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Saturday, June 02, 2018

Darkstream: Hierarchy and Human Behavior



From Hierarchy and Human Behavior.

The important thing to understand is that the names don't matter. This is something that for some
reason a lot of people struggle with; the fact is that we're not creating anything here, we're not inventing anything here. Now I like to use the example of the okapi. The okapi is an animal that looks kind of like a combination of a zebra and a giraffe, and it's only found in some of the deep jungles in Africa. People told scientists and zoologists for decades that this animal existed, but it wasn't "discovered" until you know sometime, in I think it was, in the mid-20th century. And then they named it "the okapi", but the thing that you need to understand is that the animal existed before it was named. The animal was always there.

These behavioral patterns exist and are exhibited on a daily basis by people around you every single day. It doesn't matter what you call them, it doesn't matter whether you think they're good or you think they're bad, you know, all we're doing is recognizing that similar people in similar social positions, they are all playing out the same role.

Chronicle your behavioral patterns with regards to how you interact with others and it's very, very easy to categorize your behavioral form through the eyes of someone else. Most people have no ability, they have no ability whatsoever, to honestly judge themselves. And that's one reason why I  stopped blogging at Alpha Game, because I got so tired of all these people who wanted to talk about
what they were, you know, what other people thought they were, and then argue about what they were. You know, to do that, to focus on that, is to completely miss the point.

It's not about you, it's about how you can anticipate and predict the behavior of others, and anyone can do it. It doesn't matter what you are, you know, doesn't it matter more if you're hiring someone, if you're bringing someone in as a volunteer, isn't it more important to understand whether that person is going to try to take over your company, if they're going to be incapable of taking responsibility and  making decisions on their own, or if they're going to lash out in a fit of rage and attempt to destroy you and the organization if they don't get their way, or if they're going to pay no attention to whatever you tell them to do and they're just going to go off and do their own thing without really paying much attention to what your objectives are?  Wouldn't you agree that being able to distinguish between  those things is much much more important?

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43 Comments:

Blogger Nate73 June 02, 2018 11:49 AM  

Sure. But I think most people don't even think in those terms. Something like Xe has flipped out and trying to destroy my comics company with xer's SJW artwork isn't something most people think of even predicting, let alone preparing for.

Blogger Iamblichus June 02, 2018 11:50 AM  

Great content. Vox can we get your thoughts on cryptocurrencies?

Blogger Ashes June 02, 2018 11:56 AM  

This was pretty enjoyable.
You mentioned that Gammas are good for trivia, fine details and unearthing the various quirks of whatever it is you're discussing. Following up on SSH being an important tool for handing out responsibilities and roles, does this make them decent consultants?

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother June 02, 2018 11:57 AM  

Could we put them in suspended animation until we need monomaniacal levels of knowledge on a particular topic?

Blogger VD June 02, 2018 12:03 PM  

Vox can we get your thoughts on cryptocurrencies?

No. I don't have any.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother June 02, 2018 12:06 PM  

Cryptocurrencies are a sucker's bet.

Blogger Long Live The West June 02, 2018 12:07 PM  

Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Could we put them in suspended animation until we need monomaniacal levels of knowledge on a particular topic?

I don't know why you would want to do that to yourself... Every time you unthaw them you'd get to hear about how you really should keep them around because they're so helpful and informative on a day to day basis.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother June 02, 2018 12:10 PM  

Maybe search engines could replace gammas.

Blogger Iamblichus June 02, 2018 12:17 PM  

Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Cryptocurrencies are a sucker's bet.


Been hearing that since 2012. This sucker rolling in a McLaren

Blogger Rebel Skate June 02, 2018 12:18 PM  

@Ashes
While Gammas have some strengths their cons and potential for engaging in self-destructive behavior makes that it a bit of a gamble to have them around in any capacity.
Even as a consultant, if put forth an idea or proposal and it is rejected, they will likely take that personally and hop on the bitter bus. At that point their actions cannot be trusted. They will hold a grudge and give bad information or withhold critical information merely out of spite.
Think of it in terms of sports. Someone may be a great wide receiver but if their attitude always causes locker-room drama and division within the team then it is in the best interest of the organization to remove that cancer from the team. My analogy is a bit of a poor one as I have never met a Gamma who was that great in terms of their strengths.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother June 02, 2018 12:19 PM  

I just realized there are no gammas types at my company. We are too small and too performance focused to put up with one. Our CEO is good about that. If they don't fit our culture he doesn't hire them. Out of 30+ people there, only five are not white men.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother June 02, 2018 12:19 PM  

Iamblichus wrote:Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Cryptocurrencies are a sucker's bet.

Been hearing that since 2012. This sucker rolling in a McLaren


That's what the first guys in on a Ponzi scheme say too.

Blogger Iamblichus June 02, 2018 12:22 PM  

Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Iamblichus wrote:Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Cryptocurrencies are a sucker's bet.

Been hearing that since 2012. This sucker rolling in a McLaren


That's what the first guys in on a Ponzi scheme say too.




Maybe u should watch the gamma video again

Blogger insight June 02, 2018 12:23 PM  

"Cryptocurrencies are a sucker's bet."

