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Monday, February 25, 2019

No church can serve two masters

The African Methodists choose Jesus Christ over Mammon:
Please hear me when I say as graciously as I can: we Africans are not children in need of western enlightenment when it comes to the church’s sexual ethics. We do not need to hear a progressive U.S. bishop lecture us about our need to “grow up.”

Let me assure you, we Africans, whether we have liked it or not, have had to engage in this debate for many years now. We stand with the global church, not a culturally liberal, church elite in the U.S.

We stand with our Filipino friends! We stand with our sisters and brothers in Europe and Russia! And yes, we stand with our allies in America.

We stand with farmers in Zambia, tech workers in Nairobi, Sunday School teachers in Nigeria, biblical scholars in Liberia, pastors in the Congo, United Methodist Women in Cote d’Ivoire, and thousands of other United Methodists all across Africa who have heard no compelling reasons for changing our sexual ethics, our teachings on marriage, and our ordination standards!

We are grounded in God’s word and the gracious and clear teachings of our church. On that we will not yield! We will not take a road that leads us from the truth! We will take the road that leads to the making of disciples of Jesus Christ for transformation of the world!

I hope and pray, for your sake, that you will walk down that road with us. We would warmly welcome you as our traveling companions, but if you choose another road, we Africans cannot go with you.... Some Africans have been told that if a gracious exit petition is passed our evangelical friends in the U.S. will go their own way and no longer support efforts in Africa. That is not true.

Many of us in Africa have developed deep and long lasting friendships with our brothers and sisters in the U.S. Those relationships will not be severed if a gracious exit petition passes.

Unfortunately, some United Methodists in the U.S. have the very faulty assumption that all Africans are concerned about is U.S. financial support. Well, I am sure, being sinners like all of you, some Africans are fixated on money.

But with all due respect, a fixation on money seems more of an American problem than an African one. We get by on far less than most Americans do; we know how to do it. I’m not so sure you do. So if anyone is so naïve or condescending as to think we would sell our birth right in Jesus Christ for American dollars, then they simply do not know us.

We are seriously joyful in following Jesus Christ and God’s holy word to us in the Bible. And in truth, we think many people in the U.S. and in parts of Europe could learn a great deal from us. The UM churches, pastors and lay people who partner with us acknowledge as much.

Please understand me when I say the vast majority of African United Methodists will never, ever trade Jesus and the truth of the Bible for money.
What a bold and admirable man of God! God will bless those African churches for their faithfulness and bless their nations through them. Those enlightened liberal American churches will die, for they have forsaken Jesus Christ in the name of sin and worldly approval.

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74 Comments:

Blogger Lazarus February 25, 2019 5:19 AM  

Something that needs to be nailed on church doors across the nation.

Later to be labelled by the MSM as a hate crime.

Blogger JohnofAustria February 25, 2019 5:28 AM  

It's amazing how wonderful it feels to hear someone in any church hierarchy stand up for the actual word of God.

Blogger My 1 millionth internet profile February 25, 2019 5:31 AM  

Even more than ADOS (gotta keep current with the lingo!), Africans distrust and dislike flabby Western liberal elites.

Anonymous Anonymous February 25, 2019 5:43 AM  

Judging from the signs displayed outside the old mainline Protestant churches in my area, their main priorities are the acceptance of sodomy and refugees.

Blogger Mandos February 25, 2019 5:43 AM  

God bless this extremely based and christ-pilled man of faith. May he succeed in resisting convergence for his church as his American fellows try to go around people like him to keep advancing their dirty little agenda.

Blogger BastionHarm February 25, 2019 6:02 AM  

Mag Stuart wrote:Judging from the signs displayed outside the old mainline Protestant churches in my area, their main priorities are the acceptance of sodomy and refugees.

Exactly what I see as well. Just a few blocks away is an Episcopalian "church" (if it can be called that) with a huge electric marquee out front that always switches back and forth between a bright, glowing LGBTQ flag and a visage of colored 3rd world refugees, accompanied by hashtags for "no exceptions." And one doesn't have to drive far from here to see the same thing in about a half-dozen other churches.

