ALL BLOG POSTS AND COMMENTS COPYRIGHT (C) 2003-2018 VOX DAY. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. REPRODUCTION WITHOUT WRITTEN PERMISSION IS EXPRESSLY PROHIBITED.

Sunday, July 01, 2018

Mailvox: shaking off the dust

A reader realizes that his church is politicized, cucked, and anti-Biblical. Time to find a new place of worship:
We've been attending a church for some time now that has pretty good doctrinal foundation, but there have been noticeable cracks.  I was content to stay for the time being, but today was the last straw.  After the worship set, we were subjected to a morbidly obese, unmarried, nose ring-wearing black woman, claiming the title and mantle of a Deacon, taking to the pulpit and instructing us as a congregation to have a time of special prayer on behalf of the children being separated from their families at the southern border.  She was sure to say "this is not political", but then proceeded to levy Deuteronomy 10 in order to emotionally blackmail us, deceitfully using "sojourner" to represent permanent and illegal invaders. The Lord has a heart for these children, of course, and so should we, but the political implications and undertone were clear.

Furthermore, not once have I heard anyone take to the pulpit and ask for a special time of prayer for orphans in our own state or city.  Not once have I heard them ask for a special time of prayer for something that substantially affects our own community, such as the opioid epidemic.  Not once have I heard them address the severe negative effects that our society has borne (and will bear) due to mass immigration - from crime, physical and career displacement, increased debt/taxes, to the eventual collapse of federal finances due to the increased welfare, etc.  No, we had to have a special time of prayer over a mere 2,000 children that might have been temporarily separated from their "parents" as their bullshit asylum claims were adjudicated.  It was all I could do to not stand up and confront this shameful display by shouting her down.

The wife and I left immediately after, and are now seeking a new church home, however I have little hope that we would be able to find any American church that will boldly stand up for our own people first.  If I were so equipped, I would start one myself.  For now, the best I can do is to try and positively influence my family and friends to be aware about what is happening to our civilization, and do what we can to stem the tide.
If Christians would simply do a better job of a) following the clear instructions in the Bible, and, b) policing their institutions and organizations, this mass exodus would not be necessary. But for some reason, welcoming everyone is almost always accorded a higher priority than anything else, despite Paul's explicit warning about wolves in sheep's clothing.

The one thing I would recommend to the reader is to not disappear, but be sure he informs the pastor and the board of deacons why his family will not be attending that institution that used to be a church. Any church that has female priests, pastors, or deacons is already dead, I am not aware of a single example of a church that has adopted them that has not subsequently seen a rapid decline in both its teachings and its attendance.

Labels: ,

118 Comments:

Blogger The Kurgan July 01, 2018 5:12 PM  

Well.... we need to visit another country to get some decent Church time.
But you can catechise yourself quite decently at home with a little effort and reading.

Blogger AvocadoBob July 01, 2018 5:25 PM  

I ran into the same kind of problem. U had been dissatisfied with mainline Protestant churches for some time, but the final straw was when (this was in 2014 or so) the pastor at our (I was living and going with my parents) then-current church, a white guy, proceeded to lecture us about discrimination, and then had the black choir director stand up and give a testimony about how he went into a rather expensive store in downtown Athens, GA, and was “watched the whole time” because he was black (allegedly).

I, being young, foolish, and bluepilled, waited for the other example sure to follow, of a white person being mistreated by a minority because they were white.

Nope. The passive-aggressive cuckblasting continued (with “Yes, Lawd”s from the Ethnic Peanut Gallery).

I checked out for real after that. Took naps when i did attend, for which my mother was pissed, but I didn’t give a damn anymore.

Three years later, I found the Eastern Orthodox Church (with help from an online buddy named JimmyTheGreek), and haven’t looked back.

One would strongly encourage this person to find an Orthodox (Greek or Russian, the only real difference is the language) Church and get involved.

It sure as hell changed my life.

Blogger James Dixon July 01, 2018 5:26 PM  

If the reader is willing to share their location, other readers may be able to offer suggestions. I can understand if they don't want to do that.

Blogger VFM #7634 July 01, 2018 5:28 PM  

"Any church that has female priests, pastors, or deacons is already dead"

And the sooner people realize that BLACK WOMEN never have anything useful to say, let alone are anywhere close to being the holy legitimate arbiters of virtue even cucks constantly portray them as, the better.

Blogger Rebel Skate July 01, 2018 5:32 PM  

If anyone in the Omaha area needs a church I highly recommend Southview Bible Church over in Council Bluffs.
Additionally, if anyone can point me to a good church in the Shreveport-Bossier area I would appreciate it

Blogger Gritón del Desierto July 01, 2018 5:35 PM  

Here in LatAm we have a similar problem.While most evangelical churches are against abortion and gay marriage a lot of them have female pastors,who usually are the pastor's wife.Also they support this G12 system,that it's basically the model of church that Joel Osteen and Rick Warren promote,prosperity gospel+the kabbalistic goal of bring the things of Heaven to Earth.Only difference that it was "invented" by a Colombian pastor who got a vision where Jesus told him to do that.lol
This "conservative feminism" reached the Catholic Church too.Some months ago,there was a public act in memory of woman saint.It was broadcasted and some nuns were talking about her and you couldn't take the difference between them and the feminists who whine about the opressed women and the patriarchal society

Blogger NO GOOGLES July 01, 2018 5:36 PM  

An honest question that is not meant as criticism: If you are leaving that Church, why not challenge her? What do you have to lose in pointing out that what she is saying IS political? I understand you might be worried about the social implications, but one of the reasons that so many churches have been taken over by this nonsense is BECAUSE no one will stand up to it before it's too late. I'm sure there are people who would agree with you in the congregation.

I just don't understand the mindset. Social stigma is probably the most effective weapon SJWs wield against us yet so many still allow it to be used against them when they have a chance to fight it. I understand when there are times you can't risk it, but how is this one of them?

