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Monday, August 15, 2016

Debunking Snopes

A number of people have referred to the Snopes "debunking" of the Hiroshima-Detroit comparison, failing to realize that a) it doesn't address blacks at all, and, b) I wrote my post in the first place because the supposed debunking was so feeble.

Here is an accurate summary of the Snopes argument.

1. The picture is not of modern-day Hiroshima.

the next image in the set supposedly depicts modern-day Hiroshima — except that it doesn't. It's actually a snapshot taken from the Landmark Tower Sky Garden in Yokohama, Japan

That's true of the pictures to which Snopes was referring. It's not true of the pictures I used, which one can see is clearly of past and present Hiroshima. Furthermore, Hiroshima is in very good shape today, as Snopes itself admits. One down.

2. The picture of modern Detroit is only of one building.

the thing to note about the use of this image to portray Detroit as a locus of Hiroshima-like devastation is that all we actually see is one long-abandoned, crumbling building. It doesn't make the case.

That one picture doesn't conclusively prove the case, but it correctly demonstrates the actual case intended. Detroit's population is now 36.7 percent of its 1950s peak and is now 83 percent black. 95 percent of the whites who resided there in 1950 have left. The city filed for bankruptcy in 2013. "aerial photos reveal the tiny urban island that is left - a clutter of high-rises surrounded by empty housing plots now covered in grass." Two down.

3. The picture of Navin Field is from the 1930s, not the 1940s.

Lastly, we're shown a photo supposedly depicting Detroit in its mid-1940s heyday — except that it was taken in the mid-1930s

So what? That only makes it that much more clear how advanced Detroit was, and how far Detroit has fallen since. This is petty pedantry, as the relevant point is still demonstrated. Three down.

4. It was the Democrats fault, but it wasn't only their fault.

Did Democrats and Democratic policies play some role in the fall of Detroit? Surely they did. Every Detroit mayor since 1962 has been a Democrat, after all. But Republicans held the seat for the 12 years prior to that, from 1950 through 1961. The Packard plant whose hollowed-out remains were displayed above closed its doors during that time. Whatever blame is to be allotted to politicians must be shared by both Democrats and Republicans on the national level, as well.

Here is a tip: when you admit that the case being made is correct, even in part, it is not a debunking. Four down. There is not one single effective point that was made in this so-called "debunking".

The ironic thing about those responding to my modified Detroit-Hiroshima comparison with "Snopes says" is that I rebutted the cuckservative "Democrat policies" explanation for the difference between the two cities more effectively than Snopes did by pointing out that if Democrats are responsible for the decline of Detroit, Hiroshima should be even worse, because it was ruled by Socialists for most of the latter half of the 20th century.

Are there other factors that have contributed to the decline of Detroit beyond the fact that 478,112 blacks moved into the city between 1900 and 1960? Certainly. But that doesn't change the fact that if a city has a choice between being hit by an atomic bomb or acquiring 774,485 new black residents, the available evidence strongly indicates that the former will prove vastly preferable to the latter in the long term.

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167 Comments:

Anonymous The Ramones August 15, 2016 8:07 AM  

You may have seen this already, but if not, take a look at the before-and-after pictures of the Mark Twain Library in Detroit (sorry, I don't have a link handy.) It was famously said that the place was completely looted (by the citizens of Hiroshima, presumably), and that everything of value was stolen... except the books.

You have to see it to believe it.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 8:16 AM  

My god, will the Ministry of Truth's people at Snopes give it a rest?

Is it not obvious to them that their increasingly shrill, manic attempts to enforce The Approved Narrative Dogma on today's rapidly multiplying appearances of reality makes them look like Whack-a-mole addicts (and zealots whose connection to reality dwindles rapidly?)

Blogger James Dixon August 15, 2016 8:16 AM  

It's become obvious that Snopes no longer even pretends to be unbiased. As such, they now join the MSM in the long slide toward irrelevance.

Anonymous johnc August 15, 2016 8:29 AM  

"That super-awesome photograph is actually of Yokohama, not Hiroshima. nyah, nyah!"

Seriously, are these people drooling idiots? Yokohama, like most major Japanese cities, was completely wiped off the map in the Pacific War. Thanks for proving the point twice-over.

I am curious about Japanese "socialism" though. Is this Marxist socialism from the USSR or is this more similar to the ancient nation-state idea of the people taking care of their small percentage of poor, helpless, and elderly people through basic government mechanisms? Because even the West had the latter tradition well before Marx sprung on the scene.

Oh and never forget that Democrats caused the destruction of both Detroit and Hiroshima. They're not to be trusted with power. Ever.

Blogger Shimshon August 15, 2016 8:32 AM  

You have just single-handedly raised the bar on cruel artistry (or is that artistic cruelty) to new heights? I shed a single tear in your honor.

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 8:33 AM  

I am curious about Japanese "socialism" though. Is this Marxist socialism from the USSR.

Yes, ideologically, although in practice it is much tempered by Japanese characteristics, just as the Liberal Democratic Party is neither liberal nor democratic by historical Western standards.

Anonymous Darth Wheatley #2415 August 15, 2016 8:34 AM  

The Ramones wrote:You may have seen this already, but if not, take a look at the before-and-after pictures of the Mark Twain Library in Detroit (sorry, I don't have a link handy.) It was famously said that the place was completely looted (by the citizens of Hiroshima, presumably), and that everything of value was stolen... except the books.

You have to see it to believe it.



There's a bit more to it than that... yes, the place was trashed, but not before the city had pretty much given up on it due to structural and asbestos damage. Any abandoned building is going to get messed up, especially if it has holes in the roof.

Not saying the neighborhood was innocent, just that it being abandoned in the first place wasn't solely their fault.

More info here:
http://www.detroiturbex.com/content/parksandrec/twain/

Anonymous Dinner for Cucks August 15, 2016 8:35 AM  

All this cultural enrichment is the North's reward for "winning" the Civil War.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan August 15, 2016 8:36 AM  

The tv show "Rehab Addict" is basically centered on Detroit and as I joke with the wife tha the young lady corals the last white people left in Detroit work on her houses and to visit the open houses once they are done.

Blogger Jim Carroll August 15, 2016 8:39 AM  

I've been thinking about how effective using Hiroshima is against the "Democrat policy" as a major cause. I suppose if you limit the "Democrat policy" to the welfare, then it's a fair comparison. But leftism policy goes way beyond that.

As Stefan points out in his latest video on Milwaukee, this is what happens when you tell a community, over and over, year after year, that all of their problems are not their fault but the fault of a set of cabalistic oppressors constantly plotting their downfall. How could this not be classic case of "enablement?" You've handed them a scapegoat for their own behavior and you create an air of hatred and despair.

Stefan points out that prior to the "Great Society" (which happens to correspond generally with the Civil Rights Act), the IQ gap between blacks and whites was narrowing and the income gap was narrowing rapidly. This halted with the close of the '60s.

Note: I didn't check his references yet, and again, I'm looking for opinions and references, not assuming this can't be countered.

Anonymous The Ramones August 15, 2016 8:46 AM  

"I am curious about Japanese "socialism" though"

Part of it stems from a Japanese concept called kokutai, which is sort of a sense of national awareness, the idea that all the Japanese share the quality of all being Japanese. Used to be a fairly wide-spread concept throughout the world, until, (((well)))..... Not sure of the extent to which it's come under the influence of ideological socialism. Don't they have basically sort of an institutional ruling party that pretty much governs all the time?

"but not before the city had pretty much given up on it due to structural and asbestos damage"

Well, if you value something beautiful and useful, then you make the investment to repair the damage. If, for some weird reason that usually seems to have the number 83 in it, you don't value a beautiful library, this is a judgment and a reflection of what you do value.

Anonymous Faceless August 15, 2016 8:48 AM  

#2 Modern Day Detroit

It is absolutely an appropriate and true picture.

Mayor Dave Bing, the closest Detroit has had to a good mayor in some time, systematically tried to shut down these neighborhoods where there was one house with electric and plumbing on a block. He was stymied at every opportunity by the entrenched power of the Conyers family and their allies.

I can tell you - Sinbad's on the River - the area around it looks exactly like the war zone of your picture.

I can tell you - drive to Seven Mile and McNichols - the area around it looks exactly like the war zone of your picture.

I can tell you - drive to Harpo's - the area around it looks exactly like the war zone of your picture.

There are about six good neighborhoods left (Gilbert's area in Downtown, GM riverfront, Cork Town, Mexican Town isn't bad, the Rosa Parks neighborhood, New Center around Wayne State, and near Harper Woods comes to mind), probably 10 square miles of the 140 square miles of Detroit. The rest is very rough and tumble.

Blogger Robert What? August 15, 2016 8:50 AM  

I realized a couple of years ago that Snopes cannot be trusted. It is too bad that they sacrificed a formerly sterling reputation to become (at least part time) DNC shills.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan August 15, 2016 8:52 AM  

#10 if you hold the notion that the Left is the feminine mind then it makes sense, no one crueler than a woman "who just wants to be friends", "yes you look great with blue and pink hair."

So when some fringe element of the D party has a moment the "nice and respectable" white liberals can stand there and go "we must do something" as if that virtue signaling places them at the Last Supper of present day politics.

Blogger rumpole5 August 15, 2016 8:53 AM  

In contrast to Detroit, the many cities in the USA are in much better physical shape than in the 1950s. I just finished a vacation, visiting Carmel, and the Elkhart/Goshen areas of Indiana. These areas are well known to me from my high school and college days, and they are all much more SWPL than they were. Beautifully landscaped parks, athletic facilities, long shady biking trails, refurbished little downtown areas, traffic circles, rivers with clear waters...and so on. Elkhart/Goshen, especially, was formerly a grim rust belt industrial/farming area where everything was painted brown, and where the snow turned gray with coal dust within a day of falling. Charles Murray's book "Coming Apart" describes the huge gulf that is developing between the underclass areas and the rest of America, and after my vacation, I agree.

Anonymous Faceless August 15, 2016 8:55 AM  

#3 It was a beautiful city.

Detroit was a beautiful city.

