Saturday, January 05, 2019

ComicsGate history: 2VS edition

2VS is up to his usual antics again, this time on Captain Red Pill's channel. You all already know my position on 2VS. He's not an enemy, unlike our actual enemies he's not out to destroy Western civilization, Christianity, or the European nations. That being said, he's not a friend, and due to his intrinsic unreliability, he's not even a potential ally. And while he's a talented illustrator, he draws far too slowly to function within Arkhaven's production process.

I'm not angry about his decision to attempt to revise his past indiscretions with regards to ComicsGate, I'm not even annoyed. I find it to all be tedious and unnecessary at this point. What happened has happened. It's a pity, it was ridiculous, and I wish I had simply stayed well out of it, but it was probably all for the best in the end. The thing is, between building our infrastructure, fighting our legal battle with Indiegogo (which is now officially on), and continuing to innovate and get our comics out, none of us at Arkhaven has any time or interest in any ongoing Internet drama. Ethan has his own issues to deal with, as apparently there was some problem with the writer he hired, and he's already had to push the release of his comic back so far that we may actually complete and publish all six issues of AH:Q before Cyberfrog ships. Why he wants to keep going on and on about ComicsGate makes no sense to me.
2VS: Vox Day is somebody who I really, really enjoyed my acquaintance with. I didn't really know him — like, I didn't know his beliefs — but what I did know is that he was kind of Alt‑Right, and he decided he wanted to come in and fight these SJWs in comics without having known anything about comics, and he put out this crowdfunded comic book called Alt★Hero.

She was wearing, like, a Confederate flag for a costume. She was a hot chick. It was everything meant to trigger social justice warriors. Now, my attitude was, look, you don't want to fight the extremes with an extreme; you want to offer a moderate — you want to offer a centrist alternative to get all the audience, get all the customers. Yeah, you know, something that was my plan. His plan was just to be the opposite side. So we we fought about that for a little while. I had him on my show, interviewed him, you know. I don't know ... we kind of talked. We formed kind of a weird kind of friendship over the telephone. And then what happened was he decided that what he wanted to do was he wanted to make a publishing imprint called ComicsGate.

CRP: Oh, now I remember. So he stole your name?

2VS: Well, it's not my name. It’s just a hashtag. But in point of fact, you know, it's like there are people who consider themselves ComicsGaters who just didn't want the forced association with Vox Day. The idea was that the hashtag belongs to everybody and nobody, and you can't really — like, if you're gonna — if Vox Day is going to publish a comic book company called ComicsGate, the implication is that, you know, ComicsGate is Vox Day’s belief system.

And people had a real, real tough time with that and didn't want him to co-opt the movement. So I talked to some lawyers, and they said, “You do a YouTube show called ComicsGate Live, you actually own the copyright to the name ‘ComicsGate’.”

CRP: Oh, wow.

2VS: “Well, that's like ...”

CRP: Shit.

2VS: “... because you monetized it first.” So I hit Vox day with a ‘cease and desist’ and threatened him with a lawsuit and we've had problems ever since, he and I. But I told him, you know, when he told me he was gonna do this, I said, “Vox” — and these are magic words coming from me — I said, “Vox, as a friend, don't do it.” And he just ignored me and went on to a Livestream and announced it. Now, if I say to you “as a friend”, and you go against that, I'm asking for a favor like that, and you just defy it ... you turn, you know ... I can either owe you a favor or we're gonna become enemies; it's one of those two things. That's the way it works in my world. That's the way it's always worked in my world. So if I say to you, “Coach Red Pill, as a friend, don't do that to me” — don't do this, don't do that — and you do it anyway, you've become my enemy, because I rarely say things like that. I don't make requests to people, but I knew this was gonna cause all kinds of trouble. And it has.

I mean, it's a shame. So Vox Day went on a whole tirade, trying to smear me and calling me two-faced and everything. I'm very much singularly-faced. I asked him not to do this because I felt that it would hurt the movement that we've been working so hard to nurture and build into something, and he chose to try to co-opt it, I think, for his own reasons, which I don't want to speculate about. But anyway, Vox Day also has gone after Jordan Peterson. Just, I mean, total ... sorry. The book 12 ... well, yeah, like he ... I think so ... I think he had some good points. I actually told him. I said, “I gotta say, I'm friends with Jordan Peterson. I like him. But you did a good job. I mean, I think you did point out some of his foibles and weaknesses.” Yeah, you know, good on him. But, you know, you got to be honest with people even if you ... yeah, even if you don't agree with them about everything. Even if you're in a fight, man. When they get one over, you gotta kind of acknowledge. It’s humility, you know. You got call ’em like you see ’em, you know, not like you'd like to see ’em, you know?

