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Monday, May 14, 2018

Gentlemen, start your gambling

The crumbling of the American moral code continues:
The United States Supreme Court has ruled in favor of New Jersey in the state’s challenge to the federal law known as The Professional and Amateur Sports Protection Act. The law barred states from legalizing gambling on sporting events with the notable exception of Nevada and less notable exceptions for sports lotteries in three other states.

The court’s ruling that the law is unconstitutional, which came by a 7-2 vote, sets the stage for states to start allowing gambling on sports. How that will be implemented from state to state remains to be seen, but the amount of money on the table will lead many of them to make risking a few bucks on your favorite team a fairly easy undertaking.
What's next? Prostitution and sex slavery, presumably. The good news is that since gambling is essentially a tax on stupidity, the ongoing decline in average US intelligence should help maximize the revenues.

When designing a government system for the future, remember that it is the judicial branch and the concept of "interpreting the law" that proved to be the weak point.

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111 Comments:

Blogger Tallen May 14, 2018 4:12 PM  

remember that it is the judicial branch and the concept of "interpreting the law" that proved to be the weak point.

A valid point ever since the black-robed [fully semiautomatic high-capacity with shoulder-thing-that-goes-up] tyrants failed to uphold the clear meaning of "shall not be infringed."

Blogger Ominous Cowherd May 14, 2018 4:13 PM  

It would be hard to argue that the constitution allows the feds to regulate gambling, unless you take the expansive view of federal powers that the supremes have always taken. In other words, this is another example of a living document that conveniently says whatever suits the Left at this particular moment.

``What's next? Prostitution and sex slavery, presumably.''

Wait - are you saying those are against federal law? But that would make Hillary a criminal!

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother May 14, 2018 4:16 PM  

OC,

Vox is making the point that wanting to gamble in the first place is evidence of the moral code crumbling.

Blogger S1AL May 14, 2018 4:17 PM  

I'm not sure that there's a real argument to be made that the termination of laws that are barely more than 100 years old, and that have helped fund the mafia, is an indication of a "moral code" issue. Gambling regulation is mostly just rent-seeking.

Blogger Peaceful Poster May 14, 2018 4:17 PM  

What is the book on Trumpslide 2020?

Blogger Noah B The Savage Gardener May 14, 2018 4:23 PM  

The judicial system worked pretty well up until 1861. Despite widespread contemporary criticism the SCOTUS actually upheld the law in Dredd Scott. The Civil War broke the original USA.

Blogger Howard Stone May 14, 2018 4:26 PM  

Fools and their money are soon parted; pro sports are fake and fixed.

Blogger KPKinSunnyPhiladelpia May 14, 2018 4:27 PM  

Morality comes from the family, the church, the culture -- NOT the central government. The founders never wanted the central goverment to legislate much of anything -- ESPECIALLY morality. And they were right.

Anyway Vox, to paraphrase Claude Rains, I'm shocked SHOCKED that you think this there will be MORE gambling as a result of this that will erode the moral fabric, and that it's just a slippery slope into other forms of moral decay.

The poor will always be with us. Gambling will always be with us. Whoredom will ALWAYS be with us.

Besides, I kill myself every day for not putting 100 pounds down on Leciester City to win the Premier League in 2015.

Meanwhile, you've been to London, and there's a Ladbrokes on every corner. The moral proble in England is not gambling, it's the fact that Sadiq Khan is the mayor, and roving gangs of jihaddists are raping 12 year olds.

It would be better if they spent more time wagering, and less time ruining the British way of life. Fat effin' chance of that.

Blogger rumpole5 May 14, 2018 4:28 PM  

When Florida implemented the lottery I told my friends that it was about time that the poor and stupid paid their full share. Exorbitant rates on cigarettes and alcohol were just not bringing in enough revenue from that group!

Blogger Matt May 14, 2018 4:30 PM  

As it is, with FOSTA, we're already inching closer toward state regulated prostitution. It will be so boring.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd May 14, 2018 4:31 PM  

Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:OC,

Vox is making the point that wanting to gamble in the first place is evidence of the moral code crumbling.


Yes, it's yet another example of turpitude. I agree with the supreme court that this is unconstitutional, but the constitution is the window dressing for their decision, not the actual basis. If they actually took the constitution seriously, they would have to throw out every precedent since 1860, and many from earlier.

Noah B The Savage Gardener wrote:The judicial system worked pretty well up until 1861. Despite widespread contemporary criticism the SCOTUS actually upheld the law in Dredd Scott. The Civil War broke the original USA.

Since the invasion of the Confederacy, the judicial system has never done anything which imperiled the power or extent of Mr. Lincoln's empire. Every unconscionable, unconstitutional thing we see the feds doing today has been found ``constitutional'' by a supreme court which knows which side of its bread is buttered, and who buttered it.

Blogger James Dixon May 14, 2018 4:33 PM  

> When designing a government system for the future, remember that it is the judicial branch and the concept of "interpreting the law" that proved to be the weak point.

One of the weak points. A much more limited taxation system needs to spelled out too. Preferably only one type of taxation with a maximum percentage allowed.