Pictures of Hudson's from the 1950s still can make one hazy with feeling of remorse for what was lost. Now, it is a parking garage. One could buy every nice thing in a ten-story department store. The echo of the lost culture of Detroit lives on in the rest of Michigan. If you tour Southeast Michigan's diners, look for a Maurice Salad - a signature dish of Hudson's, long forgotten.

To assert it was from the 1930s makes it less fabulous. The city was beautiful until it was destroyed, first with the riots, then with Cole Man Young.

#4

The people who could left, and, yes, they were mostly white, and yes, they have built other places that are all nice - Brighton, South Lyon, Holly, Lake Orion, Bloomfield Hills - and, yes, the money that went into those communities would have gone into Detroit, but, again, the Democrats of Detroit - and, let's be clear, it was Cole Man Young and his friends like Vibe Magazine - drove the white people and the middle class people out. Cole Man Young said he'd be happier if the city was poorer so long as it was black. That's what he got.

Anonymous Roundtine August 15, 2016 8:55 AM  

The Chinese would love to invest in a Detroit reclamation project.

Anonymous The Ramones August 15, 2016 9:00 AM  

"Stefan points out that prior to the "Great Society" (which happens to correspond generally with the Civil Rights Act), the IQ gap between blacks and whites was narrowing and the income gap was narrowing rapidly. This halted with the close of the '60s."

Well, the other part of the problem was that once segregation pretty much ended (at least formally), what set in was the "we all want to live with the white people" syndrome, a disease which seems to exist everywhere on the planet. Blacks who were professionals, business owners, community leaders in their own communities left, which caused a lack of cohesion and social capital. Miles Davis's dad, IIRC, was a prominent dentist in a black community. Good luck finding a dentist who lives in a housing project.

But when you consider Ralph Abernathy's absurd protest of the moon launch, basically saying "hey, don't spend that money on scientific advancement and national prestige, spend it to give us free stuff", that happened in 1969. I don't think a shift in consciousness like that could have happened in only 6 or so years, I think the mindset predates the Great Society, which simply unleashed and amplified it.

Anonymous Darth Wheatley #2415 August 15, 2016 9:02 AM  

The Ramones wrote:
Well, if you value something beautiful and useful, then you make the investment to repair the damage. If, for some weird reason that usually seems to have the number 83 in it, you don't value a beautiful library, this is a judgment and a reflection of what you do value.


Yes, the city mis-managed the whole affair, but the point I was trying to make is that the building wasn't perfectly fine before it was "looted," and there wasn't anything left of value to loot.

Specifically:
"Ms. Machie explained, back in 1997 when the building was decommissioned, everything was taken out, reassigned, or sold at a garage/book sale that was of any value. Branch librarians reviewed and selected books and were able to add to their book inventory. Ms. Machie said entering the building to retrieve materials would be hazardous…"

So the statement of it having been "looted of everything except the books" isn't correct.

Anonymous The Ramones August 15, 2016 9:08 AM  

"So the statement of it having been "looted of everything except the books" isn't correct."

I did see a photo of the place as an abandoned wreck, with the books still on the shelves, but maybe that was just one sector, and maybe the books were of a kind not worth salvaging.

Blogger Jim Carroll August 15, 2016 9:08 AM  

@18 The Ramones, You're certainly right about it being around more than 6 years. I agree with Vox; politics is downstream of culture and that includes temporally. In a pseudo-democracy like ours, legislation will eventually reflect the trends in culture. ... which personally I find terrifying.

Blogger clk August 15, 2016 9:14 AM  

The observation that I will make (and I am open to be proven wrong here -- this is not an area of expertise -- the urban planning part, not the atomic bomb part -- that I know a bit about :) )

Hiroshima was destroyed by the atomic bomb -- the atomic bomb was the cause of the destruction, and after that destruction is perhaps an urban legend that only cockroaches survived ...

Detroit, was destroyed by corporate greed, changing markets forces, free trade ...

So in this analogy its seems more correct to compare free trade, globalism and corp greed with the atomic bomb.

Blogger Phillip George August 15, 2016 9:16 AM  

Quite right Roundtine, at what point do you outsource the running of the country?
Just let the Chinese run Detroit. Government for a fraction of the tax burden. Things get built and work.

This isn't a joke.

And the irony. China is becoming a Christian nation with relatively free markets.

shame on the wholesale importers of Baal.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 9:21 AM  

I imagine myself living in a community where pretty much everyone else around me was truly sharper than me. I mean, really, truly swifter and better-able to thrive under the conditions that existed.

It would redefine demoralizing. People cannot face the notion that they are being kept as "pets" by those who differ in what they are told are "superficial" ways.

The underclass (white, black, brown) lives this. The greatest dysfunction, however, is among the blacks, because they above any group have served Progressivist Virtue-Signalers as pets...yes, PETS. When your beloved dog misbehaves you don't beat it...because you didn't really expect it to behave. You sigh, clean up the mess and take the dog out for some exercise, then try a little more positive reinforcement to coax a little better behavior out of it. Group dysfunction exhibits a 1.0 correlation with the amount of condescending "help" its members get from the Virtue Signalers (see Indians, feather not dot, for confirmation.)

To a black who sees the ghetto as home turf and the inter-gang warfare as an environment to which he's suited, the "white world" is malevolent, a place whose residents insure his failure should he be foolish enough to meet them on their terms. His nose is rubbed in the impossibility of that place every time he turns on the Boob Tube. The blacks he sees there appear successful, too, but he knows they're just white people in Black Face, no matter how much a Will Smith postures in African Ancestry. In his shoes, wouldn't you hate The Other, too?

Proximity + Diversity is a PRODUCT of virtue-signaling condescension. Leftists ooze that condescension and leave a slime trail of it everywhere they go.

Narrative Defenders like those working at Snopes have oozed so much of that condescension that they're living in a tank of it.

In my mind's eye I see garden slugs in an aquarium, wearing glasses, hammering out their rebuttals on their keyboards while unaware that the slime level has risen well above their heads and the targets of their diatribes are sitting outside the glass tank laughing at them.

Blogger ThirdMonkey August 15, 2016 9:22 AM  

According to a friend of mine who lives in East Lansing, Detroit is a great place to go pheasant hunting. All of the abandoned, razed lots are proving to be pretty good habitat for them. And since the few residents left are accustomed to living in a war zone, the gunfire does not elicit a call to Detroit's finest.

I for one would rather see an increase in pheasant habitat over the current "wildlife" that inhabits Detroit. Phase Two should include converting Dearborn into a wild hog sanctuary.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 9:23 AM  

at what point do you outsource the running of the country?
Why outsource it? I thought the Clinton Foundation was already explicitly a Craigs List for selling off the running of the country to the wealthy people and corrupt nation-states of the world?

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 9:23 AM  

Detroit, was destroyed by corporate greed, changing markets forces, free trade ...

Are you willing to assert that importing 775,000 blacks to a formerly all-white city will have significantly different results than Detroit?

Blogger Zaklog the Great August 15, 2016 9:26 AM  

Vox, any comments on the current state of the American presidential election?

Blogger Shimshon August 15, 2016 9:28 AM  

The difference between 1945 Israel and 2015 Israel is incredible. There is construction everywhere. Even the boondoggles (*cough* Jerusalem light rail *cough*) are pretty good in execution.

Re Detroit, Karen de Coster loves the city and its spirit. I hear the suburbs can be quite nice too.

Anonymous Roundtine August 15, 2016 9:32 AM  

Just let the Chinese run Detroit.

They might take it over, but they'd also be happy to invest in a white-run reclamation project. They would never ask about social policy, only the ROI.

Anonymous Rick Johnsmeyer August 15, 2016 9:32 AM  

From my observations/readings over the years, the collapse of cities like Detroit (or areas within cities, even if the entire city didn't disintegrate) followed a template along these lines:

1. Uneducated agrarian southern blacks relocated to urban areas (often up north) to take menial factory jobs being produced in large numbers by the factory revolution of the early twentieth century. These jobs, at the low end, did not require much else than endurance and labor.

2. This arrangement, while not as smooth as is recalled today (remember, there were race-riots in Detroit before the 60's, too), had a stability to it. Uneducated blacks were too exhausted by long days at the factory to make much trouble in the streets, had enough walking-around money from their jobs to be materially-satisfied, and were surrounded by others in the same position.

We tend to forget the jump in urban/ghetto crime right after World War II, when many factory workers were temporarily let go/reassigned. Look up the "Paseo Massacre" in Kansas City in 1948 for an example of ghetto thuggery from that era.

3. The lowest-skilled jobs began to vanish by the 50's, during the first wave of modern factory automation and efficiency gains. This precipitated the crisis. Black crime and dysfunction rates actually began to rise gradually during this time, before LBJ's mid-60's "Great Society" programs.

The Great Society was in fact sold as a response TO rising black disorder. The Moynihan report came out concurrently with Great Society proposals, and was intended to figure out how to stem the increasing levels of joblessness and family collapse in black America.

That was a function of the loss of truly unskilled factory jobs, which unleashed uneducated blacks into the streets.

So while LBJ's proposals hardly helped, they were a lagging indicator rather than a primary cause of the chaos.

Blogger Matthew McDaniel August 15, 2016 9:34 AM  

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/41/7d/43/417d43f9c0063b33c81d70913f9331c2.jpg

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 9:34 AM  

The example of Cuba worries me.
Relatively Spanish Castro was happy to be king of a rapidly impoverished backwater whose population got more African with every turn of the calendar. Black "leaders" seem perfectly happy to rule dysfunctional little fiefdoms even if the smarter among them still prefer to golf with their predominantly white backers, lobbyists, lawyers and accountants.

The Left's leading "lights" are not bothered to see the USA's median living standard collapse as long as they get to be kings of what's left. Maybe that's the real origin of the terms Right and Left.

The Right is...right...while the Left is satisfied with what's left.

Snopes' little garden slugs give each other High Fives in joy every time they condescension-slime the troubling emergence of Truth somewhere, and as long as they're princelings in their little Virtue Signal Aquarium, they really don't care if the rest of the world burns (See BLM & Milwaukee...but try Brietbart, not the condescension-virtue-sliming MSM.)