And to think that I live in a "red state" and in a congressional district whose citizens almost always vote Republican...

Blogger Bellomy February 25, 2019 6:06 AM  

Yeah! Love it.

Blogger nswhorse February 25, 2019 6:09 AM  

That was a very heartening read.

Blogger Brett baker February 25, 2019 6:11 AM  

Will African Crusaders help rescue Europe from the Islamic invasion?

Blogger JovianStorm February 25, 2019 6:11 AM  

This blew me away with its raw truth!

Civnat might be the destruction of the West but uniting true Christians under a banner of righteousness will save it.

Blogger Sam Spade February 25, 2019 6:13 AM  

Praise them.

I hope in Europe we get religious leaders that get inspired and follow their courage and loyalty to God.

Blogger Emmett Fitz-Hume February 25, 2019 6:39 AM  

"So if anyone is so naïve or condescending as to think we would sell our birth right in Jesus Christ for American dollars, then they simply do not know us."

Rock on. That was awesome.

Blogger wreckage February 25, 2019 6:39 AM  

Empty pews follow progressivism as night follows day.

Blogger Zaklog the Great February 25, 2019 6:58 AM  

I don't know what the IQ of these church leaders is, but they clearly possess significant wisdom, and many American pastors who are likely more intelligent could learn an enormous amount from them.

Blogger Bellomy February 25, 2019 7:03 AM  

True mic drop moment.

Blogger My 1 millionth internet profile February 25, 2019 7:10 AM  

@9 - Probably not. They have plenty of Islamic problems to deal with in Africa.

Blogger Innamorato February 25, 2019 7:16 AM  

“Christ-pilled”

Amen.

Blogger Sargent.matrim February 25, 2019 7:20 AM  

Damn this makes me so happy. Could you imagine St Paul's expression at the idea of gay and female pastors being ordained in the church? As he said to the Ephesians:

When I leave wolves will come in amongst you and some of your own number will also depart from the truth.

Glad to see the UM is not one of those churches where they have let the wolves slay the sheep. Most of Western Christianity deserves to die.

Blogger Innamorato February 25, 2019 7:20 AM  

All nations can rejoice in fellowship under the banner of our savior Jesus Christ.

Blogger Solon February 25, 2019 7:24 AM  

@9 That would be a sight to see! Something I would never have forseen in a million years, if it happened.

This truly is a wacky timeline, but I gotta say, for all the blackpilling going on these days, I'm enjoying the ride. When a tsunami comes in, some people put up sandbags. I'm the sort that grabs a surf board.

Blogger Solon February 25, 2019 7:26 AM  

Clarification: not "going along with the wave," so much as "riding out the storm."

In case anyone should misread my statement.

Blogger Zaklog the Great February 25, 2019 7:33 AM  

I have to admit that it's fascinating to see a case of the destructiveness of diversity going the other direction. This church leader is 100% right, and if his congregation is behind him, then the influence of many white "Christians" would only be destructive to his congregation.

Blogger Silent Draco February 25, 2019 7:34 AM  

"Go and make disciples of all nations" seems to have worked, in this case. Now listen to the message and get our own houses in order. Stop sending teams, funds, and attached strings until you're specifically asked for help.

Anonymous Anonymous February 25, 2019 7:43 AM  

There's a cartoon showing the reversal of roles in the Pacific Islands. The first panel shows the missionaries arriving - greeted by naked and shapely natives, and beckoning to them to show modesty. The second shows the modern western tourists arriving on the beach, clad in Bikinis, bearing alcohol. The locals dressed in their Sunday formal lava-lavas and long sleeved and long skirted beckon to the westerners to show modesty. What a shame it is to see us brought so low and revealed by the people who originally received the gospels from us. But it is white-pilling. Sometimes it feels like every single non-white and most white's want to see us genocided. Apparently not.

