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Friday, February 19, 2021

Disinviting Baen

To the surprise of precisely zero Rabid Puppies, Baen Books shuttering the Bar didn't suffice to appease the SJW swarmtroopers after Jason Sanford pointed-and-shrieked at it. As an expression of gratitude for cowering before the mob, Worldcon has disinvited its 2021 Guest of Honor, Baen Books publisher Toni Weisskopf:

DisCon III condemns the violent and hostile content found within Baen Books’ forums. We also cannot condone the fact such content was enabled and allowed to ferment for so long. We want to make it clear abusive behavior is not, and will not be, tolerated at DisCon III. Such behavior goes entirely against our already established policies concerning inclusivity and creating a welcoming environment for our members, which can be found here: https://discon3.org/about/inclusion/.

We knew simply saying those words with no actions to back them up would be unacceptable. Too often, we have seen individuals and organizations say they are on the right side of issues yet do nothing to act on those words. We knew we had to take a hard look at our own position and take action based on our established policies.

As a result, after discussion with her, we have notified Toni Weisskopf we are removing her as a Guest of Honor for DisCon III.

We know this decision was not as quick as some of you would have wanted, and we understand your frustration. Our committee’s leadership was always in full agreement that there was a fundamental difference between the values Worldcon strives to uphold and the values allowed to be espoused on the forums-in-question.

In the entire eighty-plus year history of our community, no Worldcon has ever removed someone as a Guest of Honor. To remove a Guest of Honor was an unprecedented decision that needed discussion, consideration, and consensus. Those mechanisms sometimes do not move as fast as some would want, and we thank the community for its patience.

We also want to let everyone know that we are not planning on adding additional individuals to our Guest of Honor list.

In fairness, this almost certainly would have happened anyhow, no matter what Ms Weisskopf did. But demonstrating weakness in front of SJWs is nearly as predictably counterproductive as doing so in front of an angry, snarling dog. And to say that this attempt at public humiliation has angered The International Lord of Hate would be the understatement of the year. SJWs, beware! You may come to regret awakening the Mountain to the true depths of your spite and provoking him to action.

Toni had been participating in WorldCons for decades. She grew up in your scene. She volunteered. She hung out with you. She helped out. When she got into the publishing business she kept on helping out, whatever you needed, she was always there for you. She became an editor, and a damned good one too (and you fucking know it).

In fact, she became one of the best and most successful editors in the history of the genre… yet year after year, she got no prestigious award nomination, and instead you just kept giving the award to the same assholes from the same publishing house, over and over and over, as you ignored Toni because she was at that publishing house. The uncouth one. You talk a big game about “honoring strong women” as you took turns rotating through the same cadre of old white dudes for best editor.

It took me, the barbaric outsider, to rally the barbaric outsider fans to finally get Toni some recognition in your sainted halls. And even though your bleating social justice contingent threw a fit, you know what most of you old time, old school, long attending WorldConners told me in private? Good. About time.

Because even though you hated me and my friends (and trust me, we’re cool with that) you knew that Toni deserved it. Toni had earned it. She had long since put in the work. As George R.R. Martin so haughtily proclaimed when he finally admitted I was right all those years ago, and that Hugos were not for everybody (as long claimed) but rather only for your elite select body of special fans, only people who had served their time deserved your fancy awards. Except by every fucking measure in the universe, Toni had served her time.

Then along came the awards, and you snubbed her. Hell, you didn’t just snub her. They openly mocked her, said all sorts of hateful shit, and you people who claimed to be her friends, you old timers who claimed to be all about the sainted dignity of WorldCon, you sat there, silent and afraid, as they did their little high school mean girl games. Toni got up and left the awards ceremony because she wouldn’t give the sicks fucks the satisfaction of watching her endure it. Unlike you, Toni has dignity.

You fuckers talk a big game about tradition. But then the instant there was heat you crumbled before the woke mob that doesn’t give a shit about your precious traditions either. You even renamed one of your awards just to placate their tantrum.

And when those assholes fucked her over last time, you did nothing. Some of you put up some timid posts, but overall you cowered before the mob you helped create, the same one you mocked me for warning you about. People who claimed to be Toni’s friends sat there, silent, worried that if they did the right thing the mob would come for them next. At least they had the decency to stab her in the front. You stabbed her in the back.

The lesson, as always, is this: no olive branches for SJWs.

