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Sunday, February 10, 2019

Wolves in the Southern Baptist pulpits

This report on the Southern Baptist hierarchy and various church leaderships attempting to protect sexual predators doesn't surprise me. Back when I was in the States, the pastor of our Southern Baptist church told me of two separate attempts to take over churches by people who were of nefarious attempt. Not all that glitters is gold and not everyone who says they are Christian actually serves Jesus Christ. This is the price of ignoring Paul's warning about wolves in sheep's clothing as well as the ill-considered belief in forgiving the unrepentant.
In June 2008, she paid her way to Indianapolis, where she and others asked leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention and its 47,000 churches to track sexual predators and take action against congregations that harbored or concealed abusers. Vasquez, by then in her 40s, implored them to consider prevention policies like those adopted by faiths that include the Catholic Church.

Days later, Southern Baptist leaders rejected nearly every proposed reform....

Journalists in the two newsrooms spent more than six months reviewing thousands of pages of court, prison and police records and conducting hundreds of interviews. They built a database of former leaders in Southern Baptist churches who have been convicted of sex crimes.

The investigation reveals that:

• At least 35 church pastors, employees and volunteers who exhibited predatory behavior were still able to find jobs at churches during the past two decades. In some cases, church leaders apparently failed to alert law enforcement about complaints or to warn other congregations about allegations of misconduct.
• Several past presidents and prominent leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention are among those criticized by victims for concealing or mishandling abuse complaints within their own churches or seminaries.
• Some registered sex offenders returned to the pulpit. Others remain there, including a Houston preacher who sexually assaulted a teenager and now is the principal officer of a Houston nonprofit that works with student organizations, federal records show. Its name: Touching the Future Today Inc.
• Many of the victims were adolescents who were molested, sent explicit photos or texts, exposed to pornography, photographed nude, or repeatedly raped by youth pastors. Some victims as young as 3 were molested or raped inside pastors' studies and Sunday school classrooms. A few were adults — women and men who sought pastoral guidance and instead say they were seduced or sexually assaulted.
It's not just the schools and churches that are protecting the predators. It's also the medical community:
The long Journal story, which is well worth reading in its entirety, includes a facsimile of a hand-written letter that Mark wrote about Dr. Weber, blowing the whistle on him as a predator. Across all the years, I immediately recognized the handwriting. The letter included this observation about Weber’s propensity to select boys and young men as reservation clinic patients:

[T]he probability of Dr. Weber seeing so few females–based on random chance–is two out of a trillion. I have first-hand knowledge, based on my years of association with this individual, that he preferentially chooses skinny and normal weight teenage boys and young men in his practice and I observed him on many occasions picking the charts of these patients out of my own box.

You would think this sort of revelation from a colleague would be the end of Dr. Weber’s association with the Indian Health Service. But no:

After a clash with Mr. Weber, Dr. Butterbrodt was pulled into a supervisor’s office and, within weeks, transferred to a remote facility in North Dakota and stripped of bonus pay, which amounted to around one-third of his annual salary, according to personnel records and Dr. Butterbrodt. “I was chased off by a pedophile and the people who chose him over me,” said Dr. Butterbrodt, who retired soon after.
Every organization must be pressured to adopt a no-tolerance policy for sex criminals. No church should ever permit any man who admits or is even credibly accused of sexually preying on minors to have any employment at all within the church. And, as Spacebunny notes, since we have a three-strikes laws concerning drug offenses, which are comparatively minor, shouldn't we have a two-strikes-and-life-imprisonment laws for sex crimes involving minors?

Labels: ,

134 Comments:

Blogger Cinco February 10, 2019 11:11 AM  

We’re gonna need more millstones...

Blogger Vessimede Barstool February 10, 2019 11:12 AM  

"Every organization must be pressured to adopt a no-tolerance policy for sex criminals. No church should ever permit any man who admits or is even credibly accused of sexually preying on minors to have any employment at all within the church."



The easiest way to avoid having your religion, profession or community group infiltrated by pedos is to exclude male sodomites from having anything to do with them. The issue with child sex abuse in the RC Church is overwhelmingly one of gay men preying on post adolescent boys. This has become so obvious, even to normies, that there's now a SJW led campaign to highlight the tiny number of female nuns who have been sexually harassed by male priests.


I can only imagine what's going on in the Boy Scouts right now. They've rung the bell for every homo predator in the country. I wouldn't let my son go anywhere near that cesspit.

Blogger the eagle that Gandalf flew in on February 10, 2019 11:16 AM  

To anyone who discovers a pedophile operating within an organization: do not report it to administrators or organizational leaders. They will probably either cover it up, or convince themselves it is a misunderstanding, is exaggerated, did no harm, etc. Try to find police detectives who investigate and convict pedophiles. They will have no illusions about what goes on. You do not owe the organization the courtesy of informing it first.

Blogger sammibandit February 10, 2019 11:18 AM  

Actual journalism!

Blogger Chiva February 10, 2019 11:24 AM  

Wolves in sheep clothing indeed. Churches are a hunting field for these animals. People trust too easily, and too easily accept excuses for inappropriate behavior.
I have had to deal with an individual that was creeping my 14 year old daughter. I observed the behavior and immediately warned the man off. I alerted the church leadership to what happened. The result of all this was pressure from the church leadership to "forgive" and "forget". No. If he had truly repented (not the "Oh crap I got caught" repentance) and asked forgiveness I could forgive. But to forget, Never.

Blogger Damn the torpedos February 10, 2019 11:24 AM  

Come Lord Jesus come

Blogger Venturist Church February 10, 2019 11:30 AM  

The church has a more serious problem that I don't see going away any time soon. A few centuries back the capable men had few career opportunities, so by default many of them in every generation went into the church; and their abilities there made that institution competent and respected by the mob.

Now that capable men have many better things to do with their lives - by going into business, medicine, science, technology, the media and so forth - that leaves the church with having to draw talent from the lower quality men.

We can see this economically from the fact that degrees in theology, religious studies and related subjects just don't pay off as college majors. Conservatives jokes about unemployable liberals who majored in gender studies and the like; but the theology majors have the same problem.

And notice that this happened because of the separation of church and state and the liberalization of the job market, not because something that mean atheists decided to do to men who want to enter into religion as a career. The market priced down the labor of religious authorities based on whether they offer real value to society.

Blogger Matt Robison February 10, 2019 11:30 AM  

Many churches in America can't even recognize wolves dressed as wolves, let alone wolves dressed as sheep .

Blogger Damn the torpedos February 10, 2019 11:33 AM  

I hate Satan so much. It will be glorious seeing him lowered into a river of molten lava

Rev 20 “The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.”

You deserve every second of it Lucifer. I’ll be standing right next to my King and the very children whose innocence you stole praising the justice.

Blogger VD February 10, 2019 11:37 AM  

do not report it to administrators or organizational leaders.

Good point. Even if they haven't committed a crime yet, it might help establish probable cause or another angle of attack in an existing investigation.

Blogger ZhukovG February 10, 2019 11:46 AM  

This issue knows no denominational boundary. Never comfort yourself by thinking your local church or denomination is safe from this. Examine protective policies yourself, to ensure they truly protect the kids and don't merely provide cover for clever predators.

Never underestimate the predator.

Blogger cyrus83 February 10, 2019 11:47 AM  

If it can be proven beyond reasonable doubt, 1 strike and execution seems more appropriate for sex crimes against minors, it has a 0% recidivism rate.

Policies are great but they have to be enforced. There has supposedly been a no-tolerance policy in effect for years, but in practice it has been somewhat selectively enforced (more usually against laity then clergy).

