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Tuesday, February 19, 2019

Mailvox: too short for the ride

Deceivers are always going to attempt to deceive. Especially after they find themselves getting caught out. A reader emails to note that Richard Spencer is still trying to dig himself out.
At 1 hour and 49 minutes in this video Richard Spencer claims he misused a term , and you jumped on him, but he claims he didn’t mean what you thought he did. He goes on to explain his vision of pan nationalism and says omni-nationalism is naive and wouldn’t work because larger powers would easily control them.

Sounds to me exactly what you said he said but maybe I’m wrong. I don’t know what he is talking about half the time. Not very articulate and sounds, like you said, a leftist. I thought I would pass this on to you so next time his name or position comes up, you would have his “clarified” current statement on his stance.
Richard Spencer is a midwit leftist and racial imperialist who is totally incapable of articulating a coherent case for any political program going forward, let alone a credible one. He's a fame whore about as intellectually serious as Ben Shapiro.

Pan-nationalism did not work for Arabs or Africans. It will not work for Europeans or for US whites. The high-water mark of civic nationalism, a very artificial, watered-down, and surreptitious form of pan-nationalism, was the 1950s in the USA, and as we have witnessed, it carried within itself the seeds of its own destruction.

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61 Comments:

Blogger tublecane February 19, 2019 1:07 PM  

"larger powers would easily control them"

Like Persia controlled the classical Greek city-states?

Is Spencer aware of the concept of alliances? Or is that too obvious?

Blogger Amy February 19, 2019 1:12 PM  

In 1995 I was sitting in a mandated undergrad women’s studies course at uni. They were probing intersectionality then, and I was a test subject.

We looked at *Native American* casinos as pan-Indian phenomena. Ok. But the bow-and-arrow wielding horse peoples of the great plains were very different from the Indians of New England, yet the image dominated the decor.

We flock to power and popularity, no matter whom we are.

When pointed out, though, the 40 something grad student prof said that NA culture belonged to all NAs, we shouldn’t limit them to just their singular tribal expressions and customs.

The frogs have been boiling for a f****** long ass time.

Blogger Uncompliant February 19, 2019 1:18 PM  

Yes, the Feminazis were preaching in the early 1980s too.

Blogger Amy February 19, 2019 1:18 PM  

Also, was watching MASH last night, season one is airing. It’s nostalgic for me, I watched the later seasons with my parents when I was very little.

In any case, the protocol-SJW Hawkeye decides not to schtup nurse-of-the-week when he finds out she doesn’t like goons marrying “our people.”

Bravo, Nurse. Hawkeye was everything boomer globos wanted to be, they lived vicariously through his manufactured righteousness and playboy behavior and pranks.

Funny though, we fought in Korea to defend Korean nationality, but didn’t want it for ourselves. Yet now we think unity of peoples within a political boundary but irrespective of origin is the key.

That’s a nope rope if I ever saw one

Blogger Amy February 19, 2019 1:20 PM  

*proto-SJW

*gooks

Blogger Nate73 February 19, 2019 1:31 PM  

Are the black and hispanic residents of the US also stuck in the same problem of not having identity as whites? African blacks don't even consider american blacks to be the same people in any way. I wonder how many hispanics could tell you what country their parents or grandparents were from?

Blogger VD February 19, 2019 1:33 PM  

Are the black and hispanic residents of the US also stuck in the same problem of not having identity as whites?

Blacks are. Hispanics are not. Puerto Ricans are Puerto Ricans, whether they are on the island or in New York City. There is no "Hispanic" nation.

Blogger Johnny February 19, 2019 1:35 PM  

Gook was the Vietnam War term for the locals. An implicit racial disparage. Never heard the word "slope or slopes" except in the movie Apocalypse Now.

Blogger Desdichado February 19, 2019 1:38 PM  

There is no "Hispanic" nation.

Even within the nation-states, there's not necessary a single hispanic nation. I've met Mexicans who barely even spoke Spanish, who's native language was Nahuatl, and who had very little in common with the northern Mexican or multi-generational southern Californian or Texan hispanics who's ancestors were more specifically Spanish.