Blogger Mr.MantraMan July 01, 2018 5:44 PM  

Maybe mention "The Heretics of St. Possenti."

Blogger Looking Glass July 01, 2018 5:48 PM  

@7 NO GOOGLES

Religious wars of the Middle Ages. Not really joking. It's cultural traits among Westerners to not go full-on at each other in these types of situations. It historically ends up in a lot of dead people. It's also much safer to just disappear.

Not condoning the approach, but it is what it is.

Blogger ThirdMonkey July 01, 2018 5:51 PM  

All you have to do is push back with Bible in tow.

A couple of years ago, our pastor thought it would be a good idea to add single moms to the list of widows for the deacons to care for. After a couple of phone calls with the pastor and a heated deacons meeting, myself and couple of other deacons put that nonsense down pretty quickly using nothing but Scripture. Haven't had any cuckiness come up from our pastor since. Most of this SJW nonsense comes from some whining woman who got the idea most likely from a Beth Moore-type women's "bible" study. "No" and "sit down and be quiet" is sufficient if you nip it in the bud when the whining starts. The second source is busybodies. Once again, "no" and "sit down and be quiet" works quite well. Also, the husbands of these loudmouths and busybodies need some stern admonishment about growing a set and ruling your house well. Your pastor also needs to know that he needs the backing and encouragement of the men of the church, not the women, old people, and kids.

Above all, pray for and with your pastors, elders, and deacons. They need it.

Blogger Reasonably Honest July 01, 2018 6:00 PM  

Orthodox Christianity really does offer a unique combination or tradition and relevance today.

I'm joining once I decide on a church. There are at least a dozen different branches in this large city and each one is unique but the same where it counts.

Say what you want about the Americanness of Orthodoxy, but it looks and feels right to me. Haven't seen a woman outside the pews or a rainbow flag anywhere.

Blogger Chiva July 01, 2018 6:05 PM  

"But for some reason, welcoming everyone is almost always accorded a higher priority than anything else, despite Paul's explicit warning about wolves in sheep's clothing."

Catch us the foxes,
The little foxes that spoil the vines,
For our vines have tender grapes.
-Song of Solomon 2:15

Blogger Sterling Pilgrim July 01, 2018 6:07 PM  

I concur, and growing up in the south, there were plenty of audible men who would echo “amen!” Now we need men to shout “sit down and stop dividing us!”

Blogger Zaklog the Great July 01, 2018 6:12 PM  

I was thinking about why women in leadership goes so badly, and here are my ideas. The real problem is not women themselves, but that society, in general, is not willing to hold women morally accountable in the same way we do men. Having listened quite a bit to Mr. Molyneux, I suspect this may have biological roots and so be nearly universal. Now, there are a lot of flaws we can deal with in a leader, but a lack of moral accountability is not one of them.

Feel free to tell me if I'm on the right track of just crazy here.

Blogger Dire Badger July 01, 2018 6:12 PM  

VFM #7634 wrote:"Any church that has female priests, pastors, or deacons is already dead"

And the sooner people realize that BLACK WOMEN never have anything useful to say, let alone are anywhere close to being the holy legitimate arbiters of virtue even cucks constantly portray them as, the better.


Truer words are seldom spoken.

Blogger FALPhil July 01, 2018 6:12 PM  

Probably the most ignored chapter in the Bible, after Romans 9, is Genesis 11.

Blogger James Dixon July 01, 2018 6:15 PM  

> Additionally, if anyone can point me to a good church in the Shreveport-Bossier area I would appreciate it.

If you're willing to deal with an Anglican derived church, it appears there may be a Reformed Episcopal Church called All Saints in Shreveport. They have a Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/AllSaintsREC/ but it hasn't been updated in quite a while.

Blogger DraveckysHumerus July 01, 2018 6:17 PM  

I was raised Episcopal 70-80's. I served as acolyte until I was age 17 and graduated h.s. despite declaring my atheism age 12 due to a brilliant humanities and latin teachers' influences, said declaration later revised. I qualify for an orthodox church based on my surname (but not genetics) and my sole spouse in this life is a lapsed Catholic. I live in Chicago.

I can't find a Christian organization let alone a church here which does not resort to dramatic "interpretations" or otherwise is converged. I welcome suggestions for some place to go.

Blogger Rebel Skate July 01, 2018 6:27 PM  

@ James Dixon
Thank you for the suggestion, its worth a look. Worst case scenario is its compromised just like the rest

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother July 01, 2018 6:30 PM  

Rebel Skate, try this one in Shreveport. My grandmother was baptized here as the bombs were dropping on Pearl Harbor.

https://pbchurches.org/2007/11/29/temple-primitive-baptist-church-shreveport-louisiana/

Blogger Looking Glass July 01, 2018 6:30 PM  

Zaklog the Great wrote:I was thinking about why women in leadership goes so badly, and here are my ideas. The real problem is not women themselves, but that society, in general, is not willing to hold women morally accountable in the same way we do men. Having listened quite a bit to Mr. Molyneux, I suspect this may have biological roots and so be nearly universal. Now, there are a lot of flaws we can deal with in a leader, but a lack of moral accountability is not one of them.

Feel free to tell me if I'm on the right track of just crazy here.


Women are genetically incapable of upholding Theology in the ways that are necessary. Their inborn survival strategies will always take over. It doesn't matter how far right-shifted they on a distribution chart, their instincts will always make them compromise things for which there is no compromise.

It's also right there in Genesis 3:

"To the woman he said,

“I will surely multiply your pain in childbearing;
in pain you shall bring forth children.
Your desire shall be contrary to your husband,
but he shall rule over you.”"

Genesis 3:16 ESV

God tells us how things are, we've just spent a long time coming up with explanations for the functional aspects of the nature of The Fall.

