Saturday, August 25, 2018

Mailvox: on the hunt

If there are any small skeletons in Jordan Peterson's closet, Saint Chan will find them:
Just in case no one let you know already, Jordan Peterson is getting researched in the Qanon board and it includes references to your videos.
I won't be even a little bit surprised if something deeply sketchy surfaces once the chans dig deep enough. The man's guilt is literally etched on his face. I don't know what it is that he feels so guilty about, but this might be an indication.
Pedophile ring theory in Cornwall, Ont., will likely continue to swirl
16/12/2009 7:08 PM

TORONTO - It's been more than 10 years since allegations that a pedophile ring operated in eastern Ontario first made national headlines.

And long after the dust has settled from the tome that is the Cornwall inquiry report some will continue to believe in a conspiracy to cover-up the truth, experts and observers say.

Commissioner G. Normand Glaude concluded Tuesday that children were sexually abused by people in positions of authority and that public institutions failed victims by mishandling complaints dating back to the 1960s.

But many were looking to him to lay to rest a more sinister explanation for those events, that it was the work of a pedophile ring and a cover-up that reached all the way to the Attorney General's office was at play.

He did not, saying in his 1600-page report that he would not make an unequivocal statement about the theory either way.

For some, it may not have mattered.

An explanation that to some appears to debunk a conspiracy theory just further confirms others' suspicions, said University of Toronto psychology professor Jordan B. Peterson.

"It's very difficult to disprove a conspiracy theory, because every bit of disproving evidence can be just written off as additional evidence that these conspirators are particularly intelligent and sneaky," he said.

Conspiracy theories are usually started by people who are very untrusting and it gathers steam among others who are somewhat untrusting, Peterson said.

They're psychologically compelling because they neatly tie together troubling facts or assertions, he said. When things go badly there are often many explanations, and an orchestrated conspiracy "should be pretty low on your list of plausible hypotheses," Peterson said.

"A good rule of thumb is: Don't presume malevolence where stupidity is sufficient explanation," he said.

"Organizations can act badly and things can fall apart without any group of people driving that."

While Glaude made no definitive statements about a ring, he declared there was not a conspiracy by several institutions to cover up the existence of any such operation, rather that agency bungling left that impression.
But we know, beyond any shadow of a doubt, that an array of government officials and agents have been conspiring against Trump. We have the emails and text messages. We know, beyond any shadow of a doubt, that the Vatican hierarchy conspired for decades to protect its gay pedophile priests. We have the indictments, confessions, admissions, and apologies. So, how does malevolence somehow cancel out stupidity?

And more importantly, why was this particular psychologist brought in to dismiss the idea of both a pedophile ring and a coverup even when the criminal abuse of children had been confirmed? Dismissing these things appears to be a subject of some interest to him.

Given Jordan Peterson's massive guilt complex and his observed inability to answer the question about his belief in the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, taking him down might be as easy as simply asking him on camera if he has ever a) had incestuous relations with anyone in his extended family or b) had sexual contact with a minor. Again, I don't know what it is that Peterson feels so guilty about, why he feels he has to save humanity in order to expiate whatever sin or crime it is that he committed, but there appears to be something that is tearing him apart from the inside.

Remember the heuristic: anyone who claims stupidity is sufficient explanation for malevolence is in league with the malevolent.

UPDATE: Oh, Sweet Saint Solomon Kane! Apparently it's been sitting right out in the open all along.
Psychology professor Jordan Peterson explains the method small children start to explore the world – quite similar to the voyages of Star Trek. This excerpt is part of his comprehensive lecture “2017 Maps of Meaning 9: Patterns of Symbolic Representation” at the University of Toronto:
Jordan B Peterson@jordanbpeterson
Sept 1, 2017
I'm a bad guy but I'm trying not to be and that's fucking something.... 

You don't say...

UPDATE: Apparently Peterson failed to notice the pedophiles right at his own university. Or a ring of 1750 of them who were in contact with his colleague at the University of Toronto.

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Blogger Phillip George August 25, 2018 6:57 AM  

Malevolent stupid and conspiring are not mutually exclusive. See CNN.
It's not an either or.