Blogger Amy February 19, 2019 1:42 PM  

The word “gook” was specifically used multiple times in the episode I was referencing.

It wasn’t what NKs (Norks) we’re called in the 40s and 50s, but in 1973-74, when the episode aired, it was the term of disparagement most people knew.

Proto-SJW. Prep the bull and duck yourselves, for the good of the many outweighs the good of you.

Blogger Garuna February 19, 2019 2:04 PM  

Spencer has a severe case of Amerimutt-ism. I have never seen anyone outside of America yearn for a big white empire that will swallow up their nation.

Europe is starting to revolt at 90%+ white. Meanwhile America struggles to muster up a real fight at le 56%. This is the difference that having a real national identity makes. If you don't even know what your identity is exactly, how can you ever learn to love it enough to fight or die for it.

Wasn't La Lega a regional separatist party? That would mean not only do they have a strong national identity but a strong regional one too. That's probably why Salvini is having more success than the likes of Spencer or even Trump.

Blogger Damn the torpedos February 19, 2019 2:06 PM  

Vox do you think emerging white identity in the face of persecution will lead to an alliance between the post USA white nations?

Not going so far as to say we will remain one white nation (I’m from the Canadian border and don’t pretend I’m from the same stock as a Southerner) but do you think an alliance will form in the face of advancing anti whites?

Blogger Garuna February 19, 2019 2:16 PM  

do you think an alliance will form in the face of advancing anti whites?

India has a strong and rising Hindu nationalism due to a common enemy in Islam. If you take Islam out of the equation, the Hindus wouldn't be as united due to strong regional identities.

La Lega I think was also a regional separatist party which is now functioning as an Italian nationalist party due to a common enemy.

Something similar might happen with whites in America.

Maybe regional balkanization after the fight against the common enemy is over?

Blogger VD February 19, 2019 2:18 PM  

Vox do you think emerging white identity in the face of persecution will lead to an alliance between the post USA white nations?

Possibly, but the fate of South Africa indicates otherwise.

Blogger ScottC February 19, 2019 2:20 PM  

"Midwit" is being generous. When Spencer debated Adam Kokesh, he was asked why it was wrong for him to be assaulted. Spencer didn't have a ready made answer handy, so he filibustered for half an hour before giving an incoherent answer. And don't forget about his brilliant idea for Trump to come out in favor of universal health care (how it would be paid for and its impact on the national debt Spencer never said).

Shapiro is a turd but he's smarter than Spencer. If Kokesh had asked him that same question he would not have gone blank and meandered for 30 minutes.

Blogger Damn the torpedos February 19, 2019 2:25 PM  

“Possibly, but the fate of South Africa indicates otherwise.“

God help us all. I honestly don’t know what my childrens future will look like. I’m not even sure whether I should stick it out here and fight for a new nation or jump ship to Europe and try to marry into a nation there.

One things for sure, my children will not be slaves if there is anything I can do about it.

Blogger 1LLoyd February 19, 2019 2:27 PM  

Having been around some Native Americans, and having read more, they prefer to be identified by their tribe first. They recognize that each tribe has a different culture. There can be animosity based on tribe too. That profdidn't know this subject.

Blogger Balkan Yankee February 19, 2019 2:28 PM  

Richard Spencer is a fist magnet. That's all I need to know about that particular person.

Blogger 1st Earl Hardwicke February 19, 2019 2:30 PM  

What we need is a great big melting pot. Big enough to take the world and all it's got....

Wouldn't pan nationalism be the same as "multi-culturalism". Except instead of coffee coloured people. Generic white pasty squared jaw North Americans.

Blogger John Best. February 19, 2019 2:37 PM  

The guy is so dumb that he thinks power is size.

Blogger rumpole5 February 19, 2019 2:48 PM  

I agree. Now can we bring back the "no Irish need apply" signs?
From Tammany to the Kennedys (Pres, Atty Gen, AND Justice) they have been a bad lot. I really think that any citizen with significant hertage outsidtheirthe Hajnal line ought to have to pass a psyc, morality, and civics test to vote. I don't care what their complection looks like.