Blogger Stilicho February 25, 2019 7:52 AM  

The UM church in America is quite cucked. They have even made "social justice" their mission (instead of Christ).

Nate can elaborate on the struggle of the remaining Christian churches in the UM denomination to expel the SJW'S or to schism. The sjw's just want a skim suit (and any assets, of course).

Blogger Kari Hall February 25, 2019 8:08 AM  

As the wife of a United Methodist pastor the vote last night for the "One Church plan" (you do your thing and well do ours and just keep the money and name together) did not even get on the didn't even make it through the first vote outcome.
There two session one yesterday that votes on what will be discussed in then plenary session which all will be debated today. Please be in prayer for the church we have been fighting this fight for 20 yrs. Here is a link:
https://www.umnews.org/

Blogger Miguel February 25, 2019 8:08 AM  

Fantastic.

Blogger Avalanche February 25, 2019 8:11 AM  

@19 "All nations can rejoice in fellowship under the banner of our savior Jesus Christ."

So long as its fellowship (in their own countries) and NOT "so, let us all move in with you!"

Blogger The Deuce February 25, 2019 8:23 AM  

As messed up as Africa is in a myriad of ways, it looks to me like the preservation of much of Christianity is likely to be found there. It's the same thing with the Anglicans and Catholics: The African branches are holding firm to the true Faith while those churches fall into apostasy and deteriorate across the rest of the world.

One upside of the sorry condition of Africa is that it's harder for the Africans to delude themselves that they don't need God.

Blogger Kari Hall February 25, 2019 8:33 AM  

@24
The Methodist Church under John Wesley invented the principal of social justice. It started as Sunday school where indentured children were not taught bible stories but to read and write and not to succumb to the gin that was their pay. This enabled many of them to not sign their life away with an X.

The Methodist Church has made many mistakes but by the grace of God it will repent and get back on the right the path. I have been a reader of Vox for many years and I will say this he is fair. But the shallow comments make it hard for people like my husband to take our side seriously, especially when we discuss issues like IQ. Perhaps if there was more intellect and more real life participation from the right in our institutions our fight for the good, beautiful and the truth would be easier.
See you in church this Sunday?

Blogger VD February 25, 2019 8:36 AM  

But the shallow comments make it hard for people like my husband to take our side seriously, especially when we discuss issues like IQ.

Then your husband is equally shallow, as well as incorrect. The verity of the truth does not depend upon the form of its expression by its weakest adherents.

Blogger I’ve Seen Things You People Wouldn’t Believe February 25, 2019 8:44 AM  

A good start. However, we know the cucks and apostates will be working overtime to deny the express will of the conference.

Currently, there are thousands of churches and clergy in violation of the Book of Discipline, and the UM Church does NOTHING about it. No matter what happens, they will still go on openly defying the Church and Scripture, and the US Church will look away and profess ignorance.

Until EVERY congregation is forced to choose a side and be held accountable, nothing will change.

Funny thing about "Opening doors": Sometimes the result is everyone leaves.

Blogger Gettimothy February 25, 2019 8:46 AM  

"So if anyone is so naïve or condescending as to think we would sell our birth right in Jesus Christ for American dollars, then they simply do not know us."

This permeates the Body Of Christ. It is good to hear the head of a formal institution be in service to Him.

This attitude is what God does and gives at the individual level, for Christ died, rose and lives for individuals. The corporate is a fruit of the individual hearts.

What Mark Taylor calls Church 501c(3) attempts to invert the Holy Spirit's ways. The he'll with it. It is barren

Blogger Kari Hall February 25, 2019 8:56 AM  

@31VD
He feels that intellect can overcome race, if you are smart and moral we can get along. I disagree with him, but I will not disrespect him.

Blogger Iron Spartan February 25, 2019 9:06 AM  

How far has the west fallen when lands where our missionaries still walk have to preach the gospel back to us.