Anonymous Roundtine August 15, 2016 9:35 AM  

Are you willing to assert that importing 775,000 blacks to a formerly all-white city will have significantly different results than Detroit?

Seattle is more leftist than Detroit and Boeing is shedding jobs. Lots of Internet companies are moving in and expanding now. Why are they moving to Seattle when they could move to less left-wing Detroit, where real estate is far cheaper?

Blogger ThirdMonkey August 15, 2016 9:36 AM  

@27 VD

Are there any instances in which an increase in a community's black population has improved its standard of living? At best, a majority black population struggles to maintain the status quo. Detroit took a downhill slope when the trifecta of free trade, unions, and democrat politics kicked in. A high percentage black population only added fuel to the fire and accelerated the decline. Stupidity will kill you eventually, but black stupidity will kill you in a gas station fire in the middle of a riot.

Blogger Phillip George August 15, 2016 9:39 AM  

http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/christopher-biggins-and-the-fall-of-civilisation

James Delingpole, who is always right about everything, and does a remarkably good job covering Big Climate Crime Syndicates, aka Government, has just cited your book Vox.

the circle is growing.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 9:40 AM  

Not every city with a large black contingent (and black politicians or those who cater to the blacks) looks like Hamburg in December of 1945.

Appearances can be deceiving. Bullet holes in the walls of buildings don't show up in aerial photographs. A city with a large black underclass should get points for per-capita violent crime, too. By that metric, Detroit has lots and lots of erstwhile competitors.

As the period of declining violent crime between 1990(ish) and a few years ago fades into memory, one won't need the census or even aerial photos to identify places with high percentages of blacks. All you'll need is the CDC's Mortality and Morbidity Report.

Blogger SteelPalm August 15, 2016 9:49 AM  

@10

Yeah, I don't buy Stefan's argument that the black population was somehow magically integrating into white society successfully (something it had woefully failed to do for 100 years) until LBJ destroyed it all with the Great Society.

Now sure, LBJ was awful, and Civil Rights Act made matters much worse. No one is arguing the obvious there.

But read any news source or contemporary account from the 60s and you will see that the levels of crime, ignorance, tribalism, and overwhelming hatred for whitey sounds achingly familiar. That part hasn't changed, whether it was 1865, 1915, 1965, or 2015.

And Detroit was already on the decline well before LBJ enacted anything.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 9:50 AM  

As discussed by Steve Sailor, relatively liberal welfare payments have a lot to do with what cities are the most dysfunctional.
http://www.vdare.com/posts/tnr-the-unelectable-whiteness-of-scott-walker-nature-and-nurture-in-wisconsin

This reemphasizes how rapidly things can change if the rules are simply tweaked. Utterly eliminate the ability of Visa-Over-stayers and other illegal invaders to obtain any government-provided benefits and watch several million people leave during the next month.

Eliminate the "look the other way" ability for people illegally in the country to obtain above-board jobs and watch another couple million go home.

Once we get there, I imagine sentiment might finally support putting a $10,000 bounty on the heads of anyone who committed a violent crime and was later deported, only to show back up inside the USA. Serial criminals from Central America would disappear overnight. Bada-bing, bada-boom.

To those who say, "What's done is done, we can't change it now," I want to say, "Turn your head a little, I want to see if I can ram this reality into your ear and make it come out the other side."

Anonymous Bobby Farr August 15, 2016 9:53 AM  

Let the blacks wander among the ruins of America's abandoned industrial towns the way deer and squirrels live among abandoned Colorado mining towns. There are about 100 million foreigners to deport before anyone has the luxury of even hoping to take action to address the low and declining quality of America's native ethnic groups.

OpenID basementhomebrewer August 15, 2016 9:56 AM  

This is petty pedantry, as the relevant point is still demonstrated. Three down.

This has been Snopes MO for at least 4 years. They built up their credibility debunking non-political internet rumors. Starting about 4 years ago I noticed they started addressing political issues and almost every time they focus on 1 spergy detail and since it isn't correct the whole story is deemed to be a hoax. The site is no longer relevant.

Blogger Cash August 15, 2016 9:56 AM  

Detroit's MSA area is still big and growing. Thus the whole "free trade destroyed Detroit" argument is crap. The people still have jobs they just moved out of reach from all the black people.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan August 15, 2016 10:05 AM  

Revolutionary politics is in part finally stating the obvious, so, Who believes the narrative anymore?

Trump could stand up there say those 5 words and the narrative collapse will begin.

Blogger Ron August 15, 2016 10:07 AM  

The problem is not blacks, at least not in the sense of lower ability. The problem is lack of prayer.

When someone has less ability than another he gets jealous and insecure. When insecure, he gets frightened, at that point the mind usually turns to envy and hate. From there the person begins to thieve and destroy. That's what happened to detroit

HOWEVER. If that individual turns to God, that is, talks directly to God about his insecurities and needs, and makes it a focus of his life to use the insecurity as a means of reaching to God, as reason to speak to God, rather than speaking to God in order to undo the envy and fear, use the envy and fear as a means of reaching out to God, then that person will not tear apart his brother.

This was a failure of belief and culture, not of genetics.

Had the dominant culture in Detroit made a point of turning directly to God in prayer instead of turning to materialism, it would have been a different story.

If instead of getting up and running, the more capable people had gotten together and said "look, this isn't working. Let's start changing our attitude, maybe we are also not looking at this correctly. We have all this blessing, let's focus on encouraging the public to reach out to God. Let's focus on protecting each other's rights, on encouraging each other to succeed", then maybe things would have been different.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan August 15, 2016 10:16 AM  

Earth to Ron, come in Ron. The blacks of Detroit voted for Coleman Young a racialist politician who delivered a nearly white free Detroit

Anonymous WinstonWebb August 15, 2016 10:17 AM  

That's ridiculous, Ron. There are plenty of low-IQ devout. Religious focus does not make them smarter or less envious. In fact, I would argue that it makes them more susceptible to being useful idiots.
See: followers of Jackson, Rev. Jesse; Sharpton, Rev. Al

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 10:18 AM  

The problem is not blacks, at least not in the sense of lower ability. The problem is lack of prayer.

Stop cucking, Ron. The answer to low IQ and short-time preferences is not Jesus. He is the answer to a very different problem, that of sin.

Sin is not the issue here. Capability is.

Blogger Whisker biscuit August 15, 2016 10:27 AM  

OT, but the Hollywood obsession with "strong" female leads, especially she-boons, just got a little more silly.

I just saw one for the amazing she-rilla that put all the male honky NASA mathematicians to shame during the Apollo missions. I didn't stick around to get the title, but I saw Kevin Costner cucking around in it. Blah.

Blogger Ron August 15, 2016 10:30 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Anonymous WinstonWebb August 15, 2016 10:34 AM  

Capability is the stage, sin/righteousness is the script.

Myopic bullshit. There is no shortage of agnostic/atheist examples of capability.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 10:34 AM  

dc.sunsets
My god, will the Ministry of Truth's people at Snopes give it a rest?

SJW's always double down.

QED

Anonymous Be Not Afraid August 15, 2016 10:39 AM  

Just look at Google Maps' satellite images. Go NE on Charlevoix street. Look around the intersection of Vernor & McClellan. Look NE of the Wayne County Probation Office. Look down Belton Street on the west side of the city.

Blogger frigger611 August 15, 2016 10:42 AM  

I remember watching a documentary years ago on some civil war somewhere in Africa (which seem to be perpetual) and they focused on a man who made it his personal duty to guard the last few remaining books in a bombed out library.

The eerie similarities you see between that scene and with the once beautiful, now abandoned and ruined old libraries and churches around Detroit (and Gary, and Chicago, ad infinitum like the wars in Africa) will make you think uncomfortable, but necessary thoughts.

Anonymous fred August 15, 2016 10:45 AM  

"put all the male honky NASA mathematicians to shame during the Apollo missions."

Was there such a person, or it a fictional story? Not about the putting to shame part, which I'm sure is exaggerated, but that a real person like that worked there. There were a lot of women working with computers in the early days, but they weren't tech wizards or inventors, they were simply competent people who could do certain jobs.

Blogger Ceerilan August 15, 2016 10:46 AM  

@OP
So much for using Snopes as a source for urban legends. This sort of activity taints their reputation for putting out accurate and useful articles.

@48
Morals in the black community have been gutted by the policies of the Democrats, who got elected on promises of handouts and protecting the poor. To destroy a city, you first have to destroy its people. There is no more effective way to destroy a people than morally. That is the message of the comparison.

But you cannot destroy a person morally without his cooperation.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 10:50 AM  

"put all the male honky NASA mathematicians to shame during the Apollo missions."

Was there such a person, or it a fictional story?


Most likely just another Retcon job. Couldn't fit Morgan Freeman into the role, so had to get someone else.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 10:58 AM  

@55 @53, this is a new GrrrlPower narrative. Apparently NASA would never have gotten any iron off Earth if not for the unsung heroes, the women who did all the arithmetic calculations.
http://crgis.ndc.nasa.gov/historic/Human_Computers#References

This is another in the Historical Revision necessary to prove that a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle.
All Within the Narrative
Nothing Outside the Narrative
Nothing Against the Narrative.

Mussolini had it almost right, according to the Leftists.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 11:00 AM  

https://www.amazon.com/Rise-Rocket-Girls-Propelled-Missiles-ebook/dp/B013CATQPY

Anonymous The OASF August 15, 2016 11:02 AM  

A major economic engine, which may be Detroit's only hope, is also being severely hindered here...

The abandoned industrial infrastructure would make a fantastic tourist attraction, kind of like the abandoned ruins of every other fallen civilization. If anything this may be what actually gets the powers-that-be to clean it up a little.

