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Wednesday, August 29, 2018

Jordan Peterson is seriously crazy

He's also in the process of finding out what happens when your diet is insufficiently varied, and it isn't good. Twenty years ago, my father went on a keto kick, lost 20 pounds, and proceeded to go overboard with it. I expect Peterson's reaction is going to be even worse because he's already a complete lunatic:
Jordan Peterson explained how Mikhaila’s experience had convinced him to eliminate everything but meat and leafy greens from his diet, and that in the last two months he had gone full meat and eliminated vegetables. Since he changed his diet, his laundry list of maladies has disappeared, he told Rogan. His lifelong depression, anxiety, gastric reflux (and associated snoring), inability to wake up in the mornings, psoriasis, gingivitis, floaters in his right eye, numbness on the sides of his legs, problems with mood regulation—all of it is gone, and he attributes it to the diet.

“I’m certainly intellectually at my best,” he said. “I’m stronger, I can swim better, and my gum disease is gone. It’s like, what the hell?”

“Do you take any vitamins?” asked Rogan.

“No. No, I eat beef and salt and water. That’s it. And I never cheat. Ever. Not even a little bit.”

“No soda, no wine?”

“I drink club soda.”

“Well, that’s still water.”

“Well, when you’re down to that level, no, it’s not, Joe. There’s club soda, which is really bubbly. There’s Perrier, which is sort of bubbly. There’s flat water, and there’s hot water. Those distinctions start to become important.”

Peterson reiterated several times that he is not giving dietary advice, but said that many attendees of his recent speaking tour have come up to him and said the diet is working for them. The takeaway for listeners is that it worked for Peterson, and so it may work for them. Rogan also clarified that though he is also not an expert, he is fascinated by the fact that he hasn’t heard any negative stories about people who have started the all-meat diet.

“Well, I have a negative story,” said Peterson. “Both Mikhaila and I noticed that when we restricted our diet and then ate something we weren’t supposed to, the reaction was absolutely catastrophic.” He gives the example of having had some apple cider and subsequently being incapacitated for a month by what he believes was an inflammatory response.

“You were done for a month?”

“Oh yeah, it took me out for a month. It was awful ...”

“Apple cider? What was it doing to you?”

“It produced an overwhelming sense of impending doom. I seriously mean overwhelming. There’s no way I could’ve lived like that. But see, Mikhaila knew by then that it would probably only last a month.”

“A month? From fucking cider?”

“I didn’t sleep that month for 25 days. I didn’t sleep at all for 25 days.”

“What? How is that possible?”

“I’ll tell you how it’s possible: You lay in bed frozen in something approximating terror for eight hours. And then you get up.”

The longest recorded stretch of sleeplessness in a human is 11 days, witnessed by a Stanford research team.
What an utterly ridiculous liar. Not only has Jordan Peterson redefined Jesus, and God, and truth, he is now redefining WATER! And did you notice that Peterson is always in a state of terror? Why on Earth does anyone listen to a madman who by rights should be locked up in an insane asylum?

On the plus side, the Jordan Peterson Experience only going to get weirder and more entertaining as he goes off his meds and comes under increasing scrutiny and psychological pressure. It will be interesting to see how far his fans will be willing to follow him into his madness.

Now, do you remember when the vast majority of you insisted that Jordan Peterson was a good man who was just helping so many people, and you couldn't figure out why I was criticizing him? If you were one of those people, then you should really learn to trust the instincts of those who have more accurate BS detectors than you do. For example, over the years I've learned to trust Spacebunny's crazy radar; she has repeatedly and unerringly ID'd women who are charming on the surface and later turn out to be total lunatics inside from the most casual of conversations. It's accurate to the point that I don't even question her judgment anymore.

Labels:

188 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous August 29, 2018 8:06 AM  

A man who thinks he’s a cat.

Bloody hell.

Blogger tublecane August 29, 2018 8:07 AM  

"And I never cheat. Ever. Not even a little bit."

"when we restricted our diet and then ate what we weren't supposed to... "

Say what? Thought he never, ever, never cheated.

"You lay in bed frozen in something approximating terror for eight hours"

No you don't.

Blogger The Observer August 29, 2018 8:08 AM  

“Do you take any vitamins?” asked Rogan.

“No. No, I eat beef and salt and water. That’s it. And I never cheat. Ever. Not even a little bit.”


...Isn't scurvy a thing?

“I didn’t sleep that month for 25 days. I didn’t sleep at all for 25 days.”

I wonder if he's compelled to tell bigger and bigger lies just to see what he can get away with.

Blogger tublecane August 29, 2018 8:13 AM  

Listening to Peterson's lectures (which I don't bother doing anymore), I always get whiplash when, no matter the subject, he suddenly starts talking about what desperate action we need to take in order to avoid nuclear holocaust or whatever. It always comes out of nowhere.

It's like if Mozart kept digressing to the Pop Goes a Weasel melody in the middle of every piece. He has a Fixed Idea about looming catastrophe.

Blogger Daniel Paul Grech Pereira August 29, 2018 8:14 AM  

Every time I hear the phrase, "leafy greens" I know I'm in for some brain damaged mental retardation.

Blogger Nate August 29, 2018 8:15 AM  

Yep. Jordan is batahit.

Blogger Daniel Paul Grech Pereira August 29, 2018 8:18 AM  

“It produced an overwhelming sense of impending doom. I seriously mean overwhelming. There’s no way I could’ve lived like that. But see, Mikhaila knew by then that it would probably only last a month.”

“A month? From fucking cider?”

“I didn’t sleep that month for 25 days. I didn’t sleep at all for 25 days.”

“What? How is that possible?”

“I’ll tell you how it’s possible: You lay in bed frozen in something approximating terror for eight hours. And then you get up.”


-=[ W H A T I N S W E E T F * C K ]=-

Blogger Othello August 29, 2018 8:19 AM  

Funny how Vox’s coverage of this guy isn’t even making fun of him, just cut and pasting what he said.

Blogger Dave August 29, 2018 8:24 AM  

Nate's still on his pain meds.

Beef is great but I've gotta have my bacon and ham and turkey and chicken and lamb and shrimp and tuna and bison and venison...

Blogger SirMaorio August 29, 2018 8:26 AM  

@3 didn't you know that pbj has superpowers?

The more deranged (one could argue that's all of them) of his fans will follow him all the way down the rabbit hole and into the inevitable brick wall that lays at the end of it and either be committed to and asylum (if it's still done now a days) or just plain kill themselves...

the other option is that he just fades away into obscurity but that becomes less and less likely as each day passes. he will probably do an "attempted suicide" if this happens so he can get some more attention and keep the cult alive for a little longer.

Blogger Gregory the Great August 29, 2018 8:29 AM  

If you want to listen to a superior intelligence expressing itself just listen to Peterson's biblical lectures, but stop after 10 seconds when the Mozart symphony fades out...

Blogger Daniel August 29, 2018 8:31 AM  

It will be interesting to see how far his fans will be willing to follow him into his madness.

"He has now moved on to his next OT…level of OT research. This level is beyond anything any one of us ever imagined. This level is in fact done in an exterior state. Meaning, that it is done completely exterior from the body. At this level of OT, the body is nothing more than an impediment, an encumbrance to any further gain as an OT. Thus…Thus, at 2000 hours Friday, the 24th of January, A.D. 36, L. Ron Hubbard discarded the body he had used in this lifetime for 74 years, 10 months, and 11 days. The body he had used to facilitate his existence in this MEST universe had ceased to be useful and in fact had become an impediment to the work he now must do outside of its confines."

That was 32 years ago. I suspect the answer to your query is "very, very far."

Blogger Uncle John's Band August 29, 2018 8:33 AM  

This really is indistinguishable from parody.

25 days without sleep is knocking on the supernatural door. I wonder if he is leveling up on the cult leader scale. Are actual miracles claimed next? Sacramental cider vinegar seems lacking though.

How has chemistry survived this long without the Peterson bubbliness coefficient for water?

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey August 29, 2018 8:33 AM  

It's not just the obvious dishonesty. Or even the sheer irresponsibility of someone with an audience as large as his advising his listeners to adopt a pure carnivore (as opposed to keto/ paleo) diet. Or even the depression.

It's the histrionics, and the hypochondria. I mean, this is someone whose main focus is advising young men on... how to be men, right?

Blogger tuberman August 29, 2018 8:38 AM  

Yes, this is worse than imagined, he is far along the way to going Van Gogh, without the art talent.

Blogger Doug Cranmer August 29, 2018 8:41 AM  

"His lifelong depression, anxiety, ..."

He's a fuck up. Got it.

