all costs.

The black gang and blue gang were at war, Wilson decided he wanted to be a soldier in the blue army (with all the patriotic rah-rah stuff).

@145 - That is the trick. A Civilization needs to preserve itself in a way they do not themselves become barbaric. Once they cross the line, the barrier is down and it will rebound on them.

@144 - That won't be less insane and stupid than what we are doing now, except it might be more easily fought.

@143 with federalism and subsidiarity and a SMALL central government that leaves the factions alone, you can keep civilization going a lot longer than when you insist it has to follow some comprehensive and specific set of rules like Sharia. The Constitution limited the Feds, and said little about the conduct of ordinary citizens (copyright, piracy, treason were exceptions). Micromanagement is futile and will destroy the legitimacy of a state faster than anything else as no one CAN enforce all the minutiae, so everyone becomes a law-breaker (think the 55MPH speed limit) and it trickles up from the arbitrary regulation to the crime against nature.

Blogger tz July 09, 2016 11:55 PM  

@193 - Rush Limbaugh abused Oxycontin, Larry Kudlow abused Cocaine. That doesn't begin to talk about "prescription" big Pharma drug use.

I had a black friend that got off a Type 2 diabetic drug when I explained how to eat low-carb.

The Tuskeege STD experiment is being repeated with obesity - eat more "whole grains", fewer calories, and when you get sick Big Pharma will have a pill you will need for the rest of your life that Obamacare will pay for (Or Bush's Medicare Part D).

Blogger tz July 10, 2016 12:02 AM  

Cops are paramilitary death squads
And that's the problem.

Blogger Were-Puppy July 10, 2016 12:35 AM  

that website has a ton of examples

Anonymous Jack Amok July 10, 2016 12:48 AM  

So? What do you suggest Wilson SHOULD have done?

It's not what Wilson should have done, it's what all the other cops out hassling middle-class white folks should have done. People keep getting caught up in the BLM/dindu crap. That's not it. If all that was going on was your garden variety chimp outs, folks like us would be shrugging our shoulders and saying that's the way things go.

But we're not. Why?

Because guys like us - regular, non-criminal, tax-paying men trying to make a life worth living - have had enough negative interactions with Law Enforcement Officers to have - maybe not sympathy, but at least empathy - for the Dindus. That Cop "I'm in control here, obey my lawful orders" attitude grates on me, and I've got long time preferences and decent emotional control. I can completely understand how that attitude could flip the switch on someone else, and the attitude is unneeded.

Unwanted. Unhelpful. Uncivilized.

And it's coming from people who are supposed to be the guardians of... well, something. But it's part of the Occupation Force mentality, and until we stop accepting - hell, encouraging - it in our police, this problem is going to get worse and worse and worse.


Blogger BunE22 July 10, 2016 2:09 AM  

@186 I was just needling you guys. I was searching for statistics on police violence and that was one of the links that came up.

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