Blogger Were-Puppy August 15, 2016 11:13 AM  

@9 Mr.MantraMan
The tv show "Rehab Addict" is basically centered on Detroit and as I joke with the wife tha the young lady corals the last white people left in Detroit work on her houses and to visit the open houses once they are done.
---

For some real amusement check out the later seasons of Parking Wars where they had some detroit footage

Anonymous VFM #6306 August 15, 2016 11:15 AM  

Democrats were also responsible for the atomic attack on Hiroshima, so Snopes isn't exactly making its defense of Democrats any stronger...

Blogger Were-Puppy August 15, 2016 11:18 AM  

Is (((Somebody))) going to buy up the Detroit wasteland and become a slumdog millionaire?

Blogger buzzardist August 15, 2016 11:20 AM  

What kind of government rules a country affects economic development to a point, but ultimately the people of that nation are much more important than the features of the government that rules over them. Japan's greatest resource is the Japanese people. Just as Scandinavian nations have enjoyed wealth and high living standards with heavily socialist governments, Japanese cities will generally grow and succeed mostly regardless of the government ruling them because the Japanese people, rooted in their Japaneseness, will ensure growth and success.

Yes, the devastation at Hiroshima (and Nagasaki, and Tokyo, and many other cities that were bombed) was horrific. Tens of thousands--and in the case of the Tokyo firebombing, upwards of 100,000--died in single attacks. But a lot of Japanese people survived. They still formed a cohesive community and a cohesive nation that quickly began rebuilding and working toward restoring its pride.

We saw the same after the Tohoku earthquake five years ago. Devastation that would have left a city like New Orleans permanently washed off the map, not to mention much of the rest of the Gulf Coast with it, was dealt with. Did certain officials mess up at moments? Yes. But the Japanese people had the will and gumption to rebuild because their shared identity is a point of pride, which is something that America's scattered, broken identity politics lacks.

One of America's problems is that we've ended up with a large number of Scandinavians with the same socialist leanings as Europe's Scandinavians have, and so they vote for similar policies in America. Unfortunately, those policies in America are applied to people who aren't Scandinavian, and then the Scandinavians are baffled as to why their communities don't end up like the comparative paradises that existed in Northern Europe prior to the recent massive waves of immigration. Those policies don't work the same because the chief determining factor is the people themselves. If the community is made up significantly of Mexicans, the local economy and development will end up resembling Mexico. If the population of Somalians is large, then the community's development more and more resembles Somalia.

Cultural traits take several generations--a couple hundred years at the minimum, and likely much, much more--to significantly change. Government policies may influence slightly over time, but they will never trump the inborn cultural traits that mark a particular nation of people.

Anonymous Jack Amok August 15, 2016 11:21 AM  

Detroit, was destroyed by corporate greed, changing markets forces, free trade ...

The majority of Blacks in Detroit are not actively attempting to destroy civilization. They're just not doing much to maintain it. Call it the Jemisin Effect if you want, but the gist is, there are always forces (greed, crime, economic changes, sociopaths, atomic bombs, etc.) wearing away at the foundations of civilization. It takes work to repair the damage and keep those dis-civic forces at bay.

Detroit's population didn't put in that work. Hiroshima's did.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 11:21 AM  

Cultural traits take several generations--a couple hundred years at the minimum, and likely much, much more--to significantly change. Government policies may influence slightly over time, but they will never trump the inborn cultural traits that mark a particular nation of people.

The great society destroyed the black family within two generations

Anonymous CC August 15, 2016 11:24 AM  

For a long time, photo galleries depicting the wreckage of Detroit's beautiful old interiors have worked as click-bait on all sorts of websites. I always tend to look at them (and other sites) out of a sort of grim fascination and some sadness of what used to be great and also a kind of artistic appreciation of decay.

I admit it fills me with foreboding today. My mum used to say when I was growing up that the world around us reminded her of the end of the Roman Empire.

Anonymous Gen. Kong August 15, 2016 11:24 AM  

There's a reason the place is known as Detroilet over at the place run by "Paul Kersey". The place was bankrupt before the end of Coleman Young's reign, but was bailed out over and over by the state and the Feds through various schemes. Welfare payments started in the 1930s under the FDR regime. They were ramped up hugely under LBJ and the Recucklickans three decades later.

Blogger pyrrhus August 15, 2016 11:28 AM  

O/T Courageous column on the Clinton murders...http://takimag.com/article/a_hot_month_for_clintons_body_count_gavin_mcinnes/print#disqus_thread

Anonymous Jack Amok August 15, 2016 11:31 AM  

Yeah, I don't buy Stefan's argument that the black population was somehow magically integrating into white society successfully (something it had woefully failed to do for 100 years) until LBJ destroyed it all with the Great Society.

The arrow was at least pointing towards progress back then. It isn't any more.

We could argue about the timescales necessary in Vox's Time to Civilization theory, or the mechanisms involved, but the theory itself looks damned solid.

And considering that the theory requires contact with a civilized society, it shouldn't be much of a surprise the process of civilization has stalled and regressed. The rest of us have been behaving less and less civilized for two generations now.

Anonymous VFM #6306 August 15, 2016 11:32 AM  

Ironic that Snopes' reputation as exposer of urban legends would be so brutally impaled on its own dishonest reclamation of a literal urban legend.

Detroit RIP.

Blogger pyrrhus August 15, 2016 11:32 AM  

Cultural traits take several generations--a couple hundred years at the minimum, and likely much, much more--to significantly change. Government policies may influence slightly over time, but they will never trump the inborn cultural traits that mark a particular nation of people.

We have seen massive cultural changes in the West in less than one generation, more or less imposed by the Globalists....They are now trying to normalize pedophilia, maybe cannibalism is next....

Blogger Were-Puppy August 15, 2016 11:33 AM  

dc.sunsets wrote:

Snopes' little garden slugs give each other High Fives in joy every time they condescension-slime the troubling emergence of Truth somewhere, and as long as they're princelings in their little Virtue Signal Aquarium, they really don't care if the rest of the world burns (See BLM & Milwaukee...but try Brietbart, not the condescension-virtue-sliming MSM.)


And we won't care when they burn. Best way to handle this is to drain the aquarium, and they can sink or swim.

It's a good analogy. They really are like the Chimps who push the red button hoping for a banana. They have no real awareness of the world. Or awareness that the rest of us are on to them. They just keep on pushing that button because it's always worked all these years.

Anonymous VFM #6306 August 15, 2016 11:37 AM  

The South was invaded so that industrial cities (like Detroit) would have access to cheaper labor. The irony is that had the Yankee factories simply purchased slaves from the South, war would have been averted, the South would have made a faster and softer transition to post-slavery growth, and the blacks of Detroit would have developed a more civil society.

Oops.

Anonymous BGKB August 15, 2016 11:37 AM  

The picture of modern Detroit is only of one building.

Its actually the lack of buildings, there was a post apocalypse theme parks planed for Detriot, not sure what became of it. http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-mo-detroit-zombie-park-20120706-story.html

Lastly, we're shown a photo supposedly depicting Detroit in its mid-1940s heyday — except that it was taken in the mid-1930s

I was in the ruins of Pompeii in the 90s & the buildings looked more sturdy. If a tornado was coming I would feel safer in one of those than a modern stick build house.
OT: Who knew that Elon Musk got even more of his money from the Govt than Buffet? All he sells is carbon credits, and http://ericpetersautos.com/2016/08/14/now-uncle-investing-tesla/

4. It was the Democrats fault, but it wasn't only their fault.

The (((NEO COheNS))) are democrats who want to profit off of destruction.

Blogger pyrrhus August 15, 2016 11:37 AM  

"One of America's problems is that we've ended up with a large number of Scandinavians with the same socialist leanings as Europe's Scandinavians have, and so they vote for similar policies in America. Unfortunately, those policies in America are applied to people who aren't Scandinavian, and then the Scandinavians are baffled as to why their communities don't end up like the comparative paradises that existed in Northern Europe prior to the recent massive waves of immigration. Those policies don't work the same because the chief determining factor is the people themselves. If the community is made up significantly of Mexicans, the local economy and development will end up resembling Mexico. If the population of Somalians is large, then the community's development more and more resembles Somalia."

And now that the Scandinavians have invited the Orcs into their home countries, they are finding out the same thing, but the governments are suppressing any attempts to do anything about it. I continue to predict that Sweden will be a 3d world country within 25 years.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 11:40 AM  

The South was invaded so that industrial cities (like Detroit) would have access to cheaper labor. The irony is that had the Yankee factories simply purchased slaves from the South, war would have been averted, the South would have made a faster and softer transition to post-slavery growth, and the blacks of Detroit would have developed a more civil society.

This entire argument is stupid and wrong

Blogger The Other Robot August 15, 2016 11:49 AM  

Maybe Snopes can debunk this:

!!! Attention Wealthy Elites !!!

We have final message for "Wealthy Elites". We know what is wealthy but what is Elites? Elites is making laws protect self and friends, lie and fuck other peoples. Elites is breaking laws, regular peoples go to jail, life ruin, family ruin, but not Elites. Elites is breaking laws, many peoples know Elites guilty, Elites call top friends at law enforcement and government agencies, offer bribes, make promise future handjobs, (but no blowjobs). Elites top friends announce, no law broken, no crime commit. Reporters (not call journalist) make living say write only nice things about Elites, convince dumb cattle, is just politics, everything is awesome, check out our ads and our prostitutes. Then Elites runs for president.


Where did that come from, BTW?

Anonymous BGKB August 15, 2016 11:54 AM  

My god, will the Ministry of Truth's people at Snopes give it a rest?

As long as one gay cakke lay unbaked or one man in a dress barred from little girls bathrooms the fight against the 1% can wait

Well, if you value something beautiful and useful, then you make the investment to repair the damage

Black communities can't even support grocery stores, but leftists have to fight new liquor stores and payday loan offices

Left is the feminine mind then it makes sense, no one crueler than a woman

The worst Abu Ghraib pictures were from women.

"So the statement of it having been "looted of everything except the books" isn't correct."

Galileo, Copernicus, Socrates, & Aristotle would have been willing to lose a limb to get access to the knowledge stored in the Detroit library, which is funny because that is the current cost to get into the Chicongo one.