Blogger James Dixon August 29, 2018 8:49 AM  

> Twenty years ago, my father went on a keto kick, lost 20 pounds, and went overboard with it.

A high meat diet is fine. It's my normal preferred diet. A meat only diet, without even vitamins, is suicide. We're omnivores, not carnivores.

> 25 days without sleep is knocking on the supernatural door.

He didn't go 25 days without sleep. He only thinks he did. He was either microsleeping or entering a light doze and not realizing it. Or he's lying, take your pick.

Blogger Quadko August 29, 2018 8:52 AM  

Wait until he discovers the fasting cure documentary and cuts the meat, too. Normals can do it for a month, but superheroes like him certainly don't suffer such limitations...

Blogger GM August 29, 2018 8:53 AM  

Believing that weird dietary changes are the solution to emotional problems is a reliable crazy woman tell.

Blogger Ingot9455 August 29, 2018 8:53 AM  

The 'caveman' diet is a common elimination diet. You do it to rest the system and detect food sensitivities/allergies.

Some people feel so good on it because they got rid of stuff messing them up and let their system rest that they go crazy.

And if they were already crazy...

Blogger The Deplorable Podunk Ken Ramsey August 29, 2018 8:54 AM  

All you need is apple cider to take out these maniacs? Who knew? It's the new garlic!!!

Blogger Peaceful Poster August 29, 2018 8:55 AM  

JP denies he has an eating disorder just like he denies the existence of God.

Blogger Lurker August 29, 2018 8:58 AM  

Should be a big hit with the vegans.

Blogger VD August 29, 2018 8:59 AM  

superheroes like him certainly don't suffer such limitations...

It's only a matter of time before he discovers how to ingest sunlight and live off the bounty of the sun.

Blogger Harambe August 29, 2018 8:59 AM  

Toys in the attic

Blogger JACIII August 29, 2018 9:02 AM  

The carnivore dieters I see are at wits end from a thousand different digestive maladies - mostly IBS, but a lot of allergies and such. It may be the very act of simplifying their diet that helps them or it could be LACK OF SOY.
They are "crowd sourcing" dietary research with their own bodies as the guinea pigs. It is worth noting that folks for whom the diet makes things worse or no better will not be likely to report their efforts or results.

Blogger Nathan Bruno August 29, 2018 9:02 AM  

I love club soda, but it's the salt lick feature; it'll dehydrate you if it's all you drink.

He'd be less insane if he had some broccoli with that meat. It magically transforms estrogen precursors in beef into testosterone. It's the same with Brussels sprouts.

I recall the Bush family didn't like broccoli, either, and they're crazy.

Blogger Looking Glass August 29, 2018 9:06 AM  

Something is wrong with his adrenal glands, and it's likely genetic. Thinking about the cluster of issues he talks about, Depression is about Cortisol regulation. Anxiety is actually a combination of a few receptor lines, but we're back to adrenal regulation. Add in general class inflammation and you've got a good case for Crazy Christ.

Meat + low-carb vegetables + good fats is roughly the ideal diet. The science & practical experiences are there, it's just going to be a while to get it to break through. https://twitter.com/Mangan150 for some details on that stuff, if you're interested. We're starting to see it crop up in the "wild" for use with people with auto-immune issues because of the limitations it puts on inflammatory response.

But if he's that response, the guy's mind must be a wreck. I think Vox has conclusively shown that, but, by his own words, he clearly has inflammatory reactions that attack the nervous system. He's going to eventually fall into full psychosis. It's inevitable at this point.

Blogger Kieran Ricci August 29, 2018 9:07 AM  

A meat only diet will render you depleted in vitamin C, potassium, phytonutrients and place stress on the liver and kidneys.

If someone previously consumed a lot of carbs, then went to meat only, there may be a short term benefit in contrast due to fueling on fats rather than sugar. I suspect this is why it’s popular, along with the simplicity.

These one food fad “diets” are common. Check out the banana diet. This takes the evolution degeneracy to an entirely new level.

Now that “psychologist” JPB has entered philosophy and nutrition .. I’m wondering which avenue of destruction he’ll choose next?

Blogger Mr.MantraMan August 29, 2018 9:07 AM  

Diets another bit of info proving HBD, I would not last long on that diet, I doubt Eskimo types on the fringes of the Arctic Circle are that strict.

Blogger Looking Glass August 29, 2018 9:07 AM  

GM wrote:Believing that weird dietary changes are the solution to emotional problems is a reliable crazy woman tell.

You can manipulate a person's emotional state by changing their diet. Crazy Women are crazy, but it's utterly sound science. The problem is that it isn't standard practice.

Blogger Looking Glass August 29, 2018 9:13 AM  

Actually, Vox might have finally found the demons Jordan is running from. His own body is going to kill him, at some point. The rest of his body is literally attacking his mind when he doesn't run a brutally strict diet. He's trying to run away from his own organs. That's some existential dread to deal with.

Blogger JACIII August 29, 2018 9:15 AM  

The effects of what you eat on mental state is a fairly recent revelation. It makes a lot of intuitive sense, though: It's just cravings writ large.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother August 29, 2018 9:16 AM  

Sounds like he's headed for a nasty bout of diverticulitis. Goodbye intestines. On the plus side, it would take him out of commission for a long time.

Blogger tuberman August 29, 2018 9:17 AM  

He's got another major book here, called, "Experiments with Beef." Dozens of ways to cook it, levels of fat (73% or 95% burgers). Steaks or roast, and which steaks and what cuts are best? Warnings like, "no cheese, please" can be their own chapters. "Maid-rites are wrong (unless just extra beef juice). "How to clean your room after a major beef with your kitchen," will enlighten.

Blogger Steve Canyon August 29, 2018 9:21 AM  

Most documented sources say that the record for sleep deprivation is anywhere between 11 and 18 days. An Australian sleep institute claims 18. Guinness Book of World Records claims 11. A claim of 25 is poor hyperbole, or an outright fabrication.

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer August 29, 2018 9:23 AM  

I never thought he was all that impressive, but I must admit that I was unaware of his craziness until Vox looked into it.

Blogger Joseph Maroney August 29, 2018 9:24 AM  

TPTB are out to hurt people. They're using the soft-killing method, primarily through malnutrition. It's of no surprise whatsoever that JP is pushing a literally toxic diet to people, and then meekly claiming that he is not giving dietary advice, even though he is.

Blogger David The Good August 29, 2018 9:26 AM  

The Scurvy Diet helped me lose my teeth.

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer August 29, 2018 9:29 AM  

#39 wins the thread

Blogger tuberman August 29, 2018 9:30 AM  

"The Scurvy Diet helped me lose my teeth."

There is a lack of vitamin C in that diet, and those effects do show up fast.

Blogger Dave August 29, 2018 9:31 AM  

For example, over the years I've learned to trust Spacebunny's crazy radar; she has repeatedly and unerringly ID'd women who are charming on the surface and later turn out to be total lunatics inside from the most casual of conversations. It's accurate to the point that I don't even question her judgment anymore.

Spacebunny the SUPERHERO! Sees the inner bitch from a mile away. No woman can evade her lunatic tracking radar.

*Available for consultation. YMMV. Read the small print.

Blogger Q August 29, 2018 9:31 AM  

He had his daughter on a bunch of psych meds since she was like 7. Absolutely insane. He should know better.

Also if you read between the lines I really do think his wife slept with his best friend, which was the cause of their falling out.

Blogger Mocheirge August 29, 2018 9:32 AM  

“And you quit taking all your medications?”

“Everything.”


wut happened to "take your meds"? I thought daddy taught her that.

Blogger Matthew McDaniel August 29, 2018 9:36 AM  

I know I know I know... you don’t talk about your family- but you brought it up & REALLY want to know what happened to your dad on the keto diet. I’ve done keto in the past and was okay. I’ve gotta lose some weight.

Blogger dh August 29, 2018 9:41 AM  

I'll be surprised if this doesn't end with 600 gallon vats of special Apple cider that calms the terror.. for him and all of his followers

Blogger Phillip George August 29, 2018 9:41 AM  

ketogenic simulates total fasting in one respect.
It is notoriously good for epilepsy.
Might well be something like John the Baptist's diet.
Almost certainly has psychotropic affects.
Is probably one of the smarter things he's talked about.

WTF. Personally can't we just get back to burning witches? Don't we owe it to our children?

Peterson will burn out like a candle. And if he steered anyone to a semi serious read on ketogenic, that's a bit of accidental serendipity.

Blogger Roger G2 August 29, 2018 9:43 AM  

Breaking News Alert:


Ladies and gentlemen, I can now tell you the the super man exists.
And he is Canadian.