> Vox is making the point that wanting to gamble in the first place is evidence of the moral code crumbling.

People have been gambling as long as we have recorded history. It's institutionalized, state sanctioned gambling that is the issue here, not gambling as such.

> the Civil War broke the original USA.

Yep. We've been an empire since.

Blogger Cloudbuster May 14, 2018 4:44 PM  

One of the weak points. A much more limited taxation system needs to spelled out too. Preferably only one type of taxation with a maximum percentage allowed

A much more limited taxation system was spelled out. We broke that with the 16th amendment.

Blogger The Remnant May 14, 2018 4:45 PM  

While I agree with the substance of the federal law in question, it remains improper because the federal government has no enumerated power to regulate gambling. Salvaging American society depends on the decentralization of power and the fostering of competition among the states (whose power is presumptive, unlike the federal government's). Unfortunately, people shelve their concerns about limited government when a given federal law happens to be a good one. Being good isn't good enough -- it's far better to have a weak federal government that is bad than a powerful federal government that is good.

Blogger Chris Lutz May 14, 2018 4:51 PM  

KPKinSunnyPhiladelpia wrote:Morality comes from the family, the church, the culture -- NOT the central government. The founders never wanted the central goverment to legislate much of anything -- ESPECIALLY morality. And they were right.


The tired "legislating morality" argument. Legislating against murder, stealing, etc. is legislating morality. Most laws have some moral component to them. The concept that law can be divorced from morality is fanciful thinking.

Noah B The Savage Gardener wrote:The judicial system worked pretty well up until 1861. Despite widespread contemporary criticism the SCOTUS actually upheld the law in Dredd Scott. The Civil War broke the original USA.

The Civil War did not break the courts or the US. FDR broke the courts in the 30's because they were actually the only thing standing in his way. Meanwhile, Wilson (another academic) did a lot to break the country with his progressivism. The only thing the Civil War did was make clear that you couldn't just opt out of the country on a whim without either negotiating it or winning through force of arms. The CSA Constitution made it clear that secession was not an option.

OpenID bgkoranburner May 14, 2018 4:53 PM  

What's next? Prostitution and sex slavery, presumably.

Perhaps the sport of Prostitute punching, rooster or dog fighting. Wouldn't it be funny if the same ruling cleaned up Pete Rose & Mike Vick?

helped fund the mafia, is an indication of a "moral code" issue. Gambling regulation is mostly just rent-seeking

I believe it was PA that passed a law allowing gambling in all bars, but the regulations were so onerous that no one wanted a license.

Blogger Josh (the sexiest thing here) May 14, 2018 4:58 PM  

The crumbling of the American moral code continues:

Why is Matt Walsh guest blogging for Vox?

Blogger Wes350 May 14, 2018 4:58 PM  

KPKinSunnyPhiladelpia wrote:

.... Gambling will always be with us. Whoredom will ALWAYS be with us.

....


Man sins. That doesn't mean that you endorse the sin by allowing unfettered profligate behavior.

Murder will always be with us.

But pretty much everyone agrees that having laws banning certain sins, even if they don't stop the act 100% - is vastly better than the alternative.


And yes, Judicial Review is a concept that needs to be nipped in the bud. HARD.

Blogger The Observer May 14, 2018 5:01 PM  

The court’s ruling that the law is unconstitutional, which came by a 7-2 vote, sets the stage for states to start allowing gambling on sports.

...

When designing a government system for the future, remember that it is the judicial branch and the concept of "interpreting the law" that proved to be the weak point.


Once more, a piece of paper is proved to be as much again.

The anti-federalists foresaw clever re-interpretation of words on paper a long time coming.

The tired "legislating morality" argument. Legislating against murder, stealing, etc. is legislating morality. Most laws have some moral component to them. The concept that law can be divorced from morality is fanciful thinking.

Laws aren't for the moral, they're for the immoral. Legislating morality, maybe not, but I can damn well legislate behaviour.

Blogger NO GOOGLES May 14, 2018 5:06 PM  

I'm starting to think that the joke that has step 1 as "kill all the lawyers" should have an addendum saying "judges are also lawyers".

I find it hard to blame the specific justices for this action though. The old law was written so stupidly that it would have been an exercise in total judicial fiat to uphold it. And dontcha know, that's only OK when it's in favor of the right (((people))). How would these justices have been able to show their faces at the next cocktail party if they did that?

We live in an age of moral cowards.

Blogger NO GOOGLES May 14, 2018 5:09 PM  

We can argue whether the courts as an institution are the problem until the cows come home. Don't expect institutions to uphold morals that the society that created them does not.

Maybe the courts were a useful and well designed (for the most part) institution in the past but they can't save us from the moral depravity that runs rampant in the rest of the country.

Blogger FALPhil May 14, 2018 5:13 PM  

rumpole5 wrote:
When Florida implemented the lottery I told my friends that it was about time that the poor and stupid paid their full share. Exorbitant rates on cigarettes and alcohol were just not bringing in enough revenue from that group!


That was my argument for the lottery when the Florida legislature was debating it - poor people need to pay taxes, too.