Legally, depending on location and position, there may be a duty to report directly to the state authorities if abuse is suspected.

Blogger VD February 10, 2019 11:51 AM  

If it can be proven beyond reasonable doubt, 1 strike and execution seems more appropriate for sex crimes against minors, it has a 0% recidivism rate.

That's not the point. You'll never win over all the "whattabout X" people. But we know most people will go for something that sounds reasonable, like a Two-Strikes law. And that would seriously cut down on the number of pedos walking around free.

Blogger Dave February 10, 2019 11:58 AM  

A 2 strike law is a great idea although it may need another name. The whole point is 3 strikes makes an out. Strike 3; you're out! Strike 2; you're still at bat.

Something else as Vox has been saying recently is lawfare. Punish these organizations where they feel it the most. Force the members to face the fact their contributions are being used to fight lawsuits for covering up the actions of predators.

Blogger haus frau February 10, 2019 11:59 AM  

@12 "Legally, depending on location and position, there may be a duty to report directly to the state authorities if abuse is suspected."

I would never trust a organizational authority to do the reporting. Parents need to advocate for their own kids first and foremost.

Blogger Chris Mallory February 10, 2019 12:04 PM  

A denomination with 47,000 churches and 15 million members. These 380 crimes are disgusting, but they only affect .8% of SBC churches nationwide.

Blogger Emmett Fitz-Hume February 10, 2019 12:08 PM  

the eagle that Gandalf flew in on wrote:To anyone who discovers a pedophile operating within an organization: do not report it to administrators or organizational leaders. They will probably either cover it up, or convince themselves it is a misunderstanding, is exaggerated, did no harm, etc. Try to find police detectives who investigate and convict pedophiles. They will have no illusions about what goes on. You do not owe the organization the courtesy of informing it first.


It was disgusting reading the original link at Instapundit. People patting themselves on the back for reporting it to bureaucratic authorities in their organization rather than detectives. If all they did was send it up the chain to other administrators, they didn't actually do anything.

Blogger haus frau February 10, 2019 12:11 PM  

@ "These 380 crimes are disgusting, but they only affect .8% of SBC churches nationwide."
That we know of. The cover up is far more concerning. We dont know the extent of the rot but we do know the leadership is unwilling to take appropriate measures to deal with it. That's inexcusable.

Blogger ZhukovG February 10, 2019 12:12 PM  

It is good to have a firm policy of retribution against predators. But the goal should always be prevention, first and foremost.

As with animals, the human predator seeks easy prey. The more difficult and dangerous you make it for a predator, the less likely they are to even come near. Rather, they will seek organizations that are easier to infiltrate.

Churches are popular targets because they will often seek volunteers for positions that require little or no formal training. Screening of volunteers is extremely important.

Blogger Weak February 10, 2019 12:15 PM  

The work is never done. Now we need to get going on Churchgalactic.

Blogger ZhukovG February 10, 2019 12:15 PM  

@Chris Mallory: Minimizing is exactly the sort of thing that helps the predators. I'm sure that is not your intent.

Blogger Matamoros February 10, 2019 12:17 PM  

A lot of these people - leftists, pedos, etc. entered the ministry during the Vietnam era. They could get deferments by going into seminary/bible school or the ministry.

These people became leaders in their churches and produced the strong leftward social gospel push into churchianity, that while already there, was a minority until the ministry was thoroughly corrupted in the 1960's and 70's in all the churches.

Blogger VD February 10, 2019 12:18 PM  

A denomination with 47,000 churches and 15 million members. These 380 crimes are disgusting, but they only affect .8% of SBC churches nationwide.

So what? I'm a former member of an SBC church and I think the entire hierarchy should resign and face discipline over this. Totally inexcusable.

Blogger Feminism Must Die February 10, 2019 12:23 PM  

Screw "two strikes." We need a new meme:

Pedoz -> millstonez -> oceanz

Blogger Winston Smith February 10, 2019 12:25 PM  

Fact is that if you want to make real progress on this, you need to specifically target pedophilia and not try to make having sex with a 17 year old be treated the same as getting caught with a 17 month old.

Blogger Wraithburn February 10, 2019 12:26 PM  

The covering up has been going on for decades in various churches. In some cases the leadership doesn't actually have abusers in the ranks, but they vouched for an abuser. I know in Doug Wilson's case there are at least two abusers who he vouched for, they were invited into church members homes, and proceeded to abuse the family.

Once they get their reputation wrapped up in that kind of thing, it is about not admitting they made a mistake.

Blogger Matt February 10, 2019 12:29 PM  

Report?
Kill them

Blogger Jack Ward February 10, 2019 12:30 PM  

Just accentuates the decision I made decades ago to avoid organized religion and church structures. I can talk to God just fine, Thank You. And, I need no middle person/shape/weirdo/whatever to interpret the Bible for me.

Blogger Glaivester February 10, 2019 12:31 PM  

I think this will be less damaging to "Southern Baptist Churches" than the Catholic scandals were to the Catholic Church.

This is because for the most part "Southern Baptist Churches" are simply churches that organize with the Southern Baptist Conference. The SBC leadership simply has very little to do with the day-to-day running of the church, and a church could leave the SBC at any time. It's a very bottom-up structure, which helps individual churches to avoid being tarred by the actions of other churches.

Blogger Dave February 10, 2019 12:34 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Blogger Winston Smith February 10, 2019 12:36 PM  

No church should ever permit any man who admits or is even credibly accused of sexually preying on minors to have any employment at all within the church.

I would go a step further and say that no men who are credibly accused of sexual sin other than occasional consumption of pornography should be employed. One thing thing will lead to the other if you allow men who have been known to screw married women or chase tail. By now it should be obvious that if a man isn't able to generally live out the apostles' teachings on sexual morality he has no business being employed as more than a grounds keeper or something like that with no authority over anyone.

Blogger Damelon Brinn February 10, 2019 12:36 PM  

These 380 crimes are disgusting, but they only affect .8% of SBC churches nationwide.

Catholics pointed out similar irrelevant facts in the early days of the homosexual priest scandal. Enjoy the ride.

Blogger Johnny February 10, 2019 12:36 PM  

What seems inexcusable to me are the organizations that don't even take care of it within their own organization. They think somebody is up to something, but it doesn't turn up in the record or with any warning for anybody who deals with the malefactor in the future. And that is even within the organization. Always hard to know what is true by rumor, but it appears that this remains a big problem with the Catholics.

It is so easy to falsely accuse people that I am cool about making prosecution easy. But surely we can find a way to keep suspects away from activities that involve little kids.

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 12:37 PM  

No King - But KINGS!

I met the Man so very long ago - to include Pastor Pete Peters. Of LaPorte Church of Christ....

https://youtu.be/dGObUAvdH2w



Blogger lurking February 10, 2019 12:42 PM  

"A denomination with 47,000 churches and 15 million members. These 380 crimes are disgusting, but they only affect .8% of SBC churches nationwide."

Hmmmm poor attempt at deflection.. Tip of the iceberg is just 10% ie… those are just the reported crimes or the predators caught.

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 12:44 PM  

It is sad.... and says so much.... that America has changed so much and that Our formerly White Christian Youth have become Nig-Nog Gangsta Rappers.

White Christian families sacrifice their children to Molech for "Political Corrections"

The Sheep are now being lead by Wolves -

The Sheep Dogs and Watchmen have been paid off - and have sold off their children to the Slavers.

Darhma - it kills your soul - and allows the Wolves to devour Sheep.

Am I a KING - or a SLAVE?

Blogger Brett baker February 10, 2019 12:48 PM  

True. But a floating definition is popular with Leftists.