Blogger dvdivx August 29, 2018 9:47 AM  

The only people that eat a all meat diet are Eskimos. They eat the meat raw however otherwise they would get no vitamin C. The best diet for loosing weight I've used is the Ultimate Diet by Lyle Mcdonald. It combines carb cycling with exercise. Lots of data as to why it works also.

Blogger David The Good August 29, 2018 9:50 AM  

Cider Took My Sleep - I Got It Back with Beef!

"Peterson's Scurvy Diet Helped Me Lose 30 teeth in 30 days"

Clean your tomb.

Blogger Volpack August 29, 2018 9:51 AM  

He will be claiming he has recovered from a fatal head wound next.

Blogger Heuristics August 29, 2018 9:55 AM  

Scurvy is a disease of pure grain consumption.
As for where vitamin c comes from on a pure meat diet, one possibility is that gut flora can produce vitamin c https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22940212

Blogger Dangeresque August 29, 2018 9:56 AM  

He's on the all cousin diet.

Blogger JACIII August 29, 2018 10:05 AM  

Dangeresque wrote:He's on the all cousin diet.

Nasty.

Blogger Peaceful Poster August 29, 2018 10:06 AM  

Tasty

Blogger Matthew McDaniel August 29, 2018 10:06 AM  

“All beef getting a little boring... hmmm what does human flesh taste like?”

Blogger Lamarck Leland August 29, 2018 10:06 AM  

The next step for him is to become a breatharian, I think

Blogger tuberman August 29, 2018 10:07 AM  

David:

It just like his 'went 25 days without sleep." First Law of SJWs...he will lie, and he will cheat, enough to keep from getting scurvy. Don't get your hopes up people, it's the terror and anxiety that will take him out, not the stupid diet.

Watch for when he starts going full God-Talk like our three time SIFI awards winner. Writing and speaking in run-on sentences with no punctuation or paragraphs, punching out at even supporters for not realizing WHO HE REALLY IS.

Blogger Cloom Glue August 29, 2018 10:09 AM  

An excerpt from the nauseating Atlantic last paragraph is particularly wrong in the typical "everybody gets a trophy" leftist way; a benefit from any and all advice?

... there is at least some benefit to be had from any and all dietary advice, or rules for life, so long as a person believes in them, and so long as they provide a code that allows a person to feel good for having stuck with it and a cohort of like-minded adherents.

It is an endorsement while also earlier mocking the Jordanetics daughter for collecting money for telling people to "stop eating almost everything".

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer August 29, 2018 10:09 AM  

The only people that eat a all meat diet are Eskimos. They eat the meat raw however otherwise they would get no vitamin C.

You also have to eat the internal organs, heart, kidneys, liver.

Blogger John Rampton August 29, 2018 10:09 AM  

An all-meat diet never works, even for carnivores. Unless you're cutting open the stomachs of your prey, and eating the partially-digested vegetation they've recently consumed, you're not eating a truly carnivorous diet

Blogger RandyB August 29, 2018 10:10 AM  

At which point he will begin to sparkle in the sunlight.

Blogger Cloudswrest August 29, 2018 10:10 AM  

Seems more or less extreme, but I will say that when I went (more or less) paleo/LCHF years ago I experienced a similar result. All sorts of background health issues cleared up. Lost weight (~30 lbs). Rashes and psoriasis/eczema went away almost immediately.

Blogger VD August 29, 2018 10:12 AM  

Seems more or less extreme, but I will say that when I went (more or less) paleo/LCHF years ago I experienced a similar result.

What is effective as a short-term measure is not a healthy basis for a long-term diet.

Blogger Rabbi B August 29, 2018 10:14 AM  

@8 Othello

Funny how Vox’s coverage of this guy isn’t even making fun of him, just cut and pasting what he said.

That's the best kind of coverage. How do you argue with it? I know they still will, but ... doubling-down on crazy? Good grief.

It will be interesting to see how far his fans will be willing to follow him into his madness.

Not to mention entertaining.

Blogger Sean August 29, 2018 10:14 AM  

I was on the wrong side of this one. Vox was and is right: JP is nuts.

Blogger Scire August 29, 2018 10:16 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Reasonably Honest August 29, 2018 10:18 AM  

An all meth and water diet would produce excellent results in a fraction of the time. It'd probably be cheaper as well considering the price of beef.

Vim, vigor, and tooth loss without having to waste time sleeping! An ideal solution.

Blogger Scire August 29, 2018 10:19 AM  

superheroes like him certainly don't suffer such limitations...

It's only a matter of time before he discovers how to ingest sunlight and live off the bounty of the sun.


Soon, he will become a "Breatharian"

https://infogalactic.com/info/Inedia

Blogger anne August 29, 2018 10:20 AM  

I hesitate to defend JBP here, because he clearly has issues, but many of the criticisms in these comments are coming from a place of good health. When your body is that inflamed, there IS a difference between types of water. Even a change from hard, mineralized water to reverse-osmosis filtered water can make a difference.

I'm fortunate in that most of my autoimmune inflammation went to my gut instead of my brain, but an all-meat diet has made a world of difference for my body's ability to heal from Crohn's disease. And no, I don't have scurvy.

Did you think they were telling the truth about nutrition, too?

Blogger Lurker August 29, 2018 10:21 AM  

"He will be claiming he has recovered from a fatal head wound next."

Threadwin for the antiChrist reference.

Blogger MendoScot August 29, 2018 10:21 AM  

It's only a matter of time before he discovers how to ingest sunlight and live off the bounty of the sun.

Meh, old hat. I've been doing it for centuries.

Blogger David Wright August 29, 2018 10:22 AM  

A while back he posted his diet as formulated by his daughter. It allowed far more variance than this severely limited one he is now. Even allowed a little vodka. Said it fixed everything, so what happened that he needed to go to this extreme?

Just conjecture here but the sleeplessness sounds like maybe he was withdrawing from drug addiction. He and his daughter have been on meds for years. (No way he went without any sleep by the way).

Unfortunately as Vox points out, he is heading for a big breakdown. It isn't your diet Jordan. Hard to watch.

Blogger tuberman August 29, 2018 10:24 AM  

I'm going to have an apple cider, as a toast, or to celebrate.

Skål, or raise your skull bowls.

Blogger Guitar Man August 29, 2018 10:25 AM  

Mark Sisson's 80/20 on his primal diet is well-balanced. The simplest thing that anyone can do to realize health benefits is to cut out sugary drinks and highly-processed carbs.

Blogger electricsheeple August 29, 2018 10:33 AM  

Keto is the ultimate charlatan diet bc they claim you don't need a caloric deficit to lose weight (a lie). So it makes sense Peterson would jump on this wave.

I've tried Keto. It's unnecessary. The truth is, if you are having trouble controlling your calories, increase your protein moderately until you feel full eating 2,000 cals in a day (or whatever number is healthy for you).


Blogger Solaire Of Astora August 29, 2018 10:37 AM  

JBP better take fiber or he'll know real terror.

Blogger Longtime Lurker August 29, 2018 10:38 AM  

Jordan B. Pathological.

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey August 29, 2018 10:49 AM  

@60
Ron Winkleheimer
The only people that eat a all meat diet are Eskimos. They eat the meat raw however otherwise they would get no vitamin C.

You also have to eat the internal organs, heart, kidneys, liver


But not too much -- especially liver. Excess intake of fat-soluble vitamins can be ugly.

Infogalactic.com/info/Hypervitaminosis_A#Sources_of_toxicity

Blogger Johnny August 29, 2018 10:50 AM  

Truth isn't whether what you are reporting is true, but that you believe as you say it. And I am going to suppose that with regard to diet he is telling the truth.

Allowing that he doesn't suffer from some underlying medical conditon, it would appear that he is even crazier than I thought. I checked the internet to see if it was a spoof, and apparently it is real. The Atlantic asks the question: at what point does restriction become a disorder?

I tried the Atkins diet which is close to what he is doing, a heavy stress on meat and no carbs. It gives you an initial transitory weight loss, which is nice, and it can be helpful in keeping down weight. But otherwise it is relatively severe in what you are not able to eat, and ultimatly I tired of it and dropped away.

Blogger Lance E August 29, 2018 10:50 AM  

Ingot9455 wrote:The 'caveman' diet is a common elimination diet. You do it to rest the system and detect food sensitivities/allergies.

That was also my reaction to reading this. Most people who have positive things to say about keto/paleo diets tend to say things like: more consistent energy, reduced appetite, weight loss, maybe a difference in BMs. This lunatic thinks beef cures every ailment under the sun.