Blogger Doug Cranmer August 25, 2018 7:11 AM  

"My God. The paintings are real."

It's a statement for our age.

Blogger maniacprovost August 25, 2018 7:40 AM  

It makes more sense than anything else. Is Peterson a Trekkie?

Blogger tuberman August 25, 2018 7:42 AM  

""A good rule of thumb is: Don't presume malevolence where stupidity is sufficient explanation," he said."

Yep, that's the cliche, constantly hauled out, even in the face of overwhelming evidence of actual planned cover ups.

Even as he claimed to be not trying to debunk the ring's cover up, he was putting a all-in effort to bury it.

Blogger Nate August 25, 2018 7:52 AM  

While I also tend to assume stupidity over evil.. One must also remember that there is no reason it can't be both.

Blogger Amy August 25, 2018 8:10 AM  

Evil using stupidity as cover for its tracks. Peterson = pawn. Complicit or not.

Blogger cavalier973 August 25, 2018 8:11 AM  

"Even at its best, this world belongs to Satan."

~Chuck Missler

Blogger English Tom August 25, 2018 8:20 AM  

It should be obvious to anyone that the Franklin cover up, the Catholic church abuse, Jack Abramoff, Epstein, Saville, Dutroux, etc etc show that the so called elites are the worst dregs of the entire universe who constantly abuse, murder (and probably eat) children all to please their master Satan.
Petersen seems to be deflecting. I wonder why?

Anonymous Anonymous August 25, 2018 8:25 AM  

Defenders of pedophiles are pedophiles. How’s that for a heuristic?

Anonymous Anonymous August 25, 2018 8:44 AM  

Evil makes people do stupid things

Hs rule of thumb is stupid and serves evil


I think that’s a valid question. I’ve known people feel incredibly guilty for decades over very trivial things so possibly he’s one of those. But the question is definitely worth asking.

Blogger thechortling August 25, 2018 8:45 AM  

there is observably something that is tearing him apart from the inside.

He's certainly happy to publicly play, replay and play again his angst... for money. But his fanbois can't seem to ask themselves if it's all just a show from the drama club or heartwrenching, handwringing baring of soul from The Peterson. Any suggestion of the former brings out the "how DARE you, suh!" in the audience who most likely hasn't ever had a moral inclination other than the ever present modern moral substitute of fauxrage.

Peterson is laughing all the way to the bank. Or until he Bourdains himself.

Blogger IrishFarmer August 25, 2018 8:47 AM  

Vox, you said because the Catholic Church had nothing good in it we could or would have to build something better. In retort Id say that at this point its becoming clear that that wouldnt be enough either way....we're gonna need to build a new civilization.

Blogger wreckage August 25, 2018 8:51 AM  

@5. Yup. And sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from malice.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan August 25, 2018 9:00 AM  

As the joke described "bipartisan" is both stupid and evil, see globalism for reference.

Blogger VFM 4388 August 25, 2018 9:01 AM  

Peterson has repeatedly stated he enjoys rough-housing with Other People's Kids, and regrets the current climate where anyone who does so is suspected of ill intentions. It has been stated in this space that it is unnatural for a male to enjoy the company of OPK.

Make of these what you will.

Blogger Felix Bellator August 25, 2018 9:08 AM  

Hanlon's Razor only applies when the act trying to be explained away as stupid is not an act of itself evil. One might stupidly leave a rake in a yard that injures someone when stepped upon. Leaving the rake in the yard may not have been malicious. But, something like child rape is always malicious and could never be only an act of stupidity.

Blogger Alphaeus August 25, 2018 9:11 AM  

""A good rule of thumb is: Don't presume malevolence where stupidity is sufficient explanation," he said."

There's no reason to presume that this is a good rule of thumb. This saying is meant to mimic Occam's Razor, but it is actually a violation of it, or potentially so. If malevolence is the simplest explanation that covers the relevant known facts, then why multiply complexity by insisting on stupidity if actual stupidity is not in evidence?
Is it "stupid" to commit lewd acts on children and then obstruct investigations into the matter? Maybe, but it seems more simple and obvious that it is malevolent.