Perhaps its time for missionaries to go in the opposite direction.

Blogger VD February 25, 2019 9:13 AM  

He feels that intellect can overcome race, if you are smart and moral we can get along.

And yet, I am considerably smarter than he is and I am telling him that it cannot. His position is particularly ironic in that race is one of the primary determinants of intellect.

I appreciate that you do not wish to disrespect him, nor should you. But there is no way that he should be the pastor of any Christian church given his obvious lack of devotion to the truth.

Blogger FUBARwest February 25, 2019 9:16 AM  

Amen

Blogger ZhukovG February 25, 2019 9:16 AM  

I am surprised half the American's attending that event didn't spontaneously burst into flames. May God bless the African Methodists.

"You have nothing to do but to save souls. Therefore spend and be spent in this work. And go always, not only to those that want you, but to those that want you most.

Observe: It is not your business to preach so many times, and to take care of this or that society; but to save as many souls as you can; to bring as many sinners as you possibly can to repentance, and with all your power to build them up in that holiness without which they cannot see the Lord."

John Wesley

Blogger DonReynolds February 25, 2019 9:17 AM  

Only the Devil would try to seduce and tempt you with money. It is a cheap price to pay for your soul and the Devil is a generous master. What Jesus offers instead is the real gold in this life.

Blogger VFM Bear February 25, 2019 9:31 AM  

"We get by on far less than most Americans do; we know how to do it. I’m not so sure you do."

Yeah I'm pretty sure it's this times a thousand. Panem et circenses, same as it always was.

Blogger Johnny February 25, 2019 9:34 AM  

@31VD
He feels that intellect can overcome race...

Right now the devil is in the details of this concept. What does it mean to "overcome race." As that concept is now applied it often means using government to race norm society, contriving to force all groups defined by race to have equal outcomes in all areas. And this is unforced corruptly. They only enforce equal outcomes when it is politically expedient.

So, how about detail. What do you mean by overcome race? What does the pastor mean by overcome race? Should we race norm athletics? Manipulate outcomes so as to get a demographic equaling of the number of black and white swimmers and basketball players. Should we demographically norm higher mathematics graduates?

Like gulf, make the amateur equal to the pro teacher with a stroke handicap. Hey fair. Is that overcoming race if there is a race difference. If it is, I am going to need one big stroke handicap against that Tiger Woods guy. And all in the name of Jesus. Right? That is what he would want?

Blogger liberranter February 25, 2019 10:00 AM  

What a beautiful declaration!

The best thing that any Third World Christian church body can do is to stay as far away from and have as little to do with its American counterparts as possible. Rot is highly contagious and the American "church," like all of the country's institutions, is chock full of it.

Blogger Sam February 25, 2019 10:15 AM  

@34
I think he is saying that smart people of other races can adopt other races social mores. This is true. The problem is that this is usually an adoption of convenience, not a transformation. While there are some behaviors that can permanently change (for example, introducing utensils) most fall by the wayside when they return to their original group.

There are exceptions, but it is hard to tell in advance and even they are subject to their children regressing to the mean.

Blogger Kari Hall February 25, 2019 10:26 AM  

@38 Amen. The UMC has been corrupted by the world.
@41 No, he just thinks only smart people should be in charge and intelligent people can be found in all races, thus all those smart people from around the world should live together. Yes he is fallible.

@VD and all,
Forgive me if I have made this about what one elder in the church thinks, that was not my intention. My intention was to have hope and prayer that a maninline denomination may be showing a back bone and trending in the right direction back towards God. This is also not the place to discuss my husband's intellect or his call. His IQ is well documented, it is why I married him, but that also does not make him perfect in all ways, as none of us are. Your blog has made a difference in our home and I look forward to using your words of wisdom to learn and grow further.

More than likely the UMC will engage in an act they are very gifted at,using legislation to "kicking the can down the road." We will committize ourselves to death.