I'm no doctor, but it's incredibly obvious that he just eliminated some ingredients that were causing inflammatory responses due to allergies/intolerances. The smart thing to do would be to gradually reintroduce other ingredients before he gets f'n scurvy, anemia, and starts to go blind. But on the flip side, at least he'll be able to cultivate the "blind prophet" persona!

Blogger Wuzzums Fuzzums August 29, 2018 10:52 AM  

Diets by their very definition do not work because once you quit you will revert back to your original weight. And if you're able to sustain it for the rest of your life it's not qualified as a diet anymore.

I lost almost 60 pounds solely by counting calories in under 3 months. My diet: cereal, milk, crisps (plus ~12 minutes of cardio daily). It's about figuring out what works for your body and what can be sustained. I'm seriously skeptical about this new keto-diet fad or any diet in general. Nonetheless I don't understand why you would want to follow a diet that knocks you out for a month if you drink some cider. He's literally making his own body more fragile. Taleb is his only hope now!

Blogger Stilicho August 29, 2018 10:54 AM  

Glad I ate that doughnut this morning!

Blogger Lazarus August 29, 2018 10:57 AM  

He doesn't lift.

Someone needs to introduce him to Dwayne Johnson's Rock-Hard Hercules Workout And Diet Plan

Blogger Lazarus August 29, 2018 10:58 AM  

Once he got a whiff of what the Rock is cookin', he'd recover.

Blogger Guitar Man August 29, 2018 10:58 AM  

Taleb is his only hope now!

“The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly salary.”
– Nassim Nicholas Taleb

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer August 29, 2018 11:01 AM  

#79

I've tried to tell people that there are issues with taking in to much vitamin A, but they just won't believe it.

Blogger JACIII August 29, 2018 11:15 AM  

The poor sap probably wasn't eating steak. He's Canadian, so soy and some analog for grass was most likely his former dietary choice.
Just increasing your intake of healthy beef (as in your neighbor is killing a cow and you buy a third of the beef for the winter - not Kroger hormone and antibiotic and super vaccinated chemical beef) will change your strength, endurance, and energy.

Blogger The Observer August 29, 2018 11:19 AM  

Scurvy is a disease of pure grain consumption.

Because sailors, the biggest victims of scurvy, were deficient in their usual rations of grog, hardtack and salted beef...

Blogger Ominous Cowherd August 29, 2018 11:23 AM  

Banting was onto this a long time ago. Stefansson lived on a high fat, all meat diet for years, including one summer in Minnesota.

Blogger Damelon Brinn August 29, 2018 11:23 AM  

The 'caveman' diet is a common elimination diet. You do it to rest the system and detect food sensitivities/allergies.

Yeah, his health is probably better because he eliminated something obvious like gluten in the process, but there's no need to go so extreme as beef-only. The most likely result of that is that he'll get extremely bored with it and then binge on all the bad stuff again. I wouldn't be surprised to see him do what some other extreme dieters have done, and switch to something like all-potatoes.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd August 29, 2018 11:37 AM  

Mr.MantraMan wrote:I doubt Eskimo types on the fringes of the Arctic Circle are that strict.

They like things like berries in seal oil. When you're out in the cold all day, every day, you just can't eat enough fats.

Ron Winkleheimer wrote:You also have to eat the internal organs, heart, kidneys, liver.

Per Stefansson, they also ate the contents of the critter's intestines.

Anonymous Anonymous August 29, 2018 11:42 AM  

CNN Breaking News:
Canada honors it's own sleepless lunatic by placing him on their 1$ coin.

Blogger Kieran Ricci August 29, 2018 11:46 AM  

Nonsense. Not all calories are the same. Carbs with a high GI trigger insulin which creates fat. So you can have a low caloric intake of breads, pastas, crackers etc and expend more calories than you take in but put on weight.

On the flip side, a high fat, moderate protein diet will not trigger much insulin, therefore weight may be lost, even if caloric intake is higher than expenditure.

If you treat all calories the same without taking into consideration the hormonal effect that the different types of calories have, you’ll run into error.

Blogger VD August 29, 2018 11:48 AM  

An all-meat diet has made a world of difference for my body's ability to heal from Crohn's disease. And no, I don't have scurvy. Did you think they were telling the truth about nutrition, too?

You will get scurvy if you stick to your all-meat diet long enough. Neither Thomas Barlow nor the 19th century Royal Navy was in the pocket of the pharmaceutical companies.

Blogger RobertT August 29, 2018 11:49 AM  

I tried keto. It'll pull the weight off but it's like a threshing machine. Peterson's diet isn't keto. Keto gets most calories from fat, a few from meat and very few from carbs. I prefer the calorie deprived diet at about 1500 calories, but i started at 400 a day. Most calories from fat & carbs. Heavy on vegetables. Compared to the normal American diet, that's less than half the calories. But it satisfies me.

Blogger Unknown August 29, 2018 11:53 AM  

I wouldn't be surprised if he is POSSESSED. Many sources on demonology in fact point out that it is common for evil entities to attack the stomach of the host. If I recall well Malachi Martin made many mentions of this fact in his now famous interviews with Art Bell and also in his books.

Blogger Silent Draco August 29, 2018 11:53 AM  

25 days without sleep is like 25 years without rebooting a computer. Even unix will only last so long. Memory faults, random memory pointers, and processor load will melt it down.

When does the Jack T. Ripper mention of draining our vital essences come?

Blogger Statureman August 29, 2018 11:53 AM  

Hysterical comment section. Frankly, when I heard JBP was on SSRIs (from his own mouth) was when I first saw cracks in the veneer.

Also interesting how diet is functionally a belief system to itself.

Blogger Disciple of Kek August 29, 2018 11:57 AM  

Apple Cider: 1
JBP: 0

Blogger Argus Bacchus August 29, 2018 11:58 AM  

"...he is now redefining WATER!"

I've seen people try to redefine water before.

But they are usually middle school science students who are having a memory lapse, not world famous fake "messiahs" (heh) like this Peterson clown.

Blogger Patrick Kelly August 29, 2018 11:58 AM  

What's with all the recent attention to these "eat only this thing" diets lately?

If you eat only meat without anything else to supplement it bad things will eventually happen to your body.

Same with eating only "raw food from plants" or whatever. Every time I see a video or interview with on of these fanatic gastrointestinal cult leaders they sure look and act a bit off. Something ain't right with them people.

Long ago, when I was an aspiring long haired rock star hippie, I tried to go vegan. Came as close to being hospitalized as I've ever been, and vegan isn't as strict as some of these new fads.

Blogger Damelon Brinn August 29, 2018 12:01 PM  

His specific diet isn't as important as the way he talks about it. It shows him as the kind of obsessive who discovers something good and has to take it to the extreme and tell everyone else about it so they can too (despite claims that he's not pushing it). What happens when he stumbles over an obscure philosopher or a weird religious cult that just "works" for him, and does the same with that?

Blogger Looking Glass August 29, 2018 12:02 PM  

Clearly, JBP's next book should be "Do Humans Dream of Cider Sheep?".

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother August 29, 2018 12:02 PM  

What's wrong with just meat, vegetables and cheese? And dessert with the brethren at church on Sunday, of course.

Keep it simple.

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer August 29, 2018 12:02 PM  

They like things like berries in seal oil. When you're out in the cold all day, every day, you just can't eat enough fats.

I had an anthropology professor back in the day who did her thesis work by living with and studying Sherpas in the highlands of Nepal. When she hired them for stuff she payed them in butter and sugar, both of which she had to keep under lock and key. When she distributed the butter they would eat it by the stick.

Blogger David The Good August 29, 2018 12:05 PM  

electricsheeple wrote:Keto is the ultimate charlatan diet bc they claim you don't need a caloric deficit to lose weight (a lie). So it makes sense Peterson would jump on this wave.

I've tried Keto. It's unnecessary. The truth is, if you are having trouble controlling your calories, increase your protein moderately until you feel full eating 2,000 cals in a day (or whatever number is healthy for you).



Keto works because all calories are not the same. That's like saying it doesn't matter if you run your car on gas or alcohol or peanut oil because all fuel is the same.

My sister lost 55lbs in nine months on keto, no calorie counting. She looks great. I lost 30lbs a decade ago, after eating what I thought was a healthy grain-based diet for years and steadily gaining weight.

Blogger Patrick Kelly August 29, 2018 12:05 PM  

"What happens when he stumbles over an obscure philosopher or a weird religious cult that just "works" for him, and does the same with that?"

Yep, especially if he starts preaching young women should stay virgins as long as possible.