Chris Lutz wrote:
The Civil War did not break the courts or the US. FDR broke the courts in the 30's because they were actually the only thing standing in his way.


No, it was Lincoln. FDR never threatened to throw SCOTUS justices and their families in prison if they didn't go along with his trashing of the Constitution. Lincoln did. And USA prisons were a lot more brutal in the mid-1800s than they are today.

Blogger ted beale May 14, 2018 5:16 PM  

oh shut the fuck up you puritan cuck. so gambling is bad, but aligning your business/family and promoting homosex jews and mental midgets is good?...nice ted. nice...hint: anything that diminishes the mormon/jew alliance in las vegas is a godsend. thanks new jersey!

p.s. you speaking on morals is fucking lol
signed, elena and sonia


NO GOOGLES wrote:We live in an age of moral cowards.

yes, many of them are churchians that have blogs that cater to idf dads and openly promote rapist homosexual jews.

Blogger pyrrhus May 14, 2018 5:16 PM  

Well, the law was a blatant, and irrationally selective, intrusion on States' rights, and personal freedom. I can't see any way it could be upheld. Hope it becomes a trend.

Blogger pyrrhus May 14, 2018 5:19 PM  

Note that States are still permitted to ban all gambling with no exceptions, unlike Gay Marriage, abortion and contraception.

Blogger James Dixon May 14, 2018 5:21 PM  

> ted beale

Shut up, Tad.

Blogger James Dixon May 14, 2018 5:23 PM  

> Note that States are still permitted to ban all gambling with no exceptions...

The states are desperate for tax revenues. Almost none of them will. They'll just tax the daylights out of it. I expect the same for marijuana eventually.

Blogger Giraffe May 14, 2018 5:29 PM  

You finally convinced me to be more libertarian and now you're telling me Jerry Falwell was right.

Blogger Crew May 14, 2018 5:32 PM  

What's next? Prostitution and sex slavery, presumably.

An important question that Jewish brothel owners will want answered:

Are sex robots prostitutes or sex slaves or neither?

Blogger Resident Moron™ May 14, 2018 5:38 PM  

The state is inherently mercenary and immoral so it starts with taxes.

Back in New Zealand when drug dealing and prostitution were both illegal you could still use either one to explain your income to the tax department and they would not tell the police, even though a private citizen could be held liable for harm caused by a crime they knew of but did not report.

Double standards; sounds familiar, eh?

Now drug dealing is still illegal but prostitution is not, because reasons ...

Like I said, it’s not a slope it’s a cliff but because it’s a very long way down the fact you don’t immediately die fools people into thinking that jumping off is safe. They always act surprised when the inevitable fatalities occur.

Ecclesiastes 8: 11

OpenID genkong May 14, 2018 5:44 PM  

Yet Wickard (you cannot grow food on land you own to feed yourself - because interstate commerce) remains "the law of the land" in the Banana Empire. This latest is another example of Sam Francis' anarcho-tyranny in action. "Law" is what ever it means to a gang of blackrobed philosopher-kangz on a particular day.

Blogger Lovekraft May 14, 2018 5:45 PM  

o/t but found this youtuber (ThatUmbrellaGuy) who is bringing a lawyer's analysis to the comic book SJW mob's actions. A new phase of push-back against these crybullies. "Social Justice is not a legal defense."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5LlzIjhtPs

Blogger NO GOOGLES May 14, 2018 5:49 PM  

@23
"hint: anything that diminishes the mormon/jew alliance in las vegas is a godsend."

You're using the exact same reasoning to justify this court decision that Vox is using to support the people (or at least person) you're crying about.

Maybe borrow a couple brain cells to rub together before you spew your idiocy.

OpenID genkong May 14, 2018 5:50 PM  

NO GOOGLES wrote:
I'm starting to think that the joke that has step 1 as "kill all the lawyers" should have an addendum saying "judges are also lawyers".

The standard joke is: What do you call the schmuck who graduamacated at the bottom of his med-schul class?? (Doctor). OK, so what do you call the one who graduamacated at the bottom of law school class?? Your Honor

Idiocracy wasn't about the future...

OpenID archerfisher21 May 14, 2018 5:56 PM  

The USA already has national lotteries and state lotteries. What difference does betting on sport events make, besides that it's not a 1/850000 chance of winning?

Blogger swiftfoxmark2 May 14, 2018 5:57 PM  

While the remnants of libertarianism in me says, "meh", having been to a casino, it's always poor people of a certain race and IQ who go there.

So I guess not legalizing gambling is racist?

Blogger KPKinSunnyPhiladelpia May 14, 2018 6:03 PM  

Chris Lutz wrote

The tired "legislating morality" argument. Legislating against murder, stealing, etc. is legislating morality. Most laws have some moral component to them. The concept that law can be divorced from morality is fanciful thinking.

You are making a common category error. "Immoral behavior" ia huge category that runs the gamut from Adultery to...well, can't think of "Z" example, but includes, murder, rape, child molestation.