Blogger StrongCoffee61 July 01, 2018 6:38 PM  

Leftists live by an anti-golden rule: Don't do unto myself what I would do unto others.

If a leftist suffers a home invasion from an undocumented resident(criminal invader),the lefty will call the domestic version of ICE(local law enforcement) to forcefully remove the invader.

The Leftist doesn't give a rat's ass if the criminal invader is separated from their children by incarceration.
And the leftist would be outraged if the authorities informed them that the home invader had the right to reside in the leftie's home permanently at the leftie's expense.

Relatedly, all patriotic Catholics should demand that the Pope tear down the Vatican walls and lovingly invite hordes of low IQ criminal invaders in Italy to share the space and wealth of Vatican City.

Otherwise, the Pope is engaging in satanic hypocrisy and speaking with the devil's tongue.

Blogger Longtime Lurker July 01, 2018 6:58 PM  

Priveleging Central America over the United States of America is pure Pop Leftism.

Blogger JD Curtis July 01, 2018 7:01 PM  

The (possibly converged) church I attend is going through a series on Exodus.
I think it's going to culminate in an appeal for mass amnesty for illegals, but I'm letting the series play out before rushing to judgement. Two things that caught my attention today were..
A. Pointing out how the Egyptians became dependent on Isrealite labor. I can see this coming up again, and
B. While talking about the origins of Superman, the pastor mentioned he was from a "foreign" planet which I thought was an unusual choice of words.
We'll see.

Blogger Andrew Wetzel July 01, 2018 7:03 PM  

#18, being stuck in Chicago may be the problem. But try checking on some of the Eastern Orthodox churches - Greek or Russian, even Lithuanian (I've seen them before.) Worse thing is you have to learn to cross yourself backwards.

Or, just give up on the godless churches and 'roll your own.' God in in our hearts, not in any specific building (and seems to be remarkably missing in the Vatican...) Knowing you are with Him is what matters. Being in a building full of hypocrites and apostates doesn't matter, for the good, and matters for the evil influence on your soul.

I gave up attending church a long time ago and I am more 'godly' and 'in touch with the holy spirit' now than ever.

Another benefit to going it alone from an established church is that if you feel you must give 10% to God, you can do it directly to an appropriate and non-corrupt charity or social organization (preferably one that the managing directors don't make CEO of large company salaries.)

Blogger Zaklog the Great July 01, 2018 7:19 PM  

@25 I would not recommend trying to be a church of one. That is very clearly not what the Bible teaches us.

Blogger Lamarck Leland July 01, 2018 7:20 PM  

He could have joined the prayer
"...guard the children in the journey back to their own countries and give their parents wisdom that they may turn from breaking the law, amen."

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother July 01, 2018 7:25 PM  

Lamarck Leland wrote:He could have joined the prayer

"...guard the children in the journey back to their own countries and give their parents wisdom that they may turn from breaking the law, amen."


"He who provides not for his own has denied the faith and is worse than an infidel" is also a good one.

Blogger Howard Stone July 01, 2018 7:26 PM  

Tune into Kent Hovind’s YouTube Channel, he’s currently teaching on the book of Nehemiah.

Build the wall.

Blogger The Overgrown Hobbit July 01, 2018 7:34 PM  

The one thing I would recommend to the reader is to not disappear, but be sure he informs the pastor and the board of deacons why his family will not be attending that institution

Alternatively, attend, but tithe to those actually doing God's work, seek out and identify other members of that church to form a small group / home church within the larger body, and step up and teach Sunday School with your wife.

Godspeed

Blogger Avalanche July 01, 2018 7:36 PM  

@24 "but I'm letting the series play out before rushing to judgement."

Why would you not, on behalf of the less-educated/intelligent of your congregation, speak up BEFORE he reaches the direct clear horror he seems to be heading toward -- WHY would you sit silently waiting to see if he is going to ruin your church by 'following this world' instead of the Bible?

Is it not incumbent on you to discuss it with him BEFORE it crashes and burns?

Blogger McChuck July 01, 2018 7:45 PM  

Jesus set the example and showed us the light.
Paul told us what do do and how to do it. The instructions are all there.

Any "church" that ignores the words of Jesus and Paul who was Saul, is no part of of Christendom.

Blogger Andrew Brown July 01, 2018 7:48 PM  

Apostasy is on the rise big time. I even seen this advert for "Christian evidence" saying "Is JP the saviour of Christianity?"
All I could think was what an abomination.

Blogger insight July 01, 2018 7:52 PM  

"No, we had to have a special time of prayer over a mere 2,000 children that might have been temporarily separated from their "parents" as their bullshit asylum claims were adjudicated."

And that's just a walk in the park for CPS who kidnaps American children EVERYDAY by the tens of thousands across the nation. Where are the leftards on that? Oh that's right its ok to do it to Americans on a much larger scale while making a big deal about their globalist foreign tools having it done to them. Much respect to Alex Jones who covered it in detail. For every lefTARD outrage dujour the goobermint is ALREADY doing it 200X more somewhere else that the press is obviously covering up. Half past time to deep six the traitorous media.

Blogger insight July 01, 2018 7:55 PM  

"All I could think was what an abomination."

I'll keep saying it... No MPAI/Churchianity, no globalism, evil is completely dependent on ignorance and stupidity.

Blogger insight July 01, 2018 7:56 PM  

"I'll keep saying it... No MPAI/Churchianity, no globalism, evil is completely dependent on ignorance and stupidity"

Which explains why the mainstream media exists.

Blogger Bastion Harm July 01, 2018 8:01 PM  

"Furthermore, not once have I heard anyone take to the pulpit and ask for a special time of prayer for orphans in our own state or city. Not once have I heard them ask for a special time of prayer for something that substantially affects our own community, such as the opioid epidemic."

Driving by an Episcopal Church in the neighborhood recently, my 9-year old son made an observation. The electronic marquee out in front of the church always displays a message to "love and care for the poor" and its pictures are a motley crew of Muslims, Mexicans, and blacks (and with a rainbow-colored background behind them to boot!)