Blogger Looking Glass August 29, 2018 12:05 PM  

@106 Ron Winkleheimer

Fats are pure energy (and heat) in the cold environments. Carbs can be made stable for storage, which is what makes them valuable. Too much, however, is a big problem for humans.

Blogger Heuristics August 29, 2018 12:06 PM  

@89 grog (sugarcane byproduct) will not help against scurvy. Salted/old meat will possibly destroy what it is that makes vitamin c not needed when eating only (fresh) meat. https://io9.gizmodo.com/why-horse-meat-once-had-a-reputation-for-curing-scurvy-1711341132

Not to mention that the meat would likely be the first thing to run out on a ship.

Blogger VD August 29, 2018 12:09 PM  

Yep, especially if he starts preaching young women should stay virgins as long as possible.

And starts having them share his bed to test his spiritual willpower....

Blogger Patrick Kelly August 29, 2018 12:09 PM  

"Keto works because all calories are not the same."

Preach it bro! Took me a while to get this.

Not all bodies and metabolism are the same either. I had to adjust a bit from what the given Keto calculator told me was "ideal" combo of protein, fat, and carb calories, but still resulted in cutting carbs and increasing fat. I had the protein down already.

Blogger Looking Glass August 29, 2018 12:10 PM  

@107 David The Good

Keto is a great way to lose weight, but it's also not a stable diet. Over a long enough period, you'll become insulin starved and start to have weird issues crop up. Insulin is one of the primary pro-growth hormones in the body, so you can't run a full Keto for too long without causing degradation in a lot of the body.

The Paleo community has been pretty correct about a focus on far less processed foods. You can get away with a lot when products aren't refined for long-term storage. Paleo is also a generally safe suggestion for most people.

Moderate protein + moderate fat + low carb is the most stable diet for the totality of human health, but that's in a Food Surplus state. Most of human history is not in that state.

Blogger S. Misanthrope August 29, 2018 12:10 PM  

Sounds like Spacebunny is the one who ought to be starting a consulting firm.

Blogger Phelps August 29, 2018 12:13 PM  

All of the symptoms he describes from going off his diet are classic psychosomatic.

He doesn't have a diet. He has an eating disorder.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash August 29, 2018 12:19 PM  

VD wrote:It's only a matter of time before he discovers how to ingest sunlight and live off the bounty of the sun.
"Eat the sun and you will become your own father."

Blogger dienw August 29, 2018 12:19 PM  

Just increasing your intake of healthy beef (as in your neighbor is killing a cow and you buy a third of the beef for the winter - not Kroger hormone and antibiotic and super vaccinated chemical beef) will change your strength, endurance, and energy.

Go find a farmers' market; be prepared to pay and arm an a leg; else, find a German butcher shop.

Blogger mickthequick1976 August 29, 2018 12:20 PM  

I knew JBP was a world class bullshitter, but thought VD was being extreme in calling him nuts. VD was right yet again, he's a loon.
@43 I believe the best friend made a play for the wife when Peterson let him live with them and it didn't go so well for the best friend. When I heard JBP talk about the best friend's demise, JBP sounded like he was the winner in that confrontation.

Blogger LRN_News August 29, 2018 12:21 PM  

This not only confirms that JP is not sane, but that he is also a pathological liar.
It's only a matter of time when he is going to fail miserably and ultimately become irrelevant.

Blogger electricsheeple August 29, 2018 12:25 PM  

David The Good wrote:electricsheeple wrote:Keto is the ultimate charlatan diet bc they claim you don't need a caloric deficit to lose weight (a lie). So it makes sense Peterson would jump on this wave.

I've tried Keto. It's unnecessary. The truth is, if you are having trouble controlling your calories, increase your protein moderately until you feel full eating 2,000 cals in a day (or whatever number is healthy for you).



Keto works because all calories are not the same. That's like saying it doesn't matter if you run your car on gas or alcohol or peanut oil because all fuel is the same.

My sister lost 55lbs in nine months on keto, no calorie counting. She looks great. I lost 30lbs a decade ago, after eating what I thought was a healthy grain-based diet for years and steadily gaining weight.



I dissent. I understand this is pushed hard. I've been lifting weights for 20 years. As far as body composition is concerned, I've found a calorie is a calorie is a calorie. The body knows what to do with no matter what you eat.


The only advantage to protein is that you will fill fuller and need far less will power to eat less calories.


I simply don't believe the studies that claim some calories are more magical than others when it comes to fitness (body composition) because I know from experience it isn't true. The body will use carbs and fat to rebuild muscle as efficiently as protein.


Health and nutrition and whether you are getting all your vitamins is separate topic. Of course nutritious food is better than crap.

Blogger dienw August 29, 2018 12:29 PM  

Re Keto: I told my brother about Keto around six years ago: he went full meat and fat with no wheat; he lost 50#s sown to just below his high school weight, adjusted the diet a little and is now just at his high school weight; his blood pressure and cholesterol returned to normal ranges and he stopped taking the meds for them. At 70/71 y.o. he still runs up and down the soccer field as a referee.

I use the LCHFMP diet eschewing processed foods, seed oils, and corn sugar: I have more energy, strength, and a clearer/sharper mind.

Blogger dienw August 29, 2018 12:37 PM  

S. Misanthrope wrote:Sounds like Spacebunny is the one who ought to be starting a consulting firm.

Matchmaker.

Blogger Dos Voltz August 29, 2018 12:38 PM  

Gentlemen, we must do our best to summon up the blood, to remember the traditions of our valiant fathers! It is only by stern measure that we can hope to overcome the evils and plagues of modernity, the worst of which, is of course, apple cider!

Blogger CarpeOro August 29, 2018 12:41 PM  

I'll make sure to raise a glass of cider this fall and toast to his idiocy.

Blogger Kieran Ricci August 29, 2018 12:48 PM  

Nonsense.

The fact that insulin spikes are drastically lowered with the ketogenic diet is specifically why it is healthy.

Yes, you need a small amount of insulin to regulate blood sugar among other things, but insulin is created by the pancreas every time you eat, no matter what you eat.

Also, if you consume a decent amount of cruciferous vegetables (healthy carbs) ... they will also spike additional insulin in sufficient amounts.

The only way I could see the keto diet being a problem is if carbs are completely eliminated and only one meal is consumed per day... but this is more in line with the carnivore diet.

Healthy versions of the ketogenic diet promote a high vegetable intake, to the point that “insulin starvation” is not of concern.

Blogger Jack Amok August 29, 2018 12:51 PM  

TPTB are out to hurt people. They're using the soft-killing method, primarily through malnutrition. It's of no surprise whatsoever that JP is pushing a literally toxic diet to people, and then meekly claiming that he is not giving dietary advice, even though he is.

Since we are pretty certain the Jordeo-Crazy-Christ is a paid shill of TPTB, and their previous dietary advice was the carb-loaded food pyramid that caused an obesity epidemic, my assumption is his marching orders are now to discredit keto/paleo or any other alternatives to soi-boi diets.

As things go, keto's advantage is reversing insulin resistance. A strict keto diet for a few months (depends on how bad your carb-o-rific diet was before) will do that, then just moderate your carbs and you're fine.

The keys are: earn your carbs (calorie burning activities) and earn your protein (lift).

Petting cats does not burn enough calories to make up for the donuts.

Blogger James Dixon August 29, 2018 12:51 PM  

> ...so what happened that he needed to go to this extreme?

He's OCD.

> I've tried to tell people that there are issues with taking in to much vitamin A, but they just won't believe it.

Will they believe the Smithsonian? https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/the-most-terrible-polar-exploration-ever-douglas-mawsons-antarctic-journey-82192685/

> Not all bodies and metabolism are the same either.

This cannot be repeated often enough. While the general rules apply to almost everyone, what works for another specific individual may not work for you.

> As far as body composition is concerned, I've found a calorie is a calorie is a calorie. The body knows what to do with no matter what you eat.

See above. That may be true for you. It's not true for most people.

> The body will use carbs and fat to rebuild muscle as efficiently as protein.

That is simply not true. The body can't create proteins from carbs and fat. It has to have the basic protein building blocks to start with.

Blogger widlast washere August 29, 2018 12:56 PM  

Beef only diet? cue deficiency diseases in 3, 2, 1, ...

Blogger Lamarck Leland August 29, 2018 12:58 PM  

Heh, when I see Northern European folks talking about their diets I become really thankful for my Southern European ancestry.
I just had some roquefort with champignon and I have no "inflammation" whatsoever

Blogger Lurker August 29, 2018 12:58 PM  

Too bad, no more Angry Orchard for the lefTARD break rooms.