Blogger VD August 25, 2018 9:16 AM  

Zip it, August West. This is not a theology debate.

Blogger Unknown August 25, 2018 9:19 AM  

Sorry, Vox.
Won't happen again.

Blogger Balkan Yankee August 25, 2018 9:19 AM  

@3: Google Jordan Peterson and Star Trek. You won't be disappointed.

Blogger Avalanche August 25, 2018 9:31 AM  

Bingo. Sad, but on the point!

Blogger Unknown August 25, 2018 9:44 AM  

@Vox Day
Is there anything to your knowledge in history to explain where these people are comming from? Is this a new phenomenon, or was this going on with the Greeks and Romans too?

Blogger Damelon Brinn August 25, 2018 9:46 AM  

That rule of thumb tends to be presented as the end of the argument, but it should raise the question: *Is* stupidity a sufficient explanation for this situation? In the priest molestation scandal, it clearly wasn't. Common sense said there had to be many people involved in covering up the aspects they knew about, from hierarchy and bureaucrats to local police and families of victims, even before we had documented proof of that. Same thing is true of media collusion, Rotherham, the Hollywood scandals that are breaking, and others.

It's a fallback position anyway. Before the truth comes out, their position is, "It can't be true, because that many people couldn't be in on it." When they can't deny it's true anymore, they shift to, "No one was really in on it; everyone was just stupid." The second position is just as much wishful thinking as the first.

Blogger VD August 25, 2018 9:47 AM  

Google Jordan Peterson and Star Trek.

I have to admit, it never even crossed my mind. I should have known to check for that.

Blogger VD August 25, 2018 9:51 AM  

Is this a new phenomenon

I don't believe so. I suspect it is, to the contrary, a very old pre-Christian one.

Blogger Phillip George August 25, 2018 9:57 AM  

my guess is that he hasn't personally had his member in some now dead child's orifices, nor facilitated, nor been there when it happened.
could be wrong
but, my guess.....
Is he adopted? Had a very ignored, unloved, unnoticed childhood?
From a distance it all looks like decompensation.
He's covering for his parents lack of any life at all.

Covering for your parents means what?

Blogger Felix Bellator August 25, 2018 10:08 AM  

Yes, old pre-Christian seems likely. If you are willing to sacrifice a child to Moloch, how bad is a little molestation on the side? Moloch won't mind. It might also explain why the destruction of all the Caananites was imperative. You would have horrible monsters emerging from the surviving population if child sacrifice and molestation were the norm for that people.

It took the Hebrews 40 years to be rid of the taint of slavery. How long does it take to get rid of the taint of Moloch? Judging from the statue in Little Rock, longer than we have had so far. Time to civilization, indeed.

Blogger Durandel August 25, 2018 10:09 AM  

@22 and @25 - Isn't the stanic stuff being uncovered very similar to the worship practices for Moloch, Ashtaroh, and the Baals? I figure this stuff has been around as long as the day Satan was cast out of Heaven.

Blogger Zaklog the Great August 25, 2018 10:10 AM  

I take it that you're not a fan of Hanlon's Razor, then?

Blogger Phillip George August 25, 2018 10:12 AM  

there is no null set.
everything's theological.
doesn't deny the need for focused moderation. So you are both on point. cheers.

Blogger Daniele Grech Pereira August 25, 2018 10:12 AM  

Star Trek? Ok, now we're on to something.

Blogger Al K. Annossow August 25, 2018 10:14 AM  

The quoted article implies no coverup or conspiracy BETWEEN agencies. The 1600 page report scared me from trying to form my own opinion. But the 55 page summary

Is more manageable. It describes the actions of coverup and conspiracy but attributes, also known as mind reading, the actions by multiple agencies and levels of law enforcement to ignorance, laziness, ILLEGAL settlements, bad procedure, fear of exposure, and bad handling of paperwork. That is NOT mere stupidity. That IS coverup. Basically it tries to tell us that everyone would have actually investigated the claims of pedophilic abuse and stopped them if they had only known that they were true before investigating. These people are sick.