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53 Comments:

Blogger Crunchy Cachalot February 19, 2021 6:36 PM  

Maybe if they say "established policies" a few more times, people won't notice that they're spineless, gormless cowards, though personally I think they're also a little short in invoking "democracy".

Blogger Shakey February 19, 2021 6:47 PM  

I appreciate Larry's take and why he wrote what he did but I can't help the feeling that we're beyond the point where a blog post on the topic will do anything. The argument about persuading the middle, the observer from the outside comes to mind, but at this point I think if someone hasn't yet been convinced then nothing short of a noose around their neck is going to make them realize that the horse just won't stop. And even then I'm sure some of them will helplessly squeal about being "reasonable" as the floor drops out from under them.

We are past the point of reason. One cannot reason with the unreasonable, nor can they reason with a parasite.

I do commend Larry for standing by his friend though, and that alone proves the merit of what he wrote.

Anonymous Anonymous February 19, 2021 7:06 PM  

Liberalism is the Nazism of the 21st century. Go back and read what Hitler said about Jews, Jehovah's Witnesses, Gypsy's, and anyone else he didnt like and compare that to what the left says today - it is almost indistinguishable.

Anonymous Anonymous February 19, 2021 7:09 PM  

Go take a look at what IDW did to Simon Furman. One of the great comic book writers of the 80's and 90's, he created the entire mythology of Alpha Flight, Transformers, and Death's Head.

And they ran him off just so could have a bunch of dykes write about faggot robots.

Blogger Jim February 19, 2021 7:32 PM  

She knew that she’d take heat from people on the right (and she has). Morons on my side of the political would call her a sell-out, quisling, traitor, boot licker, so on and so forth, and they did.

And yet, somehow, the "morons" were completely right about what the outcome would be.

Funny that.

Blogger Unknown February 19, 2021 7:38 PM  

Toni dropped to her knees to beg forgiveness and they peed in her face.

Blogger basementhomebrewer February 19, 2021 7:40 PM  

The proper response from Baen at this point is total war. I predict it will instead be an "above it all" flourish with hopes of being allowed back into the fold eventually.

Blogger weka February 19, 2021 8:06 PM  

Who cares about WorldCom? I don't. And I am waiting for the Manatees next book having just read his last, the family buys multiple copies of Barn books, and I want the next part of the Throne of Bones.

Anything that has a Hugo or Nebula after 2010 is unreadable.

Salt the fields with plutonium so those who live in the remaining rubble glow.

Blogger Quadko February 19, 2021 8:17 PM  

Their Slytherin noses smell mudbloods!

Blogger M In The 517 February 19, 2021 8:18 PM  

Satire.

The frivolity of these SJW chuds needs to be laid out.

Is there some kind of current day Monty Python-esque writer's collective but populated by anti-SJW/based/IDW/rabid puppy types?

Maybe it takes a fucking Whoopee Cushion of truth to expose the SJWs for the comprehensive frauds that they are.

Maybe it takes a seltzer bottle of real fucking Snark to fight off the Woke artillery (such as it is).

Blogger M In The 517 February 19, 2021 8:27 PM  

Also, Correia refers to people who email him privately about their misgivings about the Woke Mob.

Need a whole fuckton more out of those type of people than they are currently giving.

Exposing private email correspondence is certainly rude, but this fucking battle is not going to be won by playing nice.

Blogger MichaelJMaier February 19, 2021 8:29 PM  

Jack Tanner wrote:Go take a look at what IDW did to Simon Furman. One of the great comic book writers of the 80's and 90's, he created the entire mythology of Alpha Flight, Transformers, and Death's Head.

And they ran him off just so could have a bunch of dykes write about faggot robots.


Dude... Chris Claremont and/or John Byrne might have a word to say about your take on Alpha Flight.

Blogger MichaelJMaier February 19, 2021 8:31 PM  

As for the cons, I saw "stop attending". Stop giving them your eyeballs and your money. I'm sick of financially supporting companies that hate me.

You're a restaurant / guitar maker / rock star that supports PP / BLM / Pedo Biden?

OK, cool. Good for you. You virtue signaled for your Satanic masters.

Now do without my attention, clicks and most of all, money. If more people did so, we might see some things change.

Blogger Doktor Jeep February 19, 2021 8:46 PM  

When is it time to actually crush these people? I'm getting tired of them.