Blogger Manuel August 29, 2018 1:00 PM  

Oh come on, nobody's done it?
"Water is the mode of being your gut values the most as demonstrated or manifested in your digestion, evacuation, and action.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash August 29, 2018 1:02 PM  

electricsheeple wrote:I dissent. I understand this is pushed hard. I've been lifting weights for 20 years. As far as body composition is concerned, I've found a calorie is a calorie is a calorie. The body knows what to do with no matter what you eat.


We're not talking body building here, Bucko.

Blogger Lance E August 29, 2018 1:07 PM  

David The Good wrote:Keto works because all calories are not the same. That's like saying it doesn't matter if you run your car on gas or alcohol or peanut oil because all fuel is the same.

A calorie measures energy. If your car's engine could run on either gasoline or peanut oil, then it wouldn't make any difference which fuel you chose. If you converted your car to use a diesel engine, everything other than the engine would still run exactly the same.

A better analogy would be claiming that solar power delivers qualitatively different electricity from coal power, which is obviously false. Keto diets do work, but only when dieters "eat to hunger". That's because these diets don't violate the 1st law of thermodynamics - the chronic glucose deficiency just causes appetite suppression.

It's always calories in, calories out. All calories are the same just like all kilojoules are the same and all BTUs are the same. They literally all refer to the same quantity. You can plug any of those measurements into a calculator to get any of the other measurements.

Ketogenic diets do improve insulin sensitivity, but so does caloric restriction. So, one reason to go Keto long-term would be to maintain the insulin-sensitivity and fat-adaptation benefits on a caloric surplus. That will not lead to weight loss, but some bodybuilders like it because it's easier to maintain energy levels. However, peak power is going to suffer, so it's a tradeoff.

The internet is full of stories of Ketogenic dieters who failed to lose weight because they still ate way too much. It doesn't matter what diet you're on, your body won't burn any stored fat until it runs out of energy from food.

Blogger James Dixon August 29, 2018 1:20 PM  

> If your car's engine could run on either gasoline or peanut oil, then it wouldn't make any difference which fuel you chose.

If. And if your body burned protein, carbs, and fats the same way the same would be true for it. It doesn't, and it isn't.

> A better analogy would be claiming that solar power delivers qualitatively different electricity from coal power,

You're not familiar with the difference between AC and DC I take it.

> The internet is full of stories of Ketogenic dieters who failed to lose weight because they still ate way too much.

The fact that MPAI isn't a good basis for making your own decisions.

Blogger Solaire Of Astora August 29, 2018 1:24 PM  

@133

Is it possible that the kind of food you eat could change your metabolic rate enough that it would affect weight loss? I always thought people weren't arguing 1 calorie of carbs is quantitatively different from 1 of fat or protein but that it might cause something to change along the way that means you'll burn more/fewer calories overall.

Blogger VD August 29, 2018 1:26 PM  

I dissent. I understand this is pushed hard. I've been lifting weights for 20 years. As far as body composition is concerned, I've found a calorie is a calorie is a calorie. The body knows what to do with no matter what you eat.

You're flat-out wrong. I thought the same thing too when I was in my early 20s. My father pointed out that given my age and the intensity of my hard-core training schedule, it didn't matter what I ate. I was going to stay ripped regardless.

Now, it matters. A lot.

Blogger Tars Tarkusz August 29, 2018 1:32 PM  

Nobody goes that long without sleeping. I used to have a job which put me in contact with people who, for chemical reasons have difficulty sleeping. Though they can be chronically sleep deprived for a month or more, it is never totally without sleep. They will usually get 15 minutes of sleep at a time. They feel like they haven't slept at all, but those catnaps seem to help them. I knew one guy that went an entire month without a single full night's sleep in the local jail, though he did fall asleep 15 minutes here, 20 minutes there.
Though I don't believe he didn't sleep a single moment for 25 straight days, maybe this state of chronic sleeplessness explains some of this insanity and the horrifying bags and redness that appear in and under his eyes. Even when I was in my early 20s, not sleeping even one night made the next day very difficult.

Blogger Cloudswrest August 29, 2018 1:32 PM  

Keto is more of a therapeutic diet rather than a maintenance diet. It's good for:

Losing weight
Reversing Type II diabetes/metabolic syndrome
Suppressing epileptic seizures
Suppressing cancer

Here is Mark Sisson's carbohydrate curve: https://www.marksdailyapple.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Align-Carb-Intake.gif

Blogger pyrrhus August 29, 2018 1:50 PM  

Keto is great for me, but I take a lot of vitamins and still eat quite a bit of fruit....

Blogger Cloudswrest August 29, 2018 1:50 PM  

Solaire Of Astora wrote:@133

Is it possible that the kind of food you eat could change your metabolic rate enough that it would affect weight loss? I always thought people weren't arguing 1 calorie of carbs is quantitatively different from 1 of fat or protein but that it might cause something to change along the way that means you'll burn more/fewer calories overall.


Hi blood sugar is toxic to body tissue (see maillard reaction), therefore (in a healthy person) the body algorithmically gets reduces it as fast as possible by raising insulin. When all body tissues have had their fill of glucose and can't take anymore the universal glucose dump of last resort is fat tissue, which can take an arbitrary amount by converting it to fat. Blood glucose levels then crash and you're hungry again. High blood triglycerides are far less of a metabolic emergency as high blood glucose, and blood fats just cruise around until they are needed.

Blogger Damelon Brinn August 29, 2018 1:57 PM  

Nobody goes that long without sleeping.

I assumed that meant he's actually sleeping a normal 8 hours, but for some reason remembers spending it awake and terrified. Which is pretty scary in itself.

Blogger EricW August 29, 2018 1:58 PM  

JACIII wrote:The poor sap probably wasn't eating steak. He's Canadian, so soy and some analog for grass was most likely his former dietary choice.



Alberta beef is as good as it gets, and JBP grew up eating it. Besides, not all Canucks are like that, just most of the city folk same as in the USA.

Blogger Jack Amok August 29, 2018 1:58 PM  

It's always calories in, calories out. All calories are the same

Sorry, you are ignorant on this topic. Calories are not the same. As James already pointed out, fat and carbs are burned differently by different metabolic processes in your body, and require different chemicals and hormones in different amounts.

Blogger Amy August 29, 2018 2:01 PM  

“Paleo” god I hate the word but it’s a brand and ID, so...Paleo has been a godsend for me. I’m 90/10 with it, I’ll eat whatever when I’m out at picnics, etc. but mostly it’s meat, veg, fruit, and if some small amount of grains get in I can tolerate it. Im better meat/veg based than grain based. Im neither a cow nor a lion, neither vegan nor pure carnivore (no organism is, we just settle on varying levels).

Sisson wrote an article on Lew Rockwell years ago, and that is how I found you all...Hawaiian Libertarian, VD, CH, and so forth. So Paleo was a godsend in more than just diet terms.

Peterson is like that kid in school who was bright but awkward and desperately wanted to fit in, so he says whatever to please whatever audience. Joe Rogan is a hunter, a bona fide meat hunter, and he makes no bones about it, but meat is not the sole makeup of his diet. Peterson was trying to fit in. That’s...not the way to be a Gray Man.

Blogger Matthew McDaniel August 29, 2018 2:07 PM  

Hey, some of us like our air dried fish & half rotten/fermented shark meat.

Blogger Tars Tarkusz August 29, 2018 2:08 PM  

If calories are calories, you could live simply by drinking soda without eating anything.
The body is a complex chemical reactor which at minimum requires more than just sugar.
This was common knowledge a hundred years ago and more. In various fiction produced in the 19th century or early 20th, our heroes often would complain about lack of meat making them feel fagged.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd August 29, 2018 2:20 PM  

VD wrote:You will get scurvy if you stick to your all-meat diet long enough.

Rat meat is high in vitamin C, and will cure or prevent scurvy.

Blogger Patrick Kelly August 29, 2018 2:28 PM  

"> The internet is full of stories of Ketogenic dieters who failed to lose weight because they still ate way too much.

The fact that MPAI isn't a good basis for making your own decisions."

Definitely. Losing weight had nothing to do with me going more in the Keto direction. I wanted more mental focus, less fatigue etc.

And I lost weight, probably because I couldn't consistently consume the calories the chart said I needed to maintain current weight, which was my original intention, and fwiw I was eating twice as many carb calories (but not simple sugars) as recommended, but still, hunger was easily quenched by more fat and protein dominated meals and snacks with less overall calories.

It's not magic. I still have to exercise, get good sleep, and moderate alcohol consumption.