Blogger pyrrhus August 25, 2018 10:22 AM  

""A good rule of thumb is: Don't presume malevolence where stupidity is sufficient explanation," he said."

Stupidity never explains evil. And in our very interconnected society, pretty much everything is a conspiracy, or it couldn't exist.

Blogger Stg58/Animal Mother August 25, 2018 11:12 AM  

The lord of this world is evil. Not stupid. How many times is the word stupid/dumb/fool found in Scripture? How many times is the word evil found in Scripture?

Blogger cloom August 25, 2018 11:15 AM  

I have no specifics but here is a possible source for CHAN because it is apparently full of academics making comments and Jordan Peterson is an academic and I noticed he criticised O.I.S.Education in a tweet, and I imagine OISE academics in education are in that academics' social website since a convicted academic Deputy Education Minister of Ontario is active there:

Since his release, Levin’s Internet footprint is all over ResearchGate, a kind of Facebook for academics to post and review studies. “Research Ben” identifies himself as “retired from the University of Toronto”

Web address
Type of site
Social network service for scientists
Users 9 million[1]
Owner ResearchGate, Berlin, Germany
Created by Ijad Madisch, Sören Hofmayer, Horst Fickenscher
Launched May 2008

Benjamin Levin
Born 1952 (age 65–66)[1]
Winnipeg, Manitoba
Education B.A., University of Manitoba; Ed.M., Graduate School of Education, Harvard University; Ph.D., Department of Educational Administration, OISE, University of Toronto
Occupation Civil Servant
Title Professor
Criminal charge making and distributing child pornography, counselling to commit an indictable offence, arrangement to commit a sexual offence against a child under the age of 16
Criminal penalty 3 years incarceration[2]
Benjamin (Ben) Levin (born 1952)[1] was the Canada Research Chair in Education Leadership and Policy at the Ontario Institute for Studies in Education (OISE), University of Toronto.

Blogger VD August 25, 2018 11:32 AM  

Go away, Aeoli. I've already told you not to comment here. Go live your Secret King life somewhere else.

Blogger Lance E August 25, 2018 11:55 AM  

Several years back, Bruce Charlton wrote up a reasonable explanation of why Hanlon's Razor is idiotic (my summary, not his).

In reality, incompetent mistakes get resolved quickly. Large-scale, catastrophic failures require ulterior motives, even if those motives aren't obviously "malicious".

No surprise that Peterson regurgitates the straw-man of smoke-filled rooms and clever code names, rather than a shared long-term strategy - a difference he is surely intelligent enough to understand. And since we know that pedophile rings exist, we even know what that shared strategy is: colluding to cover up the abuse.

Cock-up isn't automatically a better explanation than conspiracy; it depends on the scale and severity of the incident and past behavior of the actors involved.

Blogger Roddie Piper August 25, 2018 11:57 AM  

Pedophilia is more an ideology than a conspiracy, so it neither has nor needs an org chart. Unlike e.g. hookers and drug dealers, who are just trying to score some easy cash, pedophiles see themselves as an unjustly persecuted minority morally obliged to help each other out any way they can.

Their ideology, that sex between consenting persons of any age is OK, is very close to current-year Progressivism and very far from biblical Christianity, where sex was legitimized by marriage, not by "consent".

The sanctity of childhood is a uniquely Christian concept. Pagans left unwanted babies to the wolves and didn't care if you took one home to use as your fucktoy. So it stands to reason that as the West becomes less Christian, it's likely to cave on pedophilia as it already has on feminism and homosexuality.

Blogger Manuel August 25, 2018 11:58 AM  

His book 12 Rules for Life is full of drawings of his children as children, some of them creeped me out.

Blogger maniacprovost August 25, 2018 12:27 PM  

I will miss Aeoli. His self conscious pose of superiority reminded me of college.

Blogger Joe August 25, 2018 12:44 PM  

The controlled opposition needs a kill switch in place or the media never would have the confidence to build them up without risk of backfire. Anyone that has been built up by the mass media should be viewed with deep suspicion for this very reason. That doesn't just include the big news organizations, either.