He then asked: "aren't there any poor whites around here that need help?"

That's when I gave him a lesson on shitlib virtue signalling, and the high they get from it.

Blogger Mr. Deficient July 01, 2018 8:33 PM  

Problem with Orthodox is each church is usually ethnically defined and an Anglo will feel as out of place there as anywhere. It definitely seems to me that they are the most true to the original intention of Christ's church.

Blogger lynnjynh9315 July 01, 2018 8:42 PM  

What are your thoughts on the slow, partial revival of German-American identity after WWI-WWII repression?

Do you think German will ever be a spoken language in America again?

Blogger State Estimation July 01, 2018 8:44 PM  

I am not aware of a single example of a church that has adopted them that has not subsequently seen a rapid decline in both its teachings and its attendance.


The Assemblies of God accepts female pastors and has maintained its doctrine and had modest growth. So far. Ordination has been open to women for 70+ years (IIRC), but they are only at about 5% female lead pastors.







Blogger LR27 July 01, 2018 8:53 PM  

Honestly, I have to drive 45 minutes from Fort Wayne, the city of churches, to find a decent church. There are a couple solid churches here and there, but a church that practices church discipline and casts out people that look to subvert or openly resist scripture is a gem and worth holding on to.

Blogger Dried Iron July 01, 2018 8:56 PM  

The church we were attending turned out to be dry and had a couple other issues, looking for something around Raleigh or Fayetteville.

Blogger bob kek mando - ( "an entirely disconnected spew of word vomit" ) July 01, 2018 9:00 PM  

while i in no way approve of ordaining women, the Methodists did "well" for quite a long time.

http://www.umc.org/what-we-believe/ask-the-umc-when-did-the-church-first-ordain-women

Blogger Snidely Whiplash July 01, 2018 9:02 PM  

If they seat female pastors, then they have already converged their doctrine.

Blogger Phelps July 01, 2018 9:04 PM  

The PCA is currently fighting off an SJW incursion, and doing a pretty good job. I would recommend looking one up. Even there, it is hit or miss. The first church I visited felt off, but the second one was spot on.

And when it is time for the membership to vote on deacons and elders, there is an explicit instruction to "read and reflect on 1 Timothy 2-3 before nominating or voting."

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar July 01, 2018 9:08 PM  

I recommend this one highly:
http://calbapt.org/index.html
Down East, NC.
Pastor Wingard still attacks Communism. Routinely.

Blogger Mr. Smith July 01, 2018 9:10 PM  

Andrew Wetzel, the Catholic Church doesn’t even consider crossing the Eastern way to be backwards. The Ukrainian Catholics, an Eastern Rite in the Catholic Church, cross from right-to-left.

Blogger SciVo July 01, 2018 9:12 PM  

Zaklog the Great wrote:I was thinking about why women in leadership goes so badly, and here are my ideas. The real problem is not women themselves, but that society, in general, is not willing to hold women morally accountable in the same way we do men. Having listened quite a bit to Mr. Molyneux, I suspect this may have biological roots and so be nearly universal. Now, there are a lot of flaws we can deal with in a leader, but a lack of moral accountability is not one of them.

Feel free to tell me if I'm on the right track of just crazy here.


That is only half of the equation. Adam's original sin was to not only fail to condemn a woman breaking God's law, but join her in it; and the Sons of Adam repeat it endlessly. Eve's original sin was to not only listen to some random stranger flattering her that God's law is holding her back from achieving her natural potential, but then invite a man to join her rebellion; and the Daughters of Eve repeat it endlessly.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash July 01, 2018 9:16 PM  

Its not just accountability. Women don't understand the concept of honor. Women don't understand fatherhood, natural or spiritual. Women CANNOT lead.

Blogger HoosierHillbilly July 01, 2018 9:27 PM  

If you are looking into the Reformed side of things, look up one of the members of NAPARC.

http://www.naparc.org/member-churches/directories-2/

Or the Protestant Reformed Church in America side of things is usually a good bet.

No promises on the above, but if you are looking for a beginning for your search, there are a lot worse places to start.

Blogger jb July 01, 2018 9:35 PM  

#41 - LR27

Our Redeemer (LCMS)

https://redeemer-fortwayne.org/

202 West Rudisill Blvd.
Fort Wayne, IN 46807 Map
(260) 744-2585

Check it out.

Blogger SciVo July 01, 2018 9:39 PM  

Leadership is sacrificial, which is to say masculine. I like to point to Quentin Tarantino's True Romance as a work of genius, because it is literally Scott Adams's "two movies on one screen": a pragmatic feminine romance in which the heroine just has to stay out of her own way and let a man take care of her, and a tragic masculine romance in which the hero must give up all of his past attachments to secure a generative future.

Feminism is literally the institutionalization of Eve's original sin of setting her self-actualization above all, and accommodation of feminism is Adam's. That is why professional feminists are so implacably hostile to Biblical Christianity, even as Churchians flail and bend over backwards to cuck their faith in appeasement.

Blogger NO GOOGLES July 01, 2018 9:47 PM  

@39
German is still spoken in the Central Texas Hill country. It's a specific dialect but native German speakers can still understand it fine. Not super popular with the younger people, but there it is.

Blogger Looking Glass July 01, 2018 9:51 PM  

Snidely Whiplash wrote:If they seat female pastors, then they have already converged their doctrine.

Yup, they gone. Most of the Charismatics were gone before they even started.

Blogger tz July 01, 2018 9:51 PM  

High churchers debate sola scriptura and anabaptism.

Whatever this church was, having a morbidly obese woman with a nose-ring (I might even bet it is a lesbian) means it has gone past the starbucks cafe and McPlayland and has gone full freakshow.