Blogger John Best. February 19, 2019 2:53 PM  

@12 The American nation in North America has over 100 million people, the French nation has 40 million, the Spanish nation over 100 million and the German nation over 60 million people. Then you have the smaller black nation, the Italian, Irish, Polish, Scandinavian and so on. So once the nations form in North America, along with the Aztec nation there will be conflict and competition between all of them, which the Chinese, Japanese and European powers having influence and supporting different north American nations.

I would think the Aztec and British nations would be the most powerful, given their numbers and the support the British would get from Britain directly. The smaller groups of the people like the Portuguese and Dutch could ally with the British. Right now though the French already have established their nation in Quebec, so they are in a strong position to bring in their people and expand.

Blogger Gen. Kong February 19, 2019 3:14 PM  

Spencer strikes me as controlled opposition (different than approved opposition but ultimately funded by the same overlords). There's some evidence of connections with the Prescott-Bush crime family. As for South Africa and the fate of the whites there, Unz had a very informative article last week.

Blogger Margo February 19, 2019 3:17 PM  

I think we have a pretty good base here in Quebec. We’ll have to fight if we want to keep montreal but otherwise saguenay, trois rivieres, quebec city and most other large cities belong to us. And thankfully our provincial premier is lowering immigration by 20%.
But allying with anglos???? Things have to get REALLY bad for that to happen.

Blogger tublecane February 19, 2019 3:22 PM  

@11- You find pan-European nationalism popping up in fascist circles here and there across Europe. Oswald Mosely, I think, promoted it. Maybe among French New Rightists like Alain de Benoist.

Blogger peacefulposter February 19, 2019 3:24 PM  

@Margo get ready for a lot of Anglo refugees from the ROC.

Blogger Margo February 19, 2019 3:30 PM  

@Peaceful Poster Honestly i’m not too worried about that because the other provinces are huge. Anglos should have enough space.

Blogger KPKinSunnyPhiladelphia February 19, 2019 3:51 PM  

VD wrote:Vox do you think emerging white identity in the face of persecution will lead to an alliance between the post USA white nations?

Possibly, but the fate of South Africa indicates otherwise.


Certainly not in the lifetimes of all of us in adulthood today.

Blogger Zaklog the Great February 19, 2019 3:57 PM  

Richard Spencer is a midwit leftist and racial imperialist who is totally incapable of articulating a coherent case for any political program going forward, let alone a credible one. He's a fame whore about as intellectually serious as Ben Shapiro.

And yet he still managed to lay the smack down on ShaunKing of Akkad, by all accounts. I sometimes enjoy Sargon's work, but that does not speak well of him.

Blogger Not Important February 19, 2019 4:19 PM  

If one believes the allegations made by Jason Kessler, Spencer is a Hitlerite with a slightly above average impulse control for that bunch.
Now the guy definitely has an axe to grind, given that most of the blame for UTR was laid at his feet but I still suspect he's right on that count.

Blogger VFM #7634 February 19, 2019 4:26 PM  

"There can be animosity based on tribe too."

@Loyd Jenkins
For example, the Flatheads think there's nothing worse than a stinking damn Crow.

Blogger judgeholdem1848 February 19, 2019 4:35 PM  

In defense of the 1950s American-style white pan nationalism, it was no more artificial than refrigeration, central heating or any other modern amenity whose presence vastly improves its absence.

Like all animate things, the short-lived white pan nationalism contained the seeds of its own destruction. But Kevin MacDonald makes a strong case in Culture of Critique that those seeds would never have grown without special activation. The other seeds were merely necessary but not sufficient preconditions to its early demise.

Even during its short life, this society produced great prosperity and perhaps the highest standards of living and quality of life anywhere or any time. A life's value can't be judged solely by its length. Why couldn't 50 or 100 of those idyllic societies be reconstituted in place of their acromegalic forbear, with the life-extending property of preemptively extirpating or sterilizing all special Abrahamic seeds in their territories? Shooting for a 1-or-2-saecula-lasting downsized, watered down, artificial whiteopia would seem better than defaulting to an all-natural POCscape. Is there a better alternative?



