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Tuesday, December 31, 2019

Mailvox: the limits of ambition

In response to a previous Darkstream, a recovering Gamma asks about where the line between positive ambition and evil ambition is drawn:
How can one determine whether an ambition is just and for good, or the motivation is evil and subversive?

As a recovering Gamma, i have the core of success you mentioned and i am trying to channel it to bring glory to god.

I am crushing right now, but the concern of stepping out of line worries me.
The answer is pretty simple. Do your ambitions involve building up your own responsibilities and capabilities or do they involve inserting yourself into the activities of another individual in some capacity for your own benefit? The former ambitions are good. The latter are evil.

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29 Comments:

Blogger Haus frau December 31, 2019 12:18 PM  

"The answer is pretty simple. Do your ambitions involve building up your own responsibilities and capabilities or do they involve inserting yourself into the activities of another individual in some capacity for your own benefit? "

This is interesting in light of the female thought process of these men. This is similar to how a woman grafts onto a successful man except, of course, that's how God designed women. It is almost romanticizing the relationship and so, when the gamma feels disappointed or spurned he acts out like an angry ex girlfriend.

Blogger Silent Draco December 31, 2019 12:34 PM  

Well-phrased question, with a healthy fear of the Lord in mind. That's crushing in a quiet way. Keep at it, sir. Praying that he continues on the path, and receives the fortitude needed to overcome small setbacks.

Blogger Johnny December 31, 2019 12:39 PM  

I am not sure if it qualifies as gamma behavior, but another version of it is building yourself up by pulling other people down. None constructive political infighting internal to an organization is what it produces.

Blogger wreckage December 31, 2019 6:17 PM  

My very limited perspective.
A word of caution: with success comes your own gammas and fractal gammas. This is a serious problem you will need to deal with if your success is conspicuous enough. I tentatively believe the fractal nature of the SSH becomes a real threat with high relative success.

The point however is this: I believe the hallmark of the alpha and the delta coping with alpha status, is positivity. Not superficial or toxic positivity, but a belief that they or their project can be the rising tide that lifts all boats. A paternal/patriarchal attitude of looking after your own. Embracing duty to your tribe as the mark of success, not the acclamation of outsiders. Fearing not to lose face, but to fail your people.

Blogger Lovekraft December 31, 2019 6:18 PM  

A use of the Golden Rule in professional relations allows you to develop a reputation for frank thinking and talk. At least that's what I would hope is the goal.

When the rule is applied, you assess each situation from a center of seeking truth, not allowing people and situations to dictate you actions

Blogger Kraemer December 31, 2019 6:51 PM  

I think the answer is right there in Genesis: good ambition is intrinsically creative, eg making the World, whereas evil ambition is messing with someone else's creation(s)

Blogger sammibandit December 31, 2019 6:53 PM  

Proxy for the self-troll test?

... or do they involve inserting yourself into the activities of another individual in some capacity for your own benefit?

Blogger Canada78Bear December 31, 2019 7:41 PM  

Pulling other people down is still the evil case.. Pulling down others benefits the Ego of the evil individual which would be the benefit.

Blogger Jack (LJCSOGHMOMAS) December 31, 2019 7:52 PM  

This is one of many of Vox's heuristics and aphorisms that I hope gets collected into a book someday. Something along the lines of Taleb's Bed of Procrustes. There are more than enough of them scattered across this blog, they would just need to be collected and organized.

Blogger Laramie Hirsch December 31, 2019 8:08 PM  

"Do your ambitions involve building up your own responsibilities and capabilities or do they involve inserting yourself into the activities of another individual in some capacity for your own benefit? The former ambitions are good. The latter are evil."

Profound life lesson. I will popularize this quotation and remember it for years to come. Well done.

Blogger map December 31, 2019 8:50 PM  

It's important to understand what a gamma is: it is a low-status person, operating in an environment of higher-status people, who tries to insert himself into the lives of higher-status people, without correctly adjusting for his own status deficiencies.

He can do and say everything right, but, because he is inferior in obvious and important ways, he activates a visceral disgust in the people around him, that manifests in what looks like an unjust and capricious rejection.