(as I type this, Irony, "Progressive" insurance has a misceganistic ad, man white, woman black, sorry for the OT)

Blogger Kat July 01, 2018 9:52 PM  

Phelps wrote:The PCA is currently fighting off an SJW incursion, and doing a pretty good job. I would recommend looking one up. Even there, it is hit or miss. The first church I visited felt off, but the second one was spot on.

And when it is time for the membership to vote on deacons and elders, there is an explicit instruction to "read and reflect on 1 Timothy 2-3 before nominating or voting."


I'd like to hear why you say this. The ReVoice Conference has some of us VERY concerned. Too many pastors are sitting on their hands instead of issuing clear and unequivocal statements that "sexual minorities" are one mincing pony away from a freak show. The conference may claim to support traditional Christian marriage, but they're kicking out the ex-gay folks who want to speak and inviting intersectional blue hairs. Anyone connected with the PCA involved in this needs to be hauled up before the GA and publicly rebuked.

Blogger tz July 01, 2018 9:54 PM  

King Jehu had the right idea on how to handle such

Temples repurposed as rest areas.

Blogger Testy July 01, 2018 10:01 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Testy July 01, 2018 10:02 PM  

@ James Dixon

Any recommendations in the OKC area?

Blogger Lazarus July 01, 2018 10:14 PM  

Zaklog the Great wrote:I was thinking about why women in leadership goes so badly, and here are my ideas. The real problem is not women themselves, but that society, in general, is not willing to hold women morally accountable in the same way we do men. Having
Feel free to tell me if I'm on the right track of just crazy here.


They are not held morally accountable because they have proven to be morally unaccountable in the same way that children are. Which is why children are not considered for church leadership either.
Their natural tendency to emotionalism and vanity, which is a admirable drive in terms of child rearing, is deadly when accepted in positions of leadership, which requires dispassionate analysis and action.

God given talents are a positive when used as designed, but lead to evil when misapplied.

Blogger Testy July 01, 2018 10:26 PM  

Actually anyone at all with recommendations in the OKC area, I'd be much obliged.

Blogger Unknown July 01, 2018 10:35 PM  

If you can find a conservative LCMS Lutheran Church you would probably like it. You can tell the conservative ones because they DON’T have praise bands or a ‘contemporary’ service. Any LCMS congregation offering any contemporary worship has probably sold their birthright for a mess of pottage. However , there are many that have not and are quite solid biblically and confessionally, and just use the liturgies of the Church

Blogger cyrus83 July 01, 2018 10:36 PM  

With regard to Orthodoxy, some things to keep in mind when looking into it:

- Orthodoxy is generally organized around Patriarchates that correspond to nationalities present in Eastern Europe. There have been splits and schisms over the centuries, so research may be in order to understand the hierarchy a particular church follows.
- The theology and worship style are distinctly Eastern compared to the Western theology of the Romans and the Reformers.
- The Orthodox Bible is not the same as a Protestant Bible (specifically the Old Testament). The Orthodox OT is the Greek Septuagint rather than the Jewish Masoretic Hebrew text the Reformers used and includes all the Old Testament books rejected by the Reformers from the Catholic list of canonical books, and also a few other Old Testament texts from the Septuagint that were never in Western Bibles following Jerome's Vulgate.
- Orthodoxy has parallels with Catholicism in general. While not always expressed in the same way, Orthodoxy does have the Theotokos, communion of saints, sacraments (mysteries), relics, icons, hierarchy, and monastics, among other things. As with the Catholics, the Eucharist is the core of the liturgy and held to be the actual body and blood of Christ.

Blogger FALPhil July 01, 2018 10:37 PM  

@56 regarding Revoice:

Revoice is pure, unadulterated SJW entryism at its very worst. As you pointed out, they have kicked the ex-homosexuals to the curb. This alone should be a huge red flag, as it amounts to no-platforming reformed homosexuals (as opposed to the ersatz Reformed homosexuals).

I think Denny Burk has called it; the splintering has already started. This could be as earth shattering as the social issues which begat the PCA back in the '60s and '70s (see Sean Lucas' For A Continuing Church).

There is a propensity for the homosexual community to equate resistance to abnormal sexual practices to rascism (or more correctly, racialism), and indeed there has been a goodly amount of rhetoric developed around that argument, but, even a casual exploration of the comparison exposes the fallacy of it. What is even more curious is that in the Southeast, it is the pastors in predominately black churches that call the fallacy out. It appears that for white churches, it's just one more guilt trip to suffer through.

Blogger RandyJJ July 01, 2018 10:51 PM  

A tactic I used to find a church: Find the homeschool groups in the area. I found a church that hosted an (unaffiliated) homeschool speech group. They were in the middle of going through the book of I Corinthians, and the first week I showed up, the pastor stated from the pulpit that marriage is not about your personal fulfillment or happiness and those aren't valid reasons for divorce.

I attended a dinner that the Pastor's family put on for newcomers and at the after-dinner sit down where everyone got to introduce themselves and ask questions, a guy asked if they would allow female elders. The answer was simple, with no elaboration whatsoever: "No."

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother July 01, 2018 10:54 PM  

Testy,

I've visited the Oklahoma City Primitive Baptist Church, and spent the Sunday afternoon at the pastor's house. As a bonus, the pastor emeritus is in the Oklahoma Patent Attorney Hall of Fame. Damndest thing I ever saw.

Blogger Lazarus July 01, 2018 10:54 PM  

lets see here

How many types of prayers does one need?

One.


What does Jesus say about how to pray?


Alone.



Blogger Triumph of Rome July 01, 2018 11:17 PM  

I know Jimmy too, and I second the recommendation.

Blogger Triumph of Rome July 01, 2018 11:17 PM  

St. Nino’s Georgian Orthodox mission. I know people there; they’re solid.

Blogger Triumph of Rome July 01, 2018 11:22 PM  

This isn’t true almost anywhere in America. I keep hearing these parishes exist but I’ve almost never encountered one.