CRP: No, I'd ... Look, in so far as Vox Day ... I have no opinion about him. I have never interacted with the guy, you know ... but in so far as what you said earlier, that he wanted to do a comic book character who would, like, trigger the SJWs, trigger the Libs, right? All right. Here, with you, I agree that it has to be something that will appeal to the normies, to the broad middle.

2VS: That’s the only way to beat them.

CRP: Yeah, and to go for the extreme? No. You just create a caricature. Not a cartoon in a cool way. Like, you do, but like a character in the sense of a very small niche audience is gonna care about that shit, you know. And if you're a businessman, because you are and I used to be involved in commercial art, okay? I mean, I was writing stuff for money. I just, you know, not not for accolades. I could give a shit about that. I was, you know, it's something that I was remunerated for, the same for you. You do comic books for money. It's a profession. It's a job. It's a perfectly respectable profession. And so the idea of doing something that will only appeal to a niche seems to me counterintuitive. You want to appeal to as broad an audience as possible. And sometimes you recognize that you have to put in elements that will appeal to a niche who will be like the hook for the bigger fish of the wider audience if you will, to make a very crude or weird metaphor, but you seen I'm saying. I mean it's all perfectly fine, but you're trying to appeal to as broad an audience as possible, and that I think what Vox Day is doing, it's just not appealing to me.

2VS: He can do it. I mean, you know, the thing is, Vox Day can call himself ... there are people in the chat that are, like, you know, Vox Day fans that are outraged right now. This guy HorseMumbler1 one says, “Ethan is lying, Coach Red Pill. Go listen to what Vox said about it at the time. The ComicsGaters acted like a bunch of half-wits.”

Well, HorseMumbler1, you know, I mean, I think we've litigated this to death, but I mean, I have the receipts, and, you know, Vox knows that I've got the receipts. And by the way, since then Vox has come to me asking for some favors. I want you to know that.

CRP: What kind of favors?

2VS: No ... no comment ... so, you know, Vox has his way of spinning a tale, of spinning a yarn. I wouldn't necessarily think that what Vox had to say ...

By the way, Vox is so smart about some things and so fucking dumb about other things, it's unreal. Like, he recently got his fans all together to explain to them why his model for the comic book industry was so much better than mine. I mean, I've lived in comics for 25 years. But what he did was he took Cyberfrog, and he said, “Look, Ethan's raised $628,000 for Cyberfrog, so why don't we divide ... you know, the main book is 48 pages long. Divide 48 into 628,000, that's how much each page costs of Cyberfrog to make. Ethan needs this. He needs $15,000/page to draw Cyberfrog. Now, on the other hand my book over here, Alt★Hero, brought in $25,000. Divide 48 into 25,000, we're bringing it in at $500 a page, so obviously our model is much more economic and makes more sense.” Because I was like ...

CRP: You raised pre-sales, pre-sales of the book, right?

2VS: It's called profit, Vox. It's not ... I make more per page than you. I don't require that much. I can draw it for free. But, you know, it's like saying, “How the hell is JK Rowling gonna write another Harry Potter book?” You know, her first book earned $117,000,000. Divide that by 500 pages. It's too expensive to write another Harry Potter book. Most half-witted and weirdo argument that he was making to his credulous audience, and, uh, you know, they're here.

I mean, you know I love you guys. But anyway the point is that, you know, their complaint is that did I gatekeep Vox Day? No, he just wasn't ... I wasn't gonna let him have the name ComicsGate if I had any legal protection over it, which I did, and he knew that. But, you know, it's everybody's. It's just not Vox’s exclusively, let's put it that way. I saved it for everyone.

CRP: So right now it's sort of like, you have the rights to it, but you're basically standing aside so anybody can use it?