It is a similar type of reaction as the Uncanny Valley: a phenomenon whereby a computer-generated figure or humanoid robot bearing a near-identical resemblance to a human being arouses a sense of unease or revulsion in the person viewing it. That is what a gamma is going through.

Let's look at an example: Imagine you have people who like talking about finance, investments and economics. They are not simply good talkers. They are usually right. You ask them questions about derivatives, or banking or any issue, and they do not merely have an opinion...they are usually correct. They can even follow your train of reasoning as well as you can.

Yet...yet...they are not outwardly successful. The clothes are off...the car is off...the family life isn't there...the relationships are not there. There is a massive, negative incongruity.

People are reacting badly to those who display these negative incongruities, because it calls into question what they know or believe. If an outward failure believes exactly what I believe, then, what? But for the grace of God, there I go? No once can accept that. So, the negative incongruent is rejected and, if he does not change this dynamic, he will experience a lifetime of these rejections, that will all seem unjust and capricious.

This is why it is important to raise your status in the world to at least match with the people around you, why you should have outside hobbies, exercise and dress better. In fact, carefully look over the things that you used to believe are shallow, and start incorporating them back in your lives.


Blogger TurboSlavic December 31, 2019 9:06 PM  

Hello Mr. Vox Day. I wanted to inform you that I talked with GOG to ask them why they didn't respond to your request to have Rebel Moon Games sold there. They told me that while they are not allowed to discuss these things, if they didn't respond to you, it must have been a mistake on their part and you should keep trying until you succeed to get a yes or no answer from them.

Also, I wanted to ask you if you have met any fellow alt-righters/identitarians while working in the comic book industry and can you recommend them to me? I also wanted to ask you if you plan to upload videos on your Voxiversity YouTube channel?

Blogger Doctor Mayhem December 31, 2019 9:26 PM  

What if it's a little of the former and a little of the latter? I always wanted to be a UMSC officer for self improvement, for the training, and in hopes to guide young marines.

But let's face it, the power amd prestige also played a part of it.

Blogger Shadow Banisher December 31, 2019 10:09 PM  

"Stand firm, as does an anvil which is beaten. It is the part of a noble athlete to be wounded, and yet to conquer. And especially, we ought to bear all things for the sake of God, that He also may bear with us."
- Ignatius of Antioch

Blogger VFM #7634 December 31, 2019 11:06 PM  

@map

I think the uncanny valley phenomenon you're talking about is more omega than gamma. Gammas inspire revulsion by angering and antagonizing other people with their superior secret-king attitudes. And the lying. The gamma is very dishonest and slippery, anything but "usually right".

Blogger Beardy Bear December 31, 2019 11:11 PM  

"do they involve inserting yourself into the activities of another individual in some capacity for your own benefit?"

This is such a foreign way to look at the world. It has given me a lot of insight. Thank you.

Blogger Meng Greenleaf December 31, 2019 11:12 PM  

I wonder if this is part of the reason why Japan developed so many social rules? There's a proper "way" to do almost everything. A Japanese gamma would probably find his energies directed into something he'd be useful at or boxed.

Speaking of boxed, I've been told that for some work places in Japan, the loser fails up - he isn't fired. He's boxed. He continues to get paid, but is segregated from having any responsibility. Everyone is expected to get his shit done too.

I suppose if you thought of the gamma as an infectious disease. Perhaps identified and quarantined is best for society. By letting him fail up, and then boxed, maybe that's the best for the overall economy? If he felt social pressure and removed his genes from society, that could be a plus?

Anyway, I found it interesting.

Blogger Tanjil Bren December 31, 2019 11:32 PM  

The answers to these questions (about how to follow the right hand path) are phenomenally simple and sensible.

The reality for many questioners, however, is that often they would really rather hear something other than what their God-head is telling them (hence the question, which hopefully is not being asked for attention, and if it is, then you don't need that; your relationship with God is enough).

You already know what is right and good (we all do).

This is not intended to be a condemnation, but a frank discussion about motivation.

You already have your answers.

Blogger judgeholdem1848 January 01, 2020 12:59 AM  

"I am not sure if it qualifies as gamma behavior, but another version of it is building yourself up by pulling other people down. None constructive political infighting internal to an organization is what it produces."