Either way its coming. Revelation 13:17

Blogger VD June 02, 2018 12:23 PM  

This sucker rolling in a McLaren.

Then perhaps you should consider backing Alt-Movies....

Blogger Iamblichus June 02, 2018 12:28 PM  

VD wrote:This sucker rolling in a McLaren.

Then perhaps you should consider backing Alt-Movies....



Yeah let me know. Im on Voxiversity - Iamblichus. Quick though before the bitcoin ponzi collapses!

Blogger Long Live The West June 02, 2018 12:32 PM  

@8

Now that I think about it.... maybe search engines have something to do with all the gamma rage these days. Its got to be depressing to have the only thing you're good at be replaced by a computer.

So I think the answer is that they already have.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother June 02, 2018 12:34 PM  

Iamblichus wrote:Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Iamblichus wrote:Stg58/Animal Mother wrote:Cryptocurrencies are a sucker's bet.

Been hearing that since 2012. This sucker rolling in a McLaren


That's what the first guys in on a Ponzi scheme say too.


Maybe u should watch the gamma video again


Yes, Iamblichus, I understand you've made a lot of money on cryptocurrencies. The entire concept has always looked like a Ponzi scheme or junk bonds to me. Plus, all of my End the Fed friends jumped on board screaming like obssessed people. The same people who screamed at the Fed for a fiat currency all pegged the needle for crypto. This is the part that never made sense to me. At least you can hold a Federal Reserve Note.

Blogger Brett baker June 02, 2018 12:50 PM  

Are you saying Glen Beck might not know what he's talking about?

Blogger Brett baker June 02, 2018 12:50 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother June 02, 2018 12:51 PM  

That is a safe assumption. On many levels, orthagonal vectors, dimensions, etc.

Blogger Matt Robison June 02, 2018 1:02 PM  

A good figure to study is Ben Franklin. We was a master of predicting other people's behavior and making friends out of enemies. A social pragmatist who had to learn the hard way after being burned over and over again.

Blogger insight June 02, 2018 1:09 PM  

"Then perhaps you should consider backing Alt-Movies...."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/movies/news/‘solo’-continues-to-nosedive-at-box-office/ar-AAy8C9Z?ocid=spartanntp

Blogger VFM #7634 June 02, 2018 1:46 PM  

VD:

You touched on some aspects in this video that I never heard before. For example, I think I now starting to understand the difference between Beta and high Delta.

Also, about how being a Sigma can be a pain in the a--. What would you say a typical Sigma's employment prospects are like?

Blogger Ashes June 02, 2018 2:18 PM  

@Rebel Skate very true, people who exhibit needlessly vindictive behavior are a drain, and I'd hate to have them in a position to "give me advice".

Maybe a good job for a more gregarious Beta?

Blogger GM June 02, 2018 2:33 PM  

Vox,

You mentioned in passing at some point that there are observable subtypes within the ranks. If you devote another darkstream to these issues, can you break them down for us?

Blogger Resident Moron™ June 02, 2018 2:58 PM  

"It's not about you, ..."

It was all making sense up to this part.

Blogger Lyon June 02, 2018 3:34 PM  

"...the names don't matter. This is something that for some
reason a lot of people struggle with; the fact is that we're not creating anything here."

Agree. We know it when we see it. Pattern recognition. Use it or lose it.

Blogger Lyon June 02, 2018 3:40 PM  

@4. Stg58/Animal Mother

Good call.

Blogger FSL June 02, 2018 6:59 PM  

I noticed you did not catalogue any negative tendencies of Beta Males, though you did mention at least some for the other personality types. Would a negative trait be feigning competence in order to elevate social status? To what extent are alphas prone to do the same?

Blogger Looking Glass June 02, 2018 7:46 PM  

VFM #7634 wrote:VD:

You touched on some aspects in this video that I never heard before. For example, I think I now starting to understand the difference between Beta and high Delta.

Also, about how being a Sigma can be a pain in the a--. What would you say a typical Sigma's employment prospects are like?


"I hope you like to travel."

Blogger Looking Glass June 02, 2018 7:55 PM  

As for cryptocurrencies, if you took a low risk back when they first started and rode it out, great! You rode the dumb-luck investment of the decade. Everything you rationalize about why it worked is wrong.

BlockChain-like tech is here to stay. As someone finally cracks a far more efficient way of managing a decentralized ledger, it's going to replace most of the backends of major Banks & Financial companies. "FinTech" is the term.

One coin is eventually going to dominate for cross-border trade. Possibly in SE Asia to start. The transaction cost can be pushed so low that it could finally make Internet-based Electronic purchases cost effective, to the point you could "tip" someone 25 cents for something. Small transactions are cost prohibitive with the current systems, which is where a coin-based one would be far cheaper.

Blogger S1AL June 02, 2018 7:57 PM  

@FSL -

Vox and others have noted that Betas exist in a sort of sweet spot: 80% of the upside for 20% of the effort, or however you want to describe it. I like to think of it as alpha goods without alpha ambition.

And that's the biggest weakness: Betas often struggle to step into Alpha shoes when necessary, even though that's their role.