2VS: That's correct, okay. Vox Day can say, “I am ComicsGate,” and I will say, “Okay, Vox, they can have a YouTube show called ComicsGate, and I'll say, “Okay,” and everybody will, but if Vox Day wants to set up a publishing ... like a monetized publishing arm that makes it look as though he represents ComicsGate, I'm not gonna let that happen, because ComicsGate is just a hashtag that everybody has to be able to use, and it doesn't imply association, like, unwanted association with any one individual. It can't be political like that. People can't perceive it to be Alt-Right. It has to be moderate. It has to be everyone. Now, the Alt-Right can be involved if they want. The Alt-Left can be involved. It doesn't really matter. It's just ComicsGate ... the idea is that there are no politics. It's apolitical. It's all about money. It's all about serving the customer. It's the opposite of the mainstream of the comic book industry right now.
With regards to my asking Ethan for a favor, it's absolutely true that I did recently ask him for something through a third party, something that is in literally everyone's interest, and I can confirm that he had the decency and the good sense to provide me with what I requested. As I have repeatedly said, he is not the enemy, and I would not hesitate to return the favor. I also should point out that contra some of the comments in last night's Darkstream, it's very clear that Ethan did NOT accuse me of ripping of Taleb, which everyone here knows perfectly well that I did not do. In fact, Ethan doesn't even appear to be familiar with Taleb in the first place.
Did you hear that Vox Day fans I use one of Vox's words anti fragile is Talab invented that all the time yeah yeah yeah well anti fragile is a concept that Nassim Taleb invented which is very very astute concept but yeah it's basically a system that becomes stronger with more use and abuse yeah Vox, they ripped that off him oh that's funny okay I didn't know about that.
For reference, here is the very first reference to antifragility in my 2015 bestseller, SJWs Always Lie: Taking Down the Thought Police.

Strategic Principle #8: Be antifragile.

I cannot too highly recommend Nassim Nicholas Taleb's 2012 book, Antifragile: Things That Gain from Disorder, or too strongly stress the importance of applying the principles he explains in it to your life, especially if you are going to take a stand against the SJW Narrative. It should be your goal to become “a thing that gains from disorder” because disorder is the natural state of the world, particularly now that SJWs have become increasingly influential within it. Antifragility in this context means you have a maximal degree of flexibility, a high level of freedom of movement, sufficient psychological strength to withstand collective social pressure, and a lack of vulnerability to the usual SJW tactics of disqualification, discrediting, and disemployment.

On what planet could that possibly be considered "ripping off", much less "plagiarism", as one person characterized it?

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Blogger Dirk Manly January 05, 2019 7:14 AM  

The frog-face alter-ego is so appropriate for this oxygen-thieving waste of skin.

Blogger Chuck Finley January 05, 2019 7:18 AM  

Another word salad smith that stutters when he says "I"

Blogger Dirk Manly January 05, 2019 7:23 AM  

" so I talked to some lawyers and they said you do a YouTube show called comics gate live you actually own the copyright to the name comics gate"

He's such a liar.

Under U.S. intellectual property law, you can't get a COPYRIGHT to a name.

You can get a TRADEMARK, but not a copyright for any such thing.

No lawyer worth 2 nickels is going to confused Copyright for Trademark.

Conclusion: He never talked to any lawyer, other than "internet lawyers" who pretend to have proceedings in "internet court."

Blogger peacefulposter January 05, 2019 7:25 AM  

Wow, 2VS thinks he owns comicsgate and that you tried to steal his precious from him.

Wrong on both counts

Blogger Tyr January 05, 2019 7:25 AM  

What a moron.

His J.K. Rowling analogy is completely inapt. She didn’t earn 117 million to write Harry Potter; she earned that much from sales of the actual book.

Perhaps I have crowdfunding all wrong, but I thought that was supposed to be an investment in the creation of a product- not just income to be pocketed by the one raising funds- and the profit would come from subsequent sales.

Blogger peacefulposter January 05, 2019 7:29 AM  

If Taleb is anti-fragile, why is he so afraid of the race question?

Blogger pdwalker January 05, 2019 7:45 AM  

I was going to ask if he released anything yet, but it appears that the answer is still “no”.

I wonder if his backers will start getting concerned, especially with Arkhaven as a yard stick to measure against.


Blogger VD January 05, 2019 8:05 AM  

If Taleb is anti-fragile, why is he so afraid of the race question?

He's financially and professionally antifragile, but he's not emotionally antifragile.

Blogger justthinkin January 05, 2019 8:14 AM  

I wanted the Comicsgate logo to be open to everyone--except Vox Day. I want antifragility to be discussed--but not by Vox Day.

Is that a reasonable summary?

Blogger CoolHand January 05, 2019 8:22 AM  

Vox man bad! Comics Gate name make sad!

Can haz moar crowdfundz!?

Blogger Mr.MantraMan January 05, 2019 8:34 AM  

#6 Vox is odds on right with his answer, but a long shot possibility is that he has actually observed and has come to understand that the race realists are mostly the usual vanity and ego intellectuals, oh so much vanity and ego.

Try telling a race realist intellectual with some standing in his or her little intellectual community that the Blank Slaters are a most pathetic lot, weak and brittle, hollowed out by so many internal contradictions and outright fail, then you will see real contempt, for you.