Blogger VFM #7634 February 19, 2019 4:39 PM  

"Possibly, but the fate of South Africa indicates otherwise."

The Anglos and Afrikaners are also in the situation of being much less numerous than the nonwhites, and furthermore, one tried to commit genocide on the other a century ago. It's possible that American whites will be better off because of those factors being less important.

Blogger jijijeac February 19, 2019 4:47 PM  

i agree with spencer mainly due to the fact that he promotes a version of white unity and identity something that is desperately needed these days. also nothing wrong with being white and economically leftwing. leftwing whites such as the norwegians can build good societies. obviously not every white group should adopt the same economic principles

Blogger Unknown February 19, 2019 4:56 PM  

Dont forget his gf is a literal leftist/satanist & he's a drug using degenerate(coke/weed confirmed) here's a link to the proof https://youtu.be/QqO91NaSdZs

Blogger John Best. February 19, 2019 5:00 PM  

@34 He is sowing the seed for the further conflict between the white nations. Forcing us together doesn't work and Spencer because he is a globalists wants to repeat it. Its just a rehash of globalism enforced by the state over the nations. I find it interesting that the high IQ people know this and its all the midwits pushing the new forms of globalism, Spencer and Peterson. If you know anything about how things are going, then the system of economics will be mercantilism, as William S Lind points out the system worked very well in the 1600's and 1700's. Then as Vox Day points out the globalist systems of economic have failed and they are evil.

Blogger VD February 19, 2019 5:22 PM  

i agree with spencer mainly due to the fact that he promotes a version of white unity and identity something that is desperately needed these days.

That's retarded and anti-nationalist. Do you not get that?

Blogger Snidely Whiplash February 19, 2019 5:26 PM  

jijijeac wrote:i agree with spencer mainly due to the fact that he promotes a version of white unity and identity something that is desperately needed these days.
Do you also agree that we need Unicorn-defecated Skittles?

Blogger sammibandit February 19, 2019 5:33 PM  

Too short for this blog.

Blogger Teleros February 19, 2019 5:47 PM  

Zaklog the Great wrote:And yet he still managed to lay the smack down on ShaunKing of Akkad, by all accounts.
"Sargon, you're not as smart as you think you are."

I might have it slightly wrong, but that was the killer line. I'd say probably true, but all the same it's basically pure rhetoric.

Blogger John Best. February 19, 2019 5:50 PM  

@40 its also true about Richard Spencer.

Blogger electricsheeple February 19, 2019 5:51 PM  

Spencer is a little bit like Peterson, in that he knows tiny tiny bit about a wide variety of philosophical subjects, which is enough to fool the marks.

Blogger VD February 19, 2019 6:21 PM  

You're banned, Robert Browning. Don't try to comment here again.

Blogger Triumph of Rome February 19, 2019 6:46 PM  

Identities are not invented by humans and cannot be manufactured atificially.

National unity comes from common blood and common heritage. Cultural unity comes from shared language, material, food, memes, etc. Christian unity comes from real spiritual brotherhood and the transformation of the heart.

What is there to unify whites? What do we actually have in common except some food and some memes, which we share with most the world now? We don’t all follow the same religion or have the same blood.

The only possible “white unity” is an ideological unity of people who believe in this particular ideology. The people who believe in this can sense this, which is why they spend their time going around trying to convince everyone it’s the correct ideology as if anyone cares.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd February 19, 2019 7:32 PM  

American Blacks don't identify as Zulu or Bantu,they identify as Black, or as Crips or Bloods. All it took to remove their national identity was several generations of being in a society that ignored everything about them except their color.

The Whites I know say their race is White, not Irish or German or English. White isn't a nation, or an identity, yet. In America we have started down the road which could make it so.