Blogger John Best August 29, 2018 2:30 PM  

Just got your daily meme wars about this. Nice work. The guy is insane.

Blogger Johnny August 29, 2018 2:46 PM  

They go round and round about this diet stuff. My current take is that the two big problems in most wealthy countries are an excess of refined carbs along with eating too much. What Peterson is doing would be okay if he didn't go to this nutty extreme. Maybe this goofiness will cause a significant loss of followers.

Blogger Nate73 August 29, 2018 2:49 PM  

I've had some success with a keto diet and I take a multi, but I'm also debating adding vegetables back into my diet. The tiny gain you get from decreasing carbs to almost 0 isn't worth having to take fiber supplements imo.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother August 29, 2018 2:52 PM  

A calorie is not a thing. It is a unit of measure. It is a property of a substance. It is not the subtance itself. BTU is the same thing.

A calorie is the amount of heat required at STP to raise the temperature of 1 gram of water by 1 degree Celsius. And kilocalorie is the proper terminology for how our bodies interact with energy/calories. When we refer to calories, we are really talking about kCal.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd August 29, 2018 2:54 PM  

Nate73 wrote:The tiny gain you get from decreasing carbs to almost 0 isn't worth having to take fiber supplements imo.

Fiber supplements? I've lived in ketosis for months at a time, and find that my digestive system works more comfortably and regularly with just the little bit of fiber in fat and meat. I do eat a bit of lettuce and broccoli and such when the mood strikes me, but not every meal, nor every day.

Blogger Nate73 August 29, 2018 2:58 PM  

Ominous Cowherd: Someone else who did Keto advised me to take them. Keto does seem to work but I don't think it's a magic bullet, you still have to exercise, count calories, etc. But for casual weight loss it can be effective for some people.

Anonymous Anonymous August 29, 2018 3:20 PM  

The simplest thing that anyone can do to realize health benefits is to cut out sugary drinks and highly-processed carbs.

Wouldn’t it be unsurprising if the creator designed the human body to thrive on almost anything, with two simple caveats:
-don’t poison it
-don’t starve it

Huh.

Blogger OneWingedShark August 29, 2018 3:40 PM  

Resident Moron™ wrote:The simplest thing that anyone can do to realize health benefits is to cut out sugary drinks and highly-processed carbs.

Wouldn’t it be unsurprising if the creator designed the human body to thrive on almost anything, with two simple caveats:
-don’t poison it
-don’t starve it

Huh.

Even then, it's pretty resilient; it takes a lot to really starve a person (intermittent fasting has some health benefits) and malnutrition generally has to be a chronic problem to be an issue. As to poison, I'm reminded of the saying "The difference between medicine & poison is the dose".

TL;DR: Psalm 139:14 - "I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well."

Blogger Didas Kalos August 29, 2018 3:54 PM  

Who needs the comedy channel when you can get both comedy and keen insights on real life matters on VD? Some of these comments should not be read with coffee in your mouth.

Blogger Dirk Manly August 29, 2018 3:55 PM  

@17

"He didn't go 25 days without sleep. He only thinks he did. He was either microsleeping or entering a light doze and not realizing it. Or he's lying, take your pick."

I'll take flat-out lies for $2000, Alex.

The Army did sleep studies back in the 1950's, on how long troops can remain even minimally functional (notice things while on observation post duty, transcribe a short radio or telephone message, etc.) abilities, and found that troops can go 2 days with 0 hours of sleep, 3 days with about 2 days of sleep, and for 4+ days, 4 hours.

From personal experience in engineering school at Purdue, (my junior and senior years, I was typically getting 4 hours/sleep per day Sunday Night-Thurs Night) when you finally do crash, you crash hard, and you know damn well that you were asleep.

Peterson isn't mistaken. It's physically impossible to stay awake for 25 days (600 hours!) no matter how !!!TERRIFIED!!! the crazy old loon is. He's flat out lying. Or he's psychotic (which is a very real possibility, considering his cousin cannibalism story and oblique claims to being a modern incarnation of the Christ who he doesn't believe in).

Blogger Zeroh Tollrants August 29, 2018 3:55 PM  

Whatever, I just ate a bag of Doritos w/ fitered water and I'm going to go take a nap.
My gut feels fine, I'm sleeping like a baby.
Let me know when the Crazy Christ starts having full-on "visions" and his followers start buying truckloads of Nikes or plan a trip to their jungle compound.
At this rate we're looking at what? June of next year? Or, will Peterson have descended to a higher plane of existence where he practices vote by then?

Blogger Ingot9455 August 29, 2018 4:17 PM  

The potato diet going around currently is different. For about 2-3 weeks you only eat potatoes, either boiled or baked, nothing added. The goal is that your taste buds reset away from all the sugar and msg style super-additives out there. When you first eat something else after that, you'll have the sensitivity of a blind person's breathing but for taste. You'll pick up flavors you never knew about before.

Another thing to remember about ketosis results is that just like intelligence has a genetic component, so does fatness and insulin sensitivity (with other factors like gut flora.) Someone blessed with good insulin sensitivity and gut flora gets less from a ketogenic style diet than someone with poor sensitivity, low metabolism, and bad flora.

Blogger The Kurgan August 29, 2018 4:23 PM  

To be fair Van Gogh art sucked tho

Blogger The Kurgan August 29, 2018 4:24 PM  

I did go seven days without sleep. And I believe that 11 days without being the most ever recorded is sensible. I doubt anyone can go 15 days.

Blogger The Kurgan August 29, 2018 4:26 PM  

Bwahahahhahahahah

Blogger Jack Amok August 29, 2018 4:30 PM  

The internet is full of stories of Ketogenic dieters who failed to lose weight because they still ate way too much.

Well, if someone thinks "keto" means eating all the meat you want, they're probably going to have trouble. Protein in excess of what you need for structural repair gets turned into glucose, so you might as well be eating carbs.

Blogger tublecane August 29, 2018 4:49 PM  

@53- That is savage.

I'll admit cousin-meat popped into my head when I heard all-meat diet. But I lacked the killer instinct to follow through.

Blogger tublecane August 29, 2018 4:53 PM  

@24- Only fools think they can live off the Sun alone. The Moon Diet, on the other hand, is perfectly sound.

Admitted, moonlight is indirect sunlight. But bouncing off the moon imbues the rays with erg power, so...

Blogger SciVo August 29, 2018 4:59 PM  

Wuzzums Fuzzums wrote:Diets by their very definition do not work because once you quit you will revert back to your original weight. And if you're able to sustain it for the rest of your life it's not qualified as a diet anymore.

It isn't a "weight-loss diet" at that point, but it's still a "diet". And besides, that's a pretty major "if", like "if you don't spend your savings then it can go up." Duh, that's the point!

The best weight-loss diet is one you can sustain, and the most sustainable one is what you would need to eat to maintain your target weight. Then when you get there, you already have the right habits.

Blogger tublecane August 29, 2018 4:59 PM  

@70- Do you think what you said has anything to do with a guy claiming he stayed awake for 25 days, frozen in fear for 8 hours a night, all because he drank some apple cider?

Blogger LP999-16 August 29, 2018 5:04 PM  

Oh Dear, this is bad!

Water...redefined!

JP was recently with Sam Harris as well.

JP is like all the others I'v seen spread their illusions, make $$ and go away just to be replaced by the next mishap, someone like JP but this time more demented-broken-disabled effeminate man.

Sure, when the fear and depression manifests as out of control those symptoms do not go away they are distracted by a fresh way to control the fears you cannot control by controlling intake. Same design different format.

Trade: these unnecessary fears (despair) and conquering them or festering fears which fosters more dysfunction.

People forget gut health; cooked soft cold (red) potatoes under chives, hot sauce and yogurto provides both a pre and pro biotic.

Blogger anne August 29, 2018 5:07 PM  

You will get scurvy if you stick to your all-meat diet long enough. Neither Thomas Barlow nor the 19th century Royal Navy was in the pocket of the pharmaceutical companies.

Scurvy was one of my concerns when investigating the carnivore diet, and it's a frequent topic of conversations within the carnivore community. There are very few observed instances of scurvy, even among the "veteran" carnivores. So far as we can tell, the quantity of vitamin C that's actually needed is much lower than the standard RDA, especially among people who are not overloading their systems with glucose (which competes with vitamin C for absorption).

This is an interesting article on the subject:

http://www.empiri.ca/2017/02/c-is-for-carnivore.html

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother August 29, 2018 5:29 PM  

Why is this complicated? If you think your low on Vitamin C, eat an orange. It's easy to find Vitamin C. This isn't King Solomon's Mines, for fuck sake.