So why should Taleb align himself with the intellectual suicide squad?

Blogger Daniele Grech Pereira January 05, 2019 8:39 AM  

"Captain Red Pill" That is jokes. When I see CRP the voice in my head reads it as "crap".

Blogger Laramie Hirsch January 05, 2019 8:40 AM  

What a mess. "Jeb, you're a mess."

Blogger Mr.MantraMan January 05, 2019 8:42 AM  

EVS is the guy you wind up and send in to the other side, not one you reason and try to use logic with in some noble gesture of nobility of the sacred truth.

Blogger Avalanche January 05, 2019 9:07 AM  

"Now, my attitude was, look, you don't want to fight the extremes with an extreme;"

Ah. Midwit with a pencil. Got it now.

Blogger Johnny January 05, 2019 9:08 AM  

To know where he is coming from it would be useful to know how his Ciberfrog project is going. If it is going poorly that would explain a lot. My take is that he has pulled his horns in. His aggressive statements are actually defensive in that he is defending his own actions, and in between he is close to being apologetic, but apparently too vain to do that.

To get where he is coming from, I don't think it useful to subject his statements to a rigorous logical analysis. He is a stream of consciousness sort of guy. His comments are just whatever pops into his head at the moment. He fits the stereotype of a person with considerable artistic talent who also has a muddled ability when it comes to logic. Not the sort of person who should be in charge of a major project.

Blogger Avalanche January 05, 2019 9:17 AM  

@5 "Perhaps I have crowdfunding all wrong, but I thought that was supposed to be an investment in the creation of a product- not just income to be pocketed by the one raising funds- and the profit would come from subsequent sales."

Depends on whether the guy running the crowdfund is honorable or not, doesn't it?

Blogger Avalanche January 05, 2019 9:25 AM  

@11 "race realists are mostly the usual vanity and ego intellectuals, oh so much vanity and ego."

Oh, I think you have this upside down!

To be an "out" race realist takes balls of steel, a mighty shield, and the ability to withstand continual attacks from slavering masses (including media and corporations)! The intellectuals *pretending* to moonlight as race realists don't actually intend to stand for it! Jared Taylor -- the epitome of race realist -- has stood up for 25+ years against the most insane vitriol and attacks (and deplatforming); and through it all has maintained his equilibrium, his courtesy, and his ability to present (yeah, dialectic) facts to anyone and everyone. There is NO "vanity and ego" there!

Like Constance-whateverhername, GRIFTERS and manipulators are all vanity and ego, noise and gibsme$$, but they are not true race realists. (And no, I don't believe that's "no true Scotsman" -- real race realists are fighting for us, the fake ones are piggybacking as parasites.

And the "intellectuals" are faking it for the press...

Blogger E. Darwin Hartshorn January 05, 2019 9:28 AM  

EVS's income was subject to SJWs for years. He didn't survive at DC without lying his ass off constantly. That's a soul killing prospect for most men. For a gamma though? He's lucky he's not living off of cave fish and muttering about hobbitses.

Blogger tuberman January 05, 2019 9:41 AM  

Where in your work 2VS? This is what people need to ask him. CyberFrog was supposed to be out by now, so where is it? All this arrogant BS about CG which he has it a slide from his lack of production?

When it does come out, very late, will it really have any coherence, as a story? Hmmm, Waiting, but not with baited breath.

Blogger SouthRon January 05, 2019 9:49 AM  

Now, my attitude was, look, you don't want to fight the extremes with an extreme; you want to offer a moderate — you want to offer a centrist alternative

Spoken like a true acolyte of The Middle Way.

And he is exhibits every attribute of being a liar and manipulator. Thank you for that Big Bear.

Blogger Unknown January 05, 2019 10:05 AM  

Can someone translate from cuckish to English, guys?

Because from what I can decipher, 2VS, a Peterson buddy just wanted to be a gatekeeper to those pesky alt-righters and Vox and co. exposed that fraud.

Blogger Silent Draco January 05, 2019 10:05 AM  

Mental floss, please. It makes Gollum sound eloquent.

Lenin would have a coin-flip on this one, to place in the useful or useless idiot category.

Blogger FP January 05, 2019 10:15 AM  

"Now, my attitude was, look, you don't want to fight the extremes with an extreme; you want to offer a moderate — you want to offer a centrist alternative"

Proof that he is politically and culturally naive at best. Clearly he's spent too much time in his comics bubble.

Blogger Daniel January 05, 2019 10:26 AM  

2VS is still talking? That is almost as incredibLe as the Cyberfrog one-shot going on two years in the making!