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 11:56 AM  

The great society destroyed the black family within two generations

Not in the sense that you imply. This is obvious because the black family doesn't exist, in the Western sense, in Africa. The Great Society simply removed the pressure for blacks to imitate European family structures.

Blogger Noah B August 15, 2016 11:57 AM  

@64 The great society destroyed the black family within two generations

The black family prospered under traditional white, Anglo-Saxon, Protestant values of limited government and individual property rights. They never understood and appreciated the reasons for their successes, and once the opportunity presented itself thanks to Frankfurt School leftists, American blacks eagerly tore down the foundations of their own well-being. Cargo-cultists, as Vox likes to say.

Great Society wasn't forced on blacks. LBJ saw them as an easily exploitable voting block, and he was entirely correct in that supposition.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 11:59 AM  

Not in the sense that you imply. This is obvious because the black family doesn't exist, in the Western sense, in Africa. The Great Society simply removed the pressure for blacks to imitate European family structures.

Agreed. The great society is also removing the pressure for whites to imitate the same family structures.

Anonymous DNW August 15, 2016 12:01 PM  

The decline of Detroit is a subject with which I have some familiarity on a number of different levels.

Anyone interested in this topic has volumes of information at their fingertips; though I have found out just now, that some of the documents may not be available except for a fee: such as the Time archives.

Nonetheless, the destructive cynicism central to Democrat election strategy can be seen from the very earliest days, as exemplified by one of their supposedly brightest up-coming political stars.

Historical perspective from what was once available from Time archives. (Bear in mind that wholesale sales figures for 1960 were, 7,869 units in thousands, that this 1961 article preceded the Detroit auto industry's biggest years. For example figures for 1965 were 11,057 (Wiki figures do not match and for 1960 are a little higher.):

Time Magazine Friday, Oct. 27, 1961

Detroit's decline has been going on for a long while. Auto production soared to an alltime peak in 1955—but there were already worrisome signs. In the face of growing foreign and domestic competition, auto companies merged, or quit, or moved out of town to get closer to markets. Automation began replacing workers in the plants that remained. In the past seven years, Chrysler, the city's biggest employer, has dropped from 130,000 to 50,000 workers. At the depth of the 1958 recession, when Detroit really began reeling. 20% of the city's work force was unemployed. Even today, the figure is an estimated 10%, and the U.S. Government lists Detroit as an area of "substantial and persistent unemployment.''

On the Dole. During Detroit's decay, much of the city's middle class has packed up and headed for the suburbs. Since 1950, Detroit has had a population drop of 197,568 from 1,849,568 to 1,652,000, while the suburbs, counting arrivals from elsewhere, have jumped by more than 1,000,000. Detroit's population decrease would have been even more drastic but for an influx of white and Negro workers from the South. In the past ten years, Detroit's Negro population has risen from 300,506 to 482,000.

With little education or training, Detroit's new arrivals have had to scramble for any job they could get. But in their desperation to find work at any wage, they have crowded out thousands of the city's longtime residents; more than 70% of the 61,692 persons on relief have lived in Detroit since before 1950. Children under three get an allowance of $5.50 a week for food, an active adult gets $10.60. The city also pays for fuel, rent and clothing. Counting city and state funds, welfare payments in Detroit this year will total around $28 million, compared with $8,197,000 in 1952.

Creeping Blight. Here and there in Detroit are hopeful eddies. Wayne State University is defiantly building a modern campus right in the heart of the city. But blight is creeping like a fungus through many of Detroit's proud, old neighborhoods. Vast areas have been leveled for redevelopment projects that have not materialized. Down on the waterfront, the city's $70 million Cobo Convention Hall and Arena is not attracting the anticipated crowds of fast-spending ...


Blogger The Other Robot August 15, 2016 12:02 PM  

The Great Society simply removed the pressure for blacks to imitate European family structures.

I suspect that those 'black' families that did function as families had members with large amounts of white (genetic) introgression.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 12:03 PM  

I suspect that those 'black' families that did function as families had members with large amounts of white (genetic) introgression.

American blacks are 20% white

Anonymous Jack Amok August 15, 2016 12:05 PM  

Agreed. The great society is also removing the pressure for whites to imitate the same family structures.

Yep. American Black's progress towards civilization stopped because they went from being in contact with a civilized people - Anglo-Saxon America - to being in contact with a post-civilized people - Melting Pot America.

Blogger clk August 15, 2016 12:11 PM  

VD says "Are you willing to assert that importing 775,000 blacks to a formerly all-white city will have significantly different results than Detroit?"

I am not sure I understand you question so let me rephrase it first -- are you asking "is having 775k blacks a significant factor in the decline of Detroit ?"

I think that would be a fair statement on your part because there is overlap in the events -- we don't have a failure and then all these blacks/poor show up .. there a loss of work, movement to other states and countries, there's a outward migration of higher income, inward migration of lower income (or low income becomes a larger proportion in a existing population) ..that puts greater social demand on a system that has fewer inputs or resources.

I think the issue missing IMHO is power --- at the time of the failure where did the power exist, who was in control ? -- I have a hard time asserting responsibility to the poor - which includes the blacks, for a situation they didn't have the power to cause and unfortunately the tools/skills to fix. BUT I can admit, that strictly speaking statistically intent is not required for causation... but philosophically it feels like blaming the victims for being victims...

The root cause for the demise of Detroit are the changes in the auto market, poor quality, foreign competition, free trade, internal competition low wage states AND labor unions (don't forget that the labor unions did this to themselves -- getting paid $25/hr in 1970 to attach the rear quarter panel was never sustainable).

In the harshest sense -- it was the free market at work.


Blogger Noah B August 15, 2016 12:16 PM  

@81 There are some real gems in that article. I had no idea the City of Detroit was paying welfare in 1961. They actually selected for people who wanted to live off of others, and blacks -- the very worst of them -- showed up en masse.

Anonymous DissidentRight August 15, 2016 12:23 PM  

I had never thought of it that way. This is why I read the comments.

Blogger John Wright August 15, 2016 12:24 PM  

@43
" This was a failure of belief and culture, not of genetics."

Amen and hear, hear. Before the Great Society, black churches were the backbone of their communities.

The genetics argument, which blames political and social failure on genes rather than on politics and society, is one which, thanks to the presence of the skepticism gene in my bloodline, I do not believe.

Anonymous BGKB August 15, 2016 12:33 PM  

Progressivist Virtue-Signalers as pets...yes, PETS. When your beloved dog misbehaves you don't beat it

You can take dogs to obedience school. What if MILO wrote a book "The Nigger Whisperer"

photos to identify places with high percentages of blacks. All you'll need is the CDC's Mortality and Morbidity Report

There was a city whose black child mortality rate was higher than the white child mortality rate during the bubonic plague. Even not blaming crack, sickle cell and kidney differences account for much of the difference in health outcomes. Their kidneys reuptake more salt which is why on urinalysis you see GFR and AA-GFR, and the genes that let them resist sleeping sickness give them more kidney failure. The scarry thing is that 44% of black 8yo girls have hit puberty. http://www.nbcnews.com/id/38600414/ns/health-childrens_health/t/growing-too-soon-puberty-strikes--year-old-girls/#.V7HpdOT6uUk
"23 percent of the 7-year-old black girls had started puberty as compared to 15 percent in the 1997 study"

OT, but the Hollywood obsession with "strong" female leads, especially she-boons, just got a little more silly

Anyone that believes she had more to do with landing on the moon than the groid who downloaded a porn virus that knocked out all the computers in a hospital for a week had to do with successful surgeries is brainwashed. Kids at space camp do that level of math.

The majority of Blacks in Detroit are not actively attempting to destroy civilization. They're just not doing much to maintain it

The terrorist Mandela family was given a gold mine, the first thing they did was fire the racist white guards & replaced them with blacks. The black guards sold the stairways & tools for scrap metal, literally not smart enough to steal gold from a gold mine.

Anonymous Ironsides August 15, 2016 12:35 PM  

@72 I really recommend that you read this article. It's quite interesting and even enlightening:

http://www.npiamerica.org/research/category/what-the-founders-really-thought-about-race#fn:44

The alt-right view is actually the NORMAL American view throughout most of United States history; and that includes Abraham Lincoln and most of the Abolitionists. I'm not kidding, read the article. They wanted to "colonize" the blacks -- that is, send them off somewhere to found their own country -- because they recognized that the two races are utterly incompatible in almost every way.

As far as the idea that the northerners wanted the blacks as cheap labor, that's pure fantasy that can be demolished by the reason for the bill to block slavery in the Western states:
-------------------------
The “Wilmot Proviso” was certainly anti-slavery, but Wilmot was not an abolitionist. He did not object to slavery in the South; only to its spread into the Western territories. During the congressional debate, Wilmot asked:

"whether that vast country, between the Rio Grande and the Pacific, shall be given up to the servile labor of the black, or be preserved for the free labor of the white man? … The negro race already occupy enough of this fair continent; let us keep what remains for ourselves, and for our children."

Wilmot called his amendment the “white man’s proviso.”
---------------------

Even the Great Emancipator and his chaps would be considered to be somewhere right of Hitler by modern SJW loons.

Anonymous VFM #6306 August 15, 2016 12:35 PM  

Josh, by 1860, 65 percent of Detroit's African American population had been born in the South. Northern factories were realizing two things: a) the South could produce more raw material than the Northern factory system could process, thus giving the South a trade advantage with Britain. The slave system was becoming more expensive than Northern day labor. Now, cities like Cincy and Detroit would have never done the South the favor of buying up slaves at premium and then converting them to sunk cost indentured freemen. I'm just saying that it might have worked out better for Detroit in the long run. Of course, the cotton "bubble" only "burst" due to the Northern blockades to Europe, so leaving that an area of Southern dominance would have been a military error at the time.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 12:35 PM  

American blacks are 20% white

Define "American blacks" and cite your source.

Blogger The Other Robot August 15, 2016 12:39 PM  

@83: The number I have seen is 18%, but it is an average.

Thus, individual 'blacks' can have anywhere from a few percent (1-2) to 80% or so 'white' genes.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 12:48 PM  

Define "American blacks" and cite your source.