A society should agree on behavior that is "criminal" and duly elected representatives should legislate against that. Legislating broader non-criminal "morality" -- say, alcohol consumption or playing blackjack for money -- is inherently totalitarian.

And within that "criminal" sub-category there are specific gradations -- shoplifiting is much less worse than, say, 1st degree murder.

Blogger Doktor Jeep May 14, 2018 6:04 PM  

Lack of separation between school and state was the other fatal weakness.

Blogger Damn Crackers May 14, 2018 6:08 PM  

@10 - Not surprising, prostitution will be even more restricted following the feminine imperative. Women don't like competition in the sexual market place.

Wait until OSHA gets a hold of the porn industry.

Blogger Othello May 14, 2018 6:08 PM  

"remember that it is the judicial branch and the concept of "interpreting the law" that proved to be the weak point."

This.

Judicial Review. Judicial Discretion. Prosecutorial Discretion. Probable Cause. Corporate Agreements. Parenting Agreements. All depend on what the definition of is, is.

The judiciary is quite literally the 3rd horse of the apocalypse.

Blogger Jack Ward May 14, 2018 6:12 PM  

@8 The founders never wanted the central government to legislate much of anything -- ESPECIALLY morality. And they were right.

True. For a look at what a truly free society would be, fictional, but, oh so inviting, read Michael Z. Williamson's first Freehold book. With all the freedom came an equal amount of direct responsibility, and woe be you should you not live up to that responsibility. I would take it in an instant, though it would mean a long space journey.

Blogger Coyotewise May 14, 2018 6:16 PM  

I take it this is a spot where libertarian ideal takes a back seat to cultural integrity? I guess I haven't thought about gambling in those terms. I'm not very invested in that issue. But I trust your discernment. Is this a big deal?

Blogger Nostromo May 14, 2018 6:20 PM  

Meh, if I want to throw my money away, I should be able to do it however I wish.

Blogger Nate May 14, 2018 6:32 PM  

Don't be fooled people. Vox is just angry because his tribes casino will be facing competition.

Blogger Unknown May 14, 2018 6:36 PM  

when designing a government... it is the judicial branch and the concept of "interpreting the law" that proved to be the weak point.

Just as interpreting Scripture is the weak point when designing a 'righteous' new politic. People always seem to want to believe Romans 7 isn't true for them.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 6:43 PM  

"The good news is that since gambling is essentially a tax on stupidity, the ongoing decline in average US intelligence should help maximize the revenues."

Isn't that a bit eugenic too? Well, at least if we ever cut social security loose...

Blogger Resident Moron™ May 14, 2018 6:48 PM  

The exact problem with judges is that they were all lawyers first. Their entire training is about what the law COULD possibly mean, if you tilt your head bite your tongue snort a line and squint really hard. It’s not about what a common reading with moderate intelligence and local contextual awareness would conclude the law intended to say, it’s about what a trained psychopath can wrest the words to conceivably admit, however unlikely, in order to justify my client.

If I was designing a justice system my very first rule, even before “kill all the lawyers!”, would be that no lawyer can ever become a judge.

The law is a stupid game of conscious perversion, like the stock market that pretends that every share ever issued is as valuable as the last one sold. A mathematical impossibility in most cases but a profitable fiction for the insiders.

Blogger Patrick Kelly May 14, 2018 6:48 PM  

"Legislating against murder, stealing, etc. is legislating morality."

There's no need for federal laws concerning most cases of those either. No constitutional basis either. IIRC there were not federal laws regarding most murder for several decades. Those were mostly prosecuted under state or local jurisdiction. The feds got involved with assassination or other cases dealing specifically with crimes against the feds themselves. Of course this expanded greatly with prohibition and the creation of the FBI, BATF, etc..

Bringing the feds into state or local criminal law enforcement just increased the reach of the police state.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 6:51 PM  

"Are sex robots prostitutes or sex slaves or neither?"

The word robot itself actually means slave.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd May 14, 2018 6:53 PM  

KPKinSunnyPhiladelpia wrote:A society should agree on behavior that is "criminal" and duly elected representatives should legislate against that. Legislating broader non-criminal "morality" -- say, alcohol consumption or playing blackjack for money -- is inherently totalitarian.

Refusing to legislate against alcohol consumption means imposing your pro-alcohol morality on the rest of us. You can't legislate morality? No, you can't legislate anything else!

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 6:53 PM  

"Is this a big deal?"

It never seems like a big deal until you're staring at the literally miles of neon signs advertising it.

Blogger RA May 14, 2018 6:55 PM  

Martin Armstrong has made the point several times that when a commodity or an income producing activity is made illegal, the government has just created a tax free income stream for anyone who wants to supply that illegal good or service. No wonder the cartels got so filthy rich. Not to mention added to the violent conduct because there are no legal remedies when one gets screwed or infringed with. Hence guns and other lethal weapons.

That said, there are still certain commodities and income producing activities that need to be kept illegal as they are just too far to be allowed. E.g., child sex trafficking.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 6:57 PM  

RA, only if the people are willing to partake. No amount of legislation is going to make something happen or not happen if the people want or don't want it enough.