People that get built up on Youtube and inexplicably pop up in peoples' feeds also fit into this category. Millions of video views of people sitting in a tub full of cereal, yeah right. Next thing you know, they have an agenda to push to the children watching them.

Blogger Dave August 25, 2018 12:53 PM  

I'm missing me some good creamy aioli sauce.

Blogger SciVo August 25, 2018 1:02 PM  

Al K. Annossow wrote:Basically it tries to tell us that everyone would have actually investigated the claims of pedophilic abuse and stopped them if they had only known that they were true before investigating.

Someday -- and it may be a hundred years hence -- but someday, that will be the official epitaph of the enemedia's handling of #Pizzagate: "If only they had known there was a fire, they would have investigated the heck out of the smoke."

Blogger The Depolrable Podunk Ken Ramsey August 25, 2018 1:08 PM  

That article Vox linked to with the Peterson quote came from 2009. Since that time another one of men suspected in the pedophile ring in Cornwall pled guilty to charges involving pedophilia in Manitoba and was defrocked as a Catholic priest.

So Peterson should have more rightly said that it's very difficult to disprove the suspicions of conspiracy when conspirators keep getting caught molesting kids.

And once again we find two Catholic priests in the pedophilic milieu here in Cornwall. It's gotten to the point that I'm looking at every priest I see with suspicion, even my own. That's deserved. You can't let them alone with kids. They have forfeited trust.

Blogger Dirk Manly August 25, 2018 2:31 PM  

If you fail to police your own, then everyone else sees every member of your group/organization as an uncivilized menace to society.

Blogger FP August 25, 2018 3:14 PM  

Phillip George wrote:Malevolent stupid and conspiring are not mutually exclusive. See CNN.

It's not an either or.

Indeed, or any government's law enforcement agencies. Government attorneys file conspiracy charges every day in courts across the land. Many with scant or circumstantial evidence. That or they know the charged is guilty but they can't admit how they got the info because they got it without a warrant. So all they have is a faked through parallel investigations aka working backwards.

Is it stupidity or malicious when district attorneys toss in extra charges to force a plea bargain?

Blogger Primus Pilus August 25, 2018 3:19 PM  

"Mass child rape is stupid, but not necessarily malevolent." - Jordan B Peterson

Blogger Doktor Jeep August 25, 2018 5:01 PM  

"A good rule of thumb is: Don't presume malevolence where stupidity is sufficient explanation," he said.

Funny. One of the biggest problems with the right, and the fall of the Tea Party post 2009, was this horribly misguided (or induced by turncoats) notion that what the left was doing was merely out of ignorance or a mistake. So the rightist movements were for the most part about two things:
1. Begging and pleading the left not to do what they were doing and dialectically proving reams of evidence as to why.
2. The left was simply ignorant of their double standards due to the media and academia (and forgetting that that IS the left)

But now that we know it's not only malevolence, but well-planned, wargamed, and table-topped malevolence carried out by people who know exactly what they are doing and they do it on purpose, we can turn our own malice on any cuck, sellout, bowtie, and false prophet who tries to tell us that this is all just some mistake in policy or "cultural differences". Having different holidays is "cultural differences". People trying to eliminate your holidays is war.

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey August 25, 2018 5:05 PM  

@Roddie Piper

Pedophilia is more an ideology than a conspiracy, so it neither has nor needs an org chart. Unlike e.g. hookers and drug dealers, who are just trying to score some easy cash, pedophiles see themselves as an unjustly persecuted minority morally obliged to help each other out any way they can

Yep. Common behavioral traits + common identity that is (at least in part) based on those traits = potential for emergent patterns of behavior that may not require an org chart or a master plan. But this type of setting also makes it easier for conscious conspiracies to form, so...

Anonymous Anonymous August 25, 2018 5:22 PM  

My uncle was a Catholic school principal in Cornwall. Because of that, I've researched this myself.

It's entirely legit. Perry Dunlop was threatened and given bogus charges as some kind of "message." Kind of disappeared after that.

My uncle won't come to terms with it because he knows some of the people, said that they were "drug addicts who made up stories." My reply was that they became drug addicts to cope.

We haven't spoken about it since, and that was a decade ago.