Anonymous Anonymous February 19, 2021 9:04 PM  

Gab is down right now. Wonder what the hell is happening ?

Blogger Snidely Whiplash February 19, 2021 9:04 PM  

I wonder if Larry and the Baen gang have finally, now, at the end of all things, come to understand:
"Of all sad words
of tongue and pen
The saddest are these
We should have listened to Vox."

Blogger Nostromo February 19, 2021 9:16 PM  

My circle of friends and family all ignored this sort of thing. For a decade I replied that yh ou will be made to care. It's finally getting through the densest ones with the fraudulent election of Pedo Joe.

Blogger Grey Man February 19, 2021 9:22 PM  

Oh no! Larry is angry! Too bad his only tool is over long angry blog posts with copious use of eff bombs.

Larry get mad but will never do anything that threatens his status or position.

Blogger Nostromo February 19, 2021 9:24 PM  

I still enjoy the feel of holding a book in my hand, havin GB bookshelves to display my books. But I haven't bought a new book in years. All my buys are garage sales, thrift shops, and the bargain bins.

Blogger tuberman February 19, 2021 10:00 PM  

It would get interesting if Larry did get angry enough to get whole hog into the Culture Wars. I hope to see it. He is capable if he tries.

Blogger MarioM February 19, 2021 10:04 PM  

Why did you stop the quote from the article - there is a good quote there: "Morons on my side of the political would call her a sell-out, quisling, traitor, boot licker, so on and so forth, and they did. She got attacked by the useless grifters on both sides, looking for hate clicks. But unlike you, Toni ignores the baying mob and always does what she thinks is the right thing to do. She looked at your peace offering, and said fine, If you want to try and mend fences, okay, I’ll take the heat, I’ll be your guest of honor. She was the bigger person."

Anonymous Anonymous February 19, 2021 10:09 PM  

The idea of reading a novel online revolts me. I want to feel the paper, the pulp, the print, I want to see the creases in the spine - feel them.

Same reason why I prefer to read the original print editions of old comics, complete with the old advertisements.

Blogger Doom February 19, 2021 10:19 PM  

It pleases my dark heart to see a feminist eaten by her own. Much as it is to watch womens' sports eaten by their politics. Amen.

Blogger Kevin Smith February 19, 2021 10:47 PM  

@3 I know very little about this issue, but when I read that statement from Worldcon, I can't help but picture Hitler saying "Nein! Nein! Nein! You cannot be zat full of shit! You have shamed ze Nazi Party! You vill vork in ze buna plant for ze rest of your life!"

Explaining to Hitler that you can be that full of shit in 2021 would be like explaining to designers of telephones of that era what a smartphone is capable of.

Blogger Yukichi Sensei February 19, 2021 11:13 PM  

I had never heard of this publisher before this. Fiction went by the wayside in my 20s.

Are they worth supporting?

Blogger MonsoonBear February 19, 2021 11:20 PM  

They retreated and capitulated and then were attacked more. Man, what a surprise, I can't believe what I'm seeing.

Blogger RealTalk103 February 19, 2021 11:31 PM  

This is a pretty good piece I happened to find defending Baen by a writer named Erica Flint, who is the most published author at Baen, and in his how words a flaming socialist.
https://ericflint.net/information/controversy-about-baens-bar/

Blogger Daniel February 19, 2021 11:44 PM  

Wait. They still have those things? With social distancing, safe space requirements, and the average individual tonnage that Xir Neckbeard brings to the event, they are going to need about one stadium for every 5 "people" in attendance. Maybe they aren't anticipating that much of a crowd.

Larry needs to support Toni, but he also needs to move on from these freaks, or he runs the risk of being Old Man Yells at Dickless Rainbows.

Blogger OvergrownHobbit February 20, 2021 12:59 AM  

I was there when they No Awarded Mrs. Weisskopf. They stomped and cheered and hooted like a pack of baboons.

No class.

They also put the Campaigners to end Puppy-Related sadness in clump near the middle front. Then that weasel running the show had everyone attending stand up if they'd been a part of cons and fandom for 5 years.

Then 10, then 15... Twenty. By the third decade we were just about the only ones left. I'm really tired of playing Red Indian in this game.

