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Saturday, November 23, 2019

Predator complains about imitator

It's jaw-droppingly astonishing to see a US diplomat complain about anyone else debt-trapping less-developed countries:
A senior US diplomat launched a verbal barrage at Beijing’s economic presence in Pakistan, claiming the massive investment brought nothing but corruption and a legacy of debt. China hit back saying IMF loans were a worse burden.

A senior American diplomat in South and Central Asia mounted harsh criticism of the China Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) project, an ambitious plan to turn Pakistan into a major trade route connecting China directly with the Arabian Sea. Speaking at the Woodrow Wilson Center, Assistant Secretary of State Alice Wells said the multibillion-dollar project, which China touts as a model of cooperation with other nations in its ambitious Belt and Road Initiative, was riddled with corruption and only hurt the Pakistani people.

“Together with non-CPEC Chinese debt payment, China is going to take a growing toll on Pakistan’s economy, especially when the bulk of payment starts to come due in the next four to six years,” the US diplomat said. She added that a “lack of transparency” would boost the cost of the projects and result in an even heavier debt burden.
All China is doing is precisely what the USA, through the IMF, has been doing since 1945. Apparently it is bad to be in debt to Chinese bankers, but good to be in debt to US bankers.

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49 Comments:

Blogger Rattlesnake_Kid November 23, 2019 11:14 AM  

Howling about financially ruinous and parasitic schemes at the *Woodrow Wilson* Center . . . I would laugh if it weren't so tangibly painful.

Blogger Section 8A November 23, 2019 11:22 AM  

This is exhibit A for how our Clueless Overlords are out to lunch. "Woodrow Wilson Center" - like the commenter above I had the same reaction to the level 10 irony. I enjoy watching China refuse to play by the NWO bankster rules. This bankster worrying about "corruption" and "lack of transparency" is laughable.

Blogger Gen. Kong November 23, 2019 11:24 AM  

All China is doing is precisely what the USA, through the IMF, has been doing since 1945. Apparently it is bad to be in debt to Chinese bankers, but good to be in debt to US bankers.

Some dude even wrote a book about how they always project. Even ones with WASP background like Alice Wells. She was removed as ambassador to Jordan by Trump at the request of that nation's king. Smells like yet another DS soldier.

Blogger SciVo November 23, 2019 11:31 AM  

One of my favorite economic stories is about how some little country (Mauritania?) rejected IMF loans with austerity strings attached, and instead gave its farmers coupons for fertilizer, which they used to actually make the country richer, improving its balance of trade to where they didn't need the loans.

Blogger Johnny November 23, 2019 11:32 AM  

Because we permit the Chinese to import more than they export, they are accumulating US dollars. Some of it goes into buying US debt instruments and some of it, now, into buying up assets in the US. And as US dollars can be spent anywhere, they are buying up assets all over the world. Africa I think is the most notable

Don't like it? A start would be to fix the balance of trade, something Trump is doing a little of.

And of course as these third world countries are more or less all corrupt, the money doesn't trickle down to the population. So what else is new?

Blogger Rattlesnake_Kid November 23, 2019 11:38 AM  

Johnny wrote:Because we permit the Chinese to import more than they export...

Who is this "we" you speak of? That "we" had plans to pack up and move to China at some point, so it seemed rational to do so. Don't confuse that "we for "US".

P.S. I will assume you mixed up import/export.

Blogger English Tom November 23, 2019 11:42 AM  

Pot. Meet kettle.

Blogger Azure Amaranthine November 23, 2019 11:46 AM  

"Sir, I SAY, SIR! You have quite the splinter in your eye. Now if you take care of that good and proper, eventually you'll have a tree just like mine!."

Blogger Johnny November 23, 2019 11:47 AM  

@6 Yeah, I mixed up import export.

And as I intended it, the "we" is us as implemented by the Untied States government. Like it or not, the government does in fact represent the collective population of the Untied States.

Blogger Dwayne Thundergrit November 23, 2019 11:52 AM  

". . .was riddled with corruption . . ."

China made sure a slice of the pie went to our DS by taking care of Hunter Biden so the real issue is a turf war.

Blogger Nate November 23, 2019 11:53 AM  

yes. from the US perspective it is bad to be beholden to the chinese and good to be beholden to us. duh.

Blogger Nate November 23, 2019 11:55 AM  

name a country that has had its port seized for not paying a loan the US made. didn't china just do exactly that?