Blogger Bultz January 05, 2019 10:27 AM  

2VS is so desperate for attention from that corner of the internet, he sees the money come in on superchats, needs a taste of it. He needs to be focussing on delivering his $500k comic, I've seen him suggest March on his indiegogo! Yeah he thinks so much of his fans that over half a year delay with sporadic updates about "wow I underestimated this" really shows how much he cares for the community

Laughing at Vox for saying that this comic costs $15k a page? He fails to see that comment was targeted at his investors. Nothing else is going to come from that hype and energy that comics gate was generating at the time, so what exactly is comics gate? They are in exactly the same position they were 18 months ago. It wasn't "vox's fans" it was 2VS npc's raiding the stream! Oh well, the fact is, I put this down to 2VS desperately looking for an online community to pick up the superchat slack once cyberfrog finally lands (and bombs)

Blogger Fuzzums Wuzzums January 05, 2019 10:29 AM  

First off, "Captain Red Pill" is a fantastic name.

Second off, Coach Red Pill sees YT as a hustle and all he does is make videos about 2015 red pill bullet points. He's got a degree in cinematography and is smart enough to see how the trend is moving so he jumps on whatever bandwagon that will have him. Most people don't like him because he's always one step behind and he never says or knows about anything interesting. Case and point, CRP is only now jumping on the ComicsGate bandwagon.

His business model consists of creating inane videos that he releases on a regular basis, talks to as many famous youtubers as possible without saying anything, gets involved in drama but stays tactically neutral until the water has settled at which point he takes a very strong position on who's been in the wrong. An example is him releasing a very flattering video about Sargoon the Quadroon basically saying what an amazing experience it was to meet him in real life. After it became clear to everyone that Sargoon is a piece of shit he took a strong stance against him retconning the whole meeting.

I don't know what 2VS was thinking attacking Vox in a convo with CRP. This will only incentivize CRP to want to talk to Vox. If CRP is one step behind, 2VS has got to be at least two steps behind. Everyone 2VS tries to associate with on YT turns out to be a backstabber, liar, degenerate, or conman. It's a statistical miracle.

Blogger Jill January 05, 2019 10:41 AM  

It's short-sighted to view crowd-funding as your profit.

Blogger Tars Tarkas January 05, 2019 11:13 AM  

It has to be moderate. It has to be everyone. Now, the Alt-Right can be involved if they want. The Alt-Left can be involved. It doesn't really matter.

This is a formula for corporate blandness. Why not get a focus group going and test some phrases? I have to confess ignorance with his writing, but given this call for moderation and not offending anyone, it must be really bad.

Blogger Franz Lyonheart January 05, 2019 11:14 AM  

With regards to my asking Ethan for a favor, it's absolutely true that I did recently ask him for something through a third party, something that is in literally everyone's interest, and I can confirm that he had the decency and the good sense to provide me with what I requested.

Oh, that one it is.

People who have paid attention can easily guess what you mean here. And if what I guess is true, then it's not going to be just a one-sided benefit amongst "friends", as Ethan makes it out to be with his somewhat nebulous statement. On the contrary, he can have the reasonable expectation that he --as a creator-- will very much benefit from you.

Blogger Lance E January 05, 2019 12:01 PM  

Ugh, I'm not surprised 2VS is being propped up by Coach Red Pill, one of the bottom-feeders of YouTube's "skeptic community", which itself was a mess to begin with. Dude's been involved in all sorts of shady drama and (IIRC) doxxing campaigns. Hard to believe he's even still around, let alone has an audience.

Anyway, good on Ethan for having at least some awareness of the difference between public good and personal gain.

Blogger Balkan Yankee January 05, 2019 12:31 PM  

Who the fuck the cares about anything Ethan says at this point? The guy just simply can't deliver what he promises. It really is just that simple.

Blogger Doktor Jeep January 05, 2019 12:37 PM  

2VS will be afraid to pick sides until the sides pick him and the poor bastard is not going to enjoy his redemption arc.

Blogger Alex January 05, 2019 1:25 PM  

Appealing to moderates is a recipe for losing. Ask the GOP. We are not extreme. We are telling the truth. The truth is not just “the extreme version of what the SJWs are doing.”

2VS might not be the enemy, but he sure is stupid.

Blogger Primus Pilus January 05, 2019 10:19 PM  

"Now, my attitude was, look, you don't want to fight the extremes with an extreme;"

You don't want to fight fire with H2O, you want to fight it with just Hydrogen or Oxygen!

Anonymous Anonymous January 06, 2019 9:42 AM  

@32 fart huffing centrists. I'm still amazed Sargon still gets views.

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