Blogger VFM #7634 February 25, 2019 10:26 AM  

Africa doesn't NEED Western missionaries any more. Here's a great example as to why.

Blogger swiftfoxmark2 February 25, 2019 10:31 AM  

Honestly, we should just leave Africa alone at this point. They have made contact with more advanced civilizations, many tribes are dedicated to the Truth, and they clearly can handle many moral issues better than we can.

Cut off their funding entirely and let them develop on their own. Maybe in a few centuries, their IQs will be much higher collectively then it is now.

Blogger Johnny February 25, 2019 10:47 AM  

@41 No, he just thinks only smart people should be in charge and intelligent people can be found in all races, thus all those smart people from around the world should live together. Yes he is fallible.

Well, not my take, but could be. The circumstance of people who live in Africa is so different that there is a bit of nonsense to supposing that their social norms should be the same as ours. I see us attempting to push our particular race and sex norms on them as an insensible conceit.

Blogger Beau February 25, 2019 10:49 AM  

My intention was to have hope and prayer that a maninline denomination may be showing a back bone and trending in the right direction back towards God.

Yes. May God use this coming Methodist vote as tinder to ignite a worldwide revival.

Blogger Arthur Isaac February 25, 2019 10:51 AM  

That message should have been wrapping a door plaque with the inscription: "Ichabod".

Blogger redtailseven February 25, 2019 10:59 AM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger redtailseven February 25, 2019 11:01 AM  

"Based"?

Blogger Other Josh February 25, 2019 11:04 AM  

Yes!!! Praise GOD for this courageous follower of Jesus. Man, this gets me fired up. Gracious but firm, and grounded in the truth. Awesome, awesome stuff.

Blogger redtailseven February 25, 2019 11:04 AM  

Judge not lest ye also be judged like wise. Stop reading signs, go inside and meet them.

Blogger Beau February 25, 2019 11:10 AM  

A post so good it's worth posting twice (hat tip to ZhuKovG)

"You have nothing to do but to save souls. Therefore spend and be spent in this work. And go always, not only to those that want you, but to those that want you most.

Observe: It is not your business to preach so many times, and to take care of this or that society; but to save as many souls as you can; to bring as many sinners as you possibly can to repentance, and with all your power to build them up in that holiness without which they cannot see the Lord."

John Wesley


He who wins souls is wise.

Blogger Dangeresque February 25, 2019 11:20 AM  

"He feels that intellect can overcome race..."

Not to go all "dems are the real racists" here, but the racism is inherent in this very statement. Race is a thing to be "overcome" for you because you view other's race as a weakness.

Will you people just stop freaking trying to play god already and just appreciate that he made us all different for a reason?...

Blogger Servant February 25, 2019 11:42 AM  

@DonReynolds

While it is true that the devil will give you whatever it takes to acquire your soul, that is not generosity. What is 70 years of being wealthy and surrounded by women or famous followed by an eternity of damnation compared to an eternal life in the presence of our Lord? Don't compare prices they are all effectively the same price.

Blogger Sean Carnegie February 25, 2019 12:29 PM  

He who wins souls is wise.

Yes, God has been accused of that before.

Blogger Northpal February 25, 2019 12:30 PM  

Hmmm.........so much for those High IQ White people.

Blogger stevo February 25, 2019 1:49 PM  

Our priest in our humble rural Quebec parish is from Congo. He sees himself as a missionary. He is right. I am ashamed of our spiritual poverty here in the west.

Blogger Damn the torpedos February 25, 2019 1:53 PM  

This made my morning Vox

We by necessity focus so much on the evil found in non western nations/races.

It’s nice to remember every once in a while that God is calling sons and daughters from every tribe and tongue.

I’d much rather be part of this mans flock than any of the “churches” in the west that preach sodomy and abortion.

Praise Jesus. I look forward to heaven where we will spend eternity with all of God’s people and national differences will no longer matter. Until then I wish this pastor the best in serving the African nations and I will do my best to serve my own people.