Government legislation is way downstream of culture.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash May 14, 2018 6:58 PM  

Azure Amaranthine wrote:The word robot itself actually means slave.
Robot means "worker". It's from Stanislaw Lem's play Rossum's Universal Workers, which was transliterated into "Robots" when the play was translated into English. The Czech work for slave is "otrok".

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 6:59 PM  

On the other hand, if the punishment is harsh enough, the behavior stops recurring, because those who would be inclined to repeat aren't alive or mobile enough to do so.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 6:59 PM  

Thanks Snidely.

Blogger pyrrhus May 14, 2018 7:00 PM  

The states are desperate for tax revenues. Almost none of them will. They'll just tax the daylights out of it. I expect the same for marijuana eventually.

Many of the states already have lotteries and river boat gambling, which yield substantial revenue....which is contributed voluntarily. Isn't that a lot better than income or property taxes as a source of revenue?

Blogger Snidely Whiplash May 14, 2018 7:00 PM  

When people say "you can't legislate morality", they mean "I don't want you to legislate against immorality of which I approve."

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 7:10 PM  

Once upon a time I didn't mind people using drugs, until I thought for a split second about what those people actually do while high, and/or when they go into withdrawal and they're out of work/money, such as murdering or stealing from other people who had nothing to do with it.

Gambling is the same sort of deal. Another addiction, another set of behaviors that just won't ever be confined entirely to their actual abusers. If you don't legislate it, standard of living goes down for those prone to that particular addiction, and that spreads to the rest of the community in some ways, eventually prompting the otherwise immune to flee.

Also, if you think legislating things isn't working even though the people are largely amenable, your problem is enforcement. People tend to not do things that result in losing a hand... and if the community isn't willing to execute punishment sufficient to deter the crime, your stick's already 100% broken on the carrot/stick persuasion scale.

Blogger Hammerli280 May 14, 2018 7:11 PM  

@47: Yup. An attorney is trained to manipulate the law for his client's benefit. Having such a person on the bench is a danger. What you need are some people accustomed to dealing with contracts. I can find some, if needed.

Blogger van helsing May 14, 2018 7:12 PM  

FDR wanted to pack the court to ensure compliance with his diktats. if he had succeeded, it would have kept happening till (and past the point) that scotus etc dwarfed congress. / gambling? i bet on pro games and usually come out ahead. maybe i'll study my options depending on what this state opts to legalize.

Blogger Nate May 14, 2018 7:15 PM  

"What's next? Prostitution and sex slavery, presumably."

I mean.. honestly... you are to educated to make a statement like this. You know damn well for the majority of our nation's history Prostitution was in fact legal. It is legal today in Nevada. Even in places where it was illegal, like Nashville TN for example, it was practiced out in the open. The laws were not enforced.

We don't have federal laws against murder. Why the hell should we have federal laws against prostitution?

And holy hell since when has government had anything to do with morality?

I mean damn... did you hit your head this morning?

Blogger Ben Cohen May 14, 2018 7:16 PM  

What's the difference between gambling and the stock market?

Blogger dienw May 14, 2018 7:16 PM  

Morality comes from the family, the church, the culture -- NOT the central government. The founders never wanted the central government to legislate much of anything -- ESPECIALLY morality. And they were right.

And there on display is the ego shriek of the libertarian; this is why I despise libertarians. The Founders did not create a constitution to enable the amoral, immoral, and the wicked to increase and thrive;the Constitution was intended to enable the moral to thrive; in fact, they declared that the republic would only last if the people stayed moral: the immoral and profligate cannot expect to thrive under a republic; nor should they expect the government to remain a republic.

Blogger Were-Puppy May 14, 2018 7:26 PM  

How soon until it's legalized to jam an EBT card into a slot machine ?

Blogger Dire Badger May 14, 2018 7:33 PM  

does anyone have any info on the hillary/huma torture video? Or is it vapor?

Blogger Dire Badger May 14, 2018 7:34 PM  

Ben Cohen wrote:What's the difference between gambling and the stock market?

The House Limit.

Blogger James Dixon May 14, 2018 7:42 PM  

> The USA already has national lotteries and state lotteries.

No, the USA has multi-state lotteries. We do not yet have a national lottery.

> ...it's always poor people of a certain race and IQ who go there.

Actually, I understand Vegas makes a killing on moderately wealthy retiree traffic.

> I guess I haven't thought about gambling in those terms. I'm not very invested in that issue. But I trust your discernment. Is this a big deal?

Do you know what the one of the most common locations for a strip club is? Right next to a casino. And what does a strip club inevitably lead to?

> Many of the states already have lotteries and river boat gambling, which yield substantial revenue....which is contributed voluntarily. Isn't that a lot better than income or property taxes as a source of revenue?

Not really, no. Skin in the game is an important factor when it comes to taxes.