Blogger birdman February 10, 2019 12:51 PM  

There's already a new about abused in boy scouts already in recent years

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 12:53 PM  

Ya want a Bible.... well,,, all Bibles are interpretations...

And the King James SODOMITE version is the most popular - and inaccurate....

I suggest a Ferrar Fenton Intrepration - NOT a King James Sodomnite Version - which taught the abomination that the King is above God.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrar_Fenton_Bible


Blogger Wraithburn February 10, 2019 12:53 PM  

@29

I used to think that as well. But consider, how many SBC churches insist on having a pastor from an accredited Seminary? Have to have that piece of paper to become a pastor. Now look at the Seminaries, and you find a tight knit web of professors who all subscribe to the same woke views of churchianity, push that message down to their pupils, and if they get caught in something, hop to another Seminary to avoid backlash.

The SBC churches are in lockstep because the institutions have been taken over by the Left, same as the rest of society.

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 12:57 PM  

The Flavian Deception:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctKy4W8qvZU

*BEWARE*

Blogger birdman February 10, 2019 12:58 PM  

And that's fucking true though if anyone wanna know https://twitter.com/NoTrueScotist/status/1092542857267765248?s=19

Also let's just kill all of this cancer

Blogger James February 10, 2019 1:01 PM  

"shouldn't we have a two-strikes-and-life-imprisonment laws for sex crimes involving minors?"

What's wrong with the guillotine? Of the head and the smaller head.

Blogger Calvin809 February 10, 2019 1:03 PM  

The SBC has way more issues than this including the leadership trying to converge the church to being "woke" and vote Democrat because whites are raciss. They should syst down just because of this but the child molestation just adds to it. Luckily my church in MN just voted to join the SBC last year.

Blogger MeneMene February 10, 2019 1:05 PM  

At the same time there are endless streams of very young men who get caught agreeing to meet someone who claims to be 15. Then they are run through the system, and have to pour money into lawyers, courts, therapists and labs. For years. And they come out with a felony and listed. It ruins their lives. No, they are not innocent, but their crime is a possible intention and no act. Is this right?

Blogger L February 10, 2019 1:12 PM  

Is the prevalence of adults preying on teenagers / children greater now than, say, 150 years ago? It seems like it to me, but maybe it's a perception created by a larger population (hence larger number of predators) and better reporting.

Blogger Zaklog the Great February 10, 2019 1:22 PM  

The more these kinds of things are exposed, the more I grow to fear that our world is literally being run by a cabal of sexual predators whose primary goal is more money and power to exploit us and our children. This is such a dark vision that it's difficult to look for the hope of God through it.

Am I missing something or am I just approaching a terrible truth?

Blogger haus frau February 10, 2019 1:22 PM  

@46 i cant see how pedophilia incidents havent increased as perversion has been normalized. It can hard to make a 1 to 1 comparison with social standards from 150 yrs ago. A grown man corrupting a 15 yr old would certainly have been unacceptable but a 30 year could court that girl with the intention of marriage. A relationship with a 15 yr old boy would have gotten that same man lynched. If predators go where the prey is then im inclined to believe many would have chosen to keep it in their pants because of the laws and social mores of the 19th century. Our society took the cap off the perversion a long time ago.

Blogger Daniele Grech Pereira February 10, 2019 1:26 PM  

Spacebunny is wrong. 1 strike and a public hanging.

Blogger Alphaeus February 10, 2019 1:27 PM  

No Christian church is immune from infiltration by the witchcraft practicing wolves wearing their sheep clothing. The bigger the church, the more likely it's been taken over by the Satanists. Test the spirits, trust but verify, take nothing for granted, take steps to protect the vulnerable.

Blogger justaguy February 10, 2019 1:32 PM  

You have to be very careful about the definitions. the social moms of the world have opened the definitions to where two kids in HS get together and one ends up a sexual predator! The definitions have been expanded ridiculously and applied capriciously. Does anyone want an 18 year old killed for "dating" a freshman?

Blogger Ron Winkleheimer February 10, 2019 1:36 PM  

We had a guy in our church who sent text messages to a teenager and engaged in some other behavior that I am not privy to. The police were informed, though he apparently didn't do anything that he could be arrested for, and he was promptly kicked out of the congregation and told never to step foot on campus ever again. All in all I thought the situation was handled as appropriately as possible, but we actually had people who quit the church because they thought we should forgive him and keep giving him chances, anything else just wasn't Christian, or so they claimed.

Blogger Didas Kalos February 10, 2019 1:37 PM  

@ 39 TSE. You have zero idea what you are talking about.

0.8% isn't relevant to the attitude displayed by the leadership. It would be if these crimes were dealt with like Paul suggested dealing with fornication in Corinth.

Blogger Solaire Of Astora February 10, 2019 1:39 PM  

@46 I don't know if these things are literally increasing or if awareness of them is but I suspect it is both. I believe all transgressive sexual desires are connected. Christians tend to focus on homosexuality a lot and throw a lot of hate at it but honestly I think it was banned in the bible not because it is a terrible evil on its own but because it is the first crack in the dam and the truly evil desires come flooding in after it. Since the west has accepted homosexuality the rest will probably increase as inhibitions fall away. People often forget that the sins of Sodom and Gomorrah were more than mere homosexuality.

Blogger VD February 10, 2019 1:39 PM  

What's wrong with the guillotine? Of the head and the smaller head.

I'm sure we're all impressed with the posturing. You know that 19 states don't even permit the death penalty, right?

The point is, a two- or three-strikes law could almost certainly pass muster with every state electorate.

Blogger Solon February 10, 2019 1:51 PM  

To everyone pointing out that "this is only .8% of the church" or whatever...

What is wrong with you?

Any percentage greater than 0.00% is absolutely unacceptable.

The minimization of it is what allows these things to happen in the first place.

There needs to be zero tolerance of pedophilia and abuse of children. ZERO. One strike, boom, gone, stripped of your titles and authority, out. If your church does excommunication, that's on the table as well. Supporting or covering up for these things should hold the same punishment (bye, anti-pope Francis).

This is why the church has fallen on such hard times: they've been infiltrated and corrupted by evil.

Like an earlier poster said, I don't need organized religious structures to understand the Bible and have a relationship with Jesus and God.

Let. It. All. Burn. Perhaps something useful can rise phoenix-like from the ashes, but this current cucktianity makes me sick.

Blogger FrankNorman February 10, 2019 2:02 PM  

One thing I wonder, is whether there's any correlation between this sort of thing, and a theological tendency towards Calvinism/Cessationism?
When Arminian/Pentecostal/Charismatic men in ministry fall into sexual sin, it involves women.
Just saying.

Blogger DonReynolds February 10, 2019 2:05 PM  

Three strikes would be too many. Of all the criminal behaviors, the offenders most likely to repeat their crime and the least likely to be rehabilitated are child molesters. These are the grand prize of pathological, similar to firebugs (arsonists), sadists, serial killers/rapists, and jihadi terrorists.

No matter how many times they are caught and punished, they will return to their passion as soon as they are able. Our experience and a mountain of data is unavoidable...they simply cannot be rehabilitated, and the typical child molester will AVERAGE 50 victims during their career, which will be their entire lifetime.

Logic and reason would dictate that three strikes are two too many. Like a shark in the ocean or a mad dog, we do not need to wonder if they can be taught a lesson or if they will attack again. It is a way of life for them. Once we have them in our net, we need to exterminate them or confine them to an island (with their own sorts) or lock them away in the deepest and blackest hole we can find and weld the door closed. They will remain a danger to children for as long as they live and there is zero reasons to believe they could ever be rehabilitated.