Blacks who are descended from slaves.

Source: Steve sailer.

http://isteve.blogspot.com/2013/02/henry-louis-gates-exactly-how-black-is.html?m=1

Now, in The Root, Harvard African-American studies professor Henry Louis Gates continues on with his interest in ancestry testing, providing some updating for the preliminary data in my 2002 article. Gates writes:
* According to Ancestry.com, the average African American is 65 percent sub-Saharan African, 29 percent European and 2 percent Native American.
* According to 23andme.com, the average African American is 75 percent sub-Saharan African, 22 percent European and only 0.6 percent Native American.
* According to Family Tree DNA.com, the average African American is 72.95 percent sub-Saharan African, 22.83 percent European and 1.7 percent Native American.
* According to National Geographic's Genographic Project, the average African American is 80 percent sub-Saharan African, 19 percent European and 1 percent Native American.

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 12:48 PM  

Define "American blacks" and cite your source.

Don't be such a pedantic asshole. If you don't know that, you're absolutely fucking ignorant about genetic science. He's correct, in fact, he's citing outdated information that is on the low side.

The more recent Harvard/23 and Me study reported:

Broadly, the genomic analysis found that on an average the African American genome was 73.2 percent African, 24 percent European and 0.8 percent Native American. With respect to European Americans, the percentages are much more different than African Americans or Latinos, with European American genomes being 98.6 percent European, 0.19 percent African and 0.18 percent Native American.

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 12:53 PM  

Amen and hear, hear. Before the Great Society, black churches were the backbone of their communities.

The genetics argument, which blames political and social failure on genes rather than on politics and society, is one which, thanks to the presence of the skepticism gene in my bloodline, I do not believe.


You may not believe it, but it is true all the same.

I think many of you who have not lived outside the USA have very little grasp of how genuinely different the races are from one another. I lived in Japan. It did not make me Japanese, even though I understand the culture much better than the average gaijin and rather like it.

If the cultural argument was meaningful, why are Jews in Germany, France, and India still Jews?

The cultural argument, like the proposition nation argument, is logically incoherent.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 12:56 PM  

He's correct, in fact, he's citing outdated information that is on the low side.

For future reference for the spergs here, almost everything I post can be backed up with sources.

Keep talking that trash, I'll pull your card.

Blogger ChickenChicken Sweep August 15, 2016 12:57 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger ChickenChicken Sweep August 15, 2016 12:59 PM  

OT, but the Hollywood obsession with "strong" female leads, especially she-boons, just got a little more silly

Some virtue signaling asshat on twitter was singing the praises of this woman (can't recall her name) by saying that "the NASA scientists would come to her to check if their latest algorithm were correct." In other words, she was an efficient and accurate human calculator, but even the virtue signaling asshat doesn't attempt to pretend she came up with any of the necessary algorithms in the first place. I'm confident Hollywood will make it seem so.

She could probably type better than I can, though.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 1:06 PM  

Josh
Blacks who are descended from slaves.

Thanks, that is clarifying. Ongoing immigration from Africa is going to affect that definition.

For example, the Nigerian doctor I know who is a US citizen with three daughters is not an "American black" by your definition, ok. When his born-in-the-USA daughters have children, will their offspring be "American black" or something else?

Source: Steve sailer.

Thank you for the cite and link.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 1:09 PM  

When his born-in-the-USA daughters have children, will their offspring be "American black" or something else?

Something else. The American blacks don't consider African immigrants to be part of their group.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 1:09 PM  


Don't be such a pedantic asshole. If you don't know that, you're absolutely fucking ignorant about genetic science.


Pardon me, but a request for evidence is part of dialectic, and therefore acceptable in any serious, science based, discussion.

Anonymous Joe Blowe August 15, 2016 1:12 PM  

Noah B wrote:I had no idea the City of Detroit was paying welfare in 1961.

Uncle Scam has been paying out welfare to blacks since the end of the Civil War. The Freedmen's Bureau was setup for that purpose.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedmen%27s_Bureau#/media/File:Freedman%27s_bureau.jpg

As for the myth of "strong Black families" Booker T. Washington was lamenting the sorry condition of the institution of marriage among his race and their notorious immorality and infidelity. This was one hundred years ago.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 1:13 PM  

Pardon me, but a request for evidence is part of dialectic, and therefore acceptable in any serious, science based, discussion.

You can't have a serious discussion with someone who's ignorant of the subject.

Anonymous Takin' a Look August 15, 2016 1:13 PM  

@ Were-puppy

The Kikenvermin already did. They were the original blockbusters, moving in dindus, starting whisper campaigns amongst the white Christians about seeing black men walking in the neighborhood, hell, PTA and radio announcements non-stop.

It was a well oiled scam, the kikes in city hall and the legal fields worked with the real estate hook noses. They money hand over fist, richer than king midas.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 1:14 PM  

The American blacks don't consider African immigrants to be part of their group.

Yet African colonists receive the same benefits as American blacks. Affirmative action, minority set-asides, etc. all treat the Africans the same as the American blacks. The government policies regard them as all the same.

If resources continue to tighten up, resentment of African blacks by American blacks can only increase. That should work out well for domestic tranquility. Another "benefit" of open borders.

Blogger Nate August 15, 2016 1:16 PM  

"When his born-in-the-USA daughters have children, will their offspring be "American black" or something else?"

Assuming they mate with american blacks the conversion will be well under way. Its like red fading to yellow. There is no bright binary line. It happens gradually over time.

Blogger Nate August 15, 2016 1:18 PM  

"If resources continue to tighten up, resentment of African blacks by American blacks can only increase. That should work out well for domestic tranquility. Another "benefit" of open borders. "

correct.

Very similar to the problem with hispanic immigration.. which I would argue of far more important and much greater issue than blacks moving to cities.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 1:22 PM  

You can't have a serious discussion with someone who's ignorant of the subject.

True. That's one reason for providing supporting cites, to demonstrate that one isn't just blowing smoke; "because I say so" isn't dialectic or serious discussion.

"The Imperial Japanese couldn't have invaded Oregon because I say so" is not the same as "The Imperial Japanese could not have invaded Oregon because [cite points to available Special Naval Landing Force units, available cargo ships, available task force to escort, etc.]", I'm sure you agree.

A few years back when I requested a cite here on a 19th century economic panic, it was provided without drama and confirmed the claim. What's with all the hubbub today?

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 1:30 PM  

True. That's one reason for providing supporting cites, to demonstrate that one isn't just blowing smoke; "because I say so" isn't dialectic or serious discussion.

If you need a citation for what I said, you're too ignorant to participate in the discussion.

No different than asking stickwick to cite "2+2=4" in a math discussion.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 1:33 PM  

Very similar to the problem with hispanic immigration.. which I would argue of far more important and much greater issue than blacks moving to cities.

85% white to 65% white...but only 10% black to 12.5%...most of that delta is not black...

Blogger Teri August 15, 2016 1:40 PM  

@20,

Here's the worst thing about that library: they moved out part of the books and ALL the computers! And how quickly did those computers become obsolete? They should have removed all the books and sold off the computers. I am to a point with the local library that I will vote down any bond issues as long as they spend the money on computers. I don't care if someone can surf the web.

Anonymous BGKB August 15, 2016 1:50 PM  

I lived in Japan. It did not make me Japanese

I will admit that in Kuwait I did shit in a hole in the floor. In Germany I consumed my fair share of wurst+ beer & went on volksmarches, but is Switzerland I didn't go down a glacier on skies like the natives.

Yet African colonists receive the same benefits as American blacks. Affirmative action, minority set-asides, etc

African colonists have at least a passing knowledge of having to work to eat.

Anonymous fred August 15, 2016 2:09 PM  

"When his born-in-the-USA daughters have children, will their offspring be "American black" or something else?"

If they regress to the mean and adopt "urban" cultural attitudes and practices, they will effectively be American blacks. If they stay Nigerian they will be Nigerian Americans.

Anonymous Octavia August 15, 2016 2:16 PM  

Blacks in America live better than people of all colors in the Ukraine, Moldova, Pakistan, India, Afghanistan, Guatamala, Sierra Leone, Uganda, Paraguay. And a bunch of other countries.

Perhaps they should be grateful. But instead we see them biting the hand that feeds them

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 2:16 PM  

The genetics argument, which blames political and social failure on genes rather than on politics and society, is one which, thanks to the presence of the skepticism gene in my bloodline, I do not believe.

Isn't it Derbyshire who recently asked, what is culture (politics, society, collective behavior) if not cumulative behavior of individuals making up that collective, and we that data are in: our behavior is largely a phenotype. To posit that Mankind is different from every other living thing on the planet should have a big burden of proof, no?

People can imitate the behavior of others, that is different however than is being who they really are. This is the heart of this subject: in small proportions people can (and usually will) imitate those around them (herd behavior is safest behavior.) Once a person who is innately different has enough of his fellows around him, he feels safe in reverting to his natural impulses. If those natural impulses are not dictated by his genes, exactly what is driving them?

Better yet, have you visited a college that has a substantial black enrollment in the last, say, 36 years? I recall the separatism and hostility of blacks attending my wife's university (a state U) in the late 1970's, so it's not a new phenomenon. The people there behaved just like what I saw on National Geographic's specials on Sub-Saharan Africa.

Blogger Jim Carroll August 15, 2016 2:17 PM  

@95 VD If the cultural argument was meaningful, why are Jews in Germany, France, and India still Jews?

Romans 11.

The cultural argument, like the proposition nation argument, is logically incoherent.

I'm not sure why there can't be contribution from both. It seems there are certain observations that can't be explained wholly by genetics. The Flynn Effect is an obvious one. The history of black progress in the US prior to 1970 as highlighted often by Walter Williams and Thomas Sowell is another.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 2:25 PM  

Octavia, they bite the hand that feeds them because they see the condescension in the eyes of their (zoo) keepers.