Blogger ant becker May 14, 2018 7:45 PM  

NEVER EVER bet using a Sportsbook. It's a mugs game as all betting companies only love losers and 95% of gamblers loose. ALWAYS use an Exchange :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocS3WaXVKuM

Blogger Chris Mallory May 14, 2018 7:46 PM  

dienw wrote:The Founders did not create a constitution to enable the amoral, immoral, and the wicked to increase and thrive;the Constitution was intended to enable the moral to thrive; in fact, they declared that the republic would only last if the people stayed moral:

Of course the nation was founded by men who smuggled, evaded taxes, rioted, shot cops and tarred and feathered government employees.

Hard liquor was the drink of choice by nearly everyone. Drugs were unregulated. Gambling was widespread. Animal blood-sports were popular. Duels were fought by gentlemen. The lower classes brawled. My ancestors ignored the King's law and crossed the Appalachians. In most cities there is that one house or building that was a long time brothel, a few of them are on the historical register. Some of these things do not apply in the puritan northeast. Were these men not moral enough for the government they formed?

Blogger James Dixon May 14, 2018 7:48 PM  

> What's the difference between gambling and the stock market?

The overall market (using the Wilshire 5000 as a proxy) is usually a winning bet, at least over the long term.

Blogger markmclay18 May 14, 2018 7:50 PM  

A man should have the right to assume risk with his own money on whatever the fuck he pleases. Fuck all to do with the State.

Blogger Nate May 14, 2018 7:57 PM  

"Were these men not moral enough for the government they formed?"

shh.... lets not be confusing the matter with actual american history.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd May 14, 2018 8:00 PM  

Chris Mallory wrote:Were these men not moral enough for the government they formed?

Looking at the mess we are in today, I would say that they were not.

Blogger Nate May 14, 2018 8:04 PM  

"Looking at the mess we are in today, I would say that they were not."

Blaming them... when they damn well told everyone the system they created would only last as long as the public could keep it.

Blogger SirHamster May 14, 2018 8:06 PM  

KPKinSunnyPhiladelpia wrote:A society should agree on behavior that is "criminal" and duly elected representatives should legislate against that. Legislating broader non-criminal "morality" -- say, alcohol consumption or playing blackjack for money -- is inherently totalitarian.

You say you support agreement on criminal standards. When society has agreed that playing blackjack for money is criminal, why are you complaining?

When anyone argues against "legislating morality", he is not limiting his opposition to the laws regulating the "minor" stuff. He is speaking against all of the law.

Knowing that man needs the law because man is no angel, this argument for lawlessness needs to be identified for what it is.

Blogger Hammerli280 May 14, 2018 8:10 PM  

And for the record, I'd argue that the real #1 contender for the Who Wrecked America title was Eisenhower's biggest mistake.

Chief Justice Earl Warren. A man whose hands itched for the levers of policy...and should never have been allowed near the bench.

Blogger Dirk Manly May 14, 2018 8:20 PM  

@7

"Fools and their money are soon parted; pro sports are fake and fixed."

With absolutely no apologies to the Michigan Lottery Commission and their most persuasive slogan:

"You can't lose if you don't play."

Blogger Weouro May 14, 2018 8:30 PM  

Co-equal branches of govt my ass

Blogger Dirk Manly May 14, 2018 8:47 PM  

@12

"One of the weak points. A much more limited taxation system needs to spelled out too. Preferably only one type of taxation with a maximum percentage allowed."

Consumption-based taxes are the best, as they inspire and provoke people to create their own wealth from low-value commodities. This spurs industriousness, and kills (or suffocates in the cradle) the welfare state.

Blogger Dirk Manly May 14, 2018 8:49 PM  

@14

"Being good isn't good enough -- it's far better to have a weak federal government that is bad than a powerful federal government that is good."

This should be written across the doors of every building used for a school, college, and university across the nation.

Blogger Dirk Manly May 14, 2018 8:52 PM  

@15

"The Civil War did not break the courts or the US. FDR broke the courts in the 30's because they were actually the only thing standing in his way. Meanwhile, Wilson (another academic) did a lot to break the country with his progressivism. The only thing the Civil War did was make clear that you couldn't just opt out of the country on a whim without either negotiating it or winning through force of arms. The CSA Constitution made it clear that secession was not an option. "

It started with Roosevelt... TEDDY Roosevelt, and his "progressivism" (which we now understand to be merely a fig-leaf term to hide the real agende: Communism).

There's a reason that the ONLY Republican president who the K-12 teachers absolutely adore is Teddy Roosevelt.

Blogger Dirk Manly May 14, 2018 8:53 PM  

@15

" The only thing the Civil War did was make clear that you couldn't just opt out of the country on a whim without either negotiating it or winning through force of arms. The CSA Constitution made it clear that secession was not an option. "

Irony, eh?

Blogger Unknown May 14, 2018 8:56 PM  

How soon until it's legalized to jam an EBT card into a slot machine?

Already here. Australian casinos have been issuing plastic cards to heavy loss high rollers gamblers for jamming the coin/card slot open so it drains their credit faster. Literally a funnel through which to pour their money. But the lightshh are {hic} shhoo pretty...

Blogger Dirk Manly May 14, 2018 8:58 PM  

#28

"You finally convinced me to be more libertarian and now you're telling me Jerry Falwell was right."