Three strikes is two too many.

Blogger Didas Kalos February 10, 2019 2:09 PM  

@54/@46 Read Romans 1 and 2 Timothy 3. Infidelity to one's wife or husband is the first crack in the dam. Lustful thoughts toward anyone other than your Covenant Marriage Partner is an abomination. Sex before marriage is an abomination. Revelation 21:8 and 27. Homosexuality carries it's own curse and is devilish in nature and origins. When the church sins it becomes weak and irrelevant to spiritual influences, no longer a light in a dark world nor salt of the earth; Useless - only fit to be cast out in the dunghill and tread underfoot. The only thing for the church to do is to REPENT. If the church doesn't repent then Jesus Himself will remove their light. Rev. 2:5.

Blogger ZhukovG February 10, 2019 2:10 PM  

@VD: In reference to some of the posturing going on.

In my, blessedly short, time with a badge it seems every pedo I put cuffs on was described, by his shocked friends, as someone who always advocated summary execution for sex offenders.

Blogger Arcane Rhino February 10, 2019 2:14 PM  

"Touching the Future Today Inc"

Seriously? As Spacebunny used to say, "you can't make this stuff up."

Blogger VD February 10, 2019 2:16 PM  

Three strikes would be too many.

You're missing the point. The current law lets them offend indefinitely. Three is better than an indefinite number usually in at least two digits. And we KNOW the public will support three strikes.

Anonymous Anonymous February 10, 2019 2:17 PM  

"You have to be very careful about the definitions. ... Does anyone want an 18 year old killed for "dating" a freshman?"

Quotes notwithstanding, why not call it what it is?

I'm not the smartest guy alive but when I was a teenager a date was something like a concert or a movie and a burger, maybe a fancy restaurant if you were serious.

Sex in the back of his car is not dating. It's just denying what's actually happening, which is effectively condoning it.

While we're at the subject of definitions: nobody needs to let the organised institutions define the rules either. Not the legislature, not the police, not the churches.

There's nothing stopping you from having a one strike rule where your own innocent family members are concerned, and it might actually be a good idea to let the people around you know you have one. As in, that might be a fairly good definition of paternal duty.

The fact is that the rules follow the people at least as much as they lead them.

Blogger ZhukovG February 10, 2019 2:17 PM  

@DonReynolds: Within your post is I think an excellent idea. Exile. A penal colony where they can have a life of sorts, but society is safe from their brand of wickedness seems best to me. I suspect many of them would volunteer for it.

Blogger Doktor Jeep February 10, 2019 2:19 PM  

It's not just SJWs who marched through the institutions. But now we know why we don't permanently lock deviants in a cage, if not execute them. And why hacking a banking system will get you more jail time than raping a kid.

That stereotype of the pervert with trench coat and hands outstretched is a lie. Those are not the ones we should fear. It's the ones in the suits talking about being so good and being "upright". It's beyond mere weakness. There's an evil afoot that indulges in taking a podium and speaking of innocence while destroying it.

They are also very good at keeping the congregations from doing anything drastic about the other forms of degeneracy. No "Black-Robed Regiment" this time, eh? And not on the accord of the baby-rapers, but on the deep state already knowing of their activities using blackmail to keep them in line. "You are going to reinterpret Romans 13 or else you go down for that little boy you screwed last year".

It's as if the entire world begs for a cleansing fire.

Blogger Calvin809 February 10, 2019 2:23 PM  

Not really since most of the leaders in the SBC have an obsessive hatred for Calvinism.

Blogger Calvin809 February 10, 2019 2:23 PM  

Read Jude on Sodom and Gomorrah.

Blogger DonReynolds February 10, 2019 2:28 PM  

ZhukovG wrote:@VD: In reference to some of the posturing going on.

In my, blessedly short, time with a badge it seems every pedo I put cuffs on was described, by his shocked friends, as someone who always advocated summary execution for sex offenders.



In my short time dealing with the problem, as a public health issue, I was always frustrated by the lack of interest on the part of those with badges. To many cops, the pedo crimes are akin to domestic, in which they really do not like to get involved. You must have been one of the good cops. The good ones seldom do it for very long.

Of course the pedos insist on death for all pedos. It is part of their cover. It is not because they dislike having competition. Within a given community, the career pedos all know each other and exchange children, in much the same way as coin or stamp collectors. Very often the pedos project the image of perfect citizen otherwise.

Blogger Timmy3 February 10, 2019 2:32 PM  

Organized church religions are committing suicide as people become even less religious. This doesn’t bode well for Christianity’s Future.

Blogger Jester February 10, 2019 2:37 PM  

I suggest that people read the responses to the original post made by Vox before responding. It's likely that someone has already replied along the same lines as you plan to and got the same reply from Vox as you will get after wasting his time. Sane men generally agree that child sex predators should be permanently removed from societal company immediately upon discovery. Wise men consider where the laws are now and will seek to move things in that direction REALISTICALLY. We aren't just defending children from the Pedophiles, but from the brainwashed masses and their "elected" legislators who enable the pedophiles, and it is a long hard road.

Blogger cyrus83 February 10, 2019 2:40 PM  

Okay, execution is unrealistic. I have always suspected it happened to my sister at school, but there was no proof. Mentally she was a wreck until she died some 10 years later, so I am not disposed to leniency here.

The issue is that so many in positions of power, be they in churches, schools, Hollywood, the rich, non-profits, government, politicians and those who fund them, like to abuse kids and use their power to cover for each other.

Blogger 1st Earl Hardwicke February 10, 2019 2:56 PM  

What's wrong with Penal Colonies?

Blogger John February 10, 2019 3:00 PM  

@57 and a theological tendency towards Calvinism/Cessationism?
When Arminian/Pentecostal/Charismatic men in ministry fall into sexual sin, it involves women. 


Any guy who can go out and successfully start a congregation from scratch is an alpha male. Insofar as a particular movement/institution relies on alpha males to do the heavy lifting, you're going to get alpha male sexual sins.

Established church bureaucracies with established seminaries and established parishes include a much higher proportion of betas, deltas, and gammas. Almost every pastor I've ever known was a delta (or a graduating gamma). Some betas. And obviously it is infinitely easier for a homo (repentant or otherwise) to graduate from seminary than to plant a church. These days it's worse because what alpha male wants to join a feminized bureaucracy run by deviants and/or wife-worshipping cucks?

Considering the tedious predictability of alpha male pastor sex scandals, I tend to think betas and deltas make the best pastors, which is definitely a plus for the "church bureaucracy" approach. You just have to guard that bureaucracy with holy fire like your children's children's souls depend on it.

Blogger Jack Morrow February 10, 2019 3:12 PM  

As usual, the mainstream media are a little late to discover the story, and act as if they discovered it. In fact, Christa Brown has been warning about this for years with the site Stop Baptist Predators and blog Stop Baptist Predators, where she mentions names not only of the predators but those who've refused to do anything about it. She accuses Paige Patterson of using the word "evildoers" to describe not the predators, but those trying to expose them--which is why I had no sympathy for him when he was forced out by the "Me, Too" crowd.

Tiffany Croft is another one who long ago addressed the issue of Darrell Croft with her blog let's stop pastor darrell gilyard together.

Also it's not an SBC church, Hillsong Church, which began in Australia and has been exported to the U.S., is led by Brian Houston, who refused to report to police--although legally required to do so--his father Frank, Hillsong's founder, when he was revealed to be a child molester. See Hillsong Church Watch.

Blogger Servant February 10, 2019 3:20 PM  

I'm leery because the church tends to treat accusation by shifty divorcee far more seriously than one from kids.