Blogger Azure Amaranthine November 23, 2019 11:55 AM  

"it is bad to be beholden to the chinese and good to be beholden to us."

Us, Kemosabe?

Blogger Azure Amaranthine November 23, 2019 11:59 AM  

"name a country that has had its port seized for not paying a loan the US made. didn't china just do exactly that?"

Well, what are the alternatives. You either send the thugs around with bats looking for knees, or you... force your parasitized pretend-fellow citizens into footing the bill upon default.

So the difference is that China cares more about its own people than (((we))) do about ours? Ok.

Blogger Jake Burton November 23, 2019 12:01 PM  

Guys, the media lied to us about Chic Fil A. Go to the Salvation Army's webpage and scroll down. There's a whole section about "Serving the LGBTQ Community." Chic Fil A dumped a converged "christian" organization! https://www.salvationarmyusa.org/usn/the-lgbtq-community-and-the-salvation-army/

Blogger Azure Amaranthine November 23, 2019 12:01 PM  

Well, I guess you can also extend and enlarge their loan, but that's just kicking the can a remove down the road. Back to options one or two, do not pass go, do not collect interest.

Blogger Nate73 November 23, 2019 12:09 PM  

An SJW is someone who farts in a closed elevator then angrily shouts "Who farted? YOU did! YOU farted not me!"

Blogger tuberman November 23, 2019 12:13 PM  

Well, about five years ago, I watched a state science fair for grades 6th - 8th grade. It was more of an engineering fair, as a group of four kids had to do what amounted to several fairly difficult engineering projects, and they were judged by meeting pretty objective standards. Anyway of the first five places, three were Chinese kids, including 1st and 2nd place, then 3rd place were white kids, after that 4th was Chinese again. A Jewish school came in at 5th place.

I was told there were other Jewish schools that didn't even make the top 6 schools, that all went to the Awards.

At the Awards there was lots of boos, and the came from the Jewish parents. I was told that this was fairly recent and the Jewish schools had been use to taking at least two of the top four for a long time before.

This is all hearsay, of course, things I was told at the fair by people there, but I heard the booing firsthand, and the boos were suggesting cheating by the Chinese parents being engineers, and being a huge help to the Chinese students, and this likely true. Yet such 'cheating; is like Tour De France cycle doping, as in everybody does it. So, the Jewish peanut gallery was mad, because the Chinese had out cheated the Jewish teams.

At the top of all USA, and most Europe Banks are Jews, this is just the truth. CEOs, CFOs, CIOs and other high level VPs, and the ones who are not are Globohomos.

So it goes.

Blogger furor kek tonicus ( according to the 13th Amendment, Slavery is neither Cruel nor Unusual: MSAGA ) November 23, 2019 12:16 PM  

VD
Apparently it is bad to be in debt to Chinese bankers, but good to be in debt to US bankers.


hey, AT LEAST they're admitting that it might be a bad idea to be in debt to any Banksta.

that's a paradigm shift right there.

Blogger Guitar Man November 23, 2019 12:20 PM  

But hey, at least they'll get General Tso's chicken.

Blogger Dave November 23, 2019 12:22 PM  

Is it really astonishing to see and hear US career diplomats and bureaucrats speak in this manner? The public got a first-hand demonstration of it this week in the public impeachment hearings. The very acts they accused Trump of were taking place under their watch for years with the Bidens, Clintons, Kerry, and others.

It's like Obama claiming his would be the most transparent presidency in history.

Blogger ThatWouldBeTelling November 23, 2019 12:24 PM  

One of the recent "world historical" inflection points was when the IMF et. al. officially mistook Indonesia's plight in the 1997 Asian financial crisis as a solvency problem instead of a liquidity one caused by a flight of "hot money." Obama's tax cheat Secretary of the Treasury has a role in this as a Clinton Treasury Department SIS "top man" in international and especially Asian affairs, and it ended up deposing Suharto, the strongman running it since the failed Communist coup in 1966. The strongmen running the PRC got very motivated to make sure that wouldn't happen to them.

It's very incestuous at the top, Wikipeida notes in the Family and Education section:

"[Timothy Geithner's] father, a German American, was the director of the Ford Foundation's Asia program in New York during the 1990s, after working for the United States Agency for International Development in Zambia and Zimbabwe. During the early 1980s, Geithner's father oversaw the Ford Foundation's microfinance programs in Indonesia being developed by Ann Dunham Soetoro, Barack Obama's mother, and they met at least once in Jakarta....