Blogger James Dixon July 01, 2018 11:39 PM  

> Raleigh or Fayetteville.
> Any recommendations in the OKC area?

For Anglican related churches, the primary test is whether they still use the 1928 prayer book or not. If they do, they're pretty much guaranteed to be as conservative as you'll find. The first thing the modern Episcopal Church did was insist on changing the prayer book.

For a list of 1928 prayer book churches see http://www.episcopalnet.org/DBS/ByState.html

It's not exhaustive, and some entries may no longer be accurate, so search for the church listed and see if they have a current website/Facebook page. If they do you can get more information. That's what I did for Shreveport.

There was a recent discussion that listed good US denominations to look for. If you search the archives you should be able to find it. I know about the Anglican churches because my wife was raised Episcopalian and has had to watch that train wreck first hand.

Blogger S1AL July 01, 2018 11:45 PM  

Off Topic: Hungary isn't backing down -

https://hotair.com/archives/2018/07/01/video-hungarian-foreign-minister-schools-bbc-reporter-illegal-migration/

Blogger jb July 01, 2018 11:50 PM  

ToR

You can check both the various Orthodox Bodies in America or the LCMS. I can assist you in finding an orthodox, Confessional Lutheran LCMS flock near you. You would need to do some digging on the Orthodox. I considered them a decade ago, but no one could fully explain theosis to me. I do know what it means, and am aware of Lutheran - Orthodox attempts to bridge various gaps with regard to theosis, but to date there has been little progress.

Rome? That has to be entirely your call. Perhaps with just the right priest in just the right flock in just the diocese - m a y b e. I am not a "betting man" with regard to the One Holy Faith.

The rest are - historically and "doctrinally" - of calvinistic origins, which I avoid like the plague.

Jes' saying . . .

Blogger jb July 01, 2018 11:51 PM  

Go Anglican Continuum if one is inclined in that direction.

Blogger Daniel Paul Grech Pereira July 01, 2018 11:53 PM  

Good advice, I will be sure to follow.

Blogger James Dixon July 02, 2018 12:13 AM  

Now for Raleigh/Fayetteville. The site I gave lists two 1928 Prayer Book churches in Raleigh, one in Chapel Hill, and one in Asheboro. It doesn't list anything in Fayetteville. The websites for the above are:

http://www.allsoulsanglican.org/
http://www.saintbenedicts.net/
http://www.stgeorgesanglican.org/
http://www.allsaintsraleigh.com/

I don't know NC all that well, so some of the others listed may be close to one city or the other.

There are two churches listed in Oklahoma City, but the first one doesn't seem to have a webpage or turn up with a search. The second's website seems to be:

http://anglicanchurchholycross.org/

I had to use Duck Duck Go to find the conversation about church denominations. Google refused to return it, though it did return results from 2017 and 2016. Somehow I'm not really surprised. You can find it at https://voxday.blogspot.com/2018/05/mailvox-hope-for-generation-zyklon.html

Go to comment 63 for the primary list. I provided three of the above links in that conversation.

Blogger The Deplorable Podunk Ken Ramsey July 02, 2018 12:15 AM  

You might also look around for a Catholic church that still performs the Latin Rite. You can find the pre-Vatican II Catholic church in these places. These parishes are very different than what you'd imagine if you have only experienced the Vatican II dominated ones. Go talk to a priest or deacon.

Blogger Daniel Babylon July 02, 2018 12:21 AM  

It depresses me that Jesus is not powerful enough to unite what political philosophers have divided.

Blogger James Dixon July 02, 2018 12:31 AM  

> You might also look around for a Catholic church that still performs the Latin Rite.

In that regard, a quick search turned up several sites listing Roman Catholic churches which perform the Latin Rite service:

https://www.latinmassdir.org/country/us/
http://www.ecclesiadei.org/masses.cfm
http://web2.airmail.net/carlsch/MaterDei/churches.htm
http://www.cmri.org/traditional-latin-mass-directory.shtml
http://latinmass.com/latinmassdirectory.html

Blogger James Dixon July 02, 2018 12:32 AM  

> It depresses me that Jesus is not powerful enough to unite what political philosophers have divided.

Why would he do that when all he wants is for us to freely choose him? Denying us free will would defeat the purpose.

Blogger jb July 02, 2018 12:36 AM  

DB -

You depress yourself. No need to do so. The One Holy Church will stand into eternity. Denominational names may or may not matter, but what is taught, most certainly will.

And when The Incarnate One said of His Church "the gates of hell shall not prevail against it - Christ shattered those gates immediately after He cried "Tετέλεσται!" and did for us. Satan had a party brewing, and Christ crashed the party huge!

Find an orthodox flock that is 1) not calvinistic in any fashion, and 2) holds to the historical, confessional faith, and understands liturgical worship in terms of "lex orandi, lex credendi."

You need to learn for yourself, and not blame Jesus.

Blogger Daniel Babylon July 02, 2018 12:40 AM  

@80 but even within those in the Church who did choose Jesus, they separate themselves over the petty hatred caused by politics (or at least it is petty when compared to the eternal)

Blogger jb July 02, 2018 12:43 AM  

Daniel -

Will you deprive yourself over the sins of others?

Blogger Noah B The Savage Gardener July 02, 2018 12:44 AM  

@78 He is indeed powerful enough to do so. He has chosen not to for reasons that we cannot fully understand.

Slightly tangential but related to the main thread - for a long time I resisted the idea of praying. Call it whatever form of sin or ignorance you like, but my attempts at logical thinking told me that I should simply trust in God without bothering him. I shouldn't try to "change God's mind." Yet I still found myself praying from time to time, and recently while praying I asked God what the purpose of prayer is.