People of very significant differences live happier lives if the walls between populations are tall and thick (e.g., the Atlantic Ocean.) Absent the rule of law, lots of people would not live together in peace. The Multi-Culti, Section 8, jam them down your throat polity we now have is like shaking cases of nitroglycerin. Sooner or later the thing's gonna blow, when all that was required for peace was S E P A R A T I O N.

Will Smith's character in Hancock said it well: "Why don't you be you, and me be me...over there." They wouldn't let him be him (just like they won't let us be us) so someone's head ended up the other guy's butt. (Other than the Magic Negro/Paired with the Blonde, the Cucky white guy, the bad guys are all white and the largest, most horrific, fictional act of graffiti in movie history, the movie's better than most now.)

Anonymous Frankenstein McBadperson August 15, 2016 2:43 PM  

How did Wilde put it? The rage of Caliban at seeing his face in a mirror.

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 2:51 PM  

True. That's one reason for providing supporting cites, to demonstrate that one isn't just blowing smoke; "because I say so" isn't dialectic or serious discussion.

That's not relevant here. To not understand that American blacks have a significant percentage of European genes indicates that you've never seen an actual African and are not even remotely equipped to join in the discussion.

It was a silly question and an even more ridiculous demand.

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 2:54 PM  

Pardon me, but a request for evidence is part of dialectic, and therefore acceptable in any serious, science based, discussion.

No, it's not. If you have to ask questions about the totally obvious and demand references for it, you are either not intellectually capable or not sufficiently prepared for the discussion.

Anonymous DNW August 15, 2016 2:56 PM  

" The history of black progress in the US prior to 1970 as highlighted often by ..."

This may be of interest: US Department of Agriculture Yearbook 1928 (published 1929) Page 475.

From pages following:

"In 1928 he owned 125 acres of land in a high state of cultivation, a modern house worth $3,000, 2 Jersey cows, 15 head of hogs including 2 brood sows and a purebred boar, 3 head of horses, improved farm implements, an automoble, 450 bushels of corn, and wheat sufficient for the year. He sold 18 bales of cotton and had 8 tons of hay for sale above what was necessary to carry him through 1928. His wife and daughter sold $330 worth of vegetables, chickens, eggs, and butter in 1927. The entire farm with modem improvements is valued at $8,000. He has a life insurance policy for $3,000 and a bank account."

See also for farm ownership to tenancy proportions in Va. and the Carolinas see page 518 of the 1923 yearbook.

Whether it makes for gladdening historical reading or currently saddening reading, depends on your view of how conditions and aspirations have comparatively progressed, and whether the apparent trajectory laid out in these pages, was intentionally radically altered, and if so, why.

Anonymous Anonymous August 15, 2016 3:01 PM  

Hiroshima is a beautiful city. I loved my time there.

Anonymous BGKB August 15, 2016 3:01 PM  

The Left's leading "lights" are not bothered to see the USA's median living standard collapse as long as they get to be kings of what's left...The Right is...right...while the Left is satisfied with what's left

I had a friend in Baltimore who was a trustfundian that lived there because he could have an apartment big enough to house 100 Mexicans in the middle of 12 gay bars. He could be popular by having afterparties, but was realistic enough to have a jeep with canvas top so those that tried to steal from his car wouldn't have to damage it & his decorations were cheap as they could be destroyed by partiers. He could afford to live in a far nicer place but chose to live as a queen amongst the rabble.

indicates that you've never seen an actual African

African blacks are so black their teeth appear white.

Blogger Jim Carroll August 15, 2016 3:03 PM  

@121 DNW, wow. Powerful anecdote. Thanks.

Anonymous Avalanche August 15, 2016 3:22 PM  

@17 "The Chinese would love to invest in a Detroit reclamation project."

Can we move it there?

Anonymous Bobby Farr August 15, 2016 3:33 PM  

@113 Wrong. Ethnicity is not magically altered by one's behavior. This is nonsensical as saying wiggers or lower class urban whites become black based on their actions.

Anonymous Gen. Kong August 15, 2016 3:35 PM  

Noah B wrote:@64 The great society destroyed the black family within two generations

The black family prospered under traditional white, Anglo-Saxon, Protestant values of limited government and individual property rights. They never understood and appreciated the reasons for their successes, and once the opportunity presented itself thanks to Frankfurt School leftists, American blacks eagerly tore down the foundations of their own well-being. Cargo-cultists, as Vox likes to say.

Great Society wasn't forced on blacks. LBJ saw them as an easily exploitable voting block, and he was entirely correct in that supposition.


Largely true, though there were a few black leaders in the very early part of the 20th century who may have at least understood something of this concept - Booker T. Washington and a couple of others. By 1920 they were rapidly shoved aside by the NAACP and the Marxist W.E.B. Dubois. The story of the NAACP itself is most curious as it's early board of directors only included Dubois and a couple of other token negroes. The majority of members were from the same group of Babylonians who took over Wall Street and waged Gramsci's "Long March through the Institutions" (whose start pre-dated Gramsci by several decades even in Amurika). As I recall, the NAACP had its first negro president around 1960 or so, nearly six decades after its foundation. Even now, it's unlikely that the large sums of money flowing to it annually come from the estates of expired rappers and star afleetes. Most seems to come from the (((usual suspects))) who have special access to Aunt Janet's trash-for-cash discount drive-thru "free market" casino.

Anonymous Avalanche August 15, 2016 3:39 PM  

@64 "The great society destroyed the black family within two generations"

No, the "Great Society" released the White society's "thumb" from holding the black family into a faked semblance of White society; hence they returned to their natural (genetic/biological) heritage and structure. Just as you can teach a dog to not eat until given permission, you can force blacks to live in an unnatural (to them) family structure attempting to mirror the White structure -- but it is not natural, and without ongoing training (and occasional force) it will not maintain!

Blogger tublecane August 15, 2016 3:46 PM  

@108-Requests for citations (what is it with people saying "cites"?) are of varying legitimacy. Asking what constitutes "American blacks" is not equivalent to but is along the same lines as responding to someone saying the sky is blue with, "What is this 'blue' of which you speak? Citation please." It's not worth talking to someone that ignorant.

Anonymous Avalanche August 15, 2016 3:52 PM  

@88 "The genetics argument, which blames political and social failure on genes rather than on politics and society, is one which ... I do not believe."

So you believe that every single instance of (groups of) blacks in ANY society or civilization, at any time, in any land, it is always politics and society that leads them to failure and violence? Even their own, untouched by Western Man, tribal societies? You believe that culture is not inherent in genetics? Even though people who did NOT fit into their cultures did not get to breed, and therefore their genes went missing; further concentrating the genetic heritage they did not participate in? Even as genetic science finds more and more "traits" are based in genetics, however those genes are effected (not a typo) by nurture/epigenetics?

Anonymous DissidentRight August 15, 2016 4:09 PM  

@ 80

VD: This is obvious because the black family doesn't exist, in the Western sense, in Africa.

Josh: Agreed. The great society is also removing the pressure for whites to imitate the same family structures.


I think it is fair to say that whites aren’t imitating Western family structures because those are the white family structures.

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 4:32 PM  

No, the "Great Society" released the White society's "thumb" from holding the black family into a faked semblance of White society; hence they returned to their natural (genetic/biological) heritage and structure. Just as you can teach a dog to not eat until given permission, you can force blacks to live in an unnatural (to them) family structure attempting to mirror the White structure -- but it is not natural, and without ongoing training (and occasional force) it will not maintain!

So explain how we're seeing the family structure break down for lower class whites.

Blogger Noah B August 15, 2016 4:34 PM  

@126 I was speaking very broadly and I do realize that there were, and still are, outliers. It's as illogical to judge the group based on the exceptional individual as it is to judge the exceptional individual based on the group.

Anonymous kfg August 15, 2016 4:36 PM  

@22: "So in this analogy its seems more correct to compare free trade, globalism and corp greed with the atomic bomb."

http://static.vinepair.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/singapore-header.jpg

And while I'm here, this is a picture of Peace Memorial Park, Hiroshima, in 1965, just 25 years after the bombing:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/6d/79/4e/6d794efb3bba8463941d492a37e25551.jpg

Blogger Noah B August 15, 2016 4:37 PM  

"So explain how we're seeing the family structure break down for lower class whites."

Some fraction of whites always required social pressures, applied via communities and churches, to maintain stable families. Both of those stabilizing influences have been targeted and corroded beyond recognition by cultural Marxists.

Anonymous DissidentRight August 15, 2016 4:46 PM  

So explain how we're seeing the family structure break down for lower class whites.

Lower class whites are lower class because of lower IQ + lower time horizons. Combine that with bad social engineering and they fall away from the Western family structure. But that doesn’t change the fact that Europeans developed a different family structure than Africans.

Anonymous kfg August 15, 2016 4:46 PM  

@129:"Even their own, untouched by Western Man, tribal societies?"

At the risk of appearing pedantic, because it has been demonstrated to make a real difference, any tribal society known to Western man has been touched by Western man.

Which I note does not touch the bulk of your argument. Carry on.

Blogger dc.sunsets August 15, 2016 4:47 PM  

"So explain how we're seeing the family structure break down for lower class whites."

You are familiar with variation within a population, right, and it is on such variation that a group mean is maintained by culling the outliers?

Or are you suggesting that Caucasians with dysfunctional family structures would be potentially successful in Sub-Saharan Africa where such structures are reportedly the mean?

I might be persuaded...if the Caucasians were also still hard core NRA members and their membership magazine of choice was "American Hunter."

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 4:49 PM  

But that doesn’t change the fact that Europeans developed a different family structure than Africans.

I never said it did

Anonymous kfg August 15, 2016 4:53 PM  

@137:

The lower class "pot hunters" of the US used to have strong family values and out hunt the upper class "sportsman." This is the reason our conservation laws, the product of the upper class, took the form they have.

The question posed is why this in no longer the case.

Anonymous DissidentRight August 15, 2016 5:13 PM  

I never said it did

True. But to be fair, the "Just as you can teach a dog to not eat until given permission" guy never said you couldn't teach whites (esp. the lower 3rd) to give up patriarchy.