"Geithner's [mother's] ... father, Charles Frederick Moore, Jr., served as vice-president of public relations for the Ford Motor Company from 1952 to 1964, and advised President Dwight D. Eisenhower, as well as Nelson Rockefeller and George W. Romney, on their respective presidential campaigns. His uncle, Jonathan Moore, served in the departments of Defense, Justice and State, as well as in the United Nations."

Blogger Johnny November 23, 2019 12:37 PM  

I believe following WW II we had mixed motives in how we set things up. A more pure example of economic exploitation would be our dealings with Latin America in the early part of the twentieth century. Because we were more honest back then, they called it dollar diplomacy.

The method was for our government to back the borrowing we encouraged a foreign government to make. To make it all work the government had to be weak. When the debt came due, if they stiffed us their credit rating is wrecked and they couldn't borrow anywhere else. That in turn would create internal economic problems that were likely to upchuck a weak government. Thus they were largely locked into our loan guarantees, and thus locked into accommodating the United States. They had to do things like not seize the local US investments.

Blogger Emmanuel November 23, 2019 1:00 PM  

@2

"I enjoy watching China refuse to play by the NWO bankster rules."

You say ironically while they're literally using the same exact playbook of controlling nations through their monetary system. The OG Baron von Rothschild couldn't be clapping any harder for the Chinese in his grave. While it is laughable that the Western Branch of the cabal is complaining about the Chinese head playing their own game mostly for the benefit of the Chinese head, doesn't mean that your own comment isn't laughable when you pause and consider that both heads ultimately belong to the same beast regardless of who wants to play king in that kingdom of darkness.

Blogger Johnny November 23, 2019 1:17 PM  

Same general theme but off topic here. I want to report something because I believe it is greatly underappreciated. Inside Britain they have a thing called the City of London that is located inside the city of London. Inside that (capital C) city they are not required to report their financial dealings. Essentially it is an on shore, "offshore tax haven," that I would imagine has special privileges because it is regarded as part of Britain. I would also imagine that when you are dealing with Britain, you never really get the full financial story because the government doesn't know what goes on in the City of London, or they don't want to know.

What an invitation for every sort of financial manipulation.

Blogger thethirdcoast November 23, 2019 1:28 PM  

Dave wrote:Is it really astonishing to see and hear US career diplomats and bureaucrats speak in this manner? The public got a first-hand demonstration of it this week in the public impeachment hearings. The very acts they accused Trump of were taking place under their watch for years with the Bidens, Clintons, Kerry, and others.

It's like Obama claiming his would be the most transparent presidency in history.


Is it that astonishing?

My experience is limited, but I felt I've spent enough time around diplomats and politicians to understand they are what Nassim Taleb calls, "IYIs," which stands for, "Intelligent, Yet Idiots."

I see them as people who have a lot of impressive credentials and book smarts that are utterly lacking in common sense, street smarts, or technical ability. They will be utterly useless in the hard times to come.

Blogger Dad29 November 23, 2019 1:36 PM  

Heh. The banks own the US Government. What the hell did you expect from a US "diplomat" after the master made a phone call?

Blogger IAMSpartacus0000 November 23, 2019 1:42 PM  

Pretty sure you meant (((US Bankers))).

Blogger Stan_qaz November 23, 2019 2:03 PM  

Borrowing from the IMF is bad but as corrupt leaders have learned over the years they aren't usually held to account personally and their governments usually just borrow more.

China may prove less prone to just accepting they aren't getting their money back. What they do in case of a default will be interesting to see. It appears they have insisted on collateral they could seize, going after any stolen funds is also a possibility.

Blogger dienw November 23, 2019 2:14 PM  

@25
Yes. The City of London is called the Crown.

Blogger Johnny November 23, 2019 2:24 PM  

@29 China may prove less prone to just accepting they aren't getting their money back.

While we pretended internationalism, in the post WWII period we set things up to conform to European sensibilities. And in general there isn't much ability to sort out how much things will change if that setup goes away. Those who appreciate dark humor should get to see lots of entertaining events when the "globalists" suddenly realize that the globe doesn't go along with their imagined to be universal values.