Blogger Sean Carnegie February 19, 2019 8:15 PM  

I think we have a pretty good base here in Quebec. We’ll have to fight if we want to keep montreal but otherwise saguenay, trois rivieres, quebec city and most other large cities belong to us. And thankfully our provincial premier is lowering immigration by 20%.
But allying with anglos???? Things have to get REALLY bad for that to happen.


Except us Anglos would come to take what our billions upon billions of dollars has paid for out of "equalization". In quotes because there's nothing equal about it: Anglo Canada pays for Quebec to be French and Quebec then crows about how awesome their economy is.

Quebec is probably the worst off of any of the Canadian provinces. They're too addicted to having the rest of Canada pay for their province to exist to live by themselves. Like an 18 year old Chinese kid who has never made dinner, washed his laundry nor paid a bill.

Blogger sammibandit February 19, 2019 8:48 PM  

If Quebec were manufacturing like they used to, using that rich St. Lawrence river, the west wouldn't have such a gripe about equalization. We all know it out west that the monies go to pay for their luxe social services. We work until May here every year just to pay federal taxes. It's like Germany versus Greece.

Blogger Nate February 19, 2019 9:38 PM  

Spencer and Anglin are both about as useful as tits on a boar hog.

They ain't worth the effort it would take to piss on them.

Blogger damaris.tighe February 19, 2019 9:53 PM  

Zaklog the Great wrote:Richard Spencer is a midwit leftist and racial imperialist who is totally incapable of articulating a coherent case for any political program going forward, let alone a credible one. He's a fame whore about as intellectually serious as Ben Shapiro.

And yet he still managed to lay the smack down on ShaunKing of Akkad, by all accounts. I sometimes enjoy Sargon's work, but that does not speak well of him.


I remember seeing that debate. Spencer made a simple rhetorical point ridiculing Sargon's Locke-theoretical starting point and pointing to the real world. All the rest was trading insults.

Blogger damaris.tighe February 19, 2019 10:19 PM  

Teleros wrote:Zaklog the Great wrote:And yet he still managed to lay the smack down on ShaunKing of Akkad, by all accounts.

"Sargon, you're not as smart as you think you are."

I might have it slightly wrong, but that was the killer line. I'd say probably true, but all the same it's basically pure rhetoric.


Nah, that was frat-boy sark that Spencer supporters (that is, all of them )enjoyed hearing. It was an ambush and an undistinguished interchange run on personalities. Waste of an opportunity.

Blogger Theproductofafineeduction February 20, 2019 12:19 AM  

I doubt that will happen. Look at the black Americans you mention, their identity is as Blacks is only when they are presenting themselves to outsiders, amongst themselves they are entirely tribal identifying based on their ‘hood.

Whites aren’t any different we just were able to pretend we were because of the fortune of a vast land that was virtually empty.

Blogger jijijeac February 20, 2019 1:50 AM  

@VD

individual white nations by themselves can not deal with the globalist plague atm. individual white countries going against the entire nonwhite and white traitorish planet isnt realistic. temporary alliance between the white nations is needed. also a white nation is simply a gorup of white people united by a territory and with a common culture. white culture fit a lot better between themselves than non white cultures. and yes even leftwing white cultures are more compatible with right wing white cultures than nonwhite rightwing cultures with white right wing cultures

Blogger John Best. February 20, 2019 4:01 AM  

@52 What about the Loyalists in Northern Ireland, they defeated the globalists by themselves. The Rhodesians withstood the globalist attack for 15 years by themselves. The Rhodesians were just 300,000 people and the Loyalists were 200,000 Loyalists and 500,000 Unionist Protestants. Hungary is 10 million people. All these nations didn't form alliance with other nation, they stood against the globalist onslaught and maintained themselves, defeated them or are working to break apart the globalist alliances.

The reality is that we need to bring nations down to the local counties and that is how you defeat the globalist states. In Cumberland where I live the state could be overthrown, but if I then tried to overthrow the state in entirety of Britain I would fail. We need to fight the globalists on our ground, not their ground. The same goes for the Americans, you need to form nations out of counties, not a state or the US as a whole. Learn from how others defeated the globalists.