I don't know what else to call it, but I received an answer. I didn't see a light, I didn't hear Jesus or talk to angels, nothing like that. But an answer to a question I had long pondered came to me immediately when I prayed about it. And the answer was that prayer is more about us than about God. A prayer won't change God's mind or convey any new information to him, but it will open us up to understanding his will and receiving his mercy.

Perhaps this isn't really news to anyone, I'm just a neophyte Christian compared to most of you.

Blogger Daniel Babylon July 02, 2018 12:48 AM  

@83 I'm depriving myself because I'm committing the same sin that I'm criticizing. As time has gone on, my hatred for leftists has grown so large that I don't want Jesus to save them

Blogger jb July 02, 2018 12:49 AM  

Recall the parable of the wheat and tares - Jesus said they should be left to grow until the harvest, when the WILL be separated.

The Church is not a sect of perfection, it is a hospital for those who realize their OWN infection is fatal. A story . . .

Long before I became a pastor, I was going back and forth with my soon-to-be pastor (Confessional LCMS). I ran out of arguments, and in my last-gasp/last dirch effort to avoid that which I could not, I said to him -

"It's just that so many seem to be hypocrites!"

He smiled and responded -

"That's okay, Jeffrey - we can always use one more."

Blogger Okrane S. July 02, 2018 3:34 AM  

This is nonsense, why do you people need a church or religion? In 21st century I'd think there would be better ways to congregate with fellow men rather than around a 2000 year old doctrine which is obviously false

Blogger bob kek mando - ( "an entirely disconnected spew of word vomit" ) July 02, 2018 3:39 AM  

87. Okrane S. July 02, 2018 3:34 AM
This is nonsense, why do you people need a church or religion?


why do you need Marx or Freud or Darwin?

Blogger Wynn Lloyd July 02, 2018 3:58 AM  

Another option is a Traditional Catholic Parish (Latin Mass). They have spread throughout the country since 2007. There's bound to be one in driving distance wherever you are.

Blogger Wynn Lloyd July 02, 2018 4:01 AM  

For some of us, the Rite is an issue. Not that the Byzantine Rite isn't beautiful and perfect, it is, but the austere, authoritative character of the Traditional Latin Mass often speaks to those with Western mindsets.

It would be cool if the Orthodox allowed a Western Rite, and took it seriously. I know father Seraphim Rose did, but not many others.

Blogger Wynn Lloyd July 02, 2018 4:07 AM  


I agree wholeheartedly. It's not that they are stupid (though some of them are). It's that they have different instincts and innate priorities.
Honor for them is about how they present and give themselves. An "honorable woman" is chaste, devoted to family. Having principles, and sticking to them even when it hurts, is actually counterproductive for keeping a family healthy and together.

Their instinct is always to accommodate others, regardless of the threat posed. They have combative instincts, but only when it comes to status. Territorial conflicts don't mean as much to them, since they are not designed to secure them.

They should never be allowed as leaders.

Blogger Okrane S. July 02, 2018 4:30 AM  

I absolutely do not. I do not need antiquated views proven to be wrong so many times.

It is reason which should unite people not mindless and arbitrary tribalism.

Blogger Freddy July 02, 2018 5:36 AM  

Hovind? He worships NASA. A recalcitrant member of the legion globe idolatry. Smh.

Blogger Freddy July 02, 2018 5:46 AM  

The imminant future stability of the church must also address NASA'S grandiose lies and deception. Hovind and his ilk are fan boys of this satanic cabal featuring the likes of Jack Parsons, L Ron Hubard & Aleister Crowley. The only antitode to NASA is FE. Deal with it.

Blogger James Dixon July 02, 2018 6:01 AM  

> but even within those in the Church who did choose Jesus, they separate themselves over the petty hatred caused by politics

Which is a consequence of having free will. But we can't voluntarily choose Christ without that free will.

Blogger bob kek mando - ( "an entirely disconnected spew of word vomit" ) July 02, 2018 8:19 AM  

92. Okrane S. July 02, 2018 4:30 AM
It is reason which should unite people not mindless and arbitrary tribalism.



that's well and good then.

perhaps you could explain to those on the Left that Hillary is obviously one of the worst criminals to ever seek the Presidency?

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother July 02, 2018 8:35 AM  

Freddy,

Whaf are you talking about? The moon landing is satanic?

Blogger James Dixon July 02, 2018 8:39 AM  

> perhaps you could explain to those on the Left that Hillary is obviously one of the worst criminals to ever seek the Presidency?

Bob, the only correct response to Okrane S is "Shut up, Tad."

Blogger ThirdMonkey July 02, 2018 8:51 AM  

@ Testy. Try First Baptist Mustang. The doctrine is mostly Reformed (our pastor just got his doctorate from the Master's Seminary), EVERY class, to include children and youth, is led by a man (with the exception of two of the old widow women classes), and the preaching from the pulpit is expository. Aside from the minor issue I mentioned @10, it is a great church. Under the leadership and direction of our pastor, there are also approximately 60 men in our church who are taking seminary classes. We also exercise church discipline. A majority of our young families have three or more children, and we have a significant representation of homeschool families, including among our deacons and elders. We have two different homeschool groups that meet in our building during the week. We have a very active foreign mission focus as well, sending groups to Italy, Nicaragua, Brazil, South Africa, Nepal, Belize, India, China, and Canada just this year.

If you are not Reformed, I would recommend Resurrection Free Methodist Church. They are not affiliated with the UMC, and are much more conservative. Though they are small, they have a High Church Liturgy, and observe Communion every Sunday. The preaching and teaching is Biblical and very good. I am good friends with one of the elders, and, though I have some minor disagreements with Wesleyan theology, would feel at home there.

Blogger Monica July 02, 2018 9:27 AM  

I also converted to Eastern Orthodoxy, but the Greek church I currently attend (the only one available within a 2 hour drive) is *full* of pro-immigrationists mostly using the argument that, "We/our parents were immigrants, too! Who are we to judge?" I would recommend the Orthodox Church to anyone, but for reasons completely unrelated to immigration.