I don't know. When they upchuck the loan do you just let it go, as we sometimes do? Do you foreclose the country by military means and run it for your financial benefit until the loan is paid? Make it a colony and run it forever? Seize stuff internally for reparations? Install your own in house dictator? Lots of choices here and all of them have been implemented somewhere.

Blogger Jandolin November 23, 2019 2:31 PM  

How China got Sri Lanka to give up a port
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/06/26/how-china-got-sri-lanka-to-give-up-a-port.html

Every time Sri Lanka’s president, Mahinda Rajapaksa, turned to his Chinese allies for loans and assistance with an ambitious port project, the answer was yes.

Yes, though feasibility studies said the port wouldn’t work. Yes, though other frequent lenders like India had refused. Yes, though Sri Lanka’s debt was ballooning rapidly under Rajapaksa.

Over years of construction and renegotiation with China Harbor Engineering Co., one of Beijing’s largest state-owned enterprises, the Hambantota Port Development Project distinguished itself mostly by failing, as predicted. With tens of thousands of ships passing by along one of the world’s busiest shipping lanes, the port drew only 34 ships in 2012.

And then the port became China’s.

Blogger widlast washere November 23, 2019 2:37 PM  

The IMF is a criminal organization, just a loan sharking with UN backing, nothing else.

Blogger ThatWouldBeTelling November 23, 2019 2:48 PM  

@32 Jandolin: Interesting specific example. Here's some things I noticed from skimming Wikipedia on it. For example, classic corrupt self-sabotage of its economic prospects:

"However the Rajapaksa government turned down many proposals such as floating dock by China harbour Coroporation with a local investor, a proposal by a middle eastern firm to operate oil storage and bunkering was turned down due to influence from a young minister who wanted to make profit by keeping the activities under their control. Proposals for bottling factories, sugar bagging plants and grain processing plants were also refused."

The starkest example of this I've heard in a long while is that a "generator mafia" keeps Lebanon's power grid unreliable, the mafia with annual revenue of $2 billion, the electric company with $1.7 billion. This is from the buildup for a book forthcoming in March: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1610397495/

Another item about the harbor from Wikipedia is that a navy base is relocating there. The PRC has rather special military ties to Sri Lanka by providing them with what it took to terminate with extreme prejudice the Tamil Tigers, inventors of the suicide bomber.

Blogger Apoliteia November 23, 2019 3:11 PM  

Reminds me of the good ol' Soviet whataboutism when confronted about their atrocities. "Look, (insert Western democracy) has/does (insert injustice reminiscent of what USSR is accused of)! What about that, huh?"

Fun to see U.S. start playing that card in diplomatic game. What next, banishing Noble winners?

Blogger Apoliteia November 23, 2019 3:23 PM  

*Nobel

Blogger VFM #7634 November 23, 2019 5:19 PM  

The thing here is that Pakistan has geopolitical reasons for allying with China. India hates it, Afghanistan fears it, and Iran, while friendly, is still Shiite. That leaves only one option.

Blogger bodenlose Schweinerei November 23, 2019 5:39 PM  

only hurt the Pakistani people

"That's OUR job, dammit! Pakistan is one of the best slaughterin' pens for drone fodder we've found!"

Blogger Ominous Cowherd November 23, 2019 6:40 PM  

Jandolin wrote:And then the port became China’s.

Gave up a port that 34 ships stopped at? A port that they would have had to pay to maintain, with no revenue stream to support graft, let alone operations? Sounds as if Sri Lanka made out like bandits!

China got a navy base in the Indian Ocean, Sri Lanka got a foreign military base, which will mean a bit of foreign spending, even if it's just drunken sailors buying booze and bar girls. That's better than keeping the otherwise worthless port.

Blogger Ray - SoCal November 23, 2019 6:51 PM  

Pakistan and India’s relations go way back.

Pakistan helped China with uranium for their first nukes.

Were used as a cut out by Nixon for negotiations to China.

And then China helped Pakistan with their nuclear bomb program.

And shortening transit from the Middle East to China, reduces Chinas vulnerability to an embargo, having their supply lines cut.

Blogger liberranter November 23, 2019 6:55 PM  

All China is doing is precisely what the USA, through the IMF, has been doing since 1945.

That's what has Rome-on-the-Potomac so upset. They're determined to keep their monopoly on this predatory practice at all costs. They regard Beijing as competition.