Blogger Desdichado February 20, 2021 1:41 AM  

MarioM wrote:Why did you stop the quote from the article - there is a good quote there: "Morons on my side of the political would call her a sell-out, quisling, traitor, boot licker, so on and so forth, and they did. She got attacked by the useless grifters on both sides, looking for hate clicks. But unlike you, Toni ignores the baying mob and always does what she thinks is the right thing to do. She looked at your peace offering, and said fine, If you want to try and mend fences, okay, I’ll take the heat, I’ll be your guest of honor. She was the bigger person."
Probably because the "morons", as Larry calls them, were exactly correct in their predictions, and Toni and Larry weren't. It's a little hard to call someone a moron when they're better at predicting what's going to happen than you are. Unless you can credibly claim that they just got lucky, which they clearly didn't.

I mean, if the point Vox was trying to make is that conservatives like Larry are incapable of learning, that would be a good part to quote, but that's not the point he was making. This time, at least.

Blogger Hieronymus Burgmeister February 20, 2021 1:59 AM  

Larry is king.

Blogger Franz Lyonheart February 20, 2021 2:43 AM  

@21, yes, I too noticed that he just couldn't resist slipping in some libertarian-matronly civnattery, in the form of "on both sides". And your question has already been answered comprehensively by @5.

Blogger lowercaseb February 20, 2021 2:45 AM  

Of course the action that Correia will take is to double-scold JDR for being mean.

I like Correia's work and I know he means well, but I am getting really sick of him shooting right.

Blogger lowercaseb February 20, 2021 2:50 AM  

Shakey wrote:I do commend Larry for standing by his friend though, and that alone proves the merit of what he wrote.

You are correct about that. I really do respect folks that stand up for their friends and damn what others think. That's why I can get frustrated with Larry, but I'll keep supporting him. In his heart he is doing what he thinks is right.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash February 20, 2021 4:10 AM  

This whole episode illustrates nicely why Sad Puppies was doomed and Rabid Puppies was completely necessary.

Blogger L'Aristokrato February 20, 2021 4:26 AM  

Correia's finger-wagging is adorable to watch, considering how much of a thoroughbred cuckold he is.
The man will berate and backstab everyone to the right of himself; people who are at worst indifferent to him, in order to appeal to the crowd who explicitly hates him. Surely the mob is just one outraged blog post away from seeing the light...
It's fitting, I suppose, that 'correia' is the Portuguese word for 'leash'.

Blogger Brett baker February 20, 2021 5:03 AM  

Yeah. They have some good books. Though he's a lefty, Eric Flint has some interesting stuff in the Ring Of Fire/163x series. David Drake's RCN series, well pretty much anything he writes.
The early books in David Weber's Honor Harrington series are excellent, but after 7 or 8 they start too drag. Several other authors are good, too.
And of course, the International Lord Of Hate.

Blogger VD February 20, 2021 5:31 AM  

The man will berate and backstab everyone to the right of himself

That's simply not true. Correia, unlike other Sad Puppies, has resolutely refused to accept the oft-proffered invitation to disavow and denounce me, just to give one example.

Larry simply wants to write books. When he has been dragged into the fight, it has been reluctantly, against his preferences, and by the other side. Like /pol/, he is not your personal army.

Blogger VD February 20, 2021 5:33 AM  

Larry get mad but will never do anything that threatens his status or position.

Now observe that SJWs are threatening his status and position by going after his publisher. He might surprise you. Those who are first to fight are not always the most effective.

Blogger VD February 20, 2021 5:34 AM  

Why did you stop the quote from the article

So that you would read the whole thing there.

Blogger Leif Erikson February 20, 2021 6:00 AM  

The whole post and comment section is just sad to me. The equivalent of a harshly worded letter from the E.U. to a terrorist group somewhere.

In the comments endless whining and empty threats about how, as usual, those liberals will regret it someday. But why would they ever? Conservatives have never fought, and it appears never will. There does not appear to be ANY point at which they will take action in the real world to fight back. The whole Sad/Rabid Puppy thing happened several years ago with so many other outrages against the Right. The Conservative book community appear to have learned precisely nothing and have taken zero action to prepare for the inevitable attacks. One suspects the actions they take now at Baen are of a similar caliber to what Parler has done since being deplatformed.