The general rubric is if grown man offers to spend time with your kids, he's not to be trusted. As far as youth pastors and your sexually mature kids go it appears you can't let your daughter around any other authority figure than yourself. Also no greater abomination than youth groups.

Blogger artensoll February 10, 2019 3:42 PM  

@28 "I can talk to God just fine, Thank You"

I stand with Jack Ward.

As a relatively new Christian I've had nothing but trouble trying to find a church community to join and in which to raise my midget. The last one said we were not welcome as I would not leave my child alone in the Sunday school without getting to know the people running it.

Blogger OGRE February 10, 2019 4:01 PM  

@68 DonReynolds

To many cops, the pedo crimes are akin to domestic, in which they really do not like to get involved.

As someone who has had to defend those accused of sexual assaults against minors, I can say that my experience has been the complete opposite: even a hint of sexual misconduct involving children brings on the full force of the justice system.

I'd also point out that sexual misconduct charges have a wide gradation depending on conduct and circumstance, and the penalties vary widely as well. In my state, sexual assault of a minor under 12 carries a mandatory indeterminate sentence of 25-100 years, with no possibility of parole for 25 years. (i.e. serves at least 25 years, then until either paroled or the 100 years is up.) If there are multiple charges (and there almost always are), the sentencing judge can apply them consecutively or concurrently; one can easily end up facing a mandatory minimum sentence of 100 years or more on their first conviction, even with no prior criminal history or misconduct. And then if one does happen to get paroled, not only are they under supervised release for a very long time, they are on the sexual predator list for life, with very serious reporting requirements and limitations on conduct. And any subsequent offenses carry an even stiffer penalty of a mandatory 50-150 years. (Plus several other charges for violating supervised release and sex offender registry requirements.)

Even the lowest possible charge for sexual conduct involving a minor under 12 carries a penalty of 5-25 years. This would be the charge for something like caressing the buttocks over the clothes. Subsequent offenses jumps up to 10-35 years.

So I don't know how it is in other states, but at least here theres really no need for any 2 or 3 strike type laws, because we pretty much already have them. Aside from murder 1 and 2 theres nothing that carries a stronger penalty than sexual assault of a minor under 12. (And again that might be different elsewhere, I'm just speaking to what I know.)

Blogger Michael February 10, 2019 4:07 PM  

For those speaking of avoiding organized churches, we all understand, but please be mindful of these verses:

"Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is..." Heb 10:25
"...in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth." 1 Tim 3:15

Blogger dienw February 10, 2019 4:08 PM  

@31 Winston Smith
I would go a step further and say that no men who are credibly accused of sexual sin other than occasional consumption of pornography should be employed. One thing thing will lead to the other if you allow men who have been known to screw married women or chase tail. By now it should be obvious that if a man isn't able to generally live out the apostles' teachings on sexual morality he has no business being employed as more than a grounds keeper or something like that with no authority over anyone.

The men's movements be they PUA, MGTOW, or whatever have been around for over two decades; the sexual predation of females is now more widely reported; and what do you do? you ignore more than twenty years of alt-media observations and go staight for men's throats as though sexual predation is done only by males.

You have denied female agency and hypergamy on one of the very blogs these matters are frequently discussed.

Blogger Northpal February 10, 2019 4:11 PM  

I could be wrong here but, shouldn't a two strike law be applied against the flock? You know, the darkened souls and mush heads who blindly follow, allow, support, enrich and submit to Mammon.
In the Bible, church is always a reference to people, not a place.

Blogger Frank Luke February 10, 2019 4:23 PM  

It goes all the way to the top. JD Greear, the current president of the Southern Baptist Convention, is a wolf in the pulpit. He has openly stated that the Bible whispers about sexual sin and that Christians should be the fiercest advocates of LGBT rights. Both of those statements are biblically false.

Blogger artensoll February 10, 2019 4:26 PM  

@78 I know, but should I just offer up my child to strangers? I pray about it every day.

Blogger Michael February 10, 2019 4:33 PM  

@82 Understand.

Certainly don't put your kids anywhere there is the slightest doubt of their safety. Here are a few of things to look for:

1) Anyone who works with minors is required to pass a recurring background check.
2) There is a hard and fast rule that no adult is to ever meet alone with a minor or a member of the opposite sex.
3) Every class/activity is required to have a minimum of 2 adults present at all times.
4) The church preaches hard against all the things SJWs love (divorce, fornication, homo, trans, pedo, women in leadership, heaven on earth, etc.).

There is prolly more, but run from anything that doesn't at least have these.

Blogger pants of fit February 10, 2019 4:33 PM  

@3 And make sure that the police you report it do don't have conflicts of interest with fraternal organizations. Word has it Thomas Douglas Bruce McArthur of Toronto would have been in jail a lot earlier and some of his victims still alive if he hadn't used his connections to get an assault investigation closed.

Blogger dienw February 10, 2019 4:35 PM  

@ 78 Michael
"Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is..." Heb 10:25
One departs from apostate churches lest one is led astray and falls away from the faith. When there is a plague of apostate churches/denominations, one has to walk alone or rely on small, non-church meetings: Jesus' statement that where two or three are gathered together, He will be in the midst of them is a statement that anticipates not only the scarcity of churches but also their widespread apostasy.

Blogger Michael February 10, 2019 4:35 PM  

5) The "youth pastor/youth director" never does anything involving the youth without his wife present.

Blogger DonReynolds February 10, 2019 4:37 PM  

@77 OGRE
"So I don't know how it is in other states, but at least here theres really no need for any 2 or 3 strike type laws, because we pretty much already have them. Aside from murder 1 and 2 theres nothing that carries a stronger penalty than sexual assault of a minor under 12. (And again that might be different elsewhere, I'm just speaking to what I know.)"

Every one of the fifty states has their own set of laws and I certainly am not familiar with them all. Tennessee has the "three strikes" law and it is certainly not limited to drug offenses. ANY three offenses will do just fine, they do not even have to be the same offense committed three times. ANY three felonies will count to trigger another 20 years of time in prison.

I do not doubt there are states where three strikes only apply to drug laws, but in the state of Tennessee, that is not the case. Thank you, for what you have already done.

Blogger Michael February 10, 2019 4:38 PM  

@85 Yes. True.

But it doesn't relieve us from the command to "assemble". Just means we have to keep striving & praying. Or contact some distant non-apostate church and request they plant a church in your area.

Our Lord never said it would be easy.

Blogger liberranter February 10, 2019 4:38 PM  

...not everyone who says they are Christian actually serves Jesus Christ.

If that isn't painfully obvious by now to anyone who has spent more than a few minutes in any American church during the past 50 years, they are either willfully blind, deaf, and dumb or else profoundly mentally retarded.

This is the price of ignoring Paul's warning about wolves in sheep's clothing as well as the ill-considered belief in forgiving the unrepentant.

First of all, sexual perversion and licentiousness has captured ALL of our society, including the "church" (completely co-opted and converged decades ago in all other aspects too). Why would the church crack down on sexual misconduct when that's part and parcel of the fake humanist theology that has replaced Scripture?

Second, and directly related to the previous point, the Cult of Nice has replaced church discipline. This stands to reason when your organization has become a money-changing den of idolatrous apostate whores that functions as a business (that must keep its paying customers happy) rather than a House of God.

Blogger liberranter February 10, 2019 4:50 PM  

@8:

Indeed. It's as if Jesus's instruction in Matthew 10:16 doesn't exist. It's absolutely infuriating to see how moronically clueless and naive most self-described "Christians" are today. It lends credence to the mocking claims of non-believers that most Christians are ignorant simpletons, retarded children in adult bodies who can't cope with real-world existence.