Blogger jb July 02, 2018 9:32 AM  

@ 90 - WL -

It would be cool if the Orthodox allowed a Western Rite, and took it seriously. I know father Seraphim Rose did, but not many others.

The are a good number of Orthodox parishes that employ the Western Rite. Takes a little checking around.

Pax

Blogger FALPhil July 02, 2018 9:46 AM  

@82 but even within those in the Church who did choose Jesus, they separate themselves over the petty hatred caused by politics (or at least it is petty when compared to the eternal)

Which is probably a good indicator that free will is a false theology. Romans 8 & 9 in context. Either God is sovereign or He is not. Is a non-sovereign god worth worshipping?

Blogger Okrane S. July 02, 2018 10:02 AM  

Spoken like a good little sheep.

Blogger Okrane S. July 02, 2018 10:05 AM  

I dont see how this has anything to do with Hillary... I'm not trying to troll here, but to genuinely understand what makes rational people cling to a corrupt institution like the church in 21st century?

The only thing I can come up with is the need of some form of an in-group buy I may be mistaken.

Some light on this would be appreciated

Blogger Mr Darcy July 02, 2018 10:43 AM  

@5 Rebel Skate:

https://trinityleesville.com/visit/

You'll have to drive some distance, but I assume you are prepared to do that. I do (although not in Louisiana). Many, many people do.

Also at this site, read the "Articles."

Godspeed.

Blogger Tars Tarkusz July 02, 2018 10:44 AM  

I agree about not running. We've been running for over 50 years and where has it gotten us? We are running out of places to run to as well. Stay and fight and try to save the church, especially if it not so far gone that she felt the need to say this isn't political. It sounds as if she was checking the water to see if what the reaction was going to be to her injecting her politics into your church.

Try to approach other people in the congregation that might be sympathetic to your view and then speak as one.

Blogger Mr Darcy July 02, 2018 10:46 AM  

Of women and men and the divine order of creation:

https://trinityleesville.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/man-woman-relationship-and-womens-ordination.pdf

Blogger Crush Limbraw July 02, 2018 11:02 AM  

To look for a more biblical church is easier said than done - since one does not exist that isn't at least somewhat converged. The seminaries are worse. Antonio Gramsci left no stone unturned!
So what to do?
When Jesus said: "...All authority in heaven and earth is mine.....go and make disciples of all nations...." - Matt 28:18-20 - was He just fooling?
And what does that actually mean?
Vox, your post on this subject is my reason for being on the net - way too long to explain everything here, but anyone willing to explore becoming a mentor can start here - https://crushlimbraw.blogspot.com/2015/10/the-alliance-made-in-hell.html?m=0 - the summary of how the church was corrupted by Old Scratch.

Blogger Mr Darcy July 02, 2018 11:42 AM  

@ 42

Raleigh:
https://www.oslcraleigh.org/who-we-are/

Goldsboro:
http://www.peacelutherangoldsboro.org/

Blogger Mr Darcy July 02, 2018 11:47 AM  

@ 41 & 51:

Ditto.

Blogger Mr Darcy July 02, 2018 12:07 PM  

" [...] Orthodoxy has parallels with Catholicism in general. While not always expressed in the same way, Orthodoxy does have the Theotokos, communion of saints, sacraments (mysteries), relics, icons, hierarchy, and monastics, among other things. As with the Catholics, the Eucharist is the core of the liturgy and held to be the actual body and blood of Christ."

Ditto for *real* Lutheran churches. As another commenter has already pointed out, try and LCMS or an ELDoNA congregation. Forget the ELCA (totally converged).

Godspeed.

Blogger Rhology July 02, 2018 1:18 PM  

@61, Testy

I know a good brother in that area and would be happy to help you make the connection.
Email me: rhology gmail

Blogger Johnny Reb July 02, 2018 2:08 PM  

Well since we're on the subject I'll ask. Any good suggestions for Seattle. I know a fair number of Ilk are in the area. Man am I so weary of the search. Rainbow banners, Hate has no place here signs, women in leadership rolls, SJW causes, etc. I'm just starving for fellowship and this town must be the loneliest city I've lived in. Just checked out Cross and Crown which is a pick up the pieces church from the Mars Hill church. Seems alright but thought I'd just in case.

Blogger Pam July 02, 2018 2:43 PM  

If you want to try an Orthodox parish in Chicago, try All Saints. You can hear Father Patrick Henry Reardon on Ancient Faith Radio and he is a wonderful expository and pastor. It is where I would go if I lived there.

Blogger Dirk Manly July 03, 2018 10:22 AM  

@38

"Problem with Orthodox is each church is usually ethnically defined and an Anglo will feel as out of place there as anywhere. It definitely seems to me that they are the most true to the original intention of Christ's church."

So, and Anglo, should, instead, attend the anti-Christian Anglican church instead, because "everyone there has a face like mine" being oh, so, so much more important than "am I attending a TRUE church, and not some demonically corrupt abomination" ???

Dude, get your priorities straight.

Blogger Dirk Manly July 03, 2018 10:26 AM  

"The Assemblies of God accepts female pastors and has maintained its doctrine and had modest growth. So far. Ordination has been open to women for 70+ years (IIRC), but they are only at about 5% female lead pastors."

That's way more than 5% too many.

Blogger Dirk Manly July 03, 2018 10:34 AM  

@49

"Women don't understand the concept of honor. "

And here I thought I was the only one who noticed.

Blogger Dirk Manly July 04, 2018 2:25 AM  

@87

" In 21st century I'd think there would be better ways to congregate with fellow men rather than around a 2000 year old doctrine which is obviously false"


Please tell us what is false in the conversation below.


Matthew 22:36-40

36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Post a Comment

Rules of the blog
Please do not comment as "Anonymous". Comments by "Anonymous" will be spammed.

<< Home

Newer Posts Older Posts