There used to be a website,, and fragments are in the Wayback Machine.

Anonymous Anonymous August 25, 2018 5:28 PM  

@32 I learned when I was a teen serving Mass and wondering why I was allowed to be a bartender that the Roman Catholic Church has diplomatic immunity. "Churches are extraterritorial from Ontario and not subject to the Criminal Code, Provincial Liquor Control Act or anything else, my son."

Anonymous Anonymous August 25, 2018 5:30 PM  

@35 My teacher friend (who got her masters from OISE) said "jokes on them, Ben Levin wrote the previous curriculum they're reverting back to as well." (I dated her in high school, it's a loyalty thing.)

Blogger tublecane August 25, 2018 5:36 PM  

It's a dead certainty Peterson believes in a number of conspiracy theories, including the holocaust. Official history is full of them. In fact, it's almost impossible to do history or journalism without them. Unless you're just listing out bare facts no one wants to read.

Peterson sounds like a CIA stooge here.

This idea that it's impossible to disprove conspiracy theories is like how we say "you can't prove a negative." But of course you can, which is why people offer alibis to the police.

It's only certain kinds of negatives that are impossible to orove. For instance , that I have a microscopic invisible leprechaun in my pocket. But we're not talking about paranoid schizophrenic delusions here. We're talking about something very difficult to explain as anything other than a cover-up.

Blogger Vaughan Williams August 25, 2018 6:49 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Anonymous Anonymous August 25, 2018 8:11 PM  

Peterson's Trek persona is Anti Spock. An emotional, illogical cryman

Blogger Vaughan Williams August 25, 2018 9:06 PM  

When I saw Jordan Peterson's response to the question "Do you believe Jesus Christ rose from the dead", I saw a man who wants to maintain his popularity, and he knows that a clear answer on either side could lose him a lot of his following.

Blogger Paul M August 26, 2018 1:29 AM  

Nate wrote:While I also tend to assume stupidity over evil.. One must also remember that there is no reason it can't be both.

The difficulty is that JP, whatever else he may be, isn't stupid.

Blogger Paul M August 26, 2018 1:39 AM  

Durandel wrote:@22 and @25 - Isn't the stanic stuff being uncovered very similar to the worship practices for Moloch, Ashtaroh, and the Baals? I figure this stuff has been around as long as the day Satan was cast out of Heaven.

One of the salient things about the story of Abraham's sacrifice of Isaac is that at no point did anyone throw up their hands in horror and say "WTF?!". Also salient is the story of Jepthatah's daughter. One has to ask - why would they put that story in the bible, even if it was true? The answer is: it's in there to instruct other daughters on how to comport themselves should their number ever come up.

Bronze-age, semitic religion. Heck - considering the Aztecs, bronze-age religion in general. At the core of christianity is another human sacrifice, that of God the Father human-sacrificing God the Son for the sins of the world.

Blogger Alphaeus August 26, 2018 9:45 AM  

"God the Father human-sacrificing God the Son for the sins of the world."

That's right, dumbass. God the Father did not withhold His Only Son because He wanted to give us a chance to live instead of dying and rotting in hell like we deserve. And because the Son of God sacrificed Himself, willingly, no other sacrifice is needed.
Those examples of sacrifice were meant to illustrate to the Old Testament saints the point of what God was going to do, and to us living now what God has already done, once for all. Proving the point where you are concerned that God can explain it to you, but He cannot understand it for you, if you are arrogant and stubborn and pig headed and full of your self and think your sin does not qualify you for the 2nd Death.

Blogger Audacious Epigone August 26, 2018 1:03 PM  


On a recent Q&A from his patreon supporters he was asked how a person should handle having committed an act so grievous it would cause more harm by it being made known than could ever be undone by the person coming clean about it.

JP answered that it should not be revealed and instead the one who committed the act should devote the rest of his life to doing good things to try and negate the bad. He said maybe they could confess it tor a priest if the priest was understood to keep it entirely confidential no matter how bad.

I’m going off memory but I’ll find the exact point in the audio if you think it’s of interest.

Blogger Blastmaster August 26, 2018 2:08 PM  


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