Not only does it qualify, it is the essence of it. The gamma attempts to climb their local social hierarchy through usurpation, inserting themselves into roles filled naturally by better men. This very frequently involves trash-talking behind people's back as well as openly attempting to belittle others or diminish their accomplishments, erecting a cardboard facade of superiority that is often shockingly transparent to everyone but the gamma.

One of the strongest indicators that you are dealing with a gamma is the overwhelming feeling that the person in question is frequently out of line.

Blogger Akuma January 01, 2020 1:10 AM  

"Yet...yet...they are not outwardly successful. The clothes are off...the car is off...the family life isn't there...the relationships are not there. There is a massive, negative incongruity."

Or maybe they just surrounded by crazy people. Theres not a lot of OSHA regs on clothing. Who cares what somebody wears. Suits are useless in a fight and most conflict adverse.

Driving is a privilege not a right, despite lots of dopey folk thinking otherwise. Plus one can get a used BMW (Beta Male Whip) or other high status car for cheap at the junkyard. This also increases your man points.
Lots of families are toxic to success and MPAI so most relationshits arent worth it.

I can tell by your comment you've never interacted witn a shitty manager or terrible coworkers in a corporate environment or any business. Or even asked someone who claims to be a mechanic for basic auto advice. High Status!=Sane.

Blogger Avalanche January 01, 2020 7:46 AM  

@20 "Who cares what somebody wears."

Every human on the planet, except the omegas!

Dress, just like appropriate methods of interactions -- knowing your place and staying in it while you work to improve yourself, rather than trying to insert yourself where you do not fit / belong -- is part of the tribal signaling: "you're one of us; we can rely on you" or "you just don't care about our tribe."

You either accept and color inside your tribe's lines or

you. are. not. one. of .us.

Blogger Akulkis January 01, 2020 8:11 AM  

@20

"Driving is a privilege not a right"

Driving or "operating" a vehicle is a commercial endeavor.

Taking your privately owned (with now bank lien or other commercial interest in it) onto the road, to go about your own, private, non-commercial affairs (to include traveling to and from a place where you DO engage in commercial affairs) is not subject to any sort of licensing. SCOTUS says the roads are owned by the people, that governments are charged with the task of building and maintaining them, but that the government does not OWN said roads, the people do.

Similarly, if you have an old boiler in your basement, because you have steam radiator heating, you don't need a boiler OPERATOR'S LICENSE to heat your house... but if you are a janitor at a school, who is responsible for starting, stopping, adjusting, and maintaining such a boiler, then you need a boiler operator's license. Same thing for a LOT of different activities. Cook some food, even on a grill in a public park, and give it to whoever you want to? No license needed. Run a restaurant? You need a license.
Buy some amusement park rides, put them in the backyard, and let visitors ride for free? no license needed. Run a carnival where you sell tickets,. or even just use the rides as an attraction to get people to pay for tickets for something else, or sell food to them, or whatever? Then you need an amusement device operator's license.

Have a pinball machine in your basement, made by Bally, that anyone can play for free? No license needed. Put in someplace where you charge people money to play it?
You need an amusement device license.

SCOTUS says you don't need a license to use your own (no lien) belonging to travel from place to place on the roads that are owned by the people UNLESS you are USING the roads to make money (for example, delivering goods or people, or running a sightseeing tour bus or what have you). The thing is, if you buy a new car, and you financed it, then it needs to be plated (because there's a commercial interest in the car), and because it needs to be plated, then YOU need a license (the bank wants to know that only people recognized by the state as being "qualified" are sitting behind the steering wheel). Likewise, most early drivers were chauffers, who, since they were engaged in a commercial activity, needed an operator's license.

Somehow, this all got twisted into a convention where EVERYBODY supposedly needs a driver's license. However, SCOTUS also says that that's not a good enough reason to require EVERYONE to get a driver's license,. specifically saying, "Local traditions and ways of business are NOT sufficient grounds for denying citizens their rights."

Up in northwest Indiana, entire communities are REFUSING to plate their vehicles or get driver's licenses. And neither the local police, the county sherrifs, or the state police are doing a thing about it, because they know if someone pushes it in court, it's going to turn against them, and the the whole thing will blow open, and state revenues will decline even further.