Blogger jijijeac February 20, 2019 4:56 AM  

northern ireland was an internal british issues not a globalist issue. orban in the eu is mostly trolling and hasn't implemented that many nationalist policies: hungary is still in the eu and orban and his party are memebers of the european popular party aka the same european party as merkel and her party. also orban hasnt used his veto power to veto anything at an eu level. as I mentioned before thinking u can just be an isoloated country by yourself in the face of globalism is just unrealistic atm. no country has managed to do so without repercussions(see iran and north korea)

Blogger Zerokage February 20, 2019 6:24 AM  

Richard Spencer's divorce is an interesting train wreck.

Blogger John Best. February 20, 2019 6:58 AM  

@54 you were talking about white nations, I gave you examples of white nations. Then you move to talking about Iran and DPRK. Northern Ireland was the last bastion of the national defiance against the globalist state. So the Loyalists went to war with the British state in 1913, and gained devolution from the state in 1922. The reason why the conflict started is because the globalists were trying to subvert the Loyalists and bring the under the heel of the state. So again in 1968 the Loyalists went to war and fought a 30 year conflict to defeat the globalist state and drive it out of Northern Ireland. Even now the globalists can't force abortion or immoral marriage on Northern Ireland and the DUP have been the reason for No deal Brexit. The Loyalists were able to do this because of 4th generation warfare and retro culture, Protestant faith and Loyalist nationalism.

Orban built a border wall, defeated the globalists in his last election and has stopped many EU policies because he says he won't support them, so the EU doesn't even put them forward. It also allows Poland, Czech Republic and others to oppose mass immigration on their national level. As for repercussions, the Loyalists lost dozens of the volunteers to the British and Irish states, an hundred murdered by the IRA. So there will be repercussions, the question is will can stand against them and push forward taking the fight to the globalists like the Loyalist did and Orban is doing now. And you will nice that Iran and DPRK haven't been invaded or overthrown, like western nations have been. Or like Syria which has attempted to force the Pan-Arab nation with Egypt.

Blogger Amy February 20, 2019 7:31 AM  

http://voxday.blogspot.com/2019/02/mailvox-too-short-for-ride.html?showComment=1550604432001&m=1#c1481206335796456305

That’s just it, Lloyd Jenkins. There is no “pan-x”. I’m all for No More Brother Wars, but pan nationalism necessarily erases aspects of individual cultures for the sake of White unity.

Babel, and turtles on down.

Blogger VD February 20, 2019 10:49 AM  

also a white nation is simply a gorup of white people united by a territory and with a common culture.

No, it isn't. There is no such thing as a unitary "white nation". You're ignorant of the language and history alike.

Blogger Birdman February 20, 2019 11:40 AM  

White unity? Are you stupid?? How could you unify that?

Blogger Vlad Z. February 20, 2019 7:50 PM  

@22 John Best - your post sounds like it would make a good world setting for a future sci-fi novel. Where North America has broken down and regressed to a patchwork of European nation based neo-colonies. I love those sorts of books, I would probably buy it and enjoy it.

But of course, it's fanciful and nothing like that is ever going to take place.

Almost everything that would make such a grouping possible is long gone in North Amerca. Take the German language. It is barely taught in high schools anymore despite being the ethnic background of more Americans than the ones that are. (Chinese is more common.)

There are a few loose European ethnic enclaves in America still, Boston has both Irish and Italian neighborhoods, but most of that was destroyed in the last 50 years. The Clint Eastwood character Walt Kowalsk was the last Polish guy in a previously Polish neigborhood in Detroit. There were ethnic neighborhoods in Detroit in the 1950s and 1960s but after the riots all the white people left, and they moved as individuals. This resulted in checkboard suburbs where all the European ethnics were pretty intermixed.

There is no way that Dutch or Swedish-Americans are going to suddenly reinvest in lost ethinic heritage and create a little-Sweden in North America.

As charming at that would be, and as nice a model as it was / could have been that's all far behind us now.

Blogger Alexandros February 20, 2019 9:58 PM  

The boy where Spencer ruined sargon was hilarious. The memes spawned by that were incredible.

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