It's the most reliable path to the alt-Right

Blogger Dirk Manly May 14, 2018 8:59 PM  

@29

"
An important question that Jewish brothel owners will want answered:

Are sex robots prostitutes or sex slaves or neither?"

Does the on/off switch create a momentary fire while making/breaking contact?

Blogger James Dixon May 14, 2018 9:14 PM  

> When society has agreed that playing blackjack for money is criminal, why are you complaining?

When does society agree that something is criminal? When 90% agree? 80%? 70%? 20%?

If even 20% of a large number of people disagree with a law, enforcing it becomes effectively impossible.

Blogger Nate May 14, 2018 9:31 PM  

"And for the record, I'd argue that the real #1 contender for the Who Wrecked America title was Eisenhower's biggest mistake."

if you want to look at the big mistakes... look at the Tyrant Lincoln and the radical republicans that came with him... and take a good look at Judicial Review.

here's a hint... a government body granting itself massively epic powers outside of the Constitution... is not a good idea.

Blogger Josh (the sexiest thing here) May 14, 2018 9:32 PM  

You say you support agreement on criminal standards. When society has agreed that playing blackjack for money is criminal, why are you complaining?

When did "society" agree to that?

FWIW "society" supports today's ruling: https://blogs.shu.edu/sportspoll/2018/04/26/americans-favor-legalized-sports-betting/

Blogger Unknown May 14, 2018 9:43 PM  

We lost the wars on booze, drugs, gambling and many other vices that don't harm anyone except those who engage in those activities to an extreme level! And it cost us plenty in blood, treasury and constitutional rights to lose those wars as badly as we did!

We are dealing with human beings here, not automatons who have a "morality" circuit and switch built into their brains.

Besides, why should organized crime and corrupt officials (alas, I repeat myself!) have all the fun and make all the money from those harmless vices?

And don't shower me with examples of poor slobs who become "addicted" to those vices and ruin their lives! It's their choice to start and stay addicted. One can become "addicted" to anything! And one can just as easily become "un-addicted".

OpenID Sidehill Dodger May 14, 2018 9:43 PM  

archerfisher21 wrote:The USA already has national lotteries and state lotteries. What difference does betting on sport events make, besides that it's not a 1/850000 chance of winning?

Could it possibly create an incentive to manipulate the outcome of games? Could it create new pressures on players to be corrupt, more employment opportunities for people who twist arms and break legs outside the context of contact sports?

Blogger Nate May 14, 2018 9:50 PM  

"It started with Roosevelt... TEDDY Roosevelt, and his "progressivism" (which we now understand to be merely a fig-leaf term to hide the real agende: Communism)."

bzzt.

no. It started... with Marbury vs Madison.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash May 14, 2018 10:02 PM  

Ben Cohen wrote:What's the difference between gambling and the stock market?
If you're caught manipulating the markets, the penalty is to pay back some small percentage of your illegal gains. If you're caught cheating at cards, you go to prison, presuming you survive that long.

Blogger Wild Ape May 14, 2018 10:37 PM  

I grew up in Nevada and I would go to the buffets at the casinos now and then because the food was good and cheap. I avoided the end of the month because that was when the senior citizens would gamble away their social security checks. Nothing good comes from gambling. I saw how devastating OCD people trainwrecked their lives and I never wanted to gamble. I got fired as a card dealer one night because a guy lost so much money that he had a heart attack and I paused the game while the ambulance came. The pit boss fired me because I stopped dealing cards. This law will just spread the misery and it will be a cancer for the public. The only sane thing about Nevada was that prostitution was confined to the brothels and hookers never walked the streets. Other than that....I'm glad I don't live there any more.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 14, 2018 10:42 PM  

"We lost the wars on booze, drugs, gambling and many other vices that don't harm anyone except those who engage in those activities"

You lost me already, Unknown. They do harm other people. Indirect consequences...

"Besides, why should organized crime and corrupt officials (alas, I repeat myself!) have all the fun and make all the money from those harmless vices?"

See, there's your second disconnect. Making something illegal does not automatically produce organized crime and corrupt officials. Other factors are necessary contributors, two of which I already pointed out as quality of enforcement and severity of punishment.

"And one can just as easily become "un-addicted"."

You need to go back to school. The word "addict" wouldn't exist if getting out were just as easy as getting in. Your entire argument here is denying that the thing you're using as an example exists.

Blogger Jimmy Voxx May 14, 2018 11:42 PM  

Over/under on court vote was 6 unconstitutional.
I won a little bit.

Blogger Ian Stein May 14, 2018 11:49 PM  

Over/Under was 6 for unconstitutional.
I won a little bit.

Blogger Resident Moron™ May 15, 2018 12:14 AM  

“A society should agree...”

The practical matter is that if you don’t have agreement on certain basic fixed principles, you don’t have a society.

Vox emphasizes blood, language, and culture but the purpose and advantage of culture is the perpetuation of shared values. The state always seeks to erode the shared values that define the society it rules because divide and conquer works. Team Blue vs Team Red works.