Anonymous Sagramore August 15, 2016 5:16 PM  

@86 And meanwhile, they cancelled my grandfather's green card (he worked at Uniroil) and sent him packing back to Canada. (He used to donate to Fr. Coughlin so I guess he was a SJW too.)

Anonymous Daniel H August 15, 2016 5:21 PM  

There will be a day in the not to distant future when the cumulative homicides attributed to black people in Detroit since 1945 will surpass the 55,000 or so deaths attributed to the Hiroshima bomb.

Blogger Sheila4g August 15, 2016 5:31 PM  

@94 VD: "Broadly, the genomic analysis found that on an average the African American genome was 73.2 percent African, 24 percent European and 0.8 percent Native American."

Vox, Josh, and others, one caveat here - I believe this is based on a self-selected portion of the American Negro population (i.e. those who have voluntarily submitted to and/or paid for DNA tests) and thus is higher than the actual average. In a similar vein, there's a Mexican who comments at VDare who's always claiming Mestizos are 65% European on average. He's basing his numbers on a self-selected group that's been DNA tested in the US.

I also believe I read (sorry, don't have a link but I think it was at Sailer) that those Negroes who settled in the north after 1900 or so have been found to have a larger portion of White DNA - appearing as though the slightly more capable or aspirational ones actively sought the jobs and living standards they believed were higher.

Anonymous JAG August 15, 2016 6:17 PM  

I'd say Snopes did a good job of inadvertently debunking their own supposed impartiality with the gymnastics they had to perform in order to spread some of the blame to Republicans for Detroit.

Blogger VD August 15, 2016 6:35 PM  

Vox, Josh, and others, one caveat here - I believe this is based on a self-selected portion of the American Negro population (i.e. those who have voluntarily submitted to and/or paid for DNA tests) and thus is higher than the actual average. In a similar vein, there's a Mexican who comments at VDare who's always claiming Mestizos are 65% European on average. He's basing his numbers on a self-selected group that's been DNA tested in the US.

Could be. I thought the number was 18 percent myself. The point is, it's a fair bit less than 100 percent, like the native Africans.

OpenID aew51183 August 15, 2016 6:43 PM  

@17

We could call the chinese renewal project "Delta City".

Anonymous Eric the Red August 15, 2016 6:52 PM  

Blacks are a vector of destruction for whatever pockets of civilization they've been allowed to infest. But many idiot commenters here are still trying to pin the blame on not having some superduper advanced drug regimen that would have kept the disease in check.

Anonymous 0007 August 15, 2016 6:55 PM  

@95VD: You are correct there, VD. I spent 30+years as a field engineer working all over the world from north of the Artic circle to the Far-East, the Near-East, the Middle-East and Europe. Americans who have not traveled have !NO! idea of how different the various nationalities/races are from the BS they have been fed about "human-kind".
I have maintained for years that one of the best things the.gov could do is give a round-trip ticket to just about anywhere in the world to any graduating high-school student.
Give them a month in any 2nd or 3rd world country(sorry no 1st world countries allowed (unless passing through on their return). And give them the equivalent of say 70% of the FTR for wherever they go.
I suspect that the surviving returnees would be like the students that came back from Grenada in '83 and kissed the ground as they got off the plane.
FTR between working in the private sector and the.gov I filled up more than 12 passports over the years. Sometimes I pull them out and just go through them for fun. Never did get to Italy.

Blogger residentMoron August 15, 2016 6:57 PM  

A lot of lefty websites, like Snopes, exist merely so people without an argument can say "Oh, Random Website totally debunked that!" ... and continue to pretend they know something they don't.

Anonymous A Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents August 15, 2016 7:07 PM  

Lots of contributing factors to the Detroit implosion, but a major factor in the decline of Detroit - Coleman Young, the Big Man of the city from 1974 to 1994.

Coleman Young's 20 year reign of looting Detroit would not have been possible without a solid bloc of voters to re-elect him time after time. So in addition to the social aspects, i.e. various forms of crime, blacks must also be regarded as bloc voters who will consistently support the party of the most gimmes and a Big Man if one's available.

American black or African black, it doesn't seem to matter. What percentage of the voting base can be black, without too much risk of one-party / Big Man rule?

Blogger Daniel August 15, 2016 7:13 PM  

Better jesus than mohammed

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 7:30 PM  

I also believe I read (sorry, don't have a link but I think it was at Sailer) that those Negroes who settled in the north after 1900 or so have been found to have a larger portion of White DNA - appearing as though the slightly more capable or aspirational ones actively sought the jobs and living standards they believed were higher.

If that is the case then why are Yankee cities like Detroit, Chicago, Milwaukee, Baltimore, St Louis, etc. full of worse behaving blacks?

Blogger Josh August 15, 2016 7:31 PM  

Vox, Josh, and others, one caveat here - I believe this is based on a self-selected portion of the American Negro population (i.e. those who have voluntarily submitted to and/or paid for DNA tests) and thus is higher than the actual average.

That's possible. It's also possible that the same is true for white Americans who submit to DNA tests.

You go to debate with the data you have, not the data you wish you have.

Blogger Daniel August 15, 2016 7:39 PM  

As an argentinian, it always shock me when a black from america with a car and an iphone complains about how bad their life is

Blogger Aeoli Pera August 15, 2016 7:47 PM  

Dude, Snopes has never been right on any subject, ever.

Blogger Aeoli Pera August 15, 2016 7:51 PM  

I'm tempted to post a bounty for someone to find a Snopes article that doesn't have a conclusion 180 degrees opposite of the truth.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash August 15, 2016 8:03 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash August 15, 2016 8:04 PM  

Josh wrote:If that is the case then why are Yankee cities like Detroit, Chicago, Milwaukee, Baltimore, St Louis, etc. full of worse behaving blacks?

Dude,

Atlanta.

Generally speaking, you in the South know how to manage them. In the North they tried to treat them like Whites.

Blogger residentMoron August 15, 2016 9:02 PM  

Paradigm

In a typical two party "democracy", five percent of voters is plenty enough for that bloc to be kingmakers.

There's no safe percentage. There's no safe space. Safety is an infantile fantasy craved by women and cowards.

Anonymous BGKB August 15, 2016 9:18 PM  

Even though people who did NOT fit into their cultures did not get to breed, and therefore their genes went missing

That must be why blacks rape so much.

African blacks are so black their teeth appear white.

I thought for sure someone would have taken the bait so I could tell them they have not been in bad breath range of American blacks.

Anonymous Mr. Rational August 15, 2016 9:30 PM  

dc.sunsets wrote:Apparently NASA would never have gotten any iron off Earth if not for the unsung heroes, the women who did all the arithmetic calculations.

http://crgis.ndc.nasa.gov/historic/Human_Computers#References

Electronic computers are sexist!  They're better at following specific, tedious procedures over and over all day!

Anonymous Jack Amok August 16, 2016 2:39 AM  

If that is the case then why are Yankee cities like Detroit, Chicago, Milwaukee, Baltimore, St Louis, etc. full of worse behaving blacks?

A quick glance at the typical mudshark should answer your question. Not much positive contribution to the gene pool going on there.

Anonymous argos August 16, 2016 3:14 AM  

DissidentRight wrote:Lower class whites are lower class because of lower IQ + lower time horizons.
No, no. This may be true for some cases, but by and large it is not the case.

Anonymous Noah Baudie August 17, 2016 8:16 PM  

Argos, I would agree, and offer the hypothesis that "lower class whites," i.e., the ones who pay the taxes and fight the wars, are second-class citizens, by law, everywhere they go. If they try to improve their circumstances by seeking university-level education, or government employment, they are left sucking hind tit--1450 on the SAT won't get you nearly as far as showing up with plenty of melanin, a uterus, and 700 on the SAT, at any institution that accepts Federal funds. If they seek government employment--a rational choice, given how many of their jobs have been shipped to China and Mexico--they learn very quickly that there's only one government job open to pale males, the military. And the extra 10 points they get on their Civil Service Test when they get out pales to nothing compared to the extra 250 awarded to Rastus or the 400 given to Shaneequa, who can't read any of the questions and signs her name with an "X," but mysteriously got that six-figure middle management job for the Postal Service/Parks Service/DOD/EPA/EEOC/IRS, chosen over thousands of applicants who got higher scores but had the misfortune to show up wearing pale skin.

These people--our countrymen--are systematically screwed over from birth, by a system that combines Mencken's open hatred of the "clay-eaters" with administrators like Shirley Sherrod who no longer bothering even to try to hide their hatred of Whitey, and who feel perfectly safe admitting on camera that they use the power they are given to sabotage the Blue-Eyed Devil wherever and whenever they can.

And if lower-class whites are beginning to notice, I can hardly blame them for not wearing blinders. I can hardly blame them for looking over their shoulders and saying "fuck it" and beginning to emulate the behavior of the people for whose benefit the US government is being run, and behaving like ghetto blacks, who just have to reach out their hands and say "gibs me dat" for the sky to open up and rain EBT cards, hundred-dollar bills, Section Ape welfare checks, and Cadillac Escalades with gold-plated spinner rims, which they paid for in the first place. Why shouldn't they? Why should working-class whites be emotionally invested in the survival and success of a society that has declared them beyond the pale, and which spits on them and shits on them at every turn? We live in a society in which the highest-form of virtue-signaling is to let the world know what you think of those stupid hick Untermenschen, in which they've been the butt of about 85% of the jokes in every TV sitcom since the Second World War.

It is easy, and glib, for cuckservatives to dismiss working-class whites as stupid evil subhumans who deserve every iota of their misfortune, especially that produced by the cuckservative ideal of "free trade." It's just another of their rather blatant, pathetic attempts to curry favor with Leftists who will always despise them. And possibly there is something to the idea that certain social trends of the last century have been dysgenic. I don't think it's productive, though, to assume that poor whites are another species and declare that society owes them nothing, even as those same poor whites sweat like a nigger in a cane field for every dime they make, which is then stolen by the State at bayonet point and used to pay Shaneequa $300K to be a "community diversity outreach coordinator." The joke is that they're stupid hicks, but they're not so stupid they don't notice.

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