Blogger SirHamster February 25, 2019 3:55 PM  

liberranter wrote:The best thing that any Third World Christian church body can do is to stay as far away from and have as little to do with its American counterparts as possible. Rot is highly contagious and the American "church," like all of the country's institutions, is chock full of it.

Beware the yeast of the Americans.

Blogger liberranter February 25, 2019 4:32 PM  

@45

A hearty AMEN to that. If anything, African and Asian missionaries need to go West on a spiritual "Reconquista" campaign.

Blogger Ariadne Umbrella February 25, 2019 4:37 PM  

The kid with the African windmill was the son of a Christian family. God can do all sorts of mischief: the genes for intelligence worked their way into majority in England, and are now being bred out. This kid spontaneously is able to build a windmill from a textbook from an American author, but without formal schooling. God obviously has obstetrician/pediatrics skills: witness the virgin birth.

Blogger Mark Stoval February 25, 2019 4:48 PM  

Northpal wrote:Hmmm.........so much for those High IQ White people.

I have known many people with impressive IQs. Most were white, but not all. And after all I am white so I have known far more white people.

The thing I have noticed is that IQ is not the whole story. Not by far. Wisdom and experience coupled with a relationship with God trumps a high IQ.

I sometimes think that the Devil works extra hard to corrupt the high IQ individuals. I don't know why exactly, it just looks that way to me.

Blogger Dox Day Teddy Spagetthhi February 25, 2019 5:31 PM  

What real and true heavenly happiness not of the world.

"We are seriously joyful in following Jesus Christ and God’s holy word to us in the Bible."

Blogger Daniele Grech Pereira February 25, 2019 5:39 PM  

Based Africa strikes again.

Blogger Chiva February 25, 2019 7:03 PM  

1 Peter 4:17

Blogger Calvin809 February 25, 2019 8:17 PM  

Their commitment is to deny Christianity and embrace their interpretation of paganism/gnosticism. The rest follows. Paul in Romans says that these things (sodomy) are judgement for abandoning the true worship of God.

Blogger A rebel without a General February 25, 2019 8:51 PM  

Unironically based black guy

Blogger DonReynolds February 25, 2019 10:57 PM  

Servant wrote:@DonReynolds

While it is true that the devil will give you whatever it takes to acquire your soul, that is not generosity. What is 70 years of being wealthy and surrounded by women or famous followed by an eternity of damnation compared to an eternal life in the presence of our Lord? Don't compare prices they are all effectively the same price.


Whatever you imagine to be generous the Devil is eager to pay it, but only the fool will accept it.

Blogger Didas Kalos February 25, 2019 11:03 PM  

John Wesley! A tall man. "In the decades that followed the onset of Wesley’s ministry, he was often subject to mob violence and repeated illness, but that did not stop him from traveling over 4,000 miles (on horseback) every year, preaching the message of salvation, through some 40,000 sermons during his lifetime. His scriptural convictions led him to be a timely voice for abolition, which was congruent with his coming to understand the Christian faith as essentially relational. There were 70,000 Methodist Christians when he died at age 87 in 1791.

Blogger Zaklog the Great February 25, 2019 11:40 PM  

@64 I don't think it's necessarily that the Devil corrupts more high IQ people. It's just that when such a person goes bad, they can cause far more damage.

Angela Merkel undoubtedly has a higher than average IQ. A black Chicago gangbanger most likely has a low IQ. The gangbanger may murder a few people. Merkel is likely contributing to the start of a continent-wide war.

Blogger John Rockwell February 26, 2019 7:27 AM  

Will God bless Africa as he has blessed Europe. And taking it to heights unheard of?

Blogger Nameless One February 26, 2019 11:56 AM  

@64

Because the Devil appeals to us in our pride, and high intelligence, as well as any other natural gifts (appearance, strength and athleticism, inherited wealth, etc) brings with it pride.

That's why the Bible constantly emphasizes the need for humility.

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