Blogger Lance E August 29, 2018 5:40 PM  

>If. And if your body burned protein, carbs, and fats the same way the same would be true for it. It doesn't, and it isn't.

This is Livestrong-tier pseudoscience. The human body has 3 energy systems: ATP-PC, glycolytic, and oxidative. Each is a different trade-off between peak power and duration. ATP-PC consumes creatine, glycolysis uses only carbohydrates, and oxidation uses both lipids and carbohydrates. Protein is almost never "burned" unless you're both fasting and ridiculously lean.

None of this has any relevance whatsoever to a person who sits around most of the day - glycolysis and ATP-PC only happen at elevated heart rates. If you do exercise, then low-carb and moderate protein (which in excess gets converted into glucose) means only the oxidative system can function once ATP-PC is exhausted. In other words, you burn more fat while exercising - because you have no glucose left, which is exactly the same mechanism as being in a caloric deficit, and why intermittent fasting is so popular with the sub-5% types.

You can literally run a diesel engine on vegetable oil. It's just less energy-dense than diesel or gasoline - much like carbohydrates being less energy-dense than lipids. The human body isn't a car engine, it can burn many different types of fuel - but it's all still fuel, and you're either in a deficit or a surplus. You will not burn stored fat (as opposed to dietary fat) on a Keto diet unless you are also in caloric deficit. Keto isn't a magic diet that breaks the First Law of Thermodynamics. If you take in a caloric surplus, that energy has to go somewhere!

>You're not familiar with the difference between AC and DC I take it.

You've never heard of a power inverter, I take it. See, I can do pointless snark too.

>The fact that MPAI isn't a good basis for making your own decisions.

When most people's experience converges with published research data, that's a good indicator that the data is accurate. It's when the two conflict that we need to start asking questions.

I've already been on Keto and Paleo diets. I don't need advice from the internet, I get it now from professionals. I simply wanted to correct some dangerous misinformation, and the wide variety of failure anecdotes is a good reference point.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd August 29, 2018 5:54 PM  

Jack Amok wrote:Well, if someone thinks "keto" means eating all the meat you want, they're probably going to have trouble. Protein in excess of what you need for structural repair gets turned into glucose, so you might as well be eating carbs.

Very true. I always say that I eat fat, and the meat that's attached.

Lance E wrote:You will not burn stored fat (as opposed to dietary fat) on a Keto diet unless you are also in caloric deficit.

Also true, however...

If you are staying in ketosis, hunger pangs are easily ignored, and skipping a meal because you're a little busy is easy, so you operate at a deficit occasionally. Also, saturated fat makes you feel full fast, so you rarely operate at a surplus.

Ingot9455 wrote:Another thing to remember about ketosis results is that just like intelligence has a genetic component, so does fatness and insulin sensitivity (with other factors like gut flora.)

I have a tendency toward hypoglycemia. Ketosis eliminates that. People who don't have blood sugar problems don't seem to benefit nearly so much from a ketogenic diet.

Anonymous Anonymous August 29, 2018 6:59 PM  

About 20 years ago I knew someone on an all-meat diet. She reminded me of Zoe Quinn, which is why she was a known quantity (to me anyway) when Gamergate broke.

What's the over/under on when he discovers cannabis as a panacea? "Jordan's Joints?" October 17th is coming soon.

Thought for a brief second about if SB wanted to run a consulting service, but it's a case of "if you have to ask if she's crazy, you already know the answer."

Blogger Arthur Tintagel August 29, 2018 7:02 PM  

Keto is more of an emergency diet to lose weight quick. A pencil neck like JBP should switch over to Paleo.

Anonymous Anonymous August 29, 2018 7:07 PM  

@142 Halal al-Berta beef.

Blogger Didas Kalos August 29, 2018 9:32 PM  

And then you come across assinine tweets like this one about Jordan Peterson. https://twitter.com/RadicalLib/status/1034820000102731776

"the supreme benefit of JP in this realm is that he gives permission to intellectuals to study the Bible. I know of one person who came to Jesus partly through listening to JP’s lectures on the Bible."

Blogger Stephen August 29, 2018 9:56 PM  

So he is an Eskimo now? Remember to eat the adrenal glands for vitamin C and ward off scurvy.

Blogger SciVo August 29, 2018 10:40 PM  

You know, I had been persuaded that he might eventually have a nervous breakdown and quietly check himself into a mental hospital, but now I'm leaning more toward him going full Shia LaBeouf. Alcohol could have bizarre and unpredictable results, such as him pulling out an imaginary gun and hallucinating that he's killing people.

Blogger Jack Amok August 29, 2018 11:34 PM  

I don't need advice from the internet, I get it now from professionals.

If those are the same professionals that told you all calories are the same, you might want to call them "credentialed" instead.

Blogger SciVo August 30, 2018 12:08 AM  

I can see it now:

In other news, famed Canadian psychology professor and global phenom self-help guru Jordan B. Peterson had a bizarre episode during a star-studded party to celebrate his latest best-seller, pointing an invisible gun at the guests and saying "Bam, bam, bam!" One guest, who asked to remain anonymous quote "because I would be blackballed if anyone knew I like guns" unquote, said that Mr. Peterson has clearly never actually fired a pistol, since real ones do not have such ridiculous recoil.

We were unable to reach Mr. Peterson for comment because authorities refused to release which secure psychiatric facility he was at, but a spokesperson released this statement: "I apologize to anyone that I scared by acting like I was shooting them. I'm adding a new rule: don't even hallucinate about hurting people, Jordan. I hope that all of my minions will join me in doubling down on my lifelong quest to prevent the world from being destroyed by me." At press time, social media was full of anxious fatherless men lamenting that they had not been there to be pretend-killed by their hero.

Blogger Johnny Reb August 30, 2018 1:45 AM  

@looking glass

My sister, dietician, has finally come around to the LCHFMP regime. She made my bro-in-laws life hell for years following the congenital wisdom. It was ironic enough a job health initiative that pushed him the other way and of course cutting gluten. He dropped back to am ideal weight and lost the brain fog. Still for years hiding the butter and salt, high carb, low fat, high protein diet. Finally she had to go back to work (SAHM) and picked up the new research. Now she won't shut up about it though I was telling her about it years ago. I like Mark Sisson's 80/20 rule though I have a niece who will be in pain for hours if she has any gluten, I'm sorta similar though I hear its the processing not the product. Granted there are allergies and inflammation and that plays a role.

@VD

Funny stories, I once worked for a boss who had twice been sleep deprived. Once on purpose. He told me at the end he started having hallucinations and finally had to sleep. The next time was work related, a friend found him outside staring into the sun totally unresponsive. He had to call the guys wife and check him into the psych ward at the hospital. So yes it will make you nuts...

Blogger Tanjil Bren August 30, 2018 3:02 AM  

"For example, over the years I've learned to trust Spacebunny's crazy radar; she has repeatedly and unerringly ID'd women who are charming on the surface and later turn out to be total lunatics inside from the most casual of conversations. It's accurate to the point that I don't even question her judgment anymore."

Thirty years we've been together and 100%, 24 carat, solid gold *this*.
It's a girl thing.

Blogger SciVo August 30, 2018 4:44 AM  

Tanjil Bren wrote:It's a girl thing.

I think that many men and women are more likely to breed if they are somewhat vulnerable to being tricked into it, so there could literally be a selected-for genetic component to being worse at seeing through the opposite sex. It's just a hypothesis.

Blogger Shimshon August 30, 2018 5:29 AM  

When I was in college, a bunch of us partook of [redacted]. In the middle of our journey, we ran into our friend Pete, who was in the middle of an experiment himself. He decided to try go without sleep for 72 hours. We saw him at the 60 hour mark. He was already a bit crazy.

He later told us he called it off not much later, when he found himself on the floor asleep three times going between his dorm room and the elevator.

Blogger Man of The West August 30, 2018 10:13 AM  

Don’t most cult leaders create diets for their followers?

Blogger flyingtiger August 30, 2018 11:14 AM  

Vox, I have to congratulate on exposing this fraud. I have seen Peterson's basic principals used by so many pop psychologists since the early 70s. I rolled my eyes and turned away. While this is old news, it is knew to others and they are falling into his trap and actually believe this nonsense. I thank you for the time and effort, you have put into this.

Blogger Taignobias August 30, 2018 1:52 PM  

He's almost certainly developed a malformed brain. A deficient diet (or a toxic one) leads to physical malady.

Might even be correctable, if he gets the right nutrients - it's worked for me (too much oxidized vegetable oil) and for some ex-vegans I've known. Nutrients from more eggs and organ meats should level him out.

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