Blogger Ariadne Umbrella February 10, 2019 5:03 PM  

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Blogger Winston Smith February 10, 2019 5:04 PM  

#79

You have denied female agency and hypergamy on one of the very blogs these matters are frequently discussed.

I haven't done a damn thing like that. You're acting like every other bitter little gamma f#$% who can't hear criticism of men without getting trigger and launching into a spittle-flecked tirade about women. This thread is about men because in any semi-conservative denomination men are the only ones allowed into power. By definition, women are largely irrelevant, particularly in the capacity you were ranting about.

Let's get it real simple. The Bible says you need to be known to the church as a man of good character to be eligible for authority. Well guess what? If you have people making credible charges that you're living a debauched life, the church authorities can't scandalize the congregation by giving you a position until you're cleared.

It may be a shock to you, but no one here is using the "believe all women" standard as the basis of "credible" here.

Blogger John February 10, 2019 5:06 PM  

@76 As a relatively new Christian I've had nothing but trouble trying to find a church community to join and in which to raise my midget. The last one said we were not welcome as I would not leave my child alone in the Sunday school without getting to know the people running it.

But do you read Greek and the Church Fathers?

Search lutheranliturgy(.)org. It was created by a pastor's family who got tired of visiting into non-conservative LCMS churches when they went on vacation. The LCMS is already the "mean conservative Lutheran denomination" because we ban lady pastors, gay pastors, officially deny evolution, and our pastors & seminaries still hold exactly the same reformation doctrines the Lutherans agreed upon ~450 years ago, which are of course consistent with doctrines the Western Church has held since Augustine and before. You would do well in most LCMS congregations (notwithstanding the Boomers), but lutheranliturgy has the elite few.

Blogger Ariadne Umbrella February 10, 2019 5:12 PM  

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Blogger Ariadne Umbrella February 10, 2019 5:19 PM  

Part of the horror is that southern Baptist young women are taught that they will never be happy in life, or in the after-life- if they have any sexual activity at all outside of marriage. These men took these girls' souls, when they did this.

The young woman who tried to commit suicide was notable only because it took her ten years to get it right.

The underside of sexually oriented businesses is that there are young women, in despair, who choose to live, and have labelled themselves monstrous sinners, because of these men's depradations. Houston and Dallas have some of the largest strip clubs on the planet. They are stocked with high-end girls from good families who are trying to stay alive: they tell themselves they are responsible for this, and that they are wicked. And they act it out. The high end clubs keep house mothers around to keep these women from killing themselves.

Men come from around the world to pay for time with these women. Including Baptist preacher conventions after hours partying.

Blogger liberranter February 10, 2019 5:25 PM  

@76:

Churches, unfortunately, tend to be very unwelcoming places (which is fodder for a whole 'nother series of threads). While one could argue that this is not necessarily a bad thing within the context of what is being discussed here, its long-term effect is to weaken the Body of Christ on earth, thus leading (at least indirectly) to this very same problem.

@78

This is another one of those verses that people love to quote out of context.

What Paul was referring to here was newly converted Jews in the First Century who were abandoning the church and returning to the synagogue in order to avoid persecution. He did NOT intend it as a command for individual Christians to assemble with large bodies of heretics who are perverting the Faith. Surely Paul, as the voice of God through his epistles, would know better than to issue such a counterproductive instruction, knowing that it undermines the very church he and other believers were risking all to strengthen.

Blogger OGRE February 10, 2019 5:33 PM  

@87 DonReynolds

I didn't mean to direct my comment all at you. I just wanted to respond to the part about police not taking those accusations seriously. But then I started writing and went off about the sentencing which wasn't really about your comment. My bad.

Blogger Ford Prefect February 10, 2019 5:40 PM  

@80: anyone who had knowledge of misconduct and failed to report it, either to church leadership or legal authorities, definitely deserves some form of retribution.

It would not be reasonable, or right, to bring retribution on anyone who was both uninvolved and uninformed of the situation.

Blogger Michael February 10, 2019 5:41 PM  

@96 "He did NOT intend it as a command for individual Christians to assemble with large bodies of heretics who are perverting the Faith."

No claim has been made here that he did.

Blogger sammibandit February 10, 2019 5:59 PM  

Jenna Jameson comes to mind.

Blogger Haxo Angmark February 10, 2019 6:07 PM  

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Blogger Kat February 10, 2019 6:09 PM  

Michael wrote:@82 Understand.

Certainly don't put your kids anywhere there is the slightest doubt of their safety. Here are a few of things to look for:

1) Anyone who works with minors is required to pass a recurring background check.

2) There is a hard and fast rule that no adult is to ever meet alone with a minor or a member of the opposite sex.

3) Every class/activity is required to have a minimum of 2 adults present at all times.

4) The church preaches hard against all the things SJWs love (divorce, fornication, homo, trans, pedo, women in leadership, heaven on earth, etc.).

There is prolly more, but run from anything that doesn't at least have these.


You can ask a church for their abuse prevention policy (my church has one on file).

My church mandates that you must have at least two NON RELATED adults present. Makes sense that relatives might cover for each other or even conspire together. They also have limits on child interactions like tickling which is innocuous enough but, so they told us, often used as a grooming technique precisely because it appears innocuous. They also welcome parents getting to know anyone working with kids - it's easy to observe any classrooms and see what is happening.

Even a family integrated type church (which you might consider) should have something written down as to how they handle misconduct and what rules are laid down for all adult leaders.

Blogger Ominous Cowherd February 10, 2019 6:12 PM  

VD wrote:What's wrong with the guillotine? Of the head and the smaller head.

I'm sure we're all impressed with the posturing. You know that 19 states don't even permit the death penalty, right?

The point is, a two- or three-strikes law could almost certainly pass muster with every state electorate.


Half measures stink. They are better than no measures at all, and can be a gateway to whole measures later.

Timmy3 wrote:Organized church religions are committing suicide as people become even less religious. This doesn’t bode well for Christianity’s Future.

Organized churchianity has no connection to Christ and His church.

Michael wrote:For those speaking of avoiding organized churches, we all understand, but please be mindful of these verses:

"Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is..." Heb 10:25

"...in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth." 1 Tim 3:15


I just came from a sermon in which the pastor preached that men are made by God to lead, and women are made by God to shut up and follow their men. That was just a sidebar, to illustrate the temptation to water down the word of God.

There are congregations and pastors that take God seriously. Keep looking. Move if you must.

Blogger Servant February 10, 2019 6:16 PM  

Where two or more are gathered in my name there i am also. Ffs people.

The modern conception of a church is so twisted from what it meant in Paul's time.

Yes assemble in the name of Christ! Do not assemble in the name of church! Our host calls it churchianity for a reason.

For my own sake I've been praying and praying for a church. I was given one. My elder in the faith who also refuses to attend the first church of churchianity invites me over for dinner and bible study all the time. Our number is small, but it's pure. It's my church. Nothing todo with copious degrees, certifications, tax documents and other assorted frippery.

Call a non apostate church to plant one in your area. Jeez. Reminds me of ten shekels and a shirt. Listen to that sermon.

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 6:43 PM  

@53 -

All "Bibles" in English are interpretations - from manuscripts written in ancient times -

For the New Testament - it is Koine Greek -

Koine Greek (UK: /ˈkɔɪniː/, US: /kɔɪˈneɪ, ˈkɔɪneɪ, kiːˈniː/), also known as Alexandrian dialect, common Attic, Hellenistic or Biblical Greek, was the common supra-regional form of Greek spoken and written during the Hellenistic period, the Roman Empire, and the early Byzantine Empire, or late antiquity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koine_Greek

For the Old Testament - it is Hebrew.

Of course - those who composed the books of the Bible included or excluded, and edited texts based upon beliefs and motivations.

Translations are always subject to the Author's bias.... hence we have the abomination of an alleged Judeo-Christian faith?! There is NO such thing as any sort of Judeo-Christain faith!

Scofield put the Wolves in charge of the Sheep - and misdirected the Christian People as who to worship and honor.


Bookmark the permalink.
Scofield’s Abominable Study Bible
Jun
30
by jmichaelrios

I love the Bible, but I’ve hated reading it this past year, and the reason for my hatred has been C.I. Scofield.

By my count, I’ve now read through the entire Bible five or six times. I’ve read through the New International Version two or three times—once in High School when my faith came alive, once (I believe, but I’m not certain) in College, and once again in Seminary. When I was ordained I read it again, but this time for variety I read the New Living Translation. Afterwards, I read through the New American Standard, which is the version I personally use for preaching today. Last year, wanting to read still another translation, and always planning to spend time in the most famous of translations, I set myself to read the King James. The experience has been most miserable.

Scofield_Handsome VolumeThe edition I’ve read was a gift from my grandparents back in 1998 (likely a graduation present) and is quite handsome to look at—a hefty, burgundy leather volume with gold edges. It feels nice to open, and sits nicely in the lap, and looks impressive on my shelf, although its bulk rendered it inconvenient for travel so that I quickly found myself reading it only at home during my morning devotions. Devotions are meant to be a time of stillness before the Lord, a daily period of attentiveness to the word where we seek to hear His voice and attune ourselves to His presence throughout the day. They are not, as a rule, a good time for experimental reading, and yet into my efforts to engage the King James text an unsolicited voice kept inserting itself, noisily, bombastically, irritatingly. It was the voice of C.I. Scofield.

ScofieldCyrus Ingerson Scofield was a civil war veteran who came to Christian faith as an adult, later pastoring churches in Dallas and Massachusetts. Affiliated with D.L. Moody, Scofield later began work on his reference Bible, through which he popularized a new system of theological interpretation called “Dispensationalism,” developed by an Anglo-Irish man named John Nelson Darby. When Scofield’s Bible was published in 1909, at a time of great expectation about the end of the world, his interpretive matrix took fundamentalism by storm, quickly becoming one of the best selling Bibles in history. This is the Bible that created “The Thief in the Night,” Hal Lindsay, Christian Zionism, and Left Behind. In other words, it is the Bible which has dominated a very visible portion of the Christian imagination for the last 100 years.

https://jmichaelrios.wordpress.com/2016/06/30/scofields-abominable-study-bible/

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 6:46 PM  

Christian Israel - as the original manuscripts were translated by Ferrar Fenton.

https://thetencommandmentsministry.us/ministry/ferrar_fenton/

More:

https://thetencommandmentsministry.us/

Blogger Silly but True February 10, 2019 6:50 PM  

Two strikes = surgical removal. Call it the 2-pt. conversion.

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 6:56 PM  

As for critics - I strongly suggest that you obtain a Strong's Concordance and do your own Bible studies - it will OPEN your eyes.

The Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible, generally known as Strong's Concordance, is a Bible concordance, an index of every word in the King James Version, constructed under the direction of James Strong.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong%27s_Concordance

These truths cut deeper than you think:

Even Jesus called the Canaanite Woman a DOG!

That is a racist insult of the highest order.

Blogger Silly but True February 10, 2019 7:00 PM  

It’ll be a hell of a llt more than 380 by the time the full truth comes out. If the organization was initially successful in handling it “administratively” bet your ass it became standard operating procedure for later instances.

Blogger liberranter February 10, 2019 7:39 PM  

The modern conception of a church is so twisted from what it meant in Paul's time.

It all started to go downhill once a pagan Roman emperor realized how useful it would be politically to "play Christian," make a fake conversion, kill and gut the REAL church, and slap its skin on top of a pagan Roman institution and call it "the Church" (ensuring, with all the lethal force at his disposal, that his subjects accepted it as such).

Blogger TSE February 10, 2019 7:57 PM  

@110

This!

It all started to go downhill once a pagan Roman emperor realized how useful it would be politically to "play Christian," make a fake conversion, kill and gut the REAL church, and slap its skin on top of a pagan Roman institution and call it "the Church"

Yep -

No King! - But KINGS!

https://youtu.be/dGObUAvdH2w

Blogger SirHamster February 10, 2019 9:34 PM  

Dave wrote:A 2 strike law is a great idea although it may need another name.

2nd Chance.

To not go to jail forever, possibly in a pedo-hating prison population. It is odd to me that men in jail may practice better justice than those of us outside.


Solon wrote:To everyone pointing out that "this is only .8% of the church" or whatever...

What is wrong with you?


They've forgotten to beware the yeast of the Pharisees.

It's only 0.8% shit sandwich. No biggy, yeah?

These are the sorts the millstone treatment is meant to be demonstrated for.

Imagine the pozzed Bible translation that reflects the attitude: "Elders are to be husbands of one wife, and only diddle children 0.8% of the time."

Blogger Didas Kalos February 10, 2019 10:25 PM  

@51 If an 18 year old does something like that to my 14 year old you won't have to 'have him defined as a sexual predator' because he will have become prey. I the hunter. You need to up your moral standards in a hurry! Try to think like God thinks about an 18 year old taking the virginity away from a 14 year old. If it weren't for the mercy of the cross he would die immediately.

@75 and @76 Agree with you both. I couldn't find 'youth groups' in the New Testament.

@78 Yes. Church is important. Also Heb. 12:22-24 Very important.

@81 is there a link to the statements you attribute to JD Greear?

@104 Ten Shekels and a Shirt. Everyone here needs to listen to that sermon. it's on youtube.

@105 I'm sorry, did i mention CI Scofield in my post?

@110 Sounds like you're referring to the RCC.

@112 YOur last sentence puts the right perspective on the 0.8% remark.

Blogger Legacy16 February 10, 2019 11:29 PM  

"no-tolerance policy for sex criminals" - Oh, you mean like actually enforce biblical law on this point? Agreed - bringing back capital punishment for sex crimes would fix things in a hurry.

Blogger cyrus83 February 10, 2019 11:29 PM  

@110

Establishment of Christianity as the legal religion of the empire did not come until AD 380 under Theodosius I, who was not a pagan. The first permanent split in the ancient church that has continued to this day occurred in 424 (the various branches of the Chaldeans/Church of the East), with a wider breach occurring in 451 (the non-Chalcedonian Orthodox churches, which are distinct from and not in communion with the Eastern Orthodox).

Most Protestant denominations are considered to hold to the teachings of Chalcedonian Christianity (Trinitarian with the teaching of the hypostatic union concerning Christ - two natures, one person), which is a more recent development of doctrine than what is held by the two Christian traditions above.

Blogger John Best February 11, 2019 2:16 AM  

It is interesting how the forces of evil who want pedophiles in the Church use them to demoralize and attack the Church, which then supports gay's, trans and women in the Church, who will then allow the pedophiles to operate freely within the Church. I think if they do something immoral, give them an opportunity to repent, but if they do it again hang them or lock them up. God is all about second changes for those to seek forgiveness, but if they betray that have no quarter with them.

Blogger Winston Smith February 11, 2019 5:46 AM  

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Blogger dc.sunsets February 11, 2019 8:54 AM  

@47 The more these kinds of things are exposed, the more I grow to fear that our world is literally being run by a cabal of sexual predators whose primary goal is more money and power to exploit us and our children. This is such a dark vision that it's difficult to look for the hope of God through it.

Am I missing something or am I just approaching a terrible truth?


I concur. Either the predation of those lacking agency (children, adolescents, the cognitively-impaired, etc) is the glue openly binding Satan's children (many of whom obtain great power on this Earth) or it's the binding principle used by a hereditary elite who farm us like cattle by using the most wicked of humans as their "faithful" servants.

"Touching the Future..." Everywhere, now do I see us being openly trolled in every direction. From The Matrix (which trolls us over our innate roles in life as the "batteries" from which our unnamed overlords derive their power) to endless TV crime dramas trolling us with stories of rooting out human trafficking, child sex abuse, our "elite protectors" (FBI, CIA, DHS, etc. where in fact the overlords' minions actually and undoubtedly DIRECT such demonic evils), I now assume every top-line, public title or name is a belly-laughter-inducing (among the demons with whom we rub shoulders) inversion of what really exists.

There appear to be few times in received history where Satan's evils have so clearly displayed. This is truly a realm of the Fallen.

There is thus no substitute for self-protection. Children must be watched at all times by those prepared to exterminate anyone who threatened them. It's probably too much to ask, that good fathers will drive the predators not just away from the good fathers' children but also away from the inescapable pool of vulnerable children, adolescents and weak-minded prey. It doesn't "take a village." The "village" is a predator's hunting grounds.

PS: I think the Stoics were on to something, esp. in light of our world's saturation with Satanic inducements to impulsivity and self-destruction. The way forward for people of goodwill and good conscience is to completely eschew all forms of modern temptation (along with avoiding the usual, ancient ones.)

We live in a world with temptation at every degree on the compass, at every point on the sphere in which we exist. Only by making a conscious choice to not indulge, not even dip a toe in that cesspool, are we likeliest to stay on a course toward living this life properly. How we teach our children to do this is perhaps the greatest question confronting Western Civilization.

Blogger dc.sunsets February 11, 2019 9:09 AM  

@113 It's all about agency. I've seen 14 year old girls who were the agency/actor when the boy was 18. If your 14 year old daughter has the liberty to be alone with an 18 year old boy and she voluntarily loses her virginity, whose failure is THAT?

This is why the entire "abortion debate" is BS. The evil of a young women choosing to destroy her next generation as a sop to her "convenience" is downstream of her choice to have sexual intercourse with a man with whom she has no desire to create and raise a family.

EVERYTHING WE DO BECOMES A PART OF US.

There are no actions without consequences. It is willful ignorance of this axiom that drives people to engage in continuous Errors In Judgement (a product of human cognition, but one for which we all have a work-around, called "will.")

Predatory behavior is the use of manipulation (or physical coercion) to obtain from the weak a benefit for the strong, AKA parasitism. The predator often rationalizes his/her predation as some kind of symbiosis or commensalism (by creating the lie that "it's good for the 'victim' too.")

Age is but one of several attributes that determine who is predator and who is prey, and I suggest that Job One is training ourselves and our kids to recognize the signs of incipient manipulation. Anyone older than 14 or 15 years old has surely been targeted and should be able to recognize those preliminaries once they are highlighted. Adults are subjected to relatively modest manipulation all the time. Knowing it for what it is is a key to armoring oneself to downstream Errors In Judgement.

Blogger phunktor February 11, 2019 9:10 AM  

Don’t like getting caught?

Blogger Nobody of Consequence February 11, 2019 9:36 AM  

I think a one strike and we put you to death for pedos. They are incapable of being changed/rehabilitated, at least according to psycho data from a few decades ago. Either eliminate them from the human race or face the consequences of allowing them to destroy lives at every turn.

Blogger Didas Kalos February 11, 2019 10:33 AM  

@ d c sunsets. The 18 year old man. I'm glad no one ever tried with my daughters. Or I would not be here commenting

Blogger Nobody of Consequence February 11, 2019 10:35 AM  

Interesting the talk about 18 yr olds and 14 yr olds. Not much more than 100 yrs ago, it was common for 18yr olds or even 21 yr olds to marry 14 yr olds. Do some real family genealogy. You will find them in your family. The idea of the 14 yr old not being ready is a modern invention. What do folks think a bar or bat mitzvah is about?

Pedos are evil people but we need to come up with better levels of definition.

Book: Crossed Fingers, Gary North

Blogger Winston Smith February 11, 2019 12:36 PM  

'm glad no one ever tried with my daughters. Or I would not be here commenting

And how would you feel when the boy's father shows up at your house with a loaded gun and decides that both of you have to pay for his boy getting murdered over fornication? 18 on 14 is "high school senior on high school freshman." People who pretend that it is a predatory act are in the same range of bullshit artistry as the "believe all survivors" movement.

Blogger Wade R. Potts February 11, 2019 2:01 PM  

People who deny the Trinity are worse than pedos.

Blogger VFM #7634 February 11, 2019 3:10 PM  

Yeah, 14 years old is about the time when girls become biological adults and start to flirt with men that they like, and attracting them. Age of consent laws are ridiculous, especially with the unspoken double standard where faggotry is tolerated but woe betide any man who gets hooked on jailbait and falls foul of the strange shitlib-tradcon alliance that equates being sexually attracted to a 17 year old girl with attraction to a 9 year old boy.

In the case of Chiva's daughter, that looks like a simple case of a Gamma creep going after a girl who wasn't attracted to him, and it doesn't matter if she was 14 or 18. But what if he was, say, an Alpha, or for that matter an 18 year old Delta, and she was interested in him?

Blogger Servant February 11, 2019 3:12 PM  

Uh as someone who highlights the errors of heresy and warns against its dangers when he can, I'm going to have to disagree with you there wade potts.

See heresy is worse than kid diddling. But i don't see how denying the trinity leads to eternal damnation.

Blogger Kevin Walker February 11, 2019 3:47 PM  

"Wherever God erects a house of prayer
the Devil always builds a chapel there;
And 't will be found, upon examination,
the latter has the largest congregation."
– Defoe's The True-Born Englishman, 1701

Blogger dc.sunsets February 11, 2019 3:58 PM  

@128 Sort of like how building a new McDonald's used to create an entire archipelago of remora-like business growth around it.

@122 What if the 18 year old put a ring on said daughter's finger? Actually, I don't care. The subject of this OP is about overtly adult (i.e., no one who'd be mistaken for a student at Prom) predation on teens and younger.

When the teacher (or Congressman) is diddling the student (or the page), it's the same as the orderly raping a comatose or IQ-50 woman. No consent CAN be given, making the act inherently criminal.

There are two sexes. Nouns have gender. Intersex people are NOT trannies. Sophists should be fed slowly into wood chippers. And arguing about the boundary definitions is how the Left camel got its nose under one tent flap after another.

Blogger SirHamster February 11, 2019 4:07 PM  

Punishing and ending abuse of church leadership is a more important concern than how sexually attractive you find sub-18 year old girls.

Blogger Wade R. Potts February 11, 2019 6:06 PM  

You have absolutely no idea what are talking. Period. End of story.

Blogger Didas Kalos February 11, 2019 6:56 PM  

@124 It won't bring his son out of hell. You've heard of Hatfields and McCoys? @119 My daughters are not whores. Enough said.

Blogger Winston Smith February 12, 2019 7:35 AM  

It won't bring his son out of hell.

If he's there, it won't. However, murder is the sort of sin that can never be overlooked by the Lord until it is fully repented. That means you are absolutely, unconditionally, guaranteed eternal damnation if you don't manage to pray for forgiveness AND try to bring yourself to the competent legal authorities for temporal judgment before he kills you.

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