Blogger Looking Glass June 02, 2018 8:12 PM  

S1AL wrote:@FSL -

Vox and others have noted that Betas exist in a sort of sweet spot: 80% of the upside for 20% of the effort, or however you want to describe it. I like to think of it as alpha goods without alpha ambition.

And that's the biggest weakness: Betas often struggle to step into Alpha shoes when necessary, even though that's their role.


In a hierarchy, Betas can get over-prompted, which can ruin them. They end up in a job that's simply "too big" for them, and it starts to show through. Betas make good Mayors of medium-sized towns, but they'd be overwhelmed in a much larger place.

At least, that's my read for where the Beta distinction breaks down.

On Sigma's & work, the Sigma can easily become a hierarchy assassin. That's the real downside of them. It's not about their work product, it's the fact that they are going to simply do what they want, in the end, without too much respect for the hierarchy. As Vox mentioned, he got fired by his own father.

Within the Socio-Sexual Hierarchy, you also see this play out. Alphas are always competing with other Alphas for position. The Sigma is, thus, the biggest worry for the Alpha, since the Sigma will destroy an Alpha's position for no other reason than it seemed like the proper move. This can easily happen within companies, which is why, if you have a highly placed Sigma, expect that the person will get most of the "travel opportunities". Most especially since when he isn't in the office, he's doing something productive for the company with much less downside risk.

Blogger Looking Glass June 02, 2018 8:14 PM  

Over-promoted. Ugh. I must be grammar blind to my first sentences.

Blogger VFM #7634 June 02, 2018 8:53 PM  

Looking Glass

Considering everything you mentioned, I could very easily see Sigmas having a hard time getting employment, even if they try their hardest to imitate Deltas and not rock the boat... and that they often have to either find some way to be self-employed, or in a worst-case scenario, be supported by their wives.

Blogger Looking Glass June 02, 2018 9:14 PM  

@36 VFM #7634

Sigmas don't have issues finding jobs. It's staying in them all that long that'll normally be the issue. Sigmas, being somewhere in the Beta to Alpha range, will seem like they're prized recruits, right up until the moment they realized it was a bad idea to hire them.

Contract-type work will probably suit most of them better, or running a business that interests them personally. The most Sigma-y type of work that comes to mind is "Design Engineering". Design Engineers aren't a huge field, but they all move project to project. Rarely do they get a permanent position, but it's still extremely high-end production engineering. And I think I just explained why Car Designers constantly move company to company, haha.

If you know computer hardware well enough, you might know the name Jim Keller. There's the standard issue with engineers jumping between companies, but Keller has jumped between all of them. And then helped create extremely important computer architectures everywhere he does.

Blogger LP999-16 June 03, 2018 12:06 AM  

Great listening, is it possible to devote a thread in addition to this regarding gamma hire horror stories?

Blogger VD June 03, 2018 6:23 AM  

I could very easily see Sigmas having a hard time getting employment, even if they try their hardest to imitate Deltas and not rock the boat... and that they often have to either find some way to be self-employed.

I have not been hired once for a proper job since high school.

Blogger wreckage June 03, 2018 8:50 AM  

I would say the problem with betas is that they could step up, but don't quite have the instincts for it; since they get to where they are on instinct, they then often flounder.

They have the potential to do the jobs an alpha can, but they tend to be uncomfortable applying any "mongrel" to the situation. In some cases a motivated Delta will exceed a Beta when forced into an Alpha role, because he cares less about getting along, and more about getting the job done.

Just some thoughts and observations from my limited experience.

Blogger wreckage June 03, 2018 8:57 AM  

To put it another way, and Vox correct me if I'm messing up your theory, but:
Alphas, Betas and Sigmas are all very socially adept. Alphas CAN use their social aptitude and empathy at will to further their goals. Sigmas ONLY use their social aptitude to further their goals. Betas have the social aptitude and empathy but strongly prefer not to nakedly advance their own goals outside of the purely social competition.

Or, in the Australian idiom: ideal quantity of mongrel, too much mongrel, and the proverbial "not enough mongrel". Sub in sociopathy or ego etc.

Blogger VFM #7634 June 03, 2018 4:53 PM  

@Looking Glass @VD
I'm now thinking that Sigmas make terrible wage-slaves but are good at making money in other ways. That would make sense.

Blogger John Elvidge June 06, 2018 11:30 AM  

The best leaders I've ever seen always knew the strengths and weaknesses of all their people and placed people where they could either do no damage or do great things. In the situation I was in, we had no real choice who was in our unit unless the person was incompetent, but even then, it was hard to get rid of them depending on the circumstances. The best leaders tried to keep us 'sheltered' from the BS politics of the 'head shed' so we could make them shine. Those who tried to gain attention from the 'head shed' directly and not through the unit were quickly crushed by the best leaders. If you can't be a good subordinate, in most cases you’re not going to be a good leader. Of course, this is in an average military unit in peacetime, it changed during deployment. We quickly dumped those who we all knew were going to get someone killed. Too bad many in the 'head shed' had no issue with anyone else getting killed as long as they got a medal and a ticket to the top. If you’re in a position to choose your team, make sure you don’t regret your decisions later.

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