Blogger Looking Glass May 15, 2018 1:26 AM  

Nate wrote:"It started with Roosevelt... TEDDY Roosevelt, and his "progressivism" (which we now understand to be merely a fig-leaf term to hide the real agende: Communism)."

bzzt.

no. It started... with Marbury vs Madison.


Jefferson should have had the SCOTUS executed for Treason for it. The Republic actually ended that day, though it'd go on for another nearly 60 years before it officially died.

Blogger bob kek mando - ( your mom always did like me best ) May 15, 2018 2:05 AM  

VD
The crumbling of the American moral code continues:



actually, i suspect that this is in line with the 10th Amendment. as with prostitution and alcohol, there is no Constitutional authority for the Federal government to say anything about this one way or the other.

therefore, any such purported Federal "Law" is itself in direct violation of the 10th Amendment.

Blogger Jack Amok May 15, 2018 2:24 AM  

Don't be fooled people. Vox is just angry because his tribes casino will be facing competition.

Bingo. I mean, Yahtzee. Er...

Whether or not gambling is a good idea, and whether or not the Federal government has the power to regulate it, it's a pretty odd argument to make that the Federal government has the legitimate authority to regulate it in some states, but not others. And once the whole tribal casino thing got rolling, it was pretty clear the only honest thing to do was open the floodgates.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 15, 2018 4:55 AM  

"actually, i suspect that this is in line with the 10th Amendment. as with prostitution and alcohol,"

Legality isn't morality.

Blogger Nate May 15, 2018 9:06 AM  

"You lost me already, Unknown. They do harm other people. Indirect consequences..."

Those consequences are insignificant compared to the harm the enforcement of the bans do to everyone.

It is utterly and completely stupid to even discuss making things like this.

its like I tripped and fell into RedState.

Blogger kevmalone May 15, 2018 9:51 AM  

@54
Snidely

Karel Čapek wrote RUR.
Lem was born in 1921, around the same time the play was first produced.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 15, 2018 10:00 AM  

"Those consequences are insignificant compared to the harm the enforcement of the bans do to everyone."

If you're talking short term (say, a generation or so) harm, this is true in some cases. That's basically the same excuse used by every hedonist ever though.

If you want to call it stupid, you need to argue on long term cost/benefit.

Blogger OGRE May 15, 2018 10:00 AM  

I'm late to this discussion, but the decision isn't nearly as broad as everyone is making it out to be.

The SC didn't say Congress can't regulate or prohibit gambling; in fact the opinion says that Congress can do just that. What they did say is that because Congress didn't regulate gambling directly, that they then enlisted the state legislatures to do it for them, in the way Congress wants it done. The Court reasoned that Congress is prohibited from directing the state governments and forcing them or prohibiting them from making their own laws on a matter that Congress hasn't taken upon itself to manage. Congress essentially commandeered the state legislatures here, and the Court said they don't have the power to do that.

Congress can still turn around and prohibit gambling outright, or regulate it in any rational way, based on its Commerce Clause powers. Or they can leave it be and let the states regulate it however they decide to do so.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 15, 2018 10:06 AM  

Obviously the ideal scenario is enforcement at the minimum possible level. If it's not happening, expect it to come from a higher level eventually. Realize that said higher level extends all the way up to God.

Blogger Peaceful Poster May 15, 2018 10:16 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Nobody of Consequence May 15, 2018 12:42 PM  

It's not up to the government to police us. It is up to us to police our self. Morality can never be legislated. Morality comes in the hearts and minds of believers, given by God Himself. We as sinners fail but the entire reason for existence is to do everything possible to become Christlike.

The Framers gave the federal government "few and defined" powers of which interfering in intrastate/individual activities was not one. The judicial branch has been the most dangerous branch usurping powers for themselves and the rest of the feds. 99% of the federal laws are unconstitutional. If it's not explicitly written as a granted power, IT IS NOT GRANTED. There are no implied powers. There are no inherent powers. There are no attached powers. There are no powers that are not right there in the document in explicit detail. The judges lie. The President lies. Congress lies.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd May 15, 2018 2:54 PM  

Nate wrote:Blaming them... when they damn well told everyone the system they created would only last as long as the public could keep it.

It was the founders children who lost the Republic. Who raised their children?

Nobody of Consequence wrote:Morality can never be legislated.

As I said above, all legislation forces one version of morality on everyone.

Nobody of Consequence wrote:Morality comes in the hearts and minds of believers, given by God Himself.

Can't argue with that. Unfortunately, most folks aren't believers. God always has a remnant, but it's usually a tiny percentage.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine May 15, 2018 4:11 PM  

"It's not up to the government to police us. It is up to us to police our self."

Depends on what level of gov you're talking about. Obviously if you can do it yourself your neighborhood/town/city/state/fed gov shouldn't be doing it for you in the ideal circumstances, and yet any sane person will agree that parents ought to govern children, and the just ought to police the unjust. Like I said before, minimum possible level, and if that doesn't/won't work, the next one up has to take a shot at it (eventually), and so forth.

"Morality can never be legislated."

Then the word "legislation" would not refer to something that exists or can exist.

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