The states are trying to fool people with the CDL (Commercial Driver's License), implying that there's such thing as a non-commercial driver's license. SCOTUS says there's no such thing.

Blogger Unknown January 01, 2020 9:01 AM  

false accusations fall under "evil ambitions"?...or is there cases where it is allowed?

Blogger Blume January 01, 2020 10:04 AM  

@unknown false because you are wrong? Ya that's fine, just admit it when it is pointed out. False because you are lying, no never. Though obviously Kant is wrong and you can lie to save someone's life.

Blogger Akulkis January 01, 2020 11:40 AM  

Unknown.. if you have to resort to false accusations, then why would you accuse the person at all?

And if you have valid accusations, why would you need to resort to false ones?

This all reminds me of the greatest villain mentioned among corporate types in the 70's and 80's: The backstabber. One climbs the corporate ladder over the bodies of coworkers who he stabbed in the back (giving false info to coworkers so that they make the wrong decision; or spreading gossip and false rumors; taking credit for other's work, etc.)

Blogger map January 01, 2020 6:56 PM  

VFM #7634 wrote:@map

I think the uncanny valley phenomenon you're talking about is more omega than gamma. Gammas inspire revulsion by angering and antagonizing other people with their superior secret-king attitudes. And the lying. The gamma is very dishonest and slippery, anything but "usually right".


I view a gamma as an extroverted omega. It's an omega that wants to improve so he takes the advice of his mother or some other woman to "put himself out there" without any consideration of his status relative to other people. He then gets triggered onto the path of being gamma when the unjustified rejections start poling up.

Blogger map January 01, 2020 7:00 PM  

Akuma wrote:Or maybe they just surrounded by crazy people. Theres not a lot of OSHA regs on clothing. Who cares what somebody wears. Suits are useless in a fight and most conflict adverse.

Akuma wrote:I can tell by your comment you've never interacted witn a shitty manager or terrible coworkers in a corporate environment or any business. Or even asked someone who claims to be a mechanic for basic auto advice. High Status!=Sane.

The status marker is based on the people around you. If suits and BMW's are the standard, then you better meet the standard. If tattoos and neckbeards are the standard, then you better meet the standard.

Status is entirely situational.

Yes, there are bad people and shitty managers everywhere...but...at what point does the frequency of your encounters with such people not really become something you did? If I got kicked out of 109 apartment buildings, then is it really because all those managers are shitty?

Blogger Akulkis January 02, 2020 12:34 AM  

" Theres not a lot of OSHA regs on clothing. Who cares what somebody wears."

You're what... 25 years old (at most)?

To answer your question: The children who suffered the loss of a parent due to an industrial accident which originated with, or escalated to being fatal, due to the clothing worn by the deceased.
Other relatives. Coworkers. Supervisors who were depending on those people to get the job done, because they did their job well enough that they didn't get fired for poor performance. This doesn't mean just people working at a machine. When managers walk onto a production floor, they are subject to the same clothing restrictions as the people who work their entire careers on the production floor.

Here's an example:

I was working a contract at an auto parts manufacturer site, and one of my coworkers, from a temp agency, wanted to wear arabian style desert garb, complete with headgear consisting mainly of loose cloth hanging halfway down his back, and sleeves loose enough to let small-to-medium sized dogs leave and seek refuge inside his garment WITH HIM.... and of course, full "man-dress" length, such that, if something happened that he would have to run, he would either be stuck at a hobbled gait, or or half to waste time pulling the bottom up to his waist.

Now, you and I both might say, good riddance to some IQ 85 idiot, but how about everyone else who would be impacted if he got caught in a machine and became a workplace fatality. The whole department would have to shut down while police do an investigation. This impacts customers downstream, and THEIR employees.

OSHA workplace clothing regs exist for a lot of reasons. Every single one of those reasons being a traumatic injury or death.

Every safety feature you see on a car, truck, bus, railroad train, tram, subway, airplane, ocean liner, commercial cargo carrier, and in any industrial or other commercial facility is there NOT because the owners felt like spending extra money -- they're there to prevent FURTHER DEATHS caused by the owners NOT buying equipment with those sorts of features.

A lot of OSHA regs originate with people who have witnessed industrial accidents, and the people who investigate them in the aftermath.

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