To be tone perfect for Conservatives as a group all that was lacking here was a ‘please clap’ at the end of one of the ‘they’ll regret it later’ comments.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan February 20, 2021 6:58 AM  

As one of the harshest critics in the galaxy of conservatives I don't think that thread was bad as the usual conservative cuckery outside of hating on Arroz for whatever reasons they have. But per usual with all the Right they don't know what to do next since conservatism was always about appealing to the supposed authority that both Left and Right shared and they are bewildered that a eff bomb outrage post by the Big Man Talk Loud doesn't take us back to the good old days.

Liberals believe in themselves, conservatives believe in liberals, and the breakup is hard for the conservatives since they sincerely believe they have done everything in the past that liberals wanted.

Blogger Taignobias February 20, 2021 8:59 AM  

It is to the point where I will not buy anything that has won an award - if THEY want to praise it, there can't possibly be anything good in it.

I am sad for Toni and Baen: sad that they showed weakness and sad that their torment is only just begun. Outside of learning the lessons and warning the others, what can we do when the locusts have found a tender morsel?

Blogger Matthew Hopkins (MHN) / Sam Smith February 20, 2021 9:04 AM  

Hey guys! I am doing, an, ahh, series on Mr Sanford. The first article holds his employers to account. The second article is planned for the next few days. It continues to focus on the employer (and includes their lawyer's email to me). The third will concentrate on sexual and discrimination issues regarding Mr Sanford's writing. There may be a fourth about his conduct at conventions but I need more investigation into that. The first article is here and has email addresses for all his employer's trustees -

http://matthewhopkinsnews.com/?p=7615

I would reiterate my call for people to email me via the address on my blog if they have had adverse experiences with Mr Sanford at conventions. If you feel uncomfortable, I will consider anonymous emails, even sent by Tor / proxies (although that is not as strong as giving a real name). Contact email is here -

http://matthewhopkinsnews.com/?page_id=9

Blogger Ray - SoCal February 20, 2021 9:21 AM  

Cartoon on the Baen snafu:

Formula - Day by Day Toons


Blogger GeronL February 20, 2021 9:52 AM  

The left has a very narrow, winding definition of "inclusivity".

Blogger Ken Prescott February 20, 2021 12:24 PM  

I suspect that the reason Ms. Weisskopf did what she did is that this isn't about SJWs.

It's about Tor trying to kill off a direct competitor.

And the first step in the process of staying in business is to document exactly what happened.

Blogger nono February 20, 2021 1:08 PM  

Well at this time DisCon 111 and World Con have no venue see:
https://discon3.org/news/2-14-hotel-update/

https://www.bizjournals.com/washington/news/2021/01/12/pacific-life-insurance-wardman-park-bankruptcy.html

Yes the main site has closed and kept the deposits.

Blogger VD February 20, 2021 1:30 PM  

It's about Tor trying to kill off a direct competitor.

Tor owns at least 25 percent of Baen.

Blogger Ken Prescott February 20, 2021 3:23 PM  

And if they get Baen killed off as a business, they own 25%+ of the rights to a bunch of really successful authors' work, don't they?

Blogger MichaelJMaier February 20, 2021 11:32 PM  

Mr.MantraMan wrote:As one of the harshest critics in the galaxy of conservatives I don't think that thread was bad as the usual conservative cuckery outside of hating on Arroz for whatever reasons they have.

Are you kidding me?

Arroz pisses in the punch bowl everywhere he goes, then wonders why no one invites him to white-tie parties. I have witnessed his particular brand of lunacy myself.

Step 1: Piss in someone's face to "pwn libs".
Step 2: Get beat up for it online.
Step 3: Go find a large public figure or private group and cry to them how mean libs are for sympathy and profit (gotta mention latest project in the middle of the tirade, after all).
Step 4: Berate and inflict purity spiral at the people in Step 3 for "not being man enough to step in and pwn libs."
Step 5: Get ejected by decent company on both sides.
Step 6: Repeat. ALWAYS repeat.

Blogger Daniel February 21, 2021 12:13 AM  

No. That isn't how it works. At all.

Blogger Matthew Hopkins (MHN) / Sam Smith March 01, 2021 12:15 PM  

You'll never guess what Jason, the guy who attacked Baen's Bar, has been writing about (you will, you only have to look at him). My new article -

"We Need to Talk About Jason: Jason Sanford’s Writing, Underage Girls, Torturing Children and Child Abuse"
http://matthewhopkinsnews.com/?p=7682

Dropped you an email about this to consider signal boosting.

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