Blogger Picturemaker November 23, 2019 8:57 PM  

In a tweet storm today, Adam Townsend mentioned the one big difference between IMF loans and Chinese ones. "All projects financed by Chinese loans must be awarded to Chinese companies, which come with their own materials, equipment, and technology, and often their own labor." IMF loans may be bad, but Chinese loans guarantee instant slavery to the Chicoms.

Blogger wreckage November 23, 2019 11:34 PM  

So now the USA makes social capital via debt forgiveness and lower interest rates. Because that's what capitalists do; they compete.

Blogger Bodo Staron November 24, 2019 7:27 AM  

The Chinese not only copy western technology but also "winning policies"? I'm shocked!

Blogger Akulkis November 24, 2019 7:47 AM  

Most of them are not IYI's, because, as you stated in the definition, the first word is "intelligent."

An intelligent prrson occassionally does something idiotic, as even the best of us have our bad moments.

These people, rsther than intelligent, are credentialled, in a systen in which being from one if "the right families" pseudo-aristocracy guarantees tgat they will be GIVEN the credentials, as long as "Mummy and Daddy" pay the Ivy League tuition, and their misbehavior isn't egregious enough to get them kicked out of school. Then they get their nice little sheepskin credential dignslly to the world how schmart they really must be. Minority tokens get the same deal, except Uncle Sam foots the bill.
For all the other kids who aren't low IQ minority pets, they are held to the standards, so that they are fooled into believibg that the credentials actually mean something.

So, in truth, these people are not IYI, but instead, mediocre and educated beyond their intelligence.

The sham system their grandparents set up is failing, not because the sham system is incapable of continuing to run, but because even the sham system needs people who are intelligent enough to understand it to actually make it run.

These people can't make it run. They can't figure out why their car, on a south-facing slope, will only move south, west, or east, but for some mysterious reason, no matter how far they push down the gas pedal, the car won't move in a northerly direction, neither in a forward gear or in reverse. They didn't notice that the engine quit spinning quite some time ago, and they are utterly unaware that there is even a fuel tank which needs to be filled, let alone how that is actually performed. But they're still havibg a ball riding their car-turned-glorified-soapbox-derby-coaster all the way to the bottom of the hill.

This isn't failure to exercise intelligence -- it's happening too often for that. Ut's that these so calked "elite" are all genuinely incompetent at anything other than collusion amongst themselves and extortion rackets aimed at the general public.

Blogger Griffin the Grey November 24, 2019 8:15 AM  

\\\bankers/// bad, but (((bankers))) good, don't cha know? That's just how (((international))) finance works.

Blogger Johnny November 24, 2019 10:49 AM  

@42 All projects financed by Chinese loans must be awarded to Chinese companies...

We do a lot of this same thing. Lots of the borrowing is tied to the borrower doing something for somebody in the United States. Buying your military hardware from an American contractor or whatever. Sounds like the Chinese are more blatant and thoroughgoing about it than we are.

Blogger DonReynolds November 24, 2019 11:25 AM  

Where does everyone end up when they can no longer borrow money from a commercial bank and all their credit limits are busted on their credit cards? At a certain point, they can no longer squeeze another dollar of cash from the equity in their home or business. At a certain point, the only new credit cards they can get have even worse terms than the ones they already have. At a certain point, their credit score is already in the basement or they no longer have one, and bankruptcy is no longer a viable alternative. So where do they end up, when their own relatives won't lend them a dime? They end up at the pawn shops, essentially selling what little they own for pennies on the dollar to raise cash to keep the utilities from being shut off. They end up at the neighborhood payday loan office, liquidating their next paycheck at a discount to buy food and gasoline. They end up at the appliance rental store to replace appliances that they can no longer afford to repair, that are broken or non-working because they were junk the day they were bought. This is the real destination of American Affluence....a boneyard of well-painted fake machines, with college degrees to do nothing, under a government that waits only for them to fall completely into a lonely and divorced society of aging decadence and former "greatness". They end up broke and broken, in declining health, with fewer teeth.

Blogger Pathfinderlight November 24, 2019 3:38 PM  

Everyone knows it's good to be in debt to US bankers. There's a scam their employees pull by writing fake loans against houses with no mortgage, pocket the money, then sick the banks and local government on unsuspecting homeowners for failing to pay the loan they never took out.

Sure, this is technically a crime, but it's white collar crime, which we are reliably informed is not as bad as the blue collar variety. Also, it's basically impossible to fight unless the victim is